Cuba and the Cuban Revolution

Most of their cars are 50+ years old and still well-maintained.

Meanwhile the western markets chew threw new cars on average of every 5-8 years.

It says something about capitalist disposability. The average Cuban does all their own car repairs.

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>>2550528
Pic related

A moral day of traffic on Cuba looks like an American car show

>>2550516
>spanish colonial posession
>suddenly it becames an american hideout
>suddenly it becames a soviet base in the Americas and a launchpoint for marxist guerrillas into the whole Latin America
>successful in Central America and a bunch of countries in South America where poverty, ignorance and hatred of class became staple
TL;DR Cuba's a rogue nation

>>2550528
>38 vehicles per 1000 people
>the average cuban does all their own car repairs
looks like you're a foreigner to either Cuba or the "average" concept or both

>>2550560
>38 vehicles per 1000 people
Isn't this more reasonable than the American model in the face of global warming, environmental degradation, and peak oil?

>>2550560
The average vehicle owner.

The point is they make things last while America has been through decades of car replacement and the average American can't even even top off their oil tank.

>>2550569
>peak oil
that's why right now oil's worth half of what was worth a few years ago, because it is depleting, isn't it?
>global warming, envirnomental degradation
so you think car motors efficiency have never change for good since 1900s? With every decade, fuel motors become more efficient and with that they become less and less polluting. To put it in perspective, a cuban old car can be much more polluting than the average 2010s car.

Besides, the age of electric cars is coming so NO. Your luddite rant is not going anywhere.

>>2550544
>rogue

Refusing to suck Uncle Sam's smegma laden cock makes you a rogue nation?

>>2550576
All three out of one hundred of them are driving old, heavy, unsafe relics that, if they had a proper auto industry, the material could be recycled into 4 modern vehicles.

>>2550590
Every nation sucks other nations's cock, lad

>>2550584
Are you under the impression electric cars are environmentally benign. The electricity still needs to be generated and that is still done by burning fossil fuels.

>cheap oil means we do not face peak oil
The price of oil is not left to the market. OPEC is a classic cartel. In any case, unless you think oil is inexhaustible, it will surely start to run out eventually. Even if it is fifty years away, given our dependency, is it too soon to start thinking about it and how society might best respond?

>>2550590
Refusing to cooperate with your regional economic, political and military super power gets you put in the dog house.

If you can't play nice with others....

>>2550607
>the only way to generate electricity is by burning fuel or coal
are you arab by any chance?
>OPEC is a classic cartel
So why they're keep driving the prices low? So they can keep hurting their profits? NO
Prices are low because new fracking technologies allow for previously unreacheble oil wells to be exploited. And things will keep that way for at least a decade from now.

>>2550516
The revolution was pretty weird. If you dig really deep into it, it seems less that Castro actually cared about communism and more that whenever anything bad happened his paranoia made him blame it on the U.S. which caused him to react and which caused the U.S. to actually react and the cycle continued until the two cut each other off completely. There's a great book on the subject titled That Infernal Little Cuban Republic, highly recommend it.

>>2550613
>So why they're keep driving the prices low?
To drive away competition by making more expensive methods of gaining oil not worth it, i.e. fracking.

>>2550616
Nice recommendation. Thank you, senpai.

>>Electricity production is still largely achieved through the burning of fossil fuels and it seems renewables will struggle to replace that completely.

>>2550613
Sorry. Fucked that last post right up.

Electricity production is still largely achieved through the burning of fossil fuels and it seems renewables will struggle to replace that completely.

>>2550626
You're welcome. It's basically the historiography of Cuban-American relations with a focus on Cuban history and the revolution itself.

>>2550636
Does the author believe the revolution was justified?

>>2550707
I don't really remember since it's been a while since I read it and honestly, that kind of interpretive statement wouldn't fly in such an academic book. From what I remember, the author's interpretation points toward a justified overthrow of Batista (which is common historiography) but the immediate aftermath tossed any justification out the window as Castro managed to be worse in the immediate aftermath.

>>2550576
I'm not saying I agree with it (I drive a '78 Trans Am that I've owned for years and work on in my spare time), but after owning a vehicle for many, many years and not buying something modern, I can definitely see the issues with attempting to maintain something old. It's more expensive in the long run, the vehicle itself is much less efficient (Engine puts out a lot of power but sucks fuel like a hooker on cock), and you're constantly having to repair some gubbin that started having trouble as soon as you're done fixing another one.

After a while, it becomes pretty apparent that people are better off buying a cheap modern vehicle in the long run than attempting to keep their ancient land yacht running if they're wanting to save money and reduce fuel usage. The only real advantage that old cars offer is they're easy to service yourself because most of the things on it are simple mechanical bits with no computers attached.

>>2550616
>[Castro's] paranoia

totally justified desu senpai

>>2550787
Sort of, given Guatemala, but Castro brought it on himself.

