Has capitalism been the greatest force for good in human history?

Until the planet's resources are raped to oblivion, sure.

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>>3211803

>>3211803
Pretty much, only far-left and far-right extremists will disagree.

>>3211811
That's wrong though.

The free market version of capitalism with limited government and regulations is what has advanced humanity.

>>3211803
It's the most unstable economic system in human history

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>>3211803

>>3211812
>ristocrat born to money doesn't care about material wealth of commoners

surprising

>>3211803
The notion of someone having the freedom to create a good or service and then subsequently offer it in exchange for something else doesn't sound demonic to me.
You could say that our current system promotes greed and exploitation, but it is merely a reflection of what the consumer wants.
If everyone bought from ethical businesses tomorrow many of Capitalism's problems would cease to be.
Moreover, workers are free to unite within the structure of the free market and form workers co-ops.
These freedoms to do and be whatever we want cannot be found in the two fringe ideologies pic related.
I highly doubt society would be where it is today without people being allowed to do what they do best - create. The human spirit yearns for freedom.

>>3211883
Have a look at the Bronze Age command economies of the Ancient Near East and then come back and say that.

>conflating scientific progress with capitalism

>>3211929
>saying all this bullshit when manufactured consent, conspicuous comsumption, rise of the surveillance state, global warming, race to the bottom outsourcing and immigration and 08 exist
Posts like this makes me wanna be a tankie. Fascists may get the gulag, but neoliberals will always get the bullet.

>>3211803
i think what you meant to say there was technology? or perhaps peace?

>>3211834
This. Not perfect but superior to others.

>>3211896
>literally conceding his point
Well, thanks for trying

>>3211946
No system is perfect but it's a hell lot better then millions being slaughtered or starving to death. I'll be waiting for your bullet, anon.

>>3211950
Both brought about by neoliberalism

>>3211803
>halve proportion of population living in poverty since 1950
>while tripling world population

So the absolute amount of poverty increased then?

>>3211936
As much as i hate command economies, those worked pretty well for hundreds of years, through some pretty nasty stuff, until the clusterfuck of the Collapse.

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>>3211962
Sure but you excusing the unexcusable, sprouting such lies when all those stuff I listed disprove your shit. Nothing is worse than someone making the intolerable tolerable

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>tfw

>>3211987
What if I told you that wealth isn't something that is fixed and finite therefore it's not the rich people's fault that some people have less money not that it can't happen but it always has its own reason.

>>3211987
Lies? What I said is my opinion. An individual freely offering a good or service they created isn't something I view as wrong.
If anything, I find it quite odd that you'd blame the free market for societal issues that have no direct link with capitalism. Do you really believe climate change, government surveillance, manufactured consent wouldn't exist if capitalism didn't?
These are problems not exclusive to one economic system.
I could very well pose the same statement to you that you yourself are excusing the inexcusable.
It's fair enough that each of us have weighed the pros and cons and have come to different conclusions. That's just the way the cookie crumbles and I respect you for your beliefs.

>>3211828

How is it wrong to argue that the Earth's resources aren't finite? Are you high?

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>>3211946
All of those happened despite Neoliberalism, not because of it.
Also
>race to the bottom outsourcing
lol

>>3211957
It's a meme indicator, just like commies ramble about "muh GPD per capita".
Yes, the chinese guy who's throwing himself off the factory building now earns 1.15$ per day, instead of 0.90$, therefor breaching the 1$ ceiling.
Woop-ti-doo.
>>3211964
>Both brought about by neoliberalism
Not really.
I've yet to meet 1(ONE) "economic miracle" that's been brought by the implementation of specifically neoliberal policies.

>>3212002
What if I told you that social inequality leads to a lot of social ills? And that this pic shows that people perception of stuff are always gonna be shit?

>>3212006
But this are problems magnified or even ignored by capitalism. Shit on Soviet proporganda, but they have pretended they are anything other than that and do not manufacture consent

>excusing the inexcusable
I ain't excusing shit unlike you

On its own no, in combination with the industrial revolution yes.

