Prayer is stupid

>>1715299
Nicely set-up straw man definition of prayer there.

>>1715314
you define it then, godcuck
do you think prayer is about those nice feelies you get when you ask the invisible sky man for a new bicycle?

>>1715299
Correct about your prayers.

Incorrect about mine.

>>1715327
You talk to God.

Pretty simple.

>>1715338
Perhaps this is what "proper" prayers are. It is undeniable that quite a few people pray for the sake of petitioning god for certain things however, I'd even argue that this is how most people pray. Just go on facebook and look a friend's page who has a sick relative or something. If that person if even slightly religiously inclined, they will ask for prayers for their relative's health. On some level, they believe that praying might make a difference on their eventual fate.

>>1715344
You can ask God for whatever you want.

If you find a way to force His hand, let us know. He pretty much does what He wants to do.

Pretty good gig, being God.

>Prayer is unnecessary and counter-intuitive because it accomplishes nothing.

it gets people to calm down, focus and feel at peace, it serves as a kind of mental higiene

thats actualy accomplishing a lot

>>1715344
>On some level, they believe that praying might make a difference on their eventual fate.

You know people have done studies on this, yes? And people who think a lot of people are praying for them do tend to recover faster?

>>1715354
Well that's exactly OP's point. Asking god for things is absolutely pointless since his judgement and scope are vastly superior to yours. If it's for the best that your mother survives cancer, god will make it so that occurs. In fact he probably already had that orchestrated since the beginning of time.

>>1715358
There might be some morale boosting placebo effect. Prayers themselves however don't seem to accomplish anything.

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/03/31/health/31pray.html

>>1715375
No, it's not pointless at all. You cannot force God's hand.

But He can decide to move it for you, as He has for me on many occasions.

It's hard to know that praying for God to heal His children (not the devil's children, His children) might mean the ultimate healing; death and resurrection. But it happens.

Jesus said "you receive not because you ask not".

So I ask for a lot.

>>1715375
>Prayers themselves however don't seem to accomplish anything.

Again, I've been witness to several medical miracles that the doctors could not explain, at all. Complete and total healings. Lumps and shadows and tumors and holes that were there one day and gone the next. So you'll never convince me prayers don't "work". It is written "the fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much."

I wonder if you're trying to convince yourself.

>>1715377
>But He can decide to move it for you
So on some level god will change his plan for your sake? I would think that if god has perfect judgement then he would never change his plan for any reason. For the simple fact that his plan is already the best possible outcome.

>>1715380
Well I linked you the scientific study but by all means, continue to put faith in anecdotal experience.

>I wonder if you're trying to convince yourself.
What are you
>implying
here my friend?

>>1715388
His plan is His plan. That's what God's express will is. He will do what He says He will do.

That does not encompass everything.

Everything else happens in God's permissive will, and in God's permissive will, He can act or not, as He chooses.

God's plan for me is to live forever with Him. That plan has been accomplished.

It's His plan for you too. He's still working on you, I can tell.

>>1715393
That didn't really answer the question. You say it doesn't hurt to request things from god, but whether or not he would give them to has surely already been decided. If you request something that is not for the ultimate good then he won't give it to you. If you request something however and it is for the ultimate good that you receive it, then he would have done it anyway.

Prayer as a means of talking to god I can understand. Prayer as a means of requesting things seems redundant.

>>1715398
You're trying to run a timeline from our perspective via a timeline from God's perspective. You're trying to talk yourself into the view that everything in your life was predetermined for you. God knowing what I will ask for and knowing He will or will not provide a response from before He made the earth does not impact upon my decision to ask. He doesn't tell me everything He knows, and His knowledge does not impact on my decision making processes.

It's a false worldview, and fatal.

>>1715457
>God knowing what I will ask for and knowing He will or will not provide a response from before He made the earth does not impact upon my decision to ask

Well logically, I can't see why it wouldn't. Again, if you like communing with god in this fashion I understand. It's just that asking for things in and of itself seems pointless, since by your own admission he already knows whether or not he's going to grant you whatever event or possession you desire.

Of course you don't know whether or not he'll give it to you, because you don't know what's best. But he does, so whether or not you ask doesn't matter. Whatever happens will be for the best.

>You're trying to talk yourself into the view that everything in your life was predetermined for you

Was trying to avoid the free will debate but if god knows the future, wholly and completely, then my life pretty much is pre-determined. Unless there were pockets of ignorance where god would not know the result to certain decisions I make ahead of time. But that intrudes on the concept of omniscience.

>>1715299
Prayer is just a psychological trick in order to make yourself feel better. Kind of like believing in an afterlife. Or God.