Iran-Iraq War

Because it's inconvenient to remember that the entire world backed Saddam fucking Hussein in an invasion of a sovereign nation, and only just managed to save him from getting BTFO completely.

>>2785744
Because Saddam did nothing wrong and the world hates to recognize it

Also because the house of Saud still has some grip in western media

>>2785744
Because we turned a blind eye to Saddam using the shit out of chemical weapons in the name of geopolitics then hypocritically took him out two decades later, blew up a civilian airliner with 290 innocent people onboard (basically pulled a Russia), and got caught fucking over the Iraqis, Israelis, and the rest of the Gulf Arab states via the Iran-Contra affair, destroying our credibility in the region, and our "strict neutrality" policy was a fucking joke. I'm writing a paper on this right now (no thanks y'all faggots, thanks for the sources). If you wanna know more and this thread is still up when I finish, let me know. In the meantime, read Bryan Gibson's Covert Relationship. I only got a copy of his Master's thesis but it's an excellent primer on the material. There's also a ton of transcripts with Saddam Hussein speaking directly about the war:
digitalarchive.wilsoncenter.org/collection/168/saddam-hussein-s-iraq
There's an interview with one of Saddam's favorite military officers about political, strategic, operational, and tactical matters called Saddam's War: an Iraqi Military Perspective on the Iran-Iraq War.

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>>2785744
Also, check out Georgetown National Security Archives as a source on our relationship with Saddam during the war.
Got a nice fucking photo here of Donald Rumsfeld shaking hands with Saddam.

http://nsarchive.gwu.edu/NSAEBB/NSAEBB82/index.htm

>>2785744
>Trenches
>Gas
It was literally WW1 again.

>>2785771
well said

>>2785744
he a gud boi he dindu nuffin

>>2785771

>>2785771
Hey man to be fair the CIA was giving/selling weapons and intel to both sides so it's not like Iran was TOTALLY alone.

>>2785771
FPBP

>>2785744
More importantly why did Iraq not beat the shit out of Iran despite heavy support and more advance weapons?

>>2786269
Because Iraqi combat doctrine was fucking farcical and its Army lacked a strong operations functions. The whole war was dependent on them seizing Khuzestan in a swift Nazi style blitzkrieg while Iran was still in political turmoil and its military still weak. Instead penetrating deep into Khuzestan, surrounding key objectives and encircling/starving out the Abadan and Khorramshahr garrisons, the Iraqi military put far too much importance in taking the cities. They wanted to show Iranians their firepower (essentially dickwaving) and put the fear of Allah in them.

Iran is a stronger, wealthier, and more populous nation than Iraq.

Also, every country pretty much wanted both of them to lose because a stronger Iraq was a threat to the Saudis and Syrians, so they didn't really give the Iraqis a real strategic edge in terms of materiel.

>>2786031
This board needs more people like you. Post pls

There just aren't many good books on the Iran-Iraq war. Pretty much the definitive title is Pierre Razoux's, and it is problematic in some of its details and translation.

>>2786269
>why did Iraq not beat the shit out of Iran despite heavy support and more advance weapons?

Because the Iraqi army, as are most Arab armies, was geared towards keeping their own civilians in line, as opposed to actually fighting a conventional fight against foreign armies.

The officer corps treated their men like shit, were incompetent as fuck and hired more for their loyalty to the party than any measure of competence, and stole resources that were meant for the troops for themselves at pretty much every level of command. Their troops were little more than untrained cannon fodder, and when you fail to provide realistic, competent training, treat your troops like shit, the way Arab armies do, they're not going to be motivated to perform.

Iranians weren't much better, but they had the motivation of ridding the Sunni invader from their home territory.

>>2785744
>Why the fuck does nobody talk about this war?

Because it was essentially another proxy war between the warsaw pact and NATO, which means NATO countries fueled the fighting with military aid.

>>2786531
Actually Iraq was backed by both the US and the USSR, Iran was a rogue retard nation.

>>2786532
>Iran was a rogue retard nation
Which won, against the entire world

Pretty impressive actually

>>2786536

I guess this does make sense when you look at the terrain, seize and population.

>>2786532
>Iraq was backed by both the US and the USSR, Iran was a rogue retard nation.

Iran was a U.S. proxy prior to the war, and was given military kit and training. Then the U.S. started to firmly back Saddam and Iraq. I believe Iran received aid from the French throughout the war, so the whole thing was an embarrassment to the west as they couldn't get their shit together about who to support.

>>2786624
>Khomeini
>US proxy
Are you retarded?