>>3212019
>society should strive for economic miracles
You know they aren't inherently a good thing, right? And it's perfectly possible to develop a country without a fast surge in growth.
But if you want an example, Deng Xiaoping embracing a freer market and opening China to the world, consequently leading to the creation of the second-biggest economy and the largest drop in poverty rates ever experienced by a single country. Not to mention the spillover effects it had on other nations.

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>>3211929
>If everyone bought from ethical businesses tomorrow many of Capitalism's problems would cease to be.
Pure utopianism. Capitalism cannot exist without value exploitation.
>Moreover, workers are free to unite within the structure of the free market and form workers co-ops.
"The workers forming a co-operative in the field of production are thus faced with the contradictory necessity of governing themselves with the utmost absolutism. They are obliged to take toward themselves the role of capitalist entrepreneur – a contradiction that accounts for the usual failure of production co-operatives which either become pure capitalist enterprises or, if the workers’ interests continue to predominate, end by dissolving."
>These freedoms to do and be whatever we want cannot be found in the two fringe ideologies pic related.
Literally no ideology calls for people to do anything they want.
>I highly doubt society would be where it is today without people being allowed to do what they do best - create. The human spirit yearns for freedom
It's almost like labor is the expression of our species-mind and that we should not be forced to create soley to appease a capitalist.

>>3212019
http://www.slate.com/articles/business/the_dismal_science/1997/03/in_praise_of_cheap_labor.html

>>3212052
>And it's perfectly possible to develop a country without a fast surge in growth.
It was just an extreme example.
Fine, very heightened economic growth, due to EXPLICITLY neo-liberal measures.

>Deng Xiaoping embracing a freer market
Bitch, that's why i didn't say "less commie" or "freer market" or other vague terms.

China doesn't work just because they stopped being so pants-on-head communists, because it was just communism making way for some less retarded state-sponsored and regulated socialism that lets it's citizen more off-the-leash economically.

No, i'm saying some economists deciding to apply the austrian school, or whatever other die-hard capitalistic ideology loose upon a country or region, and it working out.

Do you have an explicit example?

>>3212067
Lenin is dead. His corpse is now a capitalist tourist attraction next to Moscow's financial centre. There is porbably a mcdonalds not far from there.

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>>3212096
>not refuting anything I said.

>>3211803
It's great until artificial superintelligence and autonomous corporations become a thing. Your atoms are better utilized to compose these paperclips.

>>3212022
Social ills like conformism? That's the most dangerous after hunger and coldness.

>>3211803
Capitalism is a wasteful system for harnessing genuinely useful forces like technology.

>>3212105
Trotskysm has never achieved power anywhere ever. The world revolution was a delusion he tried too hard to believe in.

>>3212136
The idea that ideologies make revolutions is literal idealism. Moreover, you keep changing the subject.

>>3211803
I love how global poverty rates have been falling almost exclusively due to Chinese and Indian policies which have repeatedly gone against neoliberal principles but somehow we have to thank neoliberalism for this.

>>3212067
>Capitalism cannot exist without value exploitation
Considering that value exploitation doesn't exist, I don't see how that's true.

>>3212144
If ideologies don't make revolutions, marxism has no purpose.

>>3212017
>2008
>not the poster child for neoliberal economics

>>3212179
How can two different types of goods be exchanged if value does not exist?

"Neo-Liberalism" is great and all, but such a system can onto thrive on a constantly growing pyramid scheme.
And the pyramid is starting to crumble.

>>3212213
Not really. Neoliberal economics is not a real term t b h

>>3212203
Communism is not a state of affairs to be established but the real movement that abolishes the present state of things. It's the concrete expression of the needs of the working class.

>>3212227
Where are the cracks?

>>3212218
Did I say value doesn't exist?
No, I didn't. I said "value exploitation doesn't exist", as in, the marxian concept of exploitation is nonexistent, because it rests of a wrong theory of value.

