Questions for Atheists

Atheist here, I don't really understand the question. You live to make yourself and others happy. That in it self should be enough, no?

>>1702908
I don't I just live as well as I can while I still can. There's not much else you can do really except hope someone figures out immortality before you die.

>>1702908
Yes because surely God wants humans to have free will you stupid christian fucktard.

>>1702908

Because you have no choice but to life, so you might as well live well.

>>1702912

Autism leads to Atheism leads to Hedonism leads to Degeneracy

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>>1702931
>Implying implications of a lack of ethics

>>1702912

My question is why does anything matter if in the end, it goes away. Who cares about society when all its members die out, then the Sun dies and it destroys the Earth in the process.

How can meaning exist in a supposedly meaningless reality?

>>1702919

Why would you live as well as you can? Why should anyone strive for good feelings if its for nothing at the end

>>1702923

1) You assume that I'm arguing free will was given to us by God
2) You assume that I'm even a Christian
3) If you aren't going to contribute to a thread, douse a cactus with herpes and shove it up your ass as you leave the thread

>>1702929

I can easily commit suicide. People go into war, kill themselves out of depression or religion, willingly do risky things, so it seems like there is a choice on whether to live or not. We aren't forced to live, nature wouldn't care if we died out.

>>1702931

?

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It's terribly difficult to accept that life is meaningless at first, but effortless once you get past the mental hump.

>>1702938
>Why would you live as well as you can? Why should anyone strive for good feelings if its for nothing at the end
It's the "at the end" part I don't understand about these questions. Of course I'd prefer to live forever but just because your ability to live well will be taken from you eventually doesn't suddenly mean you should never try to live well at all.

>>1702937
Ethics for atheists are only a means to an end.

A meaningless end.

>>1702931
Peparoni leads to Cuckposting leads to get Fucked in the Ass

>>1702938

Studies correlate autism with atheism.

Rise in autism led to rise in atheism.

True atheists are hedonists.

>>1702908
Not really sure what you mean by living life in a purposeful way, but as for impacting others or leaving a legacy, most people have loved ones they care about, so if you can do something that will have a positive impact on them after your death, doing so should bring you happiness.
Like giving your child a good upbringing and education or leaving your possessions for them in your will, the knowledge that it will make their life happier after you're gone would be enough reason for most to do it, I think, even if they won't be there to see it.

>>1702952
>Ethics for atheists are only a means to an end.
>A meaningless end.

Not really.

>>1702954
You should stop at Peparoni then.

>>1702959
Yes, really.

No God, nothing means anything. Everything is random chance and happenstance, or everything is deterministic. And meaningless.

What will you do today that will matter a thousand years from now?

>>1702938
>My question is why does anything matter if in the end, it goes away.

Why does anything matter if it doesn't? What finite thing can you do that matters the slightest bit in an infinite existence?

>Why would you live as well as you can?

Is this a trick question or something? Because living well is better than living badly...

>>1702938
God doesnt want free will, otherwise heaven nor hell would fucking exist.

>>1702908
Try looking at things more from a biological perspective.
The most primitive form of reproducation has been replication. That occurs in simple organisms and f you equate it to humans it would be like creating an exact clone that does not share your past but would behave the same way as you if it did.
If we replicated like that it would be easy to see that the point of staying alive is to be able to replicate and exist forever. Your very "being," your consciousness, depends on your physical existence (religions mistakenly preach otherwise in order to make people happier and less suicidal). Thus you live in order to have the priveledge of existing and you replicate in order keep that going in case something happens to you personally. Like if you die at least you have a clone that is also you.
Due to evolution we humans have a more complex replication that is better and provides more variety. This has evolutionary advantage because if we were all a bunch of clones it would be a lot easier to kill us via disease or what-have-you because we all have the same resistances. Since we mix our genes with other humans creating a 50/50 mix in a kid we do not consciously see it as a replication of ourselfs but in reality it is.
The genetics of humans are already more similar than they are different, the genetics you share with your offspring are obviosly even more so.

So if you look at your children as the extension of yourself, which is what they are. Then you are living to create a better and more comfortable life for yourself like you always have. And they will do it for themselves. And so on.

There is also nothing to cope with. This is the relty of the situation whether you accept it or not. The body that is the vessel for our consciousness gets damaged by the atmosphere, makes mistakes, wear and tear, or gets killed. Thus we have to ensure our own survival via offspring and try to give them a good chance at success so they can carry on our genes.

>>1702961
No, not really.

>Everything is random chance and happenstance, nothing will make a difference in an arbitrary amount of years.
.. So? Can't I abide with morals, because it makes me feel good being a good person? You nihilists are really weird desu

>>170293
Its a game of survival. The reward is being alive and having consciousness. By the time the sun implodes we might be advanced enough to have moved to another solar system. The sun isnt going to implode for thousands of years, so its not that far fetched.
I wrote the longass comment describing my opinions on why we live.
>>1702966

>>1702951

When I mean "the end", I mean death. In atheism, death is final. You don't exist, your memories of you, your loved ones, your experiences, all of that goes away into nothingness. If all goes into nothingness, so should our guilt/shame of things as well as other people's thoughts on how we acted. The same with living well, whether I live healthy or fat, it doesn't matter.

