What's /g/'s opinion on Protonmail? I want to move

I use it since 2015 desu

It's shit for retards.

Protonmail was good, then they went all corporate and profit-oriented and now they're restrictive as shit. Also being stuck using their retarded web interface is a drag.

>>62356671
use cock.li with thunderbird

Using Tutamail, $1 a month, has multiple aliases and let me move my domains to it.

>>62356671
They started out good but they fucked up when they started deleting accounts and handing over personal info for people they suspected were doing shady activities. Stay away.

>>62357324
yandex does all that for free.

>>62356671
your shit will end up at some gmail server anyways cause most people use it
just use cockli if you don't feel like using gmail, at least they won't ban your account like protonmail

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Why'd they have to call it that?

>>62356671
Is it true that ProtonMail doesn't have IMAP/SMTP support so you can't use it with external email clients?

>>62356671
It was featured in Mr. Robot. Normies are all over it, it's not going anywhere.

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>>62356671
>Protonmail
it's hosted in Switzerland. it's compromised. Do not use anything hosted in the US or any of the US protectorate/tribute states.
Switzerland signed a data sharing agreement with the US. That means they're under the NSA's umbrella.
They're also banning accounts for """illegal""" activity.

tl;dr: stay the fuck away from that meme honeypot.

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>>62358322
Because it was created by nuclear scientists at CERN.

https://protonmail.com/about

>>62356671
They complied with some information requests from the Swiss government, so it's compromised. They decided that there was sufficient information to determine that the account holder's activities were facilitating illegal actions, and hence breaking TOS, and hence that it was okay for them to hand over information.

Worrying on two points, firstly that they handed the information over, and secondly that their system doesn't shield them from information on their clients.

I use teknik.io, but cock.li should also be good.

if the man wants to read your email, he's reading your email you buttfucking retards. protonmail is just a gmail with less features that makes you type in two fucking passwords, it's complete retarddom

>>62358340
they said it's a thing for the future, but they're not keen on implementing since it would inherently break their security sandbox walled garden

Man, I spent $1300 on a lifetime account when they offered them last year. Now apparently ProtonMail sucks? Fuuu... ._.

>>62358076
when did this happen? have any news articles?

>>62358560
Move to Yandex and get a lifetime account bro!

>>62358376
>normies watching Mr. Robot past the first few episodes
>normies even paying attention to any of the hardware/software being used

>>62358560
jesus christ who the fuck throws $1300 away for email? god damn dude.

don't know, to be honest.

But what I do know is that the only people who voted for Donald Trump are rural and suburban retards who wish they could fuck their own relatives.

City people and intelligent people all voted for Hillary Clinton

why not host your own email server if you care that much about your privacy?

>>62357283
They have a desktop client beta, but only for paid customers

>>62358725
it's bullshit. some retard was openly advertising his drug business asking those interested to contact him via protonmail. as it's in violation of their terms of use, surprise surprise, account gets shut down.

>>62358376
>Normies are all over it, it's not going anywhere.

I don't see a ton of people using gnome nowadays...

>>62358940
>why not host your own email server if you care that much about your privacy?

Isn't that how we ended up finding ALL of Hillary Clinton's emails?

>>62356671
Tutanota

>>62358101
>botnet does all that for free.

The most secure way to talk to people is face to face, with all the computers turned off, all cell phones in the microwave, with Alexa buried in the back yard, with a heavy blanket draped over your smart juicer, and your home security system disabeled.

But hey, at least we're still free, right?

>>62359875
talking about botnets doesn't make sense. yandex, contrary to gmail, doesn't index and your data to serve you ad content. even if it did, it would mean fucking nothing, since the gmail of the recipients would instruct their AI on your emails. Furthermore, mail were never designed for privacy, I bet my nuts that you don't encrypt your mail with OpenPGP. yandex offers something you could have only with the gsuite (your mail at your own domains, multiple aliases, 1000 mailboxes) except that it offers it free of charge. And you'll enjoy yandex disk and dedicated apps for whichever platform you're targeting. Look, I don't even work for yandex, but it's a fucking deal.

>>62358416
>cock.li
>literally every single email is in a government database
>somehow safer than protonmail

>>62356671
It's alright, but I prefer Tutamail's pricing for premium features.

>>62356671
Used to use it. Not being able to use it with mutt killed it for me, so I host my own now.

>>62356671
Way too expensive for anything but the most basic of accounts. Tutanota costs 1 Euro per month for their premium shit, literally a quarter of the price of Protonmail's cheapest paid tier, despite offering literally everything that Protonmail does (except for the space - 1GB included, 10 GB for another 2 Euros per month, which is still 1 Euro per month less than Protonmail's 5GB). Tutanota also doesn't make you sign up for Premium for you to send encrypted messages to external recipients.

The ONLY reason to go for Proton over Tuta is if you really want the server you use to be located inside a mountain for some reason.

>>62356671
it's really good, for some reason some people have been shilling against it and recommending shit like cuck.li; might as well stay with google

self hosting > proton >>> gmail

>>62361980
Self hosting is only a good idea if you know what you're doing. If you don't, it's the worst option you can choose. Also, protonmail is overpriced.

Self-hosting (knowledgeable)>Tutanota>Proton>non-encrypted email>Self-hosting (ignorant).

>>62358416
shit someone was selling drugs and weapons on tor and he was using protonmail

like for real we are still trying to excuse the idiot for breaking the tos

>>62362154
I don't remember where, but there's a service providing you with the knowledge to configure it correctly yourself, maybe the startpage one? I don't know

>>62360277
>switching to russian google
I wouldn't trust that for a second
How is it free?

>>62356671
>posts on /g/
>doesn't run own mail server
pls go

>>62360277
>yandex direct
equivalent of google's adsense
they do sell your data just like google

>sign up for ProtonMail
>get a VPN with it

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>mfw all these anti-Protonmail shills

Protonmail is here to stay. It's way too popular now, so it's a safe choice.
Tutanota is alright, but the free version is very limited and both the mobile client and the web UI are slow as fuck.

