Childhood is idolising Rome. Adulthood is realising Byzantine

As someone writing their dissertation on aspects of the Byzantine State, this.

>"making sense" = doing nothing but slowly collapse for a thousand years

ok

It's the same thing you clod

>>2581969
So, this is the fabled American education system. Whoa.

>>2581974
>implying American schools even cover the byzantine empire

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>>2581969

>>2581834
Reading about WRE after Septimius Severus is depressing.

>>2581974

>Implying an American would ever say "clod"

European education everyone.

>>2582067
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jxA1fbk4OS8

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>Childhood is idolizing Latin massacring Byzantines
>Adulthood is realizing Venice makes more sense

Fixed for you, OP.

Greeks were better at being Roman than the Italics. Deal with it Latiniggers.

>>2582089
>a cartoon by a character who's meant to be outlandish
Nice proof. Stop getting all your vernacular by cartoons perhaps and go into the real world.

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>>2582317
Venetians >>> Greek niggers

>>2581834
>Childhood is idolising Rome.
>Adulthood is realising Ottoman made more sense

FTFY

>>2582321
>Gets BTFO
>Doubles down on his retardation
A true American.

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>>2581861
Can I read it?

>>2582327
Why are the Byzantines and Osmanli in this list twice

>>2582301
Venetians got kicked out in 1171.
1182 was genonese and pisians getting killed

>Childhood is idolizing the Holy Land.
>Adulthood is realizing retaking Constantinople from the gayreeks before they let it fall to the roaches made more sense.

>>2582382
>implying it would be possible for the Arabs to take Iran but not Aegyptus and Syria
Nigger what? The only reason the Arabs BTFO both powers so quickly was because they were busy BTFOing each other for like 20 years prior

They either don't take much from either group or make massive territorial gains on both

>>2582382
Only half written so far my man.
(It's looking at the Impact of Latins on the Byzantine military and economy from 1050 to just before the 4th Crusade. TLDR: Latins are useful for manpower and mobilising the economy, but not much else. Not a saviour of the empire, nor are they a 'DEY GONNA RUIN IT!!!' like the orthodoxy view says. They're just useful barbarians.)

>>2582397
I take it you're majoring in History.

Childhood is idolising France.
Adulthood is realising Holy Roman Empire made more sense.

>>2582397
It always hurts to see how poorly the west reacted to the Osmanli getting wrecked by Timur.
I get that Süleyman going straight to Edirne checked local ambitions (unlike in Anatolia) but holy shit, the interregnum was the Ottoman equivalent of the Crisis of the 3rd Century and niggers couldn't take advantage of it outside of some territorial concessions and losing vassal status, which the Serbs couldn't even do because they were being so autistic.

The Ottoman interregnum is possibly the biggest wasted opportunity the Christian world had for crnturies

>>2581974
I'm Polish

>Baby
HRE
>Kid
Byzantium
>Adult
Rome
>Elder
Ottoman Empire

>>2582584
BA in history (UK, so we just focus on a single subject instead of the american jack of all, master of none)

>>2582628
>implying Rome and Byzantium are different empires
>b-but Byzantium didn't hold Rome!
>Implying Rome was the capital of the WRE, or even the capital of the unified empire after Constantine
>implying Byzantium wasn't Roman because the language of government switched from Latin to Greek in the 600's, despite Greek being widely spread throughout the empire anyways

I am autistic and I AN MAD

>Childhood
Rome
>Adulthood
Byzantium
>Wise Old Age
The Diadochi

>>2582656
That's like saying India is Great Britain because it was once an important part of the Empire.

>>2582666
This is a terrible comparison holy shit dude

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True Enlightenment

>>2582677
He made a terrible argument to begin with.
>Byzantium and Rome are the same empire
The final years of the Western empire were such a clusterfuck that there is no clear way to find a "successor" state.

>>2582714
Yeah because there doesn't need to be a successor state when the other half of the exact same Empire is still around

>>2581834
Yes

Childhood is idolizing Rome.
Adulthood is realizing Polis Greece made more sense.

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Childhood is idolzing HRE
Adulthood is realizing Prussia makes more sense

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BTFO plebs

>>2582015
We did where I lived

Also
>grouping a massive population in a massive land body as one whole

>>2581834
Maturity is realising that they are both the same fucking Empire.

>>2581969
>>2584552
Read a book for once in your lives.

>>2582666
You don't understand. Even as early as Domitian, the capital was located where the Emperor resided. Later emperors could and did pick another major city to rule from, and they often overlooked Rome because it was a strategic, indefensible liability. Except for ancient Persia I can't think of another state that had so many different capitals overtime.

