Is Egyptian art reliable as a source of ethnicity?

File: Upper Egyptians.jpg (53KB, 500x315px) Image search: [Google]

53KB, 500x315px

I would

File: Kayble.jpg (230KB, 1124x750px) Image search: [Google]

230KB, 1124x750px

say so

Ignore the skin color and take note of the fish lips on the negro

>>2657487
It's certainly exaggerated but still a good source on how the Egyptians saw themselves relative to their neighbors. Like the Nubians weren't literally pitch black, but still noticeably darker than the Egyptians. The Levantines and Berbers weren't pale white, but still noticeably lighter skinned than the Egyptians (and similar to each other).

We also have contemporary Roman depictions of themselves, Greeks, and Egyptians from their frescoes.

File: wewuz.png (4MB, 2192x868px) Image search: [Google]

4MB, 2192x868px

Someone post the Egyptian version of this.

File: ancient egypt paint palette.jpg (42KB, 707x959px) Image search: [Google]

42KB, 707x959px

>>2657487
Use of color and its interpretations is largely overlooked by most memelords when it comes to ancient egypt, with the wewuzzians taking everything at face value.

I'd recommend checking this blog out as it's pretty brief but fairly well sourced and articulates the symbolism behind them.

https://warboar.wordpress.com/2014/03/23/color/

File: sphinx02.jpg (31KB, 440x394px) Image search: [Google]

31KB, 440x394px

>>2657487

File: Narmer.jpg (55KB, 564x609px) Image search: [Google]

55KB, 564x609px

>>2657487
3d art is better

File: image.jpg (78KB, 446x446px) Image search: [Google]

78KB, 446x446px

>>2658698
This. Modern day Southern/Upper Egyptians are the racial type of the majority of Ancient Egyptians. It's that simple.

Yes. Egyptian art of Egyptians looks like modern day Copts.

Gas all the afrocentrists already.

File: pharaoh huni.png (920KB, 536x768px) Image search: [Google]

920KB, 536x768px

>>2658786

>>2658761
>>2658765

File: image.jpg (40KB, 236x354px) Image search: [Google]

40KB, 236x354px

>>2658786
No they look like modern day egyptian southerners.

>>2658786

You need to distinguish Upper and Lower Egypt. Copts who are light skinned speak more of Ancient Lower Egypt.

File: 1469542273852.png (3MB, 2034x1216px) Image search: [Google]

3MB, 2034x1216px

>>2658741

>>2658811

SHIEET

>>2658819
>>2658767

There haven't been genomic tests done on them have there? To see what admixture they have?

>>2658761
>>2658765
>>2658811
>>2658827
WE

>>2659637
WUZ

>>2659637
>>2659638
Interesting that nothing about that is said in those posts but you still said that. Would that be because they do look black?

>>2659008
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/ajpa.1330360603/epdf
>We conclude that the Egyptians have been in place since back in the Pleistocene and have been largely unaffected by either inva- sions or migrations. As others have noted, Egyptians are Egyptians, and they were so in the past as well.

>>2659646
k-kangz...

ethnics use to define civilisation class by average ruling elite being more northern or white as they came from closer to resource abundence of north glaciers for eg so gene mutation use to directly correlate to that which could maximise the exploitation of the physical natural environement around it, what produces king class. a civilisations stagtivity comes down to the average by the difference from 1 to the average in whatever comparable parameter attributes breadbasket of characteristics currencies you deem successful

>>2659646
Because, you absolute fucking baboon, no one here denies that some of the Pharoahs were actually black. The Nubian dynasty for example, as well as I'm sure plenty of blacks living within Egypt.

But that's not the point, Egypt was also under a Greek dynasty, and a Syrian dynasty, and a Persian dynasty. We don't take a statue of Cleopatra and claim all Egyptians are white, do we? There were Greeks and blacks and Arabs and Hebrews livin in Egypt, but they were minorities. The majority, the natives, looked like how modern Egyptians look.

