Sharia Law

religious law, not sure how much codified

>>1884714
AY YO HOl UP WHITE BOI

It's martial law.

>>1884714
Islam is not a religion. It is a religion, plus a government, plus a judiciary, plus a military, plus executioners, plus secular and religious laws. These laws are things like "become Muslim or pay a tax for not being Muslim, humbly", etc.

Islam is incompatible with western civilization.

>>1884880
>he doesn't know many middle east countries used to be secular and the rise in fundamentalism and islamic terrorism is relatively recent and caused by the USA supporting dictatorial coups to protect the petrodollar

>>1884714
Law and order:
Pimps up hoes down

>>1884714
It's the accumulated opinions and doctrines of Muslim theologians and legal experts. That's about it, really. All this: >>1884880 is incidental, and a lot of times either ignores or actively clashes with Sharia law whether it's modern day Pakistan and Saudi Arabia or the Ottoman Empire or the Fatimid Caliphate or even Muhammad's reign in Medina.

Today it's become a meme among Islamist and Western reactionaries to represent the totality of the social and political platform they support/attack, but for most of Islamic history it was just the current popular opinion among the judges of a particular school of thought in an area that may or may not be implemented by local authorities who were also willing and able to rule through tribal custom, martial law, or royal decree. A lot of times it was even just the wishful thinking of a scholar and not what the law actually in place was at the time.

>>1884714
Certain dietary, customary, and religious laws that all Muslims must at least accept, if not always adhere too. Sharia law is usually more of a guideline than a set of codes that are rigerously enforced. There are some exceptions to this though (Saudi Arabia).

>>1884931
>it's another Abdul and Mohamed living in the remote mountain passes of pakistan would be Voltaire reading secularists if only it weren't for the evil Americans episode

>>1884963
The Middle East did in fact have a whole lot of Voltaire reading secularists several decades ago.

>>1884972
Where specifically? The Ba'ath parties of Iraq and Syria that only paid lip service to secularism? Or the various socialist parties of Egypt that heavily integrated Islam into their doctrine? Or those few elite in Tehran and Kabul that emulated western dress in the 70s?

Secularism never had popular grass roots support in the middle East. The current wave of extremism comes from Saudi funded Imams and Mosques but they're not exactly being rejected by most people who attend their sermons, nor do they have to fight very hard against popular secular predispositions among the populace.

>>1885060
Don't forget the Iranians as well. They're often forgotten, despite being the largest state sponsor of terrorism.

Iran and Saudi Arabia are just two sides to the same coin of Islamofascism.

>>1885060
What you described were die-hard secularists who devloved into dictators which then started appealing to Islamism to stay relevant for a few more decades. Secularism was no more unpopular in the 40's and 50's in the Middle East than Islamism was popular back then. Religious reactionary ideology steadily grew in popularity among the popular masses over time. The current wave of extremism does originate from Gulf sponsorship, and it's not rejected because it's been subtly influencing education for some time now and primed by previous State Islamism by past dictatorships when they felt Nationalism begin to fail them.

>>1885089
Eh Iran is kind of a meme. Them funding Shiite minorities to take up arms is a bit different from the Saudis building billion dollar mosques in every country with more than three Sunni Muslims.

>>1884714

literally cancer

>>1885060
Thing is, these "urban elites" were actually a huge chunk of the population. The idea we have today of a small elite buckling under a huge rural mass wasn't the whole story for most of the Middle East. It was somewhat true for Afghanistan, but for the rest the cities were the major centers of population in a region where the countryside was severely depopulated or hadn't at all caught up to the huge population surge brought about from modern farming. Eventually though this boom caught up the rest of the country, and political Islamists spread their networks into the countryside at a time where other ideologues were unable to expand against the dictator or king in charge.

>>1884947
It's not their opinions and doctrines.

It is law, and it is brutally enforced.

>>1884931
>he doesn't know many middle east countries used to be secular and the rise in fundamentalism and islamic terrorism is relatively recent
>He thinks that's relevant

> the USA supporting dictatorial coups to protect the petrodollar
>muh petrodollar.
fedoras should be gassed.

I find it hard it to believe there were legit widespread secular movements in the ME when secularism was highly resisted even in fucking Turkey, the poster child of a secular Muslim country, and they then went on to eventually elect Erdogan who openly shits on Atatürk.

