Who was, objectively speaking, the worst US president?

>>2636718
Lincoln went to war to keep the United States United. How is he the worst US President?

>>2636720
Completely disregarded the fucking law

>>2636712
Depends on what you want your president to do. I mean some could legitimately say Lincoln and FDR were autocratic, but I believe that was necessary at the time to stop the country from falling appart

>>2636726
you mean the southerners who attacked a federal fort?

For a non-meme answer

Taft

File: Apple pie.jpg (3MB, 1443x1891px) Image search: [Google]

3MB, 1443x1891px

>>2636782
What's wrong with Taft? Regardless of your views on the early progressive movement, his only fault was being too cautious and moderate and not as quick to action as Roosevelt or Wilson. That being said, though, his cautiousness wasn't necessarily as actively damaging as, say Buchanan's.

He was a classic case of being a great Chief Justice but a poor President. Still, far from being the worst.

File: William_Henry_Harrison_daguerreotype_edit.jpg (359KB, 663x792px) Image search: [Google]

359KB, 663x792px

This guy by default.

>>2636712
Woodrow Willson was pretty bad desu, he gets a good rep for 'winning' ww1 but I think he was kinda underhanded

why does Buchanan get so much shit? He tried to stop the civil war. He failed because Lincoln was elected precisely on a platform that would cause civil war. After the election he more or less kept the same position that Lincoln did, that secession was illegal. If anything, I think his leadership during the war might even have been superior to Lincoln's.

>>2636720
Literally imprisoned journalists

>>2636738
you mean some imperialist northerners refused to give back land it had stolen from a sovereign state

File: 1300044776986.jpg (34KB, 600x600px) Image search: [Google]

34KB, 600x600px

>>2637674

>imperialist northerners

File: download (10).jpg (7KB, 201x251px) Image search: [Google]

7KB, 201x251px

>>2636712
Literally the man who ruined the world

>>2637538
Buchanan doesn't get much credit because he knew war was going to happen. He did whatever he could to make sure it just didn't happen on his watch and we never credit him enough for that.

Also I think Buchanan said that they could secede legally. Don't quote me on that.

Questions like these aren't worth answering, because no one person or ideology can benefit everyone so it's all just subjective "hurr durr" he hurt group x instead of my preferred group y

>>2636718
They were bad (well Carter was just mediocre) but Wilson beats them all.

File: Gerald Ford_ Proponent of big or small government_.jpg (25KB, 600x300px) Image search: [Google]

25KB, 600x300px

Became president without a single u.s. Voter having a say. Bungled everything. Provided zero leadership during the mid seventies as the nation drifted aimlessly towards oil embargo and economic collapse.

He could of pulled us out of the darkness of Watergate, restored dignity, boldly stood up to OPEC, supported the reinvention of the rust belt before it fully rusted over. He could of been important and meaningful instead of just falling down every flight if stairs he came across.

Worse, he made the nation virtually ungovernable for Carter. It was Ford that nailed the coffin shit on the middle class. Carter inherited a nation in rubble.

>>2636712
Reagan and Nixon were disastrous in the degree to which they strengthened the federal government's authoritarian power.

>>2637911
Any reasons besides "because textbooks and PBS told me"?

File: its lit.png (180KB, 221x326px) Image search: [Google]

180KB, 221x326px

>>2636852

>>2636738
No, I mean Lincoln. He completely defied the constitution AND court orders to knock that shit off.

File: 1381000532955.jpg (299KB, 1383x1600px) Image search: [Google]

299KB, 1383x1600px

>>2638002
And he saved the Union.

>>2638013
And?

>>2638026
It was all worth it in the end.

>>2637911
Harding at least had the humility to admit he was shit.

>>2638085
Bad character for a president as he admitted but really good presidency. Some excellent decisions.

>>2638026
And we didn't fucking balkanize thanks to him. There is no "and?" after that.

that guy who filled a civilian boat with munitions so the Germans would sink it and let him enter the war

>>2638126
Poor CSA would've eventually reunited with the rest.

>>2638131
Those munitions wouldn't have blown up if the Germans hadn't shot them

>>2638150
Germany wouldn't have shot if if they hadn't carried contraband of war and the Brits hadn't ordered their ships to ram any u-boat surfacing to give them a warning

>>2638230
The boat wouldn't be carrying contraband if the Germany hadn't spent the last 3 years torturing Belgian children.

