Are we more like chimps or bonobos?

>strong male coalitions
We used to be like this.

>>2478638
AMIRITE?

We are men, not beasts.

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>>2478635
Depends what race you are

Chimps. Our societies tend towards being patriarchal, violent, and champion male-only organizations over female organizations (though it's hard to tell if that's due to any sort of innate characteristic or due to the first part).

We tend to settle our conflicts diplomatically so neither.

No.

>>2478635
Equal. We are equally related. In a cladogram humans share a common branching point (i.e. a common ancestor) with both chimps and bonobos

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>>2478710
forgot pic. But that's genetics.

as for behaviour: Put 5000 people, strangers all, in a big arena and nothing happens. Put 20 chimps in the same place and you have carnage.

>>2478722

Try it with 5000 people raised into tribal society. Any one of them can learn to be okay in that scenario, but that isn't the lesson of living by hunting and gardening.

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>>2478638
>mfw hominids used to put bros before hoes

>>2478710

Bonobos are chimps. They just got separated due to a river. On one side chimps stayed normal chimps and on the other they became more sexual and eased social tensions with sex. The difference between chimps is less genetic and more behavioral.

But to answer OP, humans are a bit like both. But of course our sapience throws a big X factor into shit so we aren't really limited by genetics anymore. And that allows for a far vaster array of behaviors both genetic (how humans just are by default) and cultural (what we happen to decide we wanna do).

>>2478638

It doesn't mean male chimps looking out for each other, only with regard outsiders. A strong male coalition for chimps means a hierarchy nobody challenges.

Go in there after finishing your PHD in combinatorics and come out with a proof that proves P = NP. That's the life.

>>2478733
>The difference between chimps is less genetic
but enough to classify them as different species.
And we are genetically equidistant to both Pan species.

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>>2478755
>we are genetically equidistant to both Pan species
That may be true, but in different ways.

>>2478755

Barely a different species. It's only a different species in the same way that different squirrels or mice are a different species. For all intents and purposes they are the same shit except for a massive shift in behavior.

>>2478776
>he doesnt know what species means

>>2478791

I know what species means and I know they are technically a different species, but come on. Put a chimp next to a bonobo and try to spot the difference. Different breeds of dogs are the same species and have bigger differences than chimps and bonobos do.

>>2478806
>they are a different species,
Your opinion about that doesn't change that. Not even when you sneak in a weasel word.

Chimps.

Human women do not form strong bonds. They will sell one another out in a heartbeat

>>2478635
that depends on where you stand on the left/right spectrum

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>>2478722
Do you have any idea what happened in the Superdome during Hurricane Katrina?

The National Guard had to call in a helicopter to send in a squad with assault rifles to evac a tour group of white British students because their makeshift fortifications wouldn't hold another night against the dusky hordes, because the government didn't want bad publicity over having a couple dozen foreign teenage coeds gang raped, tortured, and cannibalized to death by American citizens.

>>2478635
the modern human race is closer to the Nigger than any of those

>>2479026
Well black people are humans, so no shit.

>>2478635
>conflicts resolved with sex
>you will never be a bonobo

>>2478635
Neither.

>>2478635
Honestly, it's a bit of both, but I would argue that we are closer to chimps. Humans do form gangs, humans have a dominance-hierarchy, and humans are violent, but we also have the capability of being very cooperative and compassionate.

>>2478635
Mostly chimps unfortunately, but more dangerous.
Bonobos are so much cooler.
I wish the hippes won the evolutionary game back in the day, things would be better

bonobos will turn violent in times of famine, the idea bonobos = liberal while chimpanzees = conservative is confirmation bias

>>2478667
>race
could you please define your social construct i thought this was a biology based thread?

>>2480759
Liberals also turn violent in times if famine.
Bonobos and chimps are a really interesting case from the etho-evolutionary/evolutionary game perspective of their socio-ecological systems
We are animals and when our needs aren't met our abstracted civilized ways devolve into our more primitive nature. Bonobos typically have more abundant resource because no competition gorillas and a more stably productive ecosystem that hasn't been nearly as affected by mans influence.
In times of plenty apes do not rely so much on authoritative social hierarchies in order to survive. And can adopt an open-mind to novel behavior that would be risky if resources were scarce, and do not need to rely on violence in order to keep there belly full.
Looking at humans in America
People who adopt a very liberal social stance typically tend to be either the well educated intellectual elite who have plenty of time to spend thinking of novel solutions to the worlds problems as they don't need to work 50 hours a week as wage slaves to survive. Or they are extermely poor and do not even have the opportunity to work as wage slaves, thus being dependent on charity and welfare from the elite liberals.
Seems like bonobos.

