When did you realize the end justifies the means?

I haven't

what anime should i watch btw

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>>2484550
Friendly reminder that the ends have to be more noble than the means were ignoble for this to be an argument and even then it's completely subjective

>>2484575
Good job dumbass, that's literally the entire point of the statement (minus the subjectivity, if we're going there then everything can be argued as subjective)

>>2484632
Except for the fact that many people use the ends justifying the means even when the ends aren't nearly as beneficial as the means were detrimental. I was saying that it's a slippery slope and even when it is justifiable it's still subjective. You may have benefited a great deal, others may have lost a great deal. Pyrrhic moral victories exist.

>>2484550
I used to think that, but then I realized that the ends are so complicated it's not worth the extreme means to do it

>Kill all your enemies
>suddenly no enemies
>suddenly everyone thinks "killing your enemies" is a good idea
>suddenly everyone is killing everyone's enemies
>third world ensues

>>2484550
Only if you achieve the desired end. So, basically no it doesn't.

Elementary school

>>2484550
The means justify The End

When I realized the means are the ends.

>>2487162
This is what rule based utilitarianism is for.

>>2484550
childhood is realizing ends justify the means
adulthood is realizing nobody has a clue what the ends are

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>>2488667
>utilitarianism
Literally the same problem as that guy described

>>2484550
When the Americans let the Soviets run roughshod over half the world after WW2 because they are a nefarious offshoot of the Eternal Anglo.

>>2488709
With rule based utilitarianism, you try and include the benefits of following the rule in your moral calculation.

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>>2488728
>include the benefits of following the rule
I might be dumb but I fail to follow

>>2488742
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rule_utilitarianism

>>2488750
>ends justify the means
>but only if it follows the rules

doesn't that just mean the ends doesn't justify the means?

Except it doesn't. My father murdered my mother in a drunken rage because she said she was gonna smother me in my crib. Where is he now? In fucking prison.