Future proof free email isn't so easy to find outside of big providers. But if you want to talk paid email services, there's a ton of them...

Also, pretty much anything is better than shit like Gmail or Outlook. It's one thing to let the government spy on you (as long as you don't use encryption they can do that), but to literally hand over your emails to companies like Google or Microsoft? Ew.

>>62356671
use your .edu university mail

>>62358940
Emails originating from your self-hosted email server will be autoflagged as spam by virtually every mainstream email provider

>>62358798

I've spent about $1100 on hosting/email in the past 15 years. Though I wouldn't pay that upfront for a mememail.com address.

I love the cock.

>>62362271
That's not the point, a secure service shields the service provider from information. There should have been no way ProtonMail could confirm what activity was associated with an email address, and what email addresses might be associated with an account holder. Zero knowledge systems are de rigueur when designing secure systems.

>>62361827
Much safer, as they didn't willingly comply, rather the German authorities forcibly seized their server. That said, with alternatives existing I certainly don't use it.

>>62362365
>russian
Yandex.com is >Yandex Europe AG, a Swiss company, located at: Werftestrasse 4, 6005 Luzern, Switzerland
fully owned by company in motherland Russia, yet distinct from it and with a different ToS.
>I wouldn't trust that for a second
because you're completely irrational. it's no better than trusting anyone else for your mail.
>how is it free?
freemium business model, they create their own eco-system with their own browser and the like. ads on top of this.
>>62362754
yes, they have a business in ads. yet you're contributing much more to the botnet filling reCAPTCHAs for free. no, you won't see a single ad even if you use webmail.

relevant passage in their privacy policy:
>Data collected by or transmitted to Yandex, the Company or Partners, in the course of accessing, interaction and operation of the Site and provision of the Services may include, without limitation, the following Data: (i) Internet Protocol (IP) address and location; (ii) cookie information; (iii) browser identification information; (iv) information on your software and hardware; (v) date and time of accessing the Site and the Services; (vi) information of third parties websites referred the Site or the Services; (vii) information related to your activity in the course of the Services use, including, without limitation, search queries history, search results provided to you in response to your query, web pages you visited by reference from the search results; (viii) other information.
>2.4. Unless you are logged in to your account with the Company information about you, such as e-mail address, password, name, home and work address, telephone number, index code, age, gender, is not collected when you access the Site or the Services.

since they operate their .com from a company incorporated in Switzerland, the Federal Act on Data Protection applies
then again, you're not encrypting your email and you have gmail recipients and the like.

>>62364373
can't use it on facebook or discord. they have blocked it.

Host your own email server with Mail-in-a-box. It's the best option.

But even then, don't think your emails are secure or anything. Email is inherently not secure, and remember that there's always another copy of your emails on the sender or receiver's end, which is probably still Gmail anyway.

>>62364660
see >>62363888 (checked)

I can only recommend Outlook.com.
Thank you.

How can i get an at&t web mail access without living in the US and without being at&t costumer?

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>>62358139
>atleast they won't ban your account like protonmail

https://twitter.com/gexcolo/status/906789811859738624

>>62358076
>deleting accounts
give an example that isn't a brasilian ledditor who was caught advertising selling drugs or some shit
>handing over personal info for people they suspected were doing shady activities
again give an example

>>62364981
https://mobile.twitter.com/ProtonMail/status/900097982212845570

>>62364658
>using kikebook

>>62365121
I am limiting my use on it. I just need it to know what people are up to. It's a normie thing I guess.

>>62365051
>https://mobile.
fucking nu-/g/ I swear

>>62365221
Nigga I have an viral infection, can't even lift my hands up.

>>62365221
It redirects there if you don't enable scripts anyway.

>>62365051
Yeah, that looks a bit bad. They backtrack a bit, say it's only for illegal stuff/court orders and then
>If we waited for a court order each time to ban spammer, phishing, ransomware, ISIS, etc accounts, we wouldn't have a functioning service.
So I don't know... It looks bad, but until I get proof that they actually delete accounts without court orders for "hate speech" or whatever I won't condemn them.
They might just be trying to appease some SJWs on Twitter (which is bad, sure, but that seems part of the business nowadays).

>>62365352
twatter without js and IndexedDB is totally unusable. And no, it doesn't redirect to the mobile site if you block all js.

>>62365500
It literally does, if you block JS, third parties scripts and frame, it will direct you to the mobile site.

>>62365516
Which doesn't work without JS.

>>62365516
>It literally does
Except it literally doesn't. Try yourself blocking all JS and frames in uMatrix. If you get a redirection, there's something more on your side.

>>62365790
I'm using noscript + ublock origin for the frame blocking, I allow absolutely nothing, and I get the redirect.

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>>62365790
>>62365783
>>62365500

And I made a webm to show what happens.

>>62366063
>>62366143
Well, it's explained. NoScript honours <noscript> tags in the source page (there was no need to create a webm tbqh).
uMatrix blocks fucking everything and prevents the meta refresh. Same happens for uBlock Origin
>https://github.com/gorhill/uBlock/issues/308
(a similar issue was opened for uMatrix @ https://github.com/gorhill/uMatrix/issues/319 , but issues for uMatrix have been disabled)

This is gorhill's position:
>uBlock does not disable javascript in the browser, it prevents it from running using a Content-Security-Policy header, and in such case it appears the browser does not fall back on noscript tags. Forcing the noscript tags to render using some trickery leads to other issues.

Also:
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1387807

>>62366371
Ahah, thanks for the explanation anon.

>>62366371
I have all scripting blocked in nosc,ubo, and um and I just get a refresh loop and the twitter logo.

