Borgias

They were white so either very bad or very good

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The one with Jeremy Irons was pretty good but I guess it got cancelled.

I didn't watch the other one.

Should I?

Oh snap I guess they are both cancelled now.

>>1676584
>How bad were these guys really?
Compared to everyone else at the time?

Par for the course.

>>1676586
Very, very bad.
Didn't even do well from the standpoint of turning the Papal States into their own little feudal realm. Giuliano Delle Rovere (Pope Julius II) rolled that shit back almost immediately. At pontifical sword-point no less.

I don't think they're really worse than any other corrupt modern politician now.

"I will not live in the same rooms as the Borgias lived. Rodrigo desecrated the Holy Church as none before. He usurped the papal power by the devil's aid, and I forbid under the pain of excommunication anyone to speak or think of Borgia again. His name and memory must be forgotten. It must be crossed out of every document and memorial. His reign must be obliterated. All paintings made of the Borgias or for them must be covered over with black crepe. All the tombs of the Borgias must be opened and their bodies sent back to where they belong – to Spain." - Pope Julius II

>>1676687
From what i gather pic related is more authentic, in that it's closer to history and the Jeremy Irons one. It's not cancelled, it actually tells the complete story from Rodrigo's rise to Cesare's death.

>Still liked Jeremy Irons performance better though

>>1676710
Cool thx anon

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>>1676584
Reminder that for all his asshole-ish & creepy attitude the guy accepts the Jews who were kicked out by Queen Isabella.

He is your Renaissance 'Refugees R' Welcome' guy.

>>1676699

If the Borgia tv show was at all accurate Pope Julius II was a sodomite and was just as corrupt as the Borgias, if not more so.

>>1676687
>The one with Jeremy Irons was pretty good
>Renaissance Italians DO NOT KNOW WHAT A GUNPOWDER WEAPON IS.
Although it's pretty refreshing to see Jeremy Irons eat pussy.

They're like Nixon. Poeple act like it don't be like it is but it do. It was a show full of power players and the Borgias were probably the best and most popular examples of that.

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>>1676584
Rodrigo's dad or granddad, I forget, was a pretty cool guy, really active on the kebab removal front. His descendands, however were cucks and didn't even remove kebab, so they deserve to go down in history as meme Assassin's Creed-tier villains and edgelorgds.

>>1676699
He sure sounds salty.

>>1676687
It's shit too. Only 1st season is ok, 2nd season is meh and 3rd season is utter shit. Also just about all actors are hacks and have annoying accents. One speaks with an American accent, the other - Irish, the third - Russian, the 4th - some yuropoor shithole's. WTF? Would ruin the immersion even if it hadn't been already ruined by hack exploitaive script. This show tried to be 'Game of Thrones but with Renaissance Italy', but failed to even be 'so bad its good' like the later seasons of GoT.

>>1677717
He was a battle commander too isn't he?

>>1677065
>Once again God's chosen people on the run
He took them either because of sympathy as a fellow cast out, or because the Jews paid him.

>>1676690
Pretty much. Cesare himself was kind of a dick but they were really no worse than anyone else. The problem is that della Rovere started spreading shit about him as soon as he lost the conclave by going "HE BRIBED EVERYONE" (even though della Rovere was being bankrolled by the French and Genoese) and basically continued to accuse him of everything under the sun from incest to poisoning cardinals to being a Marrano (i.e. CRYPTO-JEW). There's also him fathering a bunch of illegitimate children and having the gall to actually acknowledge them.

>>1677717
Anyone who held any position of power pretty much anywhere (but especially in Italy/Rome) was corrupt. He probably wasn't gay but he WAS a massive asshole who was so desperate to check Venetian influence and take Romagna for himself that he invited foreign powers into Italy and was then shocked when they continued to try and conquer shit and not respect his authority thus fucking up Italy for centuries afterwards.