>>3211803
Not capitalism as much as globalization. Remember when every leftist was extremely anti-globalization since people assumed it would lead to more extreme poverty around the globe since corporations would have an easier time abusing cheap labor? You don't hear anything from them anymore for obvious reasons.

>>3212233
If you admit value exists there's no logical way you can declare workers receive the full value of their labor (and hence are not exploited).

>>3212115
Political cynicism and apathy, crimes in general, mental illness and anoime etcetera

>>3212017
And made far worse by neoliberalism.

>>3212230
Communism is a pretty concrete concept in Marxism of a specific state of affairs. And if it expresses the needs of the working class (or at least believes it does), why have all "revolutions" has been forced over by educated, upper-class men and not a single one brought about by spontaneous working class people? And why do walls always have to be built to prevent people from escaping?

>>3212350
>not knowing the Russian Revolution was kick started by working class women
>not knowing that Lenin and Stalin were working class as fuck
The only 'revolutionary' that I can think that fits your description is Rosa

>>3212011
"Capitalism is raping the earth" is a meme argument spouted by vegans and virtue signallers. Adam Smith's tragedy of the commons proves capitalists enjoy preserving resources.

>>3212360
Do you think Lenin would also try and jump over the Berlin wall to avoid the monstrosity he had created?

>>3212406
>Lenin
>creating the GDR
That question is irrevelant to the fact that you are wrong in claiming that revolutionaries were upper middle class

>>3212360
Not him but Castro too. Overall the revolutions have been started by lower class people though.

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>>3212415
>all these people demonstraring their love for socialism

>>3212429
>there aren't anti-capitalist demonstrations ever

>>3211803
Without a doubt.

>>3212429
>got BTFO with your history revisionism
>b-but muh Berlin Wall!
Damage_control.jpg

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>>3212433
Who would win:
>All the might of the USSR
>A supermarket

>>3211811
>Until the planet's resources are raped to oblivion
Then we'll move on to rape other planet's resources

>>3212440
>when the country that survived WW2 with its industries and population relatively intact out produce the one that did not
Kek, even your whataboutism is shit

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>>3212459
All western-european countries, plus Japan had better living standards.
By the way, the red stars on those tanks stand for "love".

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>>3212471
>All the countries that received financial investments from that country turned out better
Wow color me surprised

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>>3212478
>For a long time, on the plane to Miami, he sat motionless, his head in his hands. ‘What have they done to our poor people?’ he said after a long silence.” He added, “On his return to Moscow, Yeltsin would confess the pain he had felt after the Houston excursion: the ‘pain for all of us, for our country so rich, so talented and so exhausted by incessant experiments.’ ”

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/23/world/europe/23cnd-yeltsin.html?pagewanted=all

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>>3212360
>not knowing the Russian Revolution was kick started by working class women.

And almost kick out too

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Did nothing wrong

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>>3211803
Behold the victims of capitalism

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>in a socialist society, the environment wouldn't be exploited to benefit the few! Our natural ecosystems would be preserved for the good of the collective!

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>>3212504
>One person's feelings overrides the material difference between USA and Soviet Union

>people always point towards prosperity in the first world as an example of the wonders of capitalism
>despite the fact that the so-called luxury we live in only exists on the exploitation of the third world

>>3212551
That's the way it's always been senpai, all the way back to the Roman Empire and their exploitation of the agricultural class living in the less developed provinces.

>>3212527
I like how socialists need to include things like imperialism, WW2 and the fucking Korean War to try and make a point. Nevermind the fact that Marx defended imperialism as a means to bring undeveloped nations a step closer to socialism.

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>>3212539
>don't true socialism :^)

>>3212551
By improving living standards in the third-world, you mean. By a noble prize winner:
http://www.slate.com/articles/business/the_dismal_science/1997/03/in_praise_of_cheap_labor.html

>>3212564
>posting old memes
Socialists do love living in the past

>>3212559
Marx wasn't right about everything. You know he isn't a prophet right?

>>3212579
>Marx contradicted my own point on capitalism thus Marx is wrong

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>>3212579
Maybe you guys should consider changing the name of your ideology, then.