>>62366415
you better pick one tool for that job, then. Either use NoScript as a dedicated tool to block js, and get the redirection; or don't.

>>62366516
Why would I even want that?

>>62366547
want what? I've tried to block js in noscript+umatrix+ublock origin and I got redirected btw, so it seems noscript gets the precedence. at least here.

>>62358560
Do you know where you are?

>>62365051
>>62365495
Scrolling down it's clear they actually banned that account. And
>As the email address was a hate group slogan, there is not much doubt in the case here.

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>>62366371
btw NoScript can be instructed to disregard meta refresh in noscript tags, which is imho advisable. It's the best trade off if you want to block js, want to honour eventual noscript tags but you don't want meta redirects inside noscript tags

>>62364678
That's fucked up.

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>make a poster with the slogan "hospitalize your local antifa" and add your friends' email at the end of it
>attach it somewhere in your city, a totally desert alley
>shoot photo
>upload it to the twitterwebs complaining about racism
>???????
>get you're friend account permabanned

>>62364678
So what do we do? This world needs to be cleansed.

>>62366796
That's fucked up.

>>62366891
>>62366907
that's how it works. residential dynamic IPs are not supposed to act as email servers. if they were, spam would reach delirious levels.
mail was never meant to be secure or confidential. any and all attempts to "hack" on it (including darkmail) ultimately fail.
don't use email for private and sensitive data, simple as that.

>>62366893
>add your friends' email at the end of it
They said it would have to be a legit looking address (like that "hate group" slogan - "You will not replace us").
https://www.reddit.com/r/ProtonMail/comments/6ve0u8/reminder_inciting_violence_is_illegal_in/

If your friend is a public Trump supporter it might work...

Personally I use Gmail for my main accounts (work and personal). For games, websites, w/e it's not linked to my real name, I use Protonmail.

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>>62359117
why would you EVER want to use it though
just let me sync my email to Mutt like i can do with literally any other email service

>>62366979
there's nothing hateful in "you will not replace us". It could even be the slogan of SJW activists.

>>62367022
>just let me sync my email to Mutt like i can do with literally any other email service
Which part of "encrypted email service" don't you understand? It's not compatible with standards like IMAP and such.
If you want IMAP+encryption you'll need to do encryption yourself, with PGP or whatever.

>>62365051
>https://mobile.twitter.com/ProtonMail/status/900097982212845570


That's a good thing.

>>62358379
Absolutely false. Nice sources there faggot.

>>62358408
meanwhile, the real physicists at CERN are using botnetmail :^)

I use it, $12 a month for email and VPN is great.

Just wish they had a client since using my phone for 2FA every time I login is a pain but I don't want to disable it.

>>62367089
You should get rid of the smartphone. Those devices spy on you. I only use a memepad with libreboot.

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>>62367064
what part of just just let me sync my email to Mutt dont you understand
literally just bounce the emails from protonmeme's servers with gnupg to my email client

>>62367121
t. anti-social neet

>>62358379
>private business
>bans accounts for violating TOS

Really activates the almonds.... how low is your IQ again?

>>62367149
I actually have several friends and a gf, so I'm not entirely anti-social, nor am I a neet since I have a real job

>>62367154
riddle me this then
if their service is "encrypted" as they say, how would they know it violated the terms of service?

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>>62367169
first day, huh?

>>62367169
and you're telling me you don't have a smartphone? i refuse to believe you.

you don't need to prove me wrong though.

>>62367172
hurp durp I advertise my Brazillian drug service with a protonmail account on the dark web

Wow, really takes a rocket scientist to figure out that they were conducting illegal activity, really fucking surprised they didn't have to hire Sherlock to solve that case

Riddle me my ass, faggot.

>>62367195
I got rid of my smart phone last month for a kyocera flip phone. Go to hell faggot

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>>62367210
>actually believing it makes it ok for them to read his emails to confirm
>actually believing it wont be used against other "suspicions"
shine

>>62367248
They didn't read the emails faggot, it's impossible for PM to read your emails, you can audit the fucking source code to see that if you weren't a complete fucking retard.

>>62367132
not even him, but you simply didn't grasp how services like protonmail are supposed to work. They can't "bounce" your email to something like mutt hic et simpliciter. You'd need at least an add-on to decrypt it, gnupg or not.
Btw, I won't ever believe you actually use gnupg in mails. No one uses it. Not even people who attend keysigning events.

>>62367279
It's secure, but is banning people out of simple suspicion isn't that much better. It sets up stuff like this

>>62366893
>>62366979

>>62367311
The guy didn't even try to deny it, he just started whining about it on reddit. Dude should have been thankful, if it had been (((gmail))) he would have already been arrested. With PM all that happened was he lost his account. Either way, it's a private service, and their TOS does not allow illegal activity. End of story. If people want to conduct illegal activity use a different service. Personally, as a PM user I'm glad that they don't allow it because I don't want the domain to be associated with shady shit.

>>62367337
I agree it's normal and expected to not allow illegal activity. The only problem is who gets to determine if it's illegal.
IMO it shouldn't be them, but the police/judge. If they come to them and say "hey this user is using your service for illegal stuff, shut him down", I have no problem. But if they ban people based on maybe illegal activity based on currently popular events and Twitter evidence it's lame, and it shows they're mostly just virtue signaling.

>>62367337
I'm fine with them stopping illegal activity, I just want to see there's some process in place where it's factually based actions and not a haphazard process that can be abused like the example given.

>>62367337
>he would have already been arrested
I'm not an expert in Land-Of-The-Free ® laws, but why would have he been arrested? There are no "hate speech" exceptions to the First Amendment afaik.

>>62367438
It's commonly known in the US that narcs monitor the dark web for info. If they see something like a gmail for example, they will get google to turn over data on the user. That's what happened to that guy in Thailand that ran that dark web market, forgot his name, but I think he has a hotmail or something and they got Microshit to turn over data on him.