>>2638238
what if the children consented tho

File: hqdefault.jpg (18KB, 480x360px) Image search: [Google]

18KB, 480x360px

>>2638246
When the Archduke breaks NAP by invading Bosnian Serbs' private property so you start a World War.

>>2638013
no Grant did. Abraham "let's march on richmond" Lincoln led the union into mistake after mistake. The only redeeming qualities about his were his great speech writing abilities and the fact that he was assassinated before he could be blamed for the disastrous reconstruction. inb4 he was going to ship them back meme

>>2638277
>"let's march on richmond"
that was a sound plan. macclellan was within hair's breadth of victory but he became soft and went all "muh army is outnumbered gorillion to one" despite numerical superiority

File: 1491371862430.jpg (25KB, 680x383px) Image search: [Google]

25KB, 680x383px

>it's another "leeaboos think that suspending haebas corpus is worse than slavery" episode

The correct answer: Pierce, Buchanan, A. Johnson, Hayes, Reagan.

>>2638405

edit: add Coolidge and Fillmore to the list

>>2637347
Came here to say WHH and JQA.

>>2638405
>>2638417

Fucking Hayes and Coolidge? You really hate responsible fiscal policies? You prefer men with a """vision"""

>>2638432

I hate the dismantling of Reconstruction in exchange for winning an election (Hayes) and embracing laissez-faire insanity, autistic racial theory to limit immigration from Southern and Eastern Europe (which could have saved many lives before and during World War II by taking in Jewish and other European refugees, and violent, counter-productive enforcement of Prohibition (Coolidge).

>>2638428
I'm curious: why JQA? He's the reason the Andrew Jackson had so much money to blow through.

>>2638454
>I hate the dismantling of Reconstruction in exchange for winning an election (Hayes)

Well sucks that it was the deal made by his party members but ending the reconstruction was a good choice. It was a hopeless effort.

>and embracing laissez-faire insanity

holy shit

>violent, counter-productive enforcement of Prohibition

Coolidge (just like Harding) was against things like prohibition, the Fed or the KKK but it doesn't mean they had the tools to get rid of them or that they believed they had the constitutional right for it.

>>2637538
Buchanan is the only president to come from the state I live in, so I kind of like him

Andrew Johnson was absolute dogshit and helped botch the beginning of reconstruction and all that.

>>2638554
agreed

>>2638545
One good thing I have to say about him is that he wasn't as bad as some people say while still pretty bad.
Also Pierce was worse.

File: 220px-James_Abram_Garfield,_photo_portrait_seated.jpg (8KB, 220x279px) Image search: [Google]

8KB, 220x279px

Most Wasted Potential

File: 1480856541804.png (158KB, 379x440px) Image search: [Google]

158KB, 379x440px

>>2638522

>I don't think any of these things are good but I'm not going to do anything because I worship this scrap of hemp paper to the letter
>even though Jim Crow is a blatant violation of the 14th and 15th amendments

Why is the American right so autistic?

>>2638567
You probably didn't know that by the time he came into office federal troops were only in two states right? Grant started the end of the reconstruction period because it had no sense and even longer period of treating the South as conquered territory would only make the population more bitter and angry. Hayes himself adovated for the voting rights for the Blacks but he couldn't do miracles.

>>2638566
True. At least Taylor and Harding left some lasting legacy. However his vice president Chester Arthur had the most amazing change of hearts in the history of American politics so his sacrifice wasn't wasted at least. It's a comforting thought.

>>2637795
T. Commie

Reagan a cute!

File: 1490498937259.gif (2MB, 920x518px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 920x518px

>>2638586

They were able to get angry and revolt because they never were dealt with properly in the first place. Hang every Confederate officer, politician, and plantation owner, redistribute the land to ex-slaves and yeoman white farmers. The fact that Lincoln advocated a mil Reconstruction is why I only rank him as the 2nd best president (behind Franklin "Thundercock" Roosevelt).

>>2638598
A good argument for 'the office makes the man '. I've seen it written that only someone who knew corruption inside-out like Arthur could've achieved such effective reform.

>>2637911
Harding was based as fuck though, wish he didn't die in office.
I also wish Coolidge ran for another term.

>>2638606
We know you only like FDR because he made it possible for autistic weeaboos like yourself to live off of the government for life.

LBJ. Both "great society" and Vietnam were giant money sinkholes that crashed the U.S. economy for 20 years. Plus the only good thing he did (civil rights) was pioneered and written by Kennedy so attributing it to LBJ is inaccurate.

