Vegan General

>>42776607
Because they know subconsciously that their own diets are immoral and unhealthy, but they don't wan't to change so they bash vegans instead.

man that pic sure made an impact here, everyone's using it to stomp veganism

>>42776607
It is called cognitive dissonance, when meat eaters talk with a vegan even when the subject isn't necessarily on veganism they are confronted with the fact that on a spectrum of morality they are inferior to vegans and they realize their stable live full of virtue signalling on many leveks isnt that stable anymore

Meat tastes good.

Vegan food (that is not just grains and vegetables) is expensive.

Most vegans are cunts.

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>>42776607
shut up vegan

I feel like I would dominate you physically

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>>42776638
>>42776609
>>42776607
The way vegans type is so cringe that im finding it hard to accept that there are legitimate vegans around here and that this is the new SS+GOMAD that people pretend is good to fuck with beginners.

>>42776649
post body faggot

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>>42776656
Here

Me enjoying meat.

Stay jelly, vegans.

>>42776665
Dyel confirmed

>>42776609
No we dont. Its pretty clear vegetarianism is bad

Vegetables arent natural wtf fruit grows wild? Not bananans, not limes, lemons or grapefruit, not watermelon or cauliflower, not corn, not hemp, not potatoes tomatoes, or peppers.

On the other band meat has been readily available forever.

Eskimos literally didnt have vegetables in their diet, they ate the organs and got vitamins that way instead

>>42776681
>Its pretty clear vegetarianism is bad
Can you further explain?

>why do people on a Taiwanese clam shelling public debate Hall's health and fitness board not agree with this arbitrary, unhealthy, costly, low nutrient fad diet that I follow solely to get attention from others?
Lol

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>>42776607
How about just eating a balanced diet with the correct amount of calories and not being a massive faggot

>>42776702
>le balanced diet meme

Their diet makes me respect them a little less than I normally would

Vegans are cool until they get obnoxious and try to convert people or prepend to be superior to normal people.

>>42776607
You're answering your own question OP. It's like a jehovah's witness asking, "How come so many people have something against me?" Because you're self righteous enough to A. Think your way is the best/only diet and 2. wondering OUT LOUD why others haven't spontaneously adopted your way.

>>42776609
>pre judges people, condemns lifestyles just for being different, takes the moral highground because save the floofs
I bet you're antifa too your fucking hypocrite.

>>42776607
If I wanted to be preached at, I'd go to church.

>>42776609

I know my diet harms animals, I just don't care.

>>42776607
It's a credability thing for me. I had friends who watched cowspiracy, went vegan, lectured me about how bad meat is and then got over the fad and forgot about it a month later.

And despite the consensus of the thread I dont have a moral issue with eating meat and I'm not going to change my personal beliefs based on someone else's values.

>>42777252
all vegan milks in coffee curdle and taste like shit

>>42776994
Being alive harms animals.

The only ethical choice is to an hero.

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>>42776681
Are you black?

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It's because they make meat eaters seem like the anti-christ for living their lives
I don't care what you eat or how you live your life but you should insult and demerit others life choices
That goes for vegans and people shitting on vegans
You people need to grow up

>>42776609
This. 100% spot on. Easier to shame others than work on yourself. It's how people cope with their poor choices and lack of control. I'm not a vegan, but I admire them. At least I admit I'm not strong enough to completely remove meat from my diet yet and I don't shame those who can. So far I managed to stop eating pork completely and drinking milk.

>>42776607
It does cause an enormous amount of preachyness and disinformation. I'd say it's mostly the preachy stuff tho

>>42776607
>Many scientists and professional athletes are vegans.
Many more are meat eaters.

>Vegans live six to ten years longer than the average meat eaters and their risk of heart disease is two times lower than for the average meat eater.
Thats just not true.

>Veganism doesn't cause unnecessary harm for animals.
Is nutrition unnecesary? There have been many cases of vegans that have become ill due to lack of nutrition, wich can be atributed to their diet.

>It has way lower negative impacts on the environment.
Debatable, but thats your only argument I KINDA agree with

>>42776607
OP, are you pro life too? Because being anti-abortion causes less harm to unborn humans. It would be hypocrixtical to want harm caused to one living creature and not another.
at conception the fetus has a completely separate genetic code from the mother, separating it completely as a seperate entity.

>>42776607
about vegans living longer - I've tried to find information about that and come up blank. can you link? or is it propaganda?

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>>42776607
Because they shitpost on this board far too much

>>42776609
>unhealthy
>http://chaosandpain.blogspot.com/2014/10/the-simplicity-of-dieting-it-really-is.html
>https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3529694/#!po=57.9365
>http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/42/1/127
>Contrary to popular belief, consuming a higher amount of fat (about 35 per cent of energy) is associated with a lower risk of death compared to lower intakes. However, a diet high in carbohydrates (of more than 60 per cent of energy) is related to higher mortality, although not with the risk of cardiovascular disease.
>The research on dietary fats found that they are not associated with major cardiovascular disease, but higher fat consumption was associated with lower mortality; this was seen for all major types of fats (saturated fats, polyunsaturated fats and mono unsaturated fats), with saturated fats being associated with lower stroke risk. The researchers point out that, while this may appear surprising to some, these new results are consistent with several observational studies and randomized controlled trials conducted in Western countries during the last two decades.
>The large new study, when viewed in the context of most previous studies, questions the conventional beliefs about dietary fats and clinical outcomes, says Mahshid Dehghan, the lead author for the study and an investigator at PHRI.
>https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2017/08/170829091027.htm
>(cont.)

