Was the HRE really that bad?

>>2579325
>no USA
>no French empire
come on now

between the 30 years war and the partition of Poland it was relatively powerless

no it was the perfect form of government, everything except mutual defense was devolved to local control as much as possible

just a shame christianity had to ruin perfection YET AGAIN

>>2579315
>Rome
>says it's a republic
>it's actually a monarchy

>Holy Rome
>says it's a monarchy
>it's actually an oligarchy

Really I like to think of the HRE as like Voltron with all the pilots hating each other. Separated they are still fucking lions, and together they are a scary force to be reckon with (which is why France was constantly trying to keep them down). Not like Poland or Rome proper whose divisions just weakened them horribly even divided there was still Bavaria, Handover, Switzerland, Netherlands, Frankfurt, Saxony, Austria, and of course Prussia just one of them is enough to raise hell in Europe, but combined together they create the demon king.

>>2579325
>no finland

>>2579335
The USA is a nation of inbreed morons and France is responsible for the death of the real Roman Empire.

>>2580228
what

USA and Rome has so much in common

>ever declining "democracy"
>culture "borrowed" from culturally superior civilizations
>rich and poor disparity
>senate filled with rich lazy assholes
>anti-intellectual citizenry
>cultural imperialism
>most of their workforce are illegal immigrants
>Eastern nation keeps fucking with them

>>2579315
Post 1648, yes.
Before, no it was bretty good

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>>2579315

>>2580083
Hwan won

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>>2579315

Can someone recommend a couple of good books on HRE?

Also I'd appreciate it if someone can lay out roughly any major splits or schools of thought in HRE scholarship. Redpill me.

Lack of patriotism, corrupt lords and descentralization.

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>>2581254

>conflict that ended over 150 years ago
>what 4 states happen to call themselves
>makes up less than .5% of land area and population

>>2583226
>descentralization
The greatest thing ever if you have brains.

No.

>>2579325
EXTREMELY patrician chart

>>2579325
>Byzantium listed twice
>Russia/Ottomans even on the list
>Overrated Venice and not master Italian culture Genoa

>>2583022
Thirty Years War by Wedgwood.
Spelled out all that was wrong with the HRE and the various reform ideas. The 30YW also saw the last serious attempt to unify germany for good, but then came the French and Swedes and ruined everything

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>>2583022
Can anyone help a freg out?

Metapedia references these two.

>Peter Hamish Wilson, The Holy Roman Empire, 1495-1806
2 1/2 stars on Amazon

>James Bryce, The Holy Roman Empire
3 1/2 stars on Amazon

>>2584342
Wow that timing. Thanks for this.

>>2579357
This.

The reason why intellectuals like Voltaire and most historians hate the HRE is because the intelligentsia as a caste depends upon state largesse to survive, they are pretty much useless without a bureaucracy to employ them. They hate states like the HRE that lacked such a centralized bureaucracy, and instead love France and the Soviet Union.

>>2584346
You better ask that in a recommendation or literary thread.
Or you can look through the archives for the last ones. They probably had something on the HRE