BSD And Other Things

>>58566757
First for GNU/Linux

Fuck BSD

>>58566757
>>ARCH FOR LIFE
.... But BSD is cool

>>58566757
Just one question: why should anyone switch to BSD?

GNU/Linux is already a good Unix-like. In fact, the only criticism that is constantly thrown around is lack of software/support, because it's not a popular operating system. So why should I switch to BSD? Even if it's better than Linux (and if it is, how so?), wouldn't any possible improvement be shaded by the fact that BSD is even more obscure than Linux and is famous for lacking not only software (like Linux) but also even more, such as driver support?

I'm not bashing BSD or shilling for Linux, so long as both are free they're good in my book, but I'm genuinely curious as to why anyone would use BSD as a desktop OS.

>>58566994
with bsd, it can be quite easy to change mac os software to run on bsd, based on its relation, not all software, but some of it for sure. also it is quite a bit more secure than some distros of linux **cough*ubuntu*cough**. also everything is not going to break after each update

>>58566994
freebsd can do this
https://youtu.be/qlCmvFFJ5cg

>>58566994
I find the system to generally be more integrated than most GNU/Linux distributions. Things in the ports tree have to play nice with each other, so almost everything works directly out of the box. I also prefer most BSD utilities over their GNU counterparts, but that's personal preference. ZFS is pretty nice as well.

As a side effect of integration, there isn't as much software. I guess this isn't as much of a problem if you enable the Linux compatibility layer.

I haven't had any issues with drivers, but I'm using fairly standard hardware.

I wouldn't use it as a Desktop OS, but I think it's wonderful for servers.

>>58566994
>i-i don't come here to shill linux but it's better than BSD
just fucking kill yourself

Anyone use csh? I mostly use ksh but I want to expand my knowledge. Already read the manpage, but I wonder if anyone knows neat things it can do.

>>58566994
GNU is barely Unix-like. Stallman has convinced so many people to add Lisp OS features to GNU software. A real clusterfuck. GNU is consistently different both from Unix and UNIX/SUS/POSIX

>>58566757
If you are going to use BSD, use OpenBSD.

The rest are cancer.
And especially fuck TrueOS.
Yall niggers need to fucking die.

>>58566994
These threads are half shills from big companies who profit because they can steal BSD and half hipsters and contrarians who don't even use BSD but just pretend to. Nobody can actually "switch" to BSD because it's an unusable piece of shit with no drivers and software.

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>>58567968
Nice bait, m8.

>>58568012
>replying

>>58567455
Don' give people expectations. The only reason your system doesn't break is becuase you use only the hardware recommended for BSD.

>>58568483
you mean he looked up supported hardware to make sure it worked? wow! what a shock!

>>58568012
How do you put up with lumina? It's absolute shit when xfce works far better, and has more capability/costomizability

>>58566757
What's the difference between free/open/net/etc, and which should I choose, based on what requirements?

>>58567312
So can linux, or windows via cygwin.

>>58568824
>costomizability
How many times a day do you customize your desktop?

>>58569045
When I add plug-ins/widgets to show me more than just the time

>>58568498
You actually can't look up your hardware because they don't have a list of supported ids.

They literally have such shit support that they don't know if something works and the only way they can test it is if they trick someone into trying to get it to work.

Then when you file a bug report they expect you to submit a patch that fixes it.

BSD support.

>>58567872
there is a reason why its dead anon
http://www.grymoire.com/Unix/CshTop10.txt

I hope you enjoy "\" because you will be using it lots.

#!/bin/csh -f
sed '\
s/ /\\\\
/' file

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OpenBSD is trash. Use FreeBSD instead.

>OpenBSD
>Want modern packages with security updates (without checking an eratta)

>your options:
>hang self
>use -current
>choose to use -current
>look all over the place because documentation is nonexistant
>finally find /snapshots on the FTP server which is referenced nowhere
>time to upgrade to a newer snaphot
>have to use bsd.rd, can't use pkg_add or something like freebsd-update.
>bsd.rd's upgrade is borked in this snapshot. Basically you have to shoot yourself.

OpenBSD does security well but does everything else wrong. Theo is truly a follower of the UNIX philosophy.

>>58567455
>As a side effect of integration, there isn't as much software.

Only for proprietary shit. For open source stuff there may not be an existing package or port for it, but anything that can be compiled on Linux, should compile on the BSDs as well.

>>58569340
>>58568498
bsd hardware "support" is "throw it out" aka "lol u dont need dat"

>I need this wireless card / graphics card / anything to work
>lol u dont need dat

>>58567968
>they can steal BSD
>stealing - the dastardly act of using something that is freely given, especially in accordance with it's license.

why do gnutards always feel the need to shit up these threads despite that fact that they neither use nor care about bsd?

>>58566757

BSD users are the hipsters of the Linux world. Linux is waay too mainstream. They must jump through additional hoops to run the same. fucking. toolchain.