Conservatives typically tend to be the elite business-class that make money from the work of the proletariat.(alpha chimps) or they tend to be the proletariat who earn their modest living working for the business class(betas) this is a delicate social hierarchy that winds up in conservatism, the alphas want to keep their power, and the betas want to insure their livelihood and are motivated by the prospect of one day rising to alpha status themselves.
As earths ecological systems continue to crumble and humanity plunged deeper and deeper into chaos. These traits will be more pronounced in humans. Most people will end up as chimps but the first world who has a head start will see the opportunity for some equalitarian bonobo type socio-ecological systems to emerge

>>2478635
Chimps.

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>>2478635
>if females were in charge we all get to fuck

is it worth it bros?

>>2480959
The less rights women have the more you'll get laid.

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Daily reminder that humans are the most carnivorous and bloodthirsty species of ape on the planet.

Not even being reddit right now, in a wild state, hunter-gatherer societies are much more bloodthirsty than chimp groups.They frequently go to war, and much more of their diet is meat based.

Humans are literally wild animals, and one of the most savage ape on Earth, anyone not taking that into account when looking at history and society is doing it wrong.

>>2480988
You say that as if its a bad thing. You would rather still be living in trees and getting eaten by tigers?

>>2480970
That's only true if you are sexually unappealing, otherwise the opposite.
Besides, the less rights women have the worse the sex is. Making women do big cums is almost as satisfying as doing big cums yourself. Emotional connection and mutual pleasure is what I look for in sex, if all I wanted to do is jizz I'd just jerk off. I do not want a submissive partner, I want an independent partner that keeps my head on straight for me.
>>2480916
Pointing out that here I am only considering the political extremes of the left and right. In the moderate middle class socialization and idenitiarian politics play a more pronounced role in forming ideology than the extremes where (socio-economic)-ecological systems play a bigger role

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>>2481015
>A tiger in africa?

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>>2481015
At least we wouldn't be at threat of extinction from our current sociological-ecological mismatch.
We still depend on ecological systems for survival, we are just detached from them because we buy them at the market instead of directly interacting with them. Killing the golden goose ya know

>>2481050
Don't worry, there are other planets for us to plunder, and new worlds to genocide brothers. We just need to build the right kind of star ships! The fun will never end!

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>>2481107
this.
I'm tired of hippies wasting money on this unimportant bullshit. Nothing can crush the human spirit. Remember, we put ham inside of cans :DD anything is possible with humanities superior innovation!1!

>>2478722
>46 chromosomes
>human

so are we actually retarded apes?

>>2480190
Extermely reductive. If the ""blacks"" come from a place with little social conflict and have all their needs met they will get along fine. Unless you left them cramped in there long enough for idenitarian conflict develop and reactionary ensues.
Literally nothing to do with skin color.

>>2481126
SPAM is one of the greatest inventions of mankind. I personally rank it 4th behind the iPod, cigarettes, and abortificents.

>>2481189
*reactionary games

>>2481126
HAM

>>2481206
IN

>>2481208
THE

>>2481211
CAN

>>2481189
The premise is that their needs aren't met in the stadium since there has been a disaster.

>>2478635
Obviously we are more like chimps.

>>2478638
Arguably it still happens with companies. And football teams. And armies. And political parties (which are usually mostly men).

But yes we've been like this for all of history, which is why the modern world is so fucked up.

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>>2481050
>tfw marine fish capture hasn't gone down because of conservation efforts, there just aren't fish in the ocean anymore
>tfw nearly all in tact marine ecosystems and large marine animals have disappeared
I'vebeen exteremly into marine biology since a toddler, demand my mom to read me animal encyclopedias before I could read. This shit plunged me deep into depression when I first found out about it. I still deal with extreme grief regularly, because it's not a passing event, it's the ongoing slaughter of everything I love in life, that's the terrestrial biosphere too. Glad I still have something left but the suffering doesn't end. Even the joy i still have in life is overcast with premonitory pain, most wildlife biologist are the same way.

>>2478722
>Put 5000 people, strangers all, in a big arena and nothing happens.

If they are black then they will attack each other. I am not joking. Africa is the most horrifically violent place on the planet.

