Plant Based Diet

no meat, no milk, no eggs for 6 months now.
I honestly just did it for the health benefits, and i feel really good. My bloods are better, and this diet really isnt that hard.

Some people will call you a pussy for not eating meat, but most logical people will agree that at the very least, its a good idea to lessen their meat intake considerably, especially given the absolute SHIT-tier quality of meat that we get here in the states.

>>42693216
That's what I've been finding... people who do it are reversing adverse health effects, losing weight, everything.

I was hoping it wasn't that hard to follow - with all the nutrition information out there I suppose it wouldn't be. Probably tastes better too.

>>42693186

>promoting malnutrition on a health and fitness board

>>42693186

I stopped eating meat as frequently, and when I do it's only after lifting. I still eat yogurt and eggs and feel legitimately better with eggs in my diet than without them, so they're there to stay.

Most people don't eat enough vedge and if a vegan diet is how to get there, then vegan diet for you it is.

>>42693262
How exactly is stuffing dead flesh pumped with antibiotics, steroids, and other chemicals "nutrition?"

>>42693186
Whenever someone asks me how I know that homosexuality is a choice, I'll just point them to this post.

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desu the majority of my diet is plants but i can't get past the common sense meme arguments for eating meat.

>go to woods
>eat random plant
>50/50 get sick or die
VERSUS
>eat random mammal or bird
>almost certainly fine

i really don't believe pretty much every culture on earth would eat meat if it were unhealthy. that said i eat a lot less now, probably 2-2.5 servings of high quality beef/fish/chicken per day

>>42693464
i used to think i could easily survive on a diet of dairy/eggs/fish and no other meats, but these days eating a few servings of really nice beef per week seems to make my body function really well. or feel like it

>>42693464
I eat about 3 serving of meat a week, yogurt (including greek/middle eastern sauces) 4 times a week and cheese on occasion. This seems to work best for me

>>42693464
>eat random mammal or bird
because its definitely that easy to just catch and eat an animal an animal in the wild

>>42693290
Vitamin bs which are only found in meat sources. I guess they aren't too useful since they only support the function of your brain.

you're weak and you're going to become weaker
eat everything in moderation, if you still feel the need to go full retard then go pescatarian

>>42693514
http://www.vibrancyuk.com/B12.html

>>42693703
not that guy, but thanks brah. good read

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are there any good sites to learn about real nutritional information? all the ones i come across promote meme diets like veganism/weston a price (maybe not a meme but seems sort of excessive)/paleo/keto etc. rather than just giving helpful information for a well-rounded normal diet

>>42693808
Considering most of the "official" agencies like the American Heart Association, etc are all sponsored by The American Dairy Association.... good luck finding anything that isn't heavily manipulated for the sake of big business.

>>42693890
the fucked up food regulations/lobbying and overall shitty quality food in our country is one of the main reasons i'm jealous of certain western euros. unless you can afford high quality foods in the US it seems like you're kind of fucked. we've got to work on it t.b.h.

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>what the health

>>42693947
>unless you can afford high quality foods
Honestly, the answer to this problem for me is actually just eating less meat.
High quality organic meats are more expensive then shittier 2lb chicken breast but you just compensate by eating less of it.

Organic fruits and veggies are getting less expensive now that the whole concept is getting more mainstream. If you live anywhere that isnt poor as fuck, they'll be a trendy district with a fuckton of organic shops. Even Publix(chain in se US for middle class plps) has decent organic options.

Or just stop being poor, that works too.

>>42693947
It's partly why we... or mainly why we have so many health problems.

When you have major food companies and lobbyists brainwashing you into thinking you have to have to meat and dairy to be healthy.... well you have what we have no. The highest rates of heart disease, diabetes, and other health issues.

Instead of people educating themselves on the truth they'll take the word of Kraft Foods who promise it's perfectly ok... while shoveling a cheeseburger into their mouths.

Big Beef and Dairy will spend the money to make sure you blame everything under the sun for your obesity EXCEPT meat and dairy.

>>42694028
people arent fat because they eat meat and dairy you fucking mong. They're fat because they dont expend more energy than they consume.

I agree theres a ton of lobbyists in the government who work for major food companies and they feed us a ton of crap that should be banned.

But quit spouting your vegan bullshit all over the place.

I'm on day 3 of the plant based diet and my previous digestive issues have gone away. I would have constant indigestion and acid reflux and now it's pretty much gone.

I feel much better in general. I'll probably reintroduce meat at some point in the future but mostly likely only the highest quality I can get my hands on and use it for a stew.

Plant based diets are great so far.

>>42694071
>2017
>Still believes meat and dairy have nothing to do with making you fat.

lol.

do you guys who love plant-based diets eat good meat or are you cutting out like mcdonalds chicken nuggets? or something prepackaged from the grocery store?

i eat mostly plants but when i have some meat in my meals like some nice salmon or quality beef i usually feel pretty great

>>42694075
I'm on month 14 of the meat and eggs based diet and my previous digestive issues have gone away. I would have constant indigestion and acid reflux and now it's pretty much gone.

I feel much better in general. I'll probably never reintroduce vegetables/fruit.

Meat based diets are great so far.

Check out zerocarb. Great weight loss, great muscle building (with lifting), great sleep, great lipid panel.