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>>58569715
>hipsters of the linux world
>don't you linux
nani?

>>58569682
Because you BSD shits constantly try to throw your quantum "use it but fuck off" garbage at everyone.

In OP's post:
>Potential Linux switchers welcome
>Ask questions

#1 quesiton: will it actually work

answer is always

>fuck off pleb lol u dont need dat
Admit that this thread is a circlejerk, is all I'm asking. But you won't, you keep trying to bait in new people when we know full well you have no interest in "converting" them. You WANT them to use it and freak out because you think this makes you intelligent.

>>58569752

This sounds oddly like #Gentoo on Efnet.

>>58569752
>does it actually work
to which the reply is
>why don't you try it and find out
you fuckers are all the same. If no one spoonfeeds it to you you just whine about it not working.

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>>58569715
>protip
It's microshills

>>58569793
>since both Linus and RMS respect each other
lmao is this a fucking joke

>>58567213
>with bsd, it can be quite easy to change mac os software to run on bsd
That sounds actually pretty good, I didn't know about that. I'll look it up.
>also everything is not going to break after each update
But neither does GNU/Linux.

>>58567312
So can GNU/Linux.

>>58567455
Yeah, I can see a reason to run it on servers. But I came to this thread because I thought most posters in here actually used BSD as their main desktop OS, and this always gets me curious.

>>58567676
I don't know much about BSD, which is why I came here and asked a question. With my current knowledge of BSD I don't see any reason to run it over Linux on a desktop, but there are a lot of people that do and I wanted to listen to their reasons to become more informed and maybe even change my mind about the subject. Sorry if I sounded condescending, kid.

>>58567893
That could be an argument, but can you exemplify why this is becomes a problem for GNU? In principle just because a system isn't pure Unix doesn't mean it's bad. In fact GNU never sought to be a perfect Unix clone (GNU's not Unix, after all).

>>58569877
Hes lying about OSX compatibility.
BSD users like to mislead to give the illusion of value where there is none.

>>58568824
I usually don't put up with it since I usually use cwm on OpenBSD. But this is the machine I'm currently on, which yea, has Lumina. It's okay. I haven't used xfce in years though, so I suppose I'll try it again some day.
>>58568931
FreeBSD, OpenBSD, NetBSD, and DragonFlyBSD are actually four different OSes, that share neither a kernel nor userland. They're all similar though. I only regularly use OpenBSD and FreeBSD, so I'll only compare those:
FreeBSD tends to emulate a lot of GNU/Linux stuff in an effort to appeal to enterprises. Has a lot more money in it, and all the things that come from that. They don't reply to bug reports consistently though.
OpenBSD tends to have more convenient and easy-to-understand config files. Developers often reply if you send an email to the mailing lists. It comes with X11 already available.
>>58569439
I see. I heard of this article but haven't read it: I'll do that now.
>>58569527
>your post
It's bad to lie, you know. Tell me about the packages you have that aren't modern.
>nonexistent documentation
I have a -current install on another SSD and I promise you it wasn't hard to find out about snapshots.
>want to use pkg_add to replace the kernel
???????? what would make this seem reasonable?
Though I will say that binary updates are coming soon, probably in 6.1 or 6.2: they're working on something equivalent to freebsd-update.
>UNIX philosophy
Unix philosophy* UNIX is just for SUS/POSIX losers.
>>58569682
Either extreme conformism or inferiority complex. Probably the former. They're upset that not everyone does the same thing they do.
>>58569715
>the same. fucking. toolchain.
Do you think anyone wants to use as bad a toolchain? No, that's why FreeBSD switched to clang, which is bad, but less bad.
>>58569877
Not him, but it's usually easier to port GNU/Linux software than Mac OS X software. Depends on the author: some are good at not making shitty dependencies. But both can work.

>>58569877
>actually used BSD as their main desktop OS
I do since it's more productive for me: I personally prefer the BSD userland over the GNU one. Documentation is better since man is easier to read than info, too.
>why this is becomes a problem for GNU?
Sometimes mixing things together works, but for GNU software, it seems it hasn't. Stuff like --long -------loooooooooooooooong options are less ergonomic to type out, and same with the default keybindings in many of their programs.

>>58570171
>Documentation is better
It isn't though.

>>58570242
>It isn't though.
[citation needed]

>>58570333
see
>>58569340

It's a common misconception that BSD has good documentation, it doesn't. It has a distinct lack of documentation.

>>58570358
The man pages often list hardware that works with them. At least it did when I was reading some network driver man pages.
See also:
https://www.freebsd.org/releases/10.3R/hardware.html
Who are you trying to bullshit?

>>58570383
That page literally supports my argument.

Its a bullet point list of models.

If you look at the Linux wireless documentation its far more useful.

>>58569952
im sorry, im actually not a user of bsd, i recently got interested in it, and read somewhere that there was some compatibility.

