Fasting is the Only Way

>>41264347
What about single day fasts. Do them shits do work?

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, aiming to consume a little less each time. Spend the entire second week water fasting. Listen to your body and notice the differences. Every improvement in your condition will motivate you. You'll feel lighter, look brighter and be happier.

Skinny people do 40 day fasts all the time, so us fatasses can manage 2-4 week water-only fasts. Motivate yourself with readings and testimonies.

Check out http://www.allaboutfasting.com/benefits-of-fasting.html , it's the best resource out there about fasting.

>>41264399
Single day fasts are great if you're just a bit overweight, but you want to do those once a week at least for long-term changes.

Fasting kills your muscle faggot.

>>41264469
This thread is (mostly) for fatasses. We all know that fat people can't lose weight and gain muscle so that doesn't matter.

>>41264347
fasting once in a while does have health benefits, but using it as a means of long term weight loss?
pants on head retarded.
There are no shortcuts. You will have to do the whole spiel if you wanna make it.

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>>41264347
yup I agree completely, op
can you post a pic of your body and your stats please?
I wanna know what I'll look like before I start doing extended fasts
all these dumb normal cuts where you eat food at a deficit to lose weight simply don't work and I'm glad op is talking some sense right here
I mean look at this faggot I found in the /cbt/

he'd retain so much more muscle mass on his cuts if he stopped eating calories for entire weeks at a time
what a fucking idiot that guy is

>>41264498
>pants on head retarded.

Explain. Yes everyone attempting fasting for weight loss should know they will gain some pounds the moment they start eating again, but they only gain it all back if they didn't take the fasting period to truly break themselves from unhealthy, high-calorie foods. Obviously they will have to continue healthy eating habits afterward to maintain weight loss.

>>41264491
fat people can lose weight and gain muscle at the same time you fucking retard

have fun being stuck in skinnyfat mode because you didn't lift while losing weight

>>41264525
Well I made a mistake posting this on "MUSCLES R EVERYTHING"

>>41264541
They can attempt to retain some muscles but realistically they won't gain much of them.

>>41264531
the fasting will only make you gain fat and lose muscle.
have you ever thought about, idk, just not eating shit food and going for a balanced healthy diet?
fasting will only have adverse effects to your weight loss.
it is good for you, if done very rarely, maybe once a year for a week or so. There is no way around lengthy cuts, exercise and proper nutrition. it simply takes time to lose weight. every nutritionist worth their salt will tell you as much.

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>>41264558
muscles ARE everything
do you really want to look like pic related after losing all the weight?
seriously dude?

I've gone from 270lbs obese mode to 200lbs still fat mode and all of my lifts have gone up and I'm still cutting normally to lose weight
can you explain how I lost all this weight and still gained muscle and went up in ALL of my lifts?
I sure can
stop giving yourself excuses to do these retarded meme diets

>>41264558

A fat person that lifts will burn fat for energy and use consumed protein to build muscle while regenerating. Ever heard of nitrogen balance?

>>41264347
This bitch has absolutely no clue about physiology, biology, neurology, and psychology.

How do you think your organs would handle going from a normal diet to nothing for a month, then back to a normal diet? Look up the detrimental effects of anorexia, because this is anorexia.

Think about it, your body MIGHT be able to live off of body fat stores, but do you think your muscles will like that as much as it would like lean protein? There's a reason why people who are losing massive amounts of weight need nutritionists and to still eat high protein, low carb diets.

>>41264632
Almost recovered fattie here, can confirm 100%, fuck OP for this thread and for trying to fool /fat/.

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Fuck you fasting gave me gastritis.. now i get bloated and gassy when i dont eat long periods of time

>>41264599
I went from 270 to 189 to 207 now (in about a year and a half)... If you don't have definition of any kind, your "fasting" is fucking your muscles up. You might have made tiny gains, but I'm short man, if you're taller than 5'7" you should be leaner than me. Chances are, you're form got better so you could do the movements more correctly, thus bumping your lifts up a little.

If those were your before and after pictures, something is seriously wrong and you should stop fasting immediately. I actually like looking at that picture and seeing that it's the wrong way to go about losing weight. You fucked up, big time.

Glad to see a fasting thread! I didn't see one for like 2 weeks and I thought all of muh nigga Fungfags had died of accidental starvation.

>>41264683
Wrong. Your body can adjust just fine. The human body has done so for centuries.

Fat people "need" nutritionists because all of the ignorant millennials who got nutritionists certifications "need" a job.

>>41264683

our bodies literally evolved to fast, you fucking imbecile

>>41264571
>fasting will only have adverse effects to your weight loss.

You still haven't explained why specifically.

>>41264599
LOL fasting is not a meme diet. You fuck up ONE time in your journey and it'll be incredibly easy for you to gain it all back. Calorie deficits don't really fix the eating problem. That's why 95% of people who lose weight gain it back. They eat small bags of chips or lean pockets because it "fits their calories". Rarely are dieters actually eating properly. People who are really fat are addicted to food and the only to break it is true fasting.


>>41264699
I'm not trying to fool /fat/, I'm trying to help. Every "calorie deficit" dieter stays fucking hungry the entire time. That's why they cheat every weekend. Fasting is the only way to beat true hunger.

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>>41264347
Can't argue with these scientific facts.

Good job op.

>>41264900
Take away the word "true", my mistake. And by "beating hunger" I just mean stomach pangs, headaches and all the shitty feelings you have when you don't eat. It's not ACTUALLY hunger, it's WITHDRAWAL symptoms. Notice how all of those symptoms are almost exactly like drug addicts.

>>41264683
>How do you think your organs would handle going from a normal diet to nothing for a month, then back to a normal diet?

They do just fucking fine if you break the fast properly.

Veggies
Soft Fruit
Broths/Juices
Water for a month
Broths/Juices
Soft Fruit
Veggies

There, your digestive system is fine. It's best if dieters continue a FRESH diet. There, 20-30 lbs down without suffering and "hunger" from calorie counting diet.

>>41264920
It's almost laughable how retarded you sound.
Do you seriously believe hunger is on the level of withdrawal symptoms?
Next you'll tell me to stop drinking to learn how to ignore thirst. Since, you know, thirst is totally a withdrawal symptom - dry mouth, headache, shitty feelings.

>>41264347
I tried this and ended up bingeing, which just set off a quasi-eating disorder for a few weeks.

