Yahweh/El

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>>2508425
Yes. This is the Canaanite god El, the god of the Hebrews an therefore Christians and Muslims as well.

YHWH IS EL.

This is what you pray to every time you get on your knees, hope youre not pissing off any other diety..

>>2508425
Yahweh is Allah

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The religion of the earliest Hebrews which was to become Judaism is the ancient Canaanite religion. This is fact.

Also it began as a polytheistic religion. That's why you see things in Genesis like "Man was created in OUR image", or like in Job where God addresses a host of other deities who are in heaven with him.

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>>2508460
>>2508444
Is El the equivalent of Jupiter? Or is it Cronus/Saturn?

>>2508479
What the fuck are you talking about? El had nothing to do with the Greco Roman Pantheon, it predates them by several thousand years

>>2508479
Definitely Saturn. Baal/hadad, El's son, is Jupiter.

>>2508479
>>2508493
I think he's asking if EL is the head god in the caananite pantheon of gods like Jupiter is.

The answer is yes. He was the head god. Yahweh was the god of war in the same pantheon.

>>2508515
El didn't directly rule over the gods, though he was the "head god". Baal Hadad was the real ruler over the gods and had the storm motifs that Zeus had. It's sort of like the greek gods' hierarchy if Cronus wasn't overthrown by Zeus, but just willingly sidelined by him.

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>>2508515
>>2508493
Jewish polytheism confuses me.

How can Jesus be the Son of God if the Jews had many gods?

And if they moved to a monotheistic view by the time Jesus came, which god had they decided was the main God now?

>Yahweh, El, Jehova, Allah, God - are they all the same being? Or did we get mixed up somewhere?

>>2508577
It's not Jewish, it's Caananite
Jewish as we know it didn't come until much later when the Isreals were taken into Babylon and merged with Zoroastrianism.

There are two major writers of the old testament which can be deciphered by their use of the term El or Yahweh

The praise of Yahweh became the most prevalent by the time of the exile because worship of a warrior god of war makes the most sense when you want to be delivered. Once removed from their homeland, El and the other gods fell away.

Yahweh then became monotheistic when fused with the customs and concepts of the Babylonian/Assyrian religions of Zoroastrianism

>>2508577
From what I understand Jesus being God is different from God being Jehova or YHWH because the latter are all just different names for the same being, but Jesus and God fulfill different roles while simultaneously being the same being but wearing a different face so to speak. Take this with a grain of salt though I'm not sure I'm right

>>2508613
>>2508616
So confusing.

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>>2508613
>>2508616
>humans change the identity of God all the time

Hmm. I'll just stick with God the Creator of All. Can't get any higher than that.

>>2508425
>Is this the name of the God the Jews worship?
He has many names. It's YHWH in scripture but one of his names is a 'true' 'secret' 'ineffable' name.

It's ineffable because knowing an entity's name gives you power over that entity (and that's blasphemous as shit when it comes to god and likely to get him real pissed): in many antique cultures there wasn't a clear separation between a thing and a representation of that thing, so the written name of something or a sculpture or painting of them was literally considered them (this is a major reason why depictions of god and 'graven images' were forbidden).

There's a famous Jewish satire of Christianity called the Toldot Yeshu where Jesus (Yeshu) discovers the secret name, and uses it's power to deceive people into believing he is the messiah by performing miracles.

http://jewishchristianlit.com//Topics/JewishJesus/toledoth.html

Writing or saying the ineffable name is blasphemy ("Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain") and you're likely to get smited by god for having anything to do with it.

The name is Shemhamforash.

>>2508810
heresy

Jesus is Yahweh, as is the Holy Spirit

There is no "unique" name for the father, since he is both incorporeal and incomprehensible. That's why Jesus and the Holy Spirit are necessary for us to get a glimmer of the father, all three being the presence of Yahweh

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>>2508810
>I have gone by many names, but you know me as...
(Satan's quote in every other movie.)

>>2508759
Next decade you'll be worshiping some other self-help therapy or televangelist or politician.

>>2508996
>incomprehensible
>BUT ALSO HE'S A WISE KING AND LOVES US AND HATES SIN AND

>>2508954
Are you a space marine lol

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>>2509038
Yes.