>>58570424
OSX is all proprietary shit, there is no method for running its software under any other OS, there is a project to emulate apps but it never got beyond very basic hello world type support.

>>58570383
just ignore him. he literally has no knowledge of bsd and just likes to shit on it.
/ of his posts boil down to shit like
>I don't know what hardware I use so I can't look it up

>>58570471
It isn't shit.

There are different revisions wireless of hardware models that have different product id, they don't list the ids because in most cases the drivers haven't been tested with them.

>>58570471
I know he's shit, I just want other people to know that he is.
>>58570506
It's going to be difficult for you to hear, but as long as there is closed-source hardware, there will be driver problems. The only solution is open-source hardware.

>>58570526
What are you even talking about?

I was pointing out that their documentation is shit, their drivers having shit support is an entirely separate matter.

>>58570526
>I just want other people to know that he is.
why do you think everyone here is a redditor like you who responds to tripfags?

>>58570358
It's a common misconception that 4chan cares who you are, we don't. We have a distinct lack of caring about who tripfags are.

>>58566757
inb4 no systemd

>>58567936
>muh INNOVASHUN

>>58569785
>to which the reply is
>>why don't you try it and find out
aka
>we don't know, nobody actually runs it, we only tried it in parallels

>>58570471
>>58570383
there it is, the hardware list. aka the "throw it out" list

>Oh everything will work great if you just find this one 15 year old laptop
>If you don't use this hardware then you're an idiot for expecting BSD to work
>I noticed you have need for hardware made in the last 5 years. Just throw that out and go find this 15 year old piece of shit.

By using FreeBSD and Emacs I can be the ultimate elitist.

>>58574010
Funny, I've never had any issue with it not working on any of my hardware. I don't specifically buy hardware for it either. I used to be a gamer, and it was recent enough that my main PC build reflects that. OpenBSD works just great on it.

For older hardware I have lying around it's not an issue at all. While OpenBSD will be slower than Linux to support new hardware, once it is supported you can almost certainly be assured that it will always work. Windows actively breaks shit to force users to buy new hardware, which is designed not to work with older versions of Windows. Linux does this too, but without having any compelling reason to do so other than for the hell of it apparently. FreeBSD is more conservative about it, and try not to, but if it comes down to a choice between backwards compatibility and new features, it will choose new features every time. OpenBSD will not go out of it's way to break shit once it's been supported. Even if active support has ended it will do everything within reason to ensure that it can still be used.

>>58567936
FreeBSD, NetBSD, and DragonFlyBSD all have their purposes. There are some smaller worthwhile projects, for example there are RetroBSD (2.11BSD fork) and LiteBSD (4.4BSD fork) for microcontrollers

>>58573815
>inb4 no systemd

no systemd, more integrated. linux is just kernel. FreeBSD is a operating system. hardware support is on par because its easier to reason about how a BSD system run. i.e running gtx1070 on freebsd

updates without breaking the whole system, AMI BIOS seems to directly boot a BSD partition scheme, like the american megatrands bla directly loads without skipping screens.

>>58567968

portsnap fetch
portsnap extract
pkg install xorg mate mate-desktop slim
echo 'exec "mate-session"' > .xinitrc
echo '
dbus_enable="YES"\
hald_enable="YES"\
slim_enable="YES"\
' > /etc/rc.conf

reboot, done

FreeBSD: power of gentoo with simplicity of ubuntu

>>58575525
why would you need the ports if you're using binary packages

it's even SIMPLER than what you did

>>58573913
People do in fact run the BSDs. The very active communities surrounding them aren't just there merely to troll you, and other useless dipshits. They tend to know what their BSD(s) of choice are, and are not capable of. They tend to be knowledgeable enough to have made the decision to use them in the first place, without seeking 4chan's extremely valuable input. Very few just up and decide to install BSD on a whim, or just to be different or unique, or just to spite Linux users. If that's the only reason you can think of to install one, and explore it more in depth, then I can assure you that it's probably not the OS for you, which is fine. None of them have ever intended to be a one-size-fits-all solution, nor are they intended to be an elite social club or a messianic cult.

Do any of the BSDs actually work? Yes, as any BSD user can attest, it's very much possible to install and boot them, and then use them to do shit. Will they work for you to accomplish the things you need an OS to do? I dunno. I don't know your circumstances. However if your circumstances entail having random strangers make decisions for you, and hold your hands, then no, they probably will not work for you at all, and that's that. You can now move on with your life, and never have to worry about the mean old BSDs posing a threat to your own precious ever again.

>>58574010
I've been seeing this throw it out meme quite a bit lately, sounds like someone's a little assblasted that OpenBSD doesn't support his GTX 970.

Why don't you just get a job and use Windows or Mac like normal people?

>>58575598
>very active communities
Maybe compared to darwin and OS2.

