Programming Languages

>>58700859
javascript because you can use it to do almost everything.

frontend backend shell scripting desktop and mobile apps

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>>58700859
"Best" language is subjective to what you want.

But pic related is breddy good.

Go.

>>58700865
Everything in your narrow view...

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The obvious answer is C. It's been relevant for decades and will continue to be relevant for decades more. Most languages are based on it.

>>58700859
>What are the best programming languages to learn right now?
>best
Best for what? For learning programming? For getting an entry-level job? For making a mobile application?

Rust.

>>58700923
Ah- yes
I was waiting for someone to say this.

Now why is Rust the best to learn?

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Depends on what you want to do? What do you want to do?

>>58700865
>javascript
>mobile
>desktop
>backend
Kill yourself and take your 9999 hipster github repo dependencies with you. We don't need people like you shitting up the industry.

>>58700938
Speed of C without the memory-related errors and with the expressive power of ocaml, along with scheme macros. Standard is smaller than C's. No runtime and no GC. Because correctness is enforced at the type-level, it forces you to learn how to write correct programs on the levels the type system enforces.

>>58700859
C
IDL
FORTRAN

everything else is for cucks.

>>58700859
Lua's pretty great.
Especially for gamedev and embedding, but also good for pretty much everything.

>>58700997
And why would you learn it over Go?

>>58701418
Go has a GC, fuckall expressive power (not even generics!), no hygienic macros, and is designed to be used by pooinloos rather than to allow high-quality programs to be created efficiently. In general, it ignores all the knowledge that programming language research and experience has brought. For example, it took forever until it could even do dynamic linking officially. Its only notable feature, concurrency, is much better implemented as a library than as a core part of the language.

>>58700869
why the fuck isn't this pinned

>>58700981

Don't listen to guys like this. Google hosts all their web servers using node.js and Go. It's because node.js (javascript) uses a JIT compiler (Just In Time). The compiler for javascript is actually written entirely in C contrary to how most languages do it. What you get is a language that actually get's near C++ levels of speed but with really advanced asynchronous operations, making it second to only Go in server side performance.

TDLR; Javascript was a bad with a very narrow view on programming, but has grown in to an extremely powerful language that large companies that need power use. People just hate on it because: 1) It's young 2) It use to be bad and they don't know better 3) The language is not statically type, and it has first class functions, which is contrary to most Object Oriented languages, so it scares them.

>>58701474
The people that made C made Go. Stop being mad because the language is still young and developing.

>>58701486
Because it's beyond garbage.

>>58701499
(You)

>>58701487
How much do you get paid per post?

>>58701487
>Google hosts all their web servers using node.js

What are you smoking?

> It's because node.js (javascript) uses a JIT compiler

You mean, like Java has since it was invented? Scheme and LUA have JIT implementations.

>The compiler for javascript is actually written entirely in C contrary to how most languages do it.

Ruby, Python, etc have compilers written in C. The only real exceptions are things like Rust and Go, where the compiler is written in ... Rust and Go.

jQuery

>>58701524

28 Rupees, sir.

>>58700869
>no mention of good languages

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>>58701487
>jit compilation
>first class functions
>advanced async
>network performance
Not special, almost any other language can do those things better. Languages like F# can do all those things perfectly.

>near C++ speed
Is pointless when you're forced to use 9999 poor quality dependencies pulled from github in order build anything non-trivial.

>dynamic typing
That's disgusting.

>google uses it therefore _______
Kill yourself.

>>58700859
It's like fortune always knows what threads to throw upon me whenever I need to ask a question.

So my field of study is IET (Info Engineering Tech) and I'm hoping to specialize particularly in networking. I also work as a student tech where I do administrative stuff as well. However, since I was in HS and started getting into the computer field and I first found this place, I've wanted to learn a scripting language, Perl in particular as well as bash, however I just can't fucking stick with it.

So I'm fairly familiar with the logic and operators that go behind scripting and programming, and if you were to give me a simple source code, I'd probably be able to follow along and see what it's doing, however I can't create worth a shit unless it's something extremely urgent, in which case I'll slap something together.

Now, I already know the answer to remedy this problem, and that's to actually practice and do it, but therein lies my problem. I can't keep focus and as soon as I start learning, I get distracted just as quickly and do something else.

