Psychiatry, psychology, and other mental health care-related fields

>>38981742
50 years ago they would have just said you're a human with human problems

But now you're a special snowflake with 4 mental retardation issues

Progress, huh?

>>38981784
Really makes you think huh

>>38981784
Stop being an idiot, mental illnesses are more exaggerated than regular human emotions. That's why they're disorders. You can get brain problems the same way you can get heart or skin problems

>>38981884
Yeah but sis you read ops list? His "disorders" are being shy and lack of focus

The answer to these is not as much medication as he can stomach but instead, just living.

>>38981742
>Meanwhile, my psychiatrist wants to stop prescribing me Adderall

Probably not a bad idea. Virtually every single "mass shooter" was on some sort of mental health medication.

>>38981884

>Stop being an idiot, mental illnesses are more exaggerated than regular human emotions. That's why they're disorders. You can get brain problems the same way you can get heart or skin problems

>brain problems

That's what I've been thinking a lot about lately.

One of the reasons that I went to see a neurologist was because after having seen my first psychiatrist for the first time back in the 1st of July of 2013 and he prescribed me Adderall, I was concerned that Adderall might not have been the right medication for me because I was worried that I might have been genetically predisposed to developing schizophrenia and thus Adderall might hasten the onset of schizophrenia and therefore trigger a psychotic episode.

So I went to see a neurologist and he told me to get an MRI scan done on my brain (which I did, and I paid $700 for back in mid-2013.) He didn't find anything unusual that might indicate that I was at the onset of schizophrenia or that I might develop it sometime in the future.

The neurologist then told me that I seemed to have anxiety and a bit of depression, and so he prescribed me anti-convulsant medication for treating my essential tremors, and then referred me to my second psychiatrist (apparently these two guys were friends during their college days.) And that psychiatrist then prescribed me antidepressant and anti-anxiety medication (after yet another 15-minute-long conversation) which I took for eight months and only made me feel much worse than I already did. Shortly thereafter, my neurologist closed his office, retired, and then refused answer to any and all of both my phone calls and e-mails. This second psychiatrist told me to go find another psychiatrist.

>>38981742
actual MD here

psychiatric illnesses are real illnesses.
However you can`t really think about those as standalone entities like an inflammated gall bladder.

Your diagnoses aren't illnesses absolute in themselves but all of it is a large continuum.
The "illnesses" and diagnoses are mostly arbitrary set-points/cutoffs medical professionals once consented to use so the ailments of the mind could be researched and treated in a systematic manner.

What that means is that the consented approaches in treatment dont neccesserily have to fit your individual case.

What makes the whole field even more complicated is the unity of body and mind, meaning that your physiology affects your thoughts and vice versa -> hence the multimodal approach via psychotherapy and pharmacotherapy in most mental illnesses.

What I want to convey here is that mental illnesses are VERY complex in their individual origin, treatment and so on. Meaning that most psychiatrists have to rely on the rigid systematics of treatment and diagnosis mentioned before. This means that those might not be 100% fitting in your individual case.

English is not my first language sorry for that mess.

>>38981884

Agh, shit, I couldn't finish my thought on that last post of mine.

Anyway.

So what I was trying to get at was... if the neurologist didn't believe that psychiatry was "scientific", why even bother sending me to a psychiatrist at all? He did tell me that he believed that my essential tremors and insomnia were being caused by my anxiety and depression. So then, are things like "anxiety" and "depression" considered "neurological" problems, "psychiatric" problems, "psychological" problems, or all of the aforementioned? How are such things supposed to be treated, and by who? Neurologists? Psychiatrists? Psychologists? Therapists? All of the aforementioned?

If a patient is prescribed all sorts of medications that are supposed to help their symptoms improve, that are supposed to help with their: anxiety, depression, insomnia, essential tremors. etc.... but none of the medications work, then what else is the patient supposed to do?

If a patient has already met with all of these doctors... neurologists, psychiatrists, psychologists, therapists... and the patient is still experiencing the symptoms, what else is the patient supposed to do?

If disorders such as "Major Depressive Disorder" and "Generalized Anxiety Disorder" and "Social Anxiety Disorder" are "physical" things, things of the "body" rather than the "mind", if such things have "mechanical underpinnings"... then why can't such disorders be identified by scans like MRI, PET, CT, etc.?

If such disorders can't be identified physically, then who is to say whether or not they are "real"? Who is to say whether or not they are "mental"?

If these disorders truly are "all in the mind", then why should the patient need to take expensive medication or go through expensive psychotherapy for things that might not even be "real"? Why can't the patient simply use their own "will power" to "overcome" these things that may really all be in "their head"?

>>38982217
what you need as pharmacotherapy to keep your mind and thoughts to spiral further into your problems and lots conversational therapy in all available forms.

>>38982250
My friend MD here again

The physical diagnostic tools only work on a limited scale.
Most mental disorders work on a molecular scale we cant tap into via imaging (yet)

also doctors are human too and knowledge has its individual limits, so it happens that patients get referred to other doctors until you find the one that knows whats happening with you.
That's especially true in psychiatry and the some neurological fields, where its also alot about the personal connection between patient and doctor and not only mechanical things.