>>42776607
>It has way lower negative impacts on the environment
If you decide what you eat based on global warming, you're one retarded prick.

>>42781039
>(cont.)
>https://authoritynutrition.com/it-aint-the-fat-people/
>https://authoritynutrition.com/top-8-reasons-not-to-fear-saturated-fats/
>https://authoritynutrition.com/saturated-fat-good-or-bad/
>https://chriskresser.com/the-diet-heart-myth-cholesterol-and-saturated-fat-are-not-the-enemy/
>http://www.uib.no/en/node/103172
>http://www.healthline.com/nutrition/5-studies-on-saturated-fat
>http://bjsm.bmj.com/content/early/2017/03/31/bjsports-2016-097285
>http://press.endocrine.org/doi/full/10.1210/jcem.85.1.6291
>http://suppversity.blogspot.de/2014/05/bcfa-gut-health-immunity-cancer.html
>http://www.diagnosisdiet.com/meat-and-cancer/
>https://chriskresser.com/red-meat-cancer-again-will-it-ever-stop/
>http://www.mensfitness.com/nutrition/what-to-eat/meat-cancer-bacon-who-report-mens-fitness-health
>https://rawfoodsos.files.wordpress.com/2010/08/minger_formal_response2.pdf
>https://deniseminger.com/2010/08/06/final-china-study-response-html/
>https://deniseminger.com/2010/08/03/the-china-study-a-formal-analysis-and-response/
>https://deniseminger.com/2010/07/07/the-china-study-fact-or-fallac/ >http://www.foodrenegade.com/the-china-study-discredited/
>https://deniseminger.com/the-china-study/
>https://www.westonaprice.org/our-blogs/the-curious-case-of-campbells-rats-does-protein-deficiency-prevent-cancer/
>https://www.westonaprice.org/our-blogs/taking-a-trip-down-memory-lane-fishing-for-our-good-friend-glutathione-in-the-waters-of-the-memory-hole-how-t-colin-campbell-helped-prove-that-protein-protects-us
>>http://www.saragottfriedmd.com/does-meat-cause-cancer-revisiting-the-meat-igf-1-and-cancer-connection/
>https://www.reddit.com/r/keto/comments/2qxnro/red_meat_triggers_toxic_immune_reaction_which/cnai2od/
>http://caloriesproper.com/red-meat-wont-kill-you-it-will-make-you-stronger/

Because vegans have the gall to compare me to the average meat eater. Also fuck animals.

>>42776687
>http://chaosandpain.blogspot.com/2010/07/vegetarianism-and-veganism-best.html
>http://chaosandpain.blogspot.com/2010/07/vegetarianism-and-veganism-are-as.html
>http://www.lloydianaspects.co.uk/opinion/veggie.html
>https://www.t-nation.com/diet-fat-loss/10-things-vegetarians-get-wrong
>https://www.t-nation.com/diet-fat-loss/vegans-suck-at-science-heres-the-proof

>>42776681
>posts non-factual and opinion-based statements

Good job dude you really debunked just about every argument a vegan would be able to come up with

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>>42776920

I've legit never heard this argument from meat eaters. Nice strawman tho my dude.

Harm to animals is necessary. It's very hard to cook and eat them if you don't kill, skin or pluck, and eviscerate them first, and frankly for the larger ones trying to eat them alive is unsafe as well as cruel.

>>42781714
So then You're pro life as well right? Since you want to eliminate suffering and so many vegans are not pro life shouldn't you start with your own community first?

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>>42781739

>>42777289
I'm all for minimizing cruelty to animals. That's why I hunt with a .45-70. 325 grain .458-caliber projectiles traveling at 2000 feet per second will blow huge holes through any game animal that walks this continent. If you place your shots correctly it will do catastrophic damage to your prey's heart and lungs, causing near-instantaneous incapacitation and unconsciousness and death within seconds. It's far more humane than trucking them to a slaughterhouse.

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>>42777252
>milk industry is driven by money

what the fuck? did anyone think they were a charity?

>>42781692
Let's see
>>42776643
>Most vegans are cunts.
>>42776649
>shut up vegan
>>42776733
>Their diet makes me respect them a little less than I normally would
>>42776758
>Vegans are cool until they get obnoxious and try to convert people or prepend to be superior
>>42776767
>OP. It's like a jehovah's witness ... Because you're self righteous
>>42776977
>If I wanted to be preached at,
>>42777426
>they make meat eaters seem like the anti-christ
>>42778747
>propaganda
>>42780185
>they shitpost
>>42781109
>vegans have the gall to

Enough hurt feefees for you yet?

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>>42781793

>>42781793
>ignores the three posts of actual facts to attempt to insult non-vegans
Typical vegan behavior.

>>42781828
He said non vegans never have hurt feefees because of vegans showing them the right way, I proved him wrong. Nothing more, nothing less.