>>42694252
why get so triggered over what another man eats? seems like a ridiculous waste of time when you step back and look. Be a man, not a bitch

>>42694500
I'm not the one buying veggie patties, tofu, and other artificial meats because I crave dead flesh.

>>42693186
i've been pulling benjamin button by switching to plant based diet
going 3 years now

>>42694531
neither am I? you didn't address any of what I said by the way

>>42693186
what the health is full of "alternative facts." I say that as a veterinarian who only animal products I eat are cheese and eggs and that is pretty rarely (praying for plant based eggs and cheese to be affordable). Don't tell people that you are a vegan over what the health theres like a 10 page article basically disproving the majority of it.

>>42693549
>eat everything in moderation
literally why?
do i have to eat junk food in moderation as well? should i smoke in moderation as well?

>>42693186
Been on a meatless diet for 8 years and feel pretty great. Family was concerned I'd be malnourished but I recently got a bunch of blood work done and apparently I'm in excellent health.

Would definitely recommend paying more attention to what you eat, though. Not just looking out for meat but also making sure you're getting enough iron and B12 in your diet as, admittedly, they are a bit harder to come by if you're not consuming meat.

>>42693464
I want you to do one of two things:

Go out and find another animal (bird, mammal, fish) and eat it. All of it excluding the bones. Eyes, ears, mouth, nose, and all other organs. See if you live

or you can go pick some berries or fruit and be perfectly fine.

>>42693186
If you make the effort to do your research and actually learn how to cook and plan meals, yeah, it's not a bad idea to go vegan.


Of course, like any semi-strict diet if you try and half ass it, it will wreck your ass.

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>>42693186
>I've seen nothing but positive results and no one who died or got sick from it.

Sounds convincing! Dude bruhs btfo! Who says veganism causes deficiencies in essential brain amino acids?

>>42694791
Why do you want him to all parts of an animal and not just the flesh?
You don't eat the bark, roots, etc if you pick berries, do you?

>>42693290
Because it's healthy

>he fell for the antiGMO meme

What a brainlet

>>42694791
Almost noone eats all of an animal, they tend to just eat the meat and skin, some eat the internals or the brain or the eyes but they don't get sick from it
Eating berries off strange plants has a higher chance to make you sick than almost any animal
Predator's liver is about the only exception considering the amount of vitamin A

>>42694954
>>42694945
He clearly said "Excluding" those part. refeering to only eating the meat... try to read.

>>42694936

>a diet causes a deficiency when you don't make sure to eat enough and eat varied foods

oi vey

I had iron, vit D and iodine deficiencies while eating dairy and meat. doesn't matter what you eat, you have to cover your bases

>>42694947

>GMO
I don't think you know what that word means. anyway eating meat stuffed with antibiotics is causing real problems, short and long term. this is so well documented I'm starting to wonder if this is bait.

>>42695312
Can you post the well documented studies please?

>>42693186
yeah, nutrition's bullshit, you can literally just eat ripe fruit and be perfectly nourished lol

the body only needs iron and simple sugars from food, all starches and fats break down to simple sugars, and iron attracts all else to it

>>42695276
>>>42694954
>>>42694945 (You)
>He clearly said "Excluding" those part. refeering to only eating the meat... try to read.
Guess what retard, he wrote all of it, excluding the bones. Better luck next time.
Now eat all parts of a tree excluding the roots.

>>42693186
been vegan 2 years now, is good

>>42693186

>falling for a documentary that even most vegans say is boogus

What do vegans think of fish?

>>42695604
Fish is an animal therefore off limits.

>>42694572
Sources or it didn't happen.

Money says the "researchers" and authors of those so called rebuttals are receiving funding from the beef and dairy industry.

>>42693216
>especially given the absolute SHIT-tier quality of meat that we get here in the states.
That brings up an interesting point, actually. The studies that show vegan/vegetarian diets have better health than meat-eaters in general, do any account for the quality of meat?

>>42694634
You might kill yourself in moderation as well

>>42693464

I don't see how that's an argument. Agirculture allows is to separate good plants from bad, domesticate them for best results, and mass produce them for plentiful availability. Same with animals.
Unless you're planning on living in the woods, I don't see how this is relevant. Sure it's fine as far as why we started eating meat, but it doesn't have anything to do with whether we should continue.

Also, you'd possibly still get sick from parasites, etc. Not to mention whether or not you're allowed to cook the meat in this scenario.

>>42693505
Easier than scavenging the same amount of calories through naturally growing plants.

>>42694791
Why the fuck would eating an animal's nose kill you if the rest of them wont? Because iz gwoss? We live in a world where bull testicles are a delicacy in some areas.
Organs can be dicey, sure. But you don't HAVE to eat them, that's a completely artificial limitation to insert into the comparison. And 'lel eat random berries in the woods, it'll be fine' is a really irresponsible position to hold, that's what killed that Into The Wild idiot.

>>42694634

Junk food is not a mystical new type of food, it's just regular food turned into shit.
A potato chip is derived from potatoes. Saying to eat potatoes in moderation is not the same as saying you should fry the shit out of them with fat and salt and eat that in moderation.

>>42693186
>Watches propaganda movie
>Falls for propaganda

Jesus anon, Jesus fucking christ. Hopefully you don't want some nazi propaganda and become a nazi because your to fucking stupid to think for yourself.