>>38982250
also as I said before there is no seperation between mind and body, no seperation between physical and mental
youre thinking to much in categories

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>>38982086

>Probably not a bad idea. Virtually every single "mass shooter" was on some sort of mental health medication.

Some of the most common pieces of advice that I've received from people on how to deal with depression is stuff like "go outside" - "get some sun" - "exercise". And, well, as it turns out, I've done just that. When I first started taking Adderall (back in January of 2015) I suddenly started feeling a great deal of energy and motivation, so much so that I would feel bored simply sitting in front of my computer all day long. So I started going outside and walking for four hours every day, some days I would walk for much longer. I lost a great deal of weight during that time. I went from weighing around 284 pounds in January 2015 down to about 160 pounds in November 2015.

It would seem that Adderall mitigates some of the vegetative symptoms of my depression. And it would seem that my psychologist would agree with me, as he wrote on my psychological evaluation report (which I will attempt to attach to this post.)

I realize that Adderall is a psychostimulant, but it seems to have proven somewhat more effective in treating my depression than the actual antidepressants that I used to take between the years of 2013 and 2014. Which is why I only find it baffling to think that the nurse practitioner wanted to prescribe me an antipsychotic (Abilify) while simultaneously prescribing me a psychostimulant (Adderall). And my psychiatrist (the nurse practitioner's superior) wanted to stop prescribing me Adderall altogether, despite my psychologist's advice that Adderall has been greatly beneficial in treating part of my depression and my psychologist's observation that I do not have schizophrenia.

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>>38982086

Here's page 2 of my psychological evaluation report.

>>38982382
antipsychotics arent only used in shizophrenia
they are also used in certain kinds of depressions and disorders.
The simultanious use of an antipsychotic and amphetamines is also no problem here.
You might want to switch to ritalin(methylphenidate) instead of adderal (amphetamine) because adderal usually has higher fluctuations in serum levels and more addictive properties.

>>38982382
>>38982422
MD here again

your doctor is right here.
Continue medication and conversational therapy and first and foremost:

- stop being a NEET (which is probably a major factor in your depression etc,)

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>>38982371

>also as I said before there is no seperation between mind and body, no seperation between physical and mental
>youre thinking to much in categories

My problem here is trying to fully understand what it is that I have, whether or not I truly have it, how it is that I can convince other people that what I have is "real", what is the correct treatment for me to be receiving, and trying to convince other people that I can't do this all by myself.

A few years ago (before I decided to seek mental health care) I remember reading this article:

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2013/01/08/are-raising-generation-deluded-narcissists.html

In it, the psychiatrist Dr. Keith Ablow wrote the following:

>Watch for an epidemic of depression and suicidality, not to mention homicidality, as the real self-loathing and hatred of others that lies beneath all this narcissism rises to the surface.

So I read that article and I started thinking that maybe I might be a narcissist. That maybe there's something seriously wrong with me. That maybe I have Narcissistic Personality Disorder. That this is why I'm so depressed and anxious all the time. That this is why so many people have described me as being "oversensitive." That this is why I'm a 27-year-old unemployed high school drop-out with no friends.

I will attempt to attach a page from the DSM-5 regarding Narcissistic Personality Disorder.

I highlighted the following sentence:

>Sustained feelings of shame or humiliation and the attendant self-criticism may be associated with social withdrawal, depressed mood, and persistent depressive disorder (dysthymia) or major depressive disorder.

"Major depressive disorder" is circled.

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>>38982532

Here's the rest of the pages for Narcissistic Personality Disorder on the DSM-5.

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>>38982532

Here's page 670.

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>>38982532

Aaaaaand here's page 672.

These four copies are each of the four pages for the personality disorder: "Narcissistic Personality Disorder" straight out of the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, Fifth Edition (which I scanned using one of the scanners at the Los Angeles Central Library a few months back.)

>>38982371

Anyway, what I was trying to get at with these posts here:

>>38982532
>>38982573
>>38982585
>>38982616

...is that maybe I really was "weak" all along, as so many people (especially people within my own family, have told me.)

I remember in middle school, my classmates would ambush me, hold me down, steal my money, food, Pokemon cards, and pummel me in the face.

I remember once asking my older brother (he's 16 years older than me) why it is that people are so cruel to me. He first told me, "it's all in your head." A few seconds later he added, "it's because you're weak. People sense that you're weak."

I remember once asking my brother why it is that he must always loudly make jokes at my expense everywhere we go, and he said, "get over it. You're weak. You want people to think you're weak? Okay, you're weak. You're weak."

I remember once asking my brother if he knew what depression was, why it is that I was taking antidepressants, what they were supposed to be doing for me, what they were really doing to me, and why I had depression in the first place. He said, "hahaha. I don't care. Why should I care? Stop whining. Stop feeling sorry for yourself. Who cares? Nobody cares. Suck it up. Tough it out. There are people a lot worse off than you. Be a man."

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>>38982532
Are you jealous, spiteful and hateful of other people? Are you very selfish? Do you feel both inferior and superior to other people in a weird mix?

