Judaism

>>2365395
WTF are you asking?

Whether or not you should convert based on possible persecution?

Are you seriously this autistic?

>>2365395

Doubt that minorities will face the same amount of oppression that they did decades ago.

I think people will drop the idpol, considering the amount of autism that can be seen from SJWs to stormfags. Zionists will be no exception.

>>2365395
Why Judaism?

>>2365418

why is valuing your life autistic?
>>2365470

I like the fact their culture is based around education, and I also like how their God is more abstract, where as, in Christianity, a lot more people think God is just a guy with a big beard.

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>>2365516
Agree. Judaism is exactly like that, but have you considered about Islam?

Islam is the closest to the Judaism in the term of faith and practices. We believe that YHWH is the only true God and no imagery should be make of Him.

But the Jews have make Judaism an ethnic religion. You have to be born a Jew to become a Jew, while Islam is universal.

If you have the time, please watch this:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=6shMJeDh6zc

>>2366081
>But the Jews have make Judaism an ethnic religion. You have to be born a Jew to become a Jew,


Yeah, like Ruth!

>>2366081
Not op, but I have a question about islam... It's a requisite circumcition?

>>2365395
Just convert to reform

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>>2365516
>I also like how their God is more abstract, where as, in Christianity, a lot more people think God is just a guy with a big beard.
Have you even read the OT? YHWH is a petty af tribal deity. pic related. YHWH may not have a big beard in this depiction, but he does have a big dick

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kuntillet_%CA%BFAdschrud

>>2365395
>jews be oppressed in the future in the US or western world in general?
They will believe in their superiority so there will always be people who hate them for their arrogance. It's too ugly to ignore.

>>2366103
>convert to a form of "Judaism" that gets rid of Hebrew and all the other defining characteristics of Judaism

People only convert to reform Judaism so that they can claim that they were oppressed and are a minority. Pretty much all the major leftist "Jewish" groups that attack normal orthodox Judaism and Israel are reform movements

You can't become a halachial Jew and get a free trip if Israel if that's what you're after. I'm sure some of the more lax sects will honor your LARPing.

>>2366099
Yes BUT don't worry, mankind have invented the greatest medicine of all time, anesthetic.

You only feel a SLIGHT LITTLE pain, a FEW ant bite. I'm not kidding I promise. Even Jesus got circumcised.

Circumcision is also a healthy practice, here:
http://www.webmd.com/sexual-conditions/guide/circumcision

>>2366098
What I meant was the Jews as a whole.

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Are there any Jews here? Got a few questions.

>>2366166
>What I meant was the Jews as a whole.


No, what you meant is that your only knowledge of Judaism comes from /pol/ memes, and you have no fucking clue what you're talking about.

>>2366174

do you think converts are regarded/treated as equal by born jews?

>>2366215
Those that convert to orthodox Judaism are. Criticising a full orthodox conversion that takes a long time and is approved by the Rabbi would be very taboo and incorrect.

The Torah teaches that although Judaism is not a proselytising religion and doesn't openly seek converts, those that actually go through the process of conversion and keep Jewish laws out of their own free will are said to have a Jewish soul all along.

>>2366224
Are you a Jew? Don't you think that if Judaism really is the true religion, then shouldn't it be spread to all mankind?

What about the non-Judaism? Are they going to go to hell since no one told them that Judaism is the true religion?

I'm sorry for my previous post, I never met a Jew before. No hard feelings.

>>2366166
>circumscision is good for you!
fuck off, dicksnip

>>2366264
I provide links, read the health benefits. While the non-benefits, it says that it very low and can be prevented if done in clean and sterile place. Pain can be reduced with anesthetic.

>>2366118
>People only convert to reform Judaism so that they can claim that they were oppressed and are a minority

So what? A jew is a jew is a jew.

>>2366274
of course there are "health benefits"

just like there are "health benefits" to pulling all your teeth and replacing them with dentures so you don't get cavities

>>2366257
>are you a Jew

Yeah, although I'm not overly religious so someone correct me if I say anything wrong

>if Judaism really is the true religion, then shouldn't it be spread to all mankind?
>what about non-judaism? Are they going to hell because no one told them
Not really. In most other Abrahamic religions, such as Christianity or Islam, if someone doesn't convert to their religion then they go to hell. Judaism doesn't believe in 'hell' in the same way, and we also believe that G-d judges creed not kind.