Fuck it, I'll stick to my 23/1 intermittent fasting, I can't water fast for more than that.

>>41264900
>I'm not trying to fool /fat/, I'm trying to help. Every "calorie deficit" dieter stays fucking hungry the entire time. That's why they cheat every weekend. Fasting is the only way to beat true hunger.
This is retarded on so many levels.

>>41264965
>Do you seriously believe hunger is on the level of withdrawal symptoms?

Yes, it's not "true" hunger first of all. All of those symptoms disappear after 2-3 days. People fast for over a month all the time, they would never last that long if stomach pangs and headaches were plaguing them the entire time. They are able to do it because they don't really feel anything after the first 3 days. The whole point of withdrawal symptoms is making you feel like you need the thing you're not consuming or shooting up anymore. So people think headaches is "hunger" xD

>>41264900
Fasting makes your body go into starvation mode if done for a long period of time, which makes your body store fat as way to survive, all while eating the muscle. Yes you can lose weight by fasting. However you will look like shit.

>>41265014
Sounds like a bunch of stuff that will not affect the 30+ BMI people in /fat/ threads.

>>41265031
I mean, the main point of losing weight is to look better right? /Fat/ to dyel skinnyfat isnt much of an upgrade

>>41265058
>/Fat/ to dyel skinnyfat isnt much of an upgrade

Fatass here. Seems like an upgrade to me.

>>41265058
If your BMI is 30+, you're not going to be "skinnyfat" after a month of fasting anyways. It's an upgrade no matter how you look at it.

>>41264347
LOL no, fasting is only for people who have no personal discipline whatsoever and therefore have to resort to stupid extreme measures in their vain attempt to not be a fatass anymore -- then they WILL gain it all back when they binge-eat after their so-called 'fast'.

FASTING IS FOR FAT LOSERS.

People with ACTUAL discipline can count calories successfully and not stuff their faces with pizza, cookies, cakes, and other fatass crap. Admit it, we're the superior race, you're all pleb-tier fatasses who should just kill yourselves if you can't be bothered to get some personal discipline.

>>41264962
OP is talking about on/off forever

>>41264887
Wrong, society evolved to fast. We have fast food and our bodies didn't evolve to counteract a high fat diet. We could eat a paleo diet (aka early human) and be fine.

>>41264852
You can't equate the physical activity of the early 1900s to us weight lifting. And when did they bounce back from starvation? During famine? Those people NEVER had the type of physiques we have, and they didn't just get hit with 1 big starvation event and deal with it. Those people either moved to where the food was or died... And you cant bitch a out nutritionists when you're on a board that does fuck all but talk about lifting and nutrition. So stfu.

>>41265121
>fasting is only for people who have no personal discipline whatsoever

Wat? Fasting takes all of the discipline in the world. At least for the first 3 days it does, and a LONG 72 hours it becomes.

>stupid extreme measures

Our society has really made fasting seem like a bad thing hahaha there's a reason it's been so popular in religious groups for millennia. But nowadays in the West, people are ADDICTED to food and calorie counting is not breaking the addiction - it's just making people suffer. Fasting may start with a lot of suffering but it's just part of breaking the addiction and they will feel incredible afterwards. Calorie counting just makes you yearn for bad shit the entire time.

>then they WILL gain it all back when they binge-eat after their so-called 'fast'.

Anyone who does their proper knows they can die if they binge-eat after a fast.

>>41265014
Why would your body cannibalize your muscles if it has all that extra fat laying around?

Do you think that if a fatty decides to fast, he will just become jabba the hut? A giant sack of fat with no muscle? Will your body also digest your bones? Your organs?

Get real, fag.

>>41265218
OP here, and truthfully, your non-vital muscles will be eaten by the body first (obviously not all of them or else you wouldn't be able to move around) then it goes to fat stores. But that anon is also silly to think that this shit matters when you're fat as hell.

>>41264706
You sound like a defective human being you should kys yourself

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>starving yourself is good
lol

>>41264347
I have a pretty low blood pressure even when I eat normally.
Can I even do this without blacking out or collapsing? Eating nothing seems dangerous for my blood pressure.

>>41265218
You think I know why its a shit system? Its just the way the body works. In a perfect world your body would just eat fat during a fast. Then everyone counting calories, or cutting would just go on a fasting diet and look ripped since body fat would fall off. Look it up, the body uses most of the muscle left on your body and hangs on for dear life to fat while in starvation. Cutting would be far more easy if the only rule was no eating. No one is saying fasting on rare occasions is good for the body. The problem is that fasting as a weight loss plan is retarded as fuck

>>41265314
*Not good

>>41265186
Why don't you paleofags of all people realize that early humans went for extended periods of time without eating then feasted? And so on and so forth? I'm not suggesting that "1 big starvation event" is all one needs to lose weight and they can go back to eating shit afterward. I'm pretty sure even the normalest of normalfags from the most backwater areas of teh US knows that they have to change their eating habits for life. BUT sometimes, it takes it takes cold turkey quitting to develop the right relationship with food. I did the same thing with cigarettes.

>>41265314
>hangs on for dear life to fat while in starvation.

Physics says otherwise you millennial bro-science piece of shit.

>>41264469
>"I see you're not eating anymore," says my muscle faggot.
>"I'm just fasting, you'll be okay," I respond.
>My muscle faggot looks down in pain. "You're killing me. You know that right?" he tells me.
>"But /fit/ said I could fast because fasting heals so it's a good thing."
>My muscle faggot doesn't say anything else. Just sullenly looks off into the distance with a look of great dispair for brief moment then slowly slumps over in his chair and gently falls into a melancholic slumber.
>He's been in a coma now for 39 days now.

>>41265368
So youre telling me, that fasting is a more effective way of losing body fat, then regular diet and exercise?

>>41265344
>early humans went for extended periods of time without eating then feasted?
As far as I'm aware, religious fasts are and were pretty much always intermittent and definitely not 20+ days of no food.

>walk everyday
>eat healthier
or
>starve yourself
Hmmm.... Maybe if you fat fucks actually went outside and did some exercise until you felt this wet thing on you called sweat you wouldn't have to come up with bullshit systems like fasting which are detrimental to your health and just give you an excuse to do fuck all and continue sitting on your ass all day, "b-b-but I'm fasting!"

