This guy literally possessed no redeeming qualities

Well he was a renowned fighter ace in WW1. Had 22 kills i think.

>>2871073
>The most dangerous kind of man, a stupid one.

Bullshit. Goering was intelligent and very sober by Nazi standards. He definitely stood apart from nuts like Himmler or Goebbels.

While he was obviously an antisemitism, I doubt that the Holocaust would happen with him at the helm.

Goering was fucking harmless you tard, he literally was all like "herpa derpa I can win the Battle of Britain" lost and then ran off to a castle, ate sweets, watched movies and played dress up

>>2871073

Goerring was a fat fuck, and pretty tame by comparison to Joseph Mengele.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josef_Mengele

>>2871112
>Well he was a renowned fighter ace in WW1. Had 22 kills i think.
yes but that doesn't mean anything when you have to run a government and build a war economy

>>2872511
22 air kills is more than you have achieved in your life though.

>>2872508

Mengele was an honest to god war hero before getting so seriously wounded he couldn't be an active duty field doctor.

So was Goering in the last one.

They were men who made bad decisions when they were given far too much power.

>>2872487

Leadershipwise, he was pure poison.

He was the one to insist that Dunkirk could be tied down with solely Luftwaffe assets.

He was the one who agreed with Hitler that British cities should be bombed instead of the airfield after the RAF raided Berlin following a Luftwaffe accidental drop on London.

He was the one who assured Hitler that he could keep the 6th Army in supply so that Wehrmacht ground forces didn't have to get diverted to break them out when the 6th Army was still combat effective. He couldn't but insisted he was doing it, circumventing Manstein literally screaming to be allowed to organize a breakthrough, which he would get at the very last moments.

Goering ws criminally inept and it screams volumes about Hitler that he was allowed to stay in power until the very end of the war when good Luftwaffe men like Kesselring were left to secondary positions.

That said, Goering was extremely charming and held an immense love for his family; and when he lost weight and got sober at his trial, he presented a serious threat to Jackson, knowing just how to get under Jackson's thin skin.

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>I wonder what does this baby taste like.

Someone post the Nuremberg transcript where he btfo the judges

>>2872577
last time I check he was sentence to death

>>2872584

Expecting any other result from a show trial where the judges are from the enemy nations instead of neutral.

>>2872558
>he presented a serious threat to Jackson, knowing just how to get under Jackson's thin skin.

Can you expand on this?

>>2872531
>that ad hominem
so i'm guessing you have no argument:?

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>>2871123
>I doubt that the Holocaust would happen with him at the helm.

Well no shit. Literally anyone except meth-mongering white Mugabe and his band of sycophants would think gassing six million people was good for PR.

>>2872665
weak bait

>>2872628
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfwujaV7Ia8

He was vague and humourous and able to elicit laughter and applauds from the audience which infuriated Jackson to make mistakes.

>>2872683
what makes you think he's baiting? he's basically correct

>>2871123
Who gives a fuck about antisemitism?

>>2872652
You're argument is that he has no redeeming qualities.
He was a good fighter pilot, which is a redeeming quality, so go fuck yourself I guess.

>>2871073
He was a skilled fighter pilot and also a genius. Those are two very good qualities.

>>2872508
Mengele was small time. Why do people always drop his name when they are talking about Nazis? He wasn't in charge of shit.

>>2872937

Uhhhh... Jews?

>>2873016
Why should that concern us?

He had a very aesthetic skull

>>2873002
They're usually the ones with rudimentary knowledge. They don't know the Kaltenbrunner's or Pohl's.

>>2873038
But of course you would say an allied fighter ace should get the praise.

>>2873038
So fighting for your country isn't a positive thing no matter the circumstances? Do you take the position that men like Bishop aren't heroes either because they won?

>>2872531
Hmm... I'm not sure that killing 22 or so people in a war that was inevitably lost anyway* should be counted as a positive.
*And in which Germany, while not the bad guys, certainly were not the good guys either (since there were no good guys)

>>2873043
>>2873047
Oops sorry, edited...
Fighting for Germany as a fighter pilot was utterly useless. What would have been real fighting for his country would have been to convince the leadership to either formulate an actual winning plan, or to negotiate a peace.

