haters gonna hate http://benchmarksgame.alioth.debian .org/u64q/php.html

>>60126145
Yeah, they fixed a lot of problems in the Zend Engine when they upgraded to the version number that comes after 5, which — according to the PHP core devs — is 7.

They won't be able to fix the language itself and its standard library which is beyond saving.
Not as long as the core devs are split into pro FP / pro OOP / pro procedural groups which vote down nearly every single proposal that's made by one of the other groups, at least.

And even then we'll be stuck with faggot retards who keep running PHP 5.3 even today, which is like 8 years old and got its last security fixes 3 years ago and its last bugfixes 4 years ago.

God damn I hate PHP and the people who keep it relevant by using it.

>>60126514
>won't be able to fix the language itself
i feel like it's intentionally byzantine to make it difficult to rewrite programs in any other language, thus providing job security for php devs and making sure they have a hard time switching to any other language

>God damn I hate PHP and the people who keep it relevant by using it.
meh. What else do you really have for web scripting? Ruby and Python are just worse PHP in a fancier box. Javascript is, well, Javascript.

>>60126655
>What else do you really have for web scripting

Java or C#. At least when you have automatic recompiling.

>>60126675
>Java or C#
have actually been planning on learning one or both of those in the next year... C# looks especially comfy now that MS is onboard with OSS to some extent.

PHP shops aren't going away any time soon though.

>>60126145
>vs Python 3
whooptie fucking doo

>>60126712
Don't forget that most of PHP's market share comes from Wordpress shit. Most of these installs don't have a PHP developer behind them, they are usually made from free (and pirated) wordpress plugins slapped together.

And if this post here just saves one person from even considering writing WordPress plugins for a living: I've done you a huge service. Fucking don't.


If it has to be PHP, I use Symfony. Together with PHPStorm and the Symfony plugin, it's actually kinda comfy.
But I know how horrible it would be without the plugin. It would be full of magic string constants nobody could possibly understand and lose relations between files nobody could comprehend.

The lack of attributes, generics, (possibly extensible) enums and a complex type system really makes PHP a nightmare for large projects.

>>60126773
Laravel here. Composer's autoloader actually makes namespacing pretty convenient, in my experience.

The type system is shit, but I don't really rely on it too much, honestly

>>60126857
I never complained about namespacing. Of course composer and PSR-0 and PSR-4 have solved many problems (Although it's pathetic that this had to be fixed externally, the SPL's default autoload implementation is absurd).

>>60126889
i was just saying i rely on that for keeping big projects organized.

i literally work in vim and it's not difficult for me to manage fairly large web apps / services that way...

>>60126675
>java
how?

>>60126514
But the php-fig is awesome and they've come up with nice interfaces for everybody to use so you use whatever parts of a framework you want with whatever pars of other frameworks.

If only they worked faster.

>>60126964
Spring framework, for example.

It's basically what Symfony is trying to be, just like Doctrine is trying to copy Hibernate.
Most of the FIGs efforts are basically to make working with PHP like working with Java's retarded cousin, which at least is still much nicer than what Lerdorf intended (Perl and C' retarded cousin).

Basically, you can give any language a nice HTTP library and you already have something that's more capable as a language for HTTP scripts than PHP.
And when general purpose languages are better at handling web stuff than a language that was designed ONLY to be used for this specific purpose you know just how much of a turd is really is.

>>60127017
>any language
i mean, you're comparing it to a compiled language... be fair and compare it to Python or Ruby, at least.

PHP is better (faster at least) for general programming stuff than those languages, which were designed for general programming

>>60126773
What does the symfony plugin for phpstorm do? Does it give you completion for the container?

>>60126514
Right now it's mod_php and WordPress.

But before it was mod_perl and Movable Type.

Now perl is fucking dead on shared hosting.

The future you want can happen with mod_fizzbuzz and a good CMS.

>>60127184
>Right now it's mod_php and WordPress

I'd say nginx + fastcgi with Symfony

>>60126145
php is bad because my internet memes told me so.

>itt: plebeians not using a full Common Lisp stack with caveman2 serverside and parenscript clientside

>>60126655
>What else do you really have for web scripting?
Literally everything goes.

>>60127182
That was the original function, yeah.
Later they added lots more... easy generation of servie XML or YAML definitions, config autocompletions, doctrine autocompletions (DQL queries with entity names and properties and everything), Navigating to twig templates from a controller and back, autocompletion for values passed into twig templates from a controller, Autocompletions for formtypes and their plain text options, even supporting your own extensions, Autocompletion for "Annotations", being able to set up a keyboard shortcut to navigate to a controller by route name, Autocompletion and navigating for routing including route parameters and twig template names...

It has it all.

PHP vs Node.js
https://benchmarksgame.alioth.debian.org/u64q/compare.php?lang=php&lang2=node