I was at the gym a few days ago and saw this regular guy who's probably like 5'10'' fucking HUGE bear mode like no joke like this guy is probably upwards of 300lbs. But he's fucking doing mad weight. He's always with his girlfriend too who is also almost equally as huge. I saw him and his girl on the exercise bike and he was really going at it, obviously trying to better himself. His girlfriend wasn't having any of it. She was clearly not interested in losing the weight and putting forth the effort. I could see the disappointment on his face and the guilt in hers. It was fucking disgusting. You fat fucks think starving yourself will cure all your problems, Jesus Christ.

>>41265403
You're deflecting. All I said was that "hanging on to fat for dear life" is bullshit. If you don't consume calories, your body will have to go to fat stores to continue functioning whether it "wants to" or not.

>>41265344
I was close friends with arab kids in high school. They only fasted during daylight and then feasted at night. Also it was for one week.

>>41265477
I was thinking more monks and religious officials than random modern arabs.

>>41264347
Is this what anorexics really think?

>>41264965
Glad I was able to find this book again that kind of goes into depth about the differences between hunger and withdrawal.

https://books.google.com/books?id=leN5CwAAQBAJ&pg=PT264&dq=fasting+hunger&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiy9aTY88zTAhWsyoMKHYqmBcM4ChDoAQgmMAA#v=onepage&q=fasting%20hunger&f=false

Fasting is only for brave people, lazy fatfucks will never do something like that, is easy when you used to do it but the first days/weeks requires mental power

>>41265368
No it doesn't. Anabolic and catabolic processes apply to all tissue. Any gain will involve bone, muscle, fat, and attachment. As will any loss, to one degree or another. In fact, your body will prioritise fat over other tissue types while in a mild catabolic state because muscle and connective tissues are extremely costly to build, and fat isn't.

'No eating' doesn't work for cutting because fasting is almost impossible for most people to keep up for any length of time, and inevitably leads to binge eating when the body decides to take matters into its own hands.

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>>41265465
>If you don't consume calories, your body will have to go to fat stores to continue functioning whether it "wants to" or not.
Yeah, that's called starving. If your body has to go into fat reserves in order to keep up natural bodily functions... that is not healthy, m8.

>>41265572
Lol it's literally ketosis. Don't you guy love that here?

>>41265551
This is why I'm clearing the pantry and fridge today.

>>41264558
Sorry buddy, muscles are everything. Higher muscle mass even while carrying around too much fat completely alters your carbohydrate metabolism, not to mention making literally every physical task easier. A guy who's 40% bf at 220 it likely pre-diabetic if not already diabetic. A guy who's 40% bf at 300 probably won't be.

>>41265598
>Lol it's literally ketosis.
Lol it's literally exercise.

>>41265572

I hate that myth about the AK47. I've owned two that were both made in former Russian states and they were pieces of shit. Inaccurate and they jammed fairly often. They were easy to fix and I could always get them back shooting but they jam frequently.

>>41265700
Every gun is prone to jam. Most of the time it's fault of the ammo being used or gun not being properly maintained.

>promoting anorexia

KEK!

Can someone tell me if intermittent fasting with keto is the best way to fast?

If you do it right you still get your daily intake of protein, fat, sodium, etc. While also having your body enter into fasting mode and burning fat.

I'm a little worried that my muscles and overall energy will go down but right now I'm doing 20/4 intermittent fasting keto and i've liked the results so far.

>>41265753
Anorexics are mentally ill and obsess about food. Fasting is about mental clarity and specifically learning to not obsess over food.

>>41265754
OP here, and IF is a healthier way to fast if done right, HOWEVER, like calorie counting, it allows people to not truly change their eating habits for the better. It's just doing it in different time periods.

>>41265797
I mean how drastically are we talking about changing our eating habits?

I've completely cut out sugars carbs and sodas from my diet. I eat only veggies and meats. So it can't be the type of foods you eat.
Do you mean how much food you eat? I try to aim for 1200-1400 calories a day so not sure what you consider as good eating habits.

This thread's turned into an ordeal of shit, and the site's interface unfortunately doesn't allow an orderly sorting of it.

To anyone new, be cautious as to the information posted here, as it is very like that it is in fact misinformation, regardless of stance.

Properly inform yourself on the topic, and abandon the thread:
https://youtu.be/ETkwZIi3R7w

>>41265386
Not bad

>>41265836
Not him, but single ingredient foods only with 35g of fiber at least and 1gram/lb bodyweight in protein at least is a great place to start. You'll spend less time fretting about calorie counting because it's very nearly impossible to overeat on a diet where the foods have such a high satiety effect. It sounds almost like that's what you're doing though. Are you positive you're actually sticking to it? I imagine you'd be pretty miserable on 1200-1400 cals a day unless you're a turbomanlet or a grill though...

>>41265836
I just mean eating as fresh as possible. Sure, in your case, protein and veggies is fine as long as you stick with it. Although, I personally wouldn't overdo it with the meat. Meats are hard on your digestive system, even if you don't "feel" it. Eventually you will. I'd definitely substitute a large portion of my meat consumption with protein shakes.

>>41264469
Factually wrong

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>>41264347
>Will only improve when you fast. Your body fixes itself when it's fasting, including your shitty metabolism.
False and retarded. Metabolism as a measured response changes marginally (typically less than 3% MoE) when fasting or lowering calories

>No, you gain it all back when you count calories (knowing you try to sneak in snacks) and not address your real problem which is food addiction.
Broken logic, I can only assume you're a woman because they compare when there is no comparison fairly often.
Counting calories has been shown to increase the likelihood of sticking to dietary changes, so even if your logic was right you'd be wrong.

>The best way to kick an addiction is quitting cold turkey, yes, even food.
By this logic you're also addicted to oxygen and sleep. Stop sleeping and breathing OP, it's the only way to be safe.

Fasting is fine, talking a load of retarded nonsense isn't. Top yourself

>>41265308
Anyone?

Reminder that the man posting the same Dr Fung videos over and over again refuses to believe that people can lose weight simply by counting calories, all because he's a self admitted fatass who can't keep from gorging unless he stops eating completely.

>>41266120
Makes a lot of sense, thanks for helping me understand the nonsense that is this thread

The lack of science in the video above is mindblowing

>>41265985
Fasting is probably not safe for you.

>>41266243
https://desuarchive.org/fit/thread/40923109
Here's a thread where he autistically screeches at people who suggest that CICO works and he just sucked at counting. If you search "fung" on desuarchive, you see this guy alot.

