How "white" were the Romans?

Who cares?

Mediterranean

>>2725133
Stormfags like OP, apparently.

Just sage and hide. We have 10's of these threads every day and it isn't any less trash now than it's ever been.

>>2725143
>>2725133
This

I'm salty that no one wants to talk about actual Roman history. No one wants to talk about their architecture, what effects the Marian reforms had on the army, the conquest of Gaul. No, they want to fucking talk about "GUYS GUYS WERE THE ROMANS WHITE GUYS" or "GUYS GUYS WERE THE EGYPTIANS WHITE GUYS"

Fuck off

>>2725175
What is your opinion of Aetius?

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>>2725125
>How "white" were the Romans?

They were Italics

>>2725187
The last person capable of saving the WRE.

>>2725187
Good general who BTFO Attila
Too little too late though, Western Rome was doomed

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>>2725125

>>2725125
White enough to breed your jealousy mah niggah

>>2725194
Germanic rape babbys. The Romans did not look like that

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>>2725242
>muh rape babbys

Here we go again

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>>2725242
>When the empire you fetishize doesn't line up with how you preserve them so you just say that the big strong empire got fucking destroyed and raped to death by some barbarians

>>2725242
>He thinks a few hundred rapes is going to suddenly replace a population of several million

>>2725242
You're wrong.

>Conversely, the foreign population of Rome was very small. Scientific evidence has shown that non-locals were in the minority, and most came from other parts of Italy or nearby provinces in Southern/Central Europe. Biochemical analysis of 166 skeletons from three non-elite imperial-era cemeteries in the vicinity of Rome revealed that only 1 individual definitely came from outside of Europe (North Africa), and another 2 possibly did, but results are inconclusive.[30][31] Other than that, there was no apparent net inter-regional migration in the imperial period, except perhaps a small continuous resettlement of Easterners in the West.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demography_of_the_Roman_Empire

>>2725175

It sucks for Roman fans, but imagine being a fan of Carthage or Egypt.

The ratio of "we wuz" shitposting for both of those is considerably higher than for Romans, which is already much higher than it has any right to be.

>>2725125
Whiteness did not exist as a concept back then and trying to apply modern racial identity to them is utter nonsense.

>>2725143
Le /pol/ boogeyman

>>2725194
That image is good for saying 1 in 6 Italians look like that in terms of skin tone and complexion.

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Roman literary records describe a large number of well-known Roman historical personalities as blond.

Augustus, founder of the Roman Empire, is by Suetonius described as having hair that was " golden".

Nero, descended from an aristocratic family, is by the historian Suetonius described as: "... his hair light blond,... his eyes blue..."

Emperor Lucius Verus (r. 161 – 169 AD) was said to sprinkle gold-dust on his already "golden" blond hair to make it even blonder and brighter.

Commodus (r. 177-192), son of Marcus Aurelius (a co-emperor with Lucius Verus), likewise had naturally blond hair.

The following Roman gods are said to have had blond hair: Amor, Apollo, Aurora, Bacchus, Ceres, Diana, Jupiter, Mars, Mercury, Minerva and Venus.

>>2725742
Nobody mentioned /pol/

>>2725742
who else would make those threads?

>>2725770
>Suetonius
Not reliable.

>>2725786
He's as reliable as any ancient source

They still worshiped white gods

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>>2725754

>>2725125
If there was a cut-off for whiteness then they are well within it. also they are the originators of most "white" culture.

>>2725770
Subflavum refers to light brown, not blond

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No different than today's Italians. Mix of more swarthy types down south and fair types up north. Blondism peaks at 20% in north. No evidence that either type was seen as any better or worse; except the fact that blonde hair was prized just like with the greeks. A minority trait amongst greeks and romans but strongly associated with the northern barbarian tribes.

>>2725125
Not White enough for your standards, albino

>>2725311
>Evolution does not exist
>Race is a construct, man!

Please motherfucker, there are legitimate scientific reasons for the question. It might not be OP's point, but its there

>>2725877
>Evolution does not exist
>Race is a construct, man!
Where did anon imply that?

>>2725133
>>2725143
>>2725175
>Stop being interested in what I don't like

>>2725194

lol someone actually took the time to cherry pick the 150 white people in italy

Define white Op.