>>1885166
That's a recent thing was my point.

>>1885183
Illiterate peasants almost never matter. Secularism was very fashionable among certain segments of society. When you had cool kids like Nasser around it's not hard to see why secularism existed.

>>1885183
It was an uphill battle for the religious types for most of the last century and they only really started gaining ground in the late 70's and early 80's.

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>>1884963
>would be
>he doesn't know many countries in the middle east (like afghanistan) were liberal as fuck and even ahead of the USA in gay and women's rights
ladies and gentlemen, american propaganda at work

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>>1884963

Pakistan literally elected a female head of state decades before the US

too bad (((someone))) killed her after she spilled the beans on what really happened on 9/11

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>>1884714

It's the answer to modern society's degeneracy and moral decadence

>>1885209
>People living in Manhattan and San Francisco are comfortable with gay marriage and abortion therefore Cletus and the entirety of the Midwest and the south are too
Do you see where you made your mistake?

>>1885238

>muh feelings

Ok, lad

>>1885235

/thread

>>1885099
>What you described were die-hard secularists who devloved into dictators which then started appealing to Islamism to stay relevant for a few more decades.
>devloved into dictators which then started appealing to Islamism to stay relevant for a few more decades.
>Islamism

>>1885245
What does recognizing a cultural divide between varying parts of a given country have to do with feelings?

Go away retard.

>>1885192
When you say recent do you mean the founding of Islam?

A compromise between textual Islam and indigenous tribal custom

>>1885253
>>Islamism
Yes?

>>1885255
No, because that would be incorrect.

>>1885209
>implying liberalism is a good thing and means advancement is a society
This is /his/ not /pol/. You must at least acknowledge there is no such thing as a right side of history nor is there such a thing as a right side.

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>>1885209
Afghanistan is still pretty good when it comes to gay. You can fuck a boy or your buddy and no one will give a shit.

>>1885263
>No, because that would be incorrect.
Ok, I guess i'll just take your word for it. Fuck the Quran its just a propaganda piece. Its not real Islam.

>>1885183
It's a meme, much like claiming that everyone in the 60's was a hippy
>>1885209
>It's a liberal revisionist episode

>>1885274
Or you could take the word of historians of the Middle East about the development and history of Shari'ah Law. Reading the Quran doesn't tell you anything about that.

>>1885099
>What you described were die-hard secularists who devloved into dictators which then started appealing to Islamism
so u be saying secularism never had a leg to stand on in the middle east and leaders HAD to become more Islamic to appeal to the populace...

...

N SHIET?

>>1885192
1,400 years does not seem "recent" to me.

>>1885226
Concluding that Pakistan is progressive and feminist as a whole because they elected Benazir Bhutto is like claiming America is a race blind society because they elected Obama.

>>1885292
No. Secularism weakened over time as Islamism strengthened. A dictator in the 50's could literally give a speech to tens of thousands where he laughs at a religious conservative talking about putting veils on women, but by the 80's his successors would be taking pictures in mosques and praying.

>>1885294
Because it's not, because your starting premise is wrong and based solely on memes.

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>>1885289

shut the FUCK up you LIBSHIT C U C K

the academic study of "history" is just a cultural marxist indoctrination, got it cuck?

we know all we need to Islam based on how the SHITSKINS have been trying to kill us and wipe out for the past 1500 years

>>1885266
>there is no such thing as a right side of history nor is there such a thing as a right side

that is literally retarded though

it's like saying "there is no truth", itself being a truth statement.

>>1885313
>it's like saying "there is no truth", itself being a truth statement.
That statement is nothing like the other. There's nothing contradictory about saying there's no right side of history.

>>1885321
>That statement is nothing like the other.

Incorrect.

Both are untrue.

>>1884714
It's the traditions of various schools of thought from the 8th and 9th century which originally had little to do with Muhammad himself and represented the living law of contemporary Umayyad and Abbasid societies. Over time these schools of thought began to fight using wildly inconsistent oral traditions which they incorporated on their terms to weaponize their teachings against each other as a form of one-ups-man-ship.

>>1885311
So islam was never propagated by the sword, until after 1948.

