Why did no one in Japanese history ever depose the Imperial dynasty?

Proper respect for divine authority unlike Soviet pigdogs. Even during the Shogunate the Imperial personage remained unmolested.

The same reason we still have a Pope.

>>1979432
Sure, but why?

The powerless Emperor was also present in China during the Spring and Autumn and the Warring State periods. Zhou emperors were also sacrosanct and considered necessary for performing religious rites. Yet, they still got deposed after centuries of unmolested reign.

What would've been the point? They had very little actual power, it just would have thrown the country into chaos and delegitimized your own rule (assuming you're the shogun or regent, or you want to become so).

Really, it would've just been a dick move for no purpose.

>>1979449
Modernity is a hell of a drug.

The Emperor was a symbolic figurehead of divine rule, and never carried any real power. He was never deposed because if you wanted power you used him as a puppet endorsement, and if you wanted to take power you killed the guy who was actually in power and took the emperor's validation for yourself.

Because no real power was ever concentrated on the hands of the Emperor. All he did was act as a rubber-stamp for the person in power.

>>1979426
Because Japanese emperors before Restoration were powerless needless idiots.

>>1979426
For a long time the Emperor did fuck all.

The reason is simple: Because Japan has never been conquered by foreigners.

>>1979426
>2
It would have been like a king killing the pope and declaring himself as as such.

Its a crude analogy but it works

>>1979426
The same reason no European king ever deposed the Pope.

The entire point of his existence was to legitimize their power to each other.

>>1979668

Poor example, Europeans did apoint anti-Popes and stuff.

>>1979676
Yeah, but to my knowledge they never actually marched on Rome to depose the "real" pope and anti-popes were more a way to bully their subjects than to try and influence other independent kings.

More importantly, why did Japanese navy suck? One would think they would realize they are living on an island and navy is their best protection

>>1979683

But thats exactly the point, you dont need to depose a figure whose legitimacy dont recognize.
And depsing a Pope is weird, is a elective position after all, they dont usually form dinasties.

>>1979691

Well they were never conquered, so it looks like a good navy wasn't necessary.

>>1979701
Granted i know shit about Japanese or generally Asian history, but i suppose they defended on land. If they had good navy, they could have ruled all the seas though.

Because the Imperial dynasty legitimized the powerful shogunate. You think the dynasty gave over power willingly? When the army is bearing down on your castle and threatens to kill you and your family line off, you bend the knee and give power to the shogun, and keep yourself alive. The shogun kept the Emperor alive because he was more useful as a rubber stamp than a dead man.

>>1979715
They did develop one when they modernized. And until WWII, that's exactly what happened.

During the Edo period they had no real imperial ambitions. They were extremely isolationist, looking inward. Why would they develop a large navy?

>>1979660
>It would have been like a king killing the pope and declaring himself as as such.

It's been done countless times in European history.

>>1979683
>Yeah, but to my knowledge they never actually marched on Rome to depose the "real" pope and anti-popes were more a way to bully their subjects than to try and influence other independent kings.

Early HRE emperors did march on Rome and deposed popes. The whole point of Gregorian reform was to put an end to that.

Emperor is a terrible translation. The office should have been called "pontifex maximus". It would be much closer to what the Japanese emperor really is.

Japanese demography (year - millions).
Official data:
1960 - 93.4
1910 - 50.9
Further extrapolation:
1860 - 27.8
1810 - 15.2
1760 - 8.3
1710 - 4.5
1660 - 2.4
1610 - 1.3
1560 - 0.7
1510 - 0.4

TEH 3000-YEARS EMPIRE.

>>1979808
When as a king declared himself pope?

Emperors were almost certainly assassinated, but no one outside the bloodline would have been put on the throne

>>1979746
>When the army is bearing down on your castle and threatens to kill you and your family line off, you bend the knee and give power to the shogun, and keep yourself alive.

Yeah no. It was a lot more subtle. Shoguns would just marry their daughters to the emperor and their sons to the emperor's daughter. After a few generations you get a situation where the newly enthroned emperor has a shogun who is his grandfather and ministers who are his uncle, nephews or step-brothers. The need to threaten the emperor to maintain the shogunate is not that necessary anymore.

>>1979831

Wait, you're using 20th century trends to extrapolate pre-modern population?

>>1979846
Japanese were steadily settling new lands till 1900. Lands were allmost empty, there werent resistance. 1900-1950 can be considered as last stage of settling. So trends were colonial.

>>1979691
Who needs a navy when you've got kamikaze on your side?

Their real value was as figureheads to legitimize shogunal (or sometimes Fujiwara or other Heian-era families) rule.

Also, Ashikaga Takauji effectively did, the northern court was a line of pliant puppets distantly related to emperor Go-Daigo, who actually tried to rule the country and lost.

>>1979447
Except popes have been disputed many times and some have even been deposed and replaced

File: japop.png (33KB, 473x1124px) Image search: [Google]

33KB, 473x1124px

>>1979831
excuse me?

>>1979627
A-are you Japanese? You might be onto something.

>>1979426
No reason to
Why bother deposing someone with 0 power especially if the people you rule over love the guy

>>1979426
Well that depends, if you mean depose the dynasty and set up a new one then no, but there were cases where you had rival claimants and shit, most famous one I know is https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nanboku-ch%C5%8D_period

To answer your question they simply had little to no actual political power. The Emperors were divine figureheads who were useful in legitimizing a shogunate. There simply was no reason to depose them since odds are you'd have the genuine Shinto believers baying for your blood and the rival daimyo seeing a perfect excuse to topple your ass.

>>1979426
>IRRELEVANT

>>1979627
>Because Japan has never been conquered by foreigners
>laughsinmacarthur.png

>>1982042
>tfw no communist north japan and republican south japan

>>1982044
Thank fuck for that. We have enough problems keeping Germany in line.

>>1982047
>allowing the House of Baggins to continue ruling Japan
piggu disgusting

>>1979627
t. Japan, american puppet state

>>1982044
Yes we definitely need another north korea
Dumbass

>>1979458
It really is.
Modernity is a phase where nothing is respected.

>>1980770
So have japanese emperors.