"White" did not exist back then. There were three categories of people: Italians, Hellenes, and barbarians. Originally the Romans were predominantly Italian empire, but they later incorporated many Hellenes and barbarians.

>>2725981
My butt is white

>>2725821
Yeah, what does that rebuke? Post an image of the average Northern Italian citizenry and we'll see how many natural fair skinned light-eyed, light-haired Italians there really are.

>>2725887
We do have dozens of wewuz threads everyday. And OP already knows the answer
>white is an american meme
>romans were europeans from the mediterranean region
stop making the same threads everyday to get the same daily answers

>>2727257
What rebuke? I simply post a picture of Italians athletes who participated Olympic Rio, you dumb fuck.

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Aryans tanned by the mediterranean sun.

>>2725175
>No one wants to talk about their architecture, what effects the Marian reforms had on the army, the conquest of Gaul.
The fuck, we talk of this shit like every fucking day. Why can't we discuss the early republic instead? Why can't we discuss the flavians?
Why must it always be muh professional armies and muh gallia est omnis divisa in partes tres?

>>2725887

>interested

more like invested am i right?

>>2725877
>Evolution does not exist

No one said that you dishonest /pol/ polisher.

>>2725125
As "white" as Italians today.

Fairer skin type in North and Central, darker skin type in South

>>2727415
This. This is the only damn answer. Italians from antiquity were virtually the same as Italians from today. Light skin in the North and darker skin in the south. Northern Italians in particular are essentially Germanic.

The whole "Mediterraneans r not whyte!!!" is a complete meme. I can only guess that it is mostly peddled by Americans who have never actually been anywhere in the Med region of Europe.

>>2727475
>Northern Italians in particular are essentially Germanic.
The fuck are you even implying here?

>>2727503
I don't mean culturally, I just mean they are essentially the same genetically. I'll see if I can find a haplogroup chart. People keep memeing that they are Arabs or some shit.

>>2727475
Northern Italians are genetically no more distinct from southern Italians than southern Germans are from northern Germans.

>>2727280
They spoke a Romance language.

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>>2727475

>>2727273
Now post a picture of a city in Northern Italy and not just selective images of its athletes, you mongoloid.

>>2727508
>I just mean they are essentially the same genetically.
No? I mean yeah both are r1b majorities, but different subclades. If you wanna make no differences of all r1b people you have only one group for most of western Europe.

>>2727509
Not the same guy but sicilians are quite distinct aren't they? Apart from that though, Italians are just White guys, I don't see where the controversy comes from.

>>2727517
They are different to an extent but still White, that is all I will say. By the standards of this board I guess I am not White as I am half Southern Spanish and "hurr one drop rule!".

"White people is a racial classification specifier, used for people of Europid ancestry"

"The Caucasian race (also Caucasoid,[1] or Europid[2]) is a grouping of human beings historically regarded as a biological taxon, which, depending on which of the historical race classifications used, have usually included some or all of the ancient and modern populations of Europe, the Caucasus, Asia Minor, North Africa, the Horn of Africa, Western Asia, Central Asia and South Asia"

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>>2727516
Not him, but how the fuck is a pic of athletes in any way selective you dumb fuck? Do you think Italy chooses its sportsmen by manifested whiteness?

>>2727534
They look swarthy.

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>>2727516

>>2727553
Holy shit why are they so black?

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>>2727552
Everyone who I post would look swarthy to you. I could post white swedes and you'd still call them swarthy because I posted them.

>>2727520
No, you're thinking of Sardinians, who are genetically distinct from the Italians. Sicilian people are basically the same as other Italians. None are particularly more "Germanic" than the others.

>Despite the lengthy Goth and Lombard presence in Italy, the I1 haplogroup associated with the Norsemen is present only among 6-7% of mainland Italians,[22] peaking at 11% in the northeast. In total a frequency of 5% I1 in Sicily has been detected.[25]

>>2727557
Because they're not northern italians lol

>>2727513
My dad looks just like him (is that a young Robert De Niro?)

>>2725850
This right here.

Most people think of Italians as someone that looks like Al Pacino, but they are a diverse bunch.

>>2725194
Not really representative of the actual italian population. Where I live, there are tons of people of italian descend and just a few look like pic related.

