ITT: Good guys who are misunderstood

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They way he is attacked by both the Left and the Right, you would think someone would take the time to read his books.

>>2038655
He is an amoral and unethical man. Which is what makes him great, but people like to cling to their spooks.

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>defending states rights is somehow villainous.

>>2038633
Wouldn't call him good, but not bad either

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>>2038633

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>>2038633
>chemical warfare in Ethiopia
>to fight people with spears and horses

I get he was trying to be extra sure he was going to beat them since they got BTFO the first time, but still.

Other than that I have a lot of respect and admiration for Mussolini.

>>2038724

Because he's the hero Gotham deserves, but not the one it needs right now, so we'll hunt him. Because he can take it, because he's not a hero. He's a silent guardian, a watchful protector, a Dark Knight.

>>2038655
his books are fantastic. I have so much admiration and respect for kissinger.

>>2038655
I don't understand how people hail him as a hero of realism when he literally accomplished nothing.

>Bombing campaigns in Cambodia and Laos
failed
>Invasion of Cambodia
failed
>Chinese Triangulation
a monkey couldve done that
>Genocide in Bangladesh
pointless/failed

>>2038633
How exactly was he good? I'm not saying he was bad either, I'd just genuinely like to know

>>2038744

I wouldn't say bringing China in from the cold was pointless. In fact, I would call it the biggest U.S. foreign policy victory in its history.

At a time when imperial socialism was threatening the entire world, he devised a method to mitigate the risks.

>>2038796
He was the first man to recognize the Vatican as an independent state.

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>>2038796
>Got rid of mafia
>Invented social security
>Better educational system for Italy
>Created many jobs
>Improved infrastructure in Italy and colonies
>Was a good colonial ruler (except from his brutality in taking Ethiopia)
>Respected by many others, like Churchill, until WW2
>Crushed threat of Communism in Italy
>Gave Church authority because he believed in a moral society, not because he was religious

>>2038900
Really?
Can you tell me any more? I'd like especially to know about the social security thing.

>>2038633
Would he be one of the most respected figures of the 20th century if instead of ignoring everyone's advice and going after Ethiopia, he had joined Britain and France in stopping Germany?

>>2038683
>defending slavery is somehow villainous

>>2038919
Just a friendly reminder that slavery was technically outlawed in the south before the north.

>>2038914
Now that I look over it, I don't know if he invented it so fourth, but he definitely introduced it in Italy, and was probably one of the first to introduce it in Europe.

>Pension schemes
>Welfare
>Compensation for workers
>Education was made compulsory

>>2038958
>Welfare
wtf i hate il duce now

>>2038740
>to fight people with spears and horses
Ethiopia had a fucking air force

>>2038949
irrelevant

>>2038958
All of these things are actually bad

>>2039065
/pol/ please go.

>>2039087

I didn't know that 'stealing = bad' was a /pol/ opinion

>>2039065
>I oppose things because socialists would also do it

Take this hypothetical situation, /pol/, you work hard all your life but when you become too old to do the trade you did all your life, there was no pension scheme to help you. Or, you lose your job because the factory you work at gets burnt to the ground and there is no welfare to help you in your transitional period. Or your children become illiterate because there is no school for them.

>>2039109
>implying /pol/tards would ever work or would allow the state to educate their kids

>>2038949
Just a friendly reminder that it was Northerners who outlawed slavery in the south.

>>2039109

>you work hard all your life but when you become too old to do the trade you did all your life, there was no pension scheme to help you.

Get a gun and rob your neighbour

>you lose your job because the factory you work at gets burnt to the ground and there is no welfare to help you in your transitional period.

Get a knife and hold up a store

>your children become illiterate because there is no school for them.

Kidnap a teachers kids and force them to work for you.

It's quite easy to come up to solutions for societal problems if your allowed to use force.

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>>2038633
>>2038900
>fascism

its like cuckoldry the ideology

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>>2039065
And so are babies, right?

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>>2039160
>anti-fascists have been 15 year old edgelords since the 1930s
Really makes you think...

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>>2039158
I bet you're an unironic ancap

>>2039186
In all fairness, so have fascists. Both the Italian fascists and the Nazis were reportedly extremely popular among high school students, to greater degree than with any other social group

>>2039045
of approximately 2 bi planes

I'm serious

>>2039188

Nope. Socialist. The law should apply equally for all.

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>>2039268
Doesn't surprise me, to be honest. Socialists basically hate the working class nowadays.

source: Hollande's labour laws

>>2038660
>spooks
>>>/leftypol/

>>2038919

>implying innate human rights exist
>implying that those unable or unwilling to keep themselves free deserve freedom

>>2038958
Pretty sure Germany pioneered the concept of Social Security about 50 years earlier.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otto_von_Bismarck#Social_legislation

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>>2039196
Ofc, they are reactionary ideologies that attract the active generation.

t: pro fascist (at least on some sense)

>>2039158
You do realize a functioning society is a prerequisite to being able to use your "solutions"? which you apparently dont like?

drink a tall glass of acid my man!

>>2040230

My point is that none of these are solutions. Any society that calls them one but only if the government does it cannot be referred to as 'functioning'.

We cannot continue to ignore the violence of the state.

>>2040239
cite me 10 sources that proves this point

>>2038900
>be mussolini
>give authority to church because church helped you get there
>replace people in jobs with partisans
>be incompetent
>lose
>get hanged

>>2038740

Could you explain what specifically you admire about his actions in government or leading up to government?

