Why Linux sucks

>>58980497
broken components within Linux are considered a feature.

>>58980497
The btrfs RAID 5/6 code getting cleaned up would be nice. I was originally using it on my home server, but I took it off, and it's just running JBOD at the moment.
I'm also waiting on the AMDGPU DC code to land.

Other than that, I have no real issues with the Linux kernel.

>>58980497
>1 - Gaming
>2 - Gaming
>3 - Gaming

>>58980561
can't break what doesn't exist

>>58980497
Nvidia driver support, optimus, wayland

Its fucking disgusting that your gpu performs significantly worse on linux than on windows

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>>58980582

>>58980497
It's userbase

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>>58980561

Yes, there are absolutely no games on Linux.

>>58980514
Bugs within any OS or program are features, as long as it's useful. That's development 101.

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>>58980619
Not even close to as many as on Windows and the shitty video drivers make them run like complete crap, but keep deluding yourself that Linux gaming is a thing. I'll be on Windows enjoying 21:9 games at butter smooth 100fps

>>58980497
It will always suck. You cant create something good and cohesive when doing it by committee. Committee's of people that have no vetting, no ultimate responsibility for the end product, and no real goal other than try to make it better when you can with free time...

>>58980619
>Borderlands, L4D, and a bunch of indie garbage
I'm glad that Linux is becoming a better gaming platform, but face it, there's still a long way to go.

Fucking wifi, bluetooth and battery life when compared to windows or osx

Linux is broken by design. The kernel is a complete mess that's just been haphazardly cobbled together over decades

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NEVER EVER

>>58980701
Not to mention fragmented into trillions of different special snowflake distros broken and incompatible with each other.

It's bloat.

>>58980663
I use all of this stuff and have great battery life. Your PC must be taking a shit on you. My computer is probably one of the most proprietary and I am running Arch fuckin' flawlessly. I even have Nvidia drivers installed and working, touchpad, touchscreen, keyboard light, etc is working like a charm. Please, Linux isn't that hard to use and it certainly isn't a buggy pos like people always say. 79% of people who own servers wouldn't use Linux on them if it was shit. NASA wouldn't use Gentoo if it was a shitty meme distro like everyone says. Also, if you have a problem, try Googling it. I can almost guarantee you will find a solution.

>>58980715
Someone correct the record

>>58980781
Using eOS I get an hour less battery life, constant bluetooth problems (turning on by itself or displaying error messages on boot) and very frequent wifi disconnects when compared to windows 10.

>inb4 eOS
It's based on Ubuntu 16.04

Kernel level support for the thousands of proprietary devices that already exist and continue to come out will never be a realistic goal

>>58980781
omg no one called for the linux defense go away jeez

>>58980781
>NASA wouldn't use Gentoo
I thought they used ultron

>piping screenfetch to cowsay
lol.
In truth, screenfetch is a ricer kiddie application, not a UNIX tool

>>58980818
Elementary OS? I personally don't like the dev team because they try to trick you into donating on their download page. I'll donate if it's worth it.
>>58980821
You mad?
>>58980823
Kek

>>58980497
>broken/needs improvement?
1. Basically all DE's
2. Being able to buy any laptop/component without having yo do research first.

1 I can let slip, but dunno about normies, 2 is what keeps stopping Looniks to be usable for the masses or anyone who doesn't wants to spend two weeks looking for hardware just to be like >lol, right model, wrong revision after buying

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>>58980715
They'll fix it in GTK4

>>58980918
>Elementary OS? I personally don't like the dev team because they try to trick you into donating on their download page. I'll donate if it's worth it.
Yup.
I don't like that either, but I really like the look of the OS.
I find it to be worth it, been using it since Loki came out, I might throw some money their way if I use it a bit longer.

>>58980928
Never had any of these problems and own an Asus Zenbook Pro UX501vw.

>>58980918
>they try to trick you into donating on their download page
Well, so does Ubuntu.

