Why did America abandon its streetcars and interurban networks

>>3127538
(((they))) orchestrated it
(((they)))=General Motors=happy merchants

Most places did, unfortunately. The streetcar conspiracy is overstated, and even without some unfortunate levies placed on companies with regards to road maintenance most of the streetcar networks were unprofitable and seen as obsolescent by the mid century. Seems crazy the lack of foresight people had that would make them abandon light and heavy rail networks despite population growth.

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>>3127546
Don't forget the role that urban planners like (((Robert Moses))) played in the deliberate destruction of public transit in America.

>Robert Moses (December 18, 1888 – July 29, 1981) was a public official who worked mainly in the New York metropolitan area. Known as the "master builder" of mid-20th century New York City, Long Island, Rockland County, and Westchester County, he is sometimes compared to Baron Haussmann of Second Empire Paris, and was one of the most polarizing figures in the history of urban development in the United States. His decisions favoring highways over public transit helped create the modern suburbs of Long Island and influenced a generation of engineers, architects, and urban planners who spread his philosophies across the nation despite not training in those professions. Moses would call himself a "coordinator" and was referred to in the media as a "master builder".[3]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Moses

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>all of this was scrapped

Feels bad, man.

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What a waste

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SAD!

FDR sucking Goodyear's and GM's fat cock for campaign donations.

>>3127614
>>3127627
>>3127631
imagine being homeless or in the post apocalypse turning those into a big house

>m-muh trains! The c-cars did this!

Stay mad, foamers.

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>I was a regular commuter of LA's PCCs for several years, right up to the day of abandonment. To the credit of the LAMTA, that I despised, the cars were were all maintained in excellent, impeccable condition to the very end. The abandonment made no sense to me, and I made my very vocal and caustic views on the matter known to the LA Times, Mayor Yorty, George Putnam (the "Paul Harvey" of Los Angeles, for those not from here), and anyone else that would listen, much to the irritation of LAMTA Special Agents who made repeated visits to my house.

>Indeed, LAMTA officials made verbal threats to "cease and desist"....."OR ELSE." In the end, it was all for nothing. The LAMTA did not have to answer to anyone, they did as they pleased. And so LA's PCC system, with DECADES of service life remaining, was sacrificed on the altar of "progress."
I rode the "New #26 Pico Bus line" on the first week day of the "Silverliner" bus service with its "improved curb service." The level of comfort was an inferior, appalling experience, to say the least. After just one week of this "new and improved service," I said to HELL with LA's public transit and like millions of other Angelenos, started driving to school (LA Trade Tech) and later in the day, to work. In the months that followed, I watched through the windshield of my car as all traces of the PCC system that I so revered, disappeared before my eyes.

>It was not until the opening of the Long Beach Blue Blue Line in July of 1990, that I returned to LA's public transit system. And speaking of that fiasco, if anyone had paid any attention to me and the 8000 Long Beach line commuters that signed my petitions back in 1960, taxpayers could have saved $700 million to reinstate something that was already there. A bunch of damn fools running this city at that time....

http://www.pacificelectric.org/los-angeles-railway/lamta-3137-and-3143-on-the-road-to-oblivion/

>>3127554
retard detected

it never happened in Melbourne, the street car capital of the world, which coincidentally has the best and comfiest public transport

same in europe

this shit was endemic to the robber barron 3rd world where rockefeller and the oligarchs rule

>>3127561
robert moses was a hired gun for the robber baron fascist oligarchs, like ayn rand and kissinger

>>3127538
>In the early 1900s, General Motors' long-time president, Alfred P. Sloan, Jr., began implementing a plan to expand auto sales and maximize profits by eliminating streetcars.
>In 1922, Sloan established a special unit within GM that was charged with, among other things, the task of replacing the United States' electric railways with cars, trucks, and buses. Consumers who no longer had the option of taking the streetcar turned first to the bus lines and, eventually, to owning and driving their own automobiles.

no public transport because car companies bribed government officials in the 40s and 50s to plan cities without public transport oriented towards cars ie us suburbia

public transport was sabotaged to steer the flock towards car/oil

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5Wlo0Pv344

Segal
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L2lMxCA7CL4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_NcwTbpIDQ


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Motors_streetcar_conspiracy

>In 1930 the electric streetcar ruled Chicago

with social engineering and propoganda campaigns, GM successfully wasted billions of public tax dollars.
wasted billions of public $$ to fund their monopoly.

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>>3128059
>it never happened in Melbourne, the street car capital of the world, which coincidentally has the best and comfiest public transport
And why is Melbourne "the street car capital of the world" my Dunning-Kruger afflicted friend?

>>3127538
Auto Utopianism
Seriously
Americans are fucking stupid

>>3128064
Tell me more, I'm listening.

>>3128072
>Segal
>citing a fucking d-list actor acting in a d-list movie as evidence of anything

lmaoing@ur life

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>>3128108
>think you are just meming because the guy in the vid has the same surname
>get bored, check video
>the cunt has actually posted some stephen seagal shit

>>3127538
Wasn't this mentioned in "Who framed Roger Rabbit"?