>>41266243
>the nonsense that is this thread

Tired of this "if it's not about lifting it's not /fit/ and it's nonsense" don't know why the "health" portion of fit was removed but fitness is much broader than lifting.

>>41264683

Your liver can literally make glucose from your stored fat. Your organs continue getting the fuel they need even on a fast. Nothing really changes for them fuel wise.

Fucking broscience

>>41266285
But this thread is nonsense. I'm sorry your self control is so awful that you have to choose between not eating at all or gorging yourself, but please don't come to /fit/ and sperg at everybody else who has more self control.

>>41264347
>fancy words
>not just calling yourself too lazy to cook

Isn't fasting just skipping a fucking meal or 2? Wtf is fasting one day/2 days. It happens when you lazy ass forget to get up in the morning during a weekend

Holy shit fitness industry is full of retards

>>41266120
>>41266259
Isn't fasting just taking CICO to the limit of CI = 0? What is the meaningful difference, why would that magically work differently?

>>41266372
He claims that it's all about insulin and calories are meaningless.

>>41266306
Remember the 95%

Alright faggots. When you lift, your muscles tear and then rebuild themselves. This degradation and synthesis is related to a process called protein turnover. Considering humans are not able to synthesize all the amino acids necessary for protein synthesis, how the FUCK do you expect protein degradation to not be greater than protein synthesis on an expected fast?

It seems to me that if you damage your muscles by lifting and then eat nothing for 2 weeks your muscles will not recover and will actually get smaller.

>>41266455
No one is denying this bud. But this thread is really about fatasses and it's clear that non-fatasses can't keep themselves out of the conversation.

>>41266411

Sort of wrong. He says IF and cutting out extra sugar/processed food/refined carbs is the best way to go. And you can eat an unlimited amount of fat sans trans fat.

> Hey guys, here's my totally unscientific, uniformed medical opinion
> Oh, don't trust that? Well how about
> A philosopher from 2,000 years ago
> Some Egyptian from 5,000 years ago
> A writer

Lmao, what do any of these people know about medical science again?

>>41266688
I trust them a lot more than the medical jew that only studies health for money (which would be against their self-interest to actually heal people)

>>41264469
If you have no fat left yeah
When you're in a fasted state the first thing that gets targeted is fat. If there's no more fat then your body cannibalizes its muscles.
Most people fasting here probably have >22% BMI

Is lifting and running while fasting advisable, or would that fuck you up?

>>41264599
look you dont just "burn fat". same with keto. with keto all you are doing is giving your body "fats" the macro for energy not bodyfat its a common misconception. the only reason a keto or old school lifter looks more cut is because there skin is tighter and they dont retain alot of water because for every like idk 150 carbs you retain like 1.2 liters of water for your muscles and bodily functions and your skin is tighter and your depelted of glycogen. when you burn "bodyfat" all your doing is converting it to carbon dioxide by breathing every second. look stuff up before you spread mis info like burning bodyfat please i really dislike shit like that

It's retarded to think that you can eat nothing and make any progress with lifting heavy weights, strength or hypertrophy wise.

That being said, how come /fit/ degenerates into HAES logic any time someone brings drastic caloric reduction

>muh starvation mode
In one thread you're laughing at the delusional whales saying that they eat only 800 calories but gain weight, yet in the next one you're firing the exact same bullet points. This seems awfully stupid to me.

Can someone thinking keto/IF/cutting more than 500 cals is the devil please point out to me what's wrong or bad with being active - doing resistance training at least 3 times a week plus doing some form of cardio - and making sure you eat enough protein per pound of lean body mass but little else? What would, in theory, be the difference between this and eating at your target maintenance calories/macros and say spending 8 hours a day being physically active in some way and jacking up your CO part of the CICO equation?

>>41264491
it does matter. Muscles burn fat. Shed muscles and you have harder time losing fat.
>>41264347
Why are fatsos so stupid. It's like you want to self sabotage yourself.
Eat at 500kcal deficit like a normal human being.
Don't listen to other fats. They're as dumb as you are. If they weren't they wouldn't get fat.

>>41266878

Its do able. You get used to it. I like doing it on my days off. I eat right after though. Not really useful unless you're cutting, though

>>41266878
If only IF or 1 day, no
Anything else, yes

>Intermittent Fast
>500-600 calories one day, 700 below maintenance the next.
>Lost 15lbs this week.(7 DAYS)
>Shit doesn't make sense, I'm only at a 1200/day deficit.
> 7 x 1200 = 8400. 8400/3500= 2.4 lbs expected
>Losing weight 6x faster than expected.
>Mostly fat, Id wager 90% is fat, muscles have barely declined.
>Pants too loose to wear yesterday.
>Estimate I went from 30%+ BF to 23% so far.

This shit is kind of spooky /fit/ my body took to fasting immediately, no hunger feelings. I'm upping my daily protein because I assume if it's eating lbs this fast it must be taking more muscle. Still maintaining workouts. Am skinnyfat, cutting before bulking, worried I just added an extra month of lean gains work with a week of this stuff though.

>>41264347
All this text when its all just
cals in < cals out

>>41266929
>Can someone thinking keto/IF/cutting more than 500 cals is the devil please point out to me what's wrong or bad with being active - doing resistance training at least 3 times a week plus doing some form of cardio - and making sure you eat enough protein per pound of lean body mass but little else?
No one is saying that, at least not here. We're only saying that eating nothing is retarded.

>>41266994
It's the opposite for me, kind of. I've been fasting for about 3 months now, i dont feel hungry anymore, just a little lightheaded. But my fat isnt being lost that quickly and i dont know why, my stomach is the fucking same but my arms look smaller now

>>41267115
Theres a difference between eating nothing ALL day and eating nothing MOST of the day.

Intermittent fasting has changed my life and I'm seeing fat melt off on the daily.

>>41267170

Your metabolic rate adjusts. You are nothing over a significant period of time so your be adjusted to that.

>>41267184
Sure, but OP is speaking about eating nothing ALL day.

>>41264347
Your arguments are shit but you are still right. The reason why fasting is good for losing weight is because after not eating anything for some time your body will have switched to burning fat instead of carbs and glycogen. Additionally your insulin levels go way down and your body becomes more sensitive to it, this is good because high insulin levels make it harder to lose weight.
16-20 hour fasting 5 times a week with a 20-30% calorie deficit is ideal for losing weight without losing muscle mass.