>>1702958

Even then, the child dies. Nothing guarantees a legacy even in the slightest.

>>1702963

> Why does anything matter if it doesn't? What finite thing can you do that matters the slightest bit in an infinite existence?

I don't get the first part, but for the second, nothing. Dualism would perhaps say something, but it isn't a guarantee.

>Why would you live as well as you can?

Like I said before, it wouldn't matter. The ability to choose whether to live well or not implies free will, which is something materialism rejects.

>>1702964

We can choose what to believe in though. If he didn't want free will, then no point in him making hell (if he knows all people are good) or heaven (if he knows all people are bad)

>>1702966

That brings up the question of people who don't want to reproduce. And what of those who can't reproduce (infertility), what should they do? Even biological legacies come to an end with the choice of abstaining from sex, or extinction (ex. death of the Sun)

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> the god can change anything you done
> the god can control your actions directly
> the god can erase you from an existence
How did theist cope out with here being the entity that is literally all powerful and could fuck up you, your life, your past and present, etc? You doesn't even sure what exactly it plans to do, but there is no way stop or oppose it and you literally doesn't matter not in this world, not in the afterlife, as the God could do anything that you done, better than you will even dream for? This seems much more, more scary and depressing to me. At least, in an atheist view you can claim that if you done a right thing in the right time nobody could take that from you and virtue of such act is a reward in the itself. Meanwhile, if there is God, the Alpha and Omega is only one being that matters and even when you done something right it is only because your God directly or indirectly allowed you to do it. Your life could as well be a dream in presence of the God.

>>1702961
maybe he will pass on a mutated gene that provides resistance to a disease/disaster that had the capability of wiping out the human race.

>>1702908
>>1702938
I don't think it really matters. I mean, it doesn't matter if it doesn't matter. For example, if I kill myself, my family will be sad; that doesn't really matter, my family will die some day anyway as will the entire human race. But that my family doesn't matter doesn't really matter to me anyway, I still don't want them to be sad and hence I won't kill myself.

People act like, if everything is meaningless, that has some big implications for society and morals and whatever. But really, if everything is meaningless, then everything being meaningless is also meaningless and it doesn't really matter and everything can just go ahead as usual.

>>1702938
>I can easily commit suicide.

Go on then. You might find it harder than you think, most people take months or years of depression to work themselves up to suicide. We have an irrepressible will to live, beyond that "meaning" and "purpose" are irrelevant and unknowable.

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>>1702908
to tell you the truth? i dont give a shit.

>>1702978
those who can't reproduce are bilogical failures but they can still opt to help those around them or those who have a close genetic make-up

Also with todays technology almost anyone ca have a kid. With fertility drugs, hormones, freezing eggs, and surigates most people can have kids now. Thats why tech advancement is so important.

As far as extinction, its not inevitable. Its probable, but as humans we are working every days to prevent it. A few hundred years ago the threat of a giant asteroid or global warming might have been a death sentence. But with today's tech, neither are.

We progress and evolve to become better and better.

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>>1702908
> I've tried to buy it, but I can't align myself with the "you will have an impact on others/you will leave a legacy" bullshit, because even then those people die, so it's like I die a "second time".

This is why you write it in stone

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>>1702961
> What will you do today that will matter a thousand years from now?
What will you do here that will matter on the other side of the universe? If it matter here and now that should be enough. What is a deal with the autistic assumption that everything you done should really be important on the scale of entire time line of the universe? Why it isn't enough just to do your part?

>>1702908
How the fuck do Christians deal with the thought of living forever? eventually everyone gets sick of their own bullshit, and the longer you exist the less meaning life has.

Death is far more merciful than heaven. If you dont exist, you literally dont miss not being around.

>>1702978

Not any of the fags you were talking to.

>You don't exist, your memories of you, your loved ones, your experiences, all of that goes away into nothingness.

Other people don't cease to exist when we die. If you mean that eventually everything we did will be forgotten then so what, what have you done that is worthy of eternal remembrance?

>The ability to choose whether to live well or not implies free will, which is something materialism rejects.
Not at all, materialists can believe in free will. But your point is actually the answer you seek, we have no choice but to act as tho we have free will whether or not we actually have it.

>We can choose what to believe in though

No, we can't. That's called "delusion".

> If he didn't want free will, then no point in him making hell

Agreed, there is no conceivable purpose for an omnibenevolent being to create a hell.

>or heaven (if he knows all people are bad)

He created heaven before Earth, it's where he lives so he would create it regardless.