>>3212564
That pic's so old you forgot to edit Venezuela out after its fall.

>>3212594
No no
the protestors are evil because they want to eat

>>3212585
>>3212592
>being a Marxist means agreeing with whatever Marx said or did

>>3212605
>Marx advocated X in regards to socialism
>Nah he's wrong on that but I'm still a Marxist

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>>3212605
>being a Christian means I can disagree with Jesus

>>3212613
>Everybody in a movement must agree on any and everything, however minor or major

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>>3212605
>>3212585
>>3212579

left wing ideologies had a long historic tendency to dogmatism, marxist use the words "revisionist" or "reactionary" to any opposition. Reminds me the christians with the heretic persecution stuff.

>>3212621
>>3212621
That sounds pretty major. Especially if your own followers make a 180 and critisize that position as one of the worse things your opponents have done.

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>>3212617
>Marxism is a religion

>>3212628
And yet when someone points out a disagreement between Marx and marxists, you ignore it to confirm your biases

>>3211827
far-left people still see capitalism as a huge improvement over feudalism, only that it isn't the final stage in human history

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>>3212579
>>3212605
>>3212621
stop being a revisionist

>>3212636
If you're ignoring key parts of Marx's socialist theories then you're not a Marxist. Pick another socialist ideology that fits you since there's dozens out there.

>>3212633
>I cannot read or understand greentext:the post

>>3212636
>And yet when someone points out a disagreement between Marx and marxists, you ignore it to confirm your biases.

See >>3212642

>>3212643
It is not even a key part desu. Repeating your non-argument doesn't make it any less false.

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There is nothing wrong with neo-liberalism and capitalism. Money give me happiness

>>3212649
>dialectic materialism isn't a major part of Marxism
?????????

>>3212644
Disagreeing on minor things is fine. Crucifying your opponents as murderers for things the guy whose name is the basis for your ideology defended is not. With these mental gymnastics, it's no wonder China and the USSR did so well in the olympics.

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>>3212655
>advocating imperialism on third world countries is the only possible application of dialectic materialism

>>3212657
>More whataboutism

>>3212527
>korean war
>WW2 axis war crimes
>famines, disease, and world hunger
>Hurrican Katrina
>india's shitty caste system
>fucking cigarettes
>rwandan genocide
>FEUDAL russia
>khmer rouge (not communist
>WW1 and WW2 in general

g8 b8 m8 i r8 it 8/8

Also
>African slave trade
>150,000,000

Slavery in Africa has been there since ancient times and persists to modern time. The Atlantic Slave Trade which is what I suspect the retard meant only involved 12 million slaves, where """"only"""" 2 million died in transit.

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>>3212636
>And yet when someone points out a disagreement between Marx and marxists, you ignore it to confirm your biases.

You don't know how revolutions works, did you? This is because you are not a marxist (maybe you're just an ancom), If you said that disagreement with marx in the middle of the turmoil of a communist revolution and you will get a ticket to the gulag or the grave.

>>3212669
Too bad this imageboard isn't the middle of a communist revolution so why the fuck did you point that out?

>>3211834
could not be more wrong.

The closest the U.S has ever been to "free market" capitalism was the return to normalcy period, 1921 to 1929. Prior to that America and the European powers were heavily protectionist, and after Smoot-Hawley made shit worse, we switched to Kenysian style state-managed capitalism.

When Russia and China adopted pro-market reforms they didn't even come close to being "free market", but one where markets were driven by government incentive programs.

The only other time we've had "free market" style reforms is the post Reagan era, which even Alan Greenspan admitted died with the 2008 crash.

>>3212663
>>advocating imperialism on third world countries is the only possible application of dialectic materialism
it's not the only application, but it's a logical outgrowth of Marx's Theory of History
stop being a Maoist

>>3212693
>logical outgrowth of Marx's Theory of History
Which is open to debate and people are still debating that. So why pretend that it is so central to Marxism?

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>>3212679
What a cynical are you, Marxist push for revolutions, in revolutions there is no place for moderates, radical fanatics can easily outnumber whatever other derivative tendencies. if you support that maybe you preaching the wrong ideology.