>>2873047
No, fighting for your country isn't automatically good. It is only good if: 1) The war is righteous, and 2) Your fighting actually contributes to winning the war.

>>2872558
>circumventing Manstein literally screaming to be allowed to organize a breakthrough
Hmm, Ziemke seems to think otherwise:
>Manstein, who also submitted an estimate to the OKH, was less positive than Paulus and Weichs. He agreed that the breakout was the safest course and that an attempt to hold out was extremely dangerous; but he did not support an immediate attempt. He believed a relief operation could start in early December if the promised reinforcements were made available. At the same time, he warned that the breakout could still become necessary if the relief forces could not be assembled.
(https://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar///USA/USA-EF-Defeat/USA-EF-Defeat-3.html, page 58)
Of course, Ziemke is a bit dated... I don't know what more recent scholarship holds

>>2873019
>Why should that concern us?
discrimination of a minority culture says a lot about the majority culture. in our age where we tolerate different christian sects and european ethnicities it's retarded to argue others shouldn't be protected the same and discriminated on flimsy arguments of race or inherent criminality

>>2872487

That's... kind of the point. He lost the battle of Britain because he approached managing the airforce thru a prism of romanticism and analogies to "knights of the sky", meanwhile the brits fully "mechanised" their approach to airpower and maximised their forces in a way Goering would never have considered.

>>2872539

Mengele was a psychopath, the defining trait of which is fearlessness, so naturally he was a "hero".

>>2872558
>He was the one who agreed with Hitler that British cities should be bombed instead of the airfield after the RAF raided Berlin following a Luftwaffe accidental drop on London.

This actually made no real difference, since the RAF obviously had to defend the cities just as they did the airfields, and since the RAF had a contingency plan to deal with the total loss of ALL their southern airbases.

>>2872620

Except many of the people tried at Nuremberg DID get off. Granted there was no chance an actual war criminal like Goering was going to, but to call them "show trials" speaks volumes to your intellectual dishonesty.

>>2873056

You, as a single citizen, don't get to determine if the war is righteous. Fighting for your country is honorable even when the war is unjustified.

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>>2873019

Well if you're a believer in the Institution of Separation of Church and State as much as I am, the state-sanctioned persecution of an entire religion is political sacrilege.

>>2871073
his brother was a really nice guy, saved a bunch of jews and when he saw the SS forcing some jews to clean a street with bare hands he started helping them which forced them to stop as not to humiliate his brother

>>2871123
>very sober by Nazi standards

Goering was certainly distinguished by his drug use. Hitler liked having flawed underlings so he could manipulate them. His addiction got so bad that he was passing out while giving speeches. When he was finally weened off during Nuremberg, Speer saw a completely different person.

>>2873132
That's an American thing. We're talking about 1930's Germany.

>>2873132

They were targeted as a race not a religion. Anyone with Jewish ancestry was gassed, not just practicing Jews.

If I was a high-ranking Nazi, I would also have soldiers take fine art for my personal collection, and throw rad parties. Goering really was the people's marshal.

>>2873143

I'm pretty sure claiming you were a convert or adopted wouldn't have saved you.

>>2873151

Yes it would you stupid prick. If you're going to opine on a subject at least be /slightly/ informed about it first.

>>2873162

If the Germans were willing to go after people who as little as a quarter Jewish, what makes you think a convert would've been safe? In their eyes, a convert no matter how Aryan would have been tainted by Jewish influence anyway.

>>2873129
>You, as a single citizen, don't get to determine if the war is righteous.
Sure I do. I'm not gonna let a government decide for me whether it's right for me to go kill a bunch of people I've never met. If a draft ever happened and I didn't think the war was righteous, I'd do my best to evade it.

>>2873132
Jews were targeted for reasons beyond religion. It's not like the Nazis were motivated to exterminate them because Christianity told them to.

>>2871073
People says he ruled Yugoslavia quate well

>>2873118
Heroes save others, you don't get the medal of honor for sending in the nukes.

>>2872652
>>2872994
Yeah you basically got punk'd OP. Fuck off.

>>2873105
They don't follow your line of thinking when they're the majority.