Anyways, enjoy your plant based diet. Nobody fucking cares what somebody else eats.

>>42697456
>Hopefully you don't want some nazi propaganda and become a nazi because your to fucking stupid to think for yourself.
Ah, it's fine, we'll just sit him down in front of Sound Of Music and he'll be right as rain again.

It can be good but if you do it wrong the results are devastating. I felt supreme when I first started doing it (about four and a half years ago) and my endurance was unmatched. I didn't really know about nutrition though and, combined with leaky gut syndrome (which I've always had), I slowly became deficient in a variety of things. My performance started getting worse, I started becoming more lethargic and training less, and just put it all down to depression or didn't think about it at all. I was fully anemic for about a year before I finally understood what the problem was. It sucks, and in many ways I feel like I lost a couple of years of my life because I felt so shit and became so anxious and depressed because of it. That's an exaggeration but it was a very bad time overall.

I blame it on myself for being ignorant, but the information just isn't clear enough. When you have leaky gut syndrome like I do, you can get ill so quickly because nutrients are leeched from your body. I've been doing better now, and know exactly what I'm doing but people need to be more careful desu.

>>42697321
Given that human beings aren't evolutionary designed to catch and eat prey should be a good indicator.

We don't have grasping claws, fangs for tearing flesh, speed to catch prey, sharp eye sight for spotting prey, and of those elements. Nor, do we have the digestive track designed to handle meat. Google the difference between the digestive system of a human and a bear, dog, cat, whatever (omnivorous animals).

The very fact you have to cook meat before eating it and pasteurize milk before drinking it - or you'll die - should be another huge red flag.

But, people don't care. They want their BBQ chicken and ribs. They want their bacon and eggs. Trying to open people's minds to an alternative eating style is a waste of time because you're up against generations of commercial indoctrination by the agriculture industry. For every study that shows an unbiased link between meat and bad health, Big Agra will ensure there are a hundred commercials and rebuttal studies telling you "Beef! It's what's for dinner!" And, there is no correlation between eating their shit and your bad health.

I mean the stats don't lie people. Those in plant based diets have an exponentially lower rate and risk of heart disease, diabetes, GERD, hypertension, and a myriad of other ailments. The numbers are clear.

But, they don't care. They buy into the lies about B12 and protein and every other falsehood pushed by profit driven companies and the so-called scientists they sponsor.

>>42697577
>The very fact you have to cook meat before eating it and pasteurize milk before drinking it - or you'll die - should be another huge red flag.

This is an argument for raw vegan diets only. You can't eat raw beans either, or raw grains, or whatever else vegans eat. In fact, I'd rather take my chances with a raw steak than with a bunch of raw beans.

>>42697577
>stats don't lie
>scientists are paid
Is this the vegan equivalent of the Jews?

>>42697615
That's complete BS. You CAN eat raw beans. They'll taste bad but they won't kill you. Cooking them is to adjust for taste and texture.

>>42697640
No, it's call to not be a fool. When you read an article take the extra time to research the scientist behind it. Who does he work for, where does he receive his funding, so on. Not all scientists are shills, you just have to make sure the information you're getting isn't bought and paid for.

>>42697668
So is this guy a bad scientist as well? https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23356638

>>42693808
This guy had some solid studies and ideas

https://www.westonaprice.org

>>42697701
Doesn't support my idea, so yes

>>42697701
You tell me. Where is the department of nutrition from East Carolina getting their funding? Where is this guy getting his grant money? Does he have ties to the Ag industry?

>Another fruitfag added to the list
Good, more meat for me

>>42694028
>dairy
>meat
>diabetes

wut

>>42697701
You think this is limited to just Oil and Gas?

https://www.texasobserver.org/at-universities-fracking-research-funded-by-oil-and-gas-companies/

>>42694791
>Go out and find another animal (bird, mammal, fish) and eat it. All of it excluding the bones. Eyes, ears, mouth, nose, and all other organs. See if you live

From what I understand this is actually very healthy for you--you create a stock or soup from the bones etc. for example fish head soup and people do eat many animal organs (liver, heart, kidneys, brains, adrenal glands, tripe, sweetbreads

>>42697760
Dunno man can you show me where his money is coming from ?

>>42697654
Lmao. You're delusional. Even just soaking them doesn't make them completely safe to eat, plenty of people get nasty reactions to them. Besides, what's the difference between soaking and cooking? Why is soaking totally natural and fine, whereas cooking apparently is unnatural and therefore bad for you?

Make a video of you eating 100g of raw, dry beans.

>>42697794
RAW. He's telling you go out and eat the whole animal RAW and see if you live.

>>42697810
You're a simpleton if you can't see the difference between eating a hand full of raw beans and a raw pork chop.

I'll do the beans if you eat three raw pork chops.

>>42697816
>>42697577
So is this raw business only limited to food? you don't mind the shitloads of processing that occurs to give modern lifestyle and medicine. Why are on the internet or using tools?

>>42697832
I'm not arguing that you should eat EITHER of them raw because I'm not a fucking retard.

>>42697857
Now you're just avoiding the main point.

>bruh muh meat

I said the fact you can't eat meat raw should be an indication you're not meant to eat it. YOU started babbleing your dude-bruh BS about "you can't eat beans raw either" - to which I corrected you.