So how do I get out of this dilemma, /g/? Also is it worth learning Python?

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Learn the following and you're good to go:
C and Ocaml
C# and F#
Java and Scala

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>>58700859
Visual Basic & Visual C#

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>>58701669

At least that clusterfuck isn't part of the sort of code you're encouraged to write.

I'm looking at you PHP.

>>58700859
Python sucks but it's my bread and butter.

Don't do fronted unless you like competing with blue hairs and diversity hires.

Learn C while studying operating systems.
Learn Java/C++ with larger projects.

Fundamentals from C will translate into most languages because you'll understand what those languages are abstracting away from the user.

If you want to get into web dev, start using python or ruby frameworks to build something. If you want to develop desktop software C#. If you want to develop apps enjoy swift and java. If you want to work for an enterprise company and deal with pajeet's constantly shitty commits, keep using java.

Expect to use javascript everywhere. React is probably the most marketable front end framework atm, coupled with something like redux or reflux.

In terms of learning, python is probably best.

>>58700859
https://www.google.com/about/careers/students/guide-to-technical-development.html

C++, Java®, Python®, JavaScript®, CSS & HTML, Ruby®, PHP®, C®, Perl®, Shell® script, Lisp®, Scheme®

I would also add C#/Android/Swift for phone development.

>>58701787
my nigga
>classic theme
>visual studio

>>58700981
kill yourself clueless cunt

if you don't want to keep reinventing the wheel you're going to have dependencies for every language.

the only reason they are used more in nodejs is because they're so simple to install and manage. they install in your project folder and dont shit up your system like python.

if you don't know what youre talking about dont try giving people advice. go back to desktop/battlestation threads.

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>>58701487
>javascript
>near C++ levels of speed
>some people will read that post and believe it because they don't know any better
>the cycle of web developers being ignorant through indoctrination continues

>>58700869
>c# and Java, as difficult to learn as C

>>58701907
>Shell®
Shell is a registered trade mark?

>>58702117
they sell gasoline

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>>58702133

>>58701993
>t.butthurt js plebian

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>>58700859
C#

already an amazing language as soon as Asp.Net Core is full featured it will be over

>>58700865
everything for faggots like you, Javascript is the biggest meme in the entire history of programming

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>>58700869
nice image post my main dude

>>58701499
>The people that made C made Go.
>implying C is well-designed

>>58701993

>If you have to reinvent the wheel and write your own left-pad
>...

>>58702247

All memes aside would C# be a good first language?

>>58701499
harder?

>>58702499
for a first language i think it's great, vstudio takes away a lot of the pain beginners would face

>>58702499
I think it would work well as a beginner language. The syntax is borrowed from C so it's pretty generic and could be leveraged when learning other C style languages.

It has a robust set of libraries, the IDE is great, and with core you can now run it on windows or linux

>>58700859
If you want to implement everything from scratch yourself and not ever finish your projects, C
If you want an extremely fast clusterfuck, C++
If you want to solve every problem with a library, Python
If you want to write """enterprise""" tier code, Java
If you want to be a modern webpleb, JS + the framework of the week
If you want to use languages that are still not finished, Rust or Go
If you want to be a Microsoft/Apple employee, C#/Objective C/Swift
If you never want anyone to understand your script, Perl
If you hate programming and just want your website to work, PHP
If you hate programming and just want to analyse your data, R
If you want to be a wizard, Lisp

>>58702572
mfw no hdl

>>58702345
i thought i was your main dude :(

No Clojurists in here?

>>58700859
For the past 5 years i was learning c++.
Of course i "learned" other stuff too because i had too, but cpp was my goto.
First job i got was about flex and AS3, second about asp.net but i kept learning and using cpp in my free time.
2 years after uni i got hired as embedded/cpp dev and i can work with what i like.

Tl;dr;
If you program for money you cant stuck to one fucking technology, but never leave what pumps you endorphines.

>>58701669
all your problems can be solved by not multiplying 5 with potato

>>58700859
HolyC

>>58703359
>cpp was my goto
But you shouldn't use these

none because by the time you are actually decent it's gonna be something else

especially if you're interested in web development

>>58700869
Useless pic with a ton of irrelevant crap and full of unsubstantiated schmopinions.