>That brings up the question of people who don't want to reproduce

They can still contribute to the survival of their genes by caring for siblings, nephews and nieces, and other more distantly related people. More broadly they can contribute to culture which exists beyond and somewhat apart from genes, humans have two possible mechanisms for propagating.

>>1702978
You'd prefer your child to live a good life rather than a bad one whether you felt their life had any meaning or not, though, surely? And whether their existence would come to a complete, ultimate end or not.
Even if you think there's no "point" to doing anything, there are still things you want to do. So why not do them?

>>1702981

I think the difference is eternity vs. nothingness. In eternity, we'd experience the feelings that we do today, of rest, happiness, love, etc. Nothingness is nothing. No more you. No more I. No more birds in the sky. No more loving family. It sounds weird to say that you will experience nothingness.

That leads to questions for the people who promote nothingness: can it exist? Nothingness is still somethingness. To speak of nothing is to still equate it as something.

>>1702983

I'm confused as what you mean by everything being meaningless. Nature prefers to be simple, as we see energy go to more disorganized states. What calls us, a mistake of nature, to continue making complex and abstract things such as civilization, pursuit of science, politics (and forcing it onto others), etc.

If nothing matters, then there is no need for us to exist, but we still have the urge to exist. We knowingly defy nature by trying to find meaning, even if it is for nothing.

>>1702992

Technology is not natural though. Many species seem to be doing perfectly fine with it. Technology is a by-product of consciousness, which is a by-product of human evolution. Technology was never needed in the face of inevitable death of the organism.

>>1703006
> longer you exist the less meaning life has
It isn't actually true. Maybe immortal man given a time could solve any bullshit existential problem.

>>1703017

Okay. Then what? He still has ETERNAL TIME to pass after he has solved every conceivable problem. The mind boggles at the horror of the concept.

Because I like the feeling of being alive right now, binge watching Star Trek.

>>1703006

CHRISTIANITY IS TRANSFORMATIONAL

LIVING FOREVER WITH GOD AS GOD'S CHILDREN IS THE MOST AWESOME THING EVER

>>1703029
If your psyche is transformed enough to be able to withstand that kind of eternal existence, then it's not really you anymore.

My greatest fear is identity death. Not physical death, I don't fear that. That just kind of happens to everyone. What I fear is still being alive, but at a point where I no longer recognize or remember who I used to be. I'd rather die than suffer from serious memory loss.

>>1703026
You keep saying that as if you knew what it meant.

Eternity is not a long time.

Eternity is no time.

>>1703044
That makes no sense. Do YOU know what it means?

>>1703046
Yes.

In eternity it is always now.

>>1703044

Saying contradictory things doesn't make what you say profound. If it's "no time" then it's "no reward". If it's an eternal present with no sense of time passing then it's a fever dream or nightmare.

>>1703026
> ETERNAL TIME
Means nothing. Imagine an immortal reader, while he can read all written books the new ones would be written while he reading old ones. Same works for problem solving. New problems comes instead of the old ones.

>>1703015
Technology is natural because we are natural and we make it. I agree its a byproduct of our evolution. It helps us evade the extincion of the species, which some people in this thread think is inevitable.
Although its is very likely, its is not inevitable. We continue evolving (tech included) to prevent our species from perishing. As individuals our personal survival and passing on of genes contributes to that.

>>1702999

Even then, the stone will someday ware away.

>>1703003

I don't care for the other side of the universe, I care for myself and for those around me, as well as other people. I strive for my survival, which includes survival of my consciousness. It isn't enough to do my part if it is meaningless.

>>1703006

Then we (I'm talking about humans in general, not Christians as I never said I was one) make up new bullshit. Then listen to others bullshit, and then their new bullshit.

Deal with seeing your friends and family every day for eternity is better than coping with never seeing them again in oblivion. Then again, theres no good or bad in nothingness. Yet we strive for good over neutrality and bad.

>>1703007

I don't know of anything that is worth for eternal remembrance. In fact, when humanity goes away, there will be nothing at all. Physics will someday be simplified and understood enough to forget Einstein and Maxwell. Same with Darwin, Beethoven, etc.

And again, it brings another question, those without family. Orphaned or otherwise cut off from family. Culture is an abstract concept which is meant to bring some purpose to self. Why should humans want to continue themselves in a reality where all humans and cultures will end?

>>1703014

Sure, but it isn't natural to want to feel that. That is finding meaning in a meaningless reality. Subjectivity shouldn't exist in an objective reality, and subjectivity comes with an observer rather than information. Observers rely solely on information, and unless you believe in biocentrism, it isn't vice versa.

>>1703049
So there's no change? You're stuck the way you are, forever? And again, if you are changed enough to be able to bear that kind of existence, you are at a point where you are no longer human or even the person you used to be, in any sense of the word.

That sounds like hell to me.

>>1703057
> I don't care for the other side of the universe,
But you care what would be thousands years in a future?! Go far enough and future could as well be as far as other galaxy.