>>62363888
That is bs, my setup is working fine.

>>62367487
There are only two possibilities: you're not using a residential, dynamic IP OR you're telling lies.
You'd need at least a static, business IP. Note that most ISP prohibit mail servers in theri ToS. Note that a static, business IPs costs $$$.

>>62367535
It is residential, but in Amsterdam. Perhaps that IP block is just not blocked by the mainstream providers.

>>62367596
I'm 100% confident your mail is flagged as spam. Some mail servers may black-hole it as well. I'm 200% confident that mxtoolbox.com would report your mail server as invalid. Also, receiving mail is extremely unreliable if you're using services like dyndns, given that there are good chances your mail will be lost when you switch IP. I'm also 100% confident that running a mail server is prohibited by the ToS of your ISP.
Unless you actually have a static, business IP obviously.

>it's another "self declared hackers with no knowledge about encryption, law and international relations shitting on a privacy oriented service out of spite because they can't afford the monthly fee"-episode
you guys are the real botnet.

>>62359327
also someone made screenshots of their conversations and handed them over to the authorities so protonmail had to deal with this.

>>62367042
he's not talking about other activists, anon.

>>62368721
but the point is that the slogan is per insufficient to declare if the account is hateful aka unlawful, according to Swiss laws. The "we comply with Swiss laws" is a red herring.

>>62368382
>privacy
>monthly fee
who's the botnet?

>>62367337
>Personally, as a PM user I'm glad that they don't allow it because I don't want the domain to be associated with shady shit.
you sound like a faggot cuck

>>62368756
so were do you want to host your emails then? sierra leone?

>>62368820
>it's a bad thing when a private company offers a premium (paid) model to support the developement and hosting of their product
get a job, kid.

>>62368963
in Russia. No one gives a flying fuck about anything in motherfucking Russia. On my own domain. Shit happens? I redirect my domain somewhere else. Privacy? There's no privacy in e-mail to begin with. No matter how much you self-host your e-mail server in a librebooted server colocated in Bahnhof's bunker. Privacy applied to e-mail is the biggest meme ever created.

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>>62364557
it wasnt but the idiot gave his email publicly on twitter while he is PUBLICLY talking to sell guns and drugs on a favela

he was literally THAT SMART

What's the best email service, paid or otherwise, to use if one of the main things I want is good aliasing support?

>>62369029
https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20160708/07535134919/putin-says-all-encryption-must-be-backdoored-two-weeks.shtml

>>62369055
>good aliasing support
yandex (free), gsuite (paid)

>>62369066
re-read the post you're quoting.

>>62369081
my point is, thinking russia is a safe haven for cypherpunks is like saying thailand is the el dorado of outed pedophiles.

>>62369102
>my point is, thinking russia is a safe haven for cypherpunks is like saying thailand is the el dorado of outed pedophiles.
Your point is wrong. I don't live in Russia's jurisdiction, Russia's FSB won't ever knock at my Western door and btw I won't ever elicit such an interest nor am I paedophile. Given that e-mail confidentiality is a red-herring, hosting my mail on $different_country' server won't defuse all those secret FSB plans, if I really were a target for FSB. Worst case scenario (but really, really, __really__ unlikely) is, case in point, if "they" pull the plug of the mail server. In such a case I'd simply redirect my domain somewhere else. I don't lose my email address as it would happen with "privacy-conscious" SJW-oriented third-party Western providers, like the Israeli-controlled Protonmail.

What's the best option if you want to use your own domain? Google apps is botnet AND expensive, outlook is the same...

>>62369286
Enjoy getting blackmailed to serve KGB

>>62369497
>KGB
nice compressor tool, too bad it has been discontinued. It could have provided a nice interface to zpaq.

>>62369485
>>62358101

>>62367132
>anime avatar
>is a brainlet

Zero (0) surprises there.

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Redbull me on GMX. They offer quite a lot for free.

>>62369626
I use it as a spammable address. Their filters are shit (sometimes they filter something they shouldn't yet they constantly miss all those Nigerian Prince mails). Other than that, what are you really expecting from it?

>>62358812
Wrong thread, CTR shill.

>>62369613

How many surprises again?

>>62369626
Absolute trash.

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absolute state of emails

>>62369669
First of all, I expect it to not be hosted by Google (or Microshit or something like that).
Other than that, not much really. I'd also mostly use it for low priority spammy shit, maybe some online shopping. Do aliases work fine? Custom filtering rules?
I tried IMAP and it seems to work (have to enable it), even though some stupid review said it's not free.

>>62369786
Why?

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>142 replies
>nobody mentions fastmail

>>62369821
>land-of-the-convict paid mail
nothing worthy about it. meme-tier/10

>>62369812 here
Actually never mind, I read a lot of complaints about it, deleted accounts and such.

>>62369821
They just closed guest accounts. Sucks because I used it for about 11 years.

>>62370017
I just pay the fifty bucks a year. I figured that email is the base of my online everything, so why not have it somewhere decent.

I made the move from Gmail about a half year ago now, for both privacy reasons and those sudden account closings you read about now and then.

They also support many domains in one account, which I also like.

>>62367678
Ah, I see what you are getting at. I relay it via my ISP, which is not blacklisted.

>>62370068
>I just pay the fifty bucks a year
Jesus.
>privacy reasons
>Australia
Jesus^2.
>multiple-email-address-in-one-account is a feature
pls staph

Just rent a 1/4 rack at a colo and put your own server in it. It's cheap these days. Don't do a vps or use aws since those can't be trusted to be secure even if they say you're on dedicated hardware.

>>62370576
What kind of pricing for that? I was thinking about it.

See >>62369409
They're liars.

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Using email at yandex.ru with own domain over it and haven`t got a trouble since the beginning. Free dropbox-like cloud includet

>>62362154
It's not that hard. But you do have to be able to get the IP address provider to set up reverse DNS for you properly, which means a business account or puting your server in a colo.