>>58980662
Risk of Rain is god-tier tho

>>58980951
It is very visually appealing. I've used it for a while but moved on. Really, what we need is someone to port

pantheon

. I would love to try but simply don't have any time.

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>>58980953

>>58980958
I agree, I also don't like Ubuntu because canonical took Debian, shit all over it and came on it too. And that's how Ubuntu was born!

linux is close to perfect, it's the software revolving around it needs improvement, constant bugs and stupid decisions because easily guilt tripped white dumbasses that let dumb people take over (github, ubuntu, and so forward), 2008 linux was just right (ubuntu 8.04 for ex)

>>58980982
To be fair, Ubuntu made Linux accessible for the masses. I remember when they were shipping free CD's all around the world.
It has the best hardware detection I've seen so far (with autoinstall for drives too), but I haven't personally used Linux on the desktop in nearly a decade, so I don't now if, say Mint, does a better job. And Shuttleworth had well intentioned suggestion that would had made the Linux landscape much better, like synched releases for projects, which would make it easier to support.

>>58980497
>What about linux is broken/needs improvement?

The focus on designing new eye-candy instead of stability/robustness/bug fixes.

A good example is KDE5. Sure, switching to version 5 gave the designers a platform to express themselves artistically, using their new "flat" style (if you like that sort of thing). But in the process, they threw a way a lot of good, stable, flexible stuff in KDE4 which they might or might not ever re-implement.

The feature loss manifests itself in 1000 tiny ways -- and if you add them all up, it becomes significant.

Instead of all that effort in redesigning the look and feel, it would have been much better if they had -- for example -- implemented a robust fix for the vsync screen tearing problem. Sure, the vsync fix is a lot more boring than getting to have fun designing new artwork -- but the vsync fix would have created, conservatively, 100 times more value per hour of development time than designing new artwork. For example, for every person who finds significant value in the new "flat" art design, there are other 100 people who were actually more bothered by the unfixed screen tearing problem.

That's the metric they don't understand: Value per hour of development time. A lot of times, the boring work of fixing bugs actually produces the maximum amount of value for the project. By focusing on low-value projects, it causes the software to advance at a much slower rate. Many people say that KDE5 is a big step backward. After spending a few days with it, I would have to agree. It's sad to see such needless self-destruction. It's not fatal -- KDE could eventually bounce back again -- but it's all so goofy because it was totally avoidable if only the developers had their priorities in the right order and focused on selecting projects that maximize the overall value of what it contributes to the software.

>>58981069
the feature and usability developers left, and the eye candy and social justice developers came in, thats why its in such a shit state

>>58980561
>>58980646
manchild

>>58981069
>they threw a way a lot of good, stable, flexible stuff in KDE4
H O L Y F U C K
O
L
Y

F
U
C
K

Please don't tell me they fucking did it again. I was there, when they switched from a perfectly usable KDE3 into the utter garbage that was KDE 4.0
>Don't worry guys
>It'll get better as we go up.
I heard that not too long ago, Plasma was finally stable and usable. And, yes for those who think and bitter and salty, I AM. I believed in helping the KDE project, I put both time and money into it. A lot of shit wasn't properly documented and they got called out on that during the switch. Their response? Disregard that, this fucker (not me but someone else) hasn't been involved in the project long enough.
THIS IS WHAT IS WRONG WITH FOSS/LINUX. They have even been called by Torvalds. Jesus Fucking Christ.

>>58981124
lol kubuntu 8.04 to 8.10 right?

>>58981133
Not even. I believe I was using Arch back then
>using Arch before it was even kool

>>58981155
>not using puppy linux
i can only imagine what configuring arch was like with the driver support and maturity of arch at that time lmao

>>58981124
They did.

>>58981185
Actually, not that hard. My laptop back then was a bit old, (2005/6) and Arch actually had a rudimentary install script that would the basic chores for you (launch the network daemon on ethernet with DHCP and partition the disk for you). The only things left to do were ALSA, X (which back then already had some sort of autoconfig script with hotplug) and the WiFi.