>>41267214
I guess I didn't understand his autistic op.

Fasting for longer than 24 hours is either involuntary or you're retarded

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I like to drink soda with zero calories on my fast. Is that cheating?

the most unfounded of broscience: the thread

test

>>41267652
Enjoy your strokes

>>41267652
Consuming anything under 50 cals while fasting is fine, so nothing to worry about

>>41267713
how tf is it fasting then

>>41266770

Then you're retarded.

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uNzZod_d18A&t=1350s
Dr. Rhonda Patrick speaks with Ray Cronise, a former NASA material scientist and co-founder of zero gravity, a company that offers weightless parabolic flights to consumers and researchers. In this episode, coming at the tail end of a rather extreme 23-day water fast for Ray, we discuss, perhaps unsurprisingly, some of the benefits that are associated with fasting! Ray talks about shifting one's perspective from looking at nutrition only through the lens of meeting day-to-day nutritional needs, and instead, also considering optimizing metabolism for longer-term effects as well, the importance of thinking about longevity in the context of functional healthspan, some of the similarities between the body’s physiological response to heat stress, cold stress, and exercise and so much more.

>>41266770

> that only studies health for money

By that logic you should trust literally zero services.

> Toilet breaks

> Nah, I'm not trusting the plumbing jew, it's in their best interest to actually fix my plumbing

> Oh my car broke down? Not gonna trust the mechanic jew, it wouldn't be in their self interest to fix my car

Hey bro, if your wires in your house cut out don't call an electrician, they'll just steal your money. Instead, just start a fire in your lounge and smash a hole in your fridge, that'll fix it, you can trust me, I'm not an electrician.

>>41267726
If it's under a certain amount, the body doesn't recognise it's not in the fasting state

>>41266833

The exact opposite of what you said is true.

>>41267075
with 95% failure rate. Long fast + eating exclusively fresh afterward means weight lost and weight kept off without struggling with calorie counting for years.

>>41266833
The body prioritizes what it burns

It's carbs then proteins (non-vital muscle) then fats

Since my thread is really about fatasses fasting, all of this shit about "starvation mode" and muscle loss doesn't really matter.

Any fatass that seriously became fit didn't gain muscles as they lost weight. They got skinny then bulked up.

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>>41267903
>Struggling with addition

>>41267862
>>41267950

Yes buds. Our body worked out a way to store excess energy when we're not able to find food only for it to say fuck that and go after the one thing that's actually going to help us find sustenance. Sounds completely legit.

You're a neanderthal. You've just feasted on some delicious woolly mammoth for about a week, but then a vicious snowstorm started and you've been snowed in for a while. That's the end of it, since your body doesn't go for that stored energy from the mammoth, nah. It goes for your musculature thus rendering you unable to ever hunt again.

The body doesn't use proteins for energy you stupid cunts. Either the amino acids are used up immediately in anabolism, or they're converted into glucose or fat ... because that's what the body uses for energy. Why in the everloving fuck would your supposedly starving body go through the trouble to convert proteins into usable energy thus expending even more energy rather than using readily available stores?

Remember, we're not talking about essential body fat (4% for men and about 10 for women), we're talking about overweight people losing weight.

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>>41266285
>Tired of this "if it's not about lifting it's not /fit/ and it's nonsense" don't know why the "health" portion of fit was removed but fitness is much broader than lifting.
Not being lifting related doesn't excuse nonsense. If someone was posting about lizard people and moon runes they'd get equal amounts of shit
Saying calorie deficit doesn't cause weight loss or is particularly hard is equally retarded

>>41268043

So where are your organs getting the amino acids they need to function if they're not getting them from your diet? Pro tip, it's from skeletal muscle.

>>41265314
google "ketosis" you retarded mongoloid

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>>41267777
he talks bout fasting at 44 20

>>41264469

That's the current conventional thinking, but I gotta say, I'm doing 16/8, at an overall deficit, and I am still losing weight and my lifts are still going up.

And, totally subjective, I know, but I feel like I look better than I did when I started.

This is my experimental extreme protocol for getting from sedentary obese slob to semi jacked in just 8 weeks.So any fatass who has the balls to stick to it will be shredded by summer.

I will explain in terms of food, exercise and drugs.

Week 1
Food: eat exactly as you have been eating but eat at a deficit of 500-750 calories per day.(if you were eating 4000 calories eat 3250 calories) in addition drink at least 1 gallon of water a day.
Exercise: mild 3 day a week cardio sessions
Drugs: 250mg test e, 350 mg tren ace per week, 50mg wimstrol per day, 24mg ephedrine per day, 400mg caffeine per day.

Week 2: Food: eat the same diet you've been eating in week 1 but eat half the total calories (if you were eating 3325 calories, eat about 1650 calories) still consume at least 1 gallon of water a day.
Drugs: same as week 1, add in aromasin 25mg monday and Friday
Exercise: 3 mild hypertrophy weight training sessions immediately followed by 3 light cardio sessions, still training 3x a week.

Week 3
Food: eat 1000 calories per day, consisting only of fruits, vegetables, raw nuts and seeds. Drink at least a gallon of water a day. Take a multivitamin/mineral and pro biotic culture pill a day.
Drugs: same as week 2
Exercise:same as week 2

Week 4

Food: water fast, eat no or as close to no calories as possible, drink at least 1-2 gallons of water a day, continue taking the multi vitamin/mineral and probiotic.
Drugs: test e 250mg/week, tren ace 350mg/week, winstrol 100mg/day, ephedrine 24mg/day, aromasin 25mg Mon and Fri.
Exercise 3x per week light to moderate hypertrophy weight training sessions, +2 light to moderate cardio sessions for a total of 5 training days per week.

Week 5
Food same as week 4
Drugs same as week 4
Exercise same as week 4

Week 6
Food same as week 3, but add in 100 grams of protein via protein powder.
Drugs same as week 5
Food same as week 5

Weeks 7 and 8 everything the same as week 5

Week 9 eat at maintenance, standard PCT with Nolva and Clomid

>>41268043

"Yea let's take someone who over eats and have them eat nothing at all, surely that will work." - stupid faggot cocksucker

>>41269174
where am i supposed to get all those drugs

>>41269316
im genuinely asking

ive been losing steady weight since ive started my intermittent fast

I do the 8 hour eating window one

I've been losing about 1 lb every two weeks, very happy with that

I enjoy doing intermittent fasting, but after the initial 6-7 wakeful fast hours, I get these stomach pains and lightheadedness and it feels as though I'm about to vomit and this feeling comes and goes until I eventually eat. Is this normal and okay? Just a hunger pang? It hurts enough so that I'm unable to listen or speak to anyone so it sucks if it happens at work or school.