>>2727577
>Sicilian people are basically the same as other Italians.
Sicilians have like 35% greek dna. It's not snow- and sandniggers who have influenced Italy's gene pool.

>>2727599
>pic of athletes from all over a country isn't representative
>personal experience of racemixed migrants is
Top kek m8.
And let's not forget that no italian enclave can ever be representative due to italians' tendency to migrate by region, so that for example most brazilian italians are northerners, most italian americans are southerners, etc.

>>2725133
It's actually an interesting historical issue. But yeah, given that this is 4chan, there's a 90% chance that anyone who makes a thread like this is a stormfag or a troll.

>>2727618
Not "Greek" per se

It's shared Anatolian DNA

>>2725175
It's the standard Internet history discussion dilemma. Either you go discuss stuff with academics and mainstream history buffs, in which case the SJW cloud hangs around and any topic that verges close to various taboos causes people to turn into politically correct robots... or you go discuss stuff with people like 4channers, in which case the stormfag cloud hangs around everything and every discussion ends up becoming abount Hitler, Aryans, conspiracy theories about Jews, etc.

>>2727665
Yes greek actually. It's very characteristically focused on what used to be Magna Grecia.
I'm not talking about neolithic famrer admixture.

>>2725125
"Was X white" threads are primary cancers of /his/.

Northern Italians have similar Northern European admixture as Southern Germans. Northern Italians also have more similar phenotypes to Southern Germans then they do to Southern Italians. It's a blurred picture. There isn't just a line in Europe that once you go below it- boom, not Germanic anymore.

But it doesn't matter anyway. Italians are and were White. Southern Italians are swarthy to be adapted to sunlight but apart from that they are hardly different.

>>2727572
>argues most of them are light haired
>post an image of the majority of them not even light haired with light to tanned olive complexions
>surprised by this reaction
???

>>2727717
In both the athletes' pic and the class pic the dominant hair colour is brown, and skin colour is fair.
You of course are likely not even bothering to look at the pics, so what's the point arguing anyway.

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>>2725125
Between Crayola Tumbleweed #DEA681 and Apricot #FDD5B1

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>>2725125
you tell me

>>2725770
BS. Joaquin Phoenix doesn't have blonde hair.

>>2727513
Handome guy I bet he fucked a ton of chicks I wish I was handsome too but God is a fucking nigger and created me ugly which is how I know Satan did nothing wrong.

>>2725125
Are you from the United Sharts of America, perhaps?

>>2727731
Brown and blonde are not the same thing. Just as fair skinned and being olive skinned are not the same thing.

>most of the images I google of Northern Italians have the majority of men and women being tanned, not fair skinned like Northern Europeans and possessing black and brown hair

Like it was said earlier, there is no more "Germanic" admixture in Northern Italians then Central or Southern Italians, comparatively they are slightly lighter skinned because they live in a cooler area and less exposure to as harsh sunlight as their southern kin.

>>2725125
How white are the Italians?

>>2727508
>>2727517
>haplogroups
You know they only tell the paternal line? Literal niggers can be r1b

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Central-North tier ""white"" if we are talking the Roman elites, assuming they were in fact Latin-Etruscan in stock.

>>2727513

deNiro is like 1/4 italian

>>2725770
Sure, but when Ceasar is described as having blond hair, said hair is described as giving him a "singular appearance"

>>2725770
The definition of blonde is a lot broader down there. Fucking light brown is counted as blonde in some countries

>>2728385
Haploniggers treat Y-DNA like an ethnicity marker lol as if being r1b means u white cuz ur dad's dad's dad's dad's dad's dad's dad's dad's dad's dad's dad's d's dad's dad's dad's dad's dad's dad's dad's dad's dad's d's dad's dad's dad's dad's dad's dad's dad's dad's dad's d's dad's dad's dad's dad's dad's dad's dad's dad's dad's d's dad's dad's dad's dad's dad's dad's dad's dad's dad's dad wuz whyte

>>2728553
>whyte
Calling someone a nigger.

>>2728407
Holy shit, they really looks similar

>>2728024
Lad

>>2727260
>Stop talking about it because I say it's settled.

>>2725877
Race doesn't mean phenotype, idiot

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>>2728348
>Like it was said earlier, there is no more "Germanic" admixture in Northern Italians then Central or Southern Italians

>>2731028
>Stop telling me the truth I refuse to hear, I want to be willfully ignorant.