I remember the bad guy saying it.

Also, that shit happened in South America too, Peru, Bolivia and Colombia (maybe I'm confusing some names).

>free market makes streetcars obsolete
>better cry conspiracy!

Typical.

>>3127614
>>3127627
>>3127631
Brutal.

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>>3127538
>How come cheap transit isn't popular in capitalist narco-corporatocracy

Next you'll be like those mooks in /sp/ that constantly ask why soccar isn't popular in the US when US soccar players are paid peanuts comparative to eggtoss or apehoop.

>>3128661
>capitalist narco-corporatocracy

What the fuck does this even mean? Not an argument.

>>3128670
A system of monetary servitude led by doped up corporate executives who have powers far exceeding the figurehead people think they elect every four years?

>>3128342
>free market
There was a very, very visible hand at work to make sure streetcars didn't catch on

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>neo-liberal libertardians will defend destroying this

>American auto industry
lmao

>>3127561
>Moses

Every fucking time is "them"

>>3128860
Confirmation bias. Seek help.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Ug94xEHZoE

>>3127538
they are still used frequently here in the california bay area

>>3127561
rest in piss

>>3127844
i fucking hate politicians

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You might be interested in discussing the topic in /upg/ on >>>/n/ or just making a new thread there.

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>>3129352
Unrelated, the tram 651 nowadays, after restoration.

>>3127538
Our city may not have streetcars anymore but we have a "streetcar" on wheels that acts a little tourist attraction/ride for people to ride and experience what it was like to ride in a streetcar several decades ago.

>>3129447
Not the same at all considering the difference in ride physics between streetcars and buses.

>>3127538

Because Americans themselves wanted cars. Railroad companies weren't known for being nice anyway, most of them were extremely unscrupulous in how they operated so people wanted to avoid them entirely. From 1950 to 2000, they did so successfully via the Interstate freeways that were built. However, this era is over and the killing blow will be when Congress lets states privatize highways.

>>3127561

He wasn't doing anything different than private railroad companies, who themselves did the same thing but with trains. He did it with cars and with taxpayer money.

Old people thought cars were more convenient and "modern".

They didn't want to spend public funds on subsidizing electric transit.

>>3127594

It's not as bad as you think. Pacific Electric needed a LOT of investment in the 1950s, more than what LA (the city) could offer due to white flight causing their tax base to dwindle. And in the end LA is rebuilding it bigger and better anyway, the two big projects underway being the Regional Connector (new downtown subway) and LinkUS (run-through tracks at LA Union Station). The sadder loss is the Key System up in Oakland, because it hasn't been replaced and cannot easily be so.

>>3127961

eh, the new trains got big ADA sized platforms

>>3128342

The only reason cars go so big was because the government regulate railroad ticket pricing and build a massive freeway system using taxpayer money.

This isn't the free market, it's literal socialism. Which makes sense as automobiles were made by UAW Democrats who wanted their profession protected by more efficient means of transport.

>>3131847
cars are more convenient. public transit fucking sucks.

>>3131847

They didn't need to be taught, cars had air conditioning and bigger seats. It was the clear upgrade for those that could afford it.

>>3128661
Soccer isn't popular in the US, because it sucks

>>3131863

Cars *were* more convenient. Try driving from LAX to Van Nuys during commute hours.

>>3131863
Cars alone are inadequate. Public transit is fine if its maintained and modern.

>>3131866
Never said otherwise?

>>3131871
*where I live cars are more convenient

>>3131897
That's nice. They're far from it in many other parts of the country.

>>3128064
>like ayn rand and kissinger
fucking what? ayn rand never actually did anything and politics was always kissinger's game, not business

>>3128059
>Melb
>best public transport
The fuck are you on about. They're only just starting to plan a cross cbd train line. And there's no outer loop. And there's a broken down tram on st Kilda Ed jamming half the network every other day

>>3128059
Ehhh I wouldn't say melbourne's public transport is the best. They ripped up a lot of lines around the same time as the seppos. It's definitely a stretch better than most though.
Fortunately I think sentiment is largely public transport friendly in melbs, so there is a demand for more infrastructure

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>The last day of regular service was a very sad day for me. For several months I had been getting petitions signed by rail passengers to prevent abandonment — petitions given to me by the City Of Long Beach on actual city letterhead. In all, about 8000 passengers signed the petitions. I, along with Long Beach city officials, went to court in an effort to save the rail service. The court ordered the Southern Pacific to make the right-of-way available to the LAMTA, but the LAMTA was not interested in continuing the rail service for many reasons. I really thought we would win the fight to save the rail service. Twice while I was petitioning aboard the cars, MTA Special Agents put me off the train, telling me that I was not allowed to petition on State Property.. The second time they threw me off the train late at night at Dominguez Junction. I was pissed. I had to walk a mile to find a pay phone and call my dad to come and get me. I got an ear full from him. All this work was for nothing. I was 18 years old at the time and on the very last run as we pulled into Long Beach at dawn, the track was lined with red flares in the dawn mist. I broke down and cried like a baby. I will NEVER FORGET THAT LAST RUN.

