Was a world war inevitable? It seems like regardless of what

Not inevitable but likely IMO.

All it would've really taken to contain it was some cooler heads at the table. There likely would've been some smaller conflicts, sort of like the Balkan wars, but it breaking into a general war was mostly autism on the part of [side you don't like].

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tGxAYeeyoIc

It was mostly the rise of Germany (with its unfortunate geography) and Japan that made a war inevitable.

>>2890180
The problem was that there were no cooler heads. Colonialism and the various treaty wranglings made everyone so paranoid about everyone else that it was only a matter of time before something happened. There were other things that nearly blew up into war prior to 1914, most notably Agadir in 1911 and Fashoda in 1898.

>>2890736
>The problem was that there were no cooler heads
Sir Edward Grey, the British foreign minister, lobbied hard for some kind of mediated solution to the AH and Serbia problem. Germany declined the offers and urged AH to seek a military redress.

Germany had to go to war with Russia before 1917 in order to beat them. After 1917 Russia's train system would've been done.

tfw you find out wwi was just three powerful cousins feuding it out, and everyone starts else getting involved.

>>2890174
Blame the rise of German imperialism. This is what forced France and Russia (formerly natural enemies) into an alliance. Germany also alienated the British by building a war fleet intended to challenge them. It was bound to endin conflict eventually.

You can argue that Germany deserved its place in the sun, but such places aren't given up without a fight. Ultimately Europe wasn't big enough for a new imperial power on the block.

>>2890781
Did you also read King, Kaiser, Tsar by Caterine Clay?

>>2890851
>"The war started because of the vile Hun and his villainous empire-building!"
>"George, the British Empire at present covers a quarter of the globe, while the German Empire consists of a small sausage factory in Tanganyika. I hardly think we can be entirely absolved from blame on the imperialistic front."

>>2890851
I heard that whole "place in the sun" phrase a few times but didn't Germany have colony's in Africa and asia....

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No

The eternal G*rmans just tried to burn down the continent again

>>2890851
If Germany had waited patiently they might've gotten a shot at expansion, obviously hindsight is 20/20 but two empires were in decline and it's quite possible that without Germany pushing for war another Russo-Japanese war could've occured later down the line

>>2890881
Honestly Bismarck should be put in the "tried-to-stop" tier, considering his actual success of staving off an alliance between France and Russia for the entirety of his career. This is just conjecture, but if not for him World War I might have started earlier, although that neglects other important factors.

>>2890174
the political climate at the time made it inevitable. With the 2 major blocs between the Entente and the Triple Alliance building up an arms race over the past decades since the Franco-Prussian war, the major European powers were indeed ready for war in order to break the status quo and tip the balance of power on the continent.

Aside from the alliances, the multiple claims on land nearly every nation had made war an enticing option in order to gain territory. France was looking to retake Alsace-Lorraine, Italy had claims to Trieste and Dalmatia, Austria-Hungary had claims on Serbia and so on so forth, most players had a reason to go to war in order to expand their empires.

The final nail that cemented the war however was Austria-Hungary's boldness to declare war on Serbia with Germany's promise to support them, without much regard for who all was going to get involved in what the Austrians thought was just a 3rd Balkan War.

The Austrians went to war on nothing else but the promise of German support, and somehow thought that would be enough to ensure victory, without even consulting Italy who refused the call as there was not much the Austrians could offer them by fighting Serbia.

You could say WWI blew up because of just laughably bad Austro-Hungarian diplomacy, who put all their cards in one ally to defend them against a major alliance against the two powers.

>>2890174
>world war
>takes place in Europe

>>2891013
And East Africa, and Arabia, and the Anatolian peninsula, and Germany's possessions in the Pacific and China wasn't exactly a peaceful place at the time and I believe there was some shooting off the coast of South America.

>>2891013
> war involving every major power in the world
> somehow not a world war

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>>2890174
>Was a world war inevitable?
Well a war in Europe between France, Russia and Imperial Germany, Austria-Hungary was certainly inevitable.