>>2637986
>mfw_hitshin_on_table.jpg

File: 1474127310443.jpg (241KB, 875x492px) Image search: [Google]

241KB, 875x492px

>>2638955

>complaining about autistic weeaboos on 4chan

>>2638261
>World War™

>>2636852
a president who just wanted another slice of pie would be pretty great, imo.

>>2639171

Grant had plenty of good intentions, he was just too trusting of his subordinates and thought that the federal government ran like the army and everyone had to do what he said.

>>2638554
This. Anyone who says otherwise should become a black during """Reconstruction"""

>>2638554

This. The leadership during Reconstruction totally shit the bed and we're all still suffering the consequences.

>>2638566

Garfield was, no meme, one of the most impressive men to ever be elected president. A shame he had to suffer so much.

>>2639198
>>2639209

Johnson got overridden and pushed out. The radical republicans got their chance at reconstruction and they turned it into a shitshow. Reconstruction was stupid and was never going to work.

File: 1200px-Harry_S_Truman_-_NARA_-_530677_(2).jpg (211KB, 1200x1444px) Image search: [Google]

211KB, 1200x1444px

>leave office with 22% approval rating
>today considered among best presidents
FUCKING HOW???

>>2639297
bombed japan lol

>>2639355
That's it though, and even then he embellished the number of Americans saved from dying in an invasion of Japan from tens if thousands to over a million.

File: John_Tyler[1].jpg (599KB, 891x1194px) Image search: [Google]

599KB, 891x1194px

An actively bad president or just an inadequate one?

>>2639413
Is he the one who died in 30 days?

What did he even do?

>>2637538
Because he sat on his hands and did nothing while letting the U.S military fall into a state of disrepair as southerners militarized and readied them themselves for the great redneck chimp out of 1860.

He tried to please everyone and ended up pleasing no one.

>>2639420
William Henry Harrison died in 30 days, Tyler was his VP who became the first unelected president. Better known for later supporting the CSA than anything he actually did as president.

>>2636712
FDR or Woodrow

>>2636712
andrew johnson
>enabled the south to enact black codes which fucked them over for a large period of time
>didnt send them all back to africa
either let them integrate or send them back, no half baked shit

>>2639459
Well we have yet to see full on massacres along those lines, so yeah pretty much. I'd expect some kind of left wing reform guy along the lines of Marius, followed by a right wing backlash along lines of Sulla.

>>2636712
Reagan

>>2636712
FDR undoubtedly.
>Jew deal
>helped the barbarian rape and plunder Europe
>made Europe politically subordinate to extra-European forces
>may have irrevocably destroyed Faustian destiny
>Breton Woods
>interned loyal Americans
>morgenthau plan
>communist
>completely ignored the constitution
>died like a cripple bitch
He's rotting in hell along with Churchill.

File: john wilkes booth protecting freedom.jpg (81KB, 720x720px) Image search: [Google]

81KB, 720x720px

>>2639889

Too bad John Wilkes wasn't still around to put an end to his tyranny the way a proper Southerner should.

Definitely LBJ followed closely by Teddy

nixon

>>2639565
>Annexing Texas wasn't a big deal

Don't do my man John Tyler like that you little whig scum.

>>2639889
>put loyal citizens into concenration camps because of their ethnic background, basically be stalin's cocksleeve, sell half of the europe to forces no different from nazis and ensue that the next 45 years will be spent stuck in a cold war between soviets&western powers
>people still worship you as the greatest thing ever

>>2639413
>>2640503
Tyler was elected just not as the president. Ford was the only unelected one.
Also according to my sources he favored restrained, limited government, ended the bloodiest Indian war etc making his record one of the best.

>>2639763
It's honestly one of them obviously. A couple more made bad precedenses like Jackson, Polk or McKinley.

>>2638002
>defied the constitution
Doesn't apply to traitorous brigands.

>>2640602
>Maryland
>CSA

He straight up ignored the courts ruling

File: 1402171529329.jpg (33KB, 303x403px) Image search: [Google]

33KB, 303x403px

>>2636852
>He was a classic case of being a great Chief Justice but a poor President.
>classic case

He's literally the only person to have held both of those offices.