>>3131869
This. I will concede that apehoop is inferior to Rugby

>>3127538
California is really the worst offender of this shit, almost every major city had a good rail car system and they ended up getting scrapped. From what I hear there was considerable pressure back then to get people buying cars. Which sucks now because there way too many fucking cars on the road.

>>3132995
I thought Cali still had railcars. The worst offender bar none is Detroit

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>>3132961

Out with the old, in with the new. See that curb? Metro trains now get their own Right-Of-Way and total signal priority (traffic lights automatically go yellow) at intersections. This is a vast improvement over the system that was torn out.

It's unfortunate people had to suffer through a half century of fuckall transit, but the silver lining is that it's being rebuilt better than ever.

>>3133001

Not him but CA was the worst offender because of LA, the largest city in the nation actually chose to dismantle ALL of their metrorail services. However, LA has mostly rebuilt their network so people don't remember the wound that existed. Detriot is a close runner up though, but Detriot has fallen apart in so many other places (culminating in their recent bankruptcy) where the lack of mass transit is less of a priority.

Ultimately, because you can take a motor car wherever you want.
Taking the trolley across the country is hard

streetcars were losing money and modern lightrail and metrorail is a white elephant scheme as well

>>3133022

it really wasn't because you could take one to the train station then get on a transcontinental train. You still can via Amtrak.

>>3133028

>and modern lightrail and metrorail is a white elephant scheme as well

how so?

>>3133034
rail has only a fraction better energy efficiency which is offset by infrastructure costs and the need to constantly stop and start on a small scale, I would go as far as saying we should abandon the subways too and fill them with liquid polyurethane foam

>>3127538
Because of the concentration of black people in cities during the 2nd half of the 20th century.

Dismantling public transportation is an extremely effective way to maintain de facto segregation of poor minority populations. Anyone who can't afford a car can only travel as far from home as they can walk in half a day. Combined with urban planning like you see in LA where major highways separate the ghetto from wealthier areas, it can be completely impossible for a coon to ever make it to the white neighborhoods.

>>3133085

>a fraction better energy efficiency

It isn't because steel wheels on steel rails are subject to far less friction than rubber tires on concrete roadways. Additionally regenerative braking systems can be used on electric railways, removing the inefficient inherit with braking in the first place. Also trains stop less than cars, because trains have a fixed and clear guideway while cars don't.

>I would go as far as saying we should abandon the subways too and fill them with liquid polyurethane foam

and why not concrete, as is what happened in real life with LA's original red car terminal?

>>3127538
>>3128072
>>3128059
>>3133028
>>3131842
>>3128149

Railways were a huge part of the 19th century USA and at that time our railway corporations were not only profitable, but were among the best in the world.

Then the early 20th came along, some ruthless guy named Rockefeller started a company called Standard Oil...and everything went to shit.

Its actually amazing how much one man cucked the USA, and in some ways the entire world. He's not Rothschild tier, but he's pretty close.

Anyway, the USA doesn't want to use less oil, because guys like Rockefeller wanted to use the most oil possible. He not only helped kill/restrain our railways, but he also battled Henry Ford over making sure automobiles ran on oil instead of corn grain alcohol (which would have made more sense in every way)

All this shit we have now. The Global oil market, Saudi Arabia controlling the petrol dollar, etc etc. It can all be traced back to Standard Oil (Rockefeller)

>>3133196
>>3128072
>>3128149

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfred_P._Sloan#Streetcar_scandal

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_General_Motors#Nazi_collaboration

Sloan is credited with establishing the concept of planned obsolescence.
watch "Who Framed Roger Rabbit"

"the Red Car plot, suburb expansion, urban and political corruption really did happen," Price stated. "In Los Angeles, during the 1940s, car and tire companies teamed up against the Pacific Electric Railway system and bought them out of business. Where the freeway runs in Los Angeles is where the Red Car used to be."[11] In Wolf's novel Who Censored Roger Rabbit?, the Toons were comic strip characters rather than movie stars

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Who_Framed_Roger_Rabbit

cities/towns/suburbs/residential were planned and designed by car/oil companies

>>3133196

Rockerfeller did what Stanford wanted to do.

>making sure automobiles ran on oil instead of corn grain alcohol (which would have made more sense in every way)

We're more or less returning to that due to states (notable California) making emissions requirements more and more stringent. Already LNG/CNG fleet vehicles are common, Ethanol is just around the corner especially when it's backed by the agribiz lobby.

>>3133202

>cities/towns/suburbs/residential were planned and designed by car/oil companies

Same but for railways. In fact most highways parallel most railways anyway.