It seemed more like he achieved very little and got railroaded by his supporters into ruining his nation.

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>>2040252
Well, mainly his ideas. I read the Doctrine of Fascism and it was a great insight as to what Benito believed in and what he wanted Italy to be.

He was rather benevolent towards all people, including blacks and Jews, until he was in the position where he wanted a stronger alliance with Hitler, and passed the Manifesto of Race in 1938.

In terms of what he achieved, he might not have done much on a global scale, but in Italy he definitely repaired it from the state it was in at the end of WW1. While his conquests and performance in WW2 were humiliating and pathetic in some ways, he cared very much for his people and his homeland and was always trying his best for the Italian people.

I believe if he stayed neutral, like Franco, he could have been in a better situation.

>>2038900
IIRC, wasn't Social Security a Prussian concept?

>>2038917
>Instead of
Germany and Japan were the biggest supporters of Ethiopia to the extent they even gave them material aid

Whereas Italy was just repeating exactly what France and Britain had already done

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He just wanted to use legal memes.

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>>2038633

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>>2039160
"Fascism is an idology of cuckoldry"
>Pro-family
>Pro-religion
>Pro-Nationalism
>Pro-Masculinity
>Encourages Motherhood and rewards women who fulfill the role with excellence
>Hates Nihilist-ideologies (ie. cummunism)
>Protects priests and nuns
>Protects the working class and manufacturing jobs
>Fights against racial miscegenation
>Believes in values greater than "muh freedombs 'n dildos mang!"
>Isnt afraid to use extreme measures to protect its people.
>Isnt globalist filth
Ohkay.

>>2043895
Fascism, at the higher ranks, is for irreligious people - religion is taken as a tool. Besides Hitler and late Mussolini, no fascist leader actually actively opposed miscegenation.

>>2039045
It literally had one airplane used for military purposes.

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>>2043925
"Fascism, at the higher ranks, is for irreligious people."
>Hitler - catholic
>Francisco Franco - catholic
>Pinochet - catholic
>Mussolini - "In Italy, a political man did not even turn his thoughts to the Divinity. And, even if he had ever thought of doing so, political opportunism and cowardice would have deterred him, particularly in a legislative assembly. It remained for me to make this bold innovation! And in an intense period of revolution! What is the truth! It is that a faith openly professed is a sign of strength"
>Sir Oswald Mosley - Christian Monarchist.
I have to disagree man.

>>2043955
According to Goebbels, Hitler was irreligious in private and he did have the SA do things like smear feces on altars and destroy churches in Germany and Poland.

>>2043895
>getting rid of freedoms
c u c k

>>2043955
Hitler was as much a Catholic as Stalin was Orthodox.

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>>2043955

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>>2038633
>served in WW2
>created the EPA
>normalized relations with USSR and China
>major funding to Science with "War on Cancer"
>ended Vietnam war which was started by LBJ
>limited nuclear weapons
Honestly were it not for Watergate he would have been one of our best Presidents. It's silly to consider watergate as terrible since we almost elected Hillary Clinton who did things a million times worse.

>>2043955
The BUF was pro religious tolerance, anon.
Hitler wasn't religious himself and many top nazis were atheistic.
Mussolini also wasn't religious himself.

Take it together with red fascism - these guys had to drop the atheistic shtick to make their plebs cooperate.

>>2044246
Like what? Emails?

We did had one president get away with high treason: Ronald Reagan. Nixon's plot didn't involve funding death squads or dumping weapons on goat herders, so he was many folds less morally bankrupt in my view.

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>Was part of the Easter Rising
>Fought back when Mick Collins and the Free Staters sold out to the Brits
>Made Ireland a Republic Again instead of a Free State
>Stayed neutral during WW2 and was the only world leader to send condolences to Hitler upon news of his death
>Maintained a good balance between the rule of law and Irish Republicanism
>Ruled longer than any other democratically elected leader

Nobody in history has had a greater role in shaping Ireland than Eamon De Valera and I'd say he did a pretty good job.

>>2044319
>fight to create a republic
>when the legitimate government of said republic doesn't agree with you, immediately go to war against it
>while you're off being a sperg, the Brits manage to consolidate their rule over Northern Ireland

0/10 Whiskey Rebellion tier leader

>>2044300
yeah and nixon had what? magnetic tape?

get real

>>2038683
Given the current state of places like Alabama, Tennessee, Kentucky, Florida, etc., yes I'd say muh states rights aren't all they're cracked up to be

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>>2038724

>>2044326
Mick Collins had already sold the 6 counties away, and that was part of the reason why he went to war with the Free Staters

>>2038900
>church
>moral
Come the fuck on man

>>2044331
>yeah and nixon had what? magnetic tape?
What? I'm not saying that either Nixon or Clinton were specially bad or weren't, I'm saying it isn't reasonable to expect that there was anything in those emails that was "a million times worse" (>>2044246) than what Nixon got on tape.

>>2039176
>entire ideology centered around "freedom"
>endorses child slavery
What the fuck guys

>>2043895
>relenquishing personal freedoms to the state
>is a fucking failure
If that doesn't scream cuckoldery then I don't know what does

>>2038900
>social security
>better education
Lmao sounds like faggot gommie in denial

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Stalin was a good Christian boy who did nothing wrong

>>2044376
How did he improve the world aside from starving commie faggots?