If you study Judaism in depth, you'll see that it's a religion for the Jewish people. The Tanakh (old testament) is the story of the 'children of Israel', and the word for 'Jew' in Hebrew is identical to the word for 'Judean'.

For all intensive purposes, I suppose it is an ethnoreligion, but if someone really wanted to convert and put the effort into doing so then they would be accepted.

>>2366289
According to Judaism, are there hell?

What people goes to hell? Does non-Judaism go to hell?

>>2366302
>Traditional Judaism firmly believes thatdeath is not the end of human existence. However, because Judaism is primarily focused on life here and now rather than on the afterlife, Judaism does not have much dogma about the afterlife, and leaves a great deal of room for personal opinion. It is possible for an OrthodoxJew to believe that the souls of the righteous dead go to a place similar to the Christian heaven, or that they are reincarnated through many lifetimes, or that they simply wait until the coming of the messiah, when they will be resurrected. Likewise, Orthodox Jews can believe that the souls of the wicked are tormented by demons of their own creation, or that wicked souls are simply destroyed at death, ceasing to exist.

>>2366310
Ayy, so evil people go to hell and good people go to heaven, regardless of their religion?

>>2366330
No. Like it says
>it is possible for an orthodox Jew to believe
>it is possible

I don't believe in hell, and neither did my rabbis who taught me when I was growing up. No where in the Torah does it mention hell, therefore it is open to debate and opinion

>>2366337
Is the Old Testament is the same as the Torah?

Are you >>2366246?

Tbqh the persecution doesn't bother me. For my lifetime at least the Jews are probably safe outside of godforsaken Islamic countries.

Now the circumcision, that bothers me. I mean, yeah I want to take the leap of faith and live the holy life, but do I really want to be a cutfag?

>>2365470
Judaism is great
>God actually seems properly infinite, indivisible and awesome (in the non-meme sense) rather than just being a very contrived McGuffin for the universe.
>Moral guidelines that have been keeping the Jewish people alive for thousands of years despite being spread all over the planet
>Saved from annihilation at the zero hour countless times. Also control the world. Clearly god is helping them.
>Jesus is without a shadow of a doubt, not the messiah.

>>2366347
The Torah is the five books of Moses, which is slightly more than the Tanakh or old testament I think. And no that's not me

>>2366347
No, the Torah is the first five books of the Old Testament.

Yahweh is obviously a spook.

>>2366081
Firstly you understand that you can convert to judaism right? It's just not necessary or even encouraged.
God made a covenant with Noah telling him and by extension the rest of humanity what we should do if we want to remain in good standing with God and since God made that covenant, it's eternally binding between man and God. This is why conversion isn't necessary.
However as an act of love, God made an additional covenant, one which we as non jews are not made to follow, one which involves only the jews and God, in the form of the law. This is what it means by the hebrews or the jews as being the chosen people. If you've actually read the law which is known as the mizvot in hebrew, you will understand just how difficult it is to follow this law and furthermore you need to understand just how damaging it is to the nation of israel if a jew breaks just one of these mizvot, this is why it is not encouraged for a non jew to become a jew.

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>>2366352
Anon, the Golden Age of the Jews is during the Golden Age of the Muslim.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_age_of_Jewish_culture_in_Spain

Look, we're not your enemies. We believe that Moses is one of the mightiest messenger of God. We honor Moses, Aaron and Joshua just like the Jews honor them. We love them dearly.

Let's not fight, ok?

>>2366354
>>2366355
So the Torah is the five books of Moses in the OT 100%? Or do you view the five books in the OT corrupted?

>>2366385
Again, no hard feelings about my previous post.

>>2366396
I don't have a problem with Muslims. I just think that Muslim countries specifically at this point in time have quite widespread anti-Semitic feelings.

>So the Torah is the five books of Moses in the OT 100%?
Yes, the books in the old testament are lifted straight from Jewish canon.

>>2366385
Soooo, why follow the law if you don't believe in hell anyway?

>>2366416
Because otherwise God will punish us on Earth. e.g Hitler.

>>2366416
Well I don't follow the law because I'm not a jew and I don't want to speak about motivations since I can't speak for the jews.
One reason why I wanted to follow the law back when I was considering conversion is because I considered it as a way I could show my love of God to God and also since the law is so perfect.
If I read your post right, you're implying that following the law seems pointless if God doesn't threaten us right? imo there is still a threat without an explicit hell since God is all powerful and punishes our transgression with judgement.
Again this is just my opinion as an outsider to the jews.

