Occultism & Magick: Library Update 52

Considering that four out of four men were in three or four secret societies during the 19th century, what was the impact of that and would you say that we are much poorer without it today?

>>2743315
Most of the serious orgs of that time period are still around in some incarnation or another.

People just need to use 'em.

Bump for books.

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Bump.

>>>/x/

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When people say that the Golden Dawn, AA and OTO are masonic off shoots what exactly does that mean?

Masons constantly deny any affiliation with the occult but most organisations claim some masonic origin

>>2743289
What is this? An image for ants!?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z43CU4a_eII

>>2743646
They either hold charters from/as Masonic Lodges or have some sort of vaguely rosicrucian practice and belief. Mostly the former.

Praying to the Ibis headed God of Reason that this thread is less of an autistic shitfest than the one on /x/

also bump

>>2744191
A lot of butthurt and autissimo going on, for sure. Give us this day our daily knowledge, and banish thee from our realm the spirit of Autissimo Maximus, so that every spirit of the firmament and of the ether, in dry land and in the water, of whirling air and rushing fire, and every spell and scourge of god may be obedient unto us...and that no more butthurt may enter! So mote it be!

>>2743289
Anything interesting or worthwhile in the the Order of the Solar Temple or are they just another masonic rip off?

>>2743646
>what exactly does that mean?

That these groups literally copy Masonic ritual and structures and rebrand them as their own

>>2743646
It's really a matter of history.
A.'.A.'. is essentially nonmasonic.
Golden Dawn splintered from SRIA as a comasonic org.
OTO is an outgrowth and revision of Memphis & Mizraim.

>>2744544
I don't really know much about those cats.

>>2744554
Since I offer Masonic ritual scripts alongside those of other orgs, you can substantiate this claim, yes?

AYY LMAO

Praise Jesus

>>2745308
> you can substantiate this claim, yes?

Of course looking at your material for the 1o in OTO

The initial and closing process prior to that is very similar to the tiling process in a Masonic lodge

They then hoodwink the candidate (using the same wording as the masons)

Then they both start with the conversation at the door with the "whom have you there"
And have a similar spiel poor fellow ect

after that they point a dagger to the candidates throat as the Masons do to the heart and eventually use the same noose.

They go though a simmilar list of commitments to which the candidate replies "I am"

-They use a striped down version of the word or token part of a masonic initiation - using the exact words in the exchange "give that word" "I was taught to be cautious" ect but only do the lettering rather than the halfing

Whilst not wholly plagiarized it borrows very very heavily

>>2745902
>Whilst not wholly plagiarized it borrows very very heavily
Ok, that's 1st.
Now tell me about 0 through 11.

Any of you guys make your own novel rituals or magical practices?

Completely original I mean, not just derivative

>>2746092
>Ok, that's 1st.

Is there a particular reasoning they copied the first ?

>>2746378
Well, let's consider the fact that even the person who I'm replying to admits it's not wholly plagiarized.

Then let's consider what I'd mentioned earlier: OTO is a revision of the Memphis & Mizraim traditions from a German Oriental outfit or possibly some irregular lodge, the history isn't clear.

The German 1st IS more or less a copy of Freemasonic Entered Apprentice with some tinkering. Early in the OTO's history, it's express purpose was "making Freemasons" which meant they essentially ported Blue Lodge degrees early on and then elaborated and revised thereon.

Crowley decided he was going to revise the whole damn thing to put it in line with Thelemic ideals and concepts.

>>2746150
What's the litmus for originality?
I'm building some eclipse rites from scratch using clues in Totemic Invokation of the Shadow Selves and some of Schulke and Chumbley's books (ZHA/Baetyla)

>>2746150
True originality is harder than you think. Which is why "master of the Temple" is it's own grade

>>2743289
Nice. Thanks Ape!

>>2746460
There's also this.
There's also the question of whether the Freemasonic model is actually worth a fuck when it comes to mystical systems.

Hence how redacted OTO initiations are, and why the A.'.A.'. doesn't really use much of the Freemasonic system(s) [read: One of the A.'.A.'. initiations is very original, and the other
Egyptian derived but nonmasonic].

>>2746468
Pleasure as always.

Back up top.

Have a bump /x/ refugees

>>2746715
thank you for welcoming us to your supple land

>>2746715
I'm not exactly a refugee; I've been posting on /his/ since very shortly after inception.

>>2747441
no one cares about your Chan cred, Ape-eroo

>>2747518
>cred
Sorry if I [triggered] you while trying to add context to someone's reply.
We (I) am not here as a 'refugee'.
I'm not here because /x/ sucks (even though it does).
I'm not here because we've been banned.

I'm here because the texts I add to the library are /his/ topical, regardless of what certain detractors may imply.

>>2747518
Look magic is a part of human culture and from what I understand this board is History and Humanities discusses things relating to that so you can have a hissy fit all you like but this technically can belong here although I much prefer it to stay on x. Not because I'm a his board user but because it makes x a little more better than it is with its presence.

>>2747697
>Not because I'm a his board user but because it makes x a little more better than it is with its presence.
Really for the last almost, like, what, a year? It's made /his/ better too compared to:
>prove me wrong
>*blocks path*
>did nothing wrong
>WE WUZ
>were [nonwhite group] white?
>MUH POLITICAL SYSTEMS
>MUH JEEBUZ SHITPOSTING
>MUH CLASSICAL ART MEMES FROM FB

>>2747709
I just meant I prefer reading this thread on X. I know you post on lit as well and from my experience the threads on x seem better to me, that is to say more/better discussions but I mostly find these threads through x and not as often on the other boards.