>>58981215
Such a fucking disgrace. Good thing now I'm a macfag.

>>58981069
>Instead of all that effort in redesigning the look and feel, it would have been much better if they had -- for example -- implemented a robust fix for the vsync screen tearing problem.

if you want vsync gone force the option through an xorg conf, every driver that I'm aware of supports it, the proprietary gpu drivers even allow you to disable it for fullscreen applications like games

>>58981069
>The focus on designing new eye-candy instead of stability/robustness/bug fixes.
That's devs in general though, in both the proprietary and FLOSS worlds.

Sellers of proprietary software hate maintaining existing software because they've already made their money on selling licenses for it, and want to reduce the cost of working on it after that. They love new features because new features bring in revenue by selling version X + 1.

FLOSS devs hate maintaining existing software becuase fixing bugs is dull, tedious work, and if there aren't any bugs to fix, then there's nothing to do at all. They love new features because new features are interesting, a blank canvas that they get to re-architect things on.

Why do you think both MS and many FLOSS operating systems are on either rolling-release schedules, or quick releases on the order of weeks to months apart, with short or zero support periods? Hint: It's not because that's what's most convenient for users.

>>58981266
Great. Now hopefully the KDE guys will actually implement that fix by default. It's 2017 -- no distro should be shipping with a default driver/compositor/configuration that exhibits the vsync problem. Now, somebody go tell that to the KDE guys. It doesn't matter if you can fix it by hand in xorg.conf. The vsync problem needs to be fixed BY DEFAULT in ALL desktops and ALL distros -- period.

>>58980745
> incompatible

Literally all of the same software runs on all of them. Wut?

>>58980701
Explain

>>58980825
>computer must be for serious computering at all times.
>arguing on /g/

>>58980825
>>58981509
cowsay is v srs

>>58981366
>That's devs in general though, in both the proprietary and FLOSS worlds.

But in the proprietary world, they can use money to actually focus on fixing the necessary but boring bugs.

> Sellers of proprietary software hate maintaining existing software

Well, they might hate it, but if it affects the bottom line, they'll do it. For example, Microsoft tries mightily to fight off the reputation that they have an insecure, buggy, crashy OS. The way people laughed at them for the blue screen of death was a huge marketing crisis for them. That got Microsoft to spend money to work on those problems. I'm not saying Microsoft fixed everything, but they sure have made some progress over the years. Progress that simply would not have been possible if the intense pressure for corporate profits didn't exist.

The problem in FOSS is that there is no corresponding business pressure to force the developers to fix their shit. That's specifically why proprietary software can enjoy such a huge advantage over FOSS on the desktop.

>>58981594
>Progress that simply would not have been possible if the intense pressure for corporate profits didn't exist.
You know that over 80% of kernel devs are paid corporate employees these days, right? Companies pay them to work on whatever bits of the kernel are important to them and their specific needs.

>>58981629
>Companies pay them to work on whatever bits of the kernel are important to them and their specific needs.
Not that anon, but I know this is true. Most relevant FOSS projects are backed by corps. None of these corps are interested in supporting a DE, making them supported mostly by actual volunteers, which very few are interested in bugfixing the boring yet usuable stuff

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It'd be nice if dist-upgrade didn't bork a box. Pic related is Debian going from Jessie to Stretch with only about 600 packages installed.

All this for nodejs that isnt at v0.4 or whatever Debian uses in it's Stable branch.

>>58981629
> over 80% of kernel devs are paid corporate employees

Yes -- the kernel is a special case. The kernel is important enough to warrant paid corporate development. As a result, the Linux kernel is getting pretty damn good.

I was talking about everything else in FOSS -- especially the desktops and apps. That's where the quality crisis is hurting FOSS the worst.

If you want to understand why we have no "year of the Linux desktop", you need to start looking at the bumbling idiocy of projects like GNOME and KDE; and to understand the magnitude of the weaknesses in software like LibreOffice and GIMP in comparison to their proprietary counterparts.

