>15 seconds to compile a hello world application >10 seconds

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>>58684274
Quick reminder that Visual studio is a botnet

>>58684290
The school I attend forces me to use visual studio or else I end up (insert meme where arch fag cant pass university because his shit keeps breaking) since the project templates are tied to the IDE

Because it's a real enterprise level application. It's not a knock off made for kids run on linux. That high level of excellence needs a powerful program.

>>58684342
Does microshaft have a buzzword 101 course ready for you winshills?

is there any alternative to VS 2015 if I still want to code in C#?

>>58684342
I'm amazed at your enunciation with that gigantic cock stuffed down your throat

>>58684342
>Enterprise costs $5,999
>Its a slow POS

Well to me its a lot of money but for Mr. Pajeet the Master of Business Administration its a good investment to ensure that the corporation has a feature rich tool set that values diversity.


Who else thinks that Microsoft could start charging 50k per install of their Visual Studio and the business drones would continue buying it?

>>58684429
C# is trash, start being a real programmer and get into C++ and write real world applications

Everything important in this world is either written in C or C++

>>58684429
SharpDevelop.
It's not that bad either.

>>58684274

can I add a bitcoin miner in compiled code?

>>58684274
Just compiled the cpp project I'm working on not that big but not tiny either took 5 seconds to compile on an FX 6300

>>58684342
Holy shit, NICE sells pitch, micros**t shill

>>58684274
because it's not for writing hello world applications.

>>58684462
I'm a C/C++ programmer, but your opinion is trash if you're not writing anything portable, blazing fast or lower level why not use C#/.NET?

>>58684492
Creating a hello world project takes 5 seconds

>>58684492
a hello world doesn't take 15 secs to compile though + compare optimizations of VS with GCC/Clang

>>58684500
why is that a problem if you are creating a project is normally to program 5 secs is nothing less time then using a Makefile...

>>58684274
PC specs? None of this applies to my incredibly average laptop. And definitely not my desktop.

Or you know, you're just memeing and none of those things actually happened.

>>58684498
so do you use VS2015 or some other IDE? Cause I like VS but it's just too slow on my laptop.

>>58684498
Because C# is slow and garbage.
If I am going to write boilerplate codes I will use C++.

If I am doing rapid prototyping of some modules, I will use meme languages like python.

There is NO reason for C***arp to exist.

>>58684515
it's normally*

>>58684519
I have compiled on a Pentium 3 he is baiting

>>58684520
I use 2012 and 2008, if you want something fast use 2008 but the compiler is missing some modern features of C++ and some not so modern features of C

>>58684519

Try compiling the ASP.NET hello world

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>>58684498
>your opinion is trash if you don't want good performance and better documentation and good libraries used in industries
gg

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>VS toddlers in /g/
So what good tech sites remain?

>>58684521
>When a retard believes the /g/ memes.

>>58684521
why not it's a nice C style syntax language, you must be one of those guys who started programming in C/C++ and are like fuck Java fuck C# you are only a real man if you program in C/C++.... I write 95% of my code in C/C++ doing lower level WinApi stuff but I like writing helper applications in C# even if I am not proficient with this language I find that I can write much faster. Though I wouldn't write in C# for production code but only because I'm a bad C# programmer.

>>58684580
>No argument left
I'm going to let you go this time hahaha

Comeback with an example of real world application written in c crap instead of C++.

Start with autodesk maya or blender or photoshop etc

>he fell for the botnet meme

kek kucked again

>>58684555
you don't need performance all the time, and C# is well documented and has a shit ton of libraries you can use + you can easily use any C/C++ (native) library...

>>58684595
>I want to write faster than C
You can write python faster C#

>I am not writing low level
lol python is not for low level programming

>I don't want good performance
python

Python is for you :^)

VS isn't really for hobbiests, it's enterprise support for enterprise developments on enterprise machines.

I'm a dev for a fintech company and use C#, java and node for micro services. Some autists will gag at that, but in the real world you use the best tools for the job.