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>tfw learned PHP
>lots of jobs but they're basically all wordpress-tier shit
>fuck all career prospects

I should have learned something useful like Python or C#

Just end my fucking life

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>>58700859
>know 3 of these (counting HTML + CSS + JS as one) already
>still unemployed
S-should I Kms?

Any Kotlin lovers in here?

>wouldnt mind doing java programming more but its tied to awful slow as fuck build systems
So am I now a Pajeet# missile?

>>58704024
I mean, it's pretty clear it's only used for websites. No scientist has ever used php to calculate some science shit. Didn't you realize your were taking the path to becoming a brainless code zombie?

>>58704024
If you're not using laravel in current year you deserve all the cancer.

>>58700859
Definitely JavaScript, you can do everything in it: Web development, app development, desktop applications. The new language features are fantastic. The only thing it lacks are strong types and code navigation/completion assistance on the level of Java/C#, but it will never have those...

Java is still going very strong: It has a fantastic ecosystem of perfect libraries and with project Valhalla (Java 10) it will be rejuvenated by decades. If you just want a job and don't dislike Java, learn Java.

C# is a nice language, we'll see how popular .net core will be. I don't believe it has a chance though, Java is too established anywhere .net would be. There is no reason for prefering C# over Java unless you really prefer programming in C#. Since Java got lambdas and streams, C#'s biggest advantage disappeared.

> Don't single out new ones like Rust and Go.
Rust is irrelevant outside of a few hipster bubbles.
Go is irrelevant outside of a few SF hightech hipster bubbles. Although it was created in 2007 they insisted on repeating the same old mistakes countless other languages made.

>>58704095
> wouldnt mind doing java programming more but its tied to awful slow as fuck build systems
If you work out of a modern IDE you don't have to fully compile anything. Full maven builds for non trivial applications do take forever though.
If you use Spring, Spring Boot got spring-boot-devtools with fast, automatic restarts on code changes.

If you want instant hot code swapping you can get JRebel, with "instant" as in "zero seconds".

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haha wow

>>58700869
This image is fucking stupid. The flow chart is shit and the opinions on these languages is mostly just memes.

>>58700859
In Sydney there seems to be quite a few new job postings looking for Ruby on rails devs.

>>58700859
C++ in general, java for android dev, html+css+js for web dev.

>>58700869
1. ancient
2. made by a python fanboy
3. wrong

>>58704634
Web development isn't true programming.

>>58702556
It's great as a first language but NEVER use Visual Studio as a beginner. It takes away so much work that you'll be helpless without it later on.

>>58704809
>that you'll be helpless without it later on
I learned VB6 as a first language.
Now I like C.
Am I helpless?

>>58700869
>Python and Java everywhere
Ummh, no sweetie.

>>58700938
Because some people don't know they can enable debug collections in gcc which check for out of bounds vector accesses and other nice things.

>>58700869
reading as well as creating this picture was a waste of time

>>58701581
> What are you smoking
Not an actual response. Because you know that the google team maintains the V8 engine and directly controls node.js compilation speed. So of course they use it for their web services. Also it's the second fastest server side programming language for web servers. So of course they use it.

>Java
> Compiled

Java is one of the slowest piece of shit languages ever invented. It compiles down to Java Byte code and then is run through an interpreter on hour machine.

> Ruby and Pythong have C compilers hur dur

Yea but they are maintained by hipsters that don't understand anything about compilation performance.
Node's compiler is built through V8 engine, a project that is actively maintained and improved by a team at google. A team that has been improving code performance constantly.

>>58704656
I agree and disagree. Some web development is just in general not true programming. (Word press bullshit sites)

But when you get to applications like Gmail, Google.com, Netflix and other high demand services you find that the problems get significantly more complex and require a great deal of thought behind them.

TDLR; Web development is half and half "true programming"

Might learn JS just to spite /g/. It'll go nicely with my knowledge of Python for web applications.

>>58700859
Python

why is there no good JavaScript course on iTunes U?

I smell witchcraft

>>58701487
The only notable thing about javascript is that most programmers (including you) are literal code monkeys that didn't even spend five minutes researching asnychronous IO so the only way they would ever get in contact with it is using a platform like NodeJS that doesn't have blocking IO and instead forces them to use asyncrhonous IO. Then they start thinking that javascript is significantly faster than whatever they used previously even though the problem was their own incompetence.