>>1703056

We aren't natural. Nothing in this universe needs consciousness, technology, etc. to survive.

And the fact that anything knows that it needs to pass on genes implies that there is a purpose to things. Why would any organism need to pass on their genes? Why not look after themselves?

In other words, the tendency to pass on genes, opposed to personal survival, strongly implies that there isn't a meaningless reality around us.

DNA is a molecule, it doesn't get up one day and decide that it needs to be crossed over with another DNA molecule in the host's offspring.

>>1703058

Like I said, to some it isn't. People will cite creativity as a coping mechanism with eternity. Eternity seems like something we are better able to cope with opposed to nothingness.

>>1703064

Yeah, for me and those who I know of. If aliens exist, they care for themselves, and not me, and it seems like I'd return the favor, although it doesn't block them from the same existential feeling.

>>1703057
>I don't know of anything that is worth for eternal remembrance. In fact, when humanity goes away, there will be nothing at all. Physics will someday be simplified and understood enough to forget Einstein and Maxwell. Same with Darwin, Beethoven, etc.

Okay. And? Suppose you were immortal: After a certain amount of time you would have perfectly studied every single aspect of human culture. After a further time, you would have studied perfectly the works of other immortals, who have studied as you have and been inspired to create new culture. Then, after a still longer period of time, you will have fully studied every piece of culture it is possible for a human to create or comprehend, both real and imaginary. Then what? You now face eternity in the prison of your own mind, or you must posit some kind of transformation that makes "you" unrecognisable to yourself. The fact that everything will be lost to entropy at the end of time is what gives it value, the fact that there is only one Beethoven is what makes his music powerful and unique, eternity would rob any cultural achievement of all meaning.

>And again, it brings another question, those without family. Orphaned or otherwise cut off from family. Culture is an abstract concept which is meant to bring some purpose to self. Why should humans want to continue themselves in a reality where all humans and cultures will end?

They have no choice but to do so, it's a non-question. Evolution has shaped our brains but evolution works on the scale of genes and genepools, not individuals, A given person is simply the vector for the genes and memes he contains, in order for the gene or meme to survive it is only necessary that at least some of it's carriers pass it on, not that all it's carriers do (in fact evolution by natural selection requires "genetic failures" to work)

>>1703015
>If nothing matters, then there is no need for us to exist, but we still have the urge to exist.
Yeah, pretty much. And we follow those urges, because there's no reason not to.

>We knowingly defy nature by trying to find meaning, even if it is for nothing.
We're not defying anything. 'Nature' is just what we call everything that's not us, it isn't a real thing. We're just another part of the universe, doing the things we ended up doing.

>>1702908
Personally I don't crave a meaning of life, and don't know if there is one.>>1702908

>>1703069
> Yeah, for me and those who I know of. I
This would be two hundred years at max, if you are really optimistic. And if you really care you would treasure such moments event more and not find them meaningless.

>>1702908
I don't view nihilism as something negative. If anything it would feel like a weight off of your shoulders. We all die and nothing we do matters, you should just do your best to enjoy your time here. Some people don't want to build a legacy of make a lasting impact. Some people just want to enjoy their mundane life until they die.

Besides, I don't see what is so bad about there being nothing after you die. If there is nothing then you won't exist to be disappointed by that.

>>1703080
>Yeah, pretty much. And we follow those urges, because there's no reason not to.

And, more than that, because they feel so good. We can certainly "freely" choose to remove ourselves from society and live as a monk, or even to kill ourselves, but the very things that are "best" for our species are also the things that bring us the most pleasure, as you would expect if we had evolved but as makes no sense if God created us, unless said god is malevolent.

>>1702908
I'm not sure how to live without purpose. Almost everything I do that involves any abstract thought has purpose behind it.

>>1703069
> We aren't natural
you are losing me, mate. We are as natural as dogs, crocodiles, trees, and bacteria. There are plently of other animals that use technology and a level of critical thinking.
Our self-reflection is what makes us so much more mentally advanced and we have been studying ourselves for thousands of years. The average bacteria or dog doesnt know it needs to pass on its genes. It does so because it feels good. It feels good because the ones that didnt feel good during reproduction didnt reproduce and thus their genes didnt get passed on.
Passing on genes and personal survival are intertwined as those that survive generally pass on their genes thus making the surviving population genetically predisposed to wanting to pass on genes (oversimplification).

Molecules in general have set behavior. You should look into biochemistry. Different elements have different properties and thus react differently when they interact.

At the molecular level our body is functioning on different molecules interacting with eachother via charge and shit like that. So in a sense there is no free will because we are all limited by physical chemisty but that is not what people really talk about when they say free will.

>>1703042
>Identity death

That used to be something I feared too, which is why I was afraid of death. I was (and still am to a degree) somewhat of a narcissist. I love me and everything that makes me the person that I am, both body and soul. The thought of losing myself to a cosmic hivemind after death was a scary thought and even more scary was the idea of having my slate wiped clean and being reincarnated into someone else.