I know I'm probably being baited, but if you are actually unironically about this, you should seriously consider suicide.

>black egyptian kings
Embarassing...

>>2659713
You're the one acting like a baboon. Raging like an animal.

>>2658730

Berbers and especially levantines were whiter then they are today

File: 053.png (160KB, 200x274px) Image search: [Google]

160KB, 200x274px

>>2657487
You answered your own question with your own picture. Are black people that color? Is any Caucasian that pale?

It's obviously stylized. All it tells is how Egyptians saw themselves compared to other people, which doesn't always represent the truth. Apparently Egyptians thought of themselves as being more brown than other mediterranean people but whither than Ethiopians. However, as evidenced in the story Aethiopica ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aethiopica ) Greeks saw Egyptians as similar to themselves but very distinct from Ethiopians.

So it seems like Egyptians just had false stereotypes about how foreigners look. Kind of like how Jews are always depicted as having large hooked noses when in reality those kinds of noses are not any more common among Jews than among other people. Or how Turks like to depict Kurds as really hairy, swarthy people with monobrows, even though many Turks look just like that. Or pic related.

Btw if Egyptians saw their homeland as the center of the world (honestly, most people do) then it would make sense to claim that their neighbors are either freakishly pale or freakishly dark while they have the "normal" skin color.

File: Argentina-Supporters.jpg (283KB, 660x350px) Image search: [Google]

283KB, 660x350px

>>2659868
Argentines are white though

The new genetic tests coming soon show them to be Eurasians and clustering with ancient and modern Levantines and having no sub-Saharan ancestry unlike later Egyptians (Copts less than Muslims).

>b-but it's from the later period of Egypt and only from specific areas

I agree, we should wait for more. Until then stop pushing your deluded Negrocentrism in light of the new genetic evidence.

File: 1492119724159.png (20KB, 5510x1366px) Image search: [Google]

20KB, 5510x1366px

>>2659889
But they still werent white so why do white nationalists like Richard Spencer still Wewuz about ancient egyptians?

Also why are white nationalists the ones to be pissed off by black Wewuzing and not actual Egyptians?

File: Ancient_Egyptians_PCA.jpg (68KB, 1024x840px) Image search: [Google]

68KB, 1024x840px

>>2659889

The genomic study showed the samples of Egyptians were largely of the Natufian component with low to moderate Iranian and Anatolian component. That looks a lot like the results for the Levant Chalcolithic. This would make the Egyptians distinct from later waves of Semitic people like the Hyksos and others.

>>2657487

Egyptians almost always painted themselves with RED OCHRE, so they are Red.

>>2659899

>weren't white

Tell us how you can count as White.

>>2658896
>using turks as greeks
wew

>>2660310

>They Wuz Nords N Shieet

>>2660319
>they wuz turks n shiet

>>2657487

Of course not, they had a limited selection of colors to pick from AND were slavishly obedient to ancient artistic conventions, such as always painting males as darker than females.

>>2660413

>Any Mediterranean fellow who doesn't look like a Nordfag is a Turk

>Not knowing those are the Faiyum Portraits

>>2660434

And yet it fits with modern day differences between Egyptians and their neighbors. Egyptians are significantly darker than North Africans like Libyans.

File: 1391884594519.jpg (17KB, 350x277px) Image search: [Google]

17KB, 350x277px

>>2660434
>such as always painting males as darker than females

If they paint themselves as dark compared to males of other ethnicities as well then that means they're shitskins, sorry.

File: 001156_af57.jpg (101KB, 600x900px) Image search: [Google]

101KB, 600x900px

>>2660470
You need to pick the Kabyle Berbers for even stronger contrast though, because those are the real descendants of the "Libyan" represented in that mural.