Got it, CAIR bear.

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>>1885349
>whiggist
>objective moralist

>>1885289
Ok cool i'll just take your word for it. I guess you are a historian then.

Provide links any day now.
>inb4 www.refugeeswelcom/muslimsarethemostpowerfulraceintheworld/ by mr. goldstein professor of Oberlin and columist for huffington post.

>>1885172
so you think the USA doesn't support dictators? are you 12, or just retarded?

>>1885353
That had absolutely nothing with what I just said. We're talking about the influence of secularism in 20th century Islamic societies.

Like I said, memes.

>>1885266
dumbest thing i've read all week. thanks, anon

>>1885367
Try Joseph Schacht's "Origins of Muhammadan Jurisprudence" written in 1950

>If I meme as hard as I can maybe I'll get lucky and he won't actually know any "books" or """"scholarship""""

>>1885377
>>1885313
The fuck is it with these tumblr cunts?

>20 fucking 16
>believing in a thing as the right side of history

>>1885311
I love how leftists defending islam for whatever fucking reason love to point to the very very brief period (about 40 years out of the 1,000 of years of existence) in which it was ok. Just a reminder though, the quran does not in any way lead to modern liberal philisophy of being nice to your neighbor.

Its sad seeing you struggle so much though really.

>muh most of Islamic history isn't real Islam
>muh brief period is perect representation of Islam.
I'll never understand why leftists are so quick to defend a hardcore conservative ideology.

>>1885402
>the quran does not in any way lead to modern liberal philisophy of being nice to your neighbor.
>implying you've read the quran

>>1885402
>I love how leftists
Might as well get a trip now if all you're going to do is repeat yourself to no effect.

>I don't know much about the subject, but I'll push as hard as I can to feel relevant no matter how off-topic or wrong I am

>>1885411
It literally doesn't though my man, as much as you like to deny it.

What are you going to do if he's a neo pagan, or his son's a fag or daughter's promiscuous? What would Muhammad do?

>>1885313
Its not retarded at all. When you read through history do you think to yourself. "Man those Romans were totally wrong and un liberal. They were on the wrong side of history"
Do you ever think "those bigoted Spartans were on the wrong side"
No you don't because there is no side in history. You are the retard. You could learn a lot from Thucydides when describing history. You can't just say this group is good because they follow my beliefs or the beliefs of most modern people.
In 200 years those beliefs will be completely different. It could go in the exact opposite direction in fact. What i'm trying to say is stop interjecting morals into history.

>>1885402
>I love how leftists defending islam for whatever fucking reason love to point to the very very brief period (about 40 years out of the 1,000 of years of existence) in which it was ok. Just a reminder though, the quran does not in any way lead to modern liberal philisophy of being nice to your neighbor.

That has nothing to do with how early 20th century Middle Eastern nations had very popular secular movements which only dwindled later, not immediately. I'm not sure you actually understand the subject we're discussing anymore.

>>1885402
It's primarily wishful thinking that drives the Left about Islam. We'll abandon this delusion in the coming decades.

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>>1885425
Those popular secular movements, by the way, hated Islam as much as pol does.

>>1885385
>implying my objective was to get you to not name sources
All I wanted was some evidence for the sake of truth. Jesus fucking christ. its always a fucking argument with you people isn't it?

By the way though, this is an opinion not a fact. There are many people on both sides.

>>1885452
They hated Islamists, and some of them hated Islam and religion in general. The quote there is not proven to be from Ataturk himself, but the sentiment is what mattered to Kemalists who spread the word.

Incidentally this is pretty similar to how the Hadiths worked and a good case study.

>>1885462
The point is that secular regimes survive in the Middle East in SPITE of Islam, not FOR Islam. Islam is inherently theocratic in ways no other Abrahamic (or Dharmic) religion is. That's why it creates such a clusterfuck wherever it goes.

>>1885454
>All I wanted was some evidence for the sake of truth. Jesus fucking christ. its always a fucking argument with you people isn't it?

I'd almost believe you if you weren't replying to a reply chain that started with hyperbole and shitposting about the "founding of Islam" and "Fuck the Quran its just a propaganda piece. It's not real Islam"

Did you or anyone ask: "Which historians?" or "Source?"

No.