VS out the box is okayish. With resharper it takes it to a new level. Compile times are fine, to run 13 services in topshelf you're talking about 10 seconds to compile on a dell xps 15.

I've been trying the jetbrains rider RC, it's all of resharper inside of intellij basically.

>>58684551
I agree with you on this. But no other builds take as long as the first one or when you clean + rebuild. Plus if you're not changing your views, setting <mvcbuildviews> (I think) to false reduces it even more. Otherwise it builds them unnecessarily each time.

In large ASP.NET projects with a lot of views, compiling them every time obviously takes a while.

>>58684599
> this fucker must be wrong
> obviously some really good applications must be written in C Sharp.
> what a fucking retard faggot
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_C_Sharp_software

noleglefttostandon.xml

>>58684630
More buzzwords

>>58684646
> what are industry words?

>>58684630
>I've been trying the jetbrains rider

How does Rider compare to VS in terms of speed/performance?

>>58684642
>>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_C_Sharp_software
L O L
AHAHAHAHAHAHA

https://jabroo.blogspot.com.au/2012/08/c-plus-plus-applications-list.html

>even botnetstudio is not written in C crap

>>58684646
What in there can you consider a buzzword?
> fintech
financial tech
> micro services
all decent services need scaling

>>58684678
he's just either a kid or hasn't had a job before. ignore either way.

Give up, microcucks

C++ smashes the fuck out of C#
Anyday
Anytime

>>58684671
It boots a lot faster, VS with resharper takes a lot longer than stock or codemaid.
I haven't notice anything being slower, however I imagine compiling might be. File indexing and updating nougat packages are a lot faster.
My only gripe with it is that I've become dependant on VS team tools and intellij uses more classical layout for VCS, though the diff is a lot better.

>>58684623
well I can think of a million reasons why I would chose c# over python:
- no forced indentation
- faster
- syntax is not cancer and is familiar to people who know and C style language
- easy to do windows stuff with it
- pointers with unsafe code

but my point is python can be a good tool too all I'm saying is I rather program in C/C++, but who am I to judge a guy because he uses another language, this is where the neckbeards who write with some console editor and debug with printf writing little 100 line C programs which makes them feel all special inside as they can then complain about people using "peasant" languages.

Anyways I can guarantee you your C code is probably slower then a lot of what you would write in C#. C needs skill to be used correctly and productively when you are writing proper software and not toys, why not make your life easier if you don't need speed, lower level.. and use another language?

Several tools can do the same job.

Still most C#/Java programmers are niggers.

>>58684705
Cool, I'll give it a go.

Does anybody know if I can get the jetbrains goodies for free with my .edu email account, even if I've left college a while ago?

>>58684639
>ASP.NET
here is your problem

>>58684740
If it's still active yes.
Rider is also publicly free while in RC

>>58684599
I like how you have such an attitude despite more than likely still being in university with zero real world experience. I realise it's /g/ but it never gets old. I like C++, I've used it a lot. But a sure sign of a shitty programmer (unless you're Linus) is sticking to a single language as if it's the be all end all.

If your definition of a good language is one that's popular for making desktop applications (probably 10% of the market), then there's not much I can do for you.

Dude photoshop lmao

Good luck finishing your first year of CS though mate

>>58684685
But I write windows applications in C++ every day :)
The winapi is not dead yet niggers.

C# is supposed to compete with Java not C++...

>>58684761
>If your definition of a good language is one that's popular for making desktop applications (probably 10% of the market), then there's not much I can do for you.
Isn't that why you use windows?
>Muh market share

>>58684761
Use whatever language to get the job done.
C/C++ is still the best language out there to do real work and I'm the guy defending C#. It doesn't try to rape you by forcing you how to program the standard libraries aren't fucking huge messes well the stl is getting there... but still, it's the way to go still I hate elitists

>>58684672
>even botnetstudio is not written in C crap
It is though. 90% of it is WPF.

>>58684761
>Anyone who doesn't use my shitty java ripoff language is a first year uni student
Goes a lot about saying inept C# pajeets

>>58684804
niggers think the compiler and the ide is the same thing they don't understand the ide is written in managed code lmao.