>>2044359
not the first nixon guy but it depends on what you think is worse, political espionage and maneuvering or global subterfuge to propagate war and death because people paying you told you to

>>2039109
School still exists you mong, and some people actually have family and a retirement fund.

>>2039176
>everyone who opposes any state program is a libertarian
Neck yourself parasite

>>2044335

>[COLLAPSES]

>>2044384
He played a part in enforcing an uneasy peace in Europe, raised the life expectancy and literacy of the people (that he didn't send to the gulags) through socialized healthcare and education, industrialized a backwards country, and, ultimately, united the west against him. When the USSR fell most of these fell under the sphere of influence of the west, while still being ahead of most third-world countries.

>>2044373
>special snowflake-ism

Pathetic, Anon.

>>2044405
Not an argument

>>2044388
>global subterfuge to propagate war and death because people paying you told you to
Wow, easy there.
1. War and death are as certain as taxes. I like peace, but shit like Russia taking turf from Ukraine is not a sign of good times to come.
2. Banks weren't pushing for war as far as we know, and there isn't much to point us in that direction, it's just that Clinton's conservatism (relating to the US's economic stance on the global market at least) is more aligned with big capital's interest than Trump's protectionist agenda is.

>>2043955
>>Hitler - catholic

Hitler hated the Catholic Church

>>Francisco Franco - catholic

Not a fascist

>>Pinochet - catholic

Not a fascist

>>Mussolini - "In Italy, a political man did not even turn his thoughts to the Divinity. And, even if he had ever thought of doing so, political opportunism and cowardice would have deterred him, particularly in a legislative assembly. It remained for me to make this bold innovation! And in an intense period of revolution! What is the truth! It is that a faith openly professed is a sign of strength"

Anti-clerical

>>Sir Oswald Mosley - Christian Monarchist.

A meme

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>>2039155
>Confederacy
>legitimate

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>>2044113
>>2044373
> >:( MUH FREEDOMS DONT U DARE TOUCH MY DILDOS AND WEED ANON! TO PASS JUDGEMENT ON MY TAKING HUGE COCKS IN MY ASS IS JUST BEING A C U C K
> REAL DEGENERATES ARE PEOPLE WHO BELIEVE IN THINGS LIKE FAMILY, HONOR, COURAGE AND VIRTUES THAT DONT REVOLVE AROUND CUMMIES!!! >:(
t. ancap dragon dildo collectors

>>2044624
>yes daddy please take away my freedoms you are clearly superior to me let me lick your boots
Literal cuckoldry, the only point in supporting fascism is to become the dictator yourself. Anything else would just be slavery.

>>2044628
>I just wanna have fun, bro
Neck yourself, normie

>>2044641
>i want everyone to be a sadsack wagecuck like me
Neck yourself, normie

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>>2043965
>>2044118
>>2044129
>>2044278
>>2044558
> "Grrr Hitler isnt a catholic because all that bad stuff he did! (no true scottsman fallacy also plz dont look into the old testament i promise all those guys were super nice and never killed anybody really)
>"Pinochet and Francisco Franco arent really fascists!"(despite there being literally dozens of books and the majority of political scientists saying otherwise)
> "Mussolini wasnt really a christian... h-he was just joking all those times in speeches and IN THE FUCKING BOOK HE WROTE "doctrine of fascism"
> "Sir Oswald Mosley isnt a real fascist because he never acquired power in Brittan and is a meme.... because so many people like him..

Come on guys, I will concede that there was alot of atheists and creepy pagans in the upper echelons of the Nazi party, but Hitler himself is a self admitted catholic in Mein Kamph. Alot of shitty christian apologists will try to distance themselves from the political ideology of fascism but you cant just ignore direct quotes from the men themselves and cherry pick contradictory quotes to prove your points

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>>2044643
>t. teenager with authority issues due to an absent father

Its sad times were living in, really. So many young men missing authority figures that they take to silly political practices like An-cap or full blown anarchy in order to strike out at society.

>>2044654
Hitler wasn't a Christian because he despised the necessity of mercy, and yes although born a Catholic, his rejection of the church was a certain feature of his regime. Also, can we get a quote from the
>self admitted Catholic in Mein Kampf?

>>2044692
Sure thing anon, Im honestly not even that much of a /pol/ak I just think facism is interesting and my jimmies get rustled when /his/ will outright ignore a historical figure saying "I AM X" and instead quote someone else who says " Nah he was actually Y, I know better than the guy himself what his spiritual beliefs were"

Quotes from Mein Kamph:

>“My feelings as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior as a
fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, surrounded
by a few followers, recognized these Jews for what they were and
summoned men to fight against them and who, God’s truth! was greatest
not as a sufferer but as a fighter. In boundless love as a Christian
and as a man I read through the passage which tells us how the Lord
at last rose in His might and seized the scourge to drive out of the
Temple the brood of vipers and adders. How terrific was his fight
against the Jewish poison. Today, after two thousand years, with
deepest emotion I recognize more profoundly than ever before the fact
that it was for this that He had to shed his blood upon the Cross. As
a Christian I have no duty to allow myself to be cheated, but I have
the duty to be a fighter for truth and justice… And if there is
anything which could demonstrate that we are acting rightly, it is
the distress that daily grows. For as a Christian I have also a duty
to my own people. And when I look on my people I see them work and
work and toil and labor, and at the end of the week they have only
for their wages wretchedness and misery. When I go out in the morning
and see these men standing in their queues and look into their
pinched faces, then I believe I would be no Christian, but a very
devil, if I felt no pity for them, if I did not, as did our Lord two
thousand years ago, turn against those by whom today this poor people
are plundered and exposed.”