Does it matter

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>>2731309
Nope, you're wrong

>>2725242
Here we see a faggot Arab thinking the Romans looked like Arab shitskins and that every normal white Italian is "Germanic". Just fuck off back to your desert Abdul.

>>2725125
jesus, that guy looks just like me

>>2732976
Like a numale?

>>2732338
haha that looks like two people fucking

>>2725770
>Bacchus
>blonde
Bullshit. Find me even one fresco or mosaic where Bacchus or Dionysos is shown with blonde hair.

>>2725786
>he isn't reliable
>but muh pottery fragments are

The eternal cuckold strikes again

>>2732976
pics

>>2732618
Lol butthurt tortellini

Oh boy! Another one of these "is X white" threads. It's quite simple really you could book a flight to Rome and take a look for yourself.

>>2732324
>My opinion is the truth. Period. Pls stop talking about this.

What I'm getting out of this thread is that there are people who believe that mediterraneans aren't white. If they're not white then what are they?

>>2734907
Brown just like mena

Anti white shills should be banned.

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>>2733903
pottery

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>>2734918
>Brown

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>>2734046
t. Gennaro

>>2725877
>Race is a construct, man
It is though. Prove it isn't. You'really genetically differect from every human, so where you draw the line is arbitrary. The Romans didn't draw the line or actually drew the line away from the pale Germanics and took pride in swarthyness.

>>2727534
Not him or saying anyone is wrong, but socioeconomic conditions could lead paler ones to having more athletic opportunities. For example, South African athletes were disproportionately white.

They were semetic you cuck now fuck off back to poll

>>2735016
We wuz jew n shiett

>>2735020
Don't you have to get to the very important Donald Trump General # 5950?

>>2735030
Why is this anti white faggot so butthurt?

>>2727572

but white swedes are swarthy...

>>2725125
Considering they build modern civilization and were the greatest empire known to man, i would say they are the whitest, snowniggers, barbarians and other non whites need not apply.

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>>2725125
Romanian here. Greenish blue eyes, clear brown hair and whiter than the usual guy. Am I Roman enough?

>>2725133
t. Philip the Arab

What is white anyway? All the people that anon posted are extremely beautiful. Enough with autism already

>>2725125
Roman myths claim they hailed from Aeneas
Aeneas sailed from modern Turkey

>>2725821
>who were the Lombards

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>>2737403
Stop rolepaying you Dacian peasant.

>>2725125
As white as Russians because white is a genetic grouping that started in 30,000 B.C.

>>2725125
Romans and the Roman elite were many people of different looks, but the common people of the Italian peninsula looked more or less the same as now. Something between Celts and Greeks.

>>2725175
res ad triarios venit

>>2728491
Ceasar had brown hair though...

>>2725133
Ding ding ding.

>>2735009
>It is though. Prove it isn't.

You can prove someone's race through genetics.

That's not much of a "social construct", sounds pretty scientifically, biologically founded to me.

>>2725133
plenty of people for understandable reasons

>>2742067
Augustus Caesar is said to have had golden brown hair.

Reminder the definition of 'white' is subjective and changes repeatedly to match political agendas.

Calling a people 'white' has no real measure or significance.

>>2725770

'Blonde' in Southern Europe is a lot broader than in Northern Europe, brainlet.

In Spain a lot, perhaps most, people who are called 'rubio' have light-brown hair and wouldn't be considered blonde in the North. The meaning of words can differ a lot per language and I doubt the Romans, from which the spics inherited their fucking language, would have had a radically different definition.

t. Dutchman who has a Spanish teacher as father who lived in Grenada for years.

>>2743121

*Granada, before some retard starts wailing on that typo.

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>>2725210
>that fucking picture
Worse than Franz driving himself to be h

>>2743179
This picture fills me with contempt and disgust.

>>2725125
Less white than those North of them and more white than those South of them.

>>2728533
>>2743121

Can confirm.

>I live in Southern Europe
>I would describe my hair as dark brown
>all the women here tell me that I'm blonde or dark blonde

>>2742067
His hair was described as light brown, which stood out when the vast majority of his soldiers had very dark brown hair.

>>2743342
Didn't Caesar have black hair?