To me it doesn't sound like you have NPD, but it's hard to judge from this thread on its own. Like the other anon said, mental disorders are not black and white, but more of a spectrum. At this moment in time your behaviour fits a certain description for which they are allowed to give you a certain treatment.

Keep seeing your psychologist, take your adderall if that has been a positive influence on your life. Are you going through CBT with your psychologist? If not, bring it up.

Your friends and family telling you to go out and meet people, etc, aren't entirely wrong either. Through dedication alone to work on your weaknesses you can make a huge difference in changing your behaviour, thought patterns, and ultimately your mood.

t. psychology student

>>38982532
let me stress it again and make it clear

its all one big thing

it is very likely that youre narcissistic and it's also not unlikely that all those other labels fit aswell. Those are only there to "describe", paint a rough picture of a soul. To put something into categories which has no catergories.

Most likely you didnt develop love for yourself and a healthy feeling of self-worth in your life which led to your problems. This however is not hard to see for the professionals youre working with, though it is hard to come by and change.

What you mostly need to do is to ACCEPT whats happpening, and to accept who you are now. One can see how entangled you are in all of this.

Convincing others and/or the general public that mental illnesses are actual problems and illnesses is a task that is not yours to fulfill, as the medical community is working on that for decades already and only some progress has been done.
If you cant find support in your social circles you can try to find this support in other patients and in medical professionals.

>>38982343

>also doctors are human too and knowledge has its individual limits, so it happens that patients get referred to other doctors until you find the one that knows whats happening with you.

>That's especially true in psychiatry and the some neurological fields, where its also alot about the personal connection between patient and doctor and not only mechanical things.

My problem is that I don't quite have the luxury to go around looking for the "right" doctors anymore (if there even is a "right" doctor.) My family has been using my name and social security number for tax-related things revolving around my older brother's illegitimate and morally dubious business these past five years or so. I get about 10% out of the income that I supposedly make (according to my taxes.) I use that money for my medical expenses since I don't have any insurance. I don't have the luxury to go from doctor to doctor, going from one diagnosis to another, going from one medication to another, taking all sorts of different medications for all sorts of different diagnoses, medications that could ultimately do me more harm than good... medications like those antidepressant and anti-anxiety medications that I was taking back in 2014 that made me feel like complete shit. Medications that essentially put me in a vegetative state for over a year. I lost an entire year of my life because of those medications. I could barely function during that time.

And I know that it's basically pointless to try and convince people how miserable I felt back then, and how miserable I am now... because I realize that neither time travel nor "telepathy" are possible. I can't take somebody back in time, give them the ability of telepathy, and have them feel exactly how I felt back in 2014. I tried to get my family back then to try and understand how I felt, but they refused to accept it. They refused to believe any of it. My family seems to have a limited capacity for empathy.

>>38982638

Hi OP, PhD in Psychology here, I'm sorry that things are difficult for you right now. But I agree with the MD anon, and with your doctor's diagnosis.

I get why you might think that you have Narcissistic Personality Disorder but based on your doctor's notes and your post that I'm quoting it seems like you see yourself in a negative light and ruminate on your past a lot. It doesn't seem like you hold yourself in the highest regard and feel superior to others.

I would follow your doctor's recommendations, and try and do one thing a day that puts you in a social situation, like volunteering or work or whatever. It will help you feel comfortable around others and it structures your time, which is a big help in itself.

Best of luck anon!

>>38982497

>- stop being a NEET (which is probably a major factor in your depression etc,)

And I've tried doing just that.

I tried to change. I really did. I've tried something different every year.

My first and only job I ever had was as a security guard at a mall. I didn't expect to end up working at a mall, but I was glad to have any job at all. I went with security because I felt that as a security guard I wouldn't have to talk to people, but I was wrong. My supervisors would tell me that I needed to learn to be more outgoing and comfortable around people, because I needed to do customer service. So that's what I tried to do. I figured that as adults, people wouldn't be as cruel as they were in middle school. I tried to get over my anxiety and just try to be a "normal" person. This only ended in further humiliation and failure.

I am not certain what I was doing wrong, but I eventually started to receive complaints from everybody. I heard from two other officers that people were saying negative things about me, calling me names such as: "idiot" - "imbecile" - "retard" - "moron", etc. I was certainly not making any friends. Supervisors would regularly become frustrated with me and verbally discipline me over the radio for everyone to hear. My radio calls would often go ignored by both dispatch and my supervisors. They would then complain that I wasn't using the radio enough. Others would complain that I was using it too much. I would receive contradicting orders and advice from my supervisors and other people, making my job incredibly difficult. I felt terribly miserable and lonely, and I was afraid to make any complaints because I didn't know who I could trust. I found myself constantly analyzing every single thing I said and did, and the things that other people said and did.

I quit that job after only a single month. I figured that I would quickly be able to find another job, but it's been nearly five years since I quit. I am still unemployed.