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>>2366423
>>2366413
>>2366385
>>2366355
>>2366354
You guys are still waiting for the Messiah, right?

Or have you given up on that?

>>2366407
Assuming that you're the muslim who has been posting in this thread I made that post because I don't think you understand the position of judaism correctly.
>Don't you think that if Judaism really is the true religion, then shouldn't it be spread to all mankind?
>Are they going to go to hell since no one told them that Judaism is the true religion?
You don't see how my post addresses those points?

>>2366448
What about Islam? It's the closest to the Jews in term of faith and practices.

>>2366452
>You guys are still waiting for the Messiah, right?
Yes.

>>2366457
Yes, from what I gather, Judaism doesn't seek converts.

Believe in afterlife, but still debating whether or not hell exist.

Non-Jews can enter Judaism, but not recommended nor discourage.

Punishment exist in the worlds if they don't follow the law.

I think that's about it, unless I'm missing something?

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>>2366473
Why do you reject Jesus and Muhammad?

They both honor Moses. They both worship the same God as Moses.

They both pray just like Moses and Aaron, fell on their face and pray to god:

Matthew 26:39
Going a little farther, he(Jesus) fell with his face to the ground and prayed...

Jesus's teachings is NOT the teaching of the Church today. Jesus said that he came to FULFILL the Mosaic Law, not to abolish it.

So why reject both of them?

>>2366473
Oh, and you guys believe that the Torah is preserve, right?

>>2366511
>Why do you reject Jesus and Muhammad?

>Jesus
Because the messiah has a very strict set of requirements and standards (moreso than most Jews) that Jesus simply did not meet. We're still living in exile without our king or temple, there's still plenty of war and suffering in the world, there's still non-Jews and non-Noahides, if Jesus is really the son of God (a very un-Jewish idea to begin with) he couldn't possibly be a patrilineal descendent of David, there's still people who deny their crimes against Israel, we don't have knowledge of the Torah beamed directly into our brains by god so we still have to study it normally instead, there's still barren land on Earth, and so forth.

>inb4 but in the next life . . .
>inb4 but the second coming . . .
That's not what the messiah is about. That's like me claiming to be the second coming of Jesus then promptly dying without anything that revelations said would happen happening but it's okay because my followers will posthumously justify this.

>Muhammad
Very simply because Islam violates the Torah. A prophet of God shouldn't contradict earlier prophets.
>inb4 Muhammad didn't contradict earlier prophets, their messages were just corrupted over time.
This is where we disagree. Jews don't believe this happened.

>>2366521
Can you rephrase that?

>>2366553
As in do you believe the Torah now is the exact Torah in the time of Moses? Exactly identical? Without a word different?

>>2366571
Not necessarily. But we do believe that the laws contained within the Torah are the exact some of those at the time of Moses.

>>2366578
Ayy, thanks f a m

Are there any Judaism General on /his/ often?

>>2366170
id take a gander and say >>2366224 is one ask him

>>2366608
Occasionally, but any time it happens you can be sure that at some point it will degenerate into stormfag and/or christfag shitposting.

>>2366612
Well, you do kill their God.

But then again, they claim Jesus was destined to be crucified. So I don't know which side to blame.

>>2366658
Yeah but they basically think that's a good thing since now he died for their sins so really they should be grateful that we killed him.

>>2366511
Because neither of them fulfill the requirements of being the Jewish messiah, and neither of them did anything positive for the Jewish people in general.
>>2366612
This. I suppose that's expected on 4chan

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>>2366672
Yes, but on what charges do you kill him? On blasphemy?

Jesus never said he is God. Nor did he said he's divine. The term "Son of God" are also used for Adam, David, Israel, People of Nepehilm, ect.

Moses, Satan, Jews even called in the Old Testament. I can give you bible verses for all of my claim if you want.

Jesus said he came to fulfill the law of the prophet. He said keep the law and salvation is yours.

Why hate him?

>>2366701
*are even called God in the Old Testament

>>2366701
>Jesus never said he is God.
John 8:54-59. Cross reference with Exodus 3:13-14

>>2366687
Anon, Moses also says the same to the Jews.

Deuteronomy 9:24
You have been rebellious against the LORD ever since I have known you.