>>2639209
Everyone should read Peskin's biography. I'm having a hell of a time finding his actual diaries and whatnot. But he was a man whose father died while he was still a toddler, raised in poverty, whose voracious quest for knowledge led him into education where he was running colleges while still in his twenties. When the Civil War came, he tought himself military tactics (despising the West Point system and the type of soldier it produced) and was fairly successful. He got to Washington and taught himself economics and damned if he wasn't good at that as well. He was honest almost to a fault and maybe a tad too trusting but was fairly incorruptible such that even when he was involved in a scandal (Credit Mobilier) even his enemies didn't think he did anything wrong outside of trusting the wrong people.

Andrew Jackson tried to portray himself as (and is portrayed as) the archetypal American: loud, rustic and rough & tumble. But Garfield should be portrayed as what an American should aspire to be. Someone who overcame their station through hard work and education going from the lowest of the lows and to eventually reaching the highest of the highs.

Garfield obviously can't be listed as one of the best Presidents but he's certainly my absolute favorite.

File: Polk.jpg (68KB, 448x597px) Image search: [Google]

68KB, 448x597px

>>2636712
Can I just say this man should be considered one of the best U.S presidents and is hardly ever acknowledged or even talked about.

>>2643716
he'll be forgotten in 50 years, he'll hes forgotten now when I was in n honors U.S. history class his name came up once.
we spoke more about Santa Anna than we did Polk.

also his imperialist war proved very unpopular with popular later presidents (Lincoln, Grant)and led to the civil war.

File: US expansion.jpg (278KB, 1200x951px) Image search: [Google]

278KB, 1200x951px

>>2643860
Still, it can't be denied that he literally defined the modern borders of mainland america along with achieving the largest amount of land expansion within one term of the presidency. (Besides possibly the Alaska purchase)

>>2643716
>Can I just say this man should be considered one of the best U.S presidents
Why? He was a third rate politician and a second rate executive. He was basically a placeholder for the split Democratic party.

>>2644144
>Still, it can't be denied that he literally defined the modern borders of mainland america along with achieving the largest amount of land expansion within one term of the presidency. (Besides possibly the Alaska purchase)

Did you even bother to read the achievements I posted from his term?

File: Washington.jpg (601KB, 1588x1932px) Image search: [Google]

601KB, 1588x1932px

How is this even a debate?

>>2644164
Such a shit general. American propaganda really fucked up the perception of him.

>>2636736
The new deal and the freeing of the slaves are the two things that have fucked this country.

Niggers and welfare

>Reagan
Glad to see there are a few of these. The man put the last nail into the American coffin for the Pope of Rome, for that he was given a 33rd degree Mason bib but may have already been suffering from debilitating brain disease. His wife was operating him like a puppet while still in office. There is always Trump though...

>>2644153
The measure of a great president isn't in square feet.

>>2644126
>with achieving the largest amount of land expansion within one term of the presidency
>Who is Jefferson
The Louisiana Purchase was much larger than the Mexican Cession.

>>2643624
A damn sin how Garfield died. He would've survived the bullet had his doctor not rejected 'germ theory' and refused to sterilise his equipment.

https://youtu.be/pNAfPvzTBmQ

>>2638611
It depends how well he fulfills his promised policy platform.

If he revitalizes the Rust Belt because of the wall, dethrones China as the world's chief manufacturing figurehead, and avoids another Middle East proxy war, then he paves the way for an even more acerbic and gregarious personality to succeed him- someone genuinely nefarious and inclined to authoritarianism.

Regardless, his jingoistic persona has ignited the spark of ethno-nationalism across America, fueled by the victim narrative of the disenfranchised, working class patriot. I can imagine a scenario wherein militias take the law into their own hands on a mass scale, and I'm just praying we don't see a 9/11-style attack on US soil. I don't think Trump would deploy 'internment' camps, because the Nazi allusions would create a diplomatic crisis. More likely he'll pull a Milosevic and turn a blind eye to vigilante justice. There's too the possibility of armed conflict during construction of the wall between US and Mexican militias, though a geographically localized skirmish could be easily quashed. Either of these scenarios would mar his legacy significantly depending on government response.

The best case scenario, if he fails, would be America turning to a more intellectual brand of leader, and finally renouncing this Western obsession with personality politics. We might see a true philosopher-king step up to the mantle.

>>2644768
But not necessarily the most important. With a signature the US basically gained hegemony over both the pacific AND the atlantic at the same time.

>>2644768
>Louisiana Purchase
>what is the Oregon Deal
>what is the Texas annexation
There was more to his term than just one war.

Why were like 60 posts deleted?

>>2647338
Politics about a certain orange man and the political climate surrounding said oompa-loompa. The mods said they were against the rules so they deleted them and sent warnings to the posters (me included).