>>2747720
I stopped /lit/ posting because there are some people with MASSIVE cases of Ascended Master Syndrome out there; people from the Gunther lineage who flip their shit if you're not keeping a public blog with your entire ritual records.

>>2747744
from what ive seen of lit, yeah, I get that. Just a bunch of contrarians and hipsters, you have to have read the 'right' books which change all the time, flavour of the month and meme book galore.
Lit is one of the worst, elitist boards on this site. They don't deserve a threadlike this.
It's their loss.

>>2747777
The idea that there is a 'correct' interpretation of texts and symbolism therein that comes from actual research and historiography makes it hard to get an English degree.

>>2747798
huh?

>>2747744
"Every man and every woman is an Ascended Master."

Thanks for the great rec. of Silene Capensis. I didn't realize the shit has effects in waking state as well. Isn't it sometimes used for necromancy?

>>2747967
He's shitting on /lit/fags who read some Evola and like a quarter of the public Crowley corpus and think they've got it ALL FIGURED.

>>2747986
Yes. IIRC, could be wrong.

>>2748004
>He's shitting on /lit/fags who read some Evola and like a quarter of the public Crowley corpus and think they've got it ALL FIGURED.
Oh right thanks for explaining all I could see were the words and the meaning wasn't sinking in.

>>2747744
>public blog w/ entire ritual records

Because it's not like this could make someone, I dunno, susceptible or anything, right?

>>2748056
?
I'm not entirely sure I follow.

Like, I got no issue if you're running an entry level A.'.A.'. blog. Go to town.

But on the other hand don't pretend you're the only person doing Work just because you post some notes on the LBRP.

(Funny enough, this guy's handle on the system was poor enough to not know the grade at which you may take students and the grade at which there's no going back, metaphysically speaking).

>>2748013
I have a sinus infection so some meaning may have been lost.

Pretty much that. They treat it like a novel and make up their own meaning for everything and don't actually put any of it into practice anyway. It's really bad when they talk about Buddhism because it really highlights that no one there has read a primary source or referenced it with a commentary.

>>2748110
Sad thing is that describes like 4/5ths of Buddhist discussion on /his/ too.

Everyone has an opinion but nobody wants to crack open the Tripitaka.

>>2748077
I just don't think posting your entire ritual notes, complete with when/where/how/why/who/what, &c.
is an entirely good idea, generally speaking,

>>2748129
But I mean, yeah if someone's just LBRPing and LRHing it up, I guess very little harm can be done by publishing that info in real time. Other things... not so much, I would think.

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>>2748122
Autistics tend to have a stigma against the kind of drugs you need to power through vedic philosophy and penomonology. 40 pages into this and I need a nap.

>>2748129
>>2748157
I'd tend to agree.

>>2748184
Man I found the short discourses to be more "trouble" than Abhidhamma; which is really just a phenomenology of perception with Indic terminology.

>>2748223
The short discourses are full of literal propaganda to convert plebs. My favorite is when anons quote the tale of gotama converting the city of yogis and think it means "see for yourself if the dhamma is true" and not "these pious fucks fell for it and so should you rajeesh".

>>2748269
They're also full of cute and interesting but hard to contextualize vignettes showing the underlying mechanics of Siddhartha's mode of thought outside the dry and systemic framework of Abhidhamma.

I dig the "I want some water" bit.

Bump
~t. Stoner Philospher

>>2748275
I haven't been through those in a long time. The last thing I read was all the entertaining stories about why monks have a rule for absolutely everything.

>>2748275
Ape, do you believe David Griffin's alleged attainment to be what it is claimed to be? I know 'above the abyss' and all that stuff, but he just doesn't strike me as quite the enlightened individual as even the Neophyte might expect from one of so exalted a grade

>>2748439
Are you fucking kidding me?
Dave Griffin couldn't Attain his way out of a wet paper nutsack.

He's the Imperator of absolutely nothing, and I doubt he's brushed his fingers across Tifaret let alone completed his Exemption.

>>2744191
Well, there's no Tranny Sevenleaf shitposting in this one, so that's a plus.

>>2748452
I mean, didn't mean to [trigger] you there. I know fuckall about the guy, other than seeing him shitting everywhere, constantly, but apparently he has a lot of people sucking his cock and thinking he knows what he's talking about. Who decides these things?

>>2748503
>2017
>not liking girldick

>>2748604
I dunno the actual lineage holders like Pat Zel and Stella Matutina.

>>2748610
>tfw no trans occultist gf to perform rituals with and suck eachother's feminine cocks

https://youtu.be/iET8HtUwdtY

>>2748630
>tfw no occultist girlfriend to perform rituals with at all, but still have gf so can't seek one out in good conscience

>>2743646
>Masons constantly deny any affiliation with the occult but most organisations claim some masonic origin

Not true

>When people say that the Golden Dawn, AA and OTO are masonic off shoots what exactly does that mean?

They conform to the same philosophy and beliefs that masons do for the most part

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>>2748647
>tfw milking bliss state as much as I can

How fucked am I?

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>>2748939
The pendulum swings both ways.

>>2748974
There is no pendulum.
There is only Awakened Ground.

>>2748122
Wisdom pubs does make that more difficult than it ought to be

>>2748223
The short discourses are more fun to listen to then to read if you can find some audio files. Granted, not ideal for deep analysis

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