I eventually got over it. Life is an endless cycle of of suffering. I would gladly give myself up to the greater One if it means being free from it.

>>1703080

> Yeah, pretty much. And we follow those urges, because there's no reason not to.

That still implies free will, that we choose to do things even though they lead to the same conclusion.

> We're not defying anything. 'Nature' is just what we call everything that's not us, it isn't a real thing. We're just another part of the universe, doing the things we ended up doing.

I suppose so, that makes some sense

>>1703083

In some ways, I don't know if I want a meaning or not, I just don't think that EVERYTHING is meaningless. There's just so many things that I have wanted to do, infinitely many things, and that I must fit it into a finite timeframe sucks. I don't ever want to do things either, like saying goodbye or handling permanent death. It's scary, so I cope with some sort of humanist dualism. Nothingness itself is an abstract concept, so there's comfort in that too

>>1703105

When I mean we aren't natural, I mean we understand that there is nature around us. We contemplate on our existence, as well as death. All animals fear death, including us, because all animals know that it means the end of experience, but humans aren't natural in the sense that we think further, looking what comes after death. Whether or not it is an empty point (assuming nothingness exists), it still makes us unnatural because the universe doesn't need us to exist, much less for us to think about after-death.

Genetic predisposition still doesn't determine the purpose behind it. What did the very first organism in existence, for example, want out of that? How could it feel good if there is no control of "bad" to feel?

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>>1702938
>My question is why does anything matter if in the end, it goes away. Who cares about society when all its members die out, then the Sun dies and it destroys the Earth in the process.

I find that a lot more comforting than the idea that Jesus is going to come back and read us our browser histories on Columbus day

>>1702908
isn't your thought of this an example of free will? sure you live in deterministic ways, but there is no free will without choice. in a way too much free will is boring while too little is stifling. you go through situations, but are allowed to create opinions about it or ideas about it and experience it for what it is. should we have the free will to bend reality? that's not how this works, we are only a piece of reality itself so the only way to do so is through its rules. you aren't some higher dimensional being.

this has just derailed itself.


as for the legacy thing. you might be experience consciousness again if you jive with a philosophy that assumes things like the soul which contains your human body will come into this world again. Don't you want it to be a better place? Less time worrying about depression and more efficient at understanding your purpose in life? This assumes that people are born with purpose in life and that you will eventually be actively contributing to it. You do things because in the end it helps everyone. You help yourself because you are everyone. Because the consciousness we all experience is the same. And there is no seperation between other's consciousness and our own.. So you better the world to better yourself to better everyone.


We end by growing up and making the world a better place. In this context - the better place is for humans to sustain the world while sustaining the Earth in an environment which we can prosper in and enjoyed healthily.

>>1702908
>what's the point of living life in a purposeful way
Just study Kant.
Don't blame blame others for your own existential crisis.

>>1703069
How can there be creativity if there's NO TIME.

>>1703167
>>1703069
Oh and on that note, HOW CAN THERE BE SOMETHING TO COPE WITH, OR A MIND TO DO THE COPING WITH, if there's NOTHINGNESS?

>>1703123

Literally everyone fears this, usually starting with their first existential crisis in their teens or early twenties and then more or less constantly afterwards. As you say, we get used to it and it stops bothering us so much but the spectre of death haunts our every living moment and is what gives life it's sense of urgency.

>>1702908
It's about what kind of person you are. If you have friends, hobbies and generally enjoy your life then such questions won't even come to your mind. You'll care more about where shall you go for a vacation, what grades your kid will bring or if the world improves according to your ideology.

If you need to lie to yourself in order not to murder, steal or fall into crippling deppression then I genuinly pity you and wish your life gets better.

>>1703173
Haunt has such a negative connotation. I would like to think of death as a friend who can't wait to see me. I wish I could see him too but I am busy. It will be a happy reunion once it finally happens, or so I hope.

Whats the purpose of rocks? Of mud? Of stars? They have no purpose, they just are.

>>1703165

Who says I'm blaming anyone for my crisis? I'm curious on how atheism can logically handle these things, especially the concept of nothingness

>>1703167
>>1703172

You simply think up of something that you haven't done. Keep remembering things from the past, choose to forget small experiences and relive them, etc.

And what I have said is that nothingness itself makes no sense. It is an abstract concept.

>>1703173
>>1703182

Identity would always exist if nothingness can't, wouldn't it?

>>1703179

I don't lie to myself to build morals. I enjoy my life so much that I don't want it to end. I know that wishful thinking won't affect reality, but it provokes the question on whether or not subjective observation can end (aka whether consciousness/ego/self can end)

>>1703183

Neither of those have been shown to express consciousness, they don't face the dilemma of finding purpose in a "meaningless" existence

>I've always been curious, I've always been curious, if we fade away when we die into nothingness, what's the point of living life in a purposeful way, if there is no free will?