>>2044740
cont.
>“I believe today that my conduct is in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator.”
>“This human world of ours would be inconceivable without the
practical existence of a religious belief.”
>“And the founder of Christianity made no secret indeed of his
estimation of the Jewish people. When He found it necessary, He drove
those enemies of the human race out of the Temple of God.”
(Next quote is talking about hitlers aspiration to become a priest in his youth)
>“I had excellent opportunity to intoxicate myself with the solemn
splendor of the brilliant church festivals. As was only natural, the
abbot seemed to me, as the village priest had once seemed to my
father, the highest and most desirable ideal.”
And finally the most blatant quote I could find with a quick google search
>“I am now as before a Catholic and will always remain so”

>>2044748
cont. (last)
I have no clue why green texting isnt working with these quotes but w/e

“Even today I am not ashamed to say that, overpowered by stormy
enthusiasm, I fell down on my knees and thanked Heaven from an
overflowing heart for granting me the good fortune of being permitted
to live at this time.”

>>2044624
>IF YOU DONT AGREE WITH GENARILISSIMO DADDY TAKING AWAY UR FREEDOMS THEN UR A BIG MEANIE GAY ANCAP BUTTHOLE
>Why yes Mr leader you can fuck my wife, ur a strong figure bro :)
t. cuck

>>2044867
If this was /pol/ I would be willing to bet this post is placed by one of the following:
> A poo in the loo
> A Swede
> Or most likely A LEAF
such poor shitposting should be punishable by death.

>>2044919
What's wrong with replying to a shitpost with a shitpost? It's not like there was of an argument to begin with.

>one of the following

American.

>>2040379
Italian Fascism was much more dynamic and endurable than people give it credit for. If Italy had lumped itself with the Allies instead of the Axis, I have no trouble believing it would have endured to present. Pity it always gets conflated with national socialism

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>>2038683

>>2044624
>>2044667

>wanting your freedoms to be taken away
>wanting to be imprisoned for doing things the state doesn't like

Sounds pretty cuckish to me.

>>2040379
Mussolini wanted to be a conquerer, but never a genocidal asshole. His fascism was pretty nice too (I consider myself a fascist of the non-racist kind). It's just that in the modern age you can't go conquering clay for the sake of glory and power, even if Italy technically did have the cassus belli restoring the Roman Empire

>>2045318
The north didn't spend an enormous amount of money, engage in a war that was a potential existential threat to the United States and send 100000s of white men (not all of them commoners) to their death just to free the slaves.

>>2044300
>Like what, emails?
Given that out is reasonably certain that it would take longer than 18 minutes to recite the content of those emails verbally, Clinton literally did the same thing as Nixon, except far worse.

The difference is that Nixon made no bones about his absolute loathing of the press, while Clinton had used her and her husband's extensive political careers, and the presses own ideological leanings, to turn journalists into her personal propaganda arm.

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>>2045118
Honestly one of the reasons that I love fascism is that it just appeals to the human psyche so well. The strong leader, the nationalism, the religious element, the feeling of camaraderie, the feeling that you fit within the cogs of the nation, that you have a higher purpose, the support of the family, the militarism and crusader mentality, all of it comes together to make a system that might not always produce the best results, but feels good man.

>>2042781
Kek was too weak back then

>>2038655
Living personification of nothing wrong

>>2044667
>being this much of a masochist

>>2045824
Nobody claimed that the North was in it to free the slaves. In fact the North wasn't even about to abolish slavery anyway, it was the South sperging out about MUH SLAVES ABOLITIONISTS GET OUT REEEEE that allowed the North to take the anti-slavery cause as a moral high ground.

>>2045872
>being a defeatist
>not wanting better for yourself
Yeah you're a cog in a machine, all right

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>>2046103
>not wanting to sacrifice for your nation
>thinking that material goods are all that's worth acquiring
Don't you want to be part of something greater anon?

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>>2044628
>>2044867
>>2045332
> What happens when low energy /his/ tries to use a term associated with the alt-right to normalize their degenerate life choices.
> "B-but muh weed and random sex with strangers! I know im spreading STDs and costing society but its muh freedumb! Why do you have the right to pass judgement, its not like its statistically proven that some behaviors are detrimental to both the individual and society and therefor should be structurally avoided by the populous as well as the government. I should be allowed to poison myself! Why cant i be a shitty parent and harm my children though my own inadequacy??? FREEDUMB IS THE MOST ESSENTIAL QUALITY ANON! TO HOLD TO TRUTH HONOR COURAGE OR LOYALTY IS WHAT KEKS DO! :((((((((

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>>2046103
Fascism isn't meant to give you a life of luxury anon. Fascism isn't mean to be comfortable.

Fascism will demand that you exercise, it will limit what you can eat, it will restrict your drugs and alcohol, and it will censor media that might cause degeneracy, it will ask that you go to church on Sundays, it will plead that you die for your country, and it will take large amounts of your income taxes that would've been spent on luxuries.