>>2659713
People do deny it. Nobody here claimed that all Egyptians were black either. You pulled that out of your ass. The point is the ones who founded it were black. The king who unified the two kingdoms is this dude >>2658765
and this one commissioned the great pyramid of giza >>2658827

File: Limestone_head_of_a_king._Thought_by_Petrie_to_be_Narmer._Bought_by_Petrie_in_Cairo,_Egypt._1st_Dynasty._The_Petrie_Museum_of_Egyptian_Archaeology,_London.jpg (184KB, 1199x1024px) Image search: [Google]

184KB, 1199x1024px

>>2660559
>he's Black because he has a wide nose!

Except his profile shows no prognathism, so we can already discard he was a pure nigger.

File: North Moroccans.jpg (275KB, 1280x960px) Image search: [Google]

275KB, 1280x960px

>>2660550

Plenty of Maghrebis aren't all that dark. Even after the Arabs and Tropical African migrants.

File: King_Narmer.jpg (354KB, 1024x1054px) Image search: [Google]

354KB, 1024x1054px

>>2660583

>>2660583

>pure nigger

Plenty of East Africans and Horners aren't "pure niggers" as you call it. Thank their West Eurasian ancestry. I find it doubtful Upper Egypt at Narmer's day didn't have a significant East African component to it.

File: Axumite_Palace_(2827701317).jpg (2MB, 2837x1784px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 2837x1784px

>>2660597
Yes, I wouldn't be surprised about that. East Africans are capable of civilization.

>>2660597
East Africans aren't called that only when people are discussing this topic, everything else they call even South Americans pure african.

>>2659713

Nubian dynastry was a relatively short lived dynasty that contributed very little and ruled over a crumbling empire.

>>2660538

Remember that there's a difference between Lower and Upper Egypt.

>>2659889

>Copts

Threadly reminder that Copts have about 15 percent East African admixture.

>>2660256
>The genomic study showed the samples of Egyptians were largely of the Natufian component with low to moderate Iranian and Anatolian component

Haven't seen that, I'll take your word for it. Either way, the Natufian and the Neolithic Levant samples were close to Eurasians and not at all close to sub-Saharans. The Bronze Age Levant wasn't that distant to them either, just shifted towards the Caucasus and Iran.

So either way, Negrocentrism should keep its nose out.

>>2659899
I don't know what this retarded term 'white' means. European? Well, yeah they weren't European at all, Mesolithic, Neolithic or modern. All I know is that they were genetically West Eurasian based on current samples. Maybe this will change in the future. Either way, the wewuzing should stop, especially since it shows them to be non-European and non-sub-Saharan. It should stop either way but we have some tentative data now.

File: 1489848337751.png (302KB, 540x790px) Image search: [Google]

302KB, 540x790px

Is japanese art reliable as a source of ethnicity?

>>2661113

What about Upper Egyptians? As >>2658819
>>2658767 >>2658698 point out, Southern Egyptians to North Sudanese come off as a meeting between the Levant and East Africa in looks.

File: img_6780.jpg (444KB, 1808x1608px) Image search: [Google]

444KB, 1808x1608px

>>2661118

When it isn't too stylized, yeah.

>>2661237
That's because they basically are the result of Neolithic Levantine farmers and Mesolithic East Africans, aren't they?

Either way, we don't know what ancient Upper Egyptians were like genetically (the samples are from Abusir el-Maleq apparently, so the southern parts of Lower Egypt) and phenotype is deceiving anyway.

We'll just have to wait for more. Maybe the other samples will be more East African or something. Maybe Lower Egypt before that period too was more East African.

It's tentative but should make some people reconsider making bold statements either way.

File: Ramses_II_charging_Nubians.jpg (1008KB, 1944x801px) Image search: [Google]

1008KB, 1944x801px

All I know is that this image you often see of Ramesses the Great charging a Nubian army while putting down the Kushite insurrections is either one of two replicas, one British and one French (the British one is in the British Museum which I visit all the time), and the colours were added by the egyptologists that did the reconstructions during the 20th century.
The original relief was discovered in the Beit el-Wali site south of the Aswan High Dam, and has far less coloration. I'll post it in a second.

File: elwali3.jpg (28KB, 348x166px) Image search: [Google]

28KB, 348x166px

>>2661359