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>>2786627
>Iran was a U.S. proxy prior to the war,
>prior to the war
>PRIOR TO THE WAR
>PRIOR

>>2786627
The Shah was US proxy when he was installed on the throne after US-UK overthrew the democratic government of Iran. Then he turned hostile over time and got himself overthrown by Khomeini.

I mean the Iranian nuclear weapons meme goes all the way back to the fucking Shah turning his back to the US.

>>2786641
>he thinks Khomeini didn't rule Iran prior to the war
Iran revolution was '78, Iran-Iraq war started in '80, dumbo.

>>2786624
>>2786627
>>2786641
>>2786689
The Shah never turned hostile to America. Part of the reason the US hostages were taken was because the Shah was granted entry into America for medical treatment.

Yes, Iran had a whole bunch of equipment going to the Shah's regime, but after a short time that equipment was rendered useless. A lack of replacements or spare parts, maintainance equipment, munitions, etc once American support disappeared.

The Wester quite firmly backed Iraq. French shenanigans and the Iran-Contra affair notwithstanding, the US alone: shot down an Iranian passenger jet, attacked and sunk Iranian navy vessels, bombed Iranian oil platforms and provided Iraq with huge amounts of equipment and munitions. Maybe even the chemical weapons he used, but that I'm not sure of.

>>2786690
>he still can't figure out what the word "prior" means

>>2786690
Dude. Not the anon you're replying to, but American support for Iran ended before the war, it ended after the revolution.

>>2786700
Yes prior to the war the ruler was Khomeini

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>>2786703
And prior to the revolution it was the U.S. backed Shah.

We're done, sunshine.

>>2786706
Yeah, prior to the revolution. Not prior to the war.

>>2786699
>attacked and sunk Iranian navy vessels, bombed Iranian oil platforms

That's because the Iranians were dumb enough to fuck with our navy escorting tankers. They still do that shit today.

>>2786715
Maybe America shouldn't have been supplying Saddam with everything on his Christmas list

>>2786722
You think?

Our middle eastern policy has pretty much always been fucked up.

>>2786727
Yeah, fair enough.

International relations has always been basically might makes right/if you can get away with it, it's legal.

>>2786527
Most of the war was Iran reversing the tables and attacking the Iraqis (after the summer of 1982). The reason everyone was condemning the Iranians was that the Iranians wouldn't back off after pushing the Iraqis off their turf.
Khomeini was fucking butthurt Saddam tortured and killed one of his dear friends, and because he was super obsessed with realizing his vision for Shia theocratic revolution in the ME in his lifetime. It got so bad, Saddam started using chemical weapons by the fucking ton because Iraq's very existence was threatened (unlike the initial casus belli of the war, where all Iraq wanted was to reassert control of the Shatt al-Arab). Since 1982, the Iraqis pretty much agreed with every UN resolution, while Iran rejected them all.
Full disclosure, I think the Iranians deserve to be condemned because they autistically refused to recognize that they had no international support and that Islamic fervor is no excuse to send 13 year old boys running across minefields.

>>2786834

>It was just a prank, bro!

Kys,

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>>2785771
Cry more.

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>>2785744
>you will never empty your machine gun into a horde of screaming majoos subhumans charging at you in a human wave armed with plastic knives and then finally pull the pins on your own grenades as the Persian beasts overrun you

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zkGiB7zvk40

>>2786536
Calling it a victory is kind of a stretch.

>>2786866
If someone sucker punches you in the face, would you pull out a gun and try to shoot him in the head? Same principle.

>>2786834
FYI Iran also tried to use chemical weapons but they were really shit quality cyanide types

>>2786924

>Upon this, one has to remark that men ought either to be well treated or crushed, because they can avenge themselves of lighter injuries, of more serious ones they cannot; therefore the injury that is to be done to a man ought to be of such a kind that one does not stand in fear of revenge.

>>2786977
A statesman should also be able to recognize the weakness of his state and the futility of struggle against an infinitely more powerful state, and not waste blood and treasure in such a foolhardy way but acquiesce and live to fight another day.
What I'm trying to impress upon you is that there is no fucking way America would have ever let Iraq fall.

>>2785744
>>Saddam then runs electrical wiring through the swamp and electrocutes the Persian soldiers on a scale that would make Mike Pence blush
thats metal as fuck

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The issue Iran had was that after 1982 the war turned into a war of attrition, which Iran had no hope of winning, since nobody but the Chinese were actually willing to sell them weapons.

The ability to resupply your armies is a hugely underrated ability, and Iran was screwed in this regard.