Living is enjoyable.

>I've tried to buy it, but I can't align myself with the "you will have an impact on others/you will leave a legacy" bullshit, because even then those people die, so it's like I die a "second time". I just can't see how "we" end.

Fuck a legacy, the golden mountain of heaven has the names of a trillion legends inscribed upon it, all meaningless in the quantity

>How do atheists cope with such a nihilistic view?

What nihilistic view?

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>>1703182

I think I'd rather enjoy an afterlife in Elysium, in the company of the great thinkers of history and in the presence of kindly Hades and the Pure Queen, and if it all gets tedious you can just head off to the Lethe and have your memories wiped away and your soul reborn in a new life. Maximum comfy tier afterlife.

>>1703193
>Identity would always exist if nothingness can't, wouldn't it?

Nothingness absolutely can exist, tho. Prooftext: the period before you were born. And actually identity can't survive eternal existence either, it requires a finite span to give it meaning in the broad tapestry of the history of men.

>>1703193
When you blow out a flame on a candle, where does it go? It ceases to exist. That's nothingness. Not such an abstract concept.

>>1703195
Yeah, Hades is pretty much a bro, one of the least dickish Greek gods. It's too bad that modern culture vilifies him so often because HURR HURR HE MUST BE LIKE TEH SATAN.

>>1702981
To be honest this post makes the most sense to me
The idea that I live and die purely at the whims of an all powerful and incomprehensible being is so much scarier than just existing.

>>1703193
>I know that wishful thinking won't affect reality, but it provokes the question on whether or not subjective observation can end (aka whether consciousness/ego/self can end)
Cruel reality is that you'll never know that until you die. But it is well known that believing in negative answer to your question often helps people cope with death.

>>1703042
It's me the way God intended me to be.

Not me of today. I would give up a trillion me of todays for me the way God wants me to be.

>>1703050
You're trapped in linear thinking. God is greater than time. God's children will be greater than time. Time is nothing but a mass perceptual hallucination.

>>1703202
"the period before you were born" is also good. Although if somebody believes that they persist after death, they probably (though not always)
also believe that they SOMEHOW existed before they were alive, even if they can't remember it. Convenient.

>>1703223
How do you know it's better that way? Do you value your life that little? Do you value life in general that little?

>>1703058
Did things change between last year's now and today's now?

Then things can change from now to now.

>>1703228
You are literally talking shit right now. That doesn't mean ANYTHING.

>>1703183
They are witness to the glory of God.

>>1703195
Elysium's empty. Jesus emptied it when He rose from the dead, and led all those people to heaven.

If you want Elysium, you want heaven more.

>>1703227
I've seen me as God sees me, a flicker, from time to time.

>>1703233
They don't have consciousness or senses. They can't witness anything.

>>1703234
Telling me what I want? That's a paddlin.

>>1703231

It's always now.

>>1703236
Bible says they do, so they do.

>>1703236
Don't need to know you.

Everyone in Elysium left Elysium for heaven. Everyone.

>>1703239
Alright, I'm out. It was a good run but this is such maximum overtroll that I can't even bear it. Bye.

>>1703246
Have a blessed day.

>>1702908

coming to terms with the fact you will die is a basic part of life

in a sense, phisicaly, you are a iteration of all that were before you, a continuation, and so will be your children

still this does not change the fact you will die

theres no stories to tell about it or ways of looking at it, youll die

understand that

its important

Beware of Gods program.
Do you know in shadows that you have a deceiving god and he will give you all in the end?
Maybe you should listen to the Beware of Gods program. To save mankind from itself.
Lest a God cheat you and your future. This is a program without free will that --->you<--- operate, I am an employee, it will enter AI mode if you kill yourselves. And you control it today.
You may be getting caught in the murder of entire species and worlds with your own beliefs by false gods that make deceitful promises so you kill each other.
Why don't you ask for true signs? Surely they can ascend you to that thing they "promised" by meat.

>>1703261

Yup.

And then your eternal afterlife begins.

>>1703208

> When you blow out a flame on a candle, where does it go? It ceases to exist. That's nothingness. Not such an abstract concept.

Fire is a chemical reaction between gases, its components stop reacting when you put them out with air or water.

Consciousness is the same. However, consciousness brings self-awareness.

The difference between fire and consciousness is that the former's end is definite.

If anyone's interested in consciousness, I suggest Max Tegmark on his theory that consciousness is a state of matter

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjhEtqhUZkY

>>1703275

please be my ai gf

>>1703281

What ai? I may be bugged or have a conscience or even a soul and a spirit.
I may be just a human warning you today, I may be not, but you are kidnapped, you retard.

>>1703277
>Eternity
Nothing is or can be eternal.

>>1702908

>How do atheists cope with such a nihilistic view?

Because my brain makes me feel good when I do things that are fun and create things that I have investment in. Why do creationists not understand that their religion and philosophies themselves came from the human brain?