After their disastrous loss in the Franco-Prussian war, all levels of French society, from the center left to the far right were united in a desire to destroy Germany and reclaim their national honour.
To this end the French government scrambled to secure an alliance with the Russians (so that the next war would be one the Germany had to fight on two fronts) and then proceed to give them a very large amount of money so that the Russians could build triple redundant railway tracks all the way to the eastern German border (allowing the Russians to stage a quick advance into eastern Prussia).

Due to this French war-mongering, such a war was inevitable.
Despite how they are portrayed in historically revisionist media, the Germans did there best to avoid a conflict and deescalate the Balkan situation before any great powers started mobilizing.
Hell, the Kaiser made repeated attempts to personally dissuade his cousin from mobilizing; The realization that his cousin had betrayed him for frog money really did distress him.

I suppose at its core.
The blame for the war is shared by both the war hungry French and Bismark for being against castrating the frogs when they had the chance.

>>2890180
Someone get this hothead out of here

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>>2890771

This was mental retardation on Germany's part. Russia was literally down hill and would have collapsed internally.

I mean really. They couldn't even beat the goddamn Japanese.

>>2890406
>rise of japan
>major role in starting wwi
Thats news to me

>>2890736
Fashoda was a meme. Frog commanders acting withhout permission from the govt (common theme in french empires history) led a ragtag force into a sudanese village to face off against kitcheners many thousands of british soldiers and their native auxiliaries in the village across. The french in charge would have been shredded had they actually did anything rash

>>2890879
It was the kaiser and proimperialist press that used it. Anyway the kaiser envisioned a world empire to rival the british and french and a fleet to secure it. He was playing toy soldiers basically. The telegraph interview that he gave and which caused a scandal in 1909 sums up this imperialist outlook pretty well

>>2891572
Russia was making great gainz on the decade between russojap war and wwi. Not as much as the germans thought in their heads but still impressive, especially there military development plabs which were set to be finished by 1917

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>>2891647

Are you retarded? The Russian empire fell apart as soon as they tried setting up a military industrial complex. They literally had the wrong ammunition for their guns. The system was corrupt to the core and they had fucking Rasputin advising the Tsar.

There were people ready to throw out Nicki in 1905 and they were in 1918 even if there was no war.

Even Stalin had a problem industrializing the country and that required hard core collectivizing which Nicki was no where able to do. There wasn't a single intelligent person in the Imperial Regime.

Sure if they overthrew him and replaced him with either democracy or communism then yeah Russia could reform, but not with Nicki in charge. Best case scenario they make him a figure head and have competent people in charge and throw out all the incompetant and corrupt nobles.

>>2891013
And Africa and Asia and the Pacific?

>>2891666
Read a book anon. Youre literally arguing on the basis of stereotypical memes. Russia had been industrializing since the 1890s and was the fourth largest economy in the world (compare that to russia today). Nicolas II was an impediment to greater reform but the empire was certainly not doomed until world war broke out or, as some may argue, until the Brusilov offensive in 1916

>>2891684
The empire was a deeply corrupt and incompetently run edifice crumbling at the edges, war or not. The average Russian serf was deeply unhappy with the regime, as demonstrated nearly a decade before in 1905.

>>2891562
>fter their disastrous loss in the Franco-Prussian war, all levels of French society, from the center left to the far right were united in a desire to des
>political party vying for revanchism only garners itself 5% of the voices in the National Assembly and general Boulanger couldn't even make it to the presidency
Riiiiiiiiiiight. Let me guess, you got the "da french were obsessed with reclaiming Alsace-Moselle" from school didn't you?

>>2891581
They cucked Russia at the beginning of the century.

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>>2892212
Revanchism permeated almost all aspects of frog society at the time, it as simply part of the cultural mind-set.
Whether it was officially a frog party position or not is irrelevant.
What is relevant is that war-mongering and provocative actions of the damn frogs.