> relevant music

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k_-W8XmOycs

>>58576058
If including macos darwin is bigger than leenux

When I first switched to *BSD I was quite hyped about it, but now after a few months, I don't see the point in making these threads and holding the BSD flag as if we were special snowflakes. Why separate ourselves from the rest of the UNIX culture?
I mean, I am aware that the /fglt/ is mostly a systemd thread with some gentoo renegades. But why not keep up with the /friendly UNIX general/ for all those that keep with the Unix style? Why make a BSD thread at all?
I also regret that so many projects are made for Linux only, I really hate that. I've wanted to try a couple projects I've found on the net but they're always the same shit: GNU Makefile, GNU configure, #!/bin/bash and so on.
And some are filled with GNU dependencies like gnutls, wget, and all sorts of related bullshit...
As such I don't see why it is at all healthy to have the community separate into "clans such as Linux, *BSD, etc. Why not just make two threads: /fsdg/ for systemd and /fug/ for unix?

>>58576628
friendly unix general is a good idea, the problem is all the other unices have died off

>>58576647
Except for Solaris, and also the non-system linux distributions loosely fit into the unix-like category.
Makes more sense to integrate the different systems rather than segregate them further, as I already said, portability between them is highly neglected.

>>58566757
>GNU/BSD

>>58575598
>Do any of the BSDs actually work? Yes, as any BSD user can attest, it's very much possible to install and boot them, and then use them to do shit
Second this, I remember when I used GNOO/LEEX, with absolutely every distribution but two ( Arch and Gentoo ), every single time something would break without me touching anything. Either the installer would abort (and because it's a blackboxed installer I was left with nothing but a blank drive) or right after installation something weird would happen like network drops every minute, random system crashes every two hours (debian!!), or a pop-up dialogue saying "A system program failed" with just an [OK] button (Ubuntu!).
The only ones that worked, as I said were Arch, which I ditched because muh systemd. And gentoo, which is a bitch to even get started, as opposed to the BSDs (at least FreeBSD which I don't really like and OpenBSD) where you can just install and run, and it JUST FUCKING WERKS.
I'd forgotten about my leenux experience, and decided to try void linux. Only to find out that getting it to connect to the network is an absolute PITA with absolute shit documentation (see man iw, it pretty much just says "use iw help for more information", and "iw help" gives the worst documentation I've seen in my life)

>>58576771
http://www.autism.org.uk/helpline

Idiots who can't get ahold of many maschin to put their softwares into, what is switching when you can have multiple?

>>58576688
you haven't heard that oracle has laid off every employee working on solaris?

>>58576828
Well Illumos is still going

>>58576628

its not about being a special snowflake, you have technically superior and inferior software. linux is great but its also pretty heavily fragmented inside itself. BSD has fragmentations but they are whole operating systems, running a window manager is from from running a usable stable operating system. Linux people legit are like the riced drifter kids, with parts assembled from wherever. BSD is more like audi or muscle desu.

BSD is not about people, the GNU/LINUX kids seem to focus more on politics/community then actually building something usable.

I think alot of people who use linux now would stay in BSD if they actually tried it to understand it.

So for BSD its about letting people know there exists something out there between Windows/Linux/MacOSX.

Minix3 microkernel is going to run bsd userland, My money is on that honestly.

Every operating system sucks and is insecure atm so i think its better to bet on a horse that does not have cancer already.

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>>58576949
>BSD is more like audi or muscle

I mean i rather have a BSD license where people can openly "steal" from eachother.

Then GNU/linux, where the quality of your theft depends on how many shit dependencies you can push downstream. looking at systemd

*upstream

or the number of shit distributions you can come up with

>>58576949
I'm not sure that saying that BSD has fragmentations. Net/Hardened/Open/Free/DragonFly/Retro/Lite-BSD all share the same root (same root being various versions of the original Berkeley Software Distribution), but they are very much different OS' nowadays - Try doing a diff between just the kernel on each of them to see what has changed (which ignores the userland, which has changed way more).
That said, I'm a happy FreeBSD user of 16 years and have other BSDs installed on stuff like my SHARP X68000 and RPI and other things.

>>58577016
When are you going to stop posting in this thread because someone has owned you this time? That's what you do in every thread when someone refutes your ignorant shilling.

>>58577080
That number is seemingly not as near-infinite as it once was, as Linux distribtions seem to be converging on being basically the same systemd-infected system with different DEs.
One of the few things I liked about Linux was how many flavours it came in - you could literally find anything that suited your tastes including full-on SEL inspired stuff.

Unrelated to any of the above, I found https://github.com/lattera/articles/blob/master/infosec/tor/2017-01-14_torified_home/article.md earlier today which seems very cool.

>>58577119

> Net/Hardened/Open/Free/DragonFly/Retro/Lite-BSD all share the same root (same root being various versions of the original Berkeley Software Distribution), but they are very much different OS' nowadays

thats what im saying, its not enough to install a new gtk3 theme and call it a distribution/operating system.

>>58577119
My picture is a more apt representation of the two communities.