>>38982497

>- stop being a NEET (which is probably a major factor in your depression etc,)

After that job experience of mine, I felt that there was something seriously wrong with me. Something that was significantly affecting the way I perceive reality, something that significantly impacted my senses: both visually and audibly. Maybe it was a mental disorder like schizophrenia, or a personality disorder like Narcissistic Personality Disorder, or something that was affecting my attention span like Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder, or something that was affecting my energy like narcolepsy. This is one of the reasons why I quit my job, because I felt that I could no longer be a productive member of society. I felt that I needed to seek help before I could function. So nearly two years later, I ended up seeing my first psychiatrist for the first time (back in the 1st of July 2013.) That same year I also ended up seeing a neurologist, who suggested that I get an MRI scan done on my brain (which I did), and he referred me to a second psychiatrist.

>>38982698
MD here again

I understand you feel like you are in a bad situation here economically and mentally.

However I dont know much about the american healthcare system, but I cant imagine that there is nothing that cant be done about your situation.
If your current treatment helps you feel better and move foward (even in small steps) continue.
You could and should also share these thoughts you write here with your doctors/ shrink/ whoever treats you.
If you had a good relationship with your now retired doctor maybe even contact him/her in some way.
Understand that you are not helpless in ANY situation ever, the decisions are always yours to make.

>>38982497

>- stop being a NEET (which is probably a major factor in your depression etc,)

And so therein lies the problem. I seem to have reached this point in my life where everybody around me has already assumed that I have, in fact, been officially diagnosed with Narcissistic Personality Disorder. That I am, in fact, a narcissist. Why do I say this? Well...

In August of 2015, I decided to try getting the "adult high school diploma". Went to a place called "Job Corps" first, but I was told that I was too old to go there since they only accepted people between the ages of 16 – 24. Since I was 26 at the time, I was already too old to go to Job Corps. I then went to some place called an "occupational center", but it seemed that they were charging a bit too much for their classes.

So after nearly 10 years of dropping out, I decided to return to my old high school. I had already taken and passed the GED exam back in February 2010, and earned the "high school equivalency certificate", however; a cousin of mine told me that it looks better in resumes to have both the adult high school diploma and high school equivalency certificate when applying for jobs. The adult school classes are also free, so I figured, hey, this might be interesting. Being back in my old high school could make me feel nostalgic and might even help with my depression, and may even improve both my memory and attention spans through "neuroplasticity". Maybe now with Adderall, I could do much better in school.

It turned out to not be so easy.

>>38982497

>- stop being a NEET (which is probably a major factor in your depression etc,)

On my first day I began to suspect that my teacher did not like me, but I brushed it off as it being due to my imagination. The adult school classes started at 1:30 PM, which was right in the middle of the regular high school classes when there's high school students (the students' ages: 14 – 18, my age: 27) walking around campus. I had initially assumed that the adult school classes would be filled with people 18+ years old (hence why the classes are called "adult" school), but it turned out that the majority of the students in adult school classes are actually minors, some of them are as young as 15 or even younger. I only needed to take three classes to obtain the high school diploma (English Composition/Expository, United States History 2, and United States Government), each class could be completed within ~100 hours, ~6 hours could be completed in 1 day (adult school classes ran from 1:30 PM to 9:00 PM, with a break from 5:30 PM to 6:00 PM), ~24 hours could be completed in 1 week (adult school classes were only on: Mondays, Tuesdays, Wednesdays, and Thursdays), and so I figured I could finish these classes within ~3 months.

>>38981742
just learn to live with it

>>38982497

I was wrong. It's been over a year since I started these classes and I've only finished 1 class so far. With each passing month, it was becoming increasingly obvious to me that my teacher, his teacher's assistant, and the students strongly disliked me. This became painfully obvious in April 2016 when I ended up writing an essay in which I believed that I may have Narcissistic Personality Disorder (or some other personality disorder) and that it was what may have caused my depression and anxiety. I had originally written on the essay: “if it turns out that I do have Narcissistic Personality Disorder or some other personality disorder”, but my teacher told me to remove that second “personality disorder” out of the sentence as it was redundant. The essay was typed up and saved on one of the school computers in the classroom. I had assumed that the essay would only be read by the teacher, but I was wrong. The essay could have easily been read by anyone in the classroom, including the students.

As it turns out, the essay actually was read by some of the students. And it seems as if: my teacher, his assistant, and his students have read the Wikipedia article on Narcissistic Personality Disorder. So now it would seem that everyone in the classroom have jumped to the conclusion that I have indeed been officially diagnosed with Narcissistic Personality Disorder. And so now it would appear to be that they are going out of their way to humiliate and/or criticize me to drive me out of school. My teacher seems to think that I have ulterior (and malicious) motives for returning to my old high school.

I remember walking to my classroom one day and seeing a group of about 10—15 students outside of the classroom whispering to each other, and when they saw me, they stopped talking, turned to look at me, and one of them said “shit”. One student said, “why do you guys talk about him?” Another replied, “because he's a narcissist.”

>>38981784
You're right. 50 years ago was the pinnacle of science and knowledge, and we've only degressed since.

I saw this pasta on /sci/ not too long ago. Fuck off, OP

>>38982497

>- stop being a NEET (which is probably a major factor in your depression etc,)

My judgment informs me that this world is not a pleasant place for people like me.