>>2481308
It's too bad we were not able to domesticate whales, porpoises, and manatees for meat production instead of eating every last tiny fish out of existence.

>>2478722
>Put 5000 people, strangers all, in a big arena and nothing happens.
Pretty sure something would happen.

The 5000 people in the stadium question reminds me of the stadium filled with people after hurricane Katrina. They might not break out in violence immediately bit after a few days they will be knee deep in shit and blood and piss and looking for someone to blame.

>>2481150
nah that's just you

>>2481189
>a place with little social conflict and have all their needs met
Where is that place, exactly? Looking around, it's almost like blacks spread poverty and disorder wherever they go.

>>2480988
This. We are now considered an extinction event in the history of the earth, one of few.

>>2478635

Some days I think we're closer to Bili apes.

>>2481331
I wonder what whale tastes like.

>>2481581
Think of the word "blubber"

>>2481308
There is still hope, anon.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/03/09/stranding-enormous-dead-fin-whale-devon-coast-shows-whale-populations/

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Evolution is a myth. I thought we settled this before.

Creation is a scientific fact.

>>2481833
[citation needed]

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>>2481839
http://www.newgeology.us/presentation32.html
https://www.trueorigin.org/spetner1.php
https://www.trueorigin.org/creatheory.php
https://www.trueorigin.org/isakrbtl.php
http://www.evidentcreation.com/TRM-Logerr.html
http://creation.com/is-evolution-pseudoscience
http://darwins-god.blogspot.be/

>Kent Hovind debunks Evolution
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=shyI-aQaXD0

>Evolution is a myth
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gjvuwne0RrE

>Dr. Jonathan Sarfati destroys Evolution
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJ-3fP4H8Ss

>The Greatest Lie Ever Told
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1ufK04tjOI

>Overwhelming Evidence for a Global Flood
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lktmmd7YnD8

>Overwhelming Evidence that Dinosaurs lived with Man
http://www.genesispark.com/exhibits/evidence/historical/dragons/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=niDCq3TbvOo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6M1b36KbHs

>Darwinism's Downfall
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7IHO-QkmomY

Evolution has been debunked & refuted. Only idiots still believe in it.

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HERE'S THE STATE OF EVOLUTION TODAY: "Evolutionary theory itself is already in a state of flux… all the central assumptions of the Modern Synthesis (often also called Neo-Darwinism) have been disproven" - Professor Denis Noble, Evolutionist, Physiologist and Biologist, May 2013

1. Abiogenesis. They have given up on it and now say it's not part of evolution theory.
2. They are now admitting that they have no explanation for diversity. So now it's not evolution either.
3. They have given up on the fossil record since it looks like creation. So now they say they don't need the fossils.
4. Gould and associates say there is no gradualism (no transitionals). Stasis is the underlying factor in the fossils so it's not evolution either. 5. Random mutations and natural selection produce nothing so that's out too and they are rejecting it as evolution.
6. All they have left is the common ancestor monkey. The inability for "kinds" to interbreed destroys that one so it's not long for this world.
7. PE is now a failure so it's out as evolution as well.
8. The “tree of life” has also been rejected.

Looks like you were created by God after all.

>>2481877
wtf i hate darwin now

>>2481839
You just had to feed the troll, didn't you?

>all these anons crying over extintions of some ecosystems
Literally who gives a fuck. Life on earth has endured much harder tests than fucking humans. No matter what happens to us, life will pull through. There's no more value in current ecosystems than the ones prior to humans. Life changes and adapts.

The only reason to care about the ecosystem is because we need it to survive. If dont fix our shit up, it'll be suffering the consequences. Mind you, unless a giant asteroid blows up the earth before we can colonize other planets, humans will never go extint either.

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>>2482390
It isn't "some" ecosystems, it's the worst dying off of animal life since the K-T extinction event, except that we are the killer asteroid.
http://www.biologicaldiversity.org/programs/biodiversity/elements_of_biodiversity/extinction_crisis/
We're talking about some extinction, we're talking about mass-extinction, an even which has only happened 6 times in the history of life on Earth, and left it devastated for millions of years afterwards.