>>3211803
Define poverty and define "good".

If you're a capitalist, there's a chance that you redefined those terms to suit your ideology.

Capitalism is structurally scarce. If we had what we needed, we would live much like many tribes around the world. Capitalism creates an ideological scarcity. It tells people they are "poor", and forces them into a job they never needed to pay for things they never wanted. But we're addicted to those materials, because they are comfortable now. We attracted to materials that are "normal", because all humans want to fit in; and we are attracted to materials that are valuable, as we all naturally want to be on top in an environment of equality (Humanity's desire for hierarchy), thus it's in the capitalist's best interest to sustain a system that abolishes hierarchy, that no one should have too much money, and that everyone should have opportunity, therefore it is progressively capitalistic to be progressively liberal, in a sense. This is why Russia was more inclined to become communist; they were in an environment that was structurally unequal, whereas the Americans lived in a system that was adequately equal (equal enough to cause internal domination, unequal enough to fool the masses into poverty). Marxism's worst atrocity wasn't that it made people into communists; but that it made the world into capitalists.

>>3212702
revisionists debate it because they're bourgeoisie traitors to the revolution. Ideologically orthodox Marxist-Leninists accept it as the truth

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I always laugh my ass off whenever /pol/ and the right Lionize and Idolize Neoliberalism. It's literally the reason why the West right now is getting bombarded with immigrants so they can keep the Capitalistic machine going because Capitalism is a system based on infinite growth on a finite plane.

>>3212664
And of course that socialist countries dis not engage in imperialism. Ever.
Not to mention the inclusion of fascism as capitalism.
The USSR made a literal non-agression pact with the Nazis in exchange for half of Poland. That's just disgraceful. They were ready to let all of Europe be devoured by Germany had Hilter not attacked them first.

>>3212727
Immigration is a good thing and is supported by Neoliberals.

>>3212727
Trivialization without practical basis. Next one please.

>>3212719
Yeah man, I don't really want to have steak for dinner, to have heating or my children to not die before the age of 5. Capitalists have really tricked me into thinking these things are good. What really want is to do backbreaking tedious manual labour and for half of what I grow to be taken by the local nobility so they can laze around all day and wank eachother off to the moral superiority of their system. You have really opened my eyes.

>>3211971
damn fish people

>>3212715
>what is "Reform or Revolution?"

>>3212724
>every Marxists is a Marxist-Leninist

>>3212741
>>every Marxists is a Marxist-Leninist
they will be when I'm done with them

>>3212663
The term whataboutism was literally created to describe a form of Soviet propaganda.

The top 6 American billionaires own more wealth than half of the worlds population.

>>3212764
Not true tho

>>3212783
ye it's actually the top 60 billionaires, and I don't know whether they are american

>>3212783
Yes true tho
https://www.commondreams.org/views/2017/02/20/morbid-inequality-now-just-six-men-have-much-wealth-half-worlds-population
https://www.ecowatch.com/richest-men-in-the-world-2274065153.html

>>3212837
Yes, sounds like a very trustworthy source. Oxfam is always so accurate!

>>3212845
>Yes, sounds like a very trustworthy source.
Yes it is. Either refute it by showing where the report is inaccurate on, or be wrong.

>>3212504
Ironic considering he made it worse for Russians

>>3212761
And I hope I am not the only one who sees this irony

>>3212350
Working class ppl are stoopid and need college boys to tell them what to do in life.

>>3213137
That wasn't whataboutism

>>3213159
>Thread about capitalism
>what about the USSR? What about the GDR? What about Lenin?
Like fucking clockwork

>>3211987
>muh income inequality
If the pie keeps getting bigger, it's to everybody's benefit even if your slice isn't getting bigger. Far leftists are morons.

>>3213162
If you go back on the discussion, it is mostly about a marxist disagreeing with marx. Nobody mentioned the GDR or Lenin.

Nobody on this board understands economics.

