Who was the worst emperor in Roman history and why was it Commodus?

>>2687125
Nero was worse. At least Commodus threw crazy games

>>2687125
Commodus doesn't come close to the worst.

>>2687135
Commodus killed way more than Nero, Commodus also surrendered everything his father fought for. Don't think crazy games justify starting the decline of the Roman empire.

>>2687125
The worst was Tiberius, whiny little cunt couldnt do anything right

Romulus Augustus

with a name like that you have one job

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>>2687125
Caracalla

even his own mother thought he was a cunt

Honorius

>>2687125
I think a special mention for Octavian should be made, since he is the man who rode a populist wave of anti-aristo hatred to destroy the Republic, instead of putting forward pro-plebe reform a la the first Tribunes.

Commodus isn't even in the bottom 5

The actual worst would be guys like
>Valentinian III
>Honorius
>Andronikos III
>Alexius III
>Phocas

>>2688215
I don't think OP was referring to Eastern Roman emperors.

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>>2688008
this meme says otherwise

>>2688223
Valentinian III and Honorius aren't Eastern

also the OP says "Roman history" not "Western Roman history"

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>>2688215
>I don't think OP was referring to Eastern Roman emperors.
Then why'd he say "Roman history"

>>2687910
t. Senate cuckold

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>it's a listing Roman emperors that were average to mediocre as the "worst" because you don't know any emperors apart from Augustus, Tiberius, Elagabalus, Nero and Commodus episode
Plebs all of you

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>>2688258
>Augustus was an Emperor.

anyone from the angeloi dynasty deserve to have their tombs desecrated and their corpses pissed on.

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Worst Roman Emperor is Ellagabalus
>Be me, Heliogabalus
>Living life as Emperor
>All is well
>Crazy bored in Palace
>Kind of want to have sex, but mom won't let me
>Let every senator know:
>I'm pimping my body out to get laid
>Video Marcus Tundercuck venire.jpg
>Every day I daydream about his lucius cock
>"Sorry I'm not Gay"
>Maybe if I'm a girl he'd want me
>All of a sudden, tell everyone I'm a girl
>Then all the Senators get out onto the floor of the Temple of Castor and Pollux and start clapping
>They tell me how brave I am to come out against the patriarchy.
>Even Marcus Thundercuck wants me now
>Randomly I get stabbed by my guard.

MFW I read the first line of every sentence.

>>2688043
Yeah my thoughts exactly. I love reading about the Roman Emperors, and anyone past Octavian we really can't blame for destroying the republic because the system was too well established by the time Octavian died, but... Once Caesar died, Octavian had a chance to support the republicans like Brutus and Cassius, and even Pompey's son. But he didn't. Even though we tend to romanticize Octavian as a thoughtful and deep Emperor, he was really a douche who got lucky by having loyal friends, luck, and an equally politically incompetent chief political rival. For most of his life he just rode his uncle's wave, and after that he kept everyone in line through force. Fuck Octavian.

Who was the worst Ottoman emperor?

>>2688467
This is special

>>2688238
When most people say Roman history they don't mean Greek Wewuzantines.

But yes my top 5 for each category.

>Best
Augustus
Trajan
Vespasian
Aurelian
Antoninus

>Worst
Honorius
Caracalla
Commodus
Tiberius
Theodosius I

>Underrated
Gallienus
Constantius II
Probus
Majorian
Domitian

I'd also say Septimius Severus is far and away the most overrated Roman emperor. Cared for nothing but MUH MILITARY, allowed his corrupt Praetorian prefect to basically run the show, gave bad to nonexistant advice to Caracalla. Allowed Caracalla to even become emperor in the first place even though he'd long by that point proven himself to be a rage-filled asshole.

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>>2688215
>>2688242
>he thinks the Byzantines were Roman

>>2688258
Not memeing, I truly 100% believe Theodosius I is one of the worst emperors the Roman Emperor (or WRE if you want to be pedantic) ever had. Got his shit pushed in by the Goths, fought a bunch of civil wars that further weakened the empire, pretty much did everything he could to kill what was left of actual Roman culture including dissolving the Vestal Virgins, making Christianity the official religion of the Empire and persecuting pagans. He also had shitty sons one of whom was just a bad, weak cuck whose wife ran the show (Arcadius) and one of whom was actually worse than Theodosius (Honorius). I'm assuming he only gets called "the Great" for being a super awesome Christian zealot.

Fuck Theodosius.

>>2687125
Caracalla. He made the status of citizenship irrelevant

>>2688629
How was Tiberius a bad emperor? Because he pissed off some faggy senators? By all accounts Tiberius did a good job of running the empire

>>2688008
>gets black emperor
>starts the crisis of the third century

can't make this shit up

>>2688688
>Tiberus
>running the empire
Are you confusing him with Domitian? Tiberius spent his reign assassinating Germanicus and then fucking off to Capri so he could rape everything in peace while allowing Sejanus to run everything and turn it into a madhouse. He's almost certainly a big reason Caligula turned out as bad as he did.