>>2550626
While I think the other anon's argument has some holes in it, there's no getting around that right now the current way to make batteries for electric vehicles involves highly destructive lithium mining, which is more environmentally damaging than oil drilling and fuel burning. You'll need to solve that problem before electric cars are actually a net benefit to the environment.

>Cuban Revolution thread is now also a car/oil thread

>>2550811
This was always going to happen

>>2550516
The Cuban people are a resilient people that make do with what they have. Following Castro's death, many people in Miami had a huge celebration and were hopeful to put an end to the communist dictatorship but as months have gone by, nothing seems to have changed. Maybe got even worse actually as Obama removed wet foot/dry foot law which allowed Cuban refugees to legally stay on U.S. soil. Which means that many cubans will have to stay in Cuba and continue to live a brutal life.

>>2551384
t. Second generation american from Cuban ancestry

>>2550516
>Was the revolution justified?
yes
>Are the people better off than they were under Batista?
yes
>Do you admire Cuban resilience to the enormous international pressure they have faced?
They are notoriously inept at economy and live in an ideological pipe dream
>How has Cuba fared in the realm of human rights?
No free speech, police state
> Could Cuba even serve as a model for nations facing the decline of oil?
It could be a model for many african countries certainly

>>2550560
You can't really nitpick at vehicle count per person. Cuban cities are far more walkable than most other cities in the world of comparable size, and social melding in Cuba is such that there's a lot more car pooling than individual vehicle travel.

>>2551531
>notoriously inept at economy
There is literally no evidence to suggest this is true.

>>2553152
>shortages
>people fleeing the island through decades
>no reliable economic data
>muh soviet economic agreements, muh oil agreements with Venezuela
>there's literally no evidence
leftypol get out

>>2550560
>>38 vehicles per 1000 people
I can't imagine why most people in cities need cars. Havana has public transport.
>>the average cuban does all their own car repairs
What's wrong with this? Afraid you might have to do some work? Not so long ago, everyone knew how to repair some stuff with their cars. Also, do you think no one has friends to lend a hand in Cuba?

>>2550516
>Was the revolution justified?
Yes. Capitalism was a plague on Cuba and it booted the American Imperialists out.
>Are the people better off than they were under Batista?
Much much better off.
>Do you admire Cuban resilience to the enormous international pressure they have faced?
Extremely. They're such an admirable nation. Blockaded for 50 years -- their economy strangled, yet they're a great country with better priorities than the US.
>How has Cuba fared in the realm of human rights?
People love to get on their high horse and act like Cuba isn't a country constantly under threat from the US. They tried to kill Castro hundreds of times and are constantly trying to undermine their country. It's sickening.
It's also rich that the Imperial US criticises Cuba. What countries has Cuba invaded? The most oppressive place on Cuba is owned by the US!
Also, Cuba was the only country to help out the Angloans.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cuban_intervention_in_Angola
>Could Cuba even serve as a model for nations facing the decline of oil?
If we could all be a bit more like Cuba, the world would have less waste, less wars and less inequality.

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>Was the revolution justified?

No, Cuba was already one of the best countries in Latin America under Batista.

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>>2554275
>Are the people better off than they were under Batista?

Under Batista people from all around the world migrated to live in Cuba. Now not even Haitians want to live there.

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>Do you admire Cuban resilience to the enormous international pressure they have faced?

I admire the way Cuban intelligence service created political movements in the rest of Latin America and put them in power to give money to Cuba. Hugo Chávez in Venezuela and Lula in Brazil are both creations of Cuban intelligence, and they have rewarded the Castros generously.

>>2554253
Go to bed, Raúl.

>>2550516
Daily reminder that Fidel was never a communist and only started pretending to be one after the retard Eisenhower slapped an embargo on Cuba. He was a third position nationalist, so pretty much a fascist.

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>>2554382
Make me, Yankee.

>>2554280
>Under Batista people from all around the world migrated to live in Cuba. Now not even Haitians want to live there.
>Under Batista CAPITALIST EXPLOITERS AND BOOTLICKERS from all around the world migrated to live in Cuba. Now not even Haitians want to live there.
FTFY

>>2554275
Source on that image?

>>2550811
who gives a fuck about health, education or work. Cars is where is at, vrum vrum

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>>2554410
Butthurt Commie detected.

>>2554145
>no reliable economic data
TIL the World Bank isn't reliable

>>2554275
Cuba's infant mortality rate is currently 4.76 per 1000 live births, lower than the US.

Cuba literally has better health metrics than the US, and they're far better than they were under Batista. Plus people get free education now, resulting in Cuba having one of the most literate and educated populaces on Earth.

>>2554683
Well I'll just say this.

A freer but unequal society is better than an more equal but poverty-ridden authoritarian society.

>>2554740
How about this.

