Were they so good?

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>invincible
>got their asses handed to them by flems and baguettes
clearly not enough superior moorish blood in their veins

It was a gigantic immobile square. Maneuvering wins wars.

>>1806569
To be fair, it took them 30 years and they got 50% of the land they wanted.

>>1806528
It was just an effective use and organization of combined arms warfare, albeit infantry heavy.

>>1806569

they didnt lose anywhere from around 1520 to 1640 iirc, from the Italian wars to Rocroi.

I think they stopped being great when battles became more strategic, with a greater use of artillery and thin lines with gunpowder weapons instead of you and your bros stabbing people with pikes.

>>1806528
Superior at taking it in combat to other formations. It would remain fighting when other formations would break. As such, with advances in firearms technology the value of the melee soldiers decreased and more firearms-heavy units would bring enough firepower to force the tercios to break.

their formations were too slow when mobile cannons appeared.

Unlike swiss or ducth their "walk and shoot" doctrine was badass as they walked forward instead of backward.

But of of course this thread wont get many replies, in this shitty board anything apart from irrelevant "murican"/anglo history is avoided
they are greater as hollywood and their stupid videogames made them believe


this is what 4chan his should be (sorry for non spanish speakers)

http://www.elgrancapitan.org/foro/index.php

where everything is discusses unlike this; a site to wank about anglo achievements/lies

>>1806528
well they lost the battle that painting is from.

and the spanish tercios got hammered by british at the dunes so they werent that elite.

as for the tercio system itself it proved less flexible and efficient than the dutch/swedish system at breitenfield and after but was effective as a form of early combined arms albeit it was a bastard to move and vulnerable to artillery

>>1807097
Anglo here and I'm really interested in this kind of stuff. People get bored of the eternal-anglo history eventually.

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Post 16th and 17th centuries

>rocroi
MUH DICK
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=625iTKITRoA

>>1806646

Thin lines didn't do the trick.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_N%C3%B6rdlingen_(1634)

It was the improvement in range and accuracy of fire weapons what eventually enabled the thin lines formation theories to became dominant. But that was much later.

>>1807526
>the dunes
Bro the Battle of the Dunes, was 15 years after Rocroi. Tercios were already outdated by then, in their prime Tercios were absolutely unbeatable specially against english infantry.

Also nice revisionism, they lost against the British AND the fucking French. Read a fucking book.

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>>1811111
>AND the fucking French
The "fucking french" were a great military power back then you dingus

>>1806528
>>1808495

>tfw no Total War game set in the Pike and Shot Age
>No fleshed out conquest of the New World
>No Golden Age of the Ottoman Empire
>No 30 years war
>No Rise of the Swedish Empire
>No Lutheran vs Papist political dynamic

>>1806528
Oh man maybe I'm tripping but that battle loos so fucking cool

Like oh man, banding up with your bros and fighting together in huge battles, brutal combat

Oh man like coming back home with your bros and telling stories and stuff, I bet soldiers actually didn't mind soldiering

>>1811260
I love that picture.

All those petty noble douchebags with their little fucking flags.

SUCK IT VASSALS

>>1811260
i think he meant that it wasn't the british who beated them if you know what i mean

>>1806528
What's impressive about tercios is their organisation and discipline, not their tactics.

>>1811291
We definitely need a total war that's between 1494 and 1699

From start of Italian wars to end of Great Turkish War.

>>1811291
Play EU4

>>1811362

EU is mainly a political, economic simulator with some military features

TW is mainly a military simulator with some political features

There's quite big difference when you play the

>>1811405
EU4 is mainly a map painting while roleplaying simulator.

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>>1811291
There are three Medieval 2 mods that might cover your bases
>Italian Wars
Not entirely in the Pike-and-Shot era but covers the transitional period of the early and mid 16th century. Pikes and early handguns are already partially in use by most European factions in the beginning of the campaign, with newer gunpowder weaponry becoming available later. As the name implies, campaign revolves around the various Italian conflicts during the period, with the map expanding to southern France, Switzerland, South Germany, the Western Balkans, Hungary and North Africa.

>1648 (pic related)
Thirty Years War mod. Combat mechanics programmed a lot differently from any other mod to best portray Pike-and-Shot warfare. Campaign focuses on the turmoil in Germany with different counties being the factions along with some of the neighboring foreign powers like France and Imperial Spain in the Lower-Countries. Unlike the Italian Wars, there are very few old-fashioned sword/spear+shield or crossbow units.

>Ogniem i Mieczem II (With Fire and Sword)
Loosely based on the Polish novel. Like 1648, the campaign begins at the start of the Thirty Years War, in 1618 but extends to the year 1700. Map covers the Eastern Europe and extends to include Sweden, Naples, the Ottoman Empire, and parts of the Safavid Empire.

>>1811111
>they lost against the British AND the fucking French
sorry I should have been a little clearer, the spanish tercios were hammered back by the british infantry oposite them at the battle of the dunes, there were french (and english) on both side, but the point I was trying to make was that spanish tercios encountering english infantry on a battlefield were driven back in disarry

>Tercios were absolutely unbeatable specially against english infantry.
when did they ever encounter british infantry?

>>1809660
>https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_N%C3%B6rdlingen_(1634)

the problem with this argument is firstly that it was largely the mistakes and misfortunes the swedes suffered in that battle rather than the tercio which was decisive the tercios were able to hold a position against infantry assault sure but only because artillery couldnt be effectively brought to bear, it also helped that they significantly outnumbered the swedes

brietenfield on the other hand neatly demonstrated the greater flexibility of the linear formations, Tillys tercios were veterans but were torn apart, its also worth noting that the swedes fought again at wittstock and the second battle of breitenfield with victories, crushing victory at 2nd breitenfield

>>1811362
>there will never a game that is EU4 map stuff + Total War military stuff

This needs to be made

>>1811111
The Commonwealth of England's New Model Army was fucking brutal - almopst certainly the best in the world at that time. Experienced, paid veterans, well led. They assaulted the Spanish veterans up a 150 foot tall line of dunes and routed them. Ever tried even walking up a big sand dune?

>>1806569
How the fuck do you get the first post on every thread?

>>1811843

After Westfalia the Spanish Army of Flanders was severely weakened of his core fighting corps; proper Spanish Tercios. What you have in the 'Spanish Army' in The Dunes is a multinational as fuck array of units. That shit usually doesn't turn out well.

>they significantly outnumbered the Swedes

Literally the other way round. The combined Spanish-Imperial Army occupied different sectors in the battlefield, and the infantry action consisted of the Swede-Saxon army launching wave after wave against the Spanish positions while the Imperial sector saw no action except for cavalry clashing until the Swede-Saxon army got so beaten in their futile attacks against the Spanish Tercios that the Spanish counterattack send their entire army in panic and flight that turned into a slaughterhouse when the Imperial infantry joined the advance.

>>1812665
except half the swedish army was with bernard opposite the imperial positions while Horn tried to take the spanish position, that half saw little combat, until the general advance was ordered

>>1809356
Any translation on what that guy at the end who died said? Or any translation?

>>1813764
Old soldiers - to the vanguard
New soldiers - to the rearguard

voiceover:
cant understand the foirst sentence but he says the man was courageous, that his name was Diego Alatriste nd that he fought as an old (experience?) Tercio in the wars in Flanders/the lowlands. When i met him he was living in Madrid, hiring himself out(?) for 4 maravedis... and then it ends before the sentence is finished

>>1813764
That was Alatriste's adopted son basically saying that Alatriste was a great dude and the best soldier he ever met. Nothing mind-blowing.