>>1885471
If that's your point it's a poor one. The enemies of secularists were Islamists, not anyone with a religion. Despite their numbers, very few Middle Eastern secularists were atheist. Even Ataturk himself can at best be described as an agnostic or just someone who kept his religion to himself, and only later was propped up by more hardcore secularists (and smeared by their opponents) as an atheist. There were Islamic clerics among the ranks of early nationalists, it wasn't a straightforwad battle between those with religion and those without.

The educated left, not the meme SJW left who has no idea what the fuck they're doing, wants to be accepting and tolerant of Islam as to not alienate them and drive them towards extremism. It's been shown when exposed to modern secularism in large amounts, people tend to become less religious, and religion becomes less of a problem. Once you reach the point of Muslims drinking beer (non-Kosher Jews, Christians eating meat on Fridays, etc) their ideology really doesn't matter much, it just becomes vaguely a set of guiding principles rather than dogmatic core beliefs. They may be "Muslim" but they've placed their worldly lives above their religion. And secularization by consumerism does work, it worked in the Middle East until those regimes were toppled with the help of foreign influences.

>>1885490
>And secularization by consumerism does work, it worked in the Middle East until those regimes were toppled with the help of foreign influences.
It's working right now. What very few seem to understand that groups like the Saudi religious police are so restrictive and tyrannical precisely because they're slowly losing the fight for social control to things like malls, TV and Internet media, dating, and so on.

It's really a wonder why /pol/lacks don't support the ME and Sharia law in general. It's the exact society they dream of.

>Degernacy and homosex are punishable by death
>Women are second class citizens, are the property of men, and are expected to be socially conservative
>Total echo chamber of religious thought and dedication, death or conversion to Infidels, tax id to want to be merciful

It's everything they spout only from a different desert prophet.

>>1885490
>don't call these people violent or they'll start being violent

Fantastic.

Also the fact that secularists and fundamentalists in the West have been shitting on each other for centuries yet still the secularists won proves you wrong

>>1885484
Why can't I want a source for the sake of a source and personally believe that the Quran instigates violence. I never said it was propaganda I said don't give me a source that is propaganda.

Serious question, do you have autism? Autistic people have the tendency to see the world as me vs them, black vs white.

>>1885484
Nobody said anything about Atheism. We are talking about Sunni Islam, and specifically how its followers desire to enforce Theocratic government, which is absent in most other present-day faiths.

>>1885490
The opposite is happening though in Europe. The young are more radicalized and religious than their immigrant parents. This is because assimilation cannot happen under permissiveness, which is part of the decline itself.

German Americans stopped speaking German when it became a liability to do so. Likewise, Islam will only die down when it becomes a liability to be Islamic. This is how Social Utility works.

>>1885501
Islam is anti-rational which doesn't have any appeal to people with triple digit IQs.

>>1885501
>/pol/ is /r9k/ and the Westboro Baptist Church smashed together

Hello redd!tor.

>Degernacy and homosex are punishable by death

Then why do they allow an extremely flamboyant gay man to represent them?

>Total echo chamber of religious thought and dedication, death or conversion to Infidels, tax id to want to be merciful

Seems like based redd!tor has never been to /pol/ and only knows from what his internet friends tell him

>>1885503
>treat these people like theyre violent and theyll start being violent because theyre treated that way anyways and youre giving them a reason to be violent

Fantastic.

>Also the fact that secularists and fundamentalists in the West have been shitting on each other for centuries yet still the secularists won proves you wrong

How does it prove anything wrong? If anything it proves it right, when a society is exposed to secularism, fundamentalists tend to be on the losing side. This is what was happening before fundamentalists were artificially propped up, ironically by foreign secular entities.

>>1885361
>whiggist

I am not le progression of history towards freedom anon.

I am le Hitler did nothing wrong anon though.

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>>1885525
>when a society is exposed to secularism, fundamentalists tend to be on the losing side

Citation needed.

>>1885503
What a childish way to phrase that.

They aren't inherently violent, Most Muslim refugees are in fact trying to escape from the violence in the ME. Telling them to fuck off because the west hates you only proves the point of extremists who then recruit them.

>>1885514
The opposite is happening in Europe because they're shit at assimilating. They stick different people in pockets and expect them to form their own community without ever being allowed to join the national identity.