But it will make you great. It will make your nation glorious. It will make the family healthy. It will please God. You will have purpose. You will have true comrades, not like these fair weather friends you have today. You will sweat and toil and bleed for your country and your God alongside your bothers and sisters, and you will do it gladly. Great things will be achieved, glorious monuments erected, magnificent cities built, olympic champions raised, holy cathedrals founded, and mighty warriors remembered. Fascism will trade comfort for greatness. Are you willing to make that sacrifice, anon?

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>>2046103
>>2046594
Fascism will enable us to eliminate racism. You and your black comrade shall be born in the same hospital. You will both go to the same type of school, where you will both be indoctrinated to love your country, love God and Christianity, and hate the enemy. You will both be put through the same trials in the military youth program, then you will both be conscripted into the army when you come of age. Boot camp will break both of you down further, molding both of you into good soldiers ready to die for each other and your country. You and your black comrade shall fight side by side killing the enemy heathens from a hostile culture, you will see whites and blacks bleeding for each other on the battlefield and you will be willing to do the same. Then, you and him will either die for your country, or you will survive and live to raise your own kids. Maybe you and him have a wife of a different race, it matters not, because your kids will be sent to the same schools and go through the same indoctrination and experiences you did.

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>>2046103
>>2046594
>>2046608
Non of this will happen though unless you have a strong fascist state to indoctrinate them first. From birth, they get taught to be loyal and productive to the state. They go into military youth programs, where more indoctrination is added and they learn useful skills, like how to kill enemies of the state.

Then they grow up, in high school they are enrolled in the local state militia, where they learn how to bandage wounds, produce homemade bombs, and fight a guerrilla war if the state is invaded. They go through a hazing ritual to mark them as a servant and soldier of the state.

After high school, they can join the military, for yet more indoctrination and training, or they can go into one of the respected professions and industries of the nation.

They will not care that their personal income taxes are so high, because it goes to the state, which they love dearly, and they will not care that corporate taxes are so low, because it helps the corporations produce more for the state.

They see the nation give them free healthcare, and useful skills, and work programs in case they lose their jobs, and they know that their nation loves them as much as they love it.

They vote on ministers related to the profession or industry that they work at. The very idea of these ministers being corrupt is preposterous, as they went through the same indoctrination as you did, and if you ever saw any corruption you would be sure to report it, but not before doling out a bit of your own punishment for hurting the nation you so love.

Race and culture is not an issue. There is but one culture, the one the state gives you, and race is but an outer wrapping to the delicious dedication the state has filled all of you with.

Individualism is only useful so far as it achieves progress for the nation. The state will not endorse tall poppy syndrome and cut down those too successful, but it will also not tolerate exploitation of your fellow citizen.

>>2046594
Worth nothing that a lot of fascism (at least I think) is based off Plato's "Republic". He talks all about controlling degeneracy, loyalty to the state, etc.

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>>2046616
>degeneracy

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>>2045332
>wanting to do things the state doesn't like.

>>2045724
Actually I take that back. You can totally conquer clay, like Russia is doing with Ukraine right now, if you can keep the rest of the world from jumping on you for it.

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>>2045872
>>2046594
>>2046608
>>2046613
Literally submission:the ideology

>>2046594
>>2046608
>>2046613
It strikes me that everything works fine in the fascist system as long as it's 100% in place and working smoothly and everyone is working towards the same goal.

Kind of like it's red-headed brother.

>>2038796
He was a true fascist. Race has no role in a man's standing if he is loyal to the nation and the state. Hitler just happened to find himself in charge of a much better military, otherwise our boy Benito was a more authentic leader.

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>>2046838
To be fair, it still uses the capitalist economic system which has proven successful, values traditional cultural values which has proven useful, and avoids the pitfalls of democracy such as endless debt and free handouts.

>>2039065
Compulsory education is absolutely not bad. This isn't up for debate, you're just stupid.

>>2044113
Wow you're treading on your wife's right to fuck Tyrone what a cuck

Kys

>>2046594
>Degeneracy
Truly the shittiest /pol/ buzzword. It's even more cringy when you realize it's mostly used by 20 year olds.

>>2046885
If you weren't a pussy your wife wouldn't fuck Tyrone.

>>2039109
This. The flaws of socialism are that it's a materialist system and it doesn't respect national boundaries and traditions. Both of these things are fixed in fascism, so the rest socialism has to offer is not inherently bad.

>>2045332
>wanting to be a degenerate and childishly needing the right to make bad decisions and drag down your people

Sounds like someone needs to be removed

So lets say Italy somehow managed to stay neutral during WW2, somehow, and Italian Fascism still remained.

What do you think would be the result?

>>2046925
Not much. If he had fought Hitler, or if Hitler had never come into power, then fascism might be viewed as a viable 3rd alternative to communism and capitalism, and Hitler would just be a guy who went a little mad but doesn't represent the ideology as a whole.

>>2044558
Mussolini had his edgy atheist phase, but he did convert to Catholicism. Now, you can say he did it for better relations with the Vatican, or because he really believed, but he technically was a Christian.
Hitler was a Catholic man and defended the Church, but he himself was as religious as most Catholics today; maybe just a casual mass, confession, but he didn't hate the catholic church.
Mosley is as fascist as Hitler or Mussolini. He was a Christian and none of these things change because he didn't acquire power.

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>>2046959
Let's not forget the Based Brazilian

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>>2046959
Or Sexy Salazar

>>2044403
what's saying he couldn't have done all that and not been a genocidal dictator?