BSD code is the tiny fire that a dev is defecating on because he doesn't contribute back. GPL encourages innovation and contribution.

Saying that BSD is like audi and Linux is like a ricer makes no sense.

I knew I shouldn't have removed by BePawsome filter.

>>58577189
he's a furry? laffo

I would argue that GPL actually discourages competition because everybody feels like they can fork everything else unconditionally. So what you get literally is shit, it takes what was coherent software and turns them into shit.

>>58577176
> muh friendship

>>58577217
If you can't share ideas you can't innovate (evolve) and you die out.

Its exactly what happened to BSD.

>>58577246

BSD is far from dead, its in every playstation 3 and 4, its in OSX, its in the windows TCP stack. Its in legit everything.

>>58577204
I'm not sure that's true, but GPL definitely means companies are very unlikely to base their systems on it like NASA, NetApp, Dell, Apple, Netflix, Juniper, Citrix, Panasonic, and Sony have done - most of which have contributed code back to BSD or have donated to the FreeBSD foundation because they can't contribute code back but want to help in some way.

>>58577263
Ignore BePawsome, he's a shill who has no fucking idea what he's talking about and will eventually go away. I suspect that he actually gets off on being insulted, so when he goes away is when he's had his cummies and need to get some tendies.

BSD has a marketing problem, not a user problem. It does not have happy story about friendship and love.

>>58577285
Like those companies have done with BSD.

>>58577290
Not really those. Those who need to run it will usually find it, and those who're too stupid to do anything without a HOWTO (see: most linux users nowadays) aren't likely to bother with it anyway.

>>58577302
>look mom I fixed my wifi without a howto
>wow timmy you showed those linux users , so proud of you

>>58577327
What I mean is copy/pasting verbatum from a HOWTO, specifically. It's what every new Linux convert wants, to be given the command to accomplish exactly what they want instead of learning how to do it themselves.

>>58577263
There is no BSD code in any playstation.
OSX has a few userland tools derived from BSD but it also isn't BSD.
Windows having used BSD network code is also a myth. A few command line tools do, similar to OSX but on a far smaller level.

None of these projects contribute back to BSD there is no growth there, the OSX and Windows userland tools are decades old examples that aren't relevant today.

>>58577347
Gentoo is a great distro to learn working with Linux in general, I find. Gets down to the core of things. Next step is probably just using the kernel itself

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>>58577355

>The PlayStation 4 system software is the updatable firmware and operating system of the PlayStation 4.

> The operating system is the Unix-like Orbis OS, based on FreeBSD 9.

>>58577405
>based on FreeBSD 9
allegedly

>>>>58577472
>allegedly
http://doc.dl.playstation.net/doc/ps4-oss/

The only way to find out what absolute shit tier garbage BSD is as a desktop OS is, is to try it you're self.
And it is completely fucking worthless, imo.
It's so fucking bad, anybody actually promoting it's usage as such, rather than gnu/linux, can only be a paid shill recruitment agent.Thanks for polluting this board, apple or sony, or whoever you are.

>>58577520
ebin

>>58577500
Well shit, guess I am not up to date. afaik back when people were saying the PS3 used BSD code there was no information like this available.

>>58577355

>None of these projects contribute back to BSD there is no growth there,

GPL growth is cancer, if you make a playstation 4 product on freebsd, then it really has no specific bearing to FreeBSD unless they rewrite a new way of doing things that can benefit the core operating system, not just nice to have's, but actual architectural improvement. That is what you want contributed back.

>>58577539
Your bullshit is always out of date or straight-up manefactured, and your post method of throwing enough shit at a wall hoping something sticks never work.
It's been known for years before the consoles even came out, ever since people with @sony.co.jp mail addresses started asking very in-depth questions on the FreeBSD mailing lists.

>>58577589
If you choose to see my arguments that way thats fine, it isn't true though.
>>58577565
>GPL growth is cancer
Really isn't. Its glorious freedom.

GPL says: "fix my shit" oh and btw its still my property.

>>58577619
Well, technically you would maintain ownership of your code that you contributed to a GPL project. You are perfectly free to re-license and remove it.

>>58577654
>re-license and remove it
Once code is GPL, you can't un-GPL it.

Also, can you please answer me a question? I'm unironically curious as to why you're on this crusade of yours against BSD?

>>58577697
Code can be un-GPL'd if all authors of the code agree to it.

>>58577697
Yes you can.

>>58577718
muh politics

>>58577697
It isn't a crusade, I'm just speaking my mind. This is a forum for free opinions.

>>58577782
What I mean is, why are you against another piece of opensource software? There are very legitimate arguments to be made against closed-source software, but what you're doing seems to accomplish nothing.

>>58577813
As an addendum to this, what are you gaining by convincing people to not use BSD or similar licenses (like MIT or Apache, though I don't see you mentioning these, despite the fact that they're functionally equivalent).

>>58577841
>>58577813
I'm not trying to accomplish anything, I just like to argue when people say BSD is better than Linux or the GPL.