>>3214264
And this doesn't include you I guess

>>3211803
freed from poverty? no, they just made poverty the norm

>>3214847
>Mean, median, and modal quality of life in the first world is highest in human history
>"Poverty the norm"

>>3212368
>Adam Smith's tragedy of the commons proves capitalists enjoy preserving resources.
Your post only proves that you enjoy spouting bullshit

>>3211803
http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/2014/08/exposing-great-poverty-reductio-201481211590729809.html


>tfw you make uo arbitrary metrics and constantly change them to defend your 500 gorillion lifted out of poverty meme

>>3211937
Shhh

>>3212017
>being such a dweeb that you worship Ben 'the subprime mortgage crisis will be contained' Bernanke

>>3211966
>So the absolute amount of poverty increased then?
Yes
http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/2014/08/exposing-great-poverty-reductio-201481211590729809.html

>>3212121
This

>>3212350
>why have all "revolutions" has been forced over by educated, upper-class men and not a single one brought about by spontaneous working class people?
Imagine actually believing this. The workers councils in Russia asked the Bolsheviks to tske power

>>3211937
crapitalism is responsible for EVERYTHING. even the krakatoa eruption and bronze age collapse.

>>3212566
Krugman doesn't have a nobel prize because the nobel prize in Economic "science" is not real nobel prize.

>>3212730
>Not to mention the inclusion of fascism as capitalism.
Fascism literally is capitalist you numbskull

>>3215325
Not him but please don't say things that aren't true. The workers councils had some legitimacy but all that was lost when Lenin stormed through.
Academia overwhelmingly accepts that the Bolsheviks took control of both Petrograd and the Soviets by force after aligning with Kronstadt (who they later betrayed as well).
The Soviets consisted of a coalition of different groups. Groups that were subsequently purged by the Bolsheviks. I'm sure they asked for that.

>>3211937
managing capital is a science

>>3214264
Neither do most economists

>>3215333
>Capitalism is responsible for the Bronze Age collapse despite those societies being command economies.
Please stop.

>>3215349
No it is not, economics is not at all scientific.

What does "neoliberal" mean anyway? Isn't it the same as liberal?

>>3215355
shut up PORKIE

reed BOOK and go to GOOLAG

>>3215347
The bolsheviks had >60% of the vote in the supreme soviet. They had the right to tale power, and subsequent civil war that the tsarists started, and the assassination attempts by opponents made for extremely nasty and regrettable policy. The fact that world revolution failed in 1919, made sure the USSR would have become isolated and even more repressive.

>>3215369
>being this shit at banter

>>3211811
no. one word. illuminati.

>>3215347
>I'm sure they asked for that.
they asked for it by being counter-revolutionary fascists

>>3215388
Go be a tankie somewhere else

>>3215403
go be a bourgeoisie traitor somewhere else

>>3215376
So getting the highest vote equates to having the right to kill your constituents?
I'm not talking about Kerensky or the Whites. I'm talking about the underhanded tactics of the Bolsheviks.
Besides, of course they'd get the highest vote in the Second Congress when they have the guns and all the power in Petrograd.
>>3215388
>the Left SR were fascists
okaaaaay, let's just pretend this power grab wasn't simply the peasantry being muscled out.

>>3215409
>Besides, of course they'd get the highest vote in the Second Congress when they have the guns and all the power in Petrograd.
This was before the seizure of power. Either way the civil war made repressive policies somewhat necessary, as happens in every state that is at war.

>>3215240
Dozens of commoners fish a lake empty so a good wholesome capitalist buys the lake, lets the fish repopulate then only fishes the optimum amount to ensure the highest replacement rates of fish and highest production of fish long term.

Who is wasting resources here?

>>3215419
The Bolsheviks had defacto armed control over Petrograd from the Kornilov affair onwards with the Red Guard.
There wouldn't be a war if it weren't for the Bolsheviks' autism in the first place.
They destroyed the Soviet.

That being said, I'm not saying that the Whites were good guys either. Both sides in the war committed atrocities.

>>3215425
>a hypothetical
Compared to real world overfishing by capitalists in dozens of cases.