>>2046893
It sucks because talking about cultural and moral degeneration is usually pretty interesting but /pol/ has spammed the word until it has become more or less meaningless.

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>>2046812
>The only political ideology that forbids the propagation of homosexual relations is "reckless faggotry"
thats literally like calling a christian a faggot because they believe marriage should be between a man and a woman. Makes no sense.

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>>2046812
>standing up to immigrant hordes
>being proud of your nation
>being militaristic and ready to die for your comrades
>working every day to further a noble cause
>not taking crap from anyone, be it terrorists, commies, or rival nations
Somehow we're the reckless faggots?

>>2047083
>this
where do I sign up?

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>>2047147
Sorry, can't help you there. Trump, Brexit, and Italexit are all steps in the right direction, and the overton window is shifting, but fascist politics won't enter the mainstream in the west for a while still.

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>>2047062
>>2047083
>ignoring the greentext to critique the reaction picture
>implying I am calling a literal faggot instead of using it as a common mocking term on 4chan
Here is a better reaction pic then

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>>2047220
Do you ever pay taxes anon? Do you obey the laws of your country? If so, you too submit to the authority of the state.

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>>2043955
>>2043895
>>2044654
>>2046594
>>2046608
>>2046613
>>2046859
>>2047062
>>2047083
>>2047157
I love how this thread started as a misunderstood historical figure thread and quickly turned into a PRO-fascism thread
on lefty /his/
Far right ideologies are definitely making big strides in the world. And I for one think its a good thing.

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>>2047256
I wouldn't really say /his/ is lefty. In fact, I don't think any of 4chan can be considered conventionally lefty, the closest we get to that is /sci/.

Of course, I'm brand new to /his/, maybe /his/ was really left wing at one point, I don't know. Fascism is definitely making a return, although I doubt it'll they'll call it fascism when it does come.

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>>2047256
Pic related is what a true lefty site looks like

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>>2047266
I would only say /his/ is lefty in the sense there are allot of communist apologetics that frequent the board and pretty much you will universally get called a /pol/ak or banned if you bring up human biodiversity or even some pretty benign points on anthropology.

>>2043875
Absolutely this

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>>2047292
Yeah, I mean, the communists are annoying, but they aren't too frequent. I haven't noticed much about biodiversity, I feel like that would be more /sci/ related, but I understand the caution against turning this place into a 2nd /pol/ on accident.

Half of the reason I came here was a love of history, but the other half is because I can't stand the Holocaust denial and obsessive racism on /pol/. Pol doesn't just make observations about race, it centers its value around it. It's why they'll never appreciate men like Mussolini, Salgado, and Peron, cause half the time the "fascists" aren't even real fascists, they just liked the Holocaust.

>>2047237
Sure, but I don't take that submission to motherfucking eleven. Also while citizen submit to the state's laws and taxes, the state in turns empower the citizens to do whatever they want. At least in republics

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Not even /pol/ but I really feel like this guy got misunderstood. Either that or Churchill was a huge asshole.

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>>2047320
Nothing wrong with a little patriotism anon. Besides, in exchange for giving up some freedom and comfort, the fascist state empowers us to do much greater things than simply whatever dickery pops into our heads.

>>2038655
He was a Jew who hated white people so much that he sought an alliance with China so the goyim in Russia and the United States could keep going on hating each other.

>>2047353
>Nothing wrong with a little patriotism anon
>a little

>empowers us to do much greater things
Which is coincidentally what the state wants. Like i said. Utter submission

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>>2047367
What's wrong with submission? You need to let go of these preconceptions that freedom and democracy is good, or that rights are anything but a human construct. We should evaluate freedom, rights, and democracy based on the results it brings, not ideas of them being inherently good.

Jesus Christ

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>>2047391
What's wrong anon?

>>2038949
>technically
That's the magic word

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>>2047386
>What's wrong with submission?
Only cucks submit.

>muh human constructs
>posts so much more human constructs like degenacy

>>2044919
Luckily it's not /pol/ so you can't use your shitty ad hominem here

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>>2047404

[Loses War]

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>>2047485
Good. Nazis were scumbags.

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This guy

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>>2047493

Indeed

>>2047266
/his/ can argue against /pol/ which makes them think this board is leftist. It's funny because Mussolini and his fascism are very popular here.

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>>2047459
There are two things to consider when discussing concepts like freedom, rights, and degeneracy. First, the effect that they have on humanity. Second, what God thinks about such things. Now, I don't recall God giving us any freedom other than free will and to be free from sin, and I certainly don't recall any mention of rights or democracy in the Bible. As for degeneracy, we can see both what God condemned, and what embracing degeneracy has done to Europe and the USA today. Democracy is complicit in this too (as well as the massive debt and immigration).

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>/his/
>lefty
Pick one. We have a few commie posters but most people are annoyed by all the political crap and revisionist bullshit about totalitarian regimes. Also >>2047507.

To contribute something to the thread, pic related. I remember a guy explaining the various reasons of the decline of the german empire and how it wasn't mainly his fault a few months ago. Should have screencapped.

>>2047504
Hol up who dis?

This might sound dumb, but can Fascism have a bill of rights and constitution?

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>>2047552
I'd say it can have a constitution, as rule of law, especially for passing control from one ruler to another, is very important. Bill of rights, not so much.

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>>2038633
I'm not sure if Salgado is "misunderstood", per se, but most people will probably read "fascist" and look at him in disgust, so he probably belongs here.