>>58981819
>None of these corps are interested in supporting a DE

You don't need to go any further to get a clear understanding of why we can't have a "year of the Linux desktop".

I'm not saying that the corporations should support DE development -- that's up to them to decide. What I'm saying is that their lack of interest in doing so so far has been a major factor in holding back Linux on the desktop.

>>58981069
But, eye candy has electrolytes. its what plants crave

Also, the only thing broken with linux its some of its users.
Ive been using fedora LXDE for around 4 years now as my only home OS. I will never switch to anything else, its amazing

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>>58980497
>this thread

>>58982107
ok

Drivers, I installed amd drivers and now linux won't even boot, oh yeah recovery mode will freeze too.

>>58982107
Don't see a problem, been here since... can't remember 2005 maybe.

>>58980497
>james

>2017
>case sensitive filenames are still a thing

>>58982298
Of course they are. Why would it be any other way?! Case insensitive filenames are what is insane.

>>58982298
You can't be serious.

>>58980597
>Nvidia
Maybe don't choose to buy from a company that couldn't give a fuck about the open source community? It's not like there's another manufacturer that respects open source and releases open source drivers...

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>>58980561

Systemd needs to go

>>58980932
nope
install KDE

With current Samba implementation, processes just half when you try to access a mount if there's no network connection. That's pretty disgusting if you ask me.

Also often I'd be unable to unmount shares, with system complaining that the file is busy, despite lsof and fuser showing no processes are accessing the mount point.

>>58980497
>t. autist

>>58981587
Sure.

fractional scaling. I have a 1080p 13.3" laptop and 1x scaling makes UI elements too small and 2x makes them enormous. Windows 10 can do 1.5x just fine, in fact it auto detects my hardware and defaults to that on a clean install. GNOME can only scale by integers. KDE can only scale by integers as well, although they have a slider that is misleading and appears to be able to do 1.5x but really only scales the fonts up and scales the UI to integer values. So basically my laptop, and almost any other small laptop with a high resolution screen, is unusable on Linux until this is fixed.

>>58984316
by the way, here's the relavent bug report for GNOME / GTK. it's really disheartening how low priority this is for them, i would imagine there are thousands of laptops affected by this bug https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=720502

>>58980543
JBOD, what is this? The 90's?

>>58984348
I have 3 drives, so I can't do RAID 10, and I don't want to do RAID 1.
I want to run them in RAID 5 again.

stability

>be using Manjaro KDE
>sudo pacman -Syu
>suddenly all my software starts crashing immediately on startup

>screen tearing
>X.org
>lack of professional touch

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>>58980497

>>58983946
Unlike most of the other complaints in this thread, ALSA was truly a disaster for sound on Linux. If we were still using OSS, half the problems people have with their sound hardware would disappear completely.

>>58980497
xkb

>>58980543
You "have" to do nothing like that.

You can just run mdadm RAID 5 or 6 and then btrfs on top.

>>58984704
OSS went closed source for a while, pretty much forcing a replacement, by the time OSS went foss again, ALSA had gained momentum

>>58984755
I know the story. It doesn't make it any less of a disaster.

>>58984716
A btrfs filesystem is capable of spanning multiple drives, so doing it natively means that btrfs can use them better (storing all of their metadata redundantly in the right places, etc.).
If you use mdadm, it can only think of it as a single block device.

>>58984582
>not screenfetch | ponysay -f pinkie -Wi +c '38;5;212';

>>58984811
That's right.

>>58981885
a lot of things have changed between jessie and stretch.. why didn't you just get that fucking package from backports or testing/unstable ?

and why did a dist-upgrade erase the part of your brain where you stored your password ?

>>58982517
Couldn't care less as a costumer why x doesn't work properly with y

It just doesn't.

>>58984795
RAID itself will make the metadata redundant etc. no problem.

BRTFS own filesystem level implementation has (very few) advantages, but its not really production ready to begin with.

Every commercial NAS etc out there uses mdadm RAID. It works, use it rather than the newfangled FS level toy that doesn't do anything much better.