Once a person is labeled a "narcissist", or a "sociopath", or a "psychopath"... or diagnosed with just about any other mental and/or personality disorder, it's basically like they're having a big label stamped on their forehead for everybody to see that states "EVIL" or "LAZY" or "CRAZY" or "WEAK" or "STUPID". And so, people take advantage of this. They see a person who is unfit for this world. They see a person who is deserving of all the hate and mockery. I finally understand now. That's the impression that I get.

I tried to change. I really did. I've tried to change every year. I've tried doing something different every year. I can't do anything right. I couldn't even get my high school diploma during my adult school classes. I confided in my teacher. I told him about my depression, my anxiety, my insecurities... and he took advantage of it all. I wrote about it in my essays. He took pleasure in my misery. He, his assistant, the rest of his students. They sense my weakness. They feed off of my misery.

Schaudenfreude. People enjoy seeing those who are weaker than them, it makes them feel better about their own situations. And those "weak:" people that they see, they see people deserving of all the hate and mockery, instead of seeing people deserving of love and understanding. That's how people in this world survive.

I took my therapist's advice and tried to make a friend. I've tried to make many friends. I tried to make my teacher my friend. Multiple failed attempts. Every attempt has failed.

>>38981742
Doesn't matter, initial treatment is an SSRI for 3 of them and stimulants for the 4th. Abilify is retarded he's just trying to distract you while he takes away your candy. If you're lucky, some of these drugs will help you. Most of them require 6 weeks to be effective, and they will make you more anxious in the meantime. If you didn't give them enough time chances are you failed, its the literal most common reason people don't benefit from them. It's not total bullshit, some people get genuine help...

>>38982921
you seem to care A LOT what others think of you and that this causes you much trouble.

Why do you care? Why dont you continue your education FOR YOURSELF. Why do you care about your teachers? Why do you care if people in school may not want to be associated with you? (Why did you write an essay about your mental health problems???)

Continue your treatment and continue your way towards independence. Independence creates self-worth, and self-worth is what youre obviously lacking.

I'm a Uk-based addictions psychiatrist AMA

>>38983057
How to stay away from porn, senpai?

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>>38982946

>I saw this pasta on /sci/ not too long ago. Fuck off, OP

Yeah, I know. That was me. I started that thread. I wrote all of that stuff.

My thread reached its bump limit so it died and was pruned.

Someone in that thread made the suggestion (pic related) that my problem is a "health and fitness problem". So I decided to come here.

>>38983027

>(Why did you write an essay about your mental health problems???)

Why? Because I had assumed that the essay would only be read by the teacher. I had assumed that my thoughts were private, personal. I had assumed that my teacher would be a mature, professional, adult teacher. I had assumed that the classroom would be full of mature adult students (or at the very least make up the majority of the class.)

It was a reflective essay.

Isn't that what a English Composition/Expository class is for? To improve one's writing skills?

Isn't that the sort of thing that adults take adult school classes for?

That's part of the reason that I decided to return to school, anyway. To improve my writing skills. To improve myself in general.

I wrote that essay as an attempt to organize my thoughts into a legible manner, in a manner that is coherent for other people to read. For other people to understand how I think and feel, and why I do the things that I do.

I wrote that essay as an attempt to better understand myself.

>>38983004
Schadenfreude only works for people who are more or less mentally ill aswell.

You know the stereotype of the bully who bullies to feel better because they hate themselves?
Protip: thats a stereotype for a reason.

There are not many healthy people in this world.
There are mostly underdiagnosed people.

Take your meds, give them time as >>38983021
said

and recognize people as what they are: not better off than you most of the time. You may feel like shit, and people may also try to make you even more feel like shit. But thats because people also feel like shit and are made to feel shit by other people.
Its the great cycle of pissing each other off.

The sooner you realize that, the sooner you can stop giving a fuck. And people will see and FEEL that you just dont give a fuck about this great cycle of bullshit. And the small group of people who also stopped giving a fuck will recognize you as their own and welcome you.

>>38983057
AA yes or no?

>>38983129
I dunno where u live but in the US that's a big FERPA violation

>>38981742
You're insecure is all it is, you're convinced there is something inherently wrong with you, go live your life and be yourself, learn acceptance and forgiveness be positive and humble you'll learn a lot about people and yourself

>>38983189
m8 you're perfectly right, but thats maybe a tad too aphoristic for him to actually understand and employ

>>38983185
The patients I am seeing are in the acute phase of their illness - requiring admission to our in-patient unit. Long term management plans, such as AA, are overseen by the community team and I don't have much knowledge of them to be honest.

>>38983021

>Doesn't matter, initial treatment is an SSRI for 3 of them and stimulants for the 4th. Abilify is retarded he's just trying to distract you while he takes away your candy. If you're lucky, some of these drugs will help you. Most of them require 6 weeks to be effective, and they will make you more anxious in the meantime. If you didn't give them enough time chances are you failed, its the literal most common reason people don't benefit from them. It's not total bullshit, some people get genuine help...

That's just the thing. I actually *have* take SSRIs.