>>2786498
there's alot but most of them are written in Arabic

Definitely one of the more interesting wars to me

Strange why the 3rd (iirc) largest war of the last century and if you'd ask most normies about it they would say they never heard of it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ukGL2K9Me4U&t=3s


Also to put into perspective, this was a solo 1-on-1 war in terms of manpower, so all those casualties were from only two countries.

Oh shit Iraq had jets and now it's a complete shithole.

>This war was the only one in history where helicopters fought in the air with other helicopters and shot them down
>One Iraqi Mi-24 literally shot down an Aircobra with it's autocannon

>>2787518
thanks bush, thanks obama

>>2786896
> Ar*b calling Persians subhuman

okay ahmed

>>2786834
That's moronic. If someone invades you then you don't have to stop just after you push them out. It's on their head. Stupid Iraqcuq.

>>2786924
>Calling it a victory is kind of a stretch.
Not really, unless you're stupid.

>>2786924
>If someone sucker punches you in the face, would you pull out a gun and try to shoot him in the head?
Fuck yeah I would, you ever read about niggers playing the 'Knockout Game'?
Shit killed people, how do I know they didn't intend to knock me out and then stomp on my neck and face?
How do I know they're not going to take it further?

>>2786066
I dont remember WW1 having antitank motorcycle cavalry.

>>2787525
I'M OFF TO SWAT SOME BOTHERSOME FLIES

It was like a child with Down's Syndrome and 30 siblings starting a fight with an old guy who lost both legs and most of his family in The War.

>>2787685
Because people dont act like nation states and both the Soviet Union and the United States had an interest in deescalation.
No one was interested in Revolutionary Iran and Ba'athist Iraq emerging as a regional hegemon: Iran was anti-Soviet and anti-American, and the Gulf Arab state shunned them for being Persians and Shia. Iraq didnt have a chance of winning any kind of protracted engagement against Iran which had top tier American tech, almost three times the population, a more homogenous population ethnically and religiously, far more oil and gas wealth, and an actual navy that could strangle all 48 km of Iraqs coastline (which is mostly useless marsh) and cut off Iraqi exports.

Iraq wanted to seize Khuzestan and force heavy concessions from Iran by seizing Irans chief oil refinery at Abadan and prime revenue producing oil fields. From this position of power, I'd presume they'd demand total sovereignty over the Shatt (a reversal of the thalweg principle that Saddam felt was extorted from him by Shah Pahlavi) and "liberate" some parts of Khuzestan which was majority Arab.

>>2785744

why has the Iraqi military always been a fucking joke?

>>2787514

>be T-72
>get BTFO by infantry

>>2788079
And to expand on the thalweg thing, basically the Shah of Iran had grandiose visions of becoming a regional leader, restoring Iran to Achaemenid primacy. He was in a ripe position to do so. The only seriously challenge to Iran in the Gulf was Saudi Arabia and neither were willing to risk fucking up their relationship with the US to fight a war with an uncertain winner. He started by abrogating a 1937 (? 1932?) agreement that Perfidious Albion brokered in Iraqs favor that basically gave Iraq total control over the waterway. That meant you stepped in the Shatt from the Iranian side, you were in Iraqi waters. Shah Pahlavi thought this was bullshit because 80% of the traffic on the Shatt went to Abadan or Khorramshahr. So he told Iraq if you wanna fight over, throw them hands nigga. Iraq, being substantially weaker militarily, got cucked.
But this wasnt enough for Pahlavi. He knew this would be trouble in the future so he wanted Iraq to legitimize the state of affairs. As par course for Middle Eastern politics, he started giving the Kurds heavy military support to fuck with his neighbors, up to and including direct air and artillery support WITHIN Iraq. The Iraqi army was basically beat the fuck up like a housewife after an exhausting COIN campaign that led nowhere. Saddam got forced to the table because he knew he couldnt continue fighting the Kurds without potentially losing even more ground to the Iranians. His Soviet tech army was thoroughly shit all over by Iranian's shiny gadgets courtesy of the USA. He agreed to concede to the thalweg principle if Iran fucked off and stopped supporting Iraqi Kurds. And as usual, the Kurds got fucked over in the end. After they signed the Algiers agreement in 75, the Iranians took back all of their heavy weaponry and abandoned the Kurds to their fate.

Saddam never forgot how Shah fucked with him though and considered signing the Algiers accord deeply shameful.