>>58705919
Javascript is a very in demand skill simply for the fact that you can't make a good website without javascript. Every website ever needs javascript to run properly.

The server side language for websites can change between python, c#, ruby, Java or Go. But the front end code always needs to use Javascript, CSS and Html.

I've worked a few jobs where the people working in web development don't know javascript that well and they never last long or make products the clients are happy with.

One piece of advice. Don't just learn JQuery. If you only learn JQuery you will cripple your self very very hard.
It's a nice tool to use some times but if that's all you learn you will never get good at Javascript.

>>58705863
> Java is slow
Uhm
It's slower than C and C++, yeah. It's faster than any other high-level language out there.

>>58705968
I have been writing synchronous code in python and C# for years. Try harder scrub.

>>58705956
> programming courses
> ITunes

- JavaScript
- Python
- Ruby
- Perl
- Go
- C
- C++

Avoid Java and .net although C# is alright. LISP is amazing but didn't make the list and I don't know enough about Rust to recommend it.

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>>58703762
cleanest way to break from nested loops

>>58707966
call/cc

>>58707757
java programmers are still widely needed. It's cobol 2.0. There's so much pajeet soft written in java it will be around for another 30 years at least.

>>58702572
My fucking sides.

>>58704242
>Go is irrelevant outside of a few SF hightech hipster bubbles. Although it was created in 2007 they insisted on repeating the same old mistakes countless other languages made.
Go was created by old school engineers who made C and worked on Plan 9. Sometimes they make decisions conservatively but that's just because they know exactly what they're doing. Give it time and it will mature to be the one language to rule them all. Even proper support for generics (don't see why you need this but everyone wants it) will be here soon enough.

By contrast, Rust was thrown together in a few weeks by people with zero experience who had no understanding of the C++ features they were copying, so they ended up randomly changing things until people got impatient and then slapped a 1.0 on it and called it stable. They haven't actually stopped changing random parts of the language. The only difference is, they've stopped announcing them, so the handful of people trying to use it are surprised when their code breaks.

Go is a stable language with a real plan for long term support for its users on a timescale of decades. Rust is a hobbyist's experiment inflated by politics and undeserving hype, a fad that will be totally forgotten in a month when the next equally uninspired hip new thing rolls around.

>>58702572
it is a good description

>>58700859
The more I read about it and the more I try it I'm leaning towards clojure.

>>58700869
this is fucking terrible.

Learn LOLCODE.
Its an esoteric language perfect for the average autistic /g/tard.

Just look at this beautiful code:

HAI 1.2
I HAS A n
GIMMEH n
n IS NOW A NUMBR
IM IN YR LOOP UPPIN YR i TIL BOTH SAEM i AN n
    VISIBLE SUM OF i AN 1
IM OUTTA YR LOOP
KTHXBYE

Absolutely magnificent.

Ada
C
Fortran
Verilog

Fite me.

>>58708649
It's /b/code.

>>58708649
>not based Befunge

>>58705863
>Java is one of the slowest piece of shit languages ever invented.
we're not in 1997 anymore you moron

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>>58705863
>compiles down to Java Byte code and then is run through an interpreter on hour machine.

>still thinks JVM is the bad thing about Java
>2017+10-12+2

>>58708759
its /your/code, you should be using it.
Its a general purpose, multi-paradigm, OO with functional aspects and is blazing fast.
Essential a mid-tier language.

javascript is pretty nice.

it has all the decent features to make it a useful replacement for most other scripting languages.

its also the only scripting language for the web so, it's pretty much universal.

>>58708057
i still chose to avoid it

>>58700859
>HTML5
>CSS3
>JS J
one of these things is not like the others

>>58700869
Your pic is garbage.

It gives average salary per language, but no indication of job availability.

>>58700859
You have to take the Coq.

Didn't want to create a new thread.

What addon libraries should I use for C++ to make general tasks much easier(eg. file handling, string handling, etc)?

>>58709234
Make your own library like everybody else you cunt.

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>>58700869
End your life ASAP

>>58700859
Forth.

>>58703688
HolyC is best C.

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>>58700865
Can't wait for aircraft manufacturers to ditch stupid languages like Ada in favor of JavaScript. Every pilot should know all about the latest framework for manipulating the cockpit's css.