Now you're just trolling.

>>42697888
No dumbass. You're arguing that meat must be bad for you because you have to cook it, and saying that this explains why vegans are healthier, live longer, and so on, despite the fact that vegans eat food that they have to cook as well, which by your logic should make their diets unhealthy.

I know all your shitty arguments, mate. I was a vegan for years and made the same dumb points. I barely even eat meat or animal products, so it's not like I'm a raging carnivore. I barely eat meat because I think plant food is generally better for you. I'm just pointing out that your argument is shit.

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plant based diet fixed a bunch of my shit. Acne cleared up. Depression and anxiety cleared up. Mood and motivation went through the roof after a couple weeks. I stay slim without counting calories. easy to bulk when I want- with beans nuts and seeds.

wfpb is easy mode for staying fit and healthy. Do recommend.

>>42697924
No genius. I'm saying meat is bad because it's full of carcinogens, fat, chemicals, and other BS. The data shows people who eat a meat based diet are far less healthy than those on a plant based diet.

Then someone brought up the fact you have to cook your meat before you eat it - to which I added to the OVER ALL set of reasons not to eat that shit.

Do you even read bruh?

>>42697950
> to which I added to the OVER ALL set of reasons not to eat that shit.

That's exactly the point I'm arguing against. Do you not understand how someone can take issue against an individual point in your argument?

>>42697888
>I said the fact you can't eat meat raw should be an indication you're not meant to eat it.
Humans can eat raw meat and raw meat is part of the cultural cuisine in some societies. I don't even know what you're talking about. Ever heard of sushi? Mett? Tartar?

The reason raw meat from a regular store cannot be consumed safely is because that meat is contaminated with bacteria, most of which originate in the intestinal tract of the slaughtered animals, which you can in fact not eat.

The meat of an animal that is butchered carefully and hygienically can be consumed raw. Industrially produced meat is not processed carefully BECAUSE consumers are expected to cook the meat.


You are also ignoring that there is a widespread consensus that humans evolved in tandem with cooking and that human physiology and anatomy cannot be understood without cooking. Hominins have been cooking for a very long time, anything from tubers, wild beans and vegetables to meat, organs and eggs.

>>42697888
>>42697924


The better argument is true carnivores don't develop atherosclerosis. You can feed carnivores a diet full of cholesterol and saturated fat for years- even thousands of times more lard than they'd normally get in their diet- and they won't develop any atherosclerosis. Same isn't true of humans. Or any other apes/monkeys that have been tested.

We cook vegetables to make more nutrients available (and for taste reasons)- we still get plenty of nutrients from raw vegetables and aren't at risk of contracting parasites and diseases that are normally living in plants (contamination comes from manure fertilizers). Meat, on the other hand, is cooked to kill parasites and harmful organisms that humans haven't evolved to handle. Again- dogs and cats are fine with raw meats- because they've evolved to handle the parasites, bacteria... etc.

>>42698089
Is anyone actually arguing that we are carnivores?

Reminder that eating meat allowed our ancestors to evolve large complex brains and that cooking and eating meat is natural and healthy.
>https://www.livescience.com/24875-meat-human-brain.html
>http://time.com/4252373/meat-eating-veganism-evolution/

>>42698301

Doesn't matter if people are arguing we're carnivores specifically. Anyone arguing humans have evolved to consume animal products regularly or semi-regularly (more than a serving or two per week) is ignoring the differences in outcome between species that have evolved to regularly consume animal meats- dogs, cats, rats and those that haven't- humans, non-human primates, pigs, and rabbits when fed large amounts of animal meats.

The best we've done as a species is collect some bacteria that breaks down animal products- and some of us even break down lactose. The metabolites of these bacteria are generally harmful- but not to the degree that would prevent a human infant from reaching sexual maturity and creating offspring.

>>42698536
We are indeed not carnivores, but also far from being herbivores. We cannot even digest cellulose. That is why a healthy, balanced diet can include vegetables and meat.
Otherwise, I fully agree that the meat industry is disgusting and harmful to us and the planet, but that means we have to change the industry, not stopping eating meat. I grew up in a small town where people raised their own animals and plants and there's nothing bad about that. Factory (processed) food, being that vegetables, fruit or meat is another topic.

>>42698882
>we cannot digest cellulose -> meat is healthy
I'm not following..
>>42698882
>there's nothing bad about that
t. expert on nutrition

>>42698954
">we cannot digest cellulose -> meat is healthy
I'm not following.."
B vit deficiency much?
How about:
Since we cannot be either totally herbi- or carnivores, we could be eating a diet containing both groups of food sources.
Otherwise please tell me what is wrong with a portion home raised (branded organic and free range in some places) and butchered chicken breast grilled with some rice and broccoli and tomatoes. I hope it's not going to clog my arteries.

>>42699024

>we cannot be either totally herbi- or carnivores
Why say something so obviously not true? Some communities live carnivorously, like the inuit. They survive alright but have relatively short lives. Some communities live herbivorously, like the Californian seventh day adventists. They have the longest life expectancy in the world.

>>42699132
Shhhhh

We don't want facts getting in the way of

>muh bacon and eggs

>>42699132
They aren't vegans however.
They are relatively active, normal height, eat modestly if little, have strict spritual lives, have low stress levels, and eat both plant and animals.