Sure, it wasn't as bad as, say, the Great Dying, when igniting hydrocarbons in the Siberian flats drove 90% of Earth life into extinction and reduced tetrapods down to a single area of Pangea in what is now Utah, but that still doesn't change the fact that it is the species at the top of the food chain who suffer when enough of the rungs below them have been knocked away, and we're the species at the top of the ecosystem currently in free-fall

>>2481189
You've clearly never been around them

>>2481472
Blacks aren't a collective, traditional socio-ecological systems involving Africans are well to do given that there is limited disturbance to the SES from the commercial economy or state intrest, which is very rare considering the whole of Africa has been heavily, and destructively exploited for centuries by those entities wanting bioresources/minerals/slaves/crops/workers/land/fisheries, you fucking name it and atleast thousands of Africans have died and entire cultures have disappeared in order for it to be stocked in consumer markets. Shit you probably just threw away half a bag of chips made with palm oil a west African government unilaterally decided to produce by cutting down aboriginal land so the state could get a loan from the world bank made possible with American and European protection and taxes, And the loan was probably spent on guns and ammunition produced with Arab-American-European state assets. So warlords can force Africans to fucking kill eachother to obtain rare earth minerals, that guess what are sold to China who has many problems aswell so American and European corporations can sell you a working cell phone.
Its almost like you are completely unaware of the powers that be and naively assume properties of things in the world around you as intrinsic to themselves, completely unaware of where they come from.
You're an idiot, I know you are not an idiot because you are you, you're an idiot because you don't know a fucking thing about the world that makes you. Africa is bad now, and the rest of the world is headed in the same direction. I hope you live to taste the irony when the third world doesn't have anything for you to leach prosperity off of.
>inb4 you mention slave descended Africans in the "devolped" world
Just don't, same shit different story.

>>2482595
I was in the DRC two months ago

>>2482647

Once again

/pol/ < people who go outside
(Super jealous btw, what was the occasion?)

>>2482595
Not him but I had a good experience with them. I went to college in Charleston where my choice was between hanging out with the black kids or the cowboys and honestly, it made me not give one single shit about skin color because those fucking rednecks were the worst kind of dumb ass paranoid control-freaks while the black guys just wanted to smoke weed and party without getting harassed by the police.

I shared an apartment with them, met their parents, attended their weddings. Never once encountered a /pol/ meme about them. In fact I learned more about the kind of people who makes /pol/ memes than I do about what message what their shitty, unsourced infographic was trying to convey.

>>2482664
Prospecting evolutionary ecology research in the new kabobo national reserve, I'll get to go back if everything goes right. Right now we are waiting on information from other researchers we are looking to collaborate with. Trying to scrape together potential funding and a team while making sure nobody has contracted some horrible infection unknown to science in the down time, everything is looking good. a magical place I'm honored to have experienced.

>>2481882
Lmao.
That quote means the role natural selection plays in evolution is in question, not its existence. NS is currently understood to play a secondary but crucial role in evolution.
Here is a very interesting paper on the topic published in January journal.frontiersin.org/article/10.3389/fevo.2017.00003/full
>1
Completly false
>2
This is so dumb I think I just lost my Ph.D.
>3.....
At first I thought you were a hard working troll but this is getting too borring to play with now. Disappointed.
Don't reply to me

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>>2482558
Good job, here have a life.
Isn't it sad how you have to appeal to utilitarian value to get people to care about life? It used to make me angry as a kiddo but now I'm mostly just sad for them

>>2482628
>Africa is bad now, and the rest of the world is headed in the same direction.
Because the African population is exploding. You're definitely right more and more of the world is going to look like Lagos Nigeria in fact London and Paris already do.

Human/Chimpanzee hybrid when?

>>2483666
Never, because humans are made in God's image and animals are not.

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How much of this characterization of bonobo society as feminist sex paradise is based on ethologist wishful thinking?

In the past anthropologists did the same to some human societies, like Margaret Meat presenting Samoa as a peaceful, sexually open utopia, which in turn influenced the sexual revolution, just to new research show that she was full of bullshit.

Then degenerates turned to hold up monkeys as a model instead.

>>2481825
Thanks
Any good news is great news, the ocean is tough. I'm worried that everything humans can obtain will be lost in the coming years.
Large fish have been hit the hardest. I get real fucked up everytime I think about life in the indo-pacific.

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>>2483675
Well if the progressives are working toward a society where all ills are resolved via mass orgies they sure are doing a horrible job at it as they've created a sexual aristocracy instead.

>>2483671

Well here in the real world, chimps and bonobos can make offspring (baby fertility unknown). Since humans, chimps, and bonobo share like 99% the same DNA, we should be able to make a humanzee.

