Why was Nobunaga a westaboo?

Because guns>swords
The real question is why does Japan portray him as a literal demon? Was it because he killed those dumb monks that were in his way and involved in the conflicts?

>>2228210
The Japanese expected warfare to be carried out in a certain way. Nobunaga didn't care for the traditional limits on warfare and just did whatever he thought expedient

>>2228132
At the time the West had superior culture, technology, and weaponry. It was also exotic and most people love exotic stuff.

>>2228210
>Why portray him as a demon.
He backstabbed his sister's husband and attacked them after making a deal with them, and some other shady shit.

Japan would've benefited from him being Shogun and replacing the Emperor though modernizing even earlier, and having large changes that wouldn't stagnate it for a long time.

>>2228210
>>2228223
>>2228227

Was Nobunaga the most "people who did nothing wrong" person in history?

>>2228210
He didn't give a shit about "the rules" of diplomacy and war and the traditional ethics of Sengoku Japan. He was angry, overambitious and played "dirty". He was aggro in his interpersonal relations as well. Kind of a cunt.
A "the end justifies the means, and I'll win no matter what it takes" kinda guy.

tl:dr Not the "honourable lord" image the Japanese have in mind when it comes to great men in their history.

>>2228132
he was so based

>>2228210
He was a brutal, angry man who hated Buddhism and was friendly with foreigners.

>>2228210
He was basically sane in a country of retards

>>2228210
The Japanese treatment of Nobunaga is complicated. There are copious representations of him in both a positive and negative light throughout the arts, probably stemming from the dissonance of him being both the 'father' of modern Japan, for lack of a better term, and a kind of mega-dickwad towards other people while he achieved that position.

>>2228281
But most of the Japanese greats are cunts who didn't quite play by the rules, including Tokugawa Ieyasu.

There seems to be some misunderstanding of Japanese culture about this guy. Japanese historiography doesn't really "demonize" Oda Nobunaga in the sense that word would normally carry in Western culture. There's no Christian monarch ideal to live up to here. He is portrayed as unusually brutal, but that doesn't really carry a moral judgement. His portrayal in Japanese history is usually positive - again, not with a moral judgement as a Good Guy, but in an awe of his achievements.

It should also be remembered that the Tokugawa who finally emerged triumphant in the period were ultimately on good terms with Nobunaga and weren't interested in smearing him after his death either.

Broadly speaking in most Asian cultures you are allowed to be a brutal cunt so long as you bring results and your transgressions aren't just some petty disloyalty or cowardice. Hell, note how central brutal pragmatism is to legends like Miyamoto Musashi.

He's only a cartoonish villain in video games, and even there it's mostly for the coolness factor. tl;dr: Nobunaga being an evil demon is a meme.

>>2229642
Don't forget also that his personality and physical appearance have also been changed a bit in pop culture to better fit with the Romance of the Three Kingdom's depiction of Cao Cao, as the two are believed to be a bit similar.

As such he has a bit more of a villainous reputation.

>>2228132
When he inherited Owari, it was a smallish domain without any strong alliances with hostile neighbors and fractious clan politic. The port in the domain would sometimes host Portugese merchants or other Japanese merchants with Portugese merchandise. He was exposed to, and was fascinated by them. He was also quite annoyed by the traditional Buddhist cultural/political institutions since he was young (so the story goes) that he saw Western ideas as a good counterbalance to that.

>>2228132
His facial features are very European/Caucasian, I don't see many Japanese like this nowadays, what the actual fuck?

File: Odanobunaga.jpg (90KB, 342x400px) Image search: [Google]

90KB, 342x400px

>>2228132
>all the stuff the portugese brought along presumably looked exotic to him
>good relations = useful technology
>presence of christianity keeps buddhism from getting too powerful

>>2231239
It was drawn by a Jesuit artist (Giovanni Niccolò) a couple of years after Nobunaga died.

File: __demon_archer_and_heshikiri_hasebe_fate_series_koha_ace_and_touken_ranbu_drawn_by_ruchi__cf2628029a72e5555ce21b4930b9bc31.jpg (646KB, 700x875px) Image search: [Google]

646KB, 700x875px

>>2228210
Because he called himself one.

>>2229534
hurrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr what a "witty" analysis

>Akechi Mitsuhide did nothing wrong

>>2231553
That's a misconception. When he referred to himself as a demon, it wasn't in the Western idea of a demon.

He was referring a Buddhist dirty, The Demon of the Sixth Heaven, which represents greed. And he did so jokingly in a letter to Shingen Takeda who had called him greedy.

Christians were persecuted in Japan for their association with the west obviously, but were they hated at all for association with Nobunaga?

Christian was allowed at first. But once they gained a certain believers, they started destroying Buddhist temple and statues, which was a huge no no at that time.

>>2235874
>they started destroying Buddhist temple and statues
what the fuck, why?

>>2235888
Iconoclasm is a thing

You have to remember Christians were literally ISIS tier

It used to be that we called Muslims backwards savages stuck in the middle ages

It's only recently that the conservative mostly Christian reactionaries have changed the narrative

>>2235900
I didn't realize iconoclasm lasted that long for Christians. I thought it was only really a thing one thousand years ago in the Byzantine empire.

>>2235888
It was by the orders of Omura, a converted daimyo. It's not known why he did it, but given the times it was probably to solidify his rule over his domain and gain the support of the portugese. It didn't go well.

>>2235900
It's a bit much to suppose that a japanese guy with jesuit ties would be a follower of a long dead byzantine movement or recently dead protestant movement, isn't it?

>>2235947
Iconclasm is a thing in general. It isn't even restricted to Christianity or Abrahamic religions.

>>2236027
Sure. But in the Japanese context, it's a bit out there. In the catholic context, which the jesuits were, it was especially out there.

>>2236034
How is it out there? Iconoclasm is destroying religious shit you don't like.

>>2236042
Iconoclasm isn't just fucking up other peoples religious icons, it's specifically the icons of your religion on the grounds that it ought not have icons in the first place.