There is no such thing as a long lived strict vegan society on any corner of the globe.

Just tiny little groups of mentally fucked up people.

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>>42699202
Not true. Almost half do not eat meat.

>>42699202

A large portion of them are, and they may be even better off.
>yeah but they exercise and--
Stop moving the goalposts. Think before you say things.

>>42699245
Animal products like milk and cheese aren't vegan anon.

Red Meat Kills:

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2016/05/160505140057.htm

Disease Higher in Meat Eaters:

http://m.ajcn.nutrition.org/content/70/3/516s.full

Dairy Linked to Cancer:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2715202/

Meat and Dairy are NOT healthy. Keep falling for the meme and die before you're 60.

>>42699272
There's no goal post to move anon. And I never said exercise. I said physically active.

You can't claim that veganism makes people immortal but completely ignore everything else that makes it actually work.

There are 100% sedentary clinically obese vegans(meaning no meat or animal byproducts) who're a twinkie away from a fucking heart attack.

What about them?

>>42699288
So then you're not arguing we need meat, you're arguing we need some sort of animal derived food. Well part of the vegetarian population are in fact vegan. Apparently you can live herbivorously. You were wrong.

>>42699132
>>42699202
>>42699154
>facts
I hope you realize the Seventh Day Adventists have a fundamental religious belief that meat and/or animal products are unhealthy and that medical science should be infiltrated to promote that belief ("Medical Evangelism"). Unsurprisingly, the studies about the health of the Seventh Day Adventists come from the Seventh Day Adventists. SDAs also co-founded the American Dietetics Association, which continues to be a propaganda mouthpiece for vegans to this days (e.g. vegans writing statement that veganism is healthy and safe, peer-reviewed by vegans and published in their own little journal)
Their cult leader Ellen G. White already had religious visions about meat being the cause of every disease of civilization in the 19th century.

>>42699323
>correlation=causation

>>42699326

>>There's no goal post to move anon

"You can't live totally herbivorously"
>show example of a community of people who do and in great health
"But that doesn't count"

Whatever your reasoning for why they exist, they exist and you were wrong. You're probably even talking to a guy who lives herbivorously right now. It's just a stupid thing to have said. You were wrong.

>You can't claim that veganism makes people immortal

Quote that

>>42699352
The American Journal of Clinical Nutrition is not a SDA run organization. That's where I'm getting my data.

Whether or not they are pushing an agenda is other topic. You may be right, but that doesn't nullify the adverse health affects of meat and dairy.

>>42699414
It's weird how they're the only strictly vegan society on earth.
Also it seems that their health, long life, and veganism is self reported.

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>>42699024
what are you talking - we cannot be totally herbivores. I guess I'll go die then

>>42693186

I've cut all dairy and meat (minus fish) out of my diet and I'm pleasantly surprised. I definitely feel better, my insomnia has less of an affect on my sleep schedule, i feel healthier overall.

I really don't see a problem with moderation with certain processed and meats though. I love steak. I'll probably have one in a few weeks but I'm not gonna eat it consistently like i used to. Shits bad.

>>42699452

And yet not the only strict vegans that exist on earth. Death certificates aren't self reported either.

>>42699486
If it's bad and you KNOW why eat it at all? Why hurt your health for 3 minutes of pleasure?

It's like banging the super bartender KNOWING she has AIDS, risking your health for a 30 second orgasm.

I don't understand people. I really don't.

So how many of you here are strong or lift , not shaming or anything just wondering loadsa time after doing 5x5 165 kg squats ill need to have a steak because fish and poultry just don't cut it for recovery probably only day of the week I consume red meat.

>>42699532
You won't believe me, but I'll tell you anyway.

Once I cut meat and dairy my maxes went UP across the board and my recovery times went DOWN. Energy went up too so I could push a little harder in the gym.

>>42693186
Good on you bro.

I have limited meat consumption to just twice a week for a few months now, while greatly upping whole food plant intake.

Feel pretty good but still a long way from my goals.

>>42699423
Meat and dairy have positive and negative health effects, and the total absence of animal products has negative health effects (widespread malnutrition among vegans with regards to zinc, iodine, calcium, omega-3 LCFA, iron and potentially choline - taking aside that the majority of vegans are also too retarded to supplement B12)

>>42699552
Can you post a vid of your lifts then ? I would try anything if can see someone put numbers up.

>>42699607
Oh this meme again. Who told you that? A study paid for by Danon Yogurt or UpJohn Merck?

What about all those oh so malnourished vegans who lived the life for years on end without taking supplements and are healthier than you?

Sorry, that meme has been disproven.

>>42699607
great argument, except that the same can be said about animal products' consumers and even worse

>>42699617
google "Patrik Baboumian"

>>42693186
Been vegan for two years now. Best decision I ever made.
Most of this board are just bros posting broscience and trying to be edgy about killing and eating animals.
It's cringe.

>>42699646
Why would I Google an irrelevant strongman?

>>42699617
On bench I went from about 230'ish to around 255.... 260 (on a good day). I'm not trying to bulk I'm happy with where I am.

>>42693186
To get enough protein to build anything decent, you'll be eating a fuckton more carbs than you need.