Nothing it just werks for me

>>58984862
Why do you space your posts like that?

>>58984862
>newfangled FS level toy that doesn't do anything much better.
scrubbing and disk addition/removal are more efficient, as the raid layer is aware of the filesystem layer, it can work only with the parts of the disk that are actually in use
also, you can potentially use multiple raid levels right down to a single file

now, i'm not him, and i do currently use btrfs over mdadm, but i'd rather be using btrfs on its own

>>58980619
Shifty indie games and old dead games with empty communities , while popular games with big player base have no support .
Linux gaming is as dead as the day is long. Don't fool yourself..

>>58980646
>the shitty video drivers make them run like complete crap
maybe your enviroment is bloated to hell or something, I get 500fps with smooth input/low latency on CS:GO, CS:S, CS 1.6, Quake3, Quakeworld, Xonotic, even osu through wine. pretty much any game I've tried

>>58984384
why do you even use a rolling release distro in the first place?
Thats actually what happens when u use bleeding-edge distribution
full of retards this place.

All open source programming languages are not regular syntax languages. Making it a huge pain in the penis to code. For example, in math you have a vector. In C you have array, map, vector, matrix, wtf? All barely functional attempts to simulate what is known as a group in math, and the 10 associated axioms you learn in highschool algebra.

>>58985060
also hash table, its just 2xN matrix. g

>>58985008
>open Don't Starve Together in store
>6,160 playing now
So dead...

Meanwhile...
>open GTA:V in store, a supposed pinnacle of PC gaming
>solid red block of bad reviews from unjust bans
So unshitty...

>>58984896
Why not?

>>58984927
Its no problem either way, scrubbing works online and you can rate limit if you really need to, addition/removal are usually rare.

Plus it's all not compensating for the "beta quality, do not use in production" btrfs RAID5/6 drawback anyhow.

Mdadm RAID works well and is tested. Don't do btrfs RAID5/6 at this point.

>>58985208
>Don't do btrfs RAID5/6 at this point
Yes, we all know it's broken.
I was waiting for them to fix it.

1) Less games
2) Less software
3) More complicated
4) Requires tinkering
5) Stupid, arrogant community
6) Boring wallpapers

>>58985241
There is no point in waiting though.

The advantages the other people managed to list are overall pretty damn tiny and it just doesn't make much sense to consider that having rarely used tiny features like that would tip the scales on having tested production-ready RAID5/6 on mdadm even if it was already out.

Also, it could take years for this reimplementation to take place. They've been taking years for just about everything else.

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>>58980497
Alright OP it's a pretty nice bait, and I will take it.
Linux in general is pretty comfy.
It's not for the average desktop consumer (see gamers, people dependent to enterprise software), but everything server related and the (usual document writing, internet browsing), it just werks and kills it.

People fight for hours, arguing why their OS is superior to the other.

(You probably have heard of the shills, shilling muh mac is better than your wind0wz reee!111 or the freetards shilling muuh gentoo).

Sane people and not actual twats, would use the best provided by both of the worlds.

It's your choice, OP.

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>>58985270
>6) Boring wallpapers

This is a new level of bait

>>58980646
There are more native games for linux and mobile released last year than all the games for windows combined.

>>58980701
bullshit, the linux kernel is a brilliant piece of software, i just rebuilt mine a couple of days ago

Linux darkstar 4.4.38 #6 SMP Wed Feb 15 06:13:34 CST 2017 x86_64 Intel(R) Core(TM) i5-3570 CPU @ 3.40GHz GenuineIntel GNU/Linux

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>>58980619
i have games

>>58985270
>6) Boring wallpapers
Not if you use BolgenOS!

>>58985308
The solution is to push the fat man onto the top of the train as it moves. This wouldn't slow down the tram and it would likely kill the fat man too.

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>>58985308

>>58980561
>>>/v/

>>58985474
not pull lever because there will be a constant pile of humans, stacked and eventually the trolley would halt and/or derail.