>>2785744

And yet if it wasn't for the the USA, USSR and Europe and the Persian gulf states stepping in to help Iraq they would have been overrun and defeated by an millita more than an army of semi trained men with Chinese and North korean weapons

Pretty shameful on the part of Iraq what happened to the blitzkrieg what happened to the expectation of Iranians not wanting war having been through a revolution why were the Iranians able to push into Iraq almost capturing Basra why did the Iraqis propose peace just to be turned down

In the end nothing changed except that Iraqis/Arabs once again proved they can't fight a war and win and that Iranians even with the odds mounted against them will fight hard and long to defend their nation

Why did Iraq's army run for the hills when the USA invaded? Seems pretty cowardly

>>2786699
I've also done some reading on French arms sales. The French are pretty fucking mercenary when it comes to selling weapons to people and they just fucking LOVE pissing off America or the Uk, especially if they make a buck doing it. Washington tried hard as hell to get the French to not ship those 5 Super Etendards with the Exocet antiship missiles. Once people found out about the sale, the French being fucking French told Iraq, blamed the US to Iraq that their shipment would be delayed, waited out the news so they wouldnt be perceived as responsible for the escalation of the Gulf conflict, then went through with it anyway.

In fact, France was the 2nd largest supplier of Iraqi military equipment and even sold them a fucking nuclear reactor, which Israel preemptively blew up in a lightning strike with a US-supplied jet, which fucking pissed the fuck out of Reagan because Iraq is anti-Zionist as fuck and the surgical strike just inflamed tensions in the region.

Btw fuck Mitterand.

>>2788154
Iranian courage is fucking superhuman. The sheer volume of human wave attacks penetrated 5 out of 6 of Basras defensive rings. They took fucking horrendous casualties, yet they reformed, and charged across minefields, endured agonizing gas attacks, drowned by the thousands in mud and marsh, again and again. Little boys on bikes peddled to their deaths with grenades in their hands. 18 year old Iraqi boys were forced to mow down battalions of 12 to 16 year olds.

Is this the power of Allah u akbar?

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>>2785771
>tfw half my family died protecting their homeland
>tfw women died because of missiles falling on tehran
>tfw cousin died of poison gas. poison fucking gas
why is america the vehicle by which satan enters the world? what the fuck is their problem.

>>2787502
>reading arabic sources on anything that has to do with Iran
enjoy muh crypto fireworshipper bullshit

>>2786715
The Tanker War was honestly one of the more interesting aspects of the war. With the delivery of French Super Etendards, the Iraqis were able to strike as far east as the Bandar-e Abbas on the strait. They blew up Irans biggest oil terminal at Kharg Island and started indiscriminately attacking any tankers loading up on Iranian oil. Saddam knew he could no longer hope to survive without
1. Disrupting the Iranian economy at large, esp. their oil revenues
2. (More importantly) force the Iranians to attack (((neutral))) Gulf Arab shipping and genuinely neutral shipping and escalate the conflict, forcing the US or USSR to intervene.
3. Try to get the Iranians to cross the red line Reagan proclaimed in 1982 that if Iran even fucking tries to blockade the strait of Hormuz, he would remove obstacles with any force necessary.

Good realpolitik by Saddam. Too bad he was like Hitler in that he couldnt run an Army for shit.

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>real life Maverick was an Iranian

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>>2786834
>Full disclosure, I think the Iranians deserve to be condemned because they autistically refused to recognize that they had no international support and that Islamic fervor is no excuse to send 13 year old boys running across minefields.

>arabshits actually believe this meme

>>2786896
>to those who fought and died for free Iraq
L M A O

>>2787514
Jesus Christ. War is hell.

>>2788194
Hold up there, Ahmedinejad. You shouldnt have tried to spread the Revolution to Shia Northern Iraq. If you just accepted the UN resolutions to ceasefire which Iraq has agreed to since like 1981 or 82, none of that would have been necessary.

>>2788229
You do know that Khomeini allowed a special dispensation to allow young schoolboy volunteers to join the Basij [suicide] battalions? You still had full grown men and you sent the boys to die first.

>>2787630
You do stop when both the USSR and the USA tell you to fucking stop.

>>2788238
>you shouldnt have tried to spread the Revolution to Shia Northern Iraq. If you just accepted the UN resolutions to ceasefire which Iraq has agreed to since like 1981 or 82, none of that would have been necessary.
>you
LARPing is for /int/ and /pol/. please go back there.

>>2788257
Literally not an argument. Come back when you realize how fucking stupid Iran's brand of fundamental Shiite Islam is.

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>>2788261
nice meme

>>2788107
>why have all Arab militaries been a joke for the past 600years
Ftfy

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Does anyone like Iranian war music? Holy fuck this stirs something in my soul. I dont speak Persian at all, some Irananon posted this on /pol/ before. Inb4 go back to /pol/. The song is damn good.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hBxCWsEcQnc

>tfw Iranian army had people dressed as Ali on a horses waving swords to motivate the infantry charges

I believe shia can be way crazier than sunni

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>>2788297

>>2788348
didn't they also hand out plastic keys to soldiers, telling them that those were the keys to the gates of paradise when they died?