>>3133249
>>3133254
wtf are you? a PR monkey for robber barrons?

post war economic stimulus by the government. get everyone out the urban areas and out into the suburbs. to buy a house, a car or two, and spend more disposable income on recreation.

mass transit used to be a profitable private venture. then the great depression saw them struggling and governments took over the operations and started bungling it.

>>3133489
>get everyone out the urban areas and out into the suburbs.

Except that's what the original interurban streetcar networks were designed to do. Or rather, get suburbs connected to urban areas so they could make huge profits on land sales.

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I'm from /n/, and some important things haven't been mentioned in this thread:

From the 1920's when the automobile became widely popular, streetcars lost their advantage over other modes of travel because they were slowed by all the cars on city streets. People quit riding them largely because they weren't efficient ways to travel anymore. Cities also had an incentive to replace streetcars with buses because maintaining overhead wires and fixed tracks is expensive, and buses can go anywhere, meaning that you have a lot more flexibility when selecting a transit route.

What killed streetcars? The development of the modern bus that could carry just as many people without needing the fixed route.

What killed the bus in America? That was post-WW2 zoning and home finance policies that encouraged people to live in suburbs not dense enough to support mass transit of any kind. And Americans on the whole were perfectly happy to move away from dangerous, dirty cities that were increasingly full of niggers and spics - car ownership was just a part of that package deal.

>>3133028
You forget that cars are losing your money indirectly on the road infrastructure. It's all paid from taxes, and it means from your pocket.

>>3133675
this

also oil, peak oil, oil wars, traffic (lost time, health issues)

>costly, inefficient, unpopular
>wasting billions of public fund $$ on dismantling established infrastructure
>wasting billions of public fund $$ on building highways and roads
>wasting billions each year on new car purchases
>wasting billions of hours in traffic

>>3133779
what's your solution then? china and the US are huge countries

>>3133779
>>3133675
>>3128072
>>3133202
>cars a fucking waste
fucking this

cars are built to be replaced every 5 years
instead of building long-lasting cars, they build shit that is guaranteed to be useless in 5 years.
it is called planned obsolescence

GM transitioned to a "buy a car yearly" model and gimped every car they produced then and made mad dosh
The fuckers bought out a guy who had managed to create a 100 mpg engine back in the 80's for millions
Then they went and locked it away in some shelf and it hasn't seen the light if day since.
Shit, VW has a car that could hit 300 mpg if you drive it right and the US government outright banned them from even showing it off here

>>3133675
>>3133789
>>3133779
so much this

we were told that we passed peak oil more than a decade ago
>the rise in oil prices over the last decade was a result of the peak oil crisis
>shale oil utilized, price does not decrease
>already way past peak oil and Saudi declares it will dramatically increase oil supply, indefinitely
>shale business goes bust
>oil prices decline rapidly

all of a sudden peak oil propaganda magically disappears. we can close all the shale business and just rely on Saudi increased production once more.

i heard that the gov't actually subsidized production and purchase of gas-guzzling SUVs that get 10 miles per gallon. it is ironic that the increase in production and purchases of SUVs coincided with the peak oil crisis with dramatic rise in gas price.

it is absurd to see US going to war "for oil" because of "peak oil", "oil shortages", "oil price increases" and yet, at the same time they increase production of gas-guzzling SUVs, becoming the most common car on the road. The gov't even funded and subsidized purchases of SUVs for the population.

and at the same time: magically stop shale oil production, magically increase Saudi oil production, magically have dramatic oil price declines..

The bastards are at like 80% storage capacity in the Cushing storage facility despite shutting down almost 800 rigs. They've tried to keep those prices up, hard, shutting down rigs, "refinery maintenance", labor strikes, the works. Fuel prices are still up compared to crude.
All of this without even considering all the new crude found and the abandoned projects.
It was all a ruse and the Saudi's showed they're willing to fuck everyone over market share.

>>3133801
>>3133789
>>3133779
>>3133675
>>3127538
>>3128072

just like the light bulb conspiracy

>Phoebus cartel destroyed long-lasting cheap light bulb with short-term bulbs that kept the customer buying more
>Centennial Light is the world's longest-lasting light bulb at least 120 years old
>The hand-blown carbon filament common light bulb was manufactured in Shelby, Ohio, by the Shelby Electric Company in the late 1890s;[5] many just like it still exist and can be found functioning.
http://spectrum.ieee.org/geek-life/history/the-great-lightbulb-conspiracy

>planned obsolescence
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zdh7_PA8GZU

>>3133779
>>3133202
>>3133196
>General Motors and Ford creates the motorized nazi war machine
>IBM partners with nazis to efficiently run the extermination of millions in Europe with IBM systems
>The Carnegie Institution and its sponsored movement spent millions to propagate American eugenic theories in post-WWI Germany, financing and directing race science programs in universities and official institutions. These included the idea that Jews must be eliminated.
>Rockefeller funded Hitler’s chief raceologist Otmar Verschuer and his insatiable twin experimentation programs.

U.S. oil companies sold oil to Nazi Germany
the Rockfeller literally allowing Hitler to keep killing millions of Europeans by selling them oil (and being their main if not only provider for a while).