>>3211962
A lot of capitalist countries have engaged in mass murder too.

>>3212429
Funnily enough, millions of former East Germans miss the old days. The phenomenon has a name: Ostalgie.

>>3212504
At the time, many Russians were enjoying the capitalist freedom to starve unemployed on the streets.

>>3215579
Privatize fish stocks and fishing rights then.

The fact is p/e on the stock market is usually between 20 and 30 and capitalists are usually thinking ahead 20 to 30 years, no other system does this.

>>3215659
>millions of former East Germans miss the old days
those stupid fucks
>bitch and moan about freedom and shit for decades
>finally get it
>oh buhh freedom is scary lets go back :C
faggos should have read sartre stupid asses, they belong in the chinese part of the world

>>3215659
>Funnily enough, millions of former East Germans miss the old days.

The only thing they miss is their lovely socdem with gunz. Also poltards miss the "good old times" too, what is the difference?

>>3212539

That's the thing about global warming, it conveniently suits your political agenda in this post, but you will deny it a thread later.

>>3216156
Yes... global warming

>In the early 1960s,[15] the Soviet government decided the two rivers that fed the Aral Sea, the Amu Darya in the south and the Syr Darya in the east, would be diverted to irrigate the desert, in an attempt to grow rice, melons, cereals, and cotton.
This was part of the Soviet plan for cotton, or "white gold", to become a major export. This temporarily succeeded, and in 1988, Uzbekistan was the world's largest exporter of cotton.[16]

>>3216192

>he doesn't know the Aral sea has been declining since the last glacial maximum of 18,000 years ago

File: Aral_sea.jpg (11KB, 235x214px) Image search: [Google]

11KB, 235x214px

>>3216283
>wow nature works in mysterious ways, don't you think.

Nope, your soviet heroes have the guilty here, In the 1920s, the Soviet Union turned lands of the the Uzbek SSR into cotton plantations and ordered the construction of irrigation canals to provide water to the crops in the middle of the plateau of the region. These hand-dug, irrigation canals moved water from the Anu Darya and Syr Darya rivers, which were the rivers that fed the freshwater Aral Sea. Until the 1960s, the system of canals, rivers, and the Aral Sea were fairly stable. However, in the 1960s, the Soviet Union decided to expand the canal system and drain more water from the rivers that fed the Aral Sea.

File: water table.jpg (26KB, 372x232px) Image search: [Google]

26KB, 372x232px

>>3216323

If you read further you will see it noted that the vast majority of water loss came from evaporation, due to the high temperatures. A little something you may not know about geology, the surface of the lake corresponds to the highest extent of the water table, even if you divert the feeding river, groundwater discharge should still feed the lake, unless the water is going elsewhere, say through evaporation.

>>3211812
Woke , gotta love Evola
>>3211905
For an aristocrat who could've just sat back and died of old he sure did everything he could to fuck up his livelihood. Better than Evola was Codreanu who also said the same.

Capitalism has by far been the greatest force of good so far.

>>3211883
>>3211896
>>3211950
>>3211966
>>3212121
>>3212171
>>3212242
>>3212527
>>3212719
>>3214847
>>3215293

Please never reproduce for the sake of humanity.

>>3216453
I agree with you, but quoting every post is a sign of autism. Take your own advice, for /his/'s sake.

>>3211803
>Artificially increase world's population towards ad infinitum industrial growth
>Whole earth will be a gigantic dump in 100 years
>Redefine definition of poverty to absolute poverty while there is a massive population boom in Asia and Africa
Lmao the delusion is real

Even if you're a capitalist try to read marx faggots

>>3216474
Welcome to 4chan, the most boring and predictable right wing popular site you can find after reddit

>>3216378
The Aral seas was bound to disappear but there's no denying Soviet agricultural practices contributed to its current size. That isn't to say it wouldn't have happened under a non-communist policy. Also, that type of groundwater gradient doesn't really correspond to such long distance and high volume water transport in any immediate way.
t. studying to be a geology major with hydrology specialization.