>>41269631
You're hyperglycemic.
Sorry.

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>>41264347
>>41264469
>>41264491
>>41264498

stop this autistic auguring about fasting vs calories in/calories out, It's been going on ever since Dr Fung and other shit stirrers came out with videos about how fasting was the true secret to weight loss and calorie counting doesn't work (even though I know from experience it does).

The points that are made are that...

>fasting reduces hunger
This is true, there are ketones and other appetite suppressors released when you only process fat.

>fasting helps weight loss
This also seems about right because of two reasons, It's easier to eat under your TDEE while fasting and you spend more time in the day with no insulin in your system, insulin prevents fat loss while promoting fat gain.

>fasting doesn't cause a loss in muscle
I choose to believe this given the evidence they've offered, while fasting HGH is released which helps maintain and gain when you do eat then workout, they also point out that tribal groups that only ate every now and then were very skinny but very lean.

The whole source of this shit show though is they're right, calorie counting wont work IF YOU EAT A BUNCH OF SHIT DURING THE DAY which they neglect to mention for whatever reason, its the shit food that promotes hunger to such bad degrees and they act like it isn't the fault of fat people for not eating less because eating all day makes them hungry but no shit when its just ice cream.

Intermittent Fasting works well for helping fat loss so long as you eat before and after you train and you actually DO train, I'm not sure about all that extended fasting.

But Calorie counting is as effective as it's always been so long as you don't shit.

I see no difference in your pic?

I have be IF for a month now and I have lost 6kilograms while not losing a fucking gram of muscle. I only eat 1 meal a day and its only about 800 calories. All you sticky worshipping faggots told me I would lose muscle and I would lose stregthn if I cut at too much of a defect but guess fucking what my lifts are going up. I am going to cut to about 10% body fat and then start eating above maintenence for my one meal a day. I feel better throughout the day. I sleep better and for less time at night and I am better rested the next day. FUCK ALL OF YOU WHO SAID THIS DOESNT WORK! 23/1 is god mode

>>41265870
>Jason Fung

Jesus fucking Christ... you have NO IDEA the mess you got yourself in.

I won't even try to argue with you. The moment one enters into the cults, nothing will deter that person.

Hope one day you'll realize the utter stupidity of listening to that man's advice.

>>41269174
>drugs
where the fuck do you get all of those

In trauma patients given varying levels of IV parenteral nutrition, a higher calorie/kg of bodyweight was directly associated with better outcomes

>>41271319
>I'm not obese, I'm resistant to trauma.

Look man, in life, having a lower percent bodyfat is directly associated with better pussy.

>>41264525
no ass
still mirin abs tho

>>41269554
1lbs every two weeks? you could easily do 2lbs per week

>>41266593
Because it's fucking /fit/. What do you expect, m8?

If you want to prove a point then post your body then OP

I do 24-26 hour fasts everyday. I don´t know are there benefits to it, I´m just used to it.

In my opinion, it doesn´t matter at which period of time you consume your calories in 30 hour range.

I eat as much calories as I did on the 6 meals a day, the only difference is that after 18 hour without eating I go deeper into ketosis than I would steadily spiking up my insulin.

You can also bulk by this method. I personally do this solely for the insulin reason. Just a little tweak in my opinion.

>>41267903
Diets have a high failure rate because fatties think the effects of a temporary diet will hold until the day they die. They do not understand that to be thin you need to live like a thin person aka eat less for your whole life. So they start eating like shit again thinking they will keep the lost pounds at bay while gaining them back slowly.

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>>41266878
>went through some shit
>didn't eat for over a week
>depression.jpg
>"I gotta man up, I'm going to the boxing gym"
>rode my bike two miles to the gym
>"I feel good, I'm totally ok"
>sit down and put on hand wraps
>go to the speed bag
>"weird...can't hit it more than twice"
>move to the heavy bag
>get winded after five punches
>"fuck I can't even do this now"
>painful as fuck ride home
>numb it with whisky
>didn't eat for another week

I lost twenty pounds in a little over two weeks through depression, fasting, panic attacks, and liquor for dinner.

I also felt like I had a stomach surgery when I started eating again. What was one meal before turned into three-four. Stomach shrinkage is a thing.

Also crying burns water weight.

>>41264900
Not trying to argue, just really curious now. So if i eat breakfast, lunch, and dinner and work out 2-3 hours a day are you saying i won't lose weight? Or im losing weight the wrong way? Compared to fasting the whole day? or fasting as in intermittent fasting?

>>41268504
>>41269239
So your arguments for this 'starvation' mode in which your body holds onto your fat for dear life and instead cannibalizes your muscle are a two strawmans and an ad hominem.

I'm fucking convinced!

>>41272770
help lol

>>41272770
There is no wrong way, that's the bottom line. There are, however, ways that are better suited for different purposes.

If you're yoked as fuck and want to retain as much muscle mass as possible while getting shredded, having a slight caloric reduction of about 300 to 500 kcal daily is going to be best for you. This way you can probably continue to progress or at the very least only plateau.

If you have more than 20 pounds to lose and are a complete amateur in terms of physical fitness, there are ways to lose fat faster and give you more immediate results. No average Joe is going to wait half an year or even more before he sees results.

Intermittent fasting, a.k.a. giving yourself a small window (ideally 6 to 4 hours a day) to consume your daily calories is the best of both worlds, no matter if you're doing keto, balanced or high carb diet. Even on high carb diet you're going to give your glycogen depots and insulin time to drain, and on keto you're just not going to feel hungry if you eat less.

Now if you eat more often and your meals contain a lot of sugar/starch, you're going to jack up your insulin, which is then going to do two things
>make your body consume all the sugars
>any additional calories from fat or even said sugars are going to be stored as fat

If we assume you're keeping track of your caloric intake, or in other words eating less than you expend, you only need to worry about half of the second part. You'll feel like shit and probably never get to the coveted 10% BF because of this.