>GM's Opel was the largest car and truck maker in the Third Reich. When Hitler came to power, his nation was still primarily a horse-drawn country. From the outset, GM consciously mass produced cars and truck for the German military, becoming a major and indispensable spear of Nazi rearmament. This included the Blitz truck which became the mainstay of the Blitzkrieg that conquered Europe. GM concealed its American control of Opel through special executives committees and board directorates. After the War, GM took all the profit, including that gained from slave labor. After a Congressional investigation, GM tried to obscure the facts and pressured Washington about a special report on the company's activities. To this day, the company frustrates research efforts into its protracted and profitable involvement in Nazi genocide

>>3133851

>General Motors, James D. Mooney, received the Grand Cross of the German Eagle for his distinguished service to the Reich. "Nazi armaments chief Albert Speer told a congressional investigator that Germany could not have attempted its September 1939 Blitzkrieg of Poland without the performance-boosting additive technology provided by Alfred P. Sloan and General Motors".[20][21][22] During the war, GM's Opel Brandenburg facilities produced bombers JU-88, trucks, land mines and torpedo detonators for Nazi Germany

>confiscate Jewish assets. IBM solution: all banks and financial institutions were run by IBM cards which were programmed to seek out the Jewish names and their accounts for seizure. Fourth: ghettoize the Jews. IBM Solution: cross-match families from their existing residences into crowded dilapidated slums so that in a single day, thousands of people could be efficiently transferred from point A to point B. Fifth, deport the Jews to camps. IBM solution: most of the railroads in Europe were routed by IBM punch cards. Create special depots to ensure that trains with cattle cars were made available to transport Jews to camps. Inbound, these trains were crowded with helpless humans. Returning, they were empty.
>IBM systems efficiently identify, track, manage, transport, and route millions of prisoners to extermination
>IBM systems maintained efficient scheduling of trains transporting millions to camps

>>3132343
>being this retarded

all burger elite are followers of the Rand cult, which is a proxy cult created by robber barrons to worship themselves

Reagan, neocons, kissinger, Alan Greenspan, Paul Ryan, republicans... all worship the Rand cult

Rand was awestruck by who she called “the great industrialists,” such as John Rockefeller, Andrew Carnegie, and Henry Ford

Rand's Atlas sculpture at the Rockefeller Center which is on the cover of Atlas Shrugged


equating Randian individual well-being with that of the Volk according to Goebbels and similarities between the "moral syntax of Randianism" and fascism

>>3133249
>Stanford
>a supreme ubermensh because he dug for gold
>one of the leading authorities of nazism/eugenics

>Rockefeller
>a supreme ubermensh because he dug for black tar and forced people to buy it
>one of the leading authorities of nazism/eugenics

The first great eugenicist supreme ubermensh was Vanderbilt’s, which grew out of the railways. Vanderbilt, born in 1794, at age twelve could hardly write his own name, but he was greedy, ruthless, and power-hungry. He began with passengers and freight. He was never particularly creative, though he was presented as such in books. He was certainly the leading merchant pirate and scoundrel of his day. His first millions were primarily the result of extortion, cheating, and theft. The mail his steam ships carried won not only foreign postage payments, but also substantial government subsidies. The postal subsidies were the real foundation of his wealth. The War put an end to his shipping career. He began a railroad enterprise at the age of 69, though he knew nothing at all about the technology and administration of this branch of transportation. Vanderbilt knew how to present himself as a leading patriot during the Civil War. When the Union government decided to send a fleet to Orleans in 1862, it bought the very ships from Vanderbilt that government subsidies had built. He even lent one of his unused ships to the government. By means of manipulation Vanderbilt succeeded in driving down the stocks of the NY Harlem railroad at the end of 1863, and bought the majority of the shares, which rose from $9 a share in the middle of 1863 to $50. It was also the usual practice to bribe the city council to secure certain railroad lines.

>>3133991
>>3133899
>>3133853
https://beyondthecurtain.wordpress.com/2010/02/21/eugenics-and-the-nazis-the-california-connection/

>>3133801
Wait, what are you even saying here? That peak oil is a scam to keep oil prices up, and that "war for oil" is an excuse to keep destabilizing the Middle East via Saudi Arabian-backed proxy wars? You'll have to be clearer on this.

>>3133899
>>3134016
the kings used the church to justify their supremacy and rule over slaves

the robber barrons use the rand cult to do the same

>>3134016
did you just grow a brain?

>>3129016
(((Pure coincidence)))

>>3134026
No, it's just hard for me to translate schizophrenic ramblings.

>>3134038
ok, if thats the case then next time please just state that you are a mongoloid and we will be happy to spoonfeed you the entire thread

here is a start >>3133196, all you need to do is scroll up, mongoloid

>>3127538
>cable
We still have them in San Francisco.