I first went to see my first mental health care worker (my first psychiatrist) back in the 1st of July of 2013. This guy diagnosed me with Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder and prescribed me Adderall after talking to him for about fifteen minutes, and I could swear that the guy was falling asleep that entire time. He was yawning, nodding off, closing his eyes... at some point he just stopped talking and closed his eyes for about ten seconds while I was describing my symptoms. He would even repeat some of his questions and make me repeat myself several times. After all that I remember thinking to myself: "really? You're prescribing Adderall to me just like that? What the hell?"

I then went to see a neurologist and he told me to get an MRI scan done on my brain. According to the neurologist, he didn't find anything unusual on this MRI scan aside from something called an "arachnoid cyst" which is apparently very common, normal, and goes away on its own.

The neurologist then referred me to my second psychiatrist. And that psychiatrist then prescribed me escitalopram and clonzapema which I took for eight months and only made me feel much worse than I already did.

>>38983283
then you should go back to that psychiatrist and try different SSRIs

>>38983283
have u tried fluoxetine? what about an SNRI? atypicals like mirtazepine? buspirone? I work under the prescribing authority of a psych in an outpatient clinic and I do all the pharmacotherapy...if this thread is up in 6 hours we can talk more

>>38982343

I've already gone back and forth from one doctor to another...

...I went from a neurologist, who then referred me to a second psychiatrist, who told me to go see a therapist (and that same psychiatrist later told me to go find a different psychiatrist), the therapist told me to go speak to a psychiatrist...

...so I returned to my first psychiatrist, and then I was told by the psychiatrist's practice that he would be too busy for the next several months and so I should go see the practice's DO, and then when I tried to see that DO again I was told that she was no longer with their practice so I ended up making an appointment to see a NP, and when I went to see the NP I was told by his practice that he couldn't make the appointment so I ended up seeing a different NP...

...and then when I tried to make an appointment with a geneticist I was told that I could only see the geneticist if I was referred to them by another doctor first, so I ended up telling the NP about this only to have her refer me to a PCP, but then after I went to see the PCP he told me that he couldn't help me with seeing a geneticist and that I would have been better off asking a psychiatrist instead...

....and then after seeing that NP for nine sessions nearly every month for over a year I was suddenly told that I was allowed neither to see nor speak to her anymore, so I ended up with yet another NP only to be later told by this practice the same thing about him not being "comfortable" near me, so now I'm allowed to only see this practice's psychiatrist...

...and when I first went to see my second therapist to see about getting tested for personality disorders she told me that she didn't really specialize in that sort of thing and that she could refer me to a psychologist who could help me, and then when I went to see the psychologist he told me to start seeing one of the therapists that works with him so that I could start my psychotherapy treatment...

etc. etc.

>>38981742
psychiatry is legit. Psychology is bullshit, they dont even have a proper medical education.

Psychiatrists are trained doctors that know what physological functions of your brain is out of order. Psychologists just make shit up about childhood and sexuality and whatnot.

>>38983359
Jesus dude what are you saying to these people

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>>38981742
most of these fields are toxic

http://www.nature.com/news/over-half-of-psychology-studies-fail-reproducibility-test-1.18248

Stay away from psychology kikes. Stay away from their magic pills. Most likely they will make it worse.

>>38983189

>You're insecure is all it is, you're convinced there is something inherently wrong with you, go live your life and be yourself, learn acceptance and forgiveness be positive and humble you'll learn a lot about people and yourself

Maybe it's the fear. These past few months I've felt some of the most intense fear that I've ever felt in my life. I feel like any day now something is about to happen. Maybe it's a side-effect of the Adderall. Maybe it's a symptom of the Major Depressive Disorder. I don't know. But I can feel a change happening in me, and I can't tell if that change is for the best or for the worst.

I've strongly suspected for years that my brother (who is 16 years older than me) qualifies as someone who has Narcissistic Personality Disorder. I've also long suspected that my brother might have other and/or co-morbid psychological conditions, such as: Antisocial Personality Disorder, Borderline Personality Disorder, and/or Bipolar Disorder. I informed my psychologist about this and he told me that based on what I've told him about my brother, my brother sounds like he might have Antisocial Personality Disorder. So my brother might be a sociopath. But my psychologist can't officially make the diagnosis since he's never met my brother. My brother also seems to have just about everyone within our family wrapped around his finger, completely under his control to feed his narcissistic supply... including: our mother, my brother's wife, one of our cousins, and possibly everyone else in our family (both of my mother's and father's [my biological father, his stepfather] sides of the family.)

But then again, I've considered the possibility that I'm simply projecting my own insecurities onto my brother. If I suspect myself to have a personality disorder (such as Narcissistic Personality Disorder), then I might be projecting this insecurity onto my brother. I informed my psychologist about this but he told me that he hasn't noticed that about me.

>>38983189

>go live your life and be yourself, learn acceptance and forgiveness be positive and humble you'll learn a lot about people and yourself

I'm trying to. I really am. I'm scrambling desperately to organize all of my thoughts, trying to form a single coherent plan. But it seems to be a very slow process. And it's making me impatient. I'm not sure how much longer this will last. A week, a month, two months, three... I'm not sure how much more of this I can take. And I'm scared shitless.