>>2483658
Walk into any supermarket or household pantry in the commercial world and you can see Africa all over the shelfs

>>2483642
In order to get through to people, you have to learn how to curse them out in their own language.

>>2481021
Lol this, the only thing male dominated societies benefit are ugly or unfit men who otherwise wouldn't get much chances to pass on their DNA. It's pretty funny really, if we lived in some communist society where woman had complete social equality attractive men could basically acrue harems of woman who wanted to fuck them and impregnate a bunch of them without having to worry about stuff like child support like in capitalist societies. Also unwanted pregnancies would hardly be an issue with easy availability of contraceptives and abortions without social stigma as well.

Socially humans are more like chimps I think. Chimps are sadistic and creative. They'll do things like rip out your scalp just because it seems like an interesting thing to do.

But I believe humans are actually less sexually dimorphic than chimps. Whatever evolutionary pressures turned us into, well, human also seemed to calm down the whole male harem and violent competition arms race that most mammals have. No need for super strong males that are good at fighting (each other).

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>>2481882
Did God made animes so perfect ?

>>2484087
What are guns

>>2478663

We're descendants of primates you retard.

>>2487612

No, we ARE primates.

>>2483927
Harems literally were the norm for millennia because women won't fuck a man who isn't attractive and has high social status you moron.

Literally has nothing to do with capitalism nor communism, and has more to do with the fact that this is how primates like us organize themselves.

>>2485506
>What are guns
Way too recent to have had any evolutionairy effect at all

>>2487682

We're both.

>>2487682

It's all taxonomy anyway, we could classify ourselves and other animals any number of ways.

>>2484087
>Whatever evolutionary pressures turned us into, well, human also seemed to calm down the whole male harem and violent competition arms race that most mammals have.

There's some interesting theories on humans 'self domesticating' in the process of forming advanced societies. That is to say those of us who were violent thuggish retards generally actually did worse, even though 'in nature' they'd have done better. Generally gentler, more sociable traits began to thrive relative to violent, aggressive ones because one group could prosper by working together while the other just alienated themselves.

Of course that's not to say that violence wasn't used in civilized societies, but it was used in a more systematic way than the standard chimp-tier dominance structure.

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>>2481877
>that same creationcuck copypasta

>>2480765
>implying race is a social construct

>>2488202

See >>2488097

Racial classification is based in observable categories - different races ARE different - but we still invent the categories. We could do it in a variety of ways which would be scientifically valid but include and exclude different people.

A lot of the things we use to base race on are relatively superficial. We could create far better, far more specific 'racial' categories, but nobody would bother remembering them because it's a lot less intuitive than "he's black and his nose is big so he's a nig"

>>2481877
>trueorigin and youtube
>valid sources

Jesus Christ this is /pol/level ignorance

>>2488491
not even the average /pol/tard is that dumb

>>2482664
>>2482647
I grew up in an 80% black city.

Even the kids whos parents were lawyers/doctors ended up being pieces of shit scum.

The only "normal" black people I met were the weirdos who were outcast from their own community and sat around listening to metal and watching anime.

>>2478635
Chimp

>>2478635
yes, in fact are taxonomy is wrong
>Homo sapiens
should be
>Pan sapiens (I think)

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We're more like Bili Apes than either of them 2bh

>>2489844
Billie apes are supposed to be chimp gorilla hybrids I think

>>2483692
That means absolutely nothing, and no you can't. Most Europeans eats European grown foods

>>2489850
They're just (large) chimps that act like gorillas

>>2481189

Name a black place with no conflict, social or otherwise.

>>2490426

Bermuda.

>>2490459
>planes and ships that go past it just fucking disappear

next

>>2481581
It's gross.

>>2489875
> Most Europeans eats European grown foods
America has been detected

>>2490763
No, I'm European. Pick up any natural product in any European supermarket, and its from Europe

We are like men.
Last I checked summing up every atheistic theory we have and putting it to work as a complex system yielded a negative and catastrophic result, so do understand that said theories were wrong which resulted in the simulation approach gaining momentum.

>>2481150
As we can tell by looking at you, having extra chromosomes doesn't mean more developed

>>2489770
retard alert

Chimpanzees. Bonobos have only evolved that way because they have a unique habitat which limits competition with other species; if bonobos were introduced into an environment where they had to compete with chimpanzees they would be destroyed