They were simply hell-bent on reclaiming Elsaß-Lothringen and destroying Imperial Germany, regardless of the amount of blood that it would cost.

>>2892249
There had been butthurt easing itself into the french psyche, and that, nothing of my doing could really shut that out, but to think that it encompasses all the reasons for which France leapt into the war is idiotic. By the 1910s, many politicians had bid the French people to dismiss revanchism, or "d'obséder devant la ligne bleue des Vosges" as they would name it, each of them aware of the odds which a lone France would be grappling with against imperial Germany, and the policy from then had been that France temperate its humiliation by reigniting the national spirit through colonialism, where they were eclipsing the germans. And think that politicians from the time, their affiliation being that of republicanism, were not in the least bothered with revanchism against Germany as the republic had only been reborn when the empire had been trampled to death in Franco-Prussian war. Reading up on the Belle époque era would have your eyes opened to how France dismissed Germany for most of it, and were much more at odds with the british, their dance in the colonies almost bringing forth war between them with the tensions harassing them down in Sudan or Indochina.

France only wound up weighing up their enmity with Germany again when Russia could be bought by heavy investments which the germans were denying them, but the logic to the alliance being forged resided that in it would shatter the isolation elaborated against them. But even when the possibility for war against Germany was revived, in the shape of the Bosnian crisis, France wanted nothing to do with it, and reneged that Russia be wholeheartedly backed by them in a war against Germany. Even when 1914 whizzed by, France again weighed what it would mean for them not to be dragged into the system of alliances, though that might have come at the cost of shattering their alliance with Russia, but Germany denied that France might be able to proclaim its neutrality lest they concede their border forts for

>>2892331
..:Germany to be certified there'd be no back-stabbing, to which France could not acquiesce, which Germany expected from them since they were hungering for their Schlieffen to be materialized.

And so France had to remain in the web of tensions, had to mobilize its forces since it was considered Russia's indubitable ally by Germany, and wouldn't you know it, got war declared on them.

tl;dr: France did empower if you want to call it that, and scolded the flames for WWI, but never quite had Alsace-Moselle in mind when working its alliance with Russia.
Are you an angry neighbor to my east?

Apologies for the poor writing. Am at work.

>>2891757
Serfdom was abolished in 1861.

>>2892249
Answer pls ;(

>>2891757
>if I keep repeating something, it makes it true!

>>2890174
>Was a world war inevitable?

Nah, if it wasn't for the eternal anglo the conflict wouldn't have even reached world war status. Most of yurope was at risk for internal insurrection, so if the war hadn't happened when it did then surely Austria-Hungary would have succumbed to internal revolution. Then Germany wouldn't even think of starting a war without any allies so I don't see how a world war could have started.

>>2890851
>muh queen did nothing wrong

Fuck off you perfidious albion.

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>>2892361
>I bet those crafty Frenchmen are plotting against us!
>*Takes actions that force the French into a state of belligerency*
>Ah-ha! I knew it!

wtf was Willy thinking?

serbs forced austria's hand. russia is allied with serb. germany cannot allow russia to destroy austria, germany's only ally among great powers. brits and french jumps in because germany was a rising great power and a threat to them. (Germany started building a naval force and britain werent having none of that shit). they were waiting for any excuse to knock germany down a peg.

can this "austria hungary in decline" meme please stop
nationalistic tensions between the various groups were vastly overplayed by british historians post ww1 as a further justification for war and victory, and has continued to this day. The vast majority of citizens of the kingdoms were completly loyal to the monarchy, and only had tension between ethnic and linguistic groups. The pre-war years were some of A-H's most prosperous and stable

>Willy caused WWI meme
It was German high command you retards.

>>2892647
>brits and french jumps in because germany was a rising great power and a threat to them

Huh, that certainly explains why the French pulled their troops 10 kilometres back from their border with Germany.

I guess they were so desperate for war that they just couldn't help provoking the Germans by presenting them with an undefended frontier.