>>42776607
How about you vegan idiots just accept that the average person doesn't give a fuck about your soy faggotry and MUH SCIENTIFIC EBIDENSE kvetching?
Most people don't care and find you vegans insufferable. I'm glad humans continue to dominate animals.
Welcome to the food chain bitch.

Before anyone falls for the false lies that vegetarianism or veganism is scientifically better for you...
https://youtu.be/mjmV8BlsJTQ

In every general I ask meatfags why, if 100% veganism is unhealthy, they don't just eat plant-based + bivalves and thus minimise ethical/environmental impact while still eating healthy? I've never once gotten a response BECAUSE MEATFAGS DON'T HAVE ONE.

>>42781854
cringe

>>42781793
Boy I was trying to help you >>42777426
Why you gotta do me dirty like that

>>42777252
>driven by money
no its not. Its held together by government subsidies and welfare. That shit went bankrupt in 1940s but you'd never know it since the government also shills and pays their way.
They throw away more milk than us used every single year. Food subsidies need to be done away with

>>42781854
this is the meat-eating version of the vegan attitude

To deny one's self of meat is to pretty much ignore all of culinary history. How am I supposed to enjoy the good life without filet mignon? Peking duck? Sushi? Any and all baked goods?
I'm being completely serious by the way.

>>42781880
I keep asking why you aren't pushing pro life in you community to minimize the ethical damage caused by abortion.

desu i might be inclined to give it a go if it didn't seem like such a pain in the arse to avoid animal products. that shit is in everything. i reckon i could do vegetarian

also my aunt went vegan for a bit and got really sick because of a lack of vitamin b or some shit, i assume that was her being retarded though

>>42781886
>if I comment cringe more people will go vegan
Sorry, your smarm does nothing. DOWN WITH THE VEGAN AGENDA.

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>>42781892
>Expecting sympathy from a bourgeoisie vegan

>>42781880
https://youtu.be/mjmV8BlsJTQ

>>42781880
It's healthy but you won't be a bodybuilder anytime soon
Otter mode is about what you can get, which is pretty good I guess cause you got access to all that vegan pussy

>>42781902
Ironically it seems like being vegan is extravagant. Especially since many prefer to eat fake meat instead of a more natural diet. Like what's the fucking point? Tricking your body with fake food? It's in some way admitting the cave man part of us craves meat.

>>42781922
It's not healthy at all.
Humans are not meant to subsist on a plant based diet. You will lose out on a ton of nutrients and amino acids.
Further more, more than 90% of vegans/vegetarians resume an omnivore diet.
Less than 3% of the population is able to maintain a vegan diet.

>>42781880
>Expecting logical consistency from "straight" "men" who claim vegans are fags, then proceed to stuff their own faces with phallic shaped literal meat and enjoy the taste and ask for more and gladly pay money to have someone's phallic shaped meat in their mouth, and then organizer gatherings on Sundays where dozens father in the same location and roast lots of phallic shaped meat and put it in all their mouths
Where was I
Oh yeah lentils are gay kids, hummus and spinach are too.
>Eat meat Bobby, put it in your mouth like your father unironically and enjoyably does in front of you... Oh god that pig meat is delicious mmm I'm so straight I could fuck Matt Kroc now oh yes mmm eat the phallic shaped meat daddy gives you
>And make sure to swallow, don't spit the meat out... Swallow it whole like the little meat slut you are
Fucking degenerates

>>42781937
>Quinoa from Peru
>Peanuts from America
>Beans from Central America
>Lentils from South Asia


>Veganism is totally natural you guys

>>42781892
Ayyy was clicking too fast, I take it back
Falafel with hummus and chill? No homo
>>42781937
Fucking lol

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>>42781950
Fun fact about the quinoa part, I used to live in the mountains down there when the hipsters discovered quinoa, since then it's been a fuckload more expensive for the natives there since they started shipping almost all of it out of the country, forcing even more people to eat meat instead of the quinoa.


So good job vegans, your expensive addiction has done zilch for the animals of the world.

>>42781739
Whatever gives you the impression I want to eliminate suffering?

>>42781937
He could eat multivitamin gummies then

>>42777426
>It's because they make slave owners seem like the anti-christ for living their lives
>I don't care what you eat or how you live your life but you should insult and demerit others life choices
>You people need to grow up

>>42781935
i have no idea why you quoted me and everything you said made you sound like a massive queer

i just think veganism sounds like a bit too much faff

>>42781991
Acknowledge: >>42781967

>>42781991
Oh shit I realized there was a typo lol

The brand of veggie burger and tempeh in that picture are cheap and tasty as fuck. I'd recommend it even to meat eaters for a high protein meal especially for cutting.

Too bad you can't say this without everyone blowing up and getting defensive. So it goes.

>>42781979
Your moralistic argument

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>>42781935

>>42782075
This doesn't quite work though.
>You like movies?
>Yes.
>Then why don't you go do the real thing?

Entertainment is not sustenance and vice versa, try again though sweaty

>>42782075
Ah another pro lifer I see!

>>42782075
If meat is murder, then abortion is also murder. Neither has a voice or consent.
Are you taking this moral high ground with your own community which is not pro life?

>>42781935
That's not even the point of fake meat. It's a terrible misnomer and awful marketing in my view. It's usually a mix of pea protein and certain veggies for taste. The idea is that it is a substitute for a dish that is generally a good idea, say a burger with a mix of savory ingredients between two buns, with this protein in its place. It's not "fake" by any means. But it does certainly replace most important vitamins and minerals and some of the new recipes they are coming out with are fucking great.