>>58700938
>Now why is Rust the best to learn?
Because it's 2017 and everyone should recognize that there are several hundred different genders.

>>58701266
Physicist ?

>>58702572
What about FORTRAN!

>>58709290
If I wanted to reinvent the wheel I'd be using C you fucking retard

>>58701993
There's more to programming than gluing together random bits of code you're not capable of understanding.

>>58710295
But C has multiple mature libraries for such task like tbox, glib, qlibc, apr already you dump cunt.

>>58704024
why not just learn a new language

>>58700859
Once you know C and Java, the rest are pretty much the same.

HTML, JS and CSS are abominations which are in dire need of replacement but yes essential for a job if you don't know C or Java.

C#, it's a Microsoft thing. Avoid companies who only do Microsoft.

>>58700912

For getting an entry-level job.

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>>58700869
Who here C++ wizard master race?

>>58709097
In a free market, high salary equals a demand higher than availability.

>>58700859
I did the usual NEET to Wagecuck transformation with HTML/CSS then PHP/JS. Currently working in Angular and not enjoying my life very much. Could be worse though, I hated PHP with every fiber of my being.

Why aren't there any HTML/CSS/JS based operating systems yet?

>>58700859
If you want to have enough interesting( and not to fall asleep behind the books) and had a good working prospects, then definitely your choice should fall on Haskell. Moderately friendly language for a beginner. Knowing Haskell at times easier to learn several other programming languages. Very versatile and popular. Popularity among employers due to the fact that in Haskell you can write almost everything, so you don't have to learn a new language because of the irrelevance of a particular language in a particular area. Haskell is a very fast language( inferior to C and C++, but unlike them is safe, perhaps even the safest). Haskell - the language of the future, as it, unlike many other popular languages, has the advantage of the parallel and multithreaded programming( consider that the more cores a computer has, the better Haskell than with other languages) and as you know in the future the gap between Haskell and other JAPANESE will only increase. Anyway, not to teach Haskell in 2017 to be down

>>58712892
>Haskell - the language of the future
t. my CS professor 10 years ago

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>>58712862
>mfw ionic/atom/electron are chromium based
>mfw chrome os

emojicode

Trumpscript

why is java a bad language?

>>58714492
It's not. Every language has strengths and weaknesses when developing something. Ideally just use what's best for the job. For general programming, use the language you like best.

>>58714767
Holy shit, where am I? A sensible answer? How the fuck is this possible on /g/?

>>58700859
Definitely Nim.

>>58712920
CS academics ALWAYS guess the language of the future wrong, and funnily enough their guesses are always functional and the language of the future is always OOP. It's hilarious watching functiocucks get rectally shattered repeatedly, over and over again, forever.

>>58710237
No, autist.

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>>58700895
C should not be used outside of kernelspace or embedded applications. Vast majority of security issues today are caused by errors in C memory management. We can't avoid humans, but we can avoid C. I'm totally OK with C in those two circumstances though.

>>58715329
You forgot libraries. If you ever make a library that needs to be used from different languages, it has to be written in C.

>>58701487
Google has written and maintains huge amounts of C++ and Java code. V8 has a JIT compiler, not Node. The language the compiler is written in has literally no bearing on its performance. In fact, writing the Javascript compiler in Javascript means performance improvements in the language will also improve its own compilation. History has shown us many examples of JIT compilers outperforming the likes of GCC at times. Asynchronous I/O helps with scalability but remember that Node's event thread is single threaded and there are no worker threads. You're basically fucked if you have any CPU bound computation implemented in server-side javascript (browsers have web workers). You'll either bottleneck the event loop or be forced to butcher up your function and schedule bits and pieces in a timer like an OS kernel.

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>>58700859
I have a question for /g/

I started with basic C to learn syntax then took a JS course. Now learning Lua because I can use it for stuff. Already made and released a game mod with 80 downloads in the past 2 days.

Is starting with Lua a good or bad idea? Ideally I want to learn Lua then C and/or Java.

ty

>>58715394
Lua has a couple places where it does things differently from 99% of other languages. Like if you have a list of items, it'll count them starting at 1 instead of 0. (There have been arguments about this for the entire history of computers.)

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>>58705863
>Java is one of the slowest piece of shit languages ever invented

The JVM is one of the finest implementations ever developed for any programming language. Java itself is mostly irrelevant; the JVM is the real star and any language that targets it is automatically relevant.