>>3134060
Yeah "big oil" and "big autos" is such an original and groundbreaking boogeyman, congratulations you blew the lid right off the top. You aren't even bold enough to blame the Jews because you're worried about what your internet friends on reddit will think of you so you pick the safest target there is. Congratulations.

>>3134060
easy on the newfag

robber barrons are just bigots and made their created nazi Germany. Allen Dulles's (cia) was their hired gun and had the firm of Sullivan and Cromwell because they supported Fascism. The Dulles brothers arranged American investments in Nazi Germany in the 1930s.

Instead of divesting the Nazi money," continue the authors, "Bush hired a lawyer to hide the assets. The lawyer he hired had considerable expertise in such underhanded schemes. It was Allen Dulles. According to Dulles's client list at Sullivan & Cromwell, his first relationship with Brown Brothers, Harriman was on June 18, 1936. In January 1937 Dulles listed his work for the firm as 'Disposal of Stan [Standard Oil] Investing stock.'

"As discussed in Chapter 3, Standard Oil of New Jersey had completed a major stock transaction with Dulles's Nazi client, I.G. Farben.

>The American eugenics was funded by various corporate foundations including the Carnegie Institution, Rockefeller Foundation, and the Harriman

>German Nazi eugenics was funded by he Rockefeller Foundation.[8]

>Rockfellers also owned IG Farben throught the Standard Oil Co. Inc., this isnt even a meme

>The Rockefeller Foundation even funded Josef Mengele

>Population Council Established in 1952 by John D. Rockefeller III, with important funding from the Rockefeller Brothers Fund, The Council has its roots in the discredited eugenics movement.

> Planned Parenthood received extensive funding from John D. Rockefeller Jr. and his family, who continued to make anonymous donations to Sanger's causes in subsequent decades

>>3134130
lurmoar newfag

see >>3134131

The Genocide, Eugenics and Birth Control movements were forced to completely re-make themselves after the Holocaust.

ie: away from hard genocide, to soft genocide

Returning to the root Malthusian hysteria, they repackaged their agenda as based on ‘over-population.’ Many, if not most, of the measures entertained prior to the Holocaust remained on the table for consideration. Only the reasons for implementing those measures were changed. Thus, in the 1950s and 1960s, calls for ‘population control’ increased in frequency and volume. See Paul Ehrlich’s “The Population Bomb” as one example that made a dent in popular opinion.

But population control advocates understood that the scope of the problem they were presenting required government action at all levels. Thus, Richard Nixon was prompted to enact population control legislation (still in force today). In 1972, Nixon would call for a commission to ‘study’ the problem and present recommendations. This is known as the Rockefeller Commission Report.

The two names most prominently listed on the Jaffe Memo are Bernard Berelson and Frederick Jaffe, the one responsible for the memo itself. These two same individuals were members of the Rockefeller Commission. Berelson was a full commissioner, while Jaffe was listed as a ‘special consultant.

http://jaffememo.com/the-memo-in-context

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>>3127538
I thought trollies were common in America? They are where I'm from(Philadelphia).

>>3134130
fucking this

bush is totally not a oil barron and totally not involved in big oil business and totally not affiliated with standard oil and rockefellers

the robber barrons dindu nuffin

>>3134130
>Yeah "hitler" and "nazis" is such an original and groundbreaking boogeyman, congratulations you blew the lid right off the top.

back to /pol/

>>3134175
I mean, that's true though.

>>3134026
>>3134060
>Woah man, like, corporations are evil and holding us back dude. I mean we could be driving hemp powered cars and live in a post-scarcity world if it wasn't for those evil oil and car companies. I mean they were NAZIS dude can you believe that? Fucking bogus, man!

Is it fair to say that 1972 was the start of the "modern era" in American mass transit?

>BART opens
>U.S. government defines "Light Rail" as a concept

>>3134355
I think you're giving BART too much credit there.

>>3134263
well duh, thats what this entire thread is about, retard

American companies sabotaged and dismantled efficient public transport to make way to gas powered Fords and traffic

>deliberate shit to force you into carfagging

Public transportation in North America is literally 3rd-world-tier, just like telecommunications.

>electric car
>A century ago, society could have started down the path of electric cars. We already had regenerative braking like hybrids have now, and we could have powered our cars on a decentralized system with home electricity, swap-out batteries and plug-in stations.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-_SPo2huUI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LXx8khPVBbY


>investigative history into the conspiracy to stop the electric car nearly a century ago
http://www.evworld.com/article.cfm?storyid=1239
http://tv.greenmedinfo.com/edwin-black-history-of-electric-cars/

>>3133822

>>3134263
Companies have been known to manipulate policy and markets in the favor. Why wouldn't they? Their stated goal is to make a profit, right?

>>3128072
>>3133779
>>3133675

American car manufacturers pushed for their government to favour cars over the private rail companies. Hence fuel and roads were subsidised by the state - ever wonder why the phrase "who will build the roads?" was chosen over a thousand other alternatives?

American rail companies compete against state industries whereas it's more or less reversed in other countries.