>>58684821
XDD

>>58684807
Can you think of a post without using a meme? Try really hard.

I know you're on 4chan all day and have the attention span of a sub 80 IQ nigger, but give it a shot.

>>58684807
better have a pajeet writing in C#. then some neck beard producing slower code which has memory leaks, buffer overflows...

>>58684826
xDaidaida

So the cocksucker piece of shit finally shows himself.

When the pro Microsoft, LLVM or Intel users try to defend themselves, you come back with "its a trash language"

You want to talk about trash? Lets talk trash. You have a 25+ year old compiler, GCC. You want to make source level optimizations? Go fuck yourself.
You want to have a decent back end compiler. Fuck off.

The trifecta of compilers run fucking circles around that garbage heap. And when Im in charge of the compiler development team at Intel, I will continue to shit down the throats of all GCC users.

>>58684836
>pajeet code
>free of memory leaks and buffer overflows
sanjay my son

>>58684462
Have you even used the language? C# has a fuckton of tools so that mediocre programmers can write good code and ASP. NET MVC is a solid alternative to Web design when you don't hate yourself enough to use php.

You can't compare C/C++ to the likes of C#/Java because the 2 sets of languages are built totally different for totally different jobs.
C# allows for safer and easier to maintain programs that require less experience to use. It removes manual memory management, switches pointer arithmetic for IEnumerables and removes complex and brittle inheritance trees.

Don't get me wrong, I love C. I use it in my free time but there are too many idiots out there that I wouldn't let near the language. Idiots who can't remember to tie their shoes, let alone remember to check for memory leaks.

I've used C# for about 3 months at our Web development firm and the frameworks in place from Microsoft means you can slap the keyboard with your face and have a stable end product.

The problem with trolls like you is that people actually believe the narrow minded crap you spew, saying x language is pointless because of "muh speed" and it makes me sad for the future of programmers in general.

>>58684821
Pretty much

>>58684274
>>5 seconds to add a new class
that's to stop you from making stupid bullshit classes for things that should be functions

>>58684848
>Web((dev))
please

>>58684842
You're a good man anon

>>58684842
>And when Im in charge of the compiler development team at Intel,
Add me in your SIMS, anon

>>58684847
writing in a "safe" language... nigger
most of you write tiny toys in C you don't know how to write software that's why your opinions are irrelevant.

>>58684848
what I have been saying in broken english though.

C# is good enough for most things not everyone can program in C/C++ people who say otherwise are shit programmers.

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>>58684893
>""""safe"""" language

>>58684906
nice meme

are you saying it's as easy in C#/Java to fuck up as in C?

>>58684918
Yes, and this is why no one writes memory critical applications in C#

>>58684929
right...
Can anybody explain this guy my english sucks.
I'm going to use malloc and free all the time in C# right... and manipulate memory directly...

If you mean memory critical applications as in using little memory yes C/C++ is the way to go doesn't mean that it's safer...

>>58684342
>Kids
>Linux
You're talking about enterprise level software. Do you happen to know which OS does your favorite company, Microsoft, run on their servers? Let me help you out:
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/10/20/microsoft_cloud_event/

>>58684952
If your team properly writes the C/C++ code with proper practice the end product will always be superior to the C# counterpart.

Using free all the time is not memory safety is all about. It requires more than that.
https://www.securecoding.cert.org/confluence/display/c/SEI+CERT+C+Coding+Standard

>>58684985
of course the point is for the average programmer today who is shit writing in C is not an option.
And I know calling free all the time is not all that you need...

>>58684976
It's just a mone for hire codemonkey, don't take him seriously.

K&R used ed to create UNIX, Wozniak uses a fork of vi last time I checked and Linus uses some distro of emacs. You understand the difference, right?

>>58685021
money*

>>58684985
Not that guy and I'm not reading the thread, but most programs do not need to use a low level language like that. You just let c# handle it and take care of memory management and more often than not it works just fine.