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>>62356671
Protonmail's traffic runs through an Israeli ddos protection company since they experienced weeks of downtime from global botnet attacks. Effectively, your mail is being MitM'd by the CIA via Jews.

Saddens me too, used it before this all happened.

>>62370576
>Just rent a 1/4 rack at a colo and put your own server in it. It's cheap these days
No, it's not.
>vps can't be trusted
>colos can somehow be trusted more
No.
Moreover, >>62369029
>how much you self-host your e-mail server in a librebooted server colocated in Bahnhof's bunker
is pretty much irrelevant.

>>62366976
You don't do it on a residential ip. You either use a business account or you put your server in a colo, and get the reverse dns for that ip set to your domain. Then you're treated like any other corporate server.

I've had my mail server in a colo for about 10 years.

There is an easy way: create docker-compose with good bunch of services like email/ownCloud/ghost blog and place it on cheap VPS for 4$/m. I could teach someone to do this if he publishes this work for anon and if we build an interesting dialog around this.

>>62370739
I relay my home mail box via a server that is trusted (mailfence).

>>62370592
Depends. About $70/month for just a 2U space on a rack. I pay $400/month for a dedicated 1/4 rack with my own door because I host other stuff in it for work.

>>62370739
>You don't do it on a residential ip
Obviously.
>You either use a business account or you put your server in a colo
Expensive and really not what most folks would expect when neckbeards spell the "just host it yourself" tantrum. Stuff like "mail-in-a-box" is guilty of this false expectations as well.

>>62370753
What you're suggesting already exist, and it's called mailcow. It features a full SOGo as well. For nextcloud there are already those collabora-empowered docker images.

>>62358475
>botnet

>>62370786
yeah, I wonder how many gmail mailvelope users you're contacting.

>>62370681
>company is israel based, so it must be illuminati
>"help, they tunnel my unreadable, encrypted data!"
>not being concerned about the location of the reiciving mailhost since almost no one exclusivley mails within the pm network
this is so tiresome.

>>62370842
Hopefully you do realize that 99.99% of people out there are not going to spend $70/mo _just_ to have the overwhelming pleasure of hosting and curating their own email. Hell, they're not going to spend it even for the full gsuite.

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>>62367192
Love ya mate. Gave me chuckles. Oldfigs gonna oldfig.

>>62370873
mailcow site contains so much about smtppop3overyourmom shit. Where is dat 3 lines of configuration and API with 5 endpoints for monkey-me?

>>62371109
Why so salty? Nothing wrong with hosting a couple of things.

>>62369558
I couldn't find how to add my own domain to the slav botnet

>>62371239
Is $70/month a lot of money to you?

>>62371613
Irrelevant question. Re-read the post you're quoting.

>>62371549
man, really?
https://domain.yandex.com/domains_add/
was it hard? shall I hold your hands?

>>62371526
salty? nothing of that, at all. why so defensive?

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>>62365051
I don't see anything wrong with it, I'm not using their service(s including their vpn) to do illegal stuff, I use it because I don't want any personal information to be leaked in an hypotetical attack somehow.

>>62371717
>https://domain.yandex.com/domains_add/
Thanks FSB, doing it now.

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>>62372586
>tfw I'm unironically the FSB
Welcome aboard, comrade

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>>62367210
>hurp durp I advertise my Brazillian drug service with a protonmail account on the dark web
>
>Wow, really takes a rocket scientist to figure out that they were conducting illegal activity, really fucking surprised they didn't have to hire Sherlock to solve that case
>
>Riddle me my ass, faggot.
So, you stupid shithead... you're telling me that all I have to do to eliminate someone's Protonmail account is to create a fake ad for some contraband on some Tor hidden service and Protonmail will delete someone's account?

kek

Fuck ProtonMail. It's an obvious NSA honeypot. It's even run by americans! If you think they won't cooperate with the NSA and Swiss intelligence/police, you're a moron.

Switzerland """privacy""" is an even bigger myth than German privacy. Hint: both countries cooperate with the NSA as Snowden docs have shown. All this """privacy""" bullshit is just clever marketing for morons to fall for. Unless you're German living in germany and using german services (and Swiss living in Switzerland), you have no privacy whatsoever.

>>62371717
>https://domain.yandex.com/domains_add/
this is the way to go. you want to use services based in the country your own country's not friendly with. that way courts can't access shit.

>>62372841
good point, actually

>>62372790
>(and Swiss living in Switzerland)
See >>62370613
Swiss data privacy laws are a big myth.

>>62362365
>>switching to russian google
Well, I don't trust the American one.

>>62373056
No they're not a myth. The data exchange agreement has nothing to do with law enforcement. It's so that multinational companies can legally transfer information back to the USA. Before that it was illegal for a company like nestle to transfer private information to the USA.

Swiss privacy rules are the strongest in the world. The proton mail thing - it sounds like it was done voluntarily by the company and not compelled.

>>62373242
>it sounds like it was done voluntarily by the company and not compelled.
That's the problem though, they're playing detective without training or any transparency to their rules and process.

>>62373242
>Swiss privacy rules are the strongest in the world.
Good joke when it's illegal to provide a service anonymously or to contest an order to share identifying data with LE.

>>62373287
The guy broke a very Swiss rule that also goes against the purpose of using proton mail - he brought attention to himself by being an attention whore on Reddit. I would have dropped him too.

>>62373326
What service are you talking about? There's plenty of anonymous 'service' in Switzerland.