Even as a meat eater, your choices of tasty, nutritional food keep on opening. I don't see what the big deal is. I understand some vegans are cunts, but come on now.

>>42782151
Millions upon Millions of impoverished people require meat in their diet because they can't afford the vegan lifestyle, it's kind of fucked how much meat we need to feed our race but that's the mess we're in at the moment.

What's right and what we have to do isn't always the same, sadly.

You can moralfag all you want, it won't change the fact that the majority of the population require meat to survive, that being said I think we should be as humane as possible in the process.

>>42782098
You missed the point
>>42782114
What does that have to do with me proving the other guy an idiot
>>42782151
Same as ^

>>42776607
people live for validation and it's been a meme for a while now that vegans are laughable

>>42782191
So you don't care about animals, just proving someone's an idiot?
I guess that just goes to show vegans/vegetarians don't care about health/ethics/environment and only care about controlling and manipulating people.

>>42782230
That would explain why she hasn't refuted any of my points.

>>42782230
>So you don't care about animals
Where did you infer that from anon? I can call you an idiot right now, that doesn't mean I don't care for animals

>>42782243
She fell for the jocks r dumb meme.

>>42782256
So then you are pro life?

She's checking Reddit to see how to answer.

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>>42782292

>>42782270
Yes, and? You should still opt for healthy and wholesome meals like lentil chili, chickpea curry, bean burritos, falafel wraps etc

>>42776607
Because nobody likes pretentious people

>>42782328
Not if you can't afford it.

>>42782328
We'll the vegan community is largely pro choice. Why are you policing here when your community doesn't place equal values on life?
If you don't clean your own home how can you come to ours?
If a fetus is a living being and has less value than a chicken, you are not being moralistically consistent.
I also see you want to try to switch hers back to the health arguments.
The health argument doesn't work for vegans,neither does the moral argument.
If you want to eat a plant based diet knock yourself out.
But stop being a little fascist trying to bully people into your way of life because of feelings.

>>42782364
It's the only way they're empty hearts can feel fulfilled, they want people to notice that they're "morally in the right" so they go out and start shit.

>>42782328
>>42782364
You are all retarded and massively insecure.

>>42776607

Because it's a bad meme like banana man that ruined /b/ YLYL threads

Sure a few pretentious faggots like going on about it ad-nauseum but everyone else wishes that you'd drop dead

>>42782407
That isn't an argument.

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>>42782407
...said the vegan

>>42777252
is this satire?

>>42782431
No said the omnivore who thinks you're a petty cunt arguing over trivial life choices. Don't even say "but they started it" either.

>>42782553
Nigga did I just catch you taking a shitpost seriously?

Lurk some more.

>>42776607
Tell someone he is an idiot because his opinion is not well thought and he will hate you. Thats pretty much all.

Also most people can't accept if they are wrong .

It's very hard to take vegans seriously when they ignore all the other suffering they're causing simply by participating in modern, developed societies. They drive cars, use electricity, buy cheap electronics and clothing etc, all things we can do because people elsewhere are suffering in some way. What's that, you spent $500 on an iphone? That could have helped people in Africa get clean water, don't you care about their suffering?

Fact is we're all assholes causing real human suffering every day simply by existing and propagating the culture around us, so the fact that you've decided to prevent some hypothetical animal suffering (we don't even know to what extent animals are actually sentient and capable of "suffering") isn't actually all that impressive.

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>>42782784
So doing something wrong is an excuse to do more wrong? Are you a child?

>we don't even know to what extent animals are actually sentient and capable of "suffering"

i cant argue with that stupidity..

>>42782848
Ok so you'll be working with vegan communities on becoming pro life? Comeback when you've cleaned up your own house before telling us how to live in ours.

>>42782912
>pro life

and what are you working on? Anti life?

What would you do if a child does wrong? Tell that child you cant educated it because you do wrong yourself?

>>42782848
>So doing something wrong is an excuse to do more wrong? Are you a child?
Where was I attempting to excuse anything? I'm simply claiming that vegan moral superiority is highly exaggerated.
>i cant argue with that
No, you can't.

>>42782948
>It's very hard to take vegans seriously when they ignore all the other suffering they're causing simply by participating in modern, developed societies. They drive cars, use electricity, buy cheap electronics and clothing etc, all things we can do because people elsewhere are suffering in some way. What's that, you spent $500 on an iphone? That could have helped people in Africa get clean water, don't you care about their suffering?

>>42782939
So then you view people who don't believe he same as you as being children?
You also believe that you can go into any community you wish and dictate your morality without cause?
Why should your morality be treated as superior here?
I believe animals are here as a source of energy to fuel my body. I hunt, I cook the majority of my own food. I am very close to my food sources.
You just want to dictate how people ought to live because you're a little controlling piece of shit. You don't really care about the suffering of animals or ecology, if you did you wouldn't use a computer as the production of plastics kill huge numbers of animals each year.

>>42782939
Fuck off little fascist. Go take your authoritarian bullshit elsewhere.

>>42782979
what did you mean by this?

>>42783015
He means that you're naturalistic fallacy is bullshit.