>>2047550
Hans-Joachim Marseille, best german flying ace in africa, only 22 years old too.

But it needs some context: I come from the district of Berlin he was born and there was movement to honor him by renaming a street to his name but of course it didn't work because he was ebil nuzi. A real shame but well.

I would have understood if the street had some other significant name but it was something dumb like park street or something.

>>2038633
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SsIWUiWSvIY

>>2047582
Didn't seem too much of a committed Nazi to me. But a true expert as a fighter pilot. Shame leftists will wipe out any traces of history they don't like.

>>2047688
True, he actually died in 1942 (plane crashed, not in combat) and I still haven't found any evidence of war crimes or anything.

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>>2047688
> Shame leftists will wipe out any traces of history they don't like.

LEFTIZ DO DIS

RIGHTIZ DO DIS

IM NOT OBERSIMPLIFYIN NUFFIN

>>2044319
>Stayed neutral during WW2 and was the only world leader to send condolences to Hitler upon news of his death
???

How would he receive them?

>>2047787
It happens everywhere they take power, their Muslim friends are doing the same in the Middle East.

>>2047582
Marseille ? he was half-french ?

>>2047901
>This

>>2047787
Essentially arguing that the whole of a movement wont be judged by the actions of a few... you do know this is /his/ right? Because that is literally how every movement has worked ever.

>>2046569
>giving up your rights and freedom at all
>getting so triggered you write an autistic all-caps paragraph

c u c k

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>>2048140
>thinking you have rights
>thinking freedom to be mediocre is worth having
>calling people cucks for striving to ascend themselves and their nation to greatness

>>2048681
>implying God didn't intend for man to have basic rights
>implying God gave you the ability to question things and not use it

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>>2048729
>implying God gave you any rights other than the right of free will
>implying God isn't okay with literal slavery
>implying my questioning hasn't brought me to the conclusion that fascism is superior
>implying God is on your side and not mine

>>2048740
>implying God is okay with slavery in an age where it's unnecessary
>implying a God as great as ours wouldn't want man to have the right to voice his opinions
>implying God would side with filthy fascists, crappy commies or awful anarchists
>implying a loving God wouldn't want a society where people are free to carve their own path as long as they don't directly hurt anyone or take from others

Oswald Mosley was a cringey failure and charlatan.

Glad that cuck is dead.

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>>2048756
>implying voicing your opinions wouldn't be allowed in a fascist society
>implying God cares about the government type as long as it produces a Christian society
>implying a fascist society wouldn't allow you to go your own way, as long as it benefitted the nation in some way.

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this board is filled with such faggots holy shit

if i post a fucking commie who murdered thousands I'll get agreement but you post a Confederate and people get all butthurt

>>2048817
>implying fascist states wouldn't censor films and books critical of the government or society
>implying God's a-ok with government styles that create suffering over peace

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>>2038633
This man's writings are often misunderstood as esoteric ramblings of a pagan but I recommend Bolbi

>>2048818
>post a fucking commie who murdered thousands I'll get agreement
???
I don't know about you anon, but I always see people shitting on Mao, Pol Pot and Castro. Haven't been browsing /his/ as much recently, but I don't remember the communists on this board being that bad.

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>>2048842
>implying strapping a dildo to your head and making pelvic thrusts in public is the same as constructive criticism of the government
>implying the government would censor criticism it can use to improve itself
>implying suffering doesn't bring us closer to God

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>>2048870
Back to /pol/ with you

>>2048861
>implying just because you disagree with it/don't understand it, doesn't mean it doesn't have meaning or doesn't have a right to exist
>not saying pelvic thrusts and dildoes are useful criticisms, but as long as they aren't hurting anybody (and preferably not nude)
>implying a state that controls that much power wouldn't use it to it's advantage when it comes to information and wouldn't just paint themselves as the eternally perfect
>implying God wants us to suffer in ways like this that serve no purpose when there are better options available

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>>2038919
>believing war propaganda from over a century ago

Through the shigs and the diggs by costanza force.

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>>2048889
>implying that exposing children and society as a whole to such degeneracy doesn't risk corrupting civilization and shiftijg the overton window towards a Godless society
>implying a leader subject to the very indoctrination from birth that leads the people to have such loyalty to the state and to God would even think about misusing such power
>implying democracy is any better in that area even if it is true.
>implying the fascist state wouldn't make the suffering constructive to the human psyche, as shown in >>2046594

>>2038683
I could care less about slavery, the South is rightful Union clay

>>2048909
>implying you don't have the ability to keep your children from seeing sinful things
>implying i'm for flat out public indecency
>implying that any amount of indoctrination could prevent him or even his cohorts from eventually picking choices in their favor or using his blind fervor and belief in his country to justify to himself that some criticisms are just anti-state and removing them
>implying that while democracy is flawed (and I mean really flawed sometimes), doesn't mean it's always the worst thing possible
>implying I'm also against other systems like monarchies where the public has a say
>implying that people shouldn't have a right to live their lives, as it's better for them to learn from their mistakes
>implying that >>2046594 is right in saying that censorship and stripping you of the right to use your own money you've worked to get is fair

>>2047552
http://www.reakt.org/fiume/charter_of_carnaro.html
>The province recognizes and confirms the sovereignty of all citizens without distinction of sex, race, language, class, or religion.
But above and beyond every other right she maintains the right of the producer; abolishes or reduces excessive centralization and coinstitutional powers, and subdivides offices and powers: so that by their harmonic, interplay communal life may grow more vigorous and abundant.