>>58577857
To my knowledge nobody has said that it is unanimously better in every single respect. It does certain things demonstrably better, and those reasons are why we BSD users think other people should give it a chance, in addition to which it also does a lot of what GNU/Linux does with only marginally more effort (and sometimes as little).

Unlike closed-source propriatary software which people pay money for, there's no reason for opensource projects to compete over users - there is no war, except those that force one for the sole sake of controversy (or as a feeble and old attempt at trolling).

>>58577924
>t also does a lot of what GNU/Linux does with only marginally more effort (and sometimes as little).

I see statements like this as misleading and inflammatory. It belittles what GNU/Linux is capable of and attempts to downplay its superiority in a disparaging way.

>>58577979
Also for a bit of insight into why I feel this way.

An analogy would be shouting about women's rights at a stag party.

The stag party in this analogy is of course Linux users and the women's rights advocate is the BSD proponent starting a thread.

You are going to get the same reaction every time regardless if I am here or not, and I don't believe people that post these threads are ignorant of that fact. They are masochists.

>> 58577246

> If you can't share ideas you can't innovate (evolve) and you die out.

GPL does not share ideas, it shares work.

Which is why everything in linux is a fragmented piece of shit and re-implementations of the same garbage.

The idea comes before the work, and in linux its very hard to actually create a new idea, because everything is tied into previous work. not ideas (abstraction). see wayland

>>58578012
You can think of what BSD users are doing as a kind of proselytizing - but not the kind that Jehova's Witnesses do where they come to the door, it's more the kind that's done at Speakers' Corner in Hyde Park (if you've never been there, it's a public space where EVERYONE is allowed to shout at their the top of their lungs for what they think matters most - which is a way better analogy than what you were going for because it's actually how the internet works, whereas a stag party isn't the place for free speech that as you seem to think it is.

>>58577979
If you read that from what I wrote, then you're reading the sentence wrong - and that's on you.

>>58578061
It's the difference between implimentation and idea. You can copyright an implimentation, you can't copyright an idea.

>>58578103
>You can copyright an implimentation, you can't copyright an idea.

hence bsd is about ideas, and linux is about implementations, but in linux case its copy left. So everybody using the same implementations all day with a very thin vinear of "freedom"

>>58578067
>place for free speech
The point was that a lot of people are going to disagree with you.
>>58578067
>If you read that from what I wrote, then you're reading the sentence wrong - and that's on you.
I'm not reading it wrong, that's how most people will interpret it. Its an extremely arrogant and ignorant thing to say.

>>58576785
thanks, I needed this

>>58576949
Well, you got a point.
It is indeed these threads that kept poking BSD at me and finally encouraged me to try it.
And yes, Linux kids focus way too much on politics. But that doesn't mean they're left out of unix discussion (systemd-free linuxes that is, although they are rare and unpopular).
I didn't know about minix3, I'll look into it.

>>58576949
>Minix3 microkernel is going to run bsd userland
IS running.

Right now Minix3 is pretty much just NetBSD with a weird kernel.

Hey linux anons, how to build kdesudo? :) I'm serious. I don't want install bunch of software for just gksudo. sudo is not work for gui programs. PolicyKit is really complicated. I want to build kdesudo. but can't find. opensuse(and others) also don't have it but no one show how to build TT.

>>58578239
You can just use sudo and set the SUDO_ASKPASS environment variable to use a graphical input prompt like pinentry to get the password.

>>58578145
No. The BSDs and Linux are both implimentations of ideas about how an operating system should function.

>>58578155
Disagree with me on what? Their wrong interpretation of what I'm saying? I'm not sure you're right that's how people interpret it just because that's how you interpret - you cannot conclude one from the other, but hey - let's find out:

HEY THREAD and >>58566757!
Can you please go vote on this: https://www.strawpoll.me/12156909

TIA.

>>58578239
Probably the wrong place to ask, but './configure', 'make' and 'sudo make install' are usually how you do things.

>>58578349
>Their wrong interpretation of what I'm saying?
The scope of your implications juxtapose your reasoning so sharply that it can only be intentional cognitive dissonance, i.e. trolling, unless you really believe the shit you are saying, in which case its just a plain old delusion.

>>58578382
Your argument was that people will interpret my words the opposite way of what they actually mean. That's what I'm challanging.

What is the best BSD GUI and why is it macOS?

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>>58578427

>>58578451
Why are you attaching an image of yourself?

>>58578437
Because macfags like to repeat their nonsense thinking people actually believe them.

>>58578349

But linux is the one who tries to copyright a idea in this case, the operating system should be as minimal as possible, providing furtile ground for further development in a as simple way as possible. read: The entire operating system.

Linux is half a idea and half a implementation, A kernel, the other half is GPL.