Median household income > Average household income.

>>2554402
Why would he pretend to be a communist?

>>2556141
To align with the Soviets for protection.

>>2554253
>What country has Cuba ever invaded?
The Cuban government participated in the Colombian drug trade in the 80's and supported both the Colombian cartels and the FARC. They also supported violent Marxist revolutions in other Latin American nations. Just because you aren't ""invading"" anyone doesn't mean you're necessarily a peaceful nation.

>>2554253
>What country has Cuba invaded?
>cites Cuba invading Angola
Fucking Poetry

>>2554402
Fidel was an opportunist who intentionally made his revolution's intentions vague before allying with the Soviets. He literally had no platform beyond "muh working class" until he started antagonizing the Americans and was forced to become a Soviet pawn.
>Is the revolution left or right?
>The revolution isn't left or right wing. It's foward.

>>2554740
>americans say this as their governments fuck them in the ass and clamour for the dismemberment of the EU when it protect's it's citizen's consumer rights.

>>2551531
>Are the people better off than they were under Batista?
depends completely on who you were
the dirt poor rural workers are certainly better off but not the urban middle class
Cuba never recovered in terms of wealth after the revolution

>>2554275
the revolution was not justified but Batista had to go in some way
he fiddled his fingers while rural Cuba was in shambles which was the primary impetus for the revolution

>>2556141
Because the Americans cucked him out of any kind of cooperation so he had to align with the Soviets. He wasn't a communist until long after the revolution, you can look up all of his speeches and writings before 1959, there is absolutely nothing communist. He was a member and supporter of Chibas' Orthodox Party which were conservative nationalist populists who opposed both socialism and capitalism.

Fun fact: when Fidel took over, the Communist Party of Cuba told Moscow he might be a CIA agent installed because Batista has became a volatile asset.

>>2554483
not him but i just wrote a paper on Cuban state-market relations and used it
http://econweb.umd.edu/~davis/eventpapers/CUBA.pdf

>>2556837
>Because the Americans cucked him out of any kind of cooperation
That's fucking wrong, though. The U.S. government recognized Castro's government and he even traveled to the United States to speak with U.S. officials and the press. The U.S. didn't turn against Castro until he purposely singled out American business and nationalized every bit of it.

>>2554740
would you say that if you were a homeless person living in america?

>>2556856
A hobo in America lives better than a doctor in Cuba.

>"I know the world thinks of us, we are Communists, and of course I have said very clear that we are not Communists; very clear." - Fidel Castro, Former President of Cuba and Leader of Cuba’s Communist party
what did he mean by this?

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>>2554407
you're next cuck

>>2556206
>>2556837
But after the Soviet Union fell, he didn't renounce communism.
>>2556840
Thanks.

>>2556927
It was kind of too late for that after 30 years of communism. It's also ironic that Raul is now considered the moderate brother when in the early days he was a hardliner Marxist/Stalinist.

>>2554224
>>2553134
>>2550576
>>2550569
>permavirgin NEETs who have never had to deal with a real commute because they've never held a real job in their lives praising socialism proposing stripping meat and cars from everyone for their own moral crusade and MUH GREENHOUSE GASSSEESSS

what a surprise

>>2556750
Nah he was pretty clear cut classic populist running with land reform and taking over foreign businesses that others in Latin America also did. Land reform was huge issue in Latin America.

Raul and Che were the ones pushing for communism.

>>2556981
>amerishart things the rest of the world has his garbled mess of a country where suppressing effective government is a type of FREEDOM.

>>2557002
>socialist assuming country of origin and instantly resorting to armchair e-psychoanalysis when pressured

I KNOW MORE ABOUT U THAN U

I KNOW U USE MINTY WHITE TOOTHPASTE SO CLEVER XD

Why are socialists always obsessed with soft sciences? It's like you're all trying to tell us something...

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>>2557002
>cuba
>effective government

>>2556860
Retard of the month alert.

>was the revolution justified
A revolution was justified. The one that won wasn't.

>Are the people better off than they were under Batista?
Comparing today to 1950's Cuba? Absolutely. Comparing today to how Cuba would be if the pro-western dictatorship remained until the 80's or so and had a robust market economy when it democratized? Probably not.

>Do you admire Cuban resilience to the enormous international pressure they have faced?
Yes, the resilience to foreigners that causes thousands of Cubans to risk their lives to go to foreign nations.

>How has Cuba fared in the realm of human rights?
kek

>Could Cuba even serve as a model for nations facing the decline of oil?
Assuming you're the guy arguing about how they're being more environmentally sustainable by having fewer cars, it sure as shit isn't by choice. Their car culture would probably be similar to the US's if they weren't embargoed for the last 50 years. Besides, all those cars still run on gasoline, so they'd be screwed either way in a few years if you believe in the whole "peak oil" thing.