The Asian fellow from the film was on tren. You can eat whatever you want on tren, as long as you lift and look good.

If he ate a diet that wasn't ideological garbage, he'd be a ton bigger.

Overall, I don't really care why you do what you do, but am interested in the results. The fitness community needs more easily swayed retards jumping on fads, to monitor the fads and see if they have real potential. Veganism, does not. But who knows? Maybe you'll be the first vegan to not suck.

>>42699607

>the total absence of animal products has negative health effects (widespread malnutrition among vegans with regards to zinc, iodine, calcium, omega-3 LCFA, iron and potentially choline

I guess not being vegan also leads to malnutrition because you could potentially be deficient in all the same things and more, as many people are.

>>42699675
So can you post a vid or not ? You're happy with a 260 bench the fuck.

>>42699647
Yeah. It's amazing how much evidence is thrown in their faces that the shit they eat is lowering life spans, causing cancer, heart disease, hypertension, and everything else.... and they ignore it cause "Joey at the gym" eats five pork chops a night and can bench 3746372828 lbs. Never mind Joey has arteries clogged so bad it would take a gallon of Drano to clear them.

>bruh's a beast!

>>42699664
you asked for lifts, I gave you lifts. every vegan will tell you their recovery time is faster

>>42699702
why wouldn't he be? that's more than most gym-goers can lift

>>42699644
>Who told you that? A study paid for by Danon Yogurt or UpJohn Merck?
It says all that in the statement by the Academy of Nutrition and Dietetics arguing that vegan diets are healthy - because there isn't any data that shows vegans are not malnourished, so they just cited that data and said that vegan diets are healthy anyway "if you plan them right"

>>42699646
>>42699701
Vegan malnutrition is the result of veganism because the named nutrients are concentrated in animal products or require them for proper absorption - among other things, is is physiologically impossible to absorb enough zinc when phytic acid exceeds 1.5-2g/d. It is theoretically possible to get enough calcium from plants, but in practice this is highly unlikely and does not happen.

Malnutrition among omnivores is the result of an inadequate, unhealthy diet, not the consumption of animal products.

>>42699702
Not at the gym so no I can't post vid.

>>42698882

There's conceptual space to acknowledge humans are omnivores- but that animal products aren't necessary and due to their average rate of consumption lead to the biggest health risks we face in terms of disease.

There's more to the story than simply "not being able to digest cellulose". While it's a good indicator that humans aren't typical herbivores, it omits the fact that cellulose plays an important part in our digestive and cardiovascular health.

>not stop eating meat

The current industry is the result of the rate at which people are eating meat. There is no fixing the industry without getting people to go without meat entirely if not most of the time.

The average american is eating just under a pound of milk, yogurt, cheese and ice cream per day on top of half a pound of chicken, turkey, pork and beef per day.

On average, Americans are eating 5 servings of diary and 8. servings of meat per day.

That's 35 and 56 servings per week. Which is 91 servings of animal products per week- and it's recommended no more than 2-3 per week (to get the health benefits seen in pescaterians and low animal product diets).

Supposing Americans cut down to 2-3 servings per week. That leaves 560 million land animals raised for food each year.

It would be wonderful to see that kind of drop in animal consumption- but it isn't enough. Way more people need to become vegan in order to slow and undo the damage caused by animal agriculture.

My two cents:

I stopped eating most meat 2 years ago and stopped dairy 1 year ago. I still eat eggs and sometimes chicken

My lifts have continued to improve, but the major things I noticed were actually about hygiene. My farts literally don't smell anymore, my sweat barely smells, acne went away

I don't think veganism is good, but meat is pretty overrated imo, and dairy is shit

>>42699721
Poultry consumption is associated with reduced risk of colon and lung cancer and no known increased risk of any cancer. Fish consumption is associated with many health benefits and is consistently associated with longevity.

>>42699729
Gym goers find 225 squat to be normal no one cares about their pathetic standards. Again I Don't care about a juiced up nobody strongman.
>>42699732
So you don't have a single lift vid for form check ? Anyway dude I'm sure this thread will be around or pop up again save vid for me.

>>42693514
>Vitamin bs which are only found in meat sources
there are literally no b vitamins exclusive to meat

>>42699787
Dude, I'm not going to vid myself pressing for you. This is the Internet, I don't care if people believe it or not.

Can anyone recommend a vegan protein powder? I just finished a tub of Garden Of Life in two weeks at $40...i feel ripped off.

>>42699814
It's alright man but you can see reason why I would be skeptical without evidence. Anyway best of luck.

>>42699787
quite the attitude you have.. where's your evidence he's juicing?
>>42699835
so evidence to you is that someone can lift more than you or something? who's to say you wan't say "juicer" when that happens. why don't you go fuck yourself, buddy.

>>42699881
>competitive strongman, irrelevant one at that
>not juicing
You're legit embarrassing yourself here. All I ever want is a vid from a person that posts in these threads no ever does.

