Why is japanese fencing more famous when European styles are

>>2808502
They weren't more famous.

If you say fencing to a random bloke in the street there is a nine out of ten chance he conjures up an image of Olympic fencing.

But it's not, outside of your weeb bubble.

>>2808502
Which term do you think is more universally known, kendo or fencing?

>>2808522
>fencing
is unlike Kendo not a term but something pretty generic

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>>2808502
Europain styles died out with the exception of sports fencing. Japanese sword traditions did not

I think a lot more westerners know about Olympic fencing than kendo

> European styles are the best in the world?

Certainly wasn't true in the 19th century when people from the places like India and China were considered far better on average than European swordsman of the time

>>2808502
>Rapier
>Good
You're joking, right? It only does well in asymmetrical HEMA matches when the other guy flails his weapon around like a retard from ten feet away.

>>2809412
>died out
you are mistaking extinction dor evolution. There simply was no need for great fencing schools since 18th century for we've had firearms or crossbows which were far more efficient and handy.
Japs on the other hand were strict isolationists who used swords, spears and bows way to the 1880's and then they adopted western style of battle for its apparent efficiency.

>>2809465
Yes it evolved, in the sense that it became sport fencing. The number of living lineages even in classical fencing in Europe are very small, So "battle efficient" swordsmanship wasn't really preserved except in texts.

However there were still viable sword systems being taught in Europe up till the early 20th century.

So while you're right that isolation preserved a lot of systems in Japan that would have otherwise been lost, modern kendo is not much older than modern fencing, kenjutsu survived along side it while western swordsmanship did not

>>2809465
Incorrect, Japan heavily adopted guns after the portuguese arrived in the 16th century but they kept practising swordsmanship next to marksmanship

>>2808502
>Why is japanese fencing more famous
I don't remember seeing kendo tournaments in the last olympics, and kenjutsu is pretty much HEMA tier even in Japan. How exactly is japanese fencing more famous than european fencing?

>>2809781
Olympic fencing is shit. Just two natters suicidally trying to slap the other guy first with any portion of the blade, even if it wouldn't actually do anything if it were a real sword.

>>2808502
The western form has no spirituality

>>2808502

The Western form is dead, all we have today is Electronic Tag.

>>2809829
>even if it wouldn't actually do anything if it were a real sword
Top fucking kek. I agree that modern fencing is pretty shit, but it's because it's suicidally hyperoffensive. The average point would be severely incapacitating with real swords, getting poked is no joke.

Weabs. Europeans and other Westerners were fascinated with Nips because they had a parallel to Medieval Europe via feudalism.

Besides judo and sumo, Jap fighting styles suck balls compared to the rest of Asia as well as Europe.

>>2809500
>kenjutsu survived along side it
Did it really? Why can't I find non choreographed demonstrations of it then? Seems to me that kenjutsu died about at the same time as western fencing.

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>>2809845
> Besides judo and sumo, Jap fighting styles suck balls compared to the rest of Asia as well as Europe.

I would love to know what grounds you think that. What Japanese arts are you familiar with?

>>2809851
>>The world know about U.S's nuke

they still exist

koryu

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>>2809851
>Did it really? Why can't I find non choreographed demonstrations of it then?

because Kenjutsu was an is primarily trained through two man kata, and thats what they demonstrate at public gatherings. shinai shiai like kendo was an edo period innovation so many schools dont practice it. There are of course many styles that still do, but they usually dont demonstrate it publicly, or only release a few small clips even if its one of their p primary training methods

>>2808502
>tfw just ordered a practice rapier
Can't wait guys

>>2809896
>"battle efficient" swordsmanship
>primarily trained through kata
doubt.jpg

>There are of course many styles that still do, but they usually dont demonstrate it publicly
I can't imagine any reason why this would be so. I mean, aside from hiding the lack of actual sparring.

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>>2809912
Forms were the common method of transmission in most living European traditions when they were still a thing as well. Consider the limits of weapons sparring with premodern equipment, then consider the goals of passing down a system as it was originally taught.

>I can't imagine any reason why this would be so. I mean, aside from hiding the lack of actual sparring.

there are styles that rarely even appear in public and want as little of their curriculum as possible exposed to the general populous. Its a cultural thing. If you talk to members in private settings they tend to be more open on the general details but often will not talk the specifics.

>>2809843
It doesn't matter if they hit the other guy with the point or not; they can just barely tap you with the edge and it still scores as a hit because lol electric sensors.

>>2809870
Daito Ryu Aiki-jutsu, Iaido, Kendo, Aikido, and Kyudo besides Judo and Sumo. I don't count the Ryukyuan arts because they had their own separate identity for centuries.

All the arts I mentioned aren't that special when you compare them to European and other Asiatic styles. Judo and sumo have my respect because it's pressure-tested; there's no bullshit involved because you have to train against resisting opponents and they condition the fuck out of you. It's also interesting how Japan preserved Catch Wrestling; which is practically lost in the West.

Jigoro Kano is my idol; this dude stressed that training must always involve breakfalls and live-drills. He synthesized various Jujutsu styles and codified it into Judo. Without Judo, there'd be no Sombo or Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu as well.

I also thought sumo was just fat guys pushing each other with crappy Greco-Roman moves, but after seeing matches and how they train, it's a legit martial art/combative sport. And unlike other "grades" in fighting arts, you either become champion or you have to start your way back up.

>>2809829
>He watches saber

Watch epee my man, much more sensible

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>>2810024
Daito ryu aside (I have alot to say about daito ryu but it would get my off track) iaido kendo aikido and kyudo are all modern standardized arts.
they are fundamentally different than the classical arts founded before meiji.

Kano's judo was primary derived from tenjin shinyo ryu and kito ryu, like judo they both had sparring as a key component of training. These days your usually not allowed to do tenjin shinyo ryu in Japan until you've achieved a certain dan rank in judo.

Of course I have the highest respect for Kano, both as an educator and a martial artists, but I think thee most radical thing he brought was they way he organized Judo into a national organization rather than a few dojos practicing the same style.

>>2809982
>they can just barely tap you with the edge and it still scores as a hit
That's wrong for 2/3 fencing disciplines.

>>2808502
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_q0MlNiTs6Q

>>2809523
for the simple reason the supply of firearms was limited + Sakoku in 1660's.
When you have 2000 firearms on an isolated island with little to no means of manufacturing ammunition other than smuggling it's clear then who gets the greatest supply, hence the rise of yakuza.
Japanese swordsmanship is a nice thing, I like it myself but it has no meaning other than amusement. Not to mention any european sword is superior to the design of katana in means of combat.