That's why the States have always been better at assimilating immigrants.

>>1885514
> The young are more radicalized
The young are more radicalized no matter what ideology, including yours. This is naturally a given. Their parents have already grown out of that phase by the time they immigrated.

>>1885506
You could try by actually asking for a source like a decent human being, but you didn't. Don't project about autism when you can't understand why you get attacked after spending all your time attacking others.

>>1885514
You're talking about Sunni Islam, despite everyone telling you that what you're actually talking about is Islamism. Those very secularists that opposed them were themselves mostly Sunni Muslims.

>>1885530
>picture
The line immediately following your quote
>This is what was happening before fundamentalists were artificially propped up, ironically by foreign secular entities.
m80

>>1885531
>That's why the States have always been better at assimilating immigrants.

The Americanization movement that assimilated Immigrants has more in common with Pol than the Democrats. People only assimilate because of Social Utility, and if it isn't advantageous to assimilate, they won't. Assimilation requires conservatism that people work tirelessly to undermine, due to misguided decadence.

>>1885535
Alright, but why aren't they "radicalized" into Globalism, which is the current reigning ideology, instead of Islamism. This is one of the primaryy reasons why I abandon faith in this Left-Wing project.

>>1885543
Still doesn't undermine the fact that Sunni Muslims have theocratic tendencies that have to be overpowered.

>>1885551
So secularism can infact provoke religious extremism after all?

>>1885530
>Not pictured, Iranian teenagers going to shopping malls and watching Game of Thrones while blogging about social justice online.

>>1885525
We treat them like they're violent because they ARE violent.

Though they do seem a bit stupid since their reaction to my cynicism is just to affirm my suspicions

>>1885531
>they're trying to escape from violence
>this means they aren't violent

Violence isn't an off and on switch.

>They stick different people in pockets and expect them to form their own community without ever being allowed to join the national identity.

Do you seriously think the poow widdle immigwants want to assimilate but big bad Europeans forbid it? Don't tell me you're this naive

>>1885558
>not pictured, underage Iranian homosexuals being executed

>>1885555
>So secularism can infact provoke religious extremism after all?
Do you understand what foreign intervention is, or is this really beyond your comprehension level?

>>1885555
>Alright, but why aren't they "radicalized" into Globalism, which is the current reigning ideology, instead of Islamism. This is one of the primaryy reasons why I abandon faith in this Left-Wing project.

The same reason why some people in the West are alt right, not SJW progressives. Many people are not happy with the direction globalization is taking their lives, and react to it.

>>1885569
When Globalism manages to control Islam, instead of being controlled by Islam, I'll begrudgingly learn to get with the program. But until then, Islamism is clearly dominating over Globalism, which in turn is feeding the Alt-Right and giving it strength as well.

>>1885601
>i dont know what globalism is but im going to assume that globalism, sjws and the left are all synonyms for things i dont like
t. /pol/

>>1885558
>they watch game of thrones and go shopping they're just like me
xD

>>1885612
Oh come on, don't waste time with a No true scotsman argument. I'm sure you can give a better response.

>>1885612
>can't think of a proper reply
>acts like a retard
Classic.

Do you think that that in a pre globalist world they'd be able to recruit naive westerners?

>>1885226
>Pakistan literally elected a female head of state decades before the US
She was a prime minister not the president.

>>1885633
>>1885625
>colonialism is leftist because sjws
No really, I don't think you have any idea what globalism means.

>>1885646
>ass to the wall
>better start sperging out

Where exactly in my post did I mention colonialism?

>>1885646
The free movement of people and goods. In theory, it has been done before, but right now, it's being done terribly by its own very proponents. The Alt-Right and Islam will then inherit what's left of the West.

>>1885653
You mentioned globalism, when you clearly don't know what globalism is, especially in a historical context, while browsing a board about history, because you've clearly been indoctrinated about what globalism is by /pol/

>>1885372

Okay Fatwa Faggot. Islam officially dindu nuffin.

>>1885660
When I think of successful examples of Globalism, I think of the Roman and Ottoman Empires in particular. Two different systems that achieved the same result. Both of them managed to make it work by making hard and necessary concessions. I would recommend figuring out why it worked then, and then move onto why it doesn't work now. There's alot of useful information there.

