Who was worse /his/ Nazi Germany or the Soviet Union

The Soviet Union was worse. People had to work with the same wages, give up their property, and weren't allowed foreign imports. At least in the Nazi party, people were given bread, etc. and Hitler helped boost the economy again. Economy was down in Soviet Union because factories lied about making a certain amount of products and selling them.

>>1695158

The Soviet Union was worse.

The Nazis only oppressed a small percentage of the population.

>>1695158
The Soviet Union purely because it lasted longer.

Soviets smell

>>1695158
The United States

>>1695158
The Soviet Union.
Hitler ws a psychopath,but Stalin was the devil in the world.

He kills anyone.Kids,Women,Anyone.

The Great Expurge.

>>1695195
>>1695201
>>1695205
>>1695228
What about the holocaust. Lamps and soaps made out of dead Jews? Ovens? Gas chambers?

>>1695195
>People had to work with the same wages
Not true.

>>1695239
only a small percentage of the whole populations as >>1695201 already stated

>>1695239
Those were all bad things, but the Soviet Union still has a higher body count. Especially because Stalin fell for the Lysenkoism meme and caused mass famine.

>>1695250
>>1695255
There are a lot of Slavs. Not a lot of Jews. This was terrible for the jews

>>1695239
>Lamps and soaps made out of dead Jews?

The fact that I'd be called a Holocaust denier for calling bullshit on these lies only emboldens actual /pol/-tier Holocaust deniers. You know that right?

I'm part yid by the way.

>>1695266
This might be heretical to say on /his/, but I consider people as people and don't arbitrarily give them more or less value based on what tribe they happen to identify as.

>>1695158
Nazi Germany because of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generalplan_Ost .

At least the Soviets never planned a genocide in such a massive scale.

>>1695239
I know.
But NAZI-Germany kill very less than The Soviet Union.

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>>1695266
pic related

>>1695280
So you're saying 1000 dead pygmies is just as bad of a tragedy as say 1000 Japanese people?

>>1695296
Yes? Did you expect a different answer? Or did you want me to answer "no" and then try to stretch that answer to come up with an arbitrary racial evaluation?

Let's see, Japanese are better than pygmies, but whites are obviously better than those slant-eyes, wetbacks are somewhere in the middle, niggers aren't even on the list...

>>1695320
No that's bullshit. Some groups are more valuable than others.>>1695280
No one arbitrarily places value on them because of the group they're in. The holocaust was the worst mass killing in history. Not just because they killed Jews. But also because Jews are the best people on this planet.

>>1695336
Okay Goldstein. I won't stop you from believing whatever nonsense you want.

>>1695341
>t.butthurt goy

>>1695195
>>1695201
>>1695205
>>1695228
>>1695206
>>1695341
Sure is /pol/ ITT.

Stalin was worse than Hitler sure, but he was around for only 30 years out of the Soviet Union's 70 years, and even then he managed to industrialize an agrarian shithole.

And for all it's flaws, the Soviet Union managed to fire-up the Space Race. Only thing Nazis managed to fire-up was a bunch of gypsies and jews.

>>1695239
>Lamps and soaps made out of dead Jews
Do people still believe this shit? I lived in liberal commiefornia and took a field trip to the holocaust museum and even they don't push that made up crap anymore

There's no better or worse in history ya sped. Discuss this stuff on /pol/.

>>1695210
this

>>1695438
The Soviet Union fired up the space race using German rocket scientists, dipshit

My grandmother used to say:
>Germans took our eggs, milk and meat, and made sure we had something to stay alive.
>Soviets took out hens, stole the cow and killed the pigs and made sure we will starve to death.

That was coming form a simple woman from a small village from Poland. (and many housewifes from that period will say the same stuff)

Obviously Nazi Germany because they lost, duh.

But seriously the USSR is much more than stalins regime. It did a lot of good for its people in the begining (education, electricity, modernization, unions, equality among classes, sexes, and races), did a lot of good around the world like the US was and still is, and post purges it was a pretty ok place.
Nazi germany was a flame that burnt brightly for a few years then got blown out. All it left behind was ash.