Recommend me some good books on this.

>>2788154
>Why did Iraq's army run for the hills when the USA invaded?

Because they were smart.

>>2788154
>Why did Iraq's army run for the hills when the USA invaded? Seems pretty cowardly

The ones that didn't run wound up dead.

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>>2788194
>MFW Muslims blame everybody but themselves for their modern violent history

Would it make you feel better if the Saudi's, or the Egyptians, were the ones propping up Iraq?

>>2788107
We just do not fucking know. The amount of money and time we throw at those camel fuckers boggles the mind, it has literally been over a decade we have tried to train them but in one of the last major battles with ISIS not even 6 months ago half of the Iraqi fighters fled the field. It may be some kind of biological deficiency, on average they're 5'0" and 100lbs in full gear, maybe it's a lack of education like they're the 3rd son in the family with no schooling at the most rudimentary level and they see the army as the only paying job they could get, the possibilities are endless.

>>2788485
The CIA was giving the Iraqi's coordinates of where to launch chemical attacks. No matter how you parse that, its pretty fucked up. t. arabshit

>>2788485
btw you replied to an /sg/ meme good job

>>2788485
It's true that muslims are at fault, but it would help if the US stopped funneling money and guns to the most stupid ones.

>>2788203
It's not like neutral sources are rife on most conflicts buddy. Also there are still a few books that were written by Iraqis who fought in the war that provide a decent perspective with no heavy bias, especially the books written by Iraqi general Ra'ad Al-hamdani, he wrote 4 books I think, one about his experience in fighting the Israelis in the Arab coalition, one about the Iran-Iraq war, one about the invasion of Kuwait, and one about desert storm and 2003. I think they are available in English

>>2788542
>it would help if the US stopped funneling money and guns to the most stupid ones.
We have to support our brothers fighting for freedom to overthrow their oppressive regimes ; )

>>2788393
no that one was a myth

like most exaggerated stories of human wave charges (most of them didn't really happen like the Iraqis described them happening)

>>2788514
>We just do not fucking know.

Iraqi "leaders" are incompetent as fuck, and treat their men as if they were little more than personal servants. Combine that with the Sunni / Shia rift, and the fact that those same leaders steal everything from gas, to the soldiers pay, to enrich themselves, and you'll start to understand why Iraqi "soldiers" have no desire to fight.


>>2788542
Can't argue against saving U.S. cash instead of wasting it in the land of Mohammad. However, if it wasn't us, it would be somebody else. It's not like the Saudi's are fans of Shia Iran, and those niggers are loaded with cash.

>>2786624
Israel also provided the Iranians with backing.

On 7 June 1981 Israeli F15 & 16 aircraft bombed and destroyed the French built Iraqi plutonium research reactor at Osirak/Tuwaitha. Intelligence for this operation came from Iran after their own failed operation on 30 Sept 1980. The Iranians also gave permission for the Israeli aircraft involved in the mission to use the Iranian airbase at Tabriz.

In July 1981 an aircraft carrying arms from Israel to Iran crashed near the Soviet-Turkish boarder. It is estimated that $500 million in arms were supplied by Israel to Iran between 1980-83.

Israel also provided technical assistance with Iran's US built weapons; notably the F1-4 Tomcat. For example supplying tyres and undercarriage brake componentsfor the F-14. In 1985 Israeli technicians worked in Iran on technical adapations of the F-14 for the Iranians.

Despite the hostility between the two nations Israel was probably Iran's most consistent supporter in the war

>>2786924
>Calling it a victory is kind of a stretch.
Is it? Iraq failed its strategic goals and objectives in annexing territory from Iran, and this is despite most of the West supporting them and having the original initiative in the war in the first place.

>>2786889
>>2786896
Which dead leader between Iran and Iraq got executed by their own people again?

>>2788635
>Despite the hostility between the two nations Israel was probably Iran's most consistent supporter in the war
Nah that'd be Assad's Syria

>>2788220
He was a fucking bad-ass.

>>2786498
I think Osprey did a good one.

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>This imagery is typical of Iranian propaganda artists, who I think are some of the most unnerving in the world. Their works often look like anti-war art, even when they are made with at least the tacit blessing of the state. The reasons for this are complicated but they have a lot do do with Shi'a Islam's cultural emphasis on martyrdom, self-sacrifice, and the moral value of struggle. Iran saw itself as the underdog in the war with Iraq (while it was much larger, it was weakened from internal conflict when Saddam invaded, and Iraq generally had the backing of both the US and the USSR). This self-image heavily influenced the work of its propagandists. Most other countries have usually tried to sanitize war, but Iran emphasized its own suffering.

