Who were the Magyars and how did they evolve into the modern

>>3352203
Just one of the mongrel peoples of the eurasian steppe who picked up some finno-ugric influence sonewhere along the way probably from one of the uralic finnic tribes of what is now Russia

>>3352203
moonstone

>>3352203
>who were the Magyars
Steppe niggers but closer to the Scythians than Turks, goturks and Turkomongols
>how did they become Hungarians
It's not as grand as Frankish to French, as they call themselves Magyars still, it's just they settled in the Pannonian basin and lived as agriculturalists rather than pastoralists, then became christians rather than great blue sky worshippers

>>3352318
>>3352349
>>3352360
shut the fuck up if you have no clue.

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>>3352203
>Who were the Magyars
Hardcore steppe niggers that raided and devastated Europe for over 90 years. Originating from far off Siberia they migrated to the Patagonian Basin. In the end, big Otto did them for good in 955, they survivors settled in with the local slavs and are largely responsible that they speak some finno-mongolic moonspeak.
They had large impact on whats was left of European society, and where one of the reasons for the advent of the knight and castles and the feudal system.

>>3352487
>Patagonian
Pannonian, fuck auto correct

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>>3352203
>how did they evolve into the modern Hungarian people
They didn't. Modern Hungarians are basically Slavo-Germans and only their language is Magyar.

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>>3352203
Just a tribe with an identity. They raided as far in as France but ended up settling Hungary.

Its the eternal story. Good at war so carved out land for themselves

>>3352465
Explain how I have no clue after reading various Wikipedia articles on the subject as well as talking our nations history with a Hungarian

>>3352487
>Originating from far off Siberia
Urals actually.

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>>3352528
Well, they kinda did. Magyars had a very hierarchic society based on nomadic pastoralism and nomadic warfare. The small warrior class ruled over many people including Magyars and Slavs. When Otto beat them at Lechfeld he erased most of the warrior noble class. The mainly civilian remains settled into the local population, but their language stayed dominant.
Irony, 300 years later Hungarians got proper fucked by steppe niggers themselves.

>>3352554
Kind of unrelated to what I posted don't you think

>>3352562
Depends, if you think genetics is everything that matters, maybe, if you are interested in the details of history and who did what, then no, it is highly relevant.
Saying the Magyars where not important just because they left not much of a genetic trace is just stupid when they left a huge cultural impact.

>>3352203
magyars on their way to europe assimilated a lot of indo-iranian folk, they entered panonian basin when the frankish empire destroyed samo's empire, then they took power over the remaining panonian slavs.

some time later, 50% of hungarian population got genocided by the mongols. the vacuum was filled with german and slavic colonists, mostly german though.

so modern hungarian isn't really a "mongol, turanist steppe warrior" anymore.

like >>3352528
>>3352554
pointed out, they are no different than their slavic and german neighbours in terms of genetics.

>>3352582
Well, genetics and culture. Modern Hungarian culture is fully Christian and central European, no different from Czech, Slovak or Austrian culture. If you think language is the only thing that makes people then okay.
>Saying the Magyars where not important
I never said that. I said modern Hungarians are not the descendants of ancient Magyars, which holds true.

>>3352585
>in terms of genetics.
Yes, but interestingly enough, they speak some finno-ugric gibberish instead of something Indo-European. I'd say that is quite some impact.

>>3352528

What does the blue one represent?

>>3352598
of course. culture and language is more important than genetics.

>>3352600
I2, a paleo-European haplogroup. Related to Scandinavian I1 and most common in the Balkans.

>>3352595
I'm not saying language is the only thing that makes people. but it is a very important part of culture and changing an entire region to some Uralic language for good is quite a bit of impact.
Of course their society collapsed after 955, but between their arrival in 899 and their downfall they completely changed Hungary. And that matters somewhat more than genetics.

>>3352623
There is far more to culture than just language though.

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>>3352623
Also their raids devastated and depopulated large regions all over Europe. Massive fortifications (for the time period) where built to withstand them. Also, knights in shining armor where recruited and a European horse warrior class was born.

>>3352640
Yes, society turned back to a Slavic agricultural lifestyle and was Christianized. Still cool that for around 90 years they where Flagellum Dei and full scale steppe niggered all of Europe. Also, Ugric language must be a huge pain in the ass in Europe.

>>3352663
It sort of is, but noblemen and officials in Hungary used Latin as an official language until the 19th century.

>>3352487
>>3352545
Hasn't it been proven that they're not genetically related to other uralic peoples? Implying that at some point they just picked up the language when migrating through those peoples

>>3352688
You have that proof in this very thread.

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>>3352688
Afaik their ethogenesis is unclear for now, only that the original language is from trans-Ural Siberia. Everything else is speculation.

>>3352706
Yeah, sure.

>>3352706

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>>3352723
See >>3352528
Or pic related.

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>>3352789
i somehow doubt it. western poles simply cannot cluster with germans, they would cluster with russians instead.

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>>3352789
Hows that a proof for the ethogenesis of Magyars or the travle of the language/culture from Siberia to modern day Hungary?
Like a couple thousand years ago, the Ugric people started to migrate, likely mixed with everybody on the way, became nomads, started venturing west, mixed with everybody on the way, stayed there for a couple centuries, went south west, mied with everybody on the way and stayed for some more centuries, then ventured west again, mixed with everybody around, stayed some more centuries and then finally a very small group of people arrived in Hungary and made a huge impact.
Now who does your fucking gene chart explain who the Magyars really were and where and when they really developed.
P.S. Uralic admixture in modern Hungarians is around 4.4% which is low, but higher than in any other group in the region.