>>1696247
Yeah, but Poles are always complaining

>>1695158
Soviet Union considering they were half of the equation that brought the world a cunt hair away from nuclear Holocaust.

They were ultimately the greater threat.

>>1696607

Because we have a PhD diploma in being raped, so we are legitimately butthurt.

>>1696609
interestingly enough you wouldnt be able to use the phrase "nuclear Holocaust" (something that never happened aside to the populations of a couple of japanese cities)without reffering to something abhorent the nazis actually did.

>>1696627
I had thought of that and laughed but the point still stands, as an overall threat to the world the Soviet Union was a worse threat than Nazi Germany.

Plus ultimately a higher body count and greater influence on world politics.

Of course they have the advantage of a much longer reign to pad their records.

That said, going by the same metric the United States is also worse than Nazi Germany, looking at the overall record.

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Nazi Germany was worse because any improvements were built on a time bomb. The policy of raubwirtschaft, of consuming the wealth of other nations by theft and conquest, was completely unsustainable. The so-called miracle of the pre-war years was a fraud produced by lying to creditors.
Hitler would eventually have run out of nations to steal from and creditors to lie to.

On the other hand. the Soviet system proved it could last (it collapsed mostly for political reasons like anti-war sentiments from conscripts in Afghanistan)

>>1695158
Nazi Germany killed over 50 million people from 1939 to 1945, mostly civilians.

The Soviet Union killed 15 million people from 1924 to 1953, mostly in the Ukrainian famine.

Per annum and in raw numbers, Nazi Germany was objectively a more evil nation.

>>1696247
Right, but the USSR didn't plan on feminising 90% of Poles and enslaving the rest

Soviets were worse.

The Holocaust doesn't even compare to the hundred million plus that have died in communist revolutions and under communist regimes. Stalin even killed more jews than Hitler did.

>>1695158
USSR killed far more people and spread their terror for 70 years.

Nazi Germany only spread their terror from 1933-1945

>>1695158

Commies.

>>1696777
USSR's goal was world domination. communists governments all over the world and all under Moscow.

Germany would have released most of Europe back to independence, had they won.

>>1695158
I don't really believe in a good or bad in history but statistically it'd be the USSR. Even if you add the most liberal estimate of WW2 casualties (even the ones not inflicted by Hitler or even his enemies) to Hitler's death toll he still wouldn't beat communism's death toll.

>>1695158
Third choice. Western capitolist imperialist democracy.

>>1696648
>On the other hand. the Soviet system proved it could last (it collapsed mostly for political reasons like anti-war sentiments from conscripts in Afghanistan)

Soviet economy had stagnated long before Afghanistan ever became anything major. Only reason Soviet economy survived the 70's was Yom Kippur War and Iranian Islamic revolution causing massive raises in energy prizes.

>>1696698
>Nazi Germany killed over 50 million people from 1939 to 1945, mostly civilians.

You greatly overestimate casualties caused by Germans.

>The Soviet Union killed 15 million people from 1924 to 1953, mostly in the Ukrainian famine.

At same time picking low range estimate for victims of communism. Since you credit all deaths caused by WWII to Nazis, you might as well give entire bodycount of Russian civil war to commies. Soviets also intentionally caused mass deaths of their own citizens by themselves, mass deportations of all kinds of minorities like Chechens.

Stalin killed 60 billion people.

>>1696781
where did you get this delusional idea?

>>1696017
>What is GIRD
>who are Korolev and Chelomey

>2016
>judging historical events from good-bad positions
>making the points of view based on biased works

soviets easily but nazis probs couda beat them they didnt get rekt in ww2

>>1696017

No. US got essentially all top level researchers except couple. Top Soviet guys were way better and ironically reverse engineering V-2 almost 1:1 was slower than designing comparable or better rocket from ground up.

Soviets were in some aspects ahead of Germans before the war, but then Stalin decided set up a purge and top Soviet rocket scientists had few rounds of NKVD edition of musical chars. Last ones to rat up friends with false accusations gets shot and rest get to Gulag.

The thing Germans had over commies was funding and what they really did better was convincing politicians to fund bigger rockets. By all means the big thing V-2 did was convincing world that big rocket is viable weapons system as proof of concept.