>>42699743
"Americans"
An interesting thing here is that you compare an average person of one of the unhealthiest country to someone who actually cares about his diet. The first part, including mcdonald's goer and bbq crazed fatties gorging on processed, shit quality meat.
In Sweden, one of the healthiest countries currently, an average person eats about 200 pounds of meat a year. However this is mostly higher quality meat, coming from a better culture of animal husbandry(eg corn pellet feed vs grass).
If we want to save the planet, we should really just get rid of about the third of our population. But at least you admit that the problem is not meat eating, but that we cannot produce enough if we eat as much as we currently do.
(Btw sell your car if you want to reduce carbon footprint, it's 3 times more effective compared to going vegan)

>>42693186
>Reddit spacing
>Wants to lower T by being vegan cuck

Checks out.

>>42699954
why would anyone go through the trouble of making a video and posting it for you, just so that you'd try beans/peas, instead of a steak after working out? do you think anyone gives a shit if you try it? no, the world doesn't revolve around you, mr relevance.

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>>42693186

>>42699731

>Vegan malnutrition is the result of veganism because the named nutrients are concentrated in animal products or require them for proper absorption
>Malnutrition among omnivores is the result of an inadequate, unhealthy diet, not the consumption of animal products.

You're claiming with no evidence that a vegan is inherently deficient in zinc, iron, etc simply because these things are also found in meat. Why do americans fail to get enough fiber? Not enough meat? What about magnesium? Lack of chicken? There's very little difference between a vegan diet and what is considered as a regular balanced diet. The majority of nutrition comes from the same sources- plants.

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>>42699829

>I just finished a tub of Garden Of Life in two weeks at $40...i feel ripped off.

Shit's expensive but the extra nutrition is great

>>42700189
I'm avoiding whey because it makes me break out.. I'm finished with 14 scoops in a week. Any cheaper option or other powders that give me more bang for my buck?

>>42700152
Maybe you are just unaware that adding even a moderate amount of animal flesh to a meal massively enhances the absorption of zinc and iron from the plant source in the meal - which usually has a very low availability by itself.

Ironically, zinc and iron insufficiency is a major problem in medium income countries where people already subsist on a "whole food plant based diet" on a large scale. Addition of animal products to the diet is actually considered a public health goal for those areas.

>>42700293
>Addition of animal products to the diet is actually considered a public health goal for those areas.
>Adding cancer causing heme iron is a public health goal
yes, good goy

>>42694098
I eat metric loads of meat, eggs, and cheese and I can gurantee im in better shape than you

>>42699976

If you mean- I used averages of all americans- including the ones not eating meat and not eating any animal products- then yes that's what an average includes. Average consumption is relevant to how many animals are being used/eaten. Pointing out that some people eat grass fed "high quality meat" isn't relevant at all when looking at averages.

The "bad" meats are more efficient to make- that's why they're cheaper (along with subsidies for corn and soy which is primarily used as animal feed). It'd do more harm- in terms of resource consumption and in shear number of animals eaten- to get rid of all "bad" meat and switch to "good quality" meat.

If you translate my numbers into years- it's not much below 200. Sweeden is at 190 and U.S. is at 170. Also, Swedes switched away from red meat- to chicken and eggs. Despite this, there's still an upward trend of obesity, CVD, and diabetes.

There's no evidence they're eating better meats, as you suggest, they're eating more fruits and vegetables.

Getting rid of 1/3 of the human population is pleb tier thinking. The world- even after cutting the population by a third - cannot continue to consume like western developed nations. I seriously doubt you could have 1 billion people living like average Americans- and other first world countries.

And finally, while urban design shouldn't be reliant on cars and should offer plenty of public transportation, walking, cycling options- it's simply not true that ditching your car is 3 times more effective compared to going vegan. The number you're quoting- pretty sure comes from 'The climate mitigation gap: education and government recommendations miss the most effective individual actions' where they define a plant based diet as 'avoiding all meat' not including dairy, eggs...

Anyway, the emissions are cited at 20% for automobiles and 21-25% for animal agriculture depending on whether you count things like refrigeration and freight. I'd call that about the same.

>>42700293

Load up those scientific references

>>42693186
>After watching What The Health and Folks Over Knives...

How long ago was that? 7 years ago? you fucking malnourished freak hang yourself.

Oh and stop making this fucking thread every day.

>after watching meme documentaries with hidden agendas i'm changing my life

>>42693186
Enjoy your PROGRESSIVE COGNITIVE DEFICIT from chronic amino acid deficiencies.

Also enjoy being SKINNYFAT from too many carbs, because nobody can eat the same small group of foods in the same combinations every meal day after day and not break at some point.

Also enjoy SHITTING YOUR GUTS OUT DAILY from getting WAY TOO MUCH FIBER every day. LOL you're probably increasing your cancer risk that way.

Also enjoy POISONING YOURSELF with herbicide/pesticide residue from eating so much goddamned vegetable matter -- and it's all through it, it doesn't just rinse off.

************

Of course this is just another BAIT thread, but I have to include the above so young naive anons won't fall for your shit.

Just admit you and all humans are OMNIVORES and need some animal products in their diet for OPTIMAL health, and promise not to shitpost threads like this on /fit/ anymore, and we'll be done here. No one who knows anything believes you so just stop wasting your time, it's autistic.

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>>42697810
germinated sprout beans are totally safe to eat.

also more nutritious than cooked ones.

You just have to wait 1 week to ate them.