>>2788647
The Israelis provided the most valuable support desu. They hated Saddam way more than Khomeini. They were also concerned about the fate of the 30,000 or so Iranian Jews trapped inside Iran.

>>2785771
>the entire world
Fuck off NATOfag

>>2788568
The Saudis are flush with American cash you fucking mongrel

>>2788647
Hafez pretty much destroyed Iraq's economy by blocking a pipeline

>>2788194
Well it would help if you didn't hold a bunch of embassy staff hostage in your Islamist chimpout. I get that we backed a coup in 53, but diplomats are off limits to everyone. Apparently it doesn't apply to radical Shiite fuckheads.

>>2788952
As an iranian (who hasn't posted in this thread so far) I definitely know that tendency in Iranian/Persian/Twelver culture. Everything is so bloody and dramatic and intensely sad and mournful.

Not gonna lie, having grown up and lived in the West all my life and seeing clips of Iranians dying at the hands of the Iraqis really bothers me. That 100% would've been me out there 35 or so years ago.

>>2790576
one doesn't have much to do with the other, the US is not one to speak about any kind of foreign policy or diplomatic faux-pas.

>>2790600
https://youtube.com/watch?v=hBxCWsEcQnc

>>2790627
If Iran wasn't a religious shithole I'd happily return to my ancestral homeland.

But I need a degree of social liberalism and justice and they simply don't offer it.

>>2790644
Ever been there? It's not that bad especially in a smaller city like Esfahan. Like any other non-European old world society, it's all about who you know.

>>2790657
No, and I really want to go but I would stick out like a sore thumb so it's not like it would be a homecoming.

Also I'm terrified I'd breakdown and have a crisis of identity as soon as I visited my ancestral city (Lar/Shiraz)

>>2790666
trips confirm you are a massive faggot jesus christ dude grow a pair. youre not iranian btw youre american and yeah i bet the goatfuckers would tear you a new asshole because you cant handle simple banter

>>2790644
Iran even under the IR is nowhere as bad as you think it is. Granted I'm only half-Persian but places like Shiraz and Mashhad as well as Tehran are fantastic.

>>2790615
>>2790630
Kill yourselfs artists
>>2790644
Go self hate else where


Why do faggots think this place is their blog?

>>2790669
>>2790672
>>2790675
the Islamic Republic is terrifying dude

>>2790672
Were you obviously only half Iranian? Did people comment on it? Before hearing you speak I mean. Im sure you have a foreign accent when speaking Persian.

>>2790679
its not hard to keep your head down especially as a foreigner.

>>2790686
I'm fully persian-born, raised in the west. Hence the crisis of identity.

Anyway, it's not my blog you're all right. I'm just over-sharing because I had a visceral reaction to OP. 20,000 Iranians dead in a swamp. Fuck.

>>2790690
>persian
yeah you surely are a real western loser. no iranian goes around calling themselves persian. self hating faggots like you are the worst goddamn.

>>2790684
Of course I have a "accent" when speaking Persian since I didn't grow up in Iran and my main language is English.

>Were you obviously only half Iranian?
I don't know how to answer this properly. My mom's family is from Tehran and Mashhad, they are all very fair skinned and light haired. Several of my mother's sisters and brothers have hazel and light green eyes. I have light brown hair and hazel eyes, and that isn't as uncommon as you would be led to believe by people ignorant of Iranians.

>>2786531
The US backed both sides
So it really was a proxy war of who of the US arms dealers could make the most money

>>2790696
jesus christ man, I actually make it a point to never call myself persian in that guido sense. I meant ethnically as in I'm not azeri or mazandarani or balochi or wtv. anyway get off my case.

>>2790721
>announcing reports

>>2790705
Well Persians are their own ethnicity within Iranian umbrella, just as Kurds are their own distinct one, same with Gilakis, Balochis, etc...

>>2790734
I know, that's why I specified persian. But the other anon has a point, in the West, those who say Persian and not just Iranian are kinda dweeby.

Sorry, this isn't /int/ I've derailed a great (and horrifying) thread.

>>2790734
Kurds are p cool. Descendants of Indo European tribes who settled Mesopotamia 4000 years ago.

>>2790744
I say Persian because the average American can't even say Iranian or even Iran properly. Same with Italy and Italians for that matter.

>>2790748
>Kurds
>Mesopotamia

"No."

>>2790748
>Kurds
>settled Mesopotamia 4000 years ago
Kurds aren't Medes.
Kurds aren't Parthians.