>>1885621
Said no one

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>>1884714
Read through a couple of the comments. Let me give you a real answer OP

>Sharia Law
According to Muslims the law given by God for them to follow. Think of it like when God would make a new firmament with every prophet in the old testament

But what most people think is Sharia Law is actually

>Fiqh
This is human interpretation of divine law. A Faqih (or Islamic lawyer) will use a specific process determined by his school of thought to determine whether an act is obligatory, recommended, permissible, not recommended, or prohibited

>>1885799
Kek delivers.

>>1885531
The US and Canada have the advantage of being able to pick their migrants among the richer and more educated strata of their societies due to the physical isolation of America. Europe gets the dregs.

>>1885535
No. What he means is that every successive generation is more radical than the previous one. Don't forget that some European countries are at the fourth generation now.

>>1885799
This is the first decent post ITT although it's not yet right.

You have:

- Quranic prescriptions: this is the actual God-given law. Not only is it short but rulings in newer Surah (the first chapters in the book) overrule rulings in later ones.

- Hadiths: the sayings and deeds of the prophet. The prophet, while not divine, is inspired by God. He is an example to all Muslims and all should imitate him and do as he said. Those are by far the most important part of Islamic law. The Quran is quite brief and sometimes unclear while the hadiths are huge and detailed. It gives rules on everything, including how to brush your teeth (with branches of a small Arabic shrub species). Where it becomes complicated is that, while the Quran is standardized, not all hadiths are considered authentic depending on sect (Sunni/Shia) and Islamic law school (Sunni only: Hanafi, Hanbali, etc...) altthough this shouldn't be exaggerated, a large core of hadiths is concensual.

- Fiqh: Mostly law treatises and compendium of jurisprudence of Islamic law written by scholars on how to interpret the Quran and, more importantly, the hadiths. The hadiths are usually detailed enough that scholars reach a consensus on most issues but there are occasionally small and sometimes large divergences.


There has been recurring periods in islamic history, since nearly the very beginning, where people went full Protestantism and started to downplay fiqh in favor of "raw" Quranic and hadith rulings. We are experiencing one such period right now. It's what we call "salafism" and is in fact nothing new . The current period started in the 30s with Qutb (the founder of the Muslim brotherhood), kind of floundered with pan-Arabism but is now in full-swing. Expect it to last for maybe 50 years more.

>>1884714

It isn't really anything. However, a literal reading of the koran does imply raping of infidels etc

>>1885660
No, I talked about converting ignorant westerners to fight for ISIS. If the infrastructure for that wasn't there, or rather wasn't as easy to access, do you really think we'd be having all those attacks?

>>1885971
>Hadith not God-Given law
According to the Quran it's commandment from God to follow the example of the Prophet and therefore Hadith (sayings and deeds of the Prophet), fall under the umbrella of Sharia.

>>1884963
Pakistan? No.
Tunisia, Egypt, Jordan, Syria, Iran? Yes.
The problem isn't religious. It's cultural.

>>1886662
>culture and religion are hermetically sealed and do not influence each other dictating social norms and attitudes
"Can't you see? Honor killings are strictly cultural and have nothing to do with religion!"

sick of this meme desu

>>1886675

If only there were a ton of jurisprudence from the great schools of Islamic jurisprudence on...female genital mutilation, for example. Then we could finally put all this nasty cultural business behind us.

Though I thought culture couldn't influence behavior, being just food and funny lettering n' all. Confusing.

>>1885990

We aren't having very many attacks. Out of the entire Muslim population in the West, about how many have committed terrorist attacks? Easily less than 1%

>>1886856

Compare that to other religious groups. Right now Western societies are stable and have strong central authorities and law enforcement, so many are discouraged from even attempting anything while others are stopped before execution. If Islamic terrorist attacks were such a non-issue, we wouldn't be having this discussion - nobody is panicking about communist terror plots these days.

>>1885235
you do realise that that the arab elites are 1000x more filthy than western "degenerates" right?
ie. hiring prostitutes and engaging in scat fetishism with them, shit like that

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>>1888061
>f Islamic terrorist attacks were such a non-issue, we wouldn't be having this discussion
That assumes that people are knowledgeable and rational.
They are not.