I'M NOT SAYING that Jews should go to hell. I'm saying that you should acknowledge your ancestors mistakes and DON'T be like them.

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>>2366714
>John 8:54-59
I AM WHO I AM? It's greek, while in Exodus it's Hebrew.

While it's not known what "I AM" in greek, you must agree that it use special greek, agree?

But this is NOT the case. It's "ego eimi". It's used MULTIPLE place in the Bible by people OTHER than Jesus. So it's not "I AM" like the Christians claim to be.

Agree?

>>2366722
Okay but Jesus is still not the messiah. The Jews worshipping the golden calf is as bad to me as worshipping a false messiah

>>2366730
*but you must agree

Also, John the Baptist used the exact same greek in John 1:21, but why aren't any Christians worship him?

>>2366732
Jesus never claimed to be god. He ask you to worship the only True God, YHWH.

It's the Christians fault for this misunderstanding, not Jesus.

>>2366733
Some people do worship John the Baptist, it's called Mandaeism

>>2365395
Converts though always seem insincere.
It's a romanticism of judaism and jewishness based on stereotypes. I don't consider converts ethnically jewish because they aren't.
And this seems to upset them and then they will mention some ancient jew who had convert ancestry, but forget those jews were still of semitic ancestry. Usually a convert from a related tribe.

>>2366739
Okay but that still doesn't make him a messiah. People were already worshipping G-d before Yeshua came along.

>>2366743
Holy shit, really? Damn I never knew that.

But again, my point still stands. The exact greek is used in multiple place in the Bible. Thus NOT THE SAME as "I AM" in Exodus.

Thus Jesus not claiming to be God.

>>2366739
So what's the significance of Jesus?

If he's just a regular old rabbi trying to reinforce the Torah what exactly is special about him? That's what every rabbi has been doing since forever.

>>2366759
The context of the phrase is very important.
>Then the Jews said to Him, “You are not yet fifty years old, and You have seen Abraham?” 58“Truly, truly, I tell you, Jesus declared, “before Abraham was born, I am!”
He's not just saying "I am" for the sake of it. He's saying he is and always was, which deliberately channels God's words to Moses.

>>2366760
He's a prophet, just like Moses.

>>2366769
Wait, are you saying that the "I am" is the same in Exodus?

>>2366770
>be Moses
>lead the Jewish people out of Egypt, split the sea, lead them in the desert

>be Jesus
>never really do anything of note and then get killed
>the religion that you spawn then prosyletises, throws laws out the Torah and persecutes your own people

>>2366770
I don't think he is though. Jesus doesn't really meet the Jewish standards of a prophet either.

http://www.askmoses.com/en/article/248,2100910/What-are-the-requirements-of-a-true-prophet.html

>>2366775
No, obviously because Jesus and Moses spoke different languages.

I'm saying that Jesus is deliberately channelling God in Exodus and saying "Yes, I'm god" is exactly what he was doing.

>>2366770
Blasphemy.

Jesus is the Son of God.

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>>2366790
Anon, let's look at the question:

“You are not yet fifty years old, and You have seen Abraham?”

Now look at the answer:
“before Abraham was born, ****YHWH name*****!”

Does it make sense for Jesus to say God's name out of nowhere? It seems out of place. Agree?

Also, does the question ask whether Jesus is divine? Or what is his name? Or is Jesus God? NO.

Does the out-of-place-God's-name statement answers the Jews question? No.

The statement is IRRELEVANT to the question. Agree? Thus it is NOT "I AM" in Exodus. Thus Jesus is not claiming to be God.

It's just the normal "I am".

>>2366811
So is Adam, David, Israel, Jacob, People of Nepehilm, ect, according to the Bible. Check Old Testament usage in:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Son_of_God_(Christianity)

David is even called BEGOTTEN Son of God, according to the Bible.

What's make Jesus different from the other Sons?

>>2366790
Also, the context of Jesus' words were about seeing Abraham before he was even born. This is nothing new in the Bible. In the Old Testament, we read:
"Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you apart; I appointed you as a prophet to the nations. (From the NIV Bible, Jeremiah 1:5)"

Since Jesus was created from the Word of GOD Almighty, and since also our human-spirits are also created from the Holy Spirit, and since Jesus was a Word from the Word of Allah Almighty, then it is quite possible for him to have known, or seen the records of the future human-creations that were going to be created on earth, such as Abraham and others. After all, Allah Almighty uses Angels, Spirits and other created Beings of His to create creations under His Command. Things in the spiritual realm are different. Existence in the spiritual world, including our spirits, is Eternal. Our earthly bodies are not Eternal. So, Jesus having a prior knowledge about Abraham's spirit is nothing unusual in the spiritual world.