>The province protects, defends, preserves, all popular rights and liberties; insuring international order by justice and discipline, seeks to bring back a time of well—ordered happiness which should bring new life to a people delivered at last from Government of lies and oppression; her constant aim is to raise the status of her citizens and to increase their prosperity; so that the citizenship shall be recognized by foreigners as a title of high honour as as it was in former days under the law of Rome.

>VI. All citizens of the State, of both sexes are equal, and feel themselves equal in the eye of the law.

>VII. Fundamental liberties, freedom of thought and of the Press, the right to hold meetings and to form associations are guaranteed to all citizens by the Constitution.
>Every form of religion is permitted and respected, and allowed to erect its own places of worship; but no citizen may allege his creed or the rites of his religion as a reason for withdrawing from the fulfilment of duties prescribed by the law.

>IX. The State does not recognize the ownership of property as an absolute and personal right, but regards it as one of the most useful and responsible of social functions.
>No property can be reserved to anyone in unrestricted ownership; nor can it be permitted that an indolent owner should leave his property unused or should dispose of it badly, to the exclusion of anyone else.

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>>2048947
>implying the you are always going to be with your children, or that the state shouldn't have a role in helping raise them
>implying that I think democracy is the worst, when it has its positives and downsides to fascism.
>implying that I don't think there should be limited amounts of voting allowed in a fascist system
>implying that the state is going to monitor your every move, rather than merely ensuring you are raised with the right values to be productive to the nation
>implying that paying back into the system that gave you the infrastructure, healthcare, education, and safety to live a good life is somehow wrong.
>further implying that the nordic system of high personal taxes, low corporate taxes, and high welfare hasn't seen great success until the recent migrant crisis (which would've been solved with fascist authoritarianism and nationalism).

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>>2048990
>>further implying that the nordic system of high personal taxes, low corporate taxes, and high welfare hasn't seen great success until the recent migrant crisis (which would've been solved with fascist authoritarianism and nationalism).


This, In Finland for example the welfare system was going rather well and even with the collapse of Nokia we were somewhat starting to recover but no, we have to pummel billions of taxes into migration and refugee housing just cause muh humanity.

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>>2049009
The nordic economies are very pseudo-fascist. They don't have the corporatism installed, but they have a good system of low corporate taxes so that the businesses grow, benefitting the nation, high personal taxes so that they can afford all the great education and welfare that keeps poverty so low, and the government working with the corporations to ensure a stable economy and good future for everyone involved.

Contrary to normie belief its not socialism though. If it was socialism they'd just nationalize everything and the country would be bankrupt within the year.

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STOP FUCKING IMPLYING

>>2038655
His only real success was fracturing communism and ensuring the russians and chinese wouldn't fight a common war against the US. Everything else was a failure. Still, his one success is so fucking big and important I think we'd all be working in gulags if it wasn't for it.

>>2038683
I don't care about the reasons, seccession is fucking treason.

>>2049051
>It is a mixed market economy so it must be fascist!
anime posters get out

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>>2048818
You get agreement from me. The union were a bunch of family murdering faggots led by a no-chin over represented president who is constantly misrepresented as being some champion of the abolition.

>>2048870
probably just b8
But this m8 is the best of the "misunderstood" historical characters.

>>2048681
>>2048729
>>2048740
>>2048756
>>2048817
>>2048861
>>2048889
>>2048909
>>2048947
>>2048984
Jesus fucking Christ give it a break with the fuggin BRICK WALL of green text, its enough to make a guys eyes cross.

>>2049078
THIS

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>>2049103
Mixed economies are not necessarily fascists, but mixed economies operating in a certain manner certainly approach the idea of fascism, hence the pseudo before the fascism.

>implying the thread.

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>>2048818
>>2049104
Sherman did nothing wrong.

>>2047966
His fathers family had huguenot roots, yes.

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>says mean things to an egghead intellectual
>gets branded a monster

Millán-Astray dindu nuffin

I read the Charter of Carnaro, it's very interesting, but what was life in Carnaro like? And did the constitution do its job of letting the citizens live a joyful, productive life?

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>better than other fascists
>nobody remember him
where are my rexist friends at?
christus rex brothers!

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>>2051260
Yet another reasonable fascist that Hitler ruined. Imagine if Hitler had never come into power, we might see fascism today in Italy, Belgium, the UK, and Brazil.

>>2051737
Fuck that noise. I like freedom of the press.

Also fascists would still be viewed as a pack of violent dipshits, since they were pretty commonly war mongers. They'd just be viewed as would-be Napoleons rather than considered complete and utter monsters.

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>>2051749
Don't you think freedom of the press is a little bit overrated? I mean, just look at the recent election, there was so much media support for Hillary that it was basically propaganda. But at least with government propaganda I know its propaganda in the first place.

>>2046594
Will I have the omelette when I break the egg?

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>>2051843
Yes. I think. I'm not sure I understand the metaphor fully, but I'm pretty sure the answer is yes.

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this dude

>hitler.jpg

>>2038900
>Got rid of mafia
You wish. They just went to hide for a while and struck deals that make his downfall even more profitable for them.

>>2038655
Literally helped China become a superpower while turning America into a nation of clerks.

>>2040379
Fuck the Jews.