Back in September of last year, my brother kicked me out of my apartment. My own apartment. This guy has been using my name and social security number for the taxes for his legally and morally questionable business for about a half a decade. He's been using me to help with his business for years. He's been using my name and social security number to explain how he's paying for a lot of the things that he's paying for: his rent, his bills, his business' expenses... and he's still doing it right now. And he's got our entire family wrapped around his finger, feeding into his narcissistic supply. He's manipulating everybody. He's successfully gotten the entire family turned against me. Our mother defends everything that he does and says. Hell, even my father (who is my biological father, but his stepfather) defends the guy... even though my father has repeatedly warned me about how "crazy" and "dangerous" my brother can be. But he still insists on defending the guy. And everybody on my father's side of the family defends him too.

I'm not sure I know what I want out of my life anymore. Ten years ago when I dropped out of high school, I had so many ideas running through my mind about what I planned to do with my future. I had so much hope, so many ambitions... but it's all gone to shit. I feel that too much time has passed. I have no experience, no references, no connections, nothing. I feel like it's too late for me to start now.

>>38983448
Why do you feel like you have NPD, exactly? It doesn't sound like it, at all. Narcissists have a misplaced sense of superiority. Nothing you've written in this thread makes you stick out as a narcissist.

>>38983189

>You're insecure is all it is, you're convinced there is something inherently wrong with you, go live your life and be yourself, learn acceptance and forgiveness be positive and humble you'll learn a lot about people and yourself

It gets worse. So much worse. My brother's business is legally dubious, and highly immoral. And I have my name, face, and social security number all of it... going as far back as the year 2011, maybe even earlier than that. I have here with me several years of taxes, showing how much I supposedly make each other. Money that I see very little of. Money that I basically have to beg for. Money that I've actually worked for, running errands, delivering supplies...

So I should I just forget about it all and move on with my life, because nothing bad will ever happen again?

Yeah, well, maybe not. Maybe none of you guys believe anything that I've told you about my brother, my family, the business. Maybe none of you guys will believe what I'm about to tell you. Maybe I just imagined the whole thing.

I remember a few years back, a couple of FBI agents stopped by our apartment.

Back then the FBI agents were looking for an old business acquaintance of my brother's. They were neither looking for me nor for my brother.

But the FBI has been going after my brother's other business acquaintances, little by little, raiding their homes, taking them down one by one.

And I just know that sooner or later, the IRS and/or FBI will find me, no matter where I am.

And they're going to arrest me.

And I'm going to prison.

And nobody is going to feel sorry for me.

I remember telling my psychologist about all of this, and he told me, "if that happens, just tell them that you were forced into it!"

Yeah, right.

That's not going to work.

Nobody is going to feel sorry for me.

Nobody is going to care.

My brother will be gone, and I will be left alone to take the blame.

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>>38983509
This whole thread is an elaborate ruse, right?

>>38983527

>This whole thread is an elaborate ruse, right?

I can assure you that it is not. I realize that I have no real way of proving anything that I'm saying. But this is all true. It's up to you whether or not you believe any of this.

>>38983471
you should come clean and to terms with your life

- gather evidence of what your brother does, call the feds on your brother, testify, take responsibility for your part in it
- disconnect from the toxic people (family, peers) and environment completely
- accept who you are
- move on with your life

how shitty live ever seems, there`s always the next day, the next week, the next year and the next decades. In 10 years nothing will be how it is right now.

>>38983486
you dont seem to understand NPD
that sense of superiority unfortunatly is what laymen think narcissism is and that there`s no much much more to it.

Please don`t perpetuate the stereotype

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>>38983509

I've been looking at the raw data of my DNA provided by AncestryDNA.

If a geneticist isn't willing to help me out, I figured that maybe I could find what I'm looking for. Maybe, once and for all, I could find that "empirical evidence" for the disorders that I've been diagnosed with. Maybe I could find "empirical evidence" for disorders and diseases that I have yet to be diagnosed with. Maybe I could find out whether or not I really am genetically predisposed to developing Alzheimer's disease, schizophrenia, antisocial personality disorder, etc.

Maybe if I find out that I don't have that variant of the Monoamine oxidase A gene associated with antisocial personality disorder, I could prove to people that I'm not a sociopath. I could prove to people that I'm not a completely awful person. But I don't think that anybody would actually care either way.

Maybe if I did actually have that variant of the MAO-A gene and I got in trouble with the law, I could get a somewhat less harsh sentence like this guy did:

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-human-beast/201007/pity-the-poor-murderer-his-genes-made-him-do-it

I'm looking at my data right now. I tried to print it out. Over 16,000 pages. Over 16,000 pages of raw data. I don't think that any of this stuff is going to help me find what I'm looking for. Maybe. Maybe not.

>>38983509
>>38983568
m8 then youre going to be legally prosecuted
fuck that.
Its fucking tax fraud!
Going to prison for that, especially in your case, is HIGHLY unlikely. Its more than likely that you wont be punished at all.

And even IF youre punished it wont be prison time. And even if its prison time its a year or two at MAX. And for that your would need to tax evade millions upon millons of dollar.