>>3133675
>>3133779

The Car screw

I'm currently waiting at a car repairshop for my car's AC being repaired. This and other car repairs I've had to do got me thinking: What is /his/'s stance on cars? Consider the following:

>They cost a shit ton of money
>They lose their value very quickly
>Cost a shit ton to maintain/upkeep
>Gas costs a shit ton aswell
>(((Taxes))) and (((insurance))) cost a shit load

The car screw is literally possibly the worst money sink for grown ups. Thoughts?

>>3134464
American rail companies are entirely freight based and have been since the 1970s. They gladly shed their unprofitable passenger services through 1950s and 1960s at the same time that streetcar lines (the two were separate entities) were being killed off. No one but public transit riders give a fuck about public transit in America.

>>3134479
Aside from the associated costs I like my car because it means U can go wherever I want whenever I want and as long as you aren't driving through major urban areas or corridors during peak hours you can avoid most traffic and comfortably cruise at 80 mph.

>>3134481
>>3134464
>>3134440
>>3133196
>Railways in the 19th century USA
One of my favorite historical journeys (this and, highly related, telegraphy). Amazing time. Amazing people. Amazing inventions. All the shenannigens. Just.

And yes, the american people got fucked over (and over and over again...) so hard in the name of business. Also amazing.

Pro-tip: all the books from that era are freely available as pdf on google books. And there are a lot of them. Fascinating stuff.


http://www.siemens.com/recollections/pdf/Siemens-Recollections.pdf

>>3133789

>>3134495
>>3134479
I hate cars. I find nothing "cool" about any fancy cars, I don´t spend my time daydreaming about buying a new car. It does not represent any status to me.

I used "like" cars when I was like 10 years old, but now that I´m older my dream would be to get rid of that fucking thing.

I got 2001 year Corolla. It is nothing fancy, just before they started to make models which you cannot even fix yourself. I can change the battery, oil, driving lights etc myself without going to repair centre and that´s cool. Saves a fine penny on that alone.

My dad buys a new car like every 5 years, these newest ones you cannot do anything yourself - you cannot even change the battery without damaging some electronic system inside.

>>3127561
>>3128064
NYC never recovered from the destruction Robert Moses had brought down on the outer boroughs. Even today there are massive dead zones where mass transit doesn't reach; some of this is intentional to keep the poorer south Queens from going up north easily. Row house neighborhoods are so packed with cars that parking a car can take almost an hour in places like Glendale. Actual mass transit is disgustingly unreliable outside of commuter hours and being mismanaged to hell by the MTA.

>that picture
That is a literal stack of transit infrastructure. It would cost absolute shitloads just to build and maintaining it would be a complete nightmare. Unless some spicy meme material that costs next to nothing, allows us to build big structures, and doesn't require any real maintenance comes along, this will remain a dream.

I would love to see more mass transit and no cars

>>3134505
I drove a used Geo Metro for 7 years and loved it. My new car by comparison is much less enjoyable. I view cars as a means of transportation but I don't hate them.

>>3128059
>>3128064

One of many reasons I hate robber barons is their fascist/eugenicist/greedy stance towards everything including public transport.

Mass transit is cheaper, more environmentally friendly and creates a better sense of community. Takes up less space too.

Cars should be banned in cities. Get people more active and healthier.

>>3127546
Not an argument.

Also it's either GM are Nazis or GM is Jews, it can't be both.

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>>3133021
>mostly rebuilt their network

>>3128670
>>3134662
>not knowing of sloan, rockefeller, ford

the greatest trick the nazi merchant robber barons ever pulled was convincing the world that merchant is the jew

lurkmoar newfag
>>3128072
>>3133853
>>3133202

>>3134505
This.
I also have a 2001 Corolla. Cars are a tool to me. I've always had a wet dream since I was a kid of building a big city with efficient trolley lines.

>>3135146
>I've always had a wet dream since I was a kid of building a big city with efficient trolley lines.
This, but I would have feeder buses too. I always liked when companies had trolleys and buses with the same paint scheme.

Also, mine would be in the late '40s.

>>3135092
>>3134662

Remember the oft-cited quotation from Calvin that the masses of workers and assmen must be kept poor and fukt so that they will be obedient to their master, and will work only when they are driven to it by necessity. This is a central theme of the capitalist economy, resulting in the theory of the “productivity” of lower wages. The misuse of the concept of sex, love, freedom, happiness runs like a red thread through English history.

According to Century Magazine of July 1910: “American lawlessness begins in children’s rooms and schools and ends in courthouses and lawmaking bodies.” The legal uncertainly is called a “national burden,” which is made even worse by the fact that cooperation is also lacking in the police system. It is not surprising that crime rates are higher in the USA than anywhere else in the world. The following figures from 1939 demonstrate the fact.

developed in the course of the 18th and 19th centuries either through land speculation, railroad enterprises, or big industry. The Vanderbilts, Morgans, Carnegies,Rockefellers, and so on were typical of those who amassed their wealth with bribery, plundering, swindles, extortion....