>>2508716
whats confusing about it? its pretty straightforward

>>2508759
God is the truth which best suits humans
ie: the principles in which allowed humans to survive in mother nature (which is constantly trying to kill us) and socially among other humans (which are constantly trying to kill each other)
Whichever for god takes, El, the arbiter of the god or Yahweh, the promised warrior god- the idea and configuration of behaviors allows that specific subset of humans to survive unimaginable difficulties.
That same concept- however morphed and changed over the centuries- still provided a structure for humans to survive their environment.

>>2509032
That's Jesus and the Holy Spirit, who both are also God

>Father: incorporeal, incomprehensible

>Jesus: corporeal, comprehensible

>Holy Spirit: incorporeal, comprehensible

>You: corporeal, incomprehensible

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>>2509080
>Holy Spirit: comprehensible

>>2509094
No one can recognize Jesus as Lord, without first receiving the guidance and wisdom of the Holy Spirit.

For those saying Jews were polytheistic isn't quite right. Back then each tribe had their own god that they worshiped exclusively. So, it was henotheistic. Other gods were acknowledge to exist, but X tribe only worshiped one particular god. Jews had Yahweh. It wasn't until the Babylonian period that another anon mentioned that suddenly god was the only god and suddenly went from the limited Yahweh into the more "omni" direction we see today.

>>2509054

He's confused because the vast majority of people proclaiming to follow the god of Abraham have no fucking idea what their god was really said to be like. It's like if you dated a girl for years and suddenly she takes her face off and it's a reptilian. It's gonna be hard coming to terms with the reality because the god preached to people is so vastly different from what their god actually is.

>>2509104
>The worship of Yahweh alone began at the earliest with Elijah in the 9th century BCE, but more likely with the prophet Hosea in the 8th; even then it remained the concern of a small party before gaining ascendancy in the exilic and early post-exilic period.[49] The process by which this came about might be described as follows: In the early tribal period each tribe would have had its own patron god; when kingship emerged the state promoted Yahweh as the national god of Israel, supreme over the other gods, and gradually Yahweh absorbed all the positive traits of the other gods and goddesses; finally, in the national crisis of the exile, the very existence of other gods was denied.[9]
How true is this?

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ill just leave this here

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>>2509134

>>2509119
To the best we can ascertain, it is at least in the realm of accuracy

>>2509119

Pretty true. That's what happened. Half the shit you see today is making excuses for stuff in the Bible that was originally attributed to a non-omni being. God losing to iron chariots? God could be beaten because Yahweh wasn't omnipotent. God speaks in the plural? It's the royal "we". A lot of this shit makes sense if you realize that god was very different than he is now. Instead, people have to rationalize a lot of shit because the original god does not match up with the very different modern understandings. Like the slavery or genocide god orders or Jesus calling a woman a dog. Yahweh wasn't the god of anybody but Jews. Everyone else had their own god. It wouldn't be until Paul made up some shit to prevent Christianity from dying out that pandered to gentiles that god even applied to anyone but Jews. Early on Christianity was understood to be for Jews, not anybody else.

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>>2509096
That doesn't make it comprehensible

The Holy Spirit is the least comprehensible part of the Holy Trinity

>>2509172
Because it's a Greek concept that emerged later. But the trinity itself is nonsense backed by no scripture at all. It was made to pander to all Christians (who worshiped Jesus, some god alone with Jesus as a prophet, some with Jesus as the son, some the holy spirit, etc.) Early on there was no canon texts or beliefs. So, to get some form of unity they came up with the trinity to appeal to the vast majority of Christians so they could all technically be right and get them to agree with one another and establish a canon that basically took all the most popular books and combined them.

Yes and yes.

Yahweh, Jehovah, LORD, God.
The Most High.
The Everlasting One.
El Shaddai.
The Lord of Hosts.
The Ancient of Days.
The "I Am"
Yeshua, Iesous, Jesus.
Messiah, Anointed, Christ.
The creator and sustainer of the universe.

On the other side we have..
Satan, Lucifer, Moloch, Baal, Shiva, the Accuser and deceiver, etc. The father of lies. The founder of Paganism, Gnosticism, New Age, Islam, Catholicism, Hinduism, Atheism, Evolutionism and every false religion in the world.