>>62356671
made an account long ago but never used it because it's too much hassle to switch primary emails

I do have questions about a recent development though:
>PM understandably bans accounts doing illegal things if evidence is provided
>PM claims to be unable to read your mails and stuff
>yet somehow there can be sufficient evidence to ban someone
what kind of evidence can possibly exist if their system works the way they promise? Anything that can be forged, like the contact address on an illegal poster, is not evidence. Aside from the textual content of the email address itself (the name), which is very flimsy grounds for banning someone, they can't really have any solid evidence of anything

>>62373369
Any telecommunication service.
https://www.admin.ch/opc/fr/classified-compilation/20002162/index.html#a15
https://www.admin.ch/opc/fr/classified-compilation/20120872/index.html

All these "anonymous" services are either lying or breaking the law.

>>62365051
They didn't break their own encryption to find any info here. Literally an email posted in public related to a poster inciting violence. This is the most sketchy shit you can find? You're really grasping for straws here.

>>62373388
Do you mean like buying a SIM card? There's no place in Europe where you can do that anonymously.

>>62373407
It's already been stated multiple times, but this just means anyone can throw a proton users email on something and get them banned.

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>>62373429

>>62373407
>They didn't break their own encryption to find any info here
Well, hopefully FFS. It wasn't implied.
>Literally an email posted in public related to a poster inciting violence.
It literally isn't.
>This is the most sketchy shit you can find? You're really grasping for straws here.
That's you.

>>62373462
Yes, We have to send a copy of our passport for every website we sign up for.

plenty of anonymous 'telecommmunication' 'services' here. Including anonymous email services. So I'm not really sure what point you're making.

>>62373388
>https://www.admin.ch/opc/it/classified-compilation/20002162/index.html#id-4
kek

>>62373348
This guy?
>>62365051
How do you prove it was him?

>>62373553
>So I'm not really sure what point you're making.
ProtonMail claims that they do not log your IP
>By default, we do not keep any IP logs which can be linked to your anonymous email account. Your privacy comes first.
The Swiss law says that companies providing telecommunication services (which is what ProtonMail does) are required to keep logs for 6 months. In the case of ProtonMail that would be access logs. Which do contain your IP.
Either ProtonMail is lying about not keeping logs or they are breaking the law.

And now considering that BÜPF has passed, anyone claiming that Switzerland is the best place to host privacy-respecting services is full of shit.

>>62373589
>https://www.admin.ch/opc/it/classified-compilation/20002162/index.html#id-4
Yes, this is basically saying surveillance is permitted in specific cases and with court orders (except in missing person cases) and that there is no blanket surveillance of the population.

Tutanota is located in germany.
How can this be more legit than a swiss product?
>price doesnt count, only 3 more bucks/month

>>62373671
I read something entirely different. Art. 2.2 basically says that this "surveillance task force" is independent from whatsoever governance and Art. 13.1 says that the same "surveillance task force" is the ultimate arbiter in deciding if there is such a Court order and if further judicial assistance is required; moreover, the "surveillance task force" proceeds in installing their own equipment with or without notification to the ISP. Also, Art. 3 says that even third parties not directly involved in said Court order and not involved in missing persons cases can be intercepted.
This is the typical case of Swiss Law. A mess.

>>62373660
There is no Swiss law saying ip addresses have to be saved.

4chan won't let me link to Westlaw, but you can see the Swiss data privacy laws there in English.

There's a lot of people shilling vpn services that say stuff like that.

>>62373876
I linked it twice already
Here, one more time. In all three languages.

https://www.admin.ch/opc/fr/classified-compilation/20002162/index.html#a15
https://www.admin.ch/opc/de/classified-compilation/20002162/index.html#a15
https://www.admin.ch/opc/it/classified-compilation/20002162/index.html#a15

Plus my own translation of the relevant bit

>They (service operators) are required to keep users' identifying data during 6 months as well as all traffic and billing data

>>62373876
It's actually illegal to identify someone in Switzerland based on their ip address.

>>62373923
>https://www.admin.ch/opc/de/classified-compilation/20002162/index.html#a15
"Monitored person".

This is the equivalent of surveillance of a criminal, for example, in the USA. It's not the general population.

>>62373923
>de la personne surveillée
>der überwachten Person
>della persona sorvegliata
it seems to be apply only if there's a surveilled person tbqh
it should be more clear about this, like stating that once an ISP is notified about a surveillance procedures, it must co-operate and keep such logs for six months [even after the surveillance ended][maybe?]

>>62374017
I'm reading it again and it's entirely possible that it just means that any ISP have to give all those logs in any moment at any request made by this task force, once a surveillance procedure is initiated.
If it's so, contrary to >>62373998 interpretation, ISP have to log everything for at least six months, just in case. It's like that in most Yurop anyway

>>62373998
Article 15 lists all the OBLIGATIONS of service providers
You're quoting paragraph 1, which says that service providers must transmit information about monitored people when asked about it.

What I'm talking about is paragraph 3 which doesn't concern monitored persons but says that service providers are obligated to keep identifying logs for 6 months of all their users. That's part of their obligations.

>>62374071
kek

>>62372841
This actually blew my mind.

>>62358416
>teknik.io
who's behind it?
is it trustworthy?

>>62374321
>This actually blew my mind.
I know. Years ago a guy I met at a hacker meetup told me that.

Also, pick one of the bigger foreign companies since they have large security teams and keep everything updated. That again keeps your data more secure since some script kiddie won't just wreck your shit.

Yandex and Mail.ru are the best for email if you're outside russia. No one can get to your shit and russians can't put you in jail.

>>62374653
an anonymous skiddo running windows on servers
no, on top of it his services are notorious for being unreliable

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Switzerland intelligence has access to XKeyscore. That means all of their telecom data is ingested into MARINA.
As part of the deal, US then extended data sharing agreements to Swiss companies.
You can basically tell which countries cooperate with the NSA based on whether they have data sharing agreements.
Most of the countries don't reveal these secret agreements (like Germany hid it for so long) but if a country had a data sharing agreement, you can bet your ass that NSA is ingesting everything.
Intelligence agencies then have access to XKeyscore which is like Google but has all the data and traffic of everyone.