>>42783052
So progressive

>>42783033
What on earth does the naturalistic fallacy have to do with it?

>>42783067
It means that you place more value on an animals life than a humans. Or on richer humans rather than poorer ones.
You will spend $500 on an iPhone instead of improving the quality of life for a starving human while complaining that people shouldn't eat meat because it's mean to animals.

Is OP one of those mythical tumblr/4chan posters i've heard so much about?

>>42783106
Yep

>>42782989

>So then you view people who don't believe he same as you as being children?

I don't believe, I think. I view stubborn people as children, specially if they have no real arguments with logic when they argue.

>You also believe that you can go into any community you wish and dictate your morality without cause?

no I dont believe that. Also most vegans dont dictate, they try their best to make you understand why your view of the world is flawed today.

>Why should your morality be treated as superior here?

its not my morality, its the one humanity has build up.

>I believe animals are here as a source of energy to fuel my body. I hunt, I cook the majority of my own food. I am very close to my food sources.

Great, but you do realise that veganism is not about going against people like you. Its more about developed countries eating meat in high quantities, produced from animals which suffer their whole life in conditions you would never wish to your worst enemy, just because it makes meat cheaper. There is a lot wrong to the world of today, its not how it used to be. We dont hunt our pray, we go the grocery store to buy products, not animal meat. Cooks of today dont even call it meat anymore, its now protein to them. We are completly disconnected from animal foods and the sad part is that we dont need animal foods in developed countries, we dont have to hunt to survive.

>You just want to dictate how people ought to live because you're a little controlling piece of shit.......

No, I don't care how people live.. I just care if something innocent has to suffer under your inferior aged views. I also care for this planet.

Yes, you are right. Animals and humans have to suffer because of how I live my life, but for gods sake at least I try my best to minimize that suffering with removing everything I can, unfortunatelyI need to work on my pc to make that happen.

>>42783083
Well yeah, that was partially what I was trying to say, his post was just a direct quote of what I said as if to make some kind of point, but I don't know what it was.

>>42783129
We'll then minimize mbe suffering and fuck off with your empty platitudes.

>>42783129
Who made you an authority On who's views are and are not flawed?

>>42783154
Logic

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>>42783129
Can't help you STILL haven't acknowledged:
>>42781967
Or
>>42782173

Really makes you think

>>42783166
I pay around 25€ a week for food, so i don't know what vegan diet you are talking about.

>>42783166
also most plant food is consumed by caged animals. Consider this aswell, 97% of animals on this earth come from farms.

>>42783210
Cockatiels have cloacas instead of normal reproductive organs.

Oh i'm sorry I thought we were both listing information irrelevant to the conversation.

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>>42783181

>>42782230
>I guess that just goes to show vegans/vegetarians don't care about health/ethics/environment and only care about controlling and manipulating people

This is also why vegans lie about the nutritional importance of meat, and why, when they tell the lie often enough that they believe it themselves, they take so much pleasure in the idea of meat-eaters dying from udder pus or whatever.

>>42781793
kek

>>42783240
>grains and legumes are expensive

The entire idea of humans being morally responsible to non humans is retarded on the extreme and anyone who espouses it deserves to be ignored and shouldn't be unemployed because they evidently can not accomplish simple logical tasks.

There is no inherent universal negativness to suffering. Itcis our experience of suffering as humans and our social contract with one another that makes human suffering bad. Animals, particularly those we eat, have no social relationship with humans. Their suffering is an absolute non concern. Their is no hypocrisy whatsoever in saying it is amoral to eat dogs but fine to eat cows. Dogs have a social role in our society. Cows don't

You're retards

>>42782407
>>You should be eating more lentils
>You're retarded
Ok

>>42782343
>I can't afford legumes
Get a job
>>42782364
>Unrelated jargon to the conversation to get more replies
>Blah blah blah
>Don't tell me to replace meat with legumes, you're bullying me (my feelings are hurt)
Literally >>42776920

>>42776607
>hey guys I'm totally superior to you and have moral high ground :)
>w-why are you mean to me? :(
Because you're a genetic failure who puts animals before humans

>>42776665
I know this is the wrong place to ask but where's her nudes?

>>42781765
I would do that too if i had a hunting license. Youre the man my dude, hunting is the most natural way of getting food after gathering and proposes no further harm to animals than nature does

Post good vegan recipes.

>>42776793
I'm with you bro.
t. child molester (don't judge me)

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>>42776607
Because vegans are smug virtue signalers.

Also because they invariably go a bit 'odd' after a few years, as the lack or omega 3 fats, digestible protein, vitamin B12 and digestible minerals takes its toll.

>>42777252

Milk is for baby mammals. And you sir, are a baby mammal.

>>42786696
I was lazy today so for breakfast I literally just opened two cans of baked beans, tossed them in a bowl, opened a can of lentils, rinsed, tossed them in the bowl too, and ate
900 kcal, 55 g protons

>>42777252

> driven by money

PETA

>>42786892
>baked beans
They look disgusting but I heard they help with shits. Is that true?

>>42781039
jesus christ you actually expect someone to sift through that autistic word vomit?

>>42786892
Do you eat the beans pure?

>>42776607
the reason i hate vegans is they have a toxic sense of moral superiority, more so than any other group of people i know. only vegans have ever made video's shaming people who don't follow their cult.