>>3216378

Man, the desertification process was due over exploation of freatic level for irrigation of cotton crops, cotton is a very demanding crop and requiere alot of water and fertilizer, this acelerate de erotion process even more and contaminate the soil too.
Additionally, the USSR once had a biological-weapons testing facility (Vozrozhdeniya Island) on one of the lakes within the Aral Sea, contaminating the zone even more with chemicals and biological spores. The true is,you can't say the soviet government don't have any responsibility in this ecological disaster.

File: Future_comunism.png (837KB, 1430x801px) Image search: [Google]

837KB, 1430x801px

>>3216479
>>3216474

What are you both hopeless? don't you think automatization in the end will bring you your utopia.

>>3216479
>Reddit
>Right wing
Hello newfriend

>>3215579
>brings up an example of an IRL commons failing in order to attack the idea that commons fail
What did he mean by this?

>>3211803
& humanities was a mistake

>>3212527
im starting to think this is bait

>>3212641
But feudalism is better that capitalism

>>3212739
>Confusing technological advancement for ideological superiority
FUCKING MATERIALISTS REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

>>3211811
>the neolib world order is going green
>the greatest world power moves further away from green policies as it moves away from neoliberalism and towards protectionism
really fires those neurons

>>3212067
A worker creates to appease a consumer. The capitalist is the middleman.

>>3219416
>going green
>thinking recent green research and the Paris Agreement is going to do shit
>thinking that greener production is genuinely helping instead of commodification of conserving the environment
The only real way to slow global warming is reduce consumption, not buying 'greener' products

>>3212171
1. Chinese economic growth banks on special economic zones which are deregulated to a greater extent than all of the West. They also have nearly no labour protection or environmental protection.
2. India is so deregulated finnancially that the shadow economy is many times greater than the taxed economy.
3. These countries are so competitive because it's cheaper for multinationals to produce there and then export to the west, with little to no tariffs in between and transportation costs going down constantly, spending pennies on foreign workers and employing less western workers.

These aren't meant as arguments against or for neoliberalism, I'm just pointing out that neoliberalism is the bread and butter of these emerging markets. Maybe you don't understand what neoliberalism is.

>>3212727
The new right (pol-types, storm-types, alt-right-types, the republican party right now) is protectionistic. They are not neoliberals. They are enemies of those that genuinely believe in free global trade.

>>3214847
Poverty was the norm. The middle-class grew and continues to grow with neoliberalism. It's shrinking in the west, and domestic reforms will be required to counteract this, but it is growing worldwide.

What the fuck even is this thread?

>>3219446
Lowering emissions is the end-goal. Making production more efficient, greener is the middle-step. Kyoto was the first big step.

Even if the environmental footprint reduces in the west, it would be cruel to deny a higher standard of living to the poor in emerging markets. Considering the food waste in countries such as the USA, redistribution could go a long way, but there is still a lot more that can be done to better humanity worldwide and that will require growth - making it so that this growth can be sustained til population caps is the way to go.

>>3219534
Brainlets not realizing that stabler economies are mixed economies.

>>3219542
This

>OP praises capitalism
>Thread is entirely dominated by commies
I rarely come to this board, has /his/ always been this leftist

>>3219534
Shitposters and newfags trying to one-up each other in terms of memes and who can garner the most replies.

>>3219669
it's being actively raided by /leftypol/
you can tell because they always post the same set of retarded infographics claiming to prove the superiority of planned economies

>>3212551
That's quite simply not true. The idea of the "third world" has been verifiably false for decades now as shown by, among others, the late Hans Rosling.

The myth lives on largely because leftist academics that would rather be "good" than right.

>>3219735
Also, please note that I'm not saying all leftist academics do this. The previously mentioned Rosling leaned towards the left himself and didn't necessarily think laissez-faire capitalism was the way to go, but he also had no shame in admitting that market economics certainly had done more good for humanity than planned economics.

>>3211966
kek, nice troll response. i guess this counterpoint would go in an antinatalist, primitavist, malthusian favor