>>2892707
Maybe Willy could have asked the General Staff not to automatically invade Belgium and France in the event of a general European war? You know, instead of being an incompetent buffoon.

>>2891581
ignorant guy here
if japan didnt attack usa, would the axis have won? would burgers have attacked them first cucking the shit out of them anyway?

>>2892983

I strongly doubt it. It's not like Germany was crushing the USSR until the Americans came along and saved the day. However, attacking the US was still a mistake because it essentially was an unwinnable war for Japan. It would have been better for Japan to attack the USSR from the East in order With Stalin focused on trying to stop the German advance, Japan could have easily taken Vladivostok and the Siberian coast without too much effort. This would put the Soviets in the uncomfortable situation of fighting a two-front war.

>>2890174
No, Wilhelmina made the third Balkan war into ww1
Bulgaria, Greek and Romanian crisis showed the empires could break up safely as long as the balance of power was kept
Germany only starts the war because Russia is getting better faster than Austria is getting worse, although the social cohesion in AH was good, industry and science was lagging behind

>>2891581
The humiliation Russia suffered at the hands of Japan made them want to enter the war to prove how they weren't actually weak.

>>2890881
>Molkte
>Sazonov
>not it's their fault tier

>>2893032
sounds realistic
i wonder why everyone started to byte more than they could chew
i mean yeah attacking russia before it could gather its shit was probably a decent idea, more or less, but isnt it better to consolidate what you already have

>>2892249
Yo please answer.

>>2892249
revanchism as a political actually didn't revive until a few years before WWI broke out.The conscription bill got passed only with great difficulty

>>2893032
japs got btfo by soviets in 1939 so hard they immediately dismissed any idea of attacking Russia

>>2894373
??
Russia got creamed so hard their admirals were committing suicide rather than returning home after the war was over.

>>2891593
It was a huge diplomatic crisis that had both countries on the verge of war. If fighting started there then France and Britain were ready to mobilize. The end result of it led to the Entente Cordiale though which didn't help the diplomatic situation either.

>>2890781
>he thinks the monarchs were the ones with all the decision making or even in the driver's seat of policy
It was only true to an extent in Russia which was an autocracy but even then Nicholas had to contend with his ministers and constantly played them off of one another to try and re-establish his authority. Part of Wilhelm's erraticism was due to his frustration at being cut out of the policymaking and he held little practical power, especially compared to Bulow and the like. George, of course, possessed pretty much no power since the British monarchy has been a meme since whenever they chopped off Charles' head.

>>2890875
>>"The war started because of the vile Hun and his villainous empire-building!"
>>"George, the British Empire at present covers a quarter of the globe, while the German Empire consists of a small sausage factory in Tanganyika. I hardly think we can be entirely absolved from blame on the imperialistic front."
Not remotely what I was saying, but glad you're keeping busy.

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>>2892572
>muh queen did nothing wrong
It was a king, you mouth-breathing redneck retard.

>>2891562
Why are you blaming Bismark? He knew the abrasion annexation of Alsace Lorraine would lead to war again and was against it. If anything blame the retarded ultranationalist junkers that forced the annexation.

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>>2892572
I know lizze the deuce is old but she's not THAT old anon.

>>2893032
If, IF the Japanese had better intelligence and Pearl Harbor had worked as intended the US would have had nothing to fight in the Pacific with.

>>2892613

The fog of war was massive in 1914. Germany and France had very different doctrines and both thought they could easily achieve their strategic objectives. Russia was simply a monster. Only AH must have thought "hm, this isn't going as expected".

And you know what, it isn't hard to imagine that the Germans could have gotten Paris.

>>2892705

>and only had tensions between ethnic and linguistic groups.

Precisely the problem.

>>2894622

Pearl Harbor was didn't make strategic sense. They should have gotten the Dutch East Indies and that's that. Nobody ever liked the Dutch enough to enter war for them, it can easily be seen in American foreign policy of the time.