Let's get rid of systemd, dbus, and SELinux.

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>>58980619
> STILL no Vive support

>>58981885
>forgets password
>somehow this is a Linux issue
Holy fuck what are they teaching you kids in school these days?

>>58984838
>buys diesel car
>complains when xhe puts gasoline into it
It should just work right?

>>58987118

What the fuck is a Vive?

Is that some new fangled VR tech for degenerates who need 3D porno with their automated masturbaters?

As far as I knew most of that shit was moving to Vulkan anyway, so Linux support will be great soon enough

>>58982362
>>58982477
Case-sensitive file names are an ancient artifact from the days when a case-insensitive string comparison was considered a slow and expensive operation. There is literally no reason anymore to keep using a case sensitive file system.

>>58984582
but muh colors

The only things I really want are better Broadcom WiFi and HiDPI display support.

>>58983946
>alsa
for real. Installeed then uninstalled gnome, xfce4 and gdm and now my speakers just don't work

>>58987147
More
>buy diesel car
>go to gas station
>car doesn't work
>hey you didn't put in diesel that came from the Cantarel Mexican reservoir
>You put on diesel that came from the Cantarel 02 Mexican reservoir
>which only sold on at the gas station close the rapey neighbourhood on the other end of the state.
>how can you be so fucking retarded, lol

>>58980497
Why fucking bother with this thread? Every complaint will just be met with
>lol if you don't know how to install a display driver without the use of your monitor go back to stumbleupon.

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>>58981587

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>>58984582

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>>58985095
>shitty indie games
>n-no they have Don't Starve Together
>6000 players, see dad?!

KEK

>>58980701
>linux is a complete mess
>windows lives in a single 300GB git repository
hmmm

>>58980818
eOS is shit. Ubuntu does the exact thing they're trying to, but better.

If you're looking to do actual work with Linux, install Ubuntu or Fedora. If you want to screw around or are experienced, choose some other distribution. If you want to play video games all day, stick to Windows.

>>58990244
this guy knows what's up

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FONTS

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BITCH FONTS TALK TOO MOTHERFUCKING MUCH

>>58990519
Dam son, that looks even worse than windows.
Must have took some work.

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>>58990544
it's just that I can't stand the fucking unhinted look of GNOME fonts, but the hinted looks makes me go back fifteen years in the past, I feel like I'm gonna download AIM on my 28k modem

I can't stand this fucking font rendering anymore

Here, have some antialiased blurry SHITFONT

>>58990627
>not going full hint
If you want blurry fonts just take your glasses off.

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>>58990644
>not going full hint
2003 called, they want their oversized inseam jeans back

>>58980561
Maybe you should learn to read more :^)
> Playstation 3 runs CellOS, a FreeBSD derivative.
Probably because creating code for hardware on linux, means GPL, which in turn means uncooperating hardware vendors.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PlayStation_3_system_software#System

>>58980701
>>58980745
Babbys first fakenews

>>58985474
>Analytically extended

Genuinely rustles me so hard. If you're going to extend the domain of a function and then pretend that your spooky findings have anything to do with the original domain, then you might as well just fuck it all off and say 1 == 0.

>>58990130
> muh player count needs to be higher
8 of the top 10 currently played Steam games also are available on Linux.

(CS:Go, Dota 2, ARK, Team Fortress 2, Rust, Rocket League, Garry's Mod, Football Manager 2017)

>>58980662
depends on what you need and how NEET you are
most adults won't have time to play a fraction of the stuff that's out for Linux anyway

>>58980715
Behold! The power of open source!

https://github.com/ahodesuka/gtk/tree/bgo141154-filechooser-icon-view-gtk2
https://gist.github.com/ahodesuka/01213036b58e510dc074
https://gist.github.com/ahodesuka/49c1d0eea4b64f24c4c7

https://aur.archlinux.org/packages/gtk2-patched-filechooser-icon-view/
https://aur.archlinux.org/packages/glib2-patched-thumbnailer/