It's hard to explain in 2000 characters, you'll have to dig into the different parts of what I said in order to learn for yourself. There are vegan bodybuilders and athletes who make the high carb diet work, but that's another question. Decide what your goals are and research which mode of eating is going to suit you personally. Some dude lost weight while eating only twinkies, some fatass literally ate nothing 360 days. Up to you which is best for you.

>>41272954
>some fatass literally ate nothing 360 days.

He was like 400 pounds when he started and ended up less than 200. Interesting read, he made an AMA on reddit if anyone is interested.

>>41272825

Losing fat means your body is in a state of catabolism. Maintaining muscle means your body is not in a state of catabolism. Losing fat but not muscle are conflicting ideas.

When you lose fat you will always lose some muscle, just like when you gain muscle you will always gain some fat. Otherwise we could just keep gaining to 20% bf and then cutting to 10% over and over and never lose a gram of muscle, which is of course ridiculous. Ask any advanced strength athlete what happens to their numbers when they lose a bit of weight. They go down, because they've lost muscle.

>>41273626
And where exactly did I say anything contradicting that? Someone claimed that your body goes after your muscles instantly which is retarded and simply not true. You will lose negligible amounts of muscle, you're not going to become an Auschwitz survivor.

In fact, let me back up a second. What you're saying implies that you wouldn't be able to make any sort of gains while on IF which is also retarded and provably untrue. Yes, its easier to gain muscle mass if you bulk than if you maintain/cut, the latter is not impossible however.

All your 'arguments' are either untrue or gross oversimplifications.

>>41273714

>Someone claimed that your body goes after your muscles instantly
>You will lose negligible amounts of muscle

So now you've gone from "it doesn't lose muscle" to "it loses negligible amounts of muscle". So you're agreeing that it DOES lose muscle right off the bat.

>What you're saying implies that you wouldn't be able to make any sort of gains while on IF

No, if you eat a caloric surplus on IF you will gain weight and therefor gain muscle. If you eat at a deficit you will lose weight and therefor muscle.

IF will change how much muscle you gain or lose though. It's based on muscle protein synthesis which can be stimulated through ingestion of amino acids roughly every 3 hours after the refractory period is over. If you fast for 24 hours, assuming you're awake for 16 of them, that's 5 times you could have stimulated MPS but didn't, resulting in either more muscle lost if you're at a deficit or less muscle gained if you're on a surplus.

>>41264347
>Facebook fitness: the OP
Not even broscience. It's Stacy-after-two-kids science.

>>41264571

Fuck up you moron.

>>41265286

Let's be real, our bodies have still not adapted to agriculture. We're feeling the full effects of that now, increases in chronic diseases, increase in endocrine disorders, increase in obesity.

The human body was designed for long periods of fasting with brief periods of feasting, not for an endless bounty of food. Especially the kind of shit we eat these days & have on tap anytime we want.

The idea of cramming 250g of sugar in your cum receptacle when you binge on Ben n Jerrys is a completely foreign notion to a body that was designed during the nomadic era of homo sapien.

>>41273735
First of all, nice strawman on the muscles part, never once in this thread have I said you're not going to lose muscle. I doubt it, but I said multiple times that you're going to have hard time progressing on a caloric deficit, I also said it's retarded to think you're going to make any progress whatsoever while doing an extended fast, i.e. eating absolutely nothing.

Since the 'against' crowd seem to be forgetting something, this thread is primarily aimed at people wanting to lose weight/fat, not people wanting to compete as bodybuilders/strongmen. Can we at the very least agree on this point? Because if we do, from then onwards, any argument you make in the way of 'yeah, fasting doesn't work for me because I'm already pretty lean and going after a certain physique outside of the norm is rings pretty hollow. What is more, any muscle you lost during this will be regained at a rate much faster than building new muscle.

NO situation exists in which you're at a huge caloric deficit and somehow you're losing muscle mass BUT NOT bodyfat. This is literal HAES logic. It goes against evolutionary science and how bodies work. This >>41264571
simply isn't true, end of story.

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>not eating clean monday-saturday
>not eating whatever and however much food you want in place of your normal calories on sunday

shiggy

>>41273735

fyi the hormonal response to short-term fasting (i.e. less than 5 days) is net muscle sparing.

within the first week of not eating there is no difference in muscle loss between someone who is starved and someone who is fed.

we know why and it's because of growth hormone.

we know GH is significantly increased when fasting, and we know GH has a powerful effect on muscle sparing

how do we know this? when we inhibit GH production of participants who were fasting all of a sudden the muscle loss was SIGNIFICANTLY higher than the control.

what does this tell us? ol GH has some enormous muscle sparing effects, and that's why fasted individuals won't significantly lose muscle for > 1 week of not eating.

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>>41273810
Careful, a jar of nutella and two pizzas can completely destroy your weeks progress.

>>41273808

"If you have no fat left yeah. When you're in a fasted state the first thing that gets targeted is fat. If there's no more fat then your body cannibalizes its muscles."

So you were trying to say your body wouldn't lose muscle unless it was down to essential fat, essentially saying that any weight lost above 4% won't result in muscle loss, which simply isn't true. You will lose muscle whilst losing weight even if your bf% is 20+.

Even if the thread is aimed at primarily weight loss, IF doesn't really have any advantages if the same diet without IF is isocaloric. You could make the argument that it might be good for compliance if fasting helps you stick to a diet.

>NO situation exists in which you're at a huge caloric deficit and somehow you're losing muscle mass BUT NOT bodyfat

Yeah, I think everybody can agree on that.

>>41273847

>within the first week of not eating there is no difference in muscle loss between someone who is starved and someone who is fed.

Link the journal.

say someone is 330 pounds and wants to lose the weight by fasting? what's the outcome going to look like and is it better then going to workout 3 days a week

>>41273904

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11147801

>>41273877
I literally posted you one of the many examples in this thread of people disagreeing with that notion.
>>41265249
Here's another

>IF doesn't really have any advantages if the same diet without IF is isocaloric

Except for the whole jacking up your insulin part. And yes, it definitely is good for compliance

>>41273923
Best if you combine both.

>>41273810
>not eating clean monday-saturday
>not eating whatever food you want on sunday
>But with a calorie restriction to your TDEE so you don't fuck up a whole weeks work of progress
It must be nice fucking up a whole week by eating 13 happy meals

>>41273927
it's not really fasting if I eat before and after a workout though

>>41273904

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20300080

Another one showing 24-hour fasts cause no (literally 0) muscle loss.