>>2584580
So if tomorrow the capital of the US was moved to Houston and then a couple hundred years later half of the northern states fell to Canadian barbarians, would what remained no longer be American?

>>2584580
>mom, i posted it again!

>>2581834
Maturity is realizing they're two legs of the same statue.

>>2584593
No.

>>2582382
>controlling Persia without Mesopotamia
Baghdad was the center of the Muslim world for so long for a reason, anon.

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>>2581834
Define "made more sense"

>>2584593
>capital moves to Houston
>less than a century later the country is politically and geographically split into Northern United States of America and Southern United States of America
>two different presidents
>within another century Northern US is destroyed by Canadian barbarians
>Southern US begins speaking Spanish and makes it the official language
>calls itself Los Estados Unidos de America
I wouldn't really consider it to be the USA anymore to be honest.

>>2581861
>their

>>2581834
Byzantibooism is a terrible hipster academic fad.

True virtue is realizing that the late Republic is the most dynamic and relevant period of Roman history.

>>2584663
>Southern US begins speaking Spanish and makes it the official language
This isn't an accurate comparison. Elites and even the upper middle class had been speaking Greek for centuries, and the "core" ares of the Byzantine empire were already majority greek speaking. No one "began" speaking Greek, they hardly even stopped speaking Latin considering they probably didn't do much of it before. But their culture was certainly Romano-hellenic

>>2584675
Byz*ntines spoke peasant tier medieval Greek, not classical Greek. Moreover, Greek was never the official language.

>>2584682
I guess Americans speak the same English as the founding fathers?

>>2584698
Classical Greek and medieval Greek are literally different languages. They wouldn't understand shit between each other unlike speakers of British English and American English.

>>2584717
>Classical Greek and medieval Greek are literally different languages
Yes, one changed into the other over centuries. That's what languages do. Is germany not really Germany because Old Germanic and Modern German are unintelligible?

>They wouldn't understand shit between each other unlike speakers of British English and American English
What does British English have to do with what I said.

Ohhh, you probably think the founding fathers spoke modern British English, and that American English evolved over time while British English is exactly as it was. I've actually heard a lot of brits tacitly affirm this belief ("we invented your language" etc.).

>>2584737
>Is germany not really Germany because Old Germanic and Modern German are unintelligible?

There was no Germany back then, so your question is quite stupid. A more appropriate comparison would be between Italian and Latin. Are Italians still Roman even though their culture and language is different?

>>2584580
Find me a professional historian who is not Edward Gibbon who passionately believes that they're two different states

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>>2582382
>romania

>>2584698

When you think of timespan, it'd be more like comparing Americans and old english.

Adulthood is when you don't idolize anybody, really.

>>2581834
Adulthood is getting off of this site and finding a job.

>>2581834
>I said it again mom!

>>2582628
>Ottoman Empire
Thinking the ottoman empire was anything but shit is fedora tier contrarian garbage.
Even if you're the ruler of the public toilet, all your subjects are shit.

>>2587305
14th to 16th Century Ottomanbooism is acceptable, even laudable.
People who pretend that they were still relevant or interesting outside of a few niche aspects that a select few could possible find entertaining into the 17th, 18th, 19th and even 20th century are simply deluded, but not nearly as deluded as Byzantinefags.
You're retarded if you think the entire Mediterranean magically became shit because it was under Ottoman ownership instead of the Greek's.

>>2587328
Its bullshit and a meme promoted by smelly turks lurking 4chan for child pornography.
The ottoman empire was shit for not having created a single thing of cultural or scientific noteworthyness because it stunted itself with a literal retard religion and rampant pederasty.
Ottomans were too busy praying and fucking little boys than to actually do anything worhty of note.
It's a completely accidental empire that only existed as long as it did because it was in a political vacuum.

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>>2587338
You have two options retarded /pol/cuck, pick up a book and learn some actual history or pick up a razor and slit your wrist.

>>2582384

The last one is actually a map of the Venetian possessions in the Med.

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>>2587564

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>muh bizantium
As an AMERICAN we fought a war to earn the right to not EVER give a shit about some thousand year old crumbling ruin from the armpit of the old world.

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>>2587813
We will never forget their crimes.

It all went downhill after the Punic Wars

>>2587820
Post more memery TV.

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>>2587822

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>>2587564

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>>2587844

How did this rome thread become a fake memri meme thread?

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>>2587857
it's real

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gCvMMSTOl4Q

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>>2584580

>>2584717
Bullshit.

Even a modern Greek can make sense of Classical Greek to some extent.

And so what. We don't discount the continuity between Middle English and Modern a English just because the former can sometimes be nonsensical to us.