The above also applies to the CLR.

>>58715405
Yeah, I noticed that when I jumped from JS but it doesn't bother me much. I like the tables too.

>>58701474
Exactly this. There are too many fundamentally bad design decisions they've made that Go is basically ruined.

For concurrent back end, Nodejs is still king, far easier to write, and if you want high performance concurrency then there are many great C++ libraries like OpenMP and Cilk.

Also how can they sell themselves as a systems programming language when they're slower than or same as Java and not even close to C/C++ performance.

>>58707966
https://linuxlock.blogspot.com/2008/12/linux-stop-holding-our-kids-back.html

>>58701487
Most of Google's back end is written in C++ and Java, you know, like a sensible company would. So is Facebook's and Microsoft's and Amazon's and pretty much any decent company that isn't run by SJW hipsters or poo-in-loos. Google is adopting Go but very incrementally.

>>58715422
All right. Learning Lua won't hurt you. Just remember, the important thing isn't knowing a bunch of languages. It's being able to get things done with them. It sounds like you're already doing that so that's a very good start.

Also remember that there are weird dark secrets in every language, some more than others. C is a major offender here, because it's supposed to be simple. C++ is so over the top that it could take you 20 years to learn it well.

>>58710343
>There's more to programming than gluing together random bits of code you're not capable of understanding.

There's more to programming then using an obscure meme language to write shitty code nobody will ever use.

>>58710019
i said web, desktop & mobile apps you fucking aspie

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>>58715446
ty anon

I want to learn Java to make android apps and increase my employment potential (don't want to do construction forever) and C just so I can be better at game modding/developing. Luckily I like doing this so practicing isn't a chore yet.

>>58701499
>The people that made C made Go.

That's somehow supposed to be a good thing? The "C people" who made Go hated C enough to make a new language yet you think they'll get it right this time?

>>58715450

yea but if you dont understand how a language actually works, you're still a meme programmer

>but muh agile
>muh JBGE

fuck off faggot, certs mean dick all and you're still a shit eater. Just because you can slap together fart apps for an iphone, doesn't make you a programmer. Go read the k&r bible pajeet.

>>58715541
C was exceptionally good for its time.

>>58715592
A time with 3 billion hardware architectures with every special snowflake company providing its own crappy compilers? Yeah. C as a language is ill-defined enough that compilers can just do a mostly crappy job and call themselves a conforming implementation, leaving you to fill in the holes.

Working with C code is like dealing with a spoiled child that thinks it owns the entire world. Integrating software is such a huge pain in the ass it's almost impossible. No wonder gofags advocate rewriting as much C code as possible in Go. Because that will totally happen lol. Go is quite simply behind the times, only barely competing with the likes of Python.

>>58715655
The argument you posted in >>58715541 is defeated and your new post is just senseless ramblings.

>>58703762
I actually never did in my life. No needed to not because im against them.

>>58708726
Add lisp and I like you

Currently, I know Java, Python, JavaScript, Objective-C, and a bit of C++.

I'm learning C now, and then I'll probably move on to C++, to learn it better.

I'm also looking into learning Erlang/Elixir for web stuff, or Ruby along with Rails.

What should I learn in terms of databases? Mainly for the web, but also just in general.

Ruby, a language primarily designed for programmer happiness.

>>58717220
MySQL and PostgreSQL

Rust, Go, Swift, and JavaScript

>>58717220
MySQL/MariaDB
PostgreSQL is less popular, but still quite prevalent
MongoDB is currently the hype for building new web-apps (especially with node)

I'd also recomment sqlite. It's small enough that grasping all of it shouldn't take more than 2 evenings, and it's quite frequently used by programs as some kind of local storage (instead of inventing their own file format, people just store data in a sqlite DB - Firecucks does this, for example).

>>58700859
C++, Python and one of C# Java or Obj-C which you can work on the side with an app or a larger project. Of course along the way you should be able to code in C, Javascript and a bunch of other languages. That pretty much goes without saying and it's not really an issue once you are at a certain level.

Most companies offer interviews in C++ or Python (take Python it's so much easier to write on the white board). When you have time you should learn SQL, hadoop etc instead of trying to be an expert on an obscure language nobody cares about.