You wouldn't build half a car, why build half a operating system

correction: halve*

Give me 5 good valid reasons why anyone should use *BSD over GNU/Linux when GNU/Linux has far better hardware support, can use any of the software that *BSD uses, and can get the exact same results that *BSD gets.

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(((FSF))) is trash
Not open source software, just FSF

>>58578525
You use OSX and BSD is a fashion statement that fuels your ego as someone aspiring to create proprietary software and engage in rent seeking behavior.

>>58578554
>You use OSX and BSD is a fashion statement that fuels your ego as someone aspiring to create proprietary software and engage in rent seeking behavior.

That says more about you really then about BSD.

>>58578585
fuck off, plebbitor.
you have to go back

>>58578552
FSF is an organization numbnuts, were you instead referring to GNU? Which is the software that stallman programmed and promotes.

>>58578554
>>58578596

> muh choices are not mine, they belong to overlord stallman

>>58578640
i don't use gnutrash nor do i plan to ever use gnutrash
you have to back, plebbitor.

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>>58578630
Call a nigger a nigger, the FSF are just a bunch of jews.

lol @ FSF/GNU/Linux imo
BSD is king

you can build a gpl community ontop of BSD, cant build BSD ontop of GPL

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>>58576786
Yea, I like drugs a lot too, but apparently not as much as you do.

>>58578783
That's blatantly impossible.

>>58578771
>community
stopped reading right there

>>58578877
GPL is a social construct. It has nothing to do with good software

>>58578783
I don't do that many drugs man. UNIX is my drug

>>58578922
>It has nothing to do with good software
why did you feel the need to write this? did you for some reason assume that wasn't obvious?

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>>58578946
You know why anon.

You know why.

>>58578927
Probably the majority of the original UNIX system 1-6 was probably developed on drugs
as an example, the story goes that chroots origins are basically fueled by drugs, because nobody knows why it was first implimented

>>58578946

Its not that obvious imo, people attribute virtious/open-source feels to a contract/project that binds them from doing anything considered "evil".

just because you close your eyes, does not mean there are no diccs in your face.

You have guys like lennard pottering/nsa running around working the system perfectly fine.

The only reason you think im shilling is that its too much reality for you. you hate reality and the things in it. like big corporations

bacc to the la la land

>>58579128
>You have guys like lennard pottering
did he get his hands on BSD as well? i must have missed the memo.
>nsa
i don't live in a US satellite state so i'm mostly fine.
>you hate reality and the things in it. like big corporations
uhh... but i don't?

>>58579320
>that obvious imo, people attribute virtious/open-source feels to a contract/project that binds them from doing anything considered "evil".
>just because you close your eyes, does not mean there are no diccs in your face.
>You have guys like lennard pottering/nsa running around working the system perfectly fine.

> the gpl system of feels and friendship

>>58578493
Ask Linus

>>58579320
>You guys
This refers to Linux users. Lennart Poettering has nothing to do with BSD, he works for Redhat.
>NSA
No, NSA spies on EVERYONE they bloody well please.

>>58579481
Fucking kek.

>>58579468
i literally couldn't comprehend the "meaning" behind this post. can you be a little less cryptic? perhaps you shouldn't skip out on your meds
>>58579490
>This refers to Linux users.
yeah, but why did he post this to me? what does loonkeks have to do with me?
>No, NSA spies on EVERYONE they bloody well please.
that's why i said "mostly".

>>58579514
>why?
Anons mind works in strange ways. Also possibly drugs.
>Mostly
As a general rule: if you genuinely fear NSA, it's time to go live as a hermit in a cave, away from all technology.

>>58579536
>if you genuinely fear NSA, it's time to go live as a hermit in a cave
true, but surely you agree that living in a country which isn't infiltrated by them to any considerable degree and living in the US are pretty different things.

>>58579574
No. They connect all data they possibly can, regardless of source or destination.

the nsa probably runs on bsd

>>58579610
are you implying the costs and general trouble involved in getting to a person don't change with distance and state?

>>58578349
it was right place for question... I try to use freebsd. sudo was not worked. might xhost ploblem. The reason I asked that was it seemed to be more Linuxer here.
thanks for answer. Thanks for answer anyway. I try it as joke. I gave up finding answer already

>>58579660
When you have a functionally unlimited budget? Easy. What makes it difficult is what stuff like Snowden has done where he's keeping himself in the public eye, and he has a faildead (opposite of failsafe) canary with the press, should he suddenly disappear.

>>58579766
>try to use freebsd. sudo was not worked. might xhost ploblem. The reason I asked that was it seemed to be more Linuxer here.

> pkg install sudo

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Could FreeBSD be considered an anime OS?

>>58579907
https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2002-03-20/lain-esque-os-for-your-computer
Yes. Unfortunately it didn't get maintained. I remember using it for a period, it fucking owned.

>>58576949
>the GNU/LINUX kids seem to focus more on politics/community then actually building something usable.