It is much easier to write something in that language then to take the care to correctly do it in a lower level one. And using the pajeet response is not an argument

>>58684274
Get an ssd

>>58684290
Quick reminder you have no life.

>>58684685
Funny, C++ and C# actually can work together under .Net.

>>58685063
You trade with severely slow performance
C++ compiles into native code, so it’s usually the baseline for performance comparisons between.
Also
>low level access
This is somewhat related to performance, but it could be also about accessing other hardware features like special input controllers in a Playstation 4. Console makers provide APIs for their hardware usually only in C++. Apple had Objective-C, but fortunately now they also have their whole API accessible through Swift.

>>58685112
between languages*

>hurr durr I only code my FizzBuzz in the finest of text editors

>why do I need an IDE to code my hello world app? That's for babies

LOL

>>58685112
Most people aren't looking for frame rate benchmarks and shit, performance is good enough that it makes more sense to get something that works then to spend the time and resources to optimize to hell and back.

Not everything is meant for embedded devices and games.

You forgot the 5 hours to install it.

Because it uses a framework, and it would also be 15 seconds to compile a CRM, web app, or mvc app. But you wouldn't know that if you were only using it to make hello worlds.

There's a shitload of dropout langs out there that claim to have better "raw" performance and I'm sure they're right when they have no framework and it takes a month to make an app because you're re-making everything. That is what "raw" is, fancy talk for "dropout lang". Just because the number of IO reads/writes per second is higher, doesn't mean it's better when you are missing a framework and can't do shit without reinventing 10 wheels.

Hosting on enterprise server is $5 a month now so you won't notice a 3ms difference, instead you WILL notice a 10 hour difference when someone asks you to make a massive change and because you have a framework it's a 5 minute job now.

>>58685699
>"raw"
this is "raw" damage control

>>58684685
Can't argue with that.

C/C++ are THE language.

>>58684274
If you're compiling hello world stick to notepad and gcc. VS is for larger and more complicated projects.

>>58684630
this.
all this enterprise whit works when you can throw hardware and man hours at it.

/g/ can't think beyond asking why you need malloc in c and posting desktops with anime backgrounds.

although the whole pajeet thing is true for these high level tools. They just want the money and the ability to half truth their resume for the next contract.

I'm about to go find a lightweight C tool chain on windows for my home setup, but on my work laptop, i install the 20 gb community addition that reports all stupid msdn surfing to their servers. oooh, so scary.

>>58684322
Your sentence structure is why you're stupid

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>>58684462
Found the idiot gaymur who has never written a line of code in his life

>>58684429
Visual Studio Code or MonoDevelop

>>58686819
>t. code artisan

>>58684274
>having to install over 10GiB of bloat in order to compile C++ code
>it doesn't even have full C++11 support yet
Well done, Microsoft.

>need windows to run it

Already dropped

I've actually turned down job offers and head hunters because the job requires the use of microshit bloatware and shitty IDE's to develop apps that could easily be created in C++ in a text editor.

Autistic, I know, but I can afford to be picky when I have valuable skills. And I don't like companies that needlessly complicate something because management is technologically illiterate and thinks just throwing money at it is the best option.

K.I.S.S. = keep it simple, stupid. Work smarter, not harder.

Developing on Windows is anything but that.

>>58686430
Aboriginals have perfect direction because they only have words for cardinal directions, OP gets retardation because he only knows how to speak retard.

>>58684457
runs fine on my workstation laptop

>>58684322
shit school

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>>58684521
>C# is slow

t. micronigger

>>58684274


why do people always complain that eclipse is slow when Visual Studio is glacial and Text editors like atom with a bare minimum of extensions for development are even slower?

>>58684274
>what is wirth's law
microsoft is piling layers of interpreted languages on another, it is bound to become slower and slower.

also they replace their pajeets on a daily basis. instead of rewriting code, which would take time and effort, pajeet will write a wrapper and make the code even more inefficient.

we are in a time where companies don't care about execution time and only worry about project time

>>58688771
>/v/tard thinks he's people
gtfo

>>58688771
>C#
>Faster than C/C++

>>58688899
>>58688928
It's usually not faster than C++, except in special circumstances where JIT + GC are able to make better decisions than C++ compiler.