>>42777252
i agree that dairy is shitty but its great for gains if you dont over do it, depending on your sensitivity to it. i am prone to acne if i drink anything more than one cup of milk a day.

Nothing that much against vegan foods as such but I like to have a choice of everything.

>>42776607
Because you act like self righteous assholes. I'm gonna eat meat, fucking stop me. Just had a bowl of chicken, rice and broccoli. Gonna have more for lunch tomorrow. The problem with vegans is you can't mind your own business and feel the need to tell others how to eat. If I wanted to be vegan I would be. When we say leave people the fuck alone, you vegans go "well leave the animals alone durr." No, leave people...the...the fuck...alone. That's what people have against vegans. You will never stop people from eating meat. Not gonna happen.

>>42781122
Did you just post blogs and listicles as evidence?

Because it's not immoral to kill animals. fight me bruh.

>>42787136
>it's not immoral to kill living beings

>>42787207
you're killing billions of living beings at this moment. Literal hitler

>>42787214
>Literal a saint
Ok?
Also im not killing them because I want to.

>>42787300
No, you can end this.

>>42787327
It's not even the same. Changing your diet is not the same as killing your self. Dumb idiot.

>>42787347
If you claim to be a moral person how can you overlook the billions of living beings that die because of you?

>>42787354
Because my morality is different to your morality.

>>42787372
Then you can't claim non-vegans are inherently immoral and it's just your subjective irrational opinion that they are.

lmao vegans

>>42787375
I'm not a vegan.

>>42787354
I eat meat too. Just not every day. Your arguments are still shit.

>>42776607
>>42776609
I haven't seen such an obvious samefag since /pol/ got IDs

>>42787008
They taste fucking amazing, have tons of protein (good for gains) and tons of fiber (great for shits)
>>42787024
I eat the beans straight off the can because they have sauce, and I eat the lentils after rinsing them because they are floating in fartbrine. If you want you can add some Tabasco, salt and pepper to the baked beans but it was morning so I wanted a mild taste
If it's another type of beans (most common is kidney), I rinse them too.

>>42776609
>Act like you are a pillar of morality
>Shove your lifestyle down other people's throats at every chance you get
>T-T-They're bashing us! W-We dindu nuffin

>>42787848
Can you recommend any beans? Do you buy the white ones?

Vegans are very good at making other people not want to be anything like them.

>>42788293
This belongs on a chink thread, not here

>>42787939
Totally agree, most are cringe worthy sops.
I've stopped eating milk & dairy this year but couldn't care less what other people eat

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>>42776609
>Immoral

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>>42777252
>drinking soy milk

I realy hope other males don't do this.

>>42787924
Best in terms of taste or protein content are lentils, kidney beans, black beans, white beans, peas and chickpeas. Green beans suck (unless you're obese and need to lose 100 lbs yesterday) and brown beans (i think you call them pinto beans over there) have very low protein and the taste and texture is like dirt.
Corn is a grain, so it's lower in protein, but it completes the bean amino acid profile, compliments the flavor and gives a nice "bite" to the dish.

>>42776607
>Vegans live six to ten years longer than the average meat eaters and their risk of heart disease is two times lower than for the average meat eater.
>>42781075
>>42787013
You mean do I expect you to do some basic reading of science you don't even have to look up and a paragraph, sure.
>>42787125
Did you not read?

>>42781848
You didn't even understand your own retarded strawman comic.
How are those brain defects going for you?

>>42788293
Perfectly humane way of slaughtering your food.

>>42783181
hello mr calcium baron

>>42788723
>being this uneducated
sad
Anyway, 1 euro buys you about 600 kcal of vegan food with about 30 g protein in cooked beans or 3400 kcal and 170g protein in pasta, so your argument is shit

>>42787347
Going Vegan does condemn yourself to an evolutionarily inappropriate and nutritionally inadequate diet, though. And it's one that apparently turns you into a preachy asshole.

Ok vegans, ive given your shit diet a try but im lacking protein still
So question:
Can i supplement with BCAA and get my daily protein intake or am i just fucked?
>inb4 vegan protein powder
Ordering it now

>>42776607
Who cares? Vegans and vegetarians live like 5-15 years longer

>>42790440
What exactly is the question? If vegan protein powder is ok or if it's ok to finish that tub of bcaa you had laying around? In both cases, the answer is yes

>>42776607
>any scientists and professional athletes are vegans.

Lies. Many are vegetarians, not vegans. Very few people are vegan, and its usually not the intelligent ones.