>>3133991
They are all the same, Dillinger,Capone, Vanderbilt, Carnegie, Morgan, and so on: gangsters, pirates, stock traders, businessmen. They have a single ideal: money-making, and still more money-making. American lawlessness and the double morality of Calvinism and Puritanism conceals it all.

>>3134479
I love cars as a hobby but having to commute day in day out with one is pretty shit, and lets not even get into how predatory the whole market around them is.

>>3135218
>>3134479
>>3133779
>>3133675
thank your ubermensh overlords ford, sloan, rockefeller, bush, and all the other eugenicists culling the useless feeders

>>3133196
>automobiles ran on oil instead of corn grain alcohol (which would have made more sense in every way)
Yeah man, let's literally burn out food for fuel.
Not that i love corn stanch in everything, but still.

>>3133789
>cars are built to be replaced every 5 years

You are too stupid for words.

>>3134479
Yeah man, let's go back to horse and buggy days, great idea!

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>>3134479
In a large nation such the US or Canada they are extremely beneficial. Even foamers acknowledge that no one will build a rail line to every single inch of the continent, and in such cases, a vehicle that does not rely on heavy infrastructure to travel is great.

Also they look cool, and commies can get fucked.

>>3136500
>that clearance

Such a fucking impractical vehicle in the environment it's depicted in. Fuck lowriders and the people who like them.

>>3135388

>You have never worked at a BMW/Benz/Land Rover Dealership. May as well get a lease because every fucking component starts to fail with ludicrous replacement costs after about 5 years of ownership.

GM and Dodge at least have cheap replacement parts

>And you are basically retarded if you don't buy Toyota or Honda.

>>3127538
>Government agency takes over LA streetcar lines
>proceeds to dismantle the system at an even faster pace than the private corporation did

What did LAMTA mean by this?

>>3136515
That's the normal clearance for a Citroen SM, retard.

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>>3136515
>uch a fucking impractical vehicle in the environment it's depicted in.
But its pavement and the salt flats though?

>>3136850
Well then its a shit vehicle and doesn't belong off road or in the Southwestern US period. Fuck off with your meme vehicle.

>>3136858
I hope you get stuck in those salt flats you little bitch.

>>3136862
Wow, no need to be all defensive about the fact that you opened up your piehole on something you clearly know nothing about.

>>3136871
Eurotrash memetards need to get the fuck off my board. Go back to /o/ and fellate yourself over impractical, gaudy as fuck shitmobiles.

"I'll buy anything if it's shiny and made in Europe" t. dickless retard aka you

>implying you would ride this shit with poor minorities if you still had them

>>3136936
Anon, it's not 1985 anymore. Big urban centers with convenient rail based public transportation are where rich people live now

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kpsTP1rOeUw

Fuck, this makes me sad knowing the fate of this line and these beautiful PCC streetcars.

>>3136974
Rich people don't take public transit.

>>3136540
Put down the crack pipe,

With routine care and a bit of rather easy mod work, an auto can last for damn near eternity.

>>3137450
Not the new ones, the old ones sure.

>>3135243

The government currently pays farmers to destroy part of their crops to keep food prices stabilized, we'd probably be wasting less food if some was being used for fuel.

>>3137735
>>3135243
>>3133196
E85 burns cleaner, is renewable, and the USA grows the most corn in the world.
It might also help prop farmers up so we dont have to use unhealthy corn syrup in food.

But no, we couldn't have that completely logical timeline. Because greedy men didn't want it.

So we prop up the Middle East while our own infrastructure remains stuck in the past, and we have to prop the corn farmers up somehow so we use corn syrup in all of our food which is making us hilariously fat monstrosities.

>>3137450
>>3135388
>retard not knowing of planned obsolescence

lurkmoar

>planned obsolescence
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zdh7_PA8GZU

>you would start looking for a new car every 3 or 4 years
www.cnbc.com/id/49504504

>>3137450
You are too stupid for words.

>>3137060
Upper middle class people do.

>>3139272
No, those people Uber or use carsharing services.

>>3127538
They are putting streetcar lines in my city because Muh History and I can tell you this --- they are fucking horrible in a city where you are trying to get around by car. Huge somewhat mobile traffic blockages.

We were supposed to see renewal and development spurred along the streetcar lines, but the city has admitted, in a very quiet voice, that this has not happened.

They are picaresque and charming and all, but a huge pain in the ass,

>>3139272
>>3137060

Yet in my city, they are putting the lines back to primarily run from uptown to those neighborhoods.

So people joy ride on them, maybe, or they stay empty -- they have NO mass transit value, and fuck up traffic.

A light rail line along modern lines, on its own right of way, fast, doesn't interact with cars and drivers, is working much better.

>>3127561

If I had a time machine the first thing I would do is burn Robert Moses alive before the fucker graduated HS. Fuck him for making the fucking BQE

>>3139848
That's very anti Semitic, anon.

>>3137805
The EROI of E85 is shit

In other words you almost put more energy making it than you get out