>>2508444
>>2508460
>>2508515
>>2508448
>this is what atheists actually believe

>>2509080
why even go to such lengths to care about this Dungeons and Dragons bullshit

>>2508425
Jews actually worship Satan

>>2509217
>This is what every scholar not associated with particularly conservative sects of Christianity actually believe

>>2509211

Except even Satan was originally an angel who was a dickhead only on god's orders to test the faith of people and separate the righteous and true believers from the sinners. Christians made up the "fall" out of nowhere. Because, in Judaism, much like Islam, angels were never understood to have free will in the way humans do. They follow what god says. The idea that an angel could fall emerged with Christianity, and way later.

>>2509134
is the dinosaur stuff supposed to be ironic or

>>2509232
Literally no scholar takes your "jewz r canaanites!" myth seriously.

The only ones who constantly regurgitate that garbage are 15 year old youtube/forum atheists.

>>2509211
Wow calm down there Constantine. We all know that the trinity is a pagan concept made up by Paul the liar to enslave the minds of the uneducated.

Islam had the only one true definition of God. A Supreme being with no equal, no limiting factors, no arguments, no sons or daughters, no "He be half man, half spirit, all father with a pinch of human too!". Good is One, the Greatest.

>>2509263
Get back to the oven

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>>2509268
Nice meme!

>>2509265
ITT: atheists make claims and assertions without any proof or evidence

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>>2509239

>>2509265

Islam is just as riddled with Pagan shit as Christianity.

Secondly, the trinity didn't come into being until the first Nicaea council. Paul just changed shit to convert gentiles like getting rid of dietary laws, circumcision, etc.

>>2509293
Roman Catholicism and Islam are both crypto-pagan religion.

Biblical Christianity or Puritan/Protestant Christianity is the only legit and real deal.

>>2509313

No. See: this entire thread. Your first point is correct, though.

>>2509239
No, the Creation museum in Kentucky is full of this dinosaur shit, I've been there.

>>2509313
>Puritan
Kike loving shit. Lutheranism or fuck off.

>>2508425
Yes.
Yes.

Jesus is the God in the flesh.

No, only dopes think that.

>>2509313
The old NT bible has been superseded by the Book of Mormon.

>>2509325
>God's Word has been superseded by a heretical cult that was founded by a Freemason

0/10

>>2509263
Um no everyone does who isn't a conservative Christian or Jew.

You dont even have to be an atheist to believe that (as if everyone who isn't a Christian is an atheist) Heck a liberal Christian could believe this

>>2509335
If you think that dangerous fringe cults are not legitimate then why do you take PROTESTANTISM of all things to be fine?
Is it because you just happen to be a protestant and are blatantly biased and idiotic? Hmm...

>>2509239
I was hoping this wouldn't happen but i couldn't find any good pictures of Ancient Israel so I decided to put ironic pictures. Do you think I should change it?

>>2509353
It is but they also believe some of the prophets to be sons of God in a "biological" manner so it kind of deviates there.

>>2509366
It made me super suspicious of that list of books because I though you were that Creationism guy who spams cult website links.

>>2508460
While I don't doubt that the Jews were originally polytheists (everyone in that region were), I don't get this point.

The Old Testament/Torah was written down some time during the 2nd or 3rd century BCE, before that, there was only an oral tradition. By that time Jews were known for being monotheists.

So, when obviously monotheist rabbis decided to write down the Torah... why would they leave in a reference to there being more gods? In the first chapter non the less.

I guess at that time this part was commonly understood as God referring only to himself as a god. Maybe it was a form of royal "we", or he was simply addressing angels (who are mentioned again several times in Genesis).

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>>2509366

>>2509373
You believe in lies and pseudo-history.

>>2509372
hmm ok then, I'll change it...
I'll use you're pic >>2509374 as a token of gratitude

>>2509375
*believes fake bible stories*

>>2509293
>
>Islam is just as riddled with Pagan shit as Christianity.

Citation needed. Islam is the exact opposite of paganism in all ways and manners. There is absolutely no tolerance for any sort of deviance from monotheism to such an extent where believing in lucky charms, even if they are Islamic writings on a piece of paper, to be heretical (i.e you wrote words of the Qur'an on a piece of paper and carry it with you thinking it will give since sort of cosmic benefit is a huge sin). Only God can give you benefit or harm. Nothing else.