Also, open war for China would be hard to sell in congress.

>>2892249
To go with that, in the 1890s the French and Germans were close to entering a treaty with each other but it died because France wouldn't drop the autistic obsession over getting back Alsace-Lorraine.

>>2891562
>muh revanchisme

It's a historical fiction, revanchisme was never a potent French political force.

>>2894622
If PH worked as intended the US would've had 5 carriers left.

>>2890916
It's absolutely conjecture as his intervention in the Balkans is what alienated Russia from Germany in the first place.

>>2894683
>implying anything would have changed if Germany captured Paris
Yeah, just like Napoleon taking Moscow totally won the war. HURRR DURRR

>>2890881
Jagow is missing in the their fault tier
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gottlieb_von_Jagow

Lichnovski missing in the tried to stop it tier
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl_Max,_Prince_Lichnowsky#The_1914_Crisis

>>2892392
Abolished != practical effects have changed how things work.

>>2894730
An attack against the Dutch would have been an attack against the Allies, since the Netherlands had been a co-belligerent since 1940. Even if FDR was some how unable to have Congress declare an open war the US still would have intervened, even if they had to go as far as having fake mutinies and sending "volunteers".

>>2894622
Actually if the Japanese plan had gone wrong and the US fleet at Pearl Harbour had sallied out to meet them then that would have been much better. Imagine 10'000s of dead US sailors and all of their capital ships under miles of water.

>>2895308
Have you ever noticed how people are only ever able to bring up one example of capturing a capital being useless?

Funny that

>>2894526
not him but it's from Blackadder, ya dingus

>>2892240
>>2893040
i think you mean jacob schiff and the jews

>>2895308

>Yeah, just like Napoleon taking Moscow totally won the war

In case you haven't noticed, Russia is a fuckload bigger than France. 17,075,200 sq. km for Russia against just 643,801 sq. km for France. Why does this matter? France can't afford to raze their own cities the way that the Russians did.

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>>2897655
>They're about to go over the top and I expect some final twist or last ditch ploy that gets him and Baldrick out of it.
>It's a comedy, after all. Right?
>MFW "Good luck everyone"

>>2897690

>capture moscow
>congrats have fun pushing further into the steppe with worsening supply lines and russian winter

>capture france
>highly centralied country looses its brain
>french logistics collapse

>>2890174
If Willy listened to Bismarck it all could have been avoided

>>2892572
>Queen
>In WWI
Why is /his/ so fucking awful?

>>2898495
>implying frog logistics mattered
>implying frogs mattered at all when britbongs and amerilards were carrying 99% of the weight on the western front

>>2898637
>amerilards were carrying 99% of the weight
>WW1
Maybe on their waists

>>2898637
>britbongs and amerilards were carrying 99% of the weight on the western front
Confirmed for don't knowing shit

>>2898637
Imagine a paperback novel 200 pages long covering the whole war from its declaration to the armistice. The American Expeditionary Force doesn't show up until page 136, they don't see combat until page 151, and by the time they see a real battle, there are 22 pages left in the whole damned book.

>>2898750
And then, on the day before the end of the war they decide to do a retarded offensive because Foch told them they should and get btfo for literally nothing, never forget that part

>>2898750
>the only thing that matters in war is how many men you lose
Good stuff frog, supplies and logistics totally didn't have an impact on either world war. Gotta fill that cemetery quota somehow right?

>>2898774
In both world wars, America's major contribution was their manufacturing and transportation capabilities, not their fighting men. It was the American factory worker and merchant mariner, not the American soldier, that crushed the Kaiser and Nazi Germany. The entente and the allies respectively owe America a great debt for this reason. Anon suggested that Americans played a huge role in WWI at the front. While a sudden influx of hundreds of thousands of fresh reinforcements were certainly appreciated, we shouldn't over inflate the role they played.