>>3352803
Do you understand what the map is actually showing or not? It's not "western Poles", it's simply Polish markers from a FST spectrum projected on a map.

>>3352819
>P.S. Uralic admixture in modern Hungarians is around 4.4% which is low, but higher than in any other group in the region.
I'd need a source on that.

>>3352828
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4209567/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4209567/figure/F3/
Just for my understanding, why are you guys so fascinated by genetics when the example of the Hungarians makes it pretty clear that history is much more than that?

Why are Hungarians so swarthy? I've been both to Croatia and Hungary, and Hungarians were the more tanned ones. I was expecting the opposite.

>>3352853
Would you refer to your stepfather as your father?
>https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4209567/figure/F3/
That's not Uralic, that's Northeast Asian. The Yakuts are a Turkic group.

>>3352864
You probably encountered Gypsies.

>>3352853
If the question is who were the magyars as in where did they come from, genetics seem like a pretty good source for clues

>>3352874
Again, no one knows what mixed into they Magyars during their 1000 year travel. We only know that the initial language was Ugric and that they came into contact with lots of different people. Also due to their society it is entire possible that only a small elite of unknown genetic composition transported the culture and language to the next population mixed in and this happened again and again. It is well possible that the Magyars that took Hungary where genetically verry different from the Guys that started migrating a thousand years earlier.
By the way none of those guys is your father or your stepfather, they are like 50 generations away.

>>3352528
>>3352853
hmm, I'm not seeing much genetic difference

I think what must have happened is they found what was a paradise for steppe peoples in the Hungarian steppe surrounded by simple slav hill folk in the Carpathians who proved to be impressionable and obedient servants who adopted Magyar language and customs since they lacked a real culture of their own. After the Germanic onslaught the elite Magyars died in battle leaving the Slavs to cosplay as their old masters.

>>3352922
>However the Slavs being simple people with no real culture to speak of adopted their language and customs
You should really stop posting.

>>3352951
you're right, it is unlikely that the slavs could have defeated the magyars, I noticed my error and altered my theory >>3352949

>>3352919
>If the question is who were the magyars as in where did they come from, genetics seem like a pretty good source for clues
Especially when the genetics do not match the language at all....
Like apparently culture and language of people change and the guys that finally invaded Hungary might as well have mainly been Goths and Avars who had been magyarized by people that might have been themselves magyarized centuries earlier. Remember, there was a 1000 years with centuries of sedentary lifestyle inbetween migration periods.

>>3352949
>steppe peoples
Steppe people, maybe, we know they spoke an Ugric language, we don't know if that population was of Uralic origin as languages travel population borders.

>>3352977
>>3352981
this, likely Magyar migration and cultural creation was more bucket chain of people who influenced each others and transfered their culture and language to the next population than just some steppe niggers riding west in one go.

>>3352961
Slavs hiding in the forest were a fortress that could not be conquered.
The only reason Magyars established dominance over Pannonian basin is because Samo's Empire was destroyed by Franks, it shattered Slavic forces and they never recovered from it.

>>3353009
Samo's Empire was boss, though again it is the same trend of Slavs following a strange foreign "sorceror" who just seems to know better than them about things, how to build a bridge, how much grain they can trade while still having enough until next harvest, how to read, etc..

>>3353035
You can put that theory to work with every country in Europe.

>>3352949
>hill folk in the Carpathians
Try plains folk in the Pannonian basin.

>>3353009
There's a 300 year gap between Samo's empire and Magyar invasion, there were other Slavic kingdoms/polities during that time. Nitravia and Moravia for example.

>>3353057
Yes, but Moravia was not in Panonian Basin and Nitra was pretty much irrelevant.

>>3353063
Nitravia was conquered and annexed by Moravia.

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>>3352853
>why are you guys so fascinated by genetics when the example of the Hungarians makes it pretty clear that history is much more than that?

I was just curious why Hungarians look so generically European when their ancestors came from Central Asia.

>>3353129
>Urals are central Asia
Why are people ITT so stupid

>>3353129
Because we don't know if their ancestors came from Asia. We only know that their ancestors spoke a ugric language. They might have picked it up somewhere else.

>>3353132
2bh the actual uralic and siberian ugrics do look like fucking mongols, khanty and mansi etc

>>3353129
Being steppeniggers at first, they mixed with a lot of folks, considering that the Scythian Steppe's ancient limits were China on one side and the Carpathians on the other. Why are they blonde(ridiculously blonde and swarthy even considering the area)? They heavily mixed with the Pannonian Slavs, the Moravians, Croatians, Germans and probably with proto-Romanians. The one place where you can still find Hungarians with slightly chinky eyes? Szekelyfold, in the center of Romania, where the Szekely population didn't mix with other peoples all that much, except some Romanians and Germans.

>>3353142
The Magyars were a confederation of tribes and only by the virtue of surviving Lechfeld and not dissolving like so many before them do they still exist. The various linguistic or genetic elements that might puzzle us can be easily explained by the fact that they were not a linguistic or genetic unit.

>>3353009
Not a lot of trees in the Pannonian Plains tho.

T. steppenigger/gyppo hybrid that lives there