I don't know that I'd consider them representative of the Linux community as a whole though. They are just a vocal minority. When you consider just how much of the world's infrastructure runs some variation of Linux, and remember how small it's desktop market share is in comparison, that paints a whole different picture.

Most Linux people probably don't get on the web after work, and start preaching the glories of GPL, or harassing people for using the incorrect OS/distro. They've been dealing with the ups and downs of Linux at work all day, and getting involved in inane discussions with neets and high-schoolers about how kewl it is, and everything else sucks is the last fucking thing they want to do. I imagine most of them don't particularly want to think about, or discuss work anymore than necessary in their free time, because they are normal human beings with lives, and other interests. They too likely would look down on the more vocal, and mouth breathing part of the Linux community.

What I'm getting at though is that the people who can be considered an expert on Linux, probably aren't all that different than the ones who can be considered an expert on BSD. The difference is that BSD is a lot more niche, and doesn't attract as much interest from undesirables looking to be 1337 hackers, or having a cause to belong to no matter how boring, and pathetic it may be. If you think Linux is bad now though, with the gamers and script kiddies, just wait until the Facebook, and Twitter retards decide to hop on the Linux bandwagon. What Linux is seeing now is merely a scouting expedition. The real faggotry may still be looming on the horizon.

>>58571323
>ledditor
Never used it. It's fine to reply to shitposters if your post is good.

>>58576647
>general
Fuck off. Generals are killing 4chan. Unix threads have been made before and work well, there is no reason to make them worse by making them generals.

>>58576647
see >>58581119

>>58576828
sasuga, oracle

>>58577979
>GNU/Linux
>superiority
Pick one.

Thread title is left too open. Let's talk about Windows.

>>58578155
>The point was that a lot of people are going to disagree with you.

You've put the same amount of effort into mastering the art of analogy, as you have into learning enough about the BSDs to form a valid opinion of them. Got it!

>>58566885

Stop being nasty, Lennart.

>>58581439
>>58581477
>>>/p/lebbit

>>58576084
Not if you consider embedded and server markets.

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Install Linux if you want spics and sandniggers in your country, cucks. Install BSD if you want a white tomorrow.

>>58566994
I ask myself this very question everytime someone mentions *BSD on the desktop. I don't mind using pfsense, but that's about the most I'll ever touch from *BSD. Even then, building a router with Linux is fine too.

some seriously disturbed autists in these threads

>>58584133
Yeah, beawesome's pretty bad

the guy (lawyer) who wrote the GPL says maybe we shouldn't enforce it all the time. BSD-style license is fine

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=okEQt-Rla7o

>>58584038
Which BSD though?

>>58584215
Literally any single one. All of them are pro white and not controlled by kikes.

>>58584038
> ITT
>who can argue with the most abstract analogies which prove nothing

>>58584225
>i cannot argue technical merits
>validate my OS bias with analogous reasoning

>>58584228
Really now?
>>58584237
but that's all correct

>>58580632
That last paragraph is probably BSDs biggest strength.

>>58580632
A tl;dr would be that normalfags ruin everything.

>>58574154
>Linux does this too, but without having any compelling reason to do so other than for the hell of it apparently.
Please prove this you fucking retard.

>>58576771
Is void a good choice of operating system for my laptop? I'm using void+i3 right now, and I have to say, it's really fucking fast. The repos aren't that great, but for what's basically a glorified internet machine, i am extremely satisfied just by the sheer speed of its boot up. Is there a better alternative I should try out? I hear openBSD is good for laptops. In what ways does void exceed openBSD?

>>58585957
Wrong thread/poor bait.

>>58566994
>GNU/Linux is already a good Unix-like
Used to be until systemd

Fun fact: most BSD variants I've tried can run their respective strong roles out of the box. That includes OpenBSD for router, firewall and wireless communications and FreeBSD as a ZFS powered NAS (NFS) or SAN.

>>58580632
>They are just a vocal minority

They are just retards. None of these people never had any real experience with real usage of operating systems besides customizing their WM with anime wallpapers.

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>>58586192
>Used to be until systemd
Yeah now its great instead.
:3

>>58586488
That's arguably because they have a base OS.

Install Gentoo... with a FreeBSD kernel

>>58586192
and now i have gentoo

>cuck license
no thanks

Gentlemen, how is GPU support in *BSDs?

I heard improvements made to Linux drm are usually get ported to BSD.

>>58589027
On FreeBSD, which is what I know most about, drm-next is being worked up, bring it current with upstream which is at 4.8 last I checked (it's in -CURRENT now, might be in the next minor release.

nvidia provides their propriatary driver in the form of x11/nvidia-driver

I don't know how AMD does, because I haven't used AMD since I had a 700MHz Athlon that was brand-spanking new - only thing I've heard is that AMD is supposed to have renewed their pledge to support opensource, but only to the point of writing for Linux, so it'll presumably have to get ported too - but they forgot about that pledge once, so we'll see.

>>58589027
Simply shit. There's no need for GPU support on servers.