Sorry my man, but there are literally no excuses to have a plant based diet, except for "muh taste"

>>42701435
>Enjoy your PROGRESSIVE COGNITIVE DEFICIT from chronic amino acid deficiencies.
[[[Source needed]]]

>Also enjoy being SKINNYFAT from too many carbs, because nobody can eat the same small group of foods in the same combinations every meal day after day and not break at some point.
Don't eat bread, pasta, or too much potatos. That's it. FTFY.

>Also enjoy SHITTING YOUR GUTS OUT DAILY from getting WAY TOO MUCH FIBER every day. LOL you're probably increasing your cancer risk that way.
Enjoy shiting once in a while dead bacteria pounds, enjoy irritating anus, enjoy poor bowel movement. Shitting as a vegan feels really good, no more fucking rapist crocodile excrement tearing your rectus walls.

>Also enjoy POISONING YOURSELF with herbicide/pesticide residue from eating so much goddamned vegetable matter -- and it's all through it, it doesn't just rinse off.
Don't you known the boiled water technique???

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>>42701435

Enjoy your unsubstantiated claims

>Just admit you and all humans are OMNIVORES and need some animal products in their diet for OPTIMAL health

Humans are omnivores, but you don't understand what omnivorism is.

>>42693186
People who stop eating meat because of "What the health" are retarded without any knowledge about nutrition nor how to spot bullshit.

I couldnt even get 1 minute in without seeing some major red flags.

>>42700803
are you Scottish? what kind of illiterate mis spells guarantee. GUR-AN-TEE. must be scottish. I'm intrigued.

>>42694028
i have a friend who is vegan, not an asshole about it, and after i fucked myself with getting the beetus i went full keto and low carb, now, twenty weeks after i am no longer a diabetic, my blood pressure is perfect, i run and lift everyday, lost 20 Kilograms and eat one meal a day, we talk about our diets all day, he eats organic and the general vegan diet with some supplements, i eat good meat with lots of veggies and good fats, butter and cream, both of us are shining beacons of health right now, while we come from different camps, we are united against the sugar and in small essence, the bad carb jew.

pescatarian master race here. ez protein while not supporting land meat industry. Plus if I get mercury poisoning or something I might get superpowers. Win-win situation

I'm still trying to stop consuming dairy though

>>42703631
haha yes, let's wipe out all sea life, it's not like that will effect us at all

>>42703393

> now, twenty weeks after i am no longer a diabetic

So you're fully capable of eating carbs now without it raising your bloodsugar abnormally high?

>>42697816
Well, you don't consume most plants raw. For example, tubers. People do eat things like liver raw occasionally, though it sounds like a pretty bad idea to me. There was actually a Vice article on some guy doing this recently:
https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/nnqw3q/this-guy-has-eaten-nothing-but-raw-meat-for-five-years

>>42699486
Watch your teeth and gums if you're not eating dairy breh, especially if you're big into fruit

>>42703802
>dairy
>good for teeth
top kek mister 1930

>>42693186
I consult the bible on issues like this. Meat is a sacrifice, and should be treated as such. It is a great gift from God, and shouldn't be eaten constantly, as it will make you sick.

>>42697654

Are you retarded? A handful of beans will literally kill you.

>>42697577
>Given that human beings aren't evolutionary designed to catch and eat prey should be a good indicator.
What the flying fuck does that have to do with what I said?

>>42700189
>maxing out on most nutrients while only getting 34g of protein with a whole day of real meals still to go
That doesn't seem wise.

And this has more carbs than protein, wtf, it's not even a protein powder.

>>42705319

>getting more nutrients is bad
???

>>42693423
But anon, don't homosexuals eat meat?

>>42705571
>what is toxicity

>>42699801

Read the sticky about Vitamin B12. Just make sure to supplement it in some way.

>>42703770
that's the fun part about ketard claiming it cure beetus , they just stop using the faucet but keep on fucking the plumbing , and act like everything is fine .

Full day still no vegan vid of lifts or pic.
Embarrassing really.

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>>42706639

How the fuck do you guys eat enough food to bulk when vege/vegan?

I'm eating 3800 calories atm and it's quite a large amount of meat, dairy, egg etc, every day...

I just dunno how that could be possible when not eating meat.

If you guys say tofu/beans etc then any chance of ever stopping eating meat can fuck right off

>>42706897
lentils, sweet potato/yams, beans, pasta, bread, rice, quinoa, almond/soy milk, nuts/seeds

>average vegan animal
The weak cuckrilla.
Known as the groid of the africas.
>average carnivore animal
The GREAT WHITE whale.
Known to be packing a nonster knob and an intellect to match it

All I eat is oats and multivitamins

>>42693186
idk if u fags care about my own experience but ive been vegan for about 7 months now and its goin great and im makin solid gains on a bulk, will stay vegan for life for sure :)
blood levels are fine also if ur wondering, no test drops or anything

>>42697577
>That first sentence
We have literally been chasing animals until that they collapse from exhaustion since before we left Africa.
I eat raw eggs, unpasteurized milk, and raw-ish fish several times a week and have never had an issue.
Don't project your shitty weak immune system and genetics in everyone else.

lmao vegans

when i was eating too many fruits and not much dairy, my teeth were soft, i started getting toothbrush abrasion, and they started to discolor, plus i had some gum disease. i started eating shitloads of dairy and less fruit. now my teeth are getting shinier and whiter and the hygienist told me that my gums look good at my last visit. you tell me