That doesn't mean it's not fast enough for 98 % of applications.

>>58684274
>15 seconds to compile a hello world application
that's just not true, the 10k program i'm working on right now doesn't even take 15 seconds to compile.

This thread is a nice breath of fresh air from the constant microsoft shill shit that goes down on this board.

>HEY GUIZE CHECK OUT MY SWEET BUILD. I INCLUDED THE PRICE FOR WINDOWS 10

>SPECCY THREAD. INCOMING WIN 10 v 7 SLAPMATCH

>LUL LINUX IS FOR KIDS/AUTISTS/NERDS AMIRITE

>MACFAGS BTFO UNIX IS GAY AF AND FREE UNIX IS ALSO GAY AF

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Wow, good thing I did all that ketamine and totally forgot the 90s and the 2000s. Microsoft is edgy now, rite?

>ms can suck my diiiiiiiiiiiiiiiick

>>58687539
t. unemployed

>>58689144
If by fresh air you mean shitting on one of the only fine product Microsoft has put out.

Seems counter-productive.

>>58689144
This

I just tested and I got:

Create new project: 3 seconds
Compile hello world: 1 second
Add new class: Pretty much instant

>>58689188
nice b8 m8 && fuck off brainlet

>>58684578
>/g/ being a good tech site ever
You are one dense motherfucker.

>>58684274
it's a big ide

>>58684599
>hahaha

>>58684274
>15 seconds to compile Hello World
>15 seconds to compile a big project
Where's the problem? VS pre-optimization pays more as the project gets bigger, try writing something more complex than fizzbuzz and you'll see.

>>58684429
Jetbrains are developing an IntelliJ platform IDE for c# called Ryder which is pretty good. Not released yet but in tech preview

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Visual Studio is supposed to be used for enterprise grade projects, not you fucking morons learning how to compile a fucking print statement LMAO

>>58684462
you sound like a complete degenerate

>>58690399
True

>complaining about what others use

I don't know, but instead of losing your precious time about bullshit, why don't you use it for your projects with your beloved ide?

>>58684274
>Microsoft

>>58690399
You mean it gets faster as the project gets bigger?
Now that's some wizardry

>>58691345
You don't browse /g/ often these days do you? It's full of those kind of threads now.

>>58688765
it's not just his school.
Micro$oft is pushing it's shit everywhere, including expensive/high level schools.
>there are people who learn APT in the final class that mentions linux.
and no, not GNU/Linux, LINUX.(read: ubunut)

>>58691867
did u compile it in debug mode or release?

>>58690399
/thread

C++ is dying.

>>58689175
openbsd dropped the spaghetti.

>>58694289
>This is what a C# code artisan nu male think these days

>>58684871
Dev implies production and development of technologies.
With the spaghetti I've not only had to write but had to fix, I'd rather start calling the people I've worked with (and myself by extension) Web degenerates.

There's a reason I'm quitting and going back to get a degree in engineering.

And still it's far better than any of the alternatives.

>>58692551
Why the fuck would you "learn apt" in school to begin with?

Maybe if you weren't using a P4, OP.

>>58684728
every one of those reasons is crap

>>58684761
>But a sure sign of a shitty programmer (unless you're Linus) is sticking to a single language as if it's the be all end all.
Chuck Moore would like to disagree.

>>58685021
>It's just a mone for hire codemonkey

I'm a Civil Engineer in Europe.

God linuxcucks are paranoid.

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Unfortunately lots of jobs require experience with this shit

>>58684274
also requires you to login with your microcuck account after month of usage

>>58684728

I agree with >>58697425 and I like C# over Python. You know crap about C# or Python if this is your comparison.

employed and experienced professionals vs anime fapping neets: the thread

>>58697663
>>58684578

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>>58684342
Hello Pajeet

>>58684274
>15 seconds to compile a hello world application
t. NEET poorfag