The term and use of "Kurd" by Persians and the Parthians was already a derogatory term for groups of outcasts and nomads and considering the Parthians already KNEW what Kurds were, I don't think anyone can argue Kurds are Parthians.

>The blogging continues

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>>2790511
>this butthurt faggot

>>2790600
>That 100% would've been me out there 35 or so years ago.

And now you just let the white men fight and die instead, right?

>>2790769
I'd happily want nobody to die.

If somebody had to fight, I'd prefer the arabs get some fighting done. They're so damn bad at war they could use the experience.

>>2790700
Whats your fathers ethnicity?

>>2790794
Scottish/German/English, with a bit of Italian and Dutch.

>>2788194
Last I checked, we weren't the ones who were using poison gas on their own people or starting oppressive theocracies.

>>2790808
999% aryan detected

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>>2790840
>""own"" people

>Saddam then runs electrical wiring through the swamp
Saddam didn't do that, some clever officer devised the plan
Saddam himself was basically a detriment to his general staff

>>2790883
>Saddam himself was basically a detriment to his general staff

Didn't he also have a nasty habit of executing his generals whenever one of their offensives failed?

I seem to recall reading that he executed a shit ton of people after the liberation of Khorramshahr.

>>2790701
That is pretty pathetic....

>>2790862I
Iraq is the Middle Eastern equivalent to Yugoslavia. It's "existence" being a stake is a meme.

>>2790696
>>2790701
At least mods on /his/ are active during the night.

>>2790901
>only Kurds want to leave
>Even then shia Feylis are pro Baghdad even in Halabja
>Assyrians don't want to
>Turkmen don't want to
>afro Iraqis don't want to
>Sunni Arab don't want to
>Even ethnic Persians aka Ajami Iraqis still see themself as Iraqis
Fuck off Biji
Go fuck your sister or something

>>2790922
Hello propaganda kun, how was your vacation from Iraq after 2003?

>>2790892
oh folks down to the lowliest of officers ended up getting purged. And not just by Saddam, the guy tended to favour commanders that used punishment as execution
it's str8 up self-inflicted attrition and that's incredibly dumb. Like you don't go into a conflict saying "well they purged their army so we got this" and then proceed to purge your army.
The iranians were doing the opposite, they were appeasing anyone with an iota of military skill and keeping em long enough to send em on a human wave attack.

>>2790769

YOLO if they were fighting something worthily maybe

>>2790769

YOLO if they were fighting something worth while maybe

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>>2785744
It's insane how driven Iran was to defeat the Iraqi forces

Sigh at all these buttmad Persians who cry about getting BTFO even though theyre responsible for unnecessarily continuing the war.

>>2785771

>Because it's inconvenient to remember that the entire world backed Saddam fucking Hussein in an invasion of a sovereign nation

true

>and only just managed to save him from getting BTFO completely.

false

>>2791892

Filthy Arab who can't come to terms with that they can't defeat Iran you cockroach eating monkey

>>2791902

Arabs crushed the shit out of Iran centuries ago.

Iranians today *are* Arabs in all but language. They worship an Arabian warrior-king FFS

>>2786924
>If someone sucker punches you in the face, would you pull out a gun and try to shoot him in the head?

'murricans probably would

>>2791913
>They worship an Arabian warrior-king FFS

They worship a Jew "god", and an Arab "prophet"....which makes them about as cucked as Christians.

>>2791942

No. Sunnis worship Allah a.k.a. Jehovah, the Semitic Hebrew god who hates pork and demands circumcision.

Shi'ites literally worship Muhammad.

>>2791949
>Shi'ites literally worship Muhammad.

Who worshipped the same Jew god that the Jews and dumb ass Christians do...

>>2791913

Hmmmm is that why you camel fuckers are so ass blasted when some even mentions Iran it's nice that we can get under your skin you sell out skit skin cannon fodder get bombed

>>2792590
Tbh "muh Majoos" and "Muh Qādisiyyah" are balkan tier autists
The Russians and Americans may as well have their hegemony secured thanks to you autists

>>2788485
>violent history
>US invaded more countries in last few decades than anyone else

hmm

>>2785771
>entire world backed Saddam fucking Hussein in an invasion of a sovereign nation, and only just managed to save him from getting BTFO completely.
never change iranian shilling

>>2786269
>despite heavy support and more advance weapons?
iraq didn't have heavy support nor more modern weapons
usa played both sides, read iran-contra
and iran had a great arsenal from shah that's more modern (and western not soviet) than anything iraq had

>>2786031
tell me more

>>2793267
>>2795167
>>2795181
You are really obnoxious with the samefagging.