>>42787008
I eat beans 1-5 times a week I shit like 3-4 times a day

>>42790489
>What exactly is the question?
According to my diet planner im lacking around 150g of protein a day despite eating 3-4 meals a day and im having to eat extra just to get my calories
Ive lost 1kg already and its only been a week and my goal is to gain weight, not lose it(was 87kg, want to get to 93kg)

>>42790556
What are you eating, post mfp/cronometer screenshot
"4 meals" means nothing. I want to see exact quantities, exact ingredients and macro breakdowns
Also, if cutting: Lots of lentils and tempeh stir frys, if bulking: lots of pb on everything

>>42776607
Lmao there have been 2 earthquakes, multiple hurricanes, the US literally being on fire, riots, nuke threats and all your concerned about is (((muh veganism)))

Get out and stay out

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Meat eater here. I've been been wanting to go vegan for a while, but it seems like the only viable source of dense vegan protein to make gains is soy, which is proven to lower testosterone production. Not to mention meat and eggs are super dense in nutrients that fuel T production. Is there any way to make gains vegan without lowering my testosterone?
>inb4 roids
>inb4 soy doesn't lower test

>>42790440
>lacking protein still
Beans, CHIA SEEDS, Quinoa, Lentils, Tempeh and Hemp Seeds

>>42776607
Literally brain damaged. Our brains evolved because we cool meat to fuel its ability to grow. Now you want to take away your brains fuel source because some false sense of morality (You still end up using Animal products one way or another). Literally going against thousands of years of evolution and going to give yourself brain damage from nutrient deficiency and will continue the retard cycle. There's so many ways to actually help the environment, thinking going vegan will do anything is just lazy bullshit. you have to go out and actually work to save animals, I doubt you'll actually even bother

>>42790585
Yeah it's almost like the CO2/methane that's being produced by cows/other animals, slaughter houses, packaging, and transporting is contributing to global warming. It's almost like it's unsubstantiatable for a society this large.

>>42790455
They actually don't. They get those results because in those studies they compared people who actually pay attention to what they eat vs. People who eat whatever. No fucking shit people who pay attention to what they eat live longer. If they truly wanted to try to compare that stat they'd compare a vegan to a meat eater that actually pays attention to what they eat; like comparing two athletes who watch their diet, but one is vegan. But again you'd need to reproduce this effect with a decent sample size.

>>42790579
>What are you eating, post mfp/cronometer screenshot
Im eating lots of beans, broccoli, quinoa, oats, spinach, kale and basically everything i know has protein in it.
Still missing and lots of protein though

Like right now im making dinner and ill be cooking a quinoa sallad with broccoli and chicpea pattys and a green spinach sallad.

Maybe im doing it wrong but so far this diet is very hard to maintain because i need to double my food intake from before basically to maintain the same level of calorie intake

Also im putting olive oil on everything i can justify

>>42790602
Doing it, still missing alot

>>42790601
>it seems like the only viable source of dense vegan protein to make gains is soy
1) Sorry for sounding condescending, but you're wrong. Legumes should be your main go-to every day as a vegan lifter, and they are like ~30-40% protein (by calories)
2) If you want to supplement that much, pea protein isolate is cheaper than either soy isolate or whey isolate/concentrate even when adjusted for dicestibility and amino acid profile and quantity of protein. Also, unlike whey and soy, it has not been linked to cancer (whey and soy are extremely insulinogenic)
>soy is proven to lower testosterone production
It's not though
>Not to mention meat and eggs are super dense in nutrients that fuel T production
Your body makes enough cholesterol on its own, if you eat more all you do is help clog your arteries.
>Is there any way to make gains vegan without lowering my testosterone?
Yes, don't be a raw fruit or high carb hippie, learn to love beans and you'll thrive
>inb4 soy doesn't lower test
Well shit you got me. Proof?

Edit: yay, new captchas. I got a tripod just now.

>>42790672
>>post exact amounts
>[doesn't even post rough estimates, just posts a list]
ok man

>>42790644
So lets destroy more land to make room for the whole world going vegan...that'll help it. My god

>>42790733
>Implying cows photosynthesize

>>42790601
Dude there are litterally sooooo many other options for protein in a vegan diets and a lot of non vegan things you eat have soy components in them anyway...
I'm nit completley vegan but i dont consume meat or dairy products and the only fish i ever eat is salmon (fucking delicious)...i'm not that big in my opinion but a few days ago someone approached me and asked me how i got this big neing vegan (so i guess i might actualley be kind of big)...also i serve in an elite unit in the army amd although it has been rough, I manage, and I'm actualley one of the fittest and strongest guys in my company...

>>42790691
3dl quinoa
150g of broccoli
100g of green spinach
and ~100g of chicpeas

Some olive oil as well but thats my current meal and so far today im lacking 120g of protein and i got one more meal planned

>>42790887
LOL, what? This is 40kg female tier
Ok, here is what I had/am having later today, to give you an idea
Breakfast:
600 g baked beans
250 g lentils
Total: 900 kcal, 55g protein
Lunch
Premade pumpkin and sweet potato soup
450 g brown beans
tbsp of PB
Total: 900 kcal, 45 g protein
Dinner:
500 g soy yogurt, sweetened
1/8 kg pasta (measured raw)
1/12 kg soy mince
some marinara sauce
Total: 700 kcal, 50g protein

Total total: 2500 kcal, 150 g protein

>>42790777
This had nothing to do with my post

>>42790995
Let me make it easier to understand
What do cows eat?
Good. Where does that grow? Doesn't it take up space? Doesn't it make sense to eat 1 kcal of grains or beans, instead of using up 10x the space to create 10x the kcal to get just 1 kcal of cow?
>b-but grass fed tho
Do you think grass fed is even remotely sustainable with the current meat consumption rates, especially after factoring in that grass has way less calories per m^2 compared to grains?

>>42790946
Thats one meal, friend
Im eating 2 of those a day so i think it should be enough but im going back to the well of "Not getting enough"
Guess its a quantity issue then really, right?