>>2366826
Now you're just being thick.

>“before Abraham was born, ****YHWH name*****!”
This is the thing "I am" is not God's name. It's a declaration of his nature. God is saying he simply is to Moses thus does not need to introduce himself. Likewise Jesus is saying that he knows Abraham because he is and always was. This means that either a) Jesus is some kind of divine entity that has always coexisted with God outside of the material world or b) Jesus is God himself. Given the choice of words he seems to be suggesting the latter.

>Also, does the question ask whether Jesus is divine?
Yes, that's exactly what the question poses. If he's like 30 yet somehow personally knows Abraham then obviously he's suggesting something divine is going on.

>Does the out-of-place-God's-name statement answers the Jews question? No.
Yes it does. To put the exchange in other words "How do you know Abraham", "Oh well that's because I'm god".

>It's just the normal "I am".
Then Jesus is a fucking idiot that can't speak property and so we should pay him no reverence.

Then sentence would make absolutely no sense, it's just a random phrase tacked on to the end for no reason. Either Jesus is literally retarded, or he actually did mean something by it.

>>2366840
Okay, but that's supremely heretical and is absolutely grounds to execute him for blasphemy.

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Does Jews accept the Psalm and Song of Solomon as the words of God?

Because I know that David and Solomon was given scripture, and they both are acknowledged by the Jews.

Do you accept them?

I only know that Jews accept the Torah and the Talmud. Are there any other books that the Jews accept?

>>2366833
Because according to the gospels Jesus is literally the biological son of God born to no other father.

>>2366848
Literally why? Do you not know that prophet are given miracles? Like Moses turn his stick into a snake?

It's just a miracle given to him by God. That's all.

>>2366853
David? He is begotten, which literally means biologyly.

>>2366844
In Exodus, it's actually make sense.

"Who are you?"
"I am who I am. Don't bother about my name. Just go preach to the Pharaoh"

But in Jesus case:

"He is yet finish his work, and you have pay him?"
"Before he was hired, ***Boss name***"

To me it doesn't make sense whatsoever.

>>2366855
Because it totally violates the Torah.

>It's just a miracle given to him by God. That's all.
Why would God do that?
God turned Moses' staff into a snake to flex his power to the Pharaoh.

What exactly are you suggesting God wants to accomplish by making Jesus in such a way that will be totally imperceivable to anyone?

>>2366870
Then why follow Jesus?

>>2366783
Ayy, but remember. He help to cure the blind and the lepers by God permission. A prophet was given miracles. And this is the miracles he performs.

John the Batisp, I think you Jews accept him as a prophet of God, performs no miracles. Yet he is a prophet.

So miracles aren't a qualification to become a prophet.

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>>2366873
He is a prophet of God. So we must follow him.

Besides, he said he came to fulfill the Mosaic Law. Which is your law, so just accept him as a Prophet, will ya?

>>2366871
It make things easier for people to accept Jesus as God.

Moses was sent to people that are expert in witchcraft. So God gave him witchcraft-like miracles.

Jesus is also in the same case. His people was expert in medicine. So God gave him medicine-like miracles so that it's easier for people to accept him as God.

Agree?

>>2366853
Adam?

>>2366928
God made Adam from the Earth, he doesn't have biological parents. Jesus supposedly does however, Mary and God.

>>2366785
Ok I gave up. What requirements does Jesus fails to meet?

I'm sorry. But please just give me example and maybe I can answer it.

>>2366930
Then how about david? God said to david:

Psalm 2:7
I will declare the decree: the LORD hath said unto me, Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee.

>>2366850
>>2366850
>>2366850
Really? "Yes or no" answer would be suffice.

>>2366925
>Besides, he said he came to fulfill the Mosaic Law
What does this even mean?
Christians love throwing this phrase around but what exactly does it mean to "fulfil" the law?

Does it mean to exemplify it? Because Jesus absolutely did not do that.
Does it mean to complete it? Because that's very heretical to suggest that it was incomplete before despite God saying multiple times that it is.


