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The biggest mystery in ancient history

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Thread replies: 14
Thread images: 3

We know that in the Iliiad Greeks were named both as Acheans and Danaoi, that seem weird, doesn't it?

Well, wait: it gets much, much weirder than this.

The Hittities often named a people, the Ahhywans, which many scholars identify with Myceneans, in relation to Troy (Wilusa at the time), these people often had names similar tot hose of Mycenean Greeks, such as those from the Iliad.

So, the Acheans are Myceneans right?

Wait, it's not that easy.

The Egyptians clearly knew of the existence of Mycenean Greece, they named the region Tanaju or Danaju west to Keftiu (Greece) and even mentioned a bunch of Mycenean towns such as Myceneane, Thebes, Kythera and others in that region.

Yeah this seems clear, mystery solved, Acheans and Danaoi are the same peoples, right?

Well, when the sea peoples invaded Egypt, Egyptians mentioned both Acheans (Ekwesh) and Danaoy (Denyen) separately just like in the Iliad (with took place during the same time of the sea peoples' invasions), and even mentioned the Ekwesh as being hired as mercenaries by them during the battle of Kadesh against the Hittities.

The Danuna or Denyen were known by the Hittities too, but they located them in Cilicia, near the city of Adana, and later early iron age inscriptions, in the same region confirm this, the people are named Danuna under a king descended from Mopsus, Mopsus was also a mythical figure in the Greek traditions, which makes things even weirder, but wait, it gets worse.

(Continues)
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>>1873971
These inscriptions, namely treaties of alliance between the Danuna and the Assyrians are bilingual, they are in Luwian and in Phoenician, in one of them the people under the king of Cilicia are named Denyen in both version, in the other inscription, they are named Denyen in Phoenician but Ahhyiwans in Luwian, which of course brings us back to the Acheans.

Very recently a massive shipyard, one of the very few found in the ancient world, was uncovered in Cilicia facing Cyprus, and it was dated to the 13th century bc, which of course links it to the sea peoples.

So wait, both Mycenean Greece and Cilicia were called the land of the Danaoi/The land of the Acheans, so does this mean Myceneans colonized Cilicia?

Well, Adana was mentioned since the 15th century bc so before the Myceneans could expand in that region, one could very well argue that they were natives.

This is really one of the weirdest mysteries ever, the fact that the Hebrews also mentioned a tribe of Dan "living on ships" living around the same time as the sea peoples doesn't help.
The people of the ancient port city of Ugarit in Syria (in the same time period, late bronze age) also stated that one of the sea people tribes "lived on ships"
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>>1873984
maby one could solve that mystery by not interpreting everything people that starts with d/a in that region with the danaoi/acheans? maby there was another people with a similiar sounding names? but you couldn't never prove that and it's probably bullshit
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>>1873971
What if the Acheans/Danaoi were more xenonyms for bigger groups (like seafering peolple in the aegis+cyprus+cilicia)which later started to be used by parts of it as autonyms. And than Danaoi could first just be used for the region cyprus+cilicia and later gained a bigger signification. But i'm neither linguist nor very much into ancient greece so just speculating
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>>1873984
>>1873971
couldn't they have been a raiding-based group living on a city made out of boats, kinda like waterworld? would this explain the "atlantis" meme?
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>>1874038
Learn to read next time, the connections aren't solely based on the names Danaoi, it's the same period, it's the connection between these cultures, and the fact that the inhabitants of Cilicia were called both Acheans and Danaoi just like the ancient Greeks, the fact that they shared similar mythical figures, you dumb fuck, that can't be a coincidence.

Herodotus also stated that Acheans lived in Cilicia, and I doubt the fact that the link between two peoples who lived so close, shared so much of their culture and names could be just coincidental, especially during a period of massive migrations in both directions.
Both the ancient Cilicians and Greeks were of course present in late bronze age Anatolia, both were obviously connected to the Sea peoples, both shared basically the same name, not just the same initials, that's been established by scholars, you could argue against the Hebew Dan but not against the Cilician/Achean connection.
If you don't know the least thing about the subject just don't fucking argue, you little shit, have some respect next time you try and answer to someone who actually put effort in what he wrote, unlike you.
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>>1874055
> And than Danaoi could first just be used for the region cyprus+cilicia and later gained a bigger signification

I don't know, Danaju seems a really precise geographical location in early Egyptian texts (14th century bc), the argument you made idn't bad however, it's probably true for Keftiu which sometimes indicated Crete and in other occasions was probably used for Cilicia according to some scholars
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>>1874063
nice that I triggered you!
Yeah your right I don't pretty much about the greece and neighbors in the bronze age,which I admitted from right from the start by stating that my theory is probably bullshit but:
the so close time periods you are talking about are almost 1000 years from first Danaoi in Cilicia to Herodotus. For me that means that that it could be like a charlemagnes franks and napoleons france (more or less direct connection)or between Hre under Otto and modern Romania (almost no connection only both call them self romans).
Also since when are the happenings of the Iliad dated with less than 200 years in each direction?
I'm just very sceptical on all the connections that are made in history befor 1000 a.d. because of the often times few sources.
ceep calm and find the soloution for your problem if you don't like mine, which I have to admit is far to simplistic.
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Interesting. This is more like an unknown than a mystery though.

You can speculate that Danuna = Denyen and Sherden = Sardinia, but this isn't really much to run on.
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>>1874108
>You can speculate that Danuna = Denyen and Sherden = Sardinia

What?

Sherden and Denyen were distinct peoples in Egyptian texts both by outfit and name, though there was a commercial link between Sardinia and Cyprus/Crete as testified by archeology, it's reasonable to speculate that Denyen (Greeks/Cilicians) were allied with the Sherden (Sardinians?) when they raided Egypt as documented by Ramses III
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>>1873971
Can someone resume the mistery?
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>>1874107
The connections aren't separated by 1000 years, the Denyen/Ahhiwana are mentioned in Cilicia during the late bronze age /early iron age and so are the Danaju/Ahhiwana/Akawasa
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>>1873971
Do we know what danaoi/acheans mean other than people somehow connected to Danaos/people from achea ?
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>>1874134
No, I don't think we know the meaning of those names.
Thread posts: 14
Thread images: 3


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