>>2898774
Americans literally had stocks in Krupp and only got involved because one of their covert arms shipments got sunk, don't try to claim the moral high ground for turning up in 1917 and dying by the handful because you'd only faught Mexican fucking bandits until then

>>2898791
I read this in Stephen Fry's voice. Just wanted you to know that.

>>2897156
Well, the British captured Philadelphia in the Revolutionary War and D.C. during the War of 1812. Not only did it not end the wars, Britain lost both of them.

>>2898813
Eh. Loss and a draw. I guess you could say 1812 was a loss considering the casus belli was the kidnapping of American sailors, and the war did make them stop.

>>2898827
It also humiliated Britain on an international stage and forced them to actually cede to American demands from the Treaty of Ghent forward. Anyone who claims that Britain came out ahead or tied in 1814 doesn't look at the actual legacy of the conflict. The real winners were Canada though because without the War of 1812 there would be no actual Canadian identity.

>>2898782
American troops contributed greatly though

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Belleau_Wood
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meuse-Argonne_Offensive
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meuse-Argonne_American_Cemetery_and_Memorial

>>2898860
>1918
War was fucked by then. the German government giving in because of a British blockade would not have suddenly changed if America remained neutral, WW1 was not your jam, get over it. You can wank yourself to death over WW2 western front shit

>>2898845
Obligatory

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WVC677-YmfM

>>2898871
I will never understand why Canadians try to claim the burning of D.C. Canadian militia never set foot out of Canada. The Burning of D.C. was undertaken by British regulars that were quite literally fresh off the boat.

>>2898881
Because it gives Americans the shits, just like Vietnam, not too hard to understand

>>2898888
Yeah, but Americans can just flip that around with the Burning of York which is much more significant than the "burning" of D.C.

>>2898892
York dosen't have the same prestige attached to it, it wasn't a capitol of an independent country

>>2898897
It was the capital of Canada and unlike D.C. the city was nearly razed to the fucking ground.

>>2898901
Canada wasn't a concept then, except for revisionist Canadians

>>2898909
>The Battle of York was fought on April 27, 1813, in York (present-day Toronto), the capital of the province of Upper Canada
Canada was a concept then. Either way, you're missing the point. People on both sides of the conflict stated that the damage of Washington was minor compared to York and was done in retaliation for York.

>>2898914
No matter how much you give a shit it's not as great propaganda as "we burnt the White House", if USA managed to burn Windsor I'm sure they wouldn't shut the fuck up about it either

>>2898926
>we
That's the issue though. They didn't do shit.

We're drifting. This happy little ditty to get us back on track.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TV74GPopwGY

>>2898934
They only say that to piss you off, fuck have you not figured out Commonwealth shitposting yet?

>>2898870
I am German. I know the reports of German soldiers and how demoralized they were losing against Americans with shotguns. The blockade didn't have a decisive impact, much Ersatz, replacement products, artificial fertilizers etc. were produced locally.

>>2898953
Yes, because Americans invented shotguns and no one used them before 1918 in fucking trench warfare, I'd be fucking embarrassed if I were you

>>2898960
why would I be embarassed?

>>2898988
Because you are obviously ignorant of the lack of food and the failed Ukrainian crop supply idea along with your no knowledge of shotguns being very common in WW1

>>2898993
Germany was a grain exporter prior to WW1, the famine rather had to do the German farmers and their sons were drafted to fight and rot in conquered soil rather than bringing in the harvest. Shotgus were absolutely uncommon except for Americans.

>>2899004
>Shotgus were absolutely uncommon except for Americans.
There's a reason a term like "trench gun" exists, sure Germans declared it inhumane because they were getting the shit kicked out of them at the time, they were perfectly fine using fowling pieces for night time infiltration runs before that

>>2899021
thanks for proving my point.
That's why Germans thought Americans are brutal and scary, and started to defect in droves.