>>41273944
Google intermittent fasting and do yourself a favor.

>>41273923
Diet will always be more important than workouts when it comes to weight loss.
ALWAYS.

Combining it helps a lot though and there's no reason not to move around an hour every day.

>>41273924

There is no control, plus the study states

>Muscle-protein breakdown was increased among participants who fasted without GH

i.e. people who fasted without growth hormone saw their muscles being broken down faster.

>>41273950

>Another one showing 24-hour fasts cause no (literally 0) muscle loss.

Fat free mass does not just mean muscle, that's everything including water, connective tissue, mass in the digestive system etc, and it fluctuates which you can see that in the data. It starts at 52kg, goes up to 52.8kg and ends up at 51.9. Plus they did lose almost 1kg of fat free mass over the course of the study.

>Insulin promotes lipogenisis
>the body releases insulin whenever the glucose levels in the blood rise
>so constant snacking keeps insulin levels high
>this makes losing fat more difficult
>an easy fix to this problem is to have an "eating window" (4-8 hours) per day
>HURF DURF IF YOU EAT NOTHING FOR 4 WEEKS YOU'LL BE SUPERMAN
Why do people always have to overdo things?

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>>41264347
>bulked up to 94kg over the last year
>started cutting in January
>eating the same shit as before but reduced my calorie intake from ~3300 to ~2600

Im down over 15kgs by now and a sixpack is getting more and more visible. Consuming calories while you lose weight just as dieting in general is only a meme if you're a lazy fuck who does no physical activity.

>>41264599
this guy ain't skinnyfat, though, he's just fat, or chubby at best.

have done a month-long water fast before. my two cents: if you're a heavy meat-eater, drink booze, smoke, drink loads of coffee and sugary foods, then it's going to be hard.
try cutting out the crap for a few weeks first, then go juicing for a few days. that should knock a few pounds off. going straight into a water fast just like that is not smart anons.

I'm not gonna eat today. Just gonna have water/coffee and a magnesium pill at some point. If I can't sleep I'll have a scoop of protein I guess.

I know that's basically all there is to it, but any other tips? 190lbs, 5'11, trying to maintain a 1-2lb per week weight loss.

I will add to all those who think that just fasting is enough: you need to learn how to cook properly and stop eating crap. get a bit more active and do some exercise. stretching, whatever.

otherwise you'll just hurt yourselves or fail to gain any longterm benefits from the fast.

skipping meals is not "fasting" if you're lazy. you'd be better off juicing or something for a weekend or a week, or going vegetarian for a month. Think about it, anons. Thanks.

>>41269631
this is normal. you can counter it by drinking some hot water with some honey or brown sugar dissolved in it (don't go overboard!) Keep drinking plenty of fluid in any case.

this also works for other minor discomforts. Water, salt and sugar - see what your body needs and adjust accordingly.

>>41269631
>>41274910
right, when I did a 24h fast for fun some salt water helped me when I was feeling bad.
a multivitamin probably wont hurt either.

the key is in balance, and knowing how to keep it.
salt and the odd spoon of sugar can go a long way in maintaining one's sanity over longer fasts.
sleep will be reduced, but be prepared for the odd nap at times. be ready to take everything very slowly too.

>>41264965
>>41265012
Thirst is not equivalent to hunger.

Thirst is a symptom of dehydration.

You're saying hunger is a symptom of hunger, which is stupid.

Fasting has huge benefits when done intermittently/in moderation, but all this shit about fasting for days/weeks at a time is fucking stupid.

Literal monks don't fast for that long.

>>41272516
>Also crying burns water weight
/fit/ lifehacks

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>>41264599
>muscles ARE everything
LMFAO

you're gravely mistaken

BONES ARE EVERYTHING. BONES. Frame/skeleton/skull ie your BONES is what determines your life. NOT "muscles" lmao.

bones don't lie, muscles do

RESPECT BONE LAW

>>41272954
Thanks for writing all that. Appreciate the advice. I'm just in a really weird spot rn with my body and health and finally doing a lot now.

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>>41276044
bones are nothing if you cover them in lard

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>>41264347
A /fit/ anon suggested 19/5 fast. LeanGains says 16/8. What are the benefits & drawbacks of each? I might be able to do 16/8 with the first "meal" being just a protein shake with half a banana before the workout (would burn quickly).

>>41264706
Drink green tea, like a liter at a time

>>41276044
>tfw bonelet

>>41269942
>I have lost 6kilograms while not losing a fucking gram of muscle.

I remember when I was this delusional.

>>41279094
The longer fasting times gives you more of the hormonal benefits, but are harder to stick to day-to-day.

>>41264706
>>41279232
Different anon here. I drink hot decaf green tea. A cup at a time. Just am much as I want. Doesn't have to be a liter. Don't know if this would help.

Get an electric kettle. Cost like $20.

>>41279301
Thanks. Got any source?

>>41267777
this is the source , I know it's long but there lots of info on IF and hormones

>>41279664
Thanks. Will check out some time.

I have been doing IF (16:8 - 20:4 - 24 depending on how I'm feeling that day) since Feb 11th.

I've lost 43lbs so far. 328 to 285

My lifts are all improving (I just started lifting like a month ago)

I used to get heartburn all the time, like every night. Have not had heartburn since I started fasting (didn't realize it until I read what OP said)

Overall, I feel amazing, and am happy I can lift more, and I'm getting more active.

If this is a meme, it's working great for me.

>>41279094
>all carbs are bad
>whole potatoes are equivalent to fries and processed carbs
trash

>>41264347
Yep, naked and afraid proves this. If you don't eat you lose weight. And the human body really really really really really really really really really really really does not need a lot of food to survive, like 500 is all you really need at all, and protein is basically the only food you need.

Just eat like one chicken breast a day.

>>41264347
Let's not forget the spiritual aspects of this. Many many religions practice fasting, it's an extremely healthy and benficial process which grounds you as a person, and brings you closer to balance, self discipline and maintaining a healthy connection between you, the world, and God.

There are no downsides to fasting. I recommend everyone to try it. The self discipline and mental peace it teaches is what I've found the most beneficial, and after a while weight loss became secondary to it.

>>41264347
>your real problem which is food addiction

yeah i need it to fucking live guy

>>41280328
Yea, it's not the best infographic, but the still some good information.

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>>41265308
>>41265985
>Taking medical advice from 4chan

Do it.