Your chance of dying through not properly washing your hands is much higher than you dying to terror attacks. Yet the number 1 concern is terrorism.
Your chance of being hit by lightning is much higher than to die in a shark attack. Yet people fear shark attacks more.

>- nobody is panicking about communist terror plots these days.
That's true, and very dumb, considering that leftwing extremist and rightwing seperatist terror makes up like 97% of all terrorism.

Also, terrorism nowadays is factually much less of an issue than it was in the 1980s and 1970s. Especially Europe has gotten much, much safer, contrary to what the recent sensationalist attacks make people believe.

>>1888138

ETA or Corsican separatists detonating a cherry bomb isn't exactly Bataclan. And comparing disease to organized murder is such dishonest bullshit - the reason this is being discussed is that these attacks and the reasoning behind them tell us something about the attitudes of the culture they originate from, a culture that is currently causing tension within Western society. Hell, on body count I can agree - they're not going to kill the West off. It is, however, a good indicator on whether it's reasonable to keep importing them.

>>1888329
>>ETA or Corsican separatists detonating a cherry bomb isn't exactly Bataclan.
>he reason this is being discussed is that these attacks and the reasoning behind them tell us something about the attitudes of the culture they originate from
Who gives a fuck whether someone bombs a train or murders a policeman because he wants his region to secede or because he wants to institute the sharia?
In both cases, people die. In both cases, something is "told about the cultures they originate from", according to your thought. The innumeracy and focus on flashy Islamic terrorism is what enables hundreds of low count murders and people like Breivik to commit mass massacres unimpeded.

>And comparing disease to organized murder is such dishonest bullshit - the reason this is being discussed is that these attacks and the reasoning behind them tell us something about the attitudes of the culture they originate from
Then they're discussed for a bad reason, because judging a whole culture (which single culture anyways?) because of a few lunatics among millions of peaceful people living here while ignoring the respective counterparts in one's own culture is, guess what: intellectually dishonest.

(Besides, I wasn't talking about diseases, but accidental poisonings. Easily avoidable deaths that have a much higher scale than the few deaths through terror.)

>>1888329
>ETA or Corsican separatists detonating a cherry bomb isn't exactly Bataclan.
In case you forgot or are too young, the IRA alone had three Bataclans and the ETA two Bataclans each year in their high times.
It hasn't been very long since the ETA laid down their arms and the IRA might get a resurrection once Northern Ireland will no longer get the EU structural funds.

>>1888454

And being wary of militant Irish Republicans was a good idea at the time - getting bloody cost the rIRA a lot of support, that's why their most effective attacks later on had economic targets.

>>1888413

Because the ideology behind the attack matters - people aren't flocking from the world over to fight international capitalism or to secure a free Corsica. And there are no "respective counterparts" to militant Islam in the modern West unless someone resurrects Calvin and pumps him full of PCP. Not to mention that the inferiority and ordained submissive status of the infidel are not some baseless fringe position in Islam. If a Muslim starts feeling angry at or slighted by his new society, he will find plenty of consistent and pertinent theological justification for lashing out. Unless you think the Quran was composed with the social cohesion of 21st century secular states in mind.

>unimpeded

Not even worth responding to.

>>1884972
>Falling for this meme

>>1885107
The Iranian goverment funds shia mosques as well

>>1888535
>people aren't flocking from [all over] the world over to fight international capitalism
Because they have plenty of terror to do domestically, now that the Communist states are gone. Also, phenomenons like the Red Faction Army in Germany prove that claim wrong.

>or to secure a free Corsica.
Separatist movements reinforce each other. The success of a separatist movement in one country would increase the success of a separatist movement in another country. That's true for the non-violent versions like the Scottish nationalists in pact with the Catalan nationalists, it's probably also true for the violent versions like the PKK or RG.

> not some baseless fringe position in Islam. If a Muslim starts feeling angry at or slighted by his new society, he will find plenty of consistent and pertinent theological justification for lashing out.
If there's one thing that humans are good at, then it's rationalization of cruelties. You could take someone from any ideology or religion and turn him into a murderer, be it the Atheist, the Muslim, the Christian, the anarchist or a freaking vegan. Humans are just too good at post-hoc rationalizations, compartmentalization and selective memories in conjunction with pattern recognition.
The ideology doesn't matter.
Especially to those left behind. If my father got killed by the Militant Atheists of Rationalia, the Free People of South Tirol, the Panvegan Convent or a bunch of skinheads, I wouldn't feel any better than if he got killed by the IS or a Christian fundamentalist.