>>2587860
Holy fug it's like Jerry Springer for Arabs

>>2587844
Here's the sauce for this.

https://youtu.be/6_PRDs6SACQ

IF ANYONE can watch this without laughing I will wire you 100 of my neetbux.

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>>2587844

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>make thread about Byzantines
>it gets taken over by Muslims

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>>2587958

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>>2587564

>>2588019
Farfour was the last man standing for mankind before the filthy kikes killed him.

>>2587875
kek

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This is my favorite one

Childhood is idolising Rome.
Adulthood is realising Byzantine made more sense.
Elderly sagehood is accepting that the Islamic caliphates were the true heir of Greco-Roman intellect and literally did nothing wrong.

>>2581834
>non painted statues

>>2587968
1453'D
4
5
3

Childhood is idolizing Byzantine Empire
Adulthood is realizing Ottomans made more sense

>>2582609
It wouldn't have mattered. First Westerners weren't that strong back then. Second, they would have gotten demolished by Tamerlane.

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>>2589518
>Tamerlane

Stop calling Timur like that.

>>2581974
>>2582026
>>2584580
t. >Holy >Roman >Emperor

>>2589260
Better in age of empires 2 desu

>>2582327
>>2589260
>>2587564
>Ottoman Empire
Honestly truly kek'd. Go to modern Turkey and find me artifacts that are Turkish in origin. You can't, they're all Armenian, Greek, Hurrian, etc. Even their most beloved mosque is a carbon copy of Aiya Sophia.

>>2588015
Fucking based

>>2581974
Everyone except for contrarian edgelords agrees that the Byzantine Empire was the successor to Rome.

>>2587776
>Venetian possessions in the Med
They were so small I didn't even notice them lol

>>2587305
I actually used to be real interested in the Ottoman Empire. The contrarian fedoras here really turned me off it.

Then I realised all Turkish legacies are actually Greek, Roman, Armenian or Anatolian in origin.

>>2590257
Venetian """"""""""Empire""""""""""

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>>2590257
>>2590281
It was literally a wall against the Ottomans. Who cares if it's small? Venetians controlled the East Med and Genoans controlled the West Med.

>>2581974
Byzantine was a continuation of Rome you mongoloid.

>>2590353
>Venetians controlled the East Med and Genoans controlled the West Med.
Are you talking about the sea? Because all I see in the map is that weak eastern coastline and the trade routes (not including Cyprus and Crete).

>>2590353
Not really.

They only got left alone by sucking Turkish cock and constantly sniveling. When the Ottomans actually decided to conquer the Venetian possesions they did so really easily, condemning Venice to irrelevance and decline

>>2581969
Shut the heck up you midget faget

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real men think like this

>>2581944
>Doing nothing
>Maintains a single politically cohesive civilization for a literal millennium
So, like, are you retarded?

>>2584647
I think it make more sense than the roman Empire, not only about the territory. The byzantine empire was the last heir of Rome and the only ortodox country (exepted russians princes) and they fought during 1000 years persians and muslims who tried to kill them. The balls was here

>>2590485
>easily

Seige of Candia lasted 21 years, friend.

>>2581974
>>2581834
>>2582015
>>2582382
>>2587813
>>2588631
>>2591484
Byzantium was Rome.
It's just a seperate period.
E.g. Kingdom, Early Republic, Late Republic etc.
The early, middle and late Byzantine periods are just more parts of its history.

>>2582301
I climbed that tower once.

>>2592679
You're not wrong but there's more to it than even that.

The WRE and the ERE were for a time contemporaneous entities and saw each other as two legs of the same body, holding a sense of mutual Romanitas. If anything, Western Romans looked up to Eastern Romans *because* of their Greek heritage which was always looked up to since even the Republic.

Anyway, It's not like we go Republic -> Empire -> Byzantium. It's more like Republic -> Empire -> emergence of the East as an autonomous and equal entity for administrative reasons -> WRE/ERE -> fall of the West to barbarians and the loss of Romanitas -> ERE becomes simply the Roman Empire - or 'Byzantium' to its detractors since that's the name of the shitty little town that would turn into Constantinople.

Of course, none of this would stop a bunch of autistic Frankaboos screeching about muh Holy Roman Empire that was neither holy nor Roman.

>>2581834
What's to love about an oppressive bureaucratic theocracy that accomplished nothing of note?

>>2590109
>carbon copy of aya sofya

Not this shit again.

>>2585163
Underrated. Still Basil II was GOAT.

>>2588005
That can't be real

>>2589531
Stop being lame and we won't call you that.

>>2593974
Its real though my uncle got eaten by some beady eyed anglos last year.

>>2593254
They kept the muzzles out of Europe for 700 years.