Next level of irony in space and missile race is that US authorities deported their best home grown rocket guy to China, because of red scare as he was Chinese immigrant that had studied in US while he had been in US commies took over mainland China.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qian_Xuesen

Can you even compare though?
I bet that if Nazi Germany had won a lot of worse shit would be going on but you don't know since it never happened.

>>1696017
Russian Empire scientists, actually.

>>1697377
/pol/

Both were horrible
Soviets for commushitism
Nazis for socialshitism

>>1696817
Even the most fervently anti-communist historians have admitted that any killcounts over 20 million for Stalin's years are poor estimates or outright fabrications.

>>1695158
Soviets commited more evil, since they had more time, power and human life had lesser weight in their lands

Nazis managed to beat them intensity wise and ideologically wise.

>>1698056
Literally the other way around.

>>1698061
>Nazis akshually commited more evil, speaking in total bodycount
>3rd Reich was around longer than USSR and had larger population
>Central Europe was barely industrialized poor-as-fuck land that held man in little value
>3rd Reich was global superpower for decades
>Soviet union was burning down hundreds and hundreds of entire settlement
>Communism advocates murdering entire nations and judges people through their blood and skull shape
>61M is span of 74 years is more than 20M in span of 12 years

Of course, You are correct. How could I've been so dumb.

there was nothing wrong with Nazi Germany.

>>1696598
>did a lot of good around the world like the US was and still is
What good actions is US doing in today's geopolitcs?

>>1695158
Soviets were around longer. They were really stat compilers/accumulators. You'll never see someone with as strong a peak as the Nazis though. There was nobody better in the league at being oppressive and brutal during their reign. We need more regimes like theirs in the Hall of Fame and less of those stat-padding regimes that lasted several decades.

>25 years after the fall of the Soviet union
>U.S. softens on communism, begins to normalize relations with Cuba

>70 years after the fall of the Nazis
>the entire world is still terrified of natsoc to the point of self-destruction

>>1698233
>Believing that 61 million were killed in the USSR

I think it is safe to say that had Nazi Germany been more successful and lasted longer then they would have done worse. The plan if Russia had been taken was to remove all food from the region and starve a majority of the population: this is well documented and established. The plan if Britian had been taken was to remove all resources and ALL men of fighting age off the island for forced labor in continental Europe.

However since the Siviet Union had more time to exist they have the higher body count and the longer length of oppression making them objectively worse.

>>1698391
>write less than 60M
>OMG USSR murdered more than 30M people!!!1! You are brainwashed by American propaganda1!!!

>Write more than 60M
>OMG USSR was good boy, 60M is imperialistic lie!1!

You can´t satisfy everybody, tavarish. But I chose the higher number since I wanted to prevent anon I replied to from lashing out at me.

>>1695158
Nazi Germany, because they caused more death in the 12 years they were active.
ISIS is worse than both, by that logic.

>>1695158
Germany if only because they started the war. But really before 1939 they were damn near indistinguishable from each other regarding how shit they were to dissenters and the party line, just replace "workers" for "germans" and "jews" for "kulaks/burgoise".

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>>1695158
The Soviets.

They were not as retarded as modern "communists" however.
Much more agreeable imo.

At least the USSR was trying to do good

>>1698457
Please, go on and explain why modern communists are in the wrong

>>1695158
To live under as a citizen? Soviet Union.

>>1698481
So did nazi Germany.

>>1698485
They are gay and like brown people

>>1695158
Nazi Germany, Stalin didn't plan on exterminating the entire German population after he had won the war.

>>1695158
Communists as a whole were much worse.

>Starved 8 millions ukrainians in the 1920's
>Killed 20+ million chinese in the 60's
>Massacre of a Million people in the Cambodian jungle

Communism treats people like something to be used and disposed of, it is an idealogy of misery and pain

>>1699415
>1920s
>UKRANIAN STARVING
American education, what can I say?

>>1698485
Please, go on and explain why modern communists are in the wrong
Because of the tendency to sniff and tug shirt.

>>1698031
>Even the most fervently anti-communist historians have admitted that any killcounts over 20 million for Stalin's years are poor estimates or outright fabrications.