Only retards think their data is safe in Switzerland.

PS: Money's not safe in Switzerland anymore either... IRS has the access to all bank data. It's part of the agreement that US forced onto Switzerland years ago over money laundering and potential sanctions on Swiss companies.

>>62358560
You can sell it to me for the exact price you've paid. :-)

>>62359813
it's pronounced 'gnome' retard

>>62358560
Seriously. Go to ProtonMail Subreddit to sell it. If you don't want it no more.

>>62369805
bump

Proton shills on suicide watch!

>>62376861
>source(s)

>>62356671
I use it for eBay because it requires real names, but only for that. Yandex and GMail for everything else, obviously never giving my real info, since they're both botnets.

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>>62358940
not having you email local has its advantages. fbi/leo niggers can't just bust in here and get that communication unless i have it open while they're here and it takes them somehow less than 1 minute to grab my computer while its on.

>>62380069
Anon, you've been fooled. Even without giving your real name, GMail will still know who you are.

>>62364751
Hello friend! This account was committing a crime and using cock.li to do it. If you become aware of this behavior and you don't disable their account (thus allowing the illegal activity using your service to continue), you lose your protections as a service provider, and you can go to prison for knowingly hosting this activity! And then *no one* will get to use their email!

>>62358416
>They complied with some information requests from the Swiss government, so it's compromised.
If it was a request, that's fucked, yeah. But if it's an order, that's totally fine. Protonmail's team is not going to jail for you either! You are *legally obligated* to respond to orders for information (subpoenas, search warrants).

>>62364557
>Much safer, as they didn't willingly comply
I have complied with every legal *order* for information I have received, and not responded to a single *request* for information. I don't want to spend the money on lawyers to file motions to squash for every single subpoena I get, though if I ever got one that was overly broad I probably would.

>>62380612
That's mathematically impossible, since I don't use any google service nor any other kind of social network.

>>62380706
>Hello friend! This account was committing a crime and using cock.li to do it. If you become aware of this behavior and you don't disable their account (thus allowing the illegal activity using your service to continue), you lose your protections as a service provider, and you can go to prison for knowingly hosting this activity! And then *no one* will get to use their email!
this.

for a bunch of technology enthusiasts, you guys sure act like a bunch of naive, idealistic, fucking retards.

>>62380306
>fbi/leo niggers can't just bust in here and get that communication unless i have it open while they're here and it takes them somehow less than 1 minute to grab my computer while its on.
Yeah tell that to DPR and that lulzec guy....

How much do you earn as a shill? I'm kind of tired of my current job. Not really.

>>62380732
>I don't use any google service nor any other kind of social network.
You're posting here, so you're using both.

>>62380732
>uses gmail
>claims not to use any google service
wut

>>62380798
>How much do you earn as a shill?
https://protonmail.com/careers#digital-marketing-specialist
We are hiring at the moment!
Send us your resume and find out :)
Very competitive salary, enter promotion code 4chan20 to get a 20% discount!

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>>62369805
wow. thanks for showing me.

>>62373242
>No they're not a myth. The data exchange agreement has nothing to do with law enforcement. It's so that multinational companies can legally transfer information back to the USA. Before that it was illegal for a company like nestle to transfer private information to the USA.

wut

>>62373383
i agree this is very surprising and immature.

>>62376861
sad

>>62380706
>You are *legally obligated* to respond to orders for information (subpoenas, search warrants).

destroy the subpoena'd evidence with hammers. thats what hillary did.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wbkS26PX4rc

>>62380794
yup that would be the only bottleneck. i only use my desktop to check my email at my apartment with doors locked. i have time to close the tab. i don't leave this desktop on but have a raspi/nas setup for 24/7 stuff

>>62359818
No, she bleached the drives

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>>62358812

>>62381318
Absolutely 100% false. She did not use a corrosive chemical, but rather, a program called bleachbit.

>>62358379
This

>>62381411
Kekd

>>62371717
If I switch from Proton to Yandex am I able to keep all of my emails?

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>>62384044
Yandex can import mailboxes but the problem is that Proton features a special snowflake encrypted implementation; as long as you can't access your mail with standard POP3/IMAP, you can't export your mailboxes anywhere
enjoy your fucking vendor lock-in

>>62384229
fuck. I found a tool to export the emails into eml format, can Yandex import that?

>>62380706
>If you become aware of this behavior
with a Court order or with "due diligence". Problem is what every other providers considers "due diligence". Some providers (see: Protonmail) seem to consider part of their duty collecting photos over the twitterwebs and connecting absolutely neutral slogan to unsolicited identities. This is past of the duties of a service provider. This is past their legal obligations to pre-emptively act on on their user-base. Everything else is fucking bullshit.

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>>62384333
I don't think so. Keep an offline copy of your past secure swiss botnet and call it a day.

>>62362154
>>62370634
What should I learn about it if I were to safely use self-hosting?

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posteo.net

>Posteois an email service provider offering paid email accounts for individuals and businesses based in Berlin, Germany. The service gained prominence during the aftermath of thepost-2013 global surveillance disclosures,[1][2]especially for its high standard security features and relative anonymity as it does not require any private information in the registration process

>>62386279
define "safely". I believe you mean "private" and/or "confidential", which would be a red herring. If you mean "properly set up so that it doesn't become a botnet for Niger heirs" you'll have to learn about blacklists, open relay, DKIM, SFP, server hardening and whatnot
>>62386593
>Germany
No. Your data is collected. And billing is compulsory, so the reference to TKG §111 is disgustingly misleading. On top of that see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Data_retention#Germany , blanket logging rules keep switching. Also, you can't add your own domain, hence you're locked forever with them.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-37465853
Swiss voters have given a strong approval to a law on new surveillance powers for the intelligence agencies.