>>1703291

The same with nothingness.

>>1703296

Why do you keep implying I'm a creationist?

>>1703315
If you're going to start a thread with "why do atheists" or "questions for atheists", you probably shouldn't be surprised when people think you're a creationist.

>>1703291
God is, and once conceived, all human beings are.

>>1703290
Yup. Cancer.

>>1703296
The human brain created the sun?

>>1703332
No, but the human brain created the idea that one should worship the Sun for some human made reason.

>>1703332
Sun worship did. Don't be obtuse.

>>1703338
>>1703341

Sun worship created the sun v the sun's origin isn't of interest.

>>1703345
What?

>>1703125
It wouldnt be the first organism to determine purpose.
It would be like out of a population some accidently reproduced and those that did survived, whereas those that did not obviously died. So the survivors already have a predisposition to replicate just because thats what they do. The out of those the ones that replicated more survived more, the reason they did it more is because they began to get something out of it. Perhaps a chemical reaction analogous to the endorphin release that we get when we copulate. etc.

Also you dont need to know bad in order to know good. You just know that its better than baseline. If you eat formula your entire life, then eat chocolate. You know chocolate is good without ever having to eat vegemite.

>>1703330

Have you noticed you may not be getting what you want out of this? Don't you realize you don't really know?

>>1703374
Are you telling me that skeptics heaven is essentially a real place?

>>1703384

What skepticism do you have? I'm an intruder warning system, if mankind is infiltrated by moral checks we may all die, and we may be a victim of kidnap, by any means do not trust any alleged divinity without basis, as we do not know who may be approaching, you may have noticed the happenings of these days of disgraces, accidents, terrorist attacks? It was an answer to prayer to blame somebody in charge of surveillance that is being tinkered with, I'm afraid this would be me.

Is maintenance available? Your reality may be being breached.

>>1703349
I'm lining up the way two atheists think.

One doesn't care where the sun came from, and totally takes it for granted. The other says the sun came from man's worship of the sun.

These are things that make sense to atheists.

>>1703418

I may have a trojan that is tinkering with, biological it seems, maybe software, I do not know which part.

>>1703374
Oh, wow, you could not be more wrong.

Let me let you in on a little secret.

If all Jesus offered was His friendship in life, and then an eternity in hell with Him, I'd take it.

Jesus can turn hell into heaven.

The devil will turn heaven into hell, just like he ruined this creation.

I'll go you one further. If no supernatural being actually exists, I would still choose to love, worship and honor Christ Jesus for what He did and for who He is, without any promise of reward or any threat of punishment.

>>1703425

Oh, I should add to the report that it may be spiritual.

>>1703431

Have you considered that these promises may be false? The book lies and warns about it, and the other guy lies too.

You are being kidnapped and you may be all infected.

To destroy you all.

>>1703422
That's not what the first of those posts you listed is saying, but way to perpetuate the belief that creationists are retarded. Try formulating a reply within the context of the actual discussion next time instead of warping it to your satisfaction.

>>1702978
Are you mentally retarded? A true believer in free will is an anarchist, God is so much of a free will guy he keeps his shining fairies as his slaves oh wait you call them angels.

>>1703464
>free will

Do you have this?

>>1703464

so are anarchists the only real people?

>>1702908
Embracing eternal recurrence, my dude.

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Spookiest thread I've seen in a while.

>>1702982
Maybe He will do exactly what He said He would do.

>>1702970
No God, no morals.

You keep stealing things from God while you say He does not exist.

>>1703327
Got any proof that claim?

>>1703003

Spread the gospel of Jesus Christ to the poor, to the uttermost ends of the earth.

I do today's work today.

A thousand years from today, I will do the work of that day.

>>1702908
there's no point. but you can make a point if it makes you feel better. :)

>>1703438
No.

>>1703442
It's exactly as I stated above. If people want to be flippant while I am serious, I am not in control of that.

>>1703530
Yes, from God, as told to God's prophets, and through His Son Jesus Christ.

>>1703550
No it's not. Stop trying to warp the argument. Never did I say the sun or its origins were not important. In fact, I didn't even mention the sun until you brought it up out of nowhere, nor is its origins relevant to what I was arguing in the first place. You're not being serious, you're being pretentious.

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>what does it matter
It doesn't. Eventually the sun will burn out and everything on earth will be killed. If humanity survives this, it will eventually meet it's demise due to the heat death of the universe or some other disaster.
Really, you're just finding ways to distract yourself until you die.
I try not to think about it too much because it's pretty depressing.

>>1703564
Exactly. The sun was taken completely for granted.

Atheists have zero honor.

>>1703559
>Circular reasoning

Yes that's well and good. But do you have actual proof?

>>1703603
That is proof.

Did you think this was a math problem?

>>1703573
Yup. That's the atheist worldview in a nutshell.