15 million for Stalin, Russian civil war and other bolshevist repression is in seriously at low end of scale.

Also 50 gorillion points for Nazis. Reality check. 6 gorillion gassed kikes, 2 to 3 million Soviet POW's, million to 2 million Poles, quarter to half million Serbs, random much smaller numbers for random minor ethnicities, political groups and retards.. list could go on. In reality Nazi score just somewhere between bit above 10 million and at maximum around 15 million, even when you include shit happening in Eastern Front like anti-partisan operations.

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>implying either were bad

>>1695239
The USSR killed more than five times the number of people killed by the Nazis.

Hitler created murder factories while Stalin chose to let people starve. Stalin won, Hitler lost. If Hitler had by some miracle won he would've done much worse things when he implemented generalplan ost.

>>1696648
>the Soviet system proved it could last
Jesus fucking Christ. The level of commie apologists on this board is beyond hilarious. I honestly don't think I could write a satirical piece about delusional cultists that captures the level of mental gymnastics displayed regularly without question on this board.

You poor fools are always whining about /pol/ like they represent something unjustifiable, all the while praising an economic system designed by a greedy, homeless, conformist who advocated violent revolution and extermination of resistant religious groups.

>>1695277
>"I'd be called a holocaust denier for denying things that literally no historian believes"
t. Holocaust denier

>>1695201
Oh yeah forget about the whole action T4, suppression of political leftists, socialists, labor unions, and anarchists, secret police, and extermination of various non-Jew groups like homosexuals and Gypsies.

Nazi Germany was flawed dream of madman, Soviet Union worked properly for better or worse.

>>1698485
> Soviet Communists
> Were competent enough to become the one and only leading power, defeated their enemies in their internal struggle in a revolution or external battle of the world war II.
> Modern Communists
> ?????

>>1700101
Soviet system lasted around 70 years. Compare it to any fascist regime.

>>1700268
Nah. It was like a drunk man stumbling down all the stairs down a metro, land on the tracks and die.

>>1696017
that was America, not Soviets

>>1695158
Nazi Germany. Genocide and systematic oppression were against Soviet official ideology.

Soviet Union.

If Nazi Germany didn't exist, the Soviets still would. If the Soviets didn't exist, Nazi Germany never would. Two birds with one stone.

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>>1695158
Soviets because Communism in itself is a murderous ideology that wants to establish chaos and misery wherever it spreads. It wants to abolish family, it wants to abolish normal human interactions that existed for thousands of years, basic human rights such as property (yes property is a basic human right) and turn everyone into same mindless ants under the sweet talk of "equality".

At least Nazis swallowed the blackpill and realized not everyone are equal, but still tried to create a society that would serve the best for all of population. Also they were right in realizing that nationalist, homogeneous society of like-minded people is the key to creating a well-functioning society. Any system that puts internationalism and globalism above nation-based society is inherently flawed.

>>1700294
>Compare it to any fascist regime.
Stalin's

>>1701845
>Also they were right in realizing that nationalist, homogeneous society of like-minded people is the key to creating a well-functioning society. Any system that puts internationalism and globalism above nation-based society is inherently flawed.
that's why they lost and the Soviet Union continued on for decades after :^)

>>1700261

None of those are bad

>>1701845
loli is degeneracy

>>1701845
>It wants to abolish family
It did not do more for abolishment of family than Nazism (Putting state above family).
>basic human rights such as property
Nazism abolish right to live for millions of people so I don´t really see your point.
>but still tried to create a society that would serve the best for all of population
As did pretty much everyone?
> Any system that puts internationalism and globalism above nation-based society is inherently flawed.
Nazis put race above nations.

Now go back, this place is not for you

>>1702023
This place isn't for YOU, naziboo

I'm not a commie but jfc so much pro-nazi misconceptions ITT

what's up with /his/ being swarmed with so much naziboos?

>>1695158
On the theory that more murders is worse than fewer murders, the Soviet Union was worse.

>>1701845
She'd be arrested for walking around with her panties revealed. Such degeneracy is for the Weimar Republic.