How then did you come to your conclusion?

>>2509372
>scientific facts and articles are "cult"

funny how atheists stop believing in science when it contradicts their evolution myth

>>2509390
>Detailed Documentary Exposing Islam (3 hours)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qk_VwZxN9bA

>Allah in Quran = Satan in Bible
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qTi1FZkoEsM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=86PL9wueH-s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TLoUq8vybzY

Islam definitely has pagan roots. The original "Allah" was a pagan moon god with 3 daughters.

>>2509390

The fact that the hajj, kaaba, and various other things in Islam are from pagan origins. Islam is far from truly "pure" monotheism in that sense.

And Mohammad himself apparently said that he wanted to tear down the kaaba, but people were too close to the age of ignorance (time before Islam). He said it to Aisha in a hadith. Even if you disregard the hadith, the fact that it incorporated practices from paganism shows it's not much different. At that point it is like Catholics who also absorbed pagan beliefs and just laid over some Christian meaning to it. But saying "oh the kaaba was totes built by our prophets guys", does not change the truth of the

>>2509407

matter.

>>2509394
Creationism is a fringe cult position, held by deep south redneck Baptists and other retards and cultists.
That's the fact, I get why you can't EVER admit this due to your enslavement to the bible. Sucks to be you.

>>2509399

You're retarded. I'm not Muslim and even I know Allah wasn't a moon god. The moon god has a different name entirely. Allah was just the name for the same god as the Jews. And not because he was THE god, but because hundreds of different gods were recognized in Mecca. Given the Christian and Jewish presence in Arabia, it made sense that god would be in there too. But the three daughters thing is true hence the "satanic verses".

>>2509419
>things i dont like are fringe
>science is false when it proves my worldview wrong
>honest scientists who believe in creation using scientific arguments are cultists!

This is your brain on militant atheism.

>>2509424
Where are the Buddhist young earth creation scientists? What about hindus? why are they all Christians? Science doesn't change with your religion

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>>2509424
just ignore him, atheists on /his/ are retarded and irrational.

i doubt he even knows what creationism is except for strawmans from his evolutionist indoctrination

>>2509424
Things that are held by a tiny fraction of redneck churches are in fact "Fringe Cult" positions.
Sorry you devoted your whole life to making a fool out of your self by mimicking science that you seem to hate so much in order to seem relevant.

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>>2509430
>Ad populum
>Appeal to ridicule
>Ad hominem

I spot 3 logical fallacies in your post, not a single actual argument. Here's a pity (You).

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>>2509430
evolutionism is a cult.

it has been proven wrong years ago yet you still clinge to a dead theory

>>2509211
/thread

>>2509434
Since when do you people even care about argumentation in the first place? This board is flooded with your proclamations about your god nonstop. Ridiculous things are only worthy of ridicule.

>>2509436
>cultist trying to turn the tables by labeling science as a "religion"
Complete inversion of reality, I'm afraid you are deranged.

>>2509217
Jokes on you, I'm not an atheist
I believe in Christianity, albeit a different approach, but I still believe it to be incredibly beneficial and true

>>2509460
science isn't a religion, evolution is a religion.

i love science, it proves creationism is right and destroys evolutionism.

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>>2509384
>>2509374
>>2509372
ok so i made it look more legit, sorry i had to shrink your image other anon i wanted the "realism" aesthetic to prevail

>>2509467
>the bible is automatically true therefore twist everything to reach that conclusion
I'm afraid that's not actual science, cultist.

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>>2509480
its the other way around, dumbass.

>evolution is automatically true therefore twist everything to reach that conclusion

many creationist scientists were ex-evolutionists. they could no longer reconcile the evidence of design and creation with their beliefs in darwinism.

the ID movement is growing whereas darwinism is dying, stay mad

>>2509467
evolution as envisioned by darwin had many flaws, but darwin's ideas have been refined over 150 more years by experimentation. it's retarded to say evolution is a religion because any theory is constantly amended to take into account new discoveries and experiments that account for anything that can't be explained by the previous theory. evolution is not a monolithic concept but something that has been edited over and over again so you can't point to one period and say "this is what evolution is." tldr you're a retard

>>2509489
Stop replying to him, evolutionists are irrational and incapable of providing any evidence for their monkey-to-man religion.