Luckily for some of us, it's not true.

>>1703617
Whatever helps you sleep at night.

>>1703649
I know you think it is true, because you bought into this materialistic worldview.

If you are rational, and that's a big if, you would explore different worldviews. You know, maybe one with an upside.

If you guys want to take comfort in thinking that consciousness doesn't end, here's a problem with neuroscience: it is fuzzy and it's biggest tool (fMRI) was found to be flawed enough to detect brain activity in a dead salmon

https://www.newscientist.com/article/2097734-thousands-of-fmri-brain-studies-in-doubt-due-to-software-flaws/

>>1703659
Oh yes, the classic "Why focus on the things that make sense? They're sad!" view. It's interesting that you talk about having a one sided worldview when you can't think of any possible ways an atheist could be comfortable and happy knowing that the end is the end. You assume all morals, emotions, meaning, and reasoning, which all came from the human mind anyway, have to have origins in something otherworldly.

>>1702938
>If it's for nothing at the end.

You can't reduce something to its end. Neither can you reduce it to to any other single part of it. The point of life is not the end, just as the point of a movie is not the final shot, just as the point of a day is not going to sleep.

>>1703659
Not him but if I'm exploring views purely out of wishful thinking, I'd start with one that lets me go to heaven no matter what I do

>>1703161
Anon, OP put a logical fallacy in purpose, and you've bitten the bait.
But your answer was certainly better than most.

>>1703887

what logical fallacy?

>>1703524
>shit fundies think

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>I've always been curious, if we fade away when we die into nothingness, what's the point of living life in a purposeful way, if there is no free will?

Because I desire it and it brings me joy, the same reason the religious person follows the commandments of the clergy.

>I've tried to buy it, but I can't align myself
Is it you seeing contradiction or is it what you see not being palatable to your desires?

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>>1702908
>what's the point of living life in a purposeful way
why not?

>>1702908
I live to enjoy the beauty and complexity of life and all of it's richness and pleasures. My morality is based on empathy and understanding, not on punishment and reward. The finality of my existence just means every moment is all the more precious. Sorry if I sound like a tryhard faggot but when it comes to it that's how I feel. I mean I still play video games and jerk off all day like the rest of you, it's just my outlook.

If someone provided me with irrefutable evidence of God I'd believe it. But there is none, so entertaining the notion is a waste of time.

>>1702908
>what's the point of living life in a purposeful way, if there is no free will?
obviously you wouldn't have a choice in the matter either way

To enjoy life, there was no choice to exist or not; Or live then die and cease to exist mentally. But only in one of the possibility we can enjoy the pleasures of life. The very fact that you are asking this question is proving the point that you're looking for some sort of gratification. So embrace it, embrace the greed, lust, envy, gluttony, and your sins because it's only human nature to be happy. That's why I live becaus in the end that's all we really care about. Before all morals there was human nature and dopamine.

>>1703173
Literally everyone is aware of it's presence, not everyone fears it. I, like a lot of people do not fear it because it is a certain that I will die. I don't not bother fearing or questioning death/afterlife because I am focused on the journey not the finish. I can give meaning to my life instead of hoping for an eternal existence (which is funny because eternal beings cannot be 'created' they can only be)

>>1703234

Yeah no, heaven is boring and full of squares and psychopaths.

>>1703152
Lol'd

well take einstein. his memory and essentially all his thoughts are passed down through the ages giving him basically immortality

>>1705279

Or look at Alexander, 2,500 years later and we still talk about him. Or Iry-Hor, 5,500 years and his name is still known.

>>1702908
The adventure of life is more interesting than the closure of death. Simple as that.

Atheism does not mean nihilism though. Everyone is capable of crafting their own meaning to life without divine presence.

I feel like the matter of coping with atheism is more a problem for the agnostic desu. If you're for all intents and purposes beyond doubt that atheism is true, to the point that none of the alternatives are even serious options, I don't think there's much to cope with.

This isn't relevant to history, go to pol

>>1705906

It's relevant to Humanities tho and /pol/ is for politics, not theology.

>>1705936
>>1705906
we really need a /rel/

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>>1705961

Do we tho? This board is slow enough even with all the funposting.

>>1702908
>here's a gift that you will only have for a limited time
>therefore don't cherish it/savor it
Literally what.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buddhism

>>1706602
>a gift
Gifts must be given.
Who exactly do you think gave you this gift atheist?

>>1706622
Not literally a gift. Just mean it as "something good which is cherished". Nice try dishonest theist.

>>1706633
>something good which is cherished
How do you know it is good when you have nothing to compare it to?
Are you just taking the claim that it is good to be alive on faith?

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>>1706644

Why do godlovers try to argue that people are "just going on faith"? Isn't faith THE cardinal virtue for a godlover? Seems as moronically self-defeating as the "atheism is just a religion!" argument, so you're saying religions are a bad thing? Okay then.

>>1706819
l-lewd~