>>1702143
>pro-nazi misconceptions
Like what?

>>1702159
the whole thread

>muh 6000000 gorrilion victims of the soviet regime
>nazis literally dindu nuffin

>>1702145
Did Soviet Union really killed more people than Nazi who started deadliest war in human history?

>>1702167
more like
>muh 6000 gorillion jews
>Soviets still beat them in numbers by a very large margin
now back to 2ch dmitry

>>1702467
>Did Soviet Union really killed more people than Nazi
yes
>who started deadliest war in human history
You mean by invading Poland? :^)

>>1702837
I won't forget Katyn

>>1702829
but 2ch hates commies

I for one count everyone who died on the Eastern Front as essentially someone who was killed by those cabbage stinking huns.

>posting this in a thread filled with wehraboos and tankies

Well done, sir.

>>1702829
I thought 2ch was japanese

>>1703629
>>1705250
2ch.ru is basically "my babushka killed 500 germans with her sniper rifle" the site

Wish the USSR still existed desu

for as horrible as it was, it posed the implicit threat of aid to a working class revolution in the west. As a result, those in power had to make life more bearable for the domestic poor or face damage to themselves.

Alas, instead we've got a world where currency flows freely (to be fair, rooted in the Nixon shock and that's rooted in failure to take up the Bancor after WW2) so those with the most money and power can live on a fucking jet and convert their currency at will, bankrupting a country that looks like it may have a revolution instead of acceding to the minimum demands necessary to save it.

>>1695255
Body count isn't a good measure. More people die from drunk driving in any given year than died in 9/11, yet we've a pointless war on terror and no anti-alcohol campaigns.

People naturally react differently to things depending on how they were handled. Causing a famine out of incompetence isn't as emotionally damaging as intentionally gassing them.

>>1696609
The USSR was more afraid of us than we were of them when it came to nuclear affairs. Even when they had the advantage in nuclear terms in the 70s things weren't in their favour overall.

With hindsight it's quite funny to see what a massive paper tiger they were. (Don't get me wrong, they did have legitimate strength and could probably take on a good chunk of Europe assuming NATO wasn't involved, but against the USA there exist almost no circumstances that wouldn't result in a Soviet defeat, except perhaps everyone dying, and nobody wanted everyone to die.)

>>1701845
Communists didn't want to abolish the right to property. They just distinguished between personal property and private property while most capitalists consider them both "private property"

A television is personal property. An individual can own a television. A factory is private property, which in the eyes of a communists should not be owned by an individual who exploits the labour of the workers inside it, but should be owned and run by said workers as communal property.

I believe even a home is also considered personal property, not private property. (Unless you're owning the home to rent it out, in which case it would be private property.) but not being a commie I'm not 100% on that.

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I find it extremely easy, in fact, to imagine an alternate Nazi 2016. I don't even imagine it as a Gestapo-dominated paranoid hell. Much of our historical memory of the Third Reich is, quite understandably, a memory of wartime Nazism. But if the war had gone the other way, this would be a memory of the wartime Allies, hardly a pretty picture either. Hitlerism no doubt would have moderated over time, as Stalinism and Maoism did.

>>1705771

it would actualy be eerily similar

>>1699442
Holodomor was very close to the 1920s, dipshit.

>>1706220
>1934
>very close to the 1920s

>>1701845
>Unironically using the word 'Globalism' while shitposting a nazi loli meme on an online imageboard

I too hate international trade and communication.

>>1695158
Nazi Germany, by a long shot.

>>1702145
>le everyone who died in the Soviet Union was literally murdered

*tips fedora*

>>1695158
Nazis, because at least Communism only destroyed half of Europe

>>1701845
>Soviets because Communism in itself is a murderous ideology that wants to establish chaos and misery wherever it spreads.
[Citation Needed]

>>1698497
>le german people were great under the nazis

maybe for a time in the 1930's, but they were repressive and terrible when the war started.

>>1696247
The Germans killed 20% of Poland's entire population. Either you're lying or your grandmother was of German ethnicity.

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>>1706607
lmao, this slavaboo delusion
The russians were mass murdering Poles before it was cool

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>>1707375
top kek