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>>2785744
>Operation Nasr
>Iranians launch massive armored offensive
>Hundreds of tanks roll over bridges in the rain
>Iraqi forward positions with infantry hold them back just long enough for an armored brigade to roll up and get ready to face the Iranian spearhead
>Iranians in a spike of autism decide to stick to the roads and run it down
>alot of shitty british cheiftain tanks overheat and cause congestion
>Iraqi armored brigade deployed around the road, dug in trenches
>they ambush the Iranians, hundreds of tanks climax in the rain
>the iranians launch soviet-style frontal spearheads trying to break through the Iraqi defenses
>the offensive fails
>the Iraqis launch a counterattack and destroy what remained of the Iranian armored spearhead across the bridge

Was this the biggest tank battle since WW2?

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my dad was in this war he killed at least one subhuman Persian scum, AMA

Good times, my country made a lot of money selling weapons to Saddam, to bad he refused to pay anything anymore once the war was over and our defense industry collapsed.

t. Brazilian

>>2788549
Where can I get his books? Google tells me nothing.

>>2790576
Who gives a fuck about that, a literally nothing in the span of history amd US-Iranian relations.

>>2785744
Iranian here. Never call us Persian again. Thanks

>>2796401
>lying

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>>2796401
Sorry i dint mean to offend u, is majoos better

>>2796644
Idk, is calling you a pagan better?

>>2796401
Lmao at least you don't have an inferiority complex like those other Ir*nians. As an Arab Christian it pisses me off when other Arab Christians call themselves Phoenician or Assyrian or whatever.

>>2796758
Well those are all western diaspora. In Iran no one calls themselves "fars", and it would be seen as an insult if they did.
It's like an Italian unironically calling themselves Roman, or like you said other middle eastern christians calling themselves Phoenician or Assyrian.

The "Persian" identity in todays sense is a meme created by westerners or those who would like to see Islam in Iran destroyed in order to try and get Iranians to reject the islamic identity we have had for the last 1400 years in favor of our pre islamic identity in a sort of larping fashion.

For instance 1400 years ago levantines did not speak Arabic, so back then they were Phoenician, Assyrian, or whatever.
But today we all middle easterners share nearly identical cultures and for the most part the same religion.

Likewise, "Arab" and "Persian" are linguistic identities, but genetically we are all related.

The only time I would ever call anyone or myself a "Persian" is if I'm referring to the linguistic identity that Iranians, Afghans, and Tajiks are all a part of.

>>2796917
>the same religion.

Yup....the very same Jew garbage that corrupted the Euro's.

>>2795919
how does it feel to be the bad guy?

>>2796401
Why not?
Legitimately curious

>>2797549
I see you explained it

>>2788297
What? Hezbollah and Syria won the Lebanon War, and Hezbollah is wodely regarded the victor of the 2006 Lebanon War- a Shiite militia btfoing the IDF funded and fueled by the American taxpayer. Then on top of that, half of the world sent troops in Iraqi Freedom- except surprise surprise Israel.

>>2797549
In the context 99% of people use it today, it is a tool to try and divide Iranians from other middle easterners.

>>2785744
I fought in this war, Iran side. Conscripted

AMA

>>2797713
Post pics of your bene now!

>>2797713
Lies

>>2785771
at least Israel and Argentina sided with Iran

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1981_Armenia_mid-air_collision

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel%27s_role_in_the_Iran%E2%80%93Iraq_war

>>2795800
Not sure, I think that might have been the battles during the 1971 India-Pakistan war. Otoh the Iran-Iraq war happened afterwards, so may have superseded the I-P battles.

>>2796917
This is a whole lot of bullshit in one post.

>>2796917
>iranian culture is similar to those of arab countries
ahvazi detected?

>>2796917
>Likewise, "Arab" and "Persian" are linguistic identities, but genetically we are all related.
Everyone is trashing your post but no one mentioned this. Look up genetic profiles, you fucking idiot

>>2796917
>It's like an Italian unironically calling themselves Roman,

about 5 million italians do so

>>2796917
>Likewise, "Arab" and "Persian" are linguistic identities
Only for Arabs, not Iranians.
>but genetically we are all related
Wrong. Autosomal DNA show Iranians are very much distant from Arabs.

>>2796917
- t. Khuzestani A*rab subhuman

>>2796401
What's the matter, my Persian friend?

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>>2796401
>>2796917

>This "Iranian" American diaspora islamist at it again with his nonsense

You're barely capable of understanding Persian yet you claim like you're somehow an authority on what actual Iranians believe?