>So God gave him medicine-like miracles so that it's easier for people to accept him as God.
Existing immaterially but consciously for 4000 years is not a medicine-like miracle.

Not to mention it's a "miracle" that is totally imperceivable to anyone but Jesus. Which sounds like cult leader tactics.

>>2366850
"word of God" isn't the right words, but they are holy.

>>2366942
>Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee.
>this day
God is basically taking David on as his adopted son from this day forth. Not unlike the Christian concept of being "born again".

Obviously David was not literally conceived on that day. David was conceived some decades earlier to human parents.

>>2366932
Because Jesus contradicts, ignores and even outright denies various parts of the Torah constantly.

>Therefore, if a man, whether a gentile or a Jew, arises and performs signs and wonders, and says that G-d sent him to add to, or take away from, a mitzvah, or to institute a new mitzvah which we did not hear from Moses, or says that the commandments with which we have been commanded are not for eternity but are meant only for a temporary period, then he is a false prophet, for he has come to undermine the prophecy of Moses. His punishment is death by strangulation, which is the punishment for deliberately speaking in the name of G-d without having been commanded to do so. G-d told Moses that all the commandments are for eternity, and no man can accuse G-d of being deceitful.

Jesus is a false prophet of the highest order in this respect. The only mistake was not killing him in the right way.

>>2366945
>law
Jesus said:

Matthew 5:17
"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.

>miracle
As I said, miracles only to make people easier for people to believe him as a prophet of God, nothing more.

>>2366947
Do Jews follow them? Do they believe that those are infallible?

>>2366951
Jesus was NEVER called begotten, according to the most ancient bible manuscripts.

>>2366966
>Jesus said:
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I know what Jesus said.

But what does it mean?

>As I said, miracles only to make people easier for people to believe him as a prophet of God, nothing more.
But no one saw it but him. How does that make it easier? As I said it just looks like something every cult leader and their dog could say.

>Jesus was NEVER called begotten, according to the most ancient bible manuscripts.
In reality he probably was though. Probably to human parents.

>>2366966
>Do Jews follow them?
Yes
>Do they believe that those are infallible?
I'm sure many Jews have different opinions on that. In Judaism it's only necessary to acknowledge the immutability of the Torah.

>>2366974
>begotten
Claim must be backed by proof

>>2366978
Do Jews accept them as valid arguments?

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>>2366974
>>2366960
>JESUS AND THE MOSAIC LAW(1/2)

Jesus said in Matthew 5:

18 For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, """"""""""NOT THE SMALLEST LETTER, NOT THE LEAST STROKE OF A PEN, WILL BY ANY MEANS DISAPPEAR FROM THE LAW UNTIL EVERYTHING IS ACCOMPLISHED.""""""""

19 Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

20For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven.

Don't murder, don't do adultery, love your neighbor, an eye for an eye, ect are ALL Jesus's teachings. You can read it here:

http://biblehub.com/niv/matthew/5.htm

>>2365516
>I also like how their God is more abstract, where as, in Christianity, a lot more people think God is just a guy with a big beard.
What the fuck prevents you from ignoring the retards and imagining God as more abstract or converting to one of those quasi-deist denominations? That's such a stupid fucking reason to change religions.

>>2367057
>Claim must be backed by proof
If we accept that Jesus was a human who walked on Earth naturally our intuition tells us that he probably got here the same way everyone else did. Sperm into the womb.

Now if you'd like to suggest that he was conceived cosmically by God then we will need proof.

>Do Jews accept them as valid arguments?
I suppose it depends on the argument you're making. If you're about to lift part of it literally and ignore all Rabbinical tradition on the matter then probably not.

>>2367078

>18 For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, """"""""""NOT THE SMALLEST LETTER, NOT THE LEAST STROKE OF A PEN, WILL BY ANY MEANS DISAPPEAR FROM THE LAW UNTIL EVERYTHING IS ACCOMPLISHED.""""""""
Yeah, that's what he said. But that's not what he did, that's just another example of Jesus contradicting himself.


>You have heard that it was said, ‘Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.’[a] 39 But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also.
Right here Jesus in black and white tells us to ignore the Torah and follow his new teaching instead. This is naked false prophecy and by all rights according Mosaic law for this he should be put to death.