>>2688682
Commodus made Rome itself irrelevant

>>2688483
Basically. I think that a lot of the problems of the next 4-500 years can be put down to the increasing concentration of power as organised by the original Julio-Claudian Emperors

Hadrian was a fucking fag

>>2688771
So what was the alternative? The Republican model basically died with close of the Punic Wars and conquest of Macedonia. Once the Gracchi started flouting authority to push their own shit through, once Marius did everything he could to hold onto power and Sulla marched on Rome, once power rested in the hands of the Triumvirate, the Republic was done. Why continue the charade or fight to prop up a long dead ideal?

>>2688827
Flouting authority because the land reforms would have fixed a MASSIVE issue in rome. Sulla restored the republic as well. Should have kept with the first citizen shit.

>>2688008
t. pleb

>>2688827
A full kingdom with hereditary succession. It would save Rome and later byzantium about 2000 years worth of grief.

Unfortunately, the Romans would never go for it cuz muh kings are ebill which is why Augustus had to be underhanded and left the succession of the most powerful office in Rome unclear forever after. Thus, endless civil wars and intrigue.

>>2688869
First citizen was a convienent fabrication, the republican apparati of governance no longer functioned

>>2688827
Greater anti-aristo reform, a reduction of the Oligarchy's power, increase in equity, solidification of equity-focussed reforms... but in many ways, as you say, the Republic was doomed. As shown by the treatment of the Gracchi brothers- as well as many other similar populists- the oligarchs at the top of the pyramid simply refused to give up their power; this would inevitably lead the strongest populist strongman gaining and solidifying their position at the top of said pyramid. They should have compromised as their forebears did, and granted greater rights to the citizenry. Avoiding reliance on military power would have been nice too.

>>2688681
>muh roman culture
Classical Roman culture had been on the decline for a very long time, theodosius was just formalizing changes that had already taken place

>>2688898
>Greater anti-aristo reform, a reduction of the Oligarchy's power, increase in equity, solidification of equity-focussed reforms...
So, an empire

>>2688910
Very droll, but I meant to suggest a greater push towards democracy, or at the very least an avoidance of murdering reform-minded Tribunes with roof tiles as the Senators were known to in the past. They should have bent to the needs of the majority, as opposed to keeping them poor and uneducated so that they would be susceptible to populists. They brought in on themselves.

>>2688906
It's just the icing on the cake that is all of Theodosius' other bullshit. Kind of funny that there were rumors that Galerius hated the Romans and wanted to destroy the empire from within because he was butthurt over Trajan fucking up the Dacians 200 years earlier but Theodosius "the Great" did more to destory Rome than Galerius ever could've hoped.

>>2687125
Why did Aurelius make him his heir? Was he retarded? He should have followed his predecessors.

>>2688939
The problem is that unless you were so incredibly lucky to get a political cohort that was large enough and intelligent enough to undergo those reforms simultaneously, you'd need to consolidate all executive power in an emperor-like figure. And once you've gone there, you can never go back

>>2688949
Theodosius may not deserve'the great' but he was better than galerius by any measure
One started civil wars and the other ended them

>>2688960
> The problem is that unless you were so incredibly lucky to get a political cohort that was large enough and intelligent enough to undergo those reforms simultaneously, you'd need to consolidate all executive power in an emperor-like figure. And once you've gone there, you can never go back

You're right, and you see this problem play out again and again throughout history. In the character of Lincoln, he had to push America towards Empirehood, and clothe himself in immense power (the latter of which is pretty close to what he actually said), thus pushing us towards War and brief repression (suspension of habeus corpus) in order to achieve the noble of goal of freeing the slaves. We have seen something like this happen for many years in America, with the increase in State and foreign power coinciding in many cases with a reduction in personal rights and reliance on government. So in this case, the problem was with Augustus and his successors, who would for years justify their actions by claiming to be caretakers for the Republic: draining the swamp in order to save Rome so that the Senators could rule again.

>>2689059
Sorry, some of this was very poorly worded. Basically, I'm in agreement with you, and reforms often need a strong person to push them through using methods that would seem amazing and illegal any other time. The use of these methods often create a justification for their use, and human want for power does the rest.

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>>2688629
>Best
Augustus
Trajan
(Justinian)

>Good
Marcus Aurelius
Lucius Verus
Claudius II
Vespasian
Titus
Hadrian
Antoninus Pius
Constantine the Great
Nerva

>Okay
Tiberius
Claudius
Diocletian
Septimus Severus

>Meh
Galba
Otho
Vitellius
Romulus Augustus
Theodosius I
Maximinus Thrax
Arcadius
Caligula
Nero
Severus Alexander
Domitian
Geta
Macrinus
Honorius

>Tyrant
Caracalla
Commodus
Elagabalus

>>2688953
He's already had threats to his position in Avidius Cassius' revolt. He wasn't going to just kill his son and he could name another heir (which probably would've been Pompeianus or something) but with Commodus still around that'd still open up a succession crisis and possible civil war by parties wanting to use Commodus to get to the top.

Really it's a shame Commodus didn't just die of the plague before Marcus.

>>2688972
Theodosius started two of them instead of just accepting Maximus and then Eugenius as western emperors because he wanted control over the whole empire himself.

>>2689249
Where's Aurelian?

>>2689292
Yeah, Aurelian and Majorian should get added to the good tier and then this list is fine.

He was tolerant of Christians and halted their persecution, unlike his father.