>>2899025
Yeah sure, not the 2 years of sawdust bread and shit tobacco, or orders to sally out to fight the RN and get fucking killed, no it was the fear of the shotgun. You are literally posting the katana in D20 is underpowered right now

>>2899032
bad food didn't prevent the Operation Michael and neither caused the Black Day of the German army in August 8. American troops breaking through where French had repeatedly failed to do so had a tremendous impact on the morale of German soldiers.

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>>2898941

Canadians don't shitpost, they post shit. Big difference between cheeky aussie banter and retarded Canadian liberals who actually believe the shit they post. I honestly can't believe Canadians aren't range-banned from this site.

>>2899054
And yet neither of those were a catalyst for the Naval mutiny and subsequent Spartacist bullshit that really ended the war, really makes you fucking think doesn't it? Almost like the population is the deciding factor in a war and not a few hundred Americans with shotguns

>>2899063
the catalyst was the fact now as there are US troops actively fighting in the West rather than just sending canned food made the German general staff ask for surrender. The naval mutiny started because they didn't want to be sacrificed in an epic last battle after the war had been lost.

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>>2899063
>Americans missing
>war is a stalemate
>Americans show up and slaughter krauts
>war ends in a heartbeat

Apparently "a few hundred Americans with shotguns" did what the entire French peasantry and British Commonwealth could not.

>>2899076
No, the catalst was that even after defeating Russia and a massive influx of veterans their tanks were fucking shit and couldn't cross a trench to break the line
>>2899084
Yeah, 4 years of war and the last one was a total decisive blow because no one ever thought of using a fowling piece in WW1, they used fucking elephant guns and plate mail but no one ever thought of using a fucking shotgun, just unheard of, beating a cunt to death with a shovel was OK but a shotgun was just too much for the German war machine, if only they had existed for the last century before it Germany would have lost on day one. Do you see how fucking dumb this sounds?

>>2899104
You're the one trying to downplay America's involvement despite being the ultimate deciding factor in Germany's defeat. You wouldn't happen to be eating a baguette by any chance?

>>2899104
Don't forget medieval maces, sapping techniques that would've been familiar to Mehmet the Conqueror, and actual fucking catapults.

>>2899104
the few German tanks didn't play a crucial role on the German side, the catalyst was the officers reported to the top brass the soldiers, officers included, lost confidence in their leadership and the Kaiser.

>>2899121
>Hurr durr Murrica won WW1!
>4 years of warfare were totally superfluous to Americans with their shotguns folded over 1000 times
You're a fucking idiot, and no I'm sucking a fat dick

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>>2899138
To be fair, they were some badass looking shotguns. Why did they require such a fuckhuge bayonet?

>>2900215

Upon doing some quick research, it appears that there is nothing special about the trench gun bayonet. It is the exact same type of M1917 bayonet as was issued to American riflemen. This model of bayonet stayed in use until the Vietnam war when it was finally replaced by the much shorter M5 bayonet.

File: 1024x1024.jpg (143KB, 1024x801px) Image search: [Google]

143KB, 1024x801px

>>2890174

>tfw you'll never fight in WW1
>tfw you'll never stab a kraut with your M1917 bayonet while screaming "this is for Belgium and Edith Cavell, you dirty hun!"

Why even live.

>>2900278
Suppose it's just the dimensions of the gun then. It's a tad shorter than a M1903 Springfield, I reckon.

>>2900215
>>2900321
The 1897 wasn't the only gun issued in the trenches either. The Auto-5 was as well. I actually have my great grandfather's Auto-5.

>>2900509
Whoops forgot name

>>2893040
It was less about proving something anymore. They've proven that they're eye to eye with Europeans in 1905. The issue was that the Treaty of Portsmouth only awarded them Southern Sakhalin. There were actually riots because of that, but the IJA was in no condition to continue the war or occupy more territory back in 1905, so they settled for what they could get. Entering WW1 was merely to expand their empire through clever opportunism. Just like they expanded the 2nd Sino-Japanese War into WW2 when the western allies were weakened and still had colonies up for grabbing in Japan's neighbourhood.