>>2509373
>2nd or 3rd century BCE
that's way too late. that fits some later works like Daniel but the Torah was definitely in writing by the 8th century BC in some form (Deuteronomy 7th century).

>>2509489
Once again you have zero grasp on reality, you can only imitate science because you are jealous of its explanatory and convincing power, but since it doesn't enforce your dogmatic preconceived RELIGION, you make up some ridiculous parody but being DECEITFUL.
So not only are you objectively wrong, but you also violate the very tenants of your self-imposed religion to be wrong. As expected of a disgusting redneck cultist.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=styLx-iWwC8

The answer is here. It's worth a watch.

tl;dw: Jews stopped worshiping Yahweh and following the Torah long ago, and instead worship money through various devils and demons like Baal and Remphan. Judaism = Jewish Mysticism/Kabbalah = Babylonian Mystery Religion. Jesus said that those who do not have the Son do not have the Father. He said the Jews do not worship in spirit and truth as sons of Abraham but are liars, sons of the devil. He said Judaism is the Synagogue of Satan.

"For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly, nor is circumcision that which is outward in the flesh; but he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the Spirit, not in the letter; whose praise is not from men but from God." Romans 2:28-29

>>2509626
>>/pol/
you're worse than cockroaches

>>2509639

This is /his/, and I'm providing a historical, not political, reply. Was something I said factually or historically incorrect?

>>2508425
The Jewish tradition was a merging of several similar regional religions, each featuring a supreme god.
The evidence is in the several names that are used for that god in the OT, including Elohim, Yahweh, Shaddai, and El Elyon.
The different names are used in different contexts: Elohim in the "Elohist" parts of Genesis, Yahweh in the "Jahwist" parts of Genesis and elsewhere, Shaddai in Job and a few other places, and El Elyon in a few places, such as when mentioning priests that were sympathetic to the Jews.

>>2509626
The only place in the Gospels where Jesus is presented as not a Jew and in opposition to Jews is John, which was written very late.
Paul =/= Jesus, so your quotation from Romans is irrelevant.

>>2509664

There are plenty of references of Jesus, even John the Baptist, opposing the Jews before John's gospel and Paul's letters.

Matthew 3:5-9, 5:17-30 cf. John 8:37-47.
Matthew 12:1-14
Matthew 12:22-32
Matthew 15:1-20 cf. Mark 7:1-23
Matthew 16:1-12 cf. Mark 8:13-21, Luke 12:1-3
Matthew 21:33-46
Matthew 22:41-46
Matthew 23:1-36 cf. Luke 11:37-54
Luke 7:30-35
Luke 16:14-18

Such opposition was corroborated by his disciple, John, and through the apostle Paul. What evidence do you offer to support your claim that Jesus' apostles did not remain true to his words and teachings? Also, where do either John or Paul present Jesus as a Gentile?

>>2509293
Says the christian while he worship at statues

>>2509651
Lie and misinformation: The Post

Atheists lying for Darwin.

>>2509154
Excellent post desu.

>>2508460
Thats not the reason of that plural, let me show you the original:
And then the rulers of darkness said: Let us make man after our image and likeness...
You see YHVH was just a ruler of darkness, so when the actual God decided to give man the spirit so man could live, YHVH thought himself a god.

>>2509190
Well said.

>>2509217
> I have never researched the thing that I base my life on

Poor form, old boy

>>2510218
Says the Muslim while he worships at
>a fucking cube

>>2509650
nothing was historical, it was all biblical exegesis from a book that has dubious historical value. you made it political as soon as you tied your shallow interpretation of the bible to brand a group in the present day as villains who are the source of all evil. and, really, what makes your amateur attempt at interpretation valid when hundreds of men more intelligent and qualified than you or that retarded youtube poster have put their talent to interpret and analyze a complex text. you think that naming off a few quotes from many hundreds of pages is proof of anything?

>>2508444
Perfect career

>>2508448
Allah is only one in the world, source of evil,sins and dirt, by words of Quran.

>>2508577
>How can Jesus be the Son of God if the Jews had many gods?
Don't see problem, dude.