The new law would allow the authorities to tap phones, snoop on email and deploy hidden cameras and bugs.

It would help Switzerland catch up with other countries, supporters say.

Opponents have feared it could erode civil liberties and put Swiss neutrality at risk by requiring closer co-operation with foreign intelligence agencies.

Some 65.5% of voters agreed to accept the proposal. It will allow the Federal Intelligence Service and other agencies to put suspects under electronic surveillance if authorised by a court, the defence ministry and the cabinet.
Analysis: Imogen Foulkes, BBC News, Berne

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-37465853
2/2
The big vote in favour of new powers for the intelligence services shows just how concerned the Swiss have become about a possible militant attack.

For decades, ever since a scandal in the 1980s in which Switzerland's government was revealed to have been spying on tens of thousands of its citizens, the Swiss have been sceptical about state surveillance. CCTV cameras are rare; even Google Street View is restricted because of Swiss privacy laws.

But the dreadful events in neighbouring France have changed many Swiss minds. Despite arguments from opponents that increased surveillance would not automatically increase security, voters handed huge new powers to their intelligence services.

The Swiss government says the powers would be used about once a month to monitor the highest-risk suspects.

The new law was not comparable to the spying capabilities of the US or other major powers, which "go well beyond what is desired in terms of individual liberty and security for our citizens", Defence Minister Guy Parmelin said earlier this year.

Swiss law currently prevents authorities from relying on anything more than publicly available information or tips from foreign officials when monitoring domestic threats, according to a government website.

The new surveillance law was passed last year but has not yet been enacted after opponents collected enough signatures to force a referendum under Switzerland's system of direct democracy.

On Sunday, Swiss voters also rejected a proposal to boost state pensions by 10% - an initiative supported by the left but considered too costly by opponents. Voters also rejected another initiative to reduce Switzerland's ecological footprint.

>>62387643
>>62387713
>>62374071
>>62373923
>>62373790
>>62373388
>>62373326
Also,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Data_retention#Switzerland

>>62387643
>to put suspects under electronic surveillance if authorised by a court
so basically you can come under surveillance if you are already a suspect

maybe stop breaking the law and becoming a suspect?

Will startmail stick around?

>>62358379
What about Tutanota?

I believe you but you didn't post a better alternative so..... WTF dude?

>>62390283
Who decides whether you're a suspect, though? And what is the criteria for "suspect"?

>>62357025
Same here

>>62390283
see >>62374071 , >>62373790

>>62390485
>>62390510
consider this: >>62372841 , >>62369286

>>62387643
There is almost no way to know for sure how many voters support anything anymore.

More often than not though these fucking media outlets are quick to let us know just how unfavorable liberties are.

Seems fishy.... Hide the Billionaires and trillionaires who own and dictate what is aired but over represent the liberty crushing shit tactics.

There is a very comforting bell ringing across the globe right now. The media is the most compromised facet of information.

>>62384564
Managed to export them all and then linked my Yandex account to Thunderbird, imported them, and now they have synced to Yandex, I'm free

>>62369821
Because they want a mail service they can pretend the government can't access. Not a mail service that actually just fucking works.

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>>62391760
excellent

>>62390510
>What about Tutanota?
It's a German company. It's hosted in Germany and run by Germans. It's completely compromised.

>According to documents Der Spiegel acquired from Snowden, the German intelligence agencies BND (foreign intelligence) and BfV (domestic intelligence) were also allowed to use the XKeyscore system. In those documents the BND agency was described as the NSA's most prolific partner in information gathering.[26] This led to political confrontations, after which the directors of the German intelligence agencies briefed members of the German parliamentary intelligence oversight committee on July 25, 2013. They declared that XKeyscore has been used by the BND since 2007 and that the BfV uses a test version since 2012. The directors also explained that this program is not for collecting data, but only for analyzing them.[27]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XKeyscore#Germany

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>>62392234
>not using posteo

>>62392266
>>62387538

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>>62392320
https://posteo.de/en/site/privacy

>>62392401
>>62387538

>>62358076
>implying we're all criminals

>>62392466
Who's deciding who is a criminal? You? Me? Some Mountain Jew? Twitter? Reddit? You tell me. Please.

>>62392401
Lily go back to >>>/tv/

>>62392401
>https://posteo.de/en/site/privacy
it's all fucking bullshit. they operate under the german law.

you cannot escape country's laws.

only way to keep your data away from your country's legal system is to host it in places where your country's legal system has no access.

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>>62392677
examples ?

>>62392746
>>62371717
>>62372841
>>62369286

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Host your own email
Neo/g/ istg

>>62362365
>>62360277
>>62359875
Switching from an encrypted Swiss provider who comply with Swiss law in shutting down blatant hate groups (while turning over ZERO emails) to an unencrypted Russian conglomerate who would happily hand over your information to the modern day KGB

No thanks. Hacking my vote was enough.

>>62394607
>>62394607
>who would happily hand over your information to the modern day KGB
and not a single fuck was given. next you'll tell me you're hillary or trump, right? see
>>62372841
>>62369286

>>62394607
>unencrypted Russian conglomerate
it's not unencrypted for all intent and purposes. Your whole perception of crypto applied to email is ultimately wrong, unless you and all your recipients are using the OpenPGP standard. Yet, the OpenPGP standard has nothing to share with "privacy" and enables EVEN MORE collection of non-repudiable metadata from any sort of middle-men.

>>62387538
Just run OpenBSD and set up OpenSMTPD. Relay your email via your ISP or other service which is not blacklisted. DKIM / SPF / DMARC is not that complicated.

>>62395288
>Just

>>62395288
This is /g/, can also do it on Gentoo or any other fetish you may have.

>>62358408
Protons don't exist

Have you ever seen a proton?

>>62395778
science btfo

>>62356671
https://mailbox.org/

go upstair instead of email ur mem