>>1888698
>If there's one thing that humans are good at, then it's rationalization of cruelties.
>people rationalize their cruelties all kinds of ways, therefore I can discard devout Muslims rationalizing their cruelties with their religion, it's like all the same man
go away retard
being raised to hate and exploit the kuffar wherever you may meet him is different from beating someone up for their wallet

>>1888750
Your pet ideology or religion isn't exempt from the human capacity to rationalize committing cruelties because of it. If people want to harm you. they will find ways to justify doing it.

Deal with it.

>>1884714
>how do I look up information on the internet?

>>1884931
>"used to be"

there's your problem, stop crying and fix it.

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>>1885089
>Islamofascism

Go away (((Michael Savage)))

>this thread

Literally Israelis voicing propaganda


>That geographic location will likely prove controversial. Israel seized the Golan Heights in the Six-Day War in 1967 and annexed the territory in 1981. Its administration of the area - which is not recognized by international law - has been mostly peaceful until the Syrian civil war broke out 23 months ago.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Clean_Break:_A_New_Strategy_for_Securing_the_Realm

>A Clean Break: A New Strategy for Securing the Realm (commonly known as the "Clean Break" report) is a policy document that was prepared in 1996 by a study group led by Richard Perle for Benjamin Netanyahu, the then Prime Minister of Israel.[1]The report explained a new approach to solving Israel's security problems in the Middle East with an emphasis on "Western values." It has since been criticized for advocating an aggressive new policy including the removal of Saddam Hussein from power in Iraq and the containment of Syria by engaging in proxy warfare and highlighting its possession of "weapons of mass destruction. "

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>>1888793
Why are liberals so backwards?
>poverty causes low IQ
>people want to harm you find reasons to harm you
>the religion that tells you to kill un believers is peaceful

>>1889620
> ask 5000 people
> we totally know opinion of 1 620 000 believers! XD

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German national socialists is an ideology of peace
#notallnazi
The nazis wouldn't have had to start a war if you evil Americans didn't screw them up in the first place. Apologize Americans. Also take in a couple thousand refugees.

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>>1889631
If you honestly think that those results are explainable with even that sample size you are fucking retarded.

>>1889632
> German national socialists is an ideology of peace
Well, this is true. Hitler wasn't the only national socialist of his era. He remembered as one just as propaganda tool to destroy rational political teachings of the third way.

I never understood why people can point to groups like the Mormons or the Evangelicals and point out how devout and serious they are about their religion yet when you do it with Muslims in the ME suddenly they're all beer drinkers who don't take Islam seriously and are merely oppressed by Islamic governments that they secretly hate.

>>1889642
Because Islam is religion of peace with deep social traditions and Mormonism just a sham.

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>>1889637
Yes of course. This is why we should let national socialist who want to murder all the jews and degenerates into our country. They are peaceful they only want to kill tons of people.

I don't care if you are a nazi or a muslim just stop pretending is a ideology of peace. I'm a white nationalist. I don't pretend that I don't want to murder all of the blacks in my country. I don't go around screaming not all white nationalists.
Maybe I would if it was a ploy to get muslims to accept white nationalists taking Jerusalem back for christians.

EVIL CAPITALIST MAKE PEACEFUL ISLAMIC COUNTRIES KILL EACH OTHER. STOP THE EVIL CAPITALIST TODAY! Muslims just want to fuck goats children, rape their wives and kill the other tribes of Islam in peace. Leave them alone. Actually no, let them flood into our countries.

Pls. I really want someone to fuck my wife and there are no black people in my neighborhood.

>>1889646
Does it works for other ethnic minorities like jews or that is only muslim thing?

>>1889667
>Pls. I really want someone to fuck my wife and there are no black people in my neighborhood.
Why does /pol/ always make "ironic" allusions to cuckoldry?

Are you trying to tell us something, fella?

>>1889631
Do you even know a single thing about statistics you cuck?