>>42791043
>Thats one meal, friend
Even if you compare your "one meal" to one of my meals, you'll see that you're way too low on legumes.
>Guess its a quantity issue then really, right?
Short answer: It's a management issue. Eat more pb if you cant stomach more legumes. High protein, high calories.
Long answer: It's a quantity AND a food selection issue. Quinoa is a meme overpriced food that does the same thing whole wheat pasta and oats do, except it's fancy and gluten free. Gluten is protein btw.
Also, don't be afraid of soymilk or tempeh. Even if you've fallen for the phytoestrogen meme, tempeh is fermented so that's moot. You should be eating it by the kilo.

Because these fucking vegans don't have the guts to be honest and admit straight up that they follow the diet because they believe it to be ethical. They need to pollute the internet with anti-science and left-wing extremism while shouting down normal people as murderers. The reason to hate vegans is no different than the reason to hate the gender constructionists or eco-terrorists. They are ideological zealots trying to hijack science for their causes.

Just look at the reaction to Layne Norton's rebuttal to a vegan propaganda video. No scientific debate, no logic, just an army of screeching soy eating morons trying to trash his reputation because his phd funding came from the dairy industry.

Veganism isn't natural, it isn't conducive to our optimal digestive health, it isn't aligned with the foods our guts evolved to eat, it leads to nutrient deficiencies and vegans insist on conflating all omnivores with the average junk-food eating American while pretending that European and Japanese meat/fish based diets don't exist. It's intellectually dishonest and dangerous especially when children and pets are involved .

>>42790733
>destroy more land
You dont have to, just replace half of the cow land with plants. You can feed more people with less space.

>>42776607
Veganism is death

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YjfZQ9skUTw

>>42791557

More accuratetly, fruitarianism

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>>42791178

>anti-science

I would argue the other side is being anti-science in its denial of veganism.

To argue in favor of a vegan diet from a health perspective is very easy, as it has a lot in common with other recognized "healthy diets" and is itself seen as healthy if you talk to someone who's thinking rationally and doesn't just have a chip on their shoulder.

Vegans don't have to make up things about meat and dairy leading to increased heart disease or cancer risk. That's mainstream science. When one tells you that steak cooked in butter is not a healthy dinner, that's not a baseless or fringe claim. On the other hand, to deny the health argument of vegans almost requires you to adopt fringe beliefs yourself, because any mainstream "healthy diet" you could compare it to in order to explain what a healthy diet looks like, is very similar to a vegan diet anyway.

I think this is why the most outspoken anti-vegan people also believe other crazy things like saturated fat and cholesterol are good for you, whole grains cause heart disease, fruits are bad for you, etc. It's the only way you can believe a vegan diet is bad; if your whole understanding of diet is wrong.

>>42791178

>Just look at the reaction to Layne Norton's rebuttal to a vegan propaganda video. No scientific debate, no logic, just an army of screeching soy eating morons trying to trash his reputation because his phd funding came from the dairy industry.

VG made a 3 hour long point by point response

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kz-VmAzMsKw

>>42791178
>Layne Norton's rebuttal to a vegan propaganda video
What are his qualifications again? Is he a medical doctor or a registered dietitian?

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>>42791809
>I would argue the other side is being anti-science in its denial of veganism.
>>42781122
>Vegans don't have to make up things about meat and dairy leading to increased heart disease or cancer risk. That's mainstream science.
>I think this is why the most outspoken anti-vegan people also believe other crazy things like saturated fat and cholesterol are good for you
>>42781039
>>42781075

>>42792738

You've had this pointed out to you many times before, but I might as well do it again in this thread.

Your image is from the report of the dietary guidelines committee that writes a summary of evidence on which the US dietary guidelines can later be based. For one, I don't know why you would cite this report just to try to defend cholesterol when the rest of it summarized saturated fat and red meat as harmful and listed a vegetarian diet among its 3 recommended healthy eating plans, but as for the claim of cholesterol not being a nutrient of concern, this was based on a misquoting of an American Heart Association report that said, when summarizing only the most recent cholesterol feeding experiments, that there was insufficient data to create a formula for its impact like they were able to do with saturated fat and trans fats, and they asked for more research to be conducted. The final published dietary guidelines cleared this up

https://health.gov/dietaryguidelines/2015/guidelines/chapter-1/a-closer-look-inside-healthy-eating-patterns/#other-components

>The Key Recommendation from the 2010 Dietary Guidelines to limit consumption of dietary cholesterol to 300 mg per day is not included in the 2015 edition, but this change does not suggest that dietary cholesterol is no longer important to consider when building healthy eating patterns. As recommended by the IOM,[24] individuals should eat as little dietary cholesterol as possible while consuming a healthy eating pattern.

>>42792925
>we learned that there's no point in limiting cholesterol and we no longer recommend limiting cholesterol, but it's humiliating to have to walk this back so please continue to limit cholesterol

>>42792962

>the scientists are just too EMBARASSED to admit they were wrong

Yeah, that makes sense. If there's one thing we know about scientists, it's that they hate testing things and making new discoveries.

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>>42776607
Maybe it isn't the lifestyle, maybe it's the people living it
have ya ever tried doing that whole "shutting the fuck up about it " yet?