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>>2366974
>>2366960
>JESUS AND THE MOSAIC LAW (2/2)

A learned man of the Jew came to Jesus and ask him what commandment is the first of all. Jesus said:

Mark 12:29
"The most important one," answered Jesus, "is this: 'Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one.

EXACTLY LIKE MOSES ANSWERS

Deuteronomy 6:4
Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God, the LORD is one.

Jesus told a law-abiding Jews to KEEP THE COMMANDMENTS in order to gain eternal life in Matthew 19:17. Here, read the chapter:

http://biblehub.com/niv/matthew/19.htm

See? Jesus came to continue the law, NOT abolish it.

The teaching of the Church today is because of Paul, not Jesus.

>>2367083
He's a Christian?

>>2367104
If you're going to make an argument make an argument.

If you're going to schizophrenically shit up the thread I'm not going to humour you.

>>2367095
Doea this answer your question?

https://www.gotquestions.org/Jesus-and-the-Law.html

>>2367109
Sorry, I was making that post before I updated the thread. My fault.

>>2367128
I don't have a question.

On this Jesus minces no words, he would like to alter the Torah. And God is clear that anyone with any such intentions is a false prophet. There is no grey area. He is not clarifying anything, he is not revealing any deeper meaning to us, he is explicitly saying that the Torah is wrong and he is right. When he says "You have heard it said . . ." he is quoting the Torah ad verbatim and telling us explicitly not to follow it. That is totally inexcusable.

On this Jesus is clear, all Christian justification for this is pure mental gymnastics to compensate for the fact that the new testament makes no fucking sense.

>>2367157
Fine, let me ask you, do any works are allowed in the Sabbath day?

>>2367172
>do any works are allowed in the Sabbath day?
Can you rephrase that?

>>2367180
According to Judaism, can any work be done on the Sabbath day?

Does Judaism law permit that?

>>2367222
No.

Unless it's to save someone's life.

>>2366928
In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Jesus existed before creation.

>>2367240
What is begotten?

It's LITERALLY MEAN TO BROUGHT INTO EXISTENCE.

Jesus is BEGOTTEN, according to Christians. Which mean he brought into existence, which mean he have a beginning.

Which mean he is NOT ETERNAL.

>>2367268
Heresy.

>>2367240
>>2367274
>>2367268
Also sorry if I sound rude. I mean no hard feelings. I ask you to seek the Truth, as Jesus commands us to do.

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>>2367230
You know what, I got nothing. I guess the link in >>2367128 provide a valid argument.

Regarding law, don't you think there's a few exceptions?

Like you said that saving lives are allowed on Sabbath day, when Moses said ANY works are not allowed.

Also like how David is allowed to eat Shewbread, but the bread ONLY lawful for the priest? Here:
https://www.google.com/amp/s/hystar.wordpress.com/2009/02/15/why-was-david-allowed-to-eat-the-shewbread/amp/?client=safari

And David was a prophet, so he should follow the law. But it seems that he broke it. Unless there's an exception.

I guess what I meant to say was maybe the "an eye for an eye" also have exception? I don't know. I don't want to think anymore.

I just want to eat cake and play call of duty while drown myself in mountain dew. I'm leaving. I hope I can make solid argument about this in the future if I recognize you here.

Anyway, thanks for compromising with me. You're the MVP.

Also, thank you Jew anons. You're the MVP.

>>2367432
Not the guy you're responding to, but:

>Like you said that saving lives are allowed on Sabbath day, when Moses said ANY works are not allowed.

That's not exactly true. Moses did so allow for temporary abrogation of certain laws when exigent circumstnaces demanded it. I can't think of any for the Sabbath off the top of my head, but they didn't do the Paschal sacrifice in the desert, when Moses was acting as a de facto king,, and he never seemed to have a problem with it.

Moses, in fact, never puts down the specifics as to what counts as "work" and what doesn't on the Sabbath, and that seemed to be kept oral for some time.

>Also like how David is allowed to eat Shewbread, but the bread ONLY lawful for the priest?

Again, he really shouldn't by the four letters of the law.

>And David was a prophet,

No, he wasn't. Who gave you that idea?

> But it seems that he broke it.

He broke the various laws lots of times. The incident with Bathsheba and arranging to have her husband killed,even though Uriah was one of his staunchest supporters, springs to mind.

>I guess what I meant to say was maybe the "an eye for an eye" also have exception?

It's generally understood to be metaphorical these days, yes.

>>2366081
I'm not really into suicide attacks though