And even if you go to prison, you wont be in high security. Youll will laugh with your fellow convicts while playing tennis at the facilities and maybe only spent the nights in prison while youre free during the day. You didnt murder someone. Get a fucking grip on reality, we know youre depressed and youre expecting the worst of life at all times but get the fuck real here.

Also in prison you dont pay a fucken cent for healthcare. You get an education for free etc so on.

>>38983607
All these years you've been trying to find out what's wrong with you and you haven't been able to, why is that? Because you believing there's something wrong with you IS what's wrong with you

Your problem is not something anybody else but you can fix your spirit is broken you're spiritually castrated you don't feel love for yourself so you can't feel it for other people you can't forgive yourself so you don't forgive other people you haven't accepted yourself so nobody is going to accept you either youre not at peace with yourself nobody can help you but yourself stop looking for other people to fix you there is nothing wrong with you stop believing your own lies, let go of the past by accepting that it happened and forgive yourself and your brother maybe you'll find peace in your heart and spirit if you're past the point of helping yourself turn to god

>>38983815
>>38983851
this tbqh

>>38982638
Your mum and brother are not very nice to you. Try not to spend any time near them.

https://youtu.be/h6H0OwnIvs8
PLEASE LISTEN TO THIS OP

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>>38983607
I won't go into details because its just a lot, but dude you're very far into your own mind.

You think al lot. While thinking is not bad it can be when there is only negativity to think about.

I've been in the same direction but not as far as you, almost the same background etc.


>Step 1 is getting control of your thoughts.
This can only be done by meditating, look it up and try doing it daily so you can eventually stop thoughts.(this is important)
You don't need those thoughts, those doubts, those conclusions. You analyse the present and past and don't have a future mindset.
These mental actions are useless.

>Step 2 is getting your body in perfect shape so your brain can feel good aswell when there is a reason to.
Get a proper eating schedule with your macro's and calories spot on and no shitty food and drinks.
Get a proper training schedule with the right frequency, intensity and volume.
This GREATLY helps with getting your confidence back IN THE LONG RUN and having a personal goal to focus on.
Remember that a shitty body is a shitty brain and a shitty attitude.
It may seem useless and too hard but looking at a ripped body in the mirror is like being on a lasting drug.

>Step 3 is fucking doing shit. Step 1 helps with this also.
Actions can only be blocked by thoughts, So if those toughts can be avoided by step 1 then a whole world opens for you.
STOP sitting behind the computer, STOP watching porn, GO do shit outside, GO do what you need to do. Go train.
Only unwanted thoughts can stop that, and an unfit body(thus mind) can feed those unwanted thoughts.

If you ignore the past, block thoughts after you fail and block the doubtful thoughts when you need to do shit you will come far.
I will see you in 3 years in the CBT thread.

>>38982698
>illegitimate and morally dubious business

10% is a pretty shitty take for laundering money. What category of business? Internet? Pyramid? Drugs?

>>38984554
Other anon here.

Can you give me advice on what type of meditating I should look into?
The more concrete the answer, the better (for me at least).

>>38983132

>The sooner you realize that, the sooner you can stop giving a fuck. And people will see and FEEL that you just dont give a fuck about this great cycle of bullshit. And the small group of people who also stopped giving a fuck will recognize you as their own and welcome you.

I don't know how to stop giving a fuck. I don't know how you do it. I don't know how anybody does it. I've tried many times in the past to stop giving a fuck, but I just can't. Make I really just am "oversensitive". Maybe I was just born this way. Maybe it's in my genes.

My psychologist told me that due to my "high IQ", (he told me that I scored in the "above average" range, see this post's image >>38982422) I seem to have a much higher sense of morality and much higher sensitivity than my brother and mother (who, according to my psychologist, both have "low intelligence"). But then again, I've considered the possibility that my psychologist only told me that I have a high IQ because he saw that I have low self-esteem and he felt that I need the ego boost. Or maybe he did, in fact, suspect that I might have Narcissistic Personality Disorder and he wanted to see my reaction when he told me. But then again he already told me that he didn't think me to have Narcissistic Personality Disorder. He also told me that he's not allowed to lie to me due to the psychologists' "code of ethics". But I still don't fully trust him, and he knows that I don't fully trust him as he's told me that he knows. Maybe IQ tests are "pseudoscience" after all.

I've heard the same thing said about sociopaths. How sociopaths generally have a higher IQ than average people. Then again I've heard the exact opposite, that sociopaths are generally all really stupid.

Anyway. I find it ridiculously difficult to stop giving a fuck.

hello i have MDD, anhedonia, sexual anhedonia
I take bupropion 300mg, abilify 2.5mg, adderall 30mg

starting abilify anhedonia lifted and i fapped myself into a coma but a month later the anhedonia returns so i'm back to waiting for the sun to go down so i can go to bed.


I've tried viibryd, sertraline, effexor, nsi-189, semax, 2/4-F(M)A
i want to talk to my psych about trying ketamine

>>38987376
oh and during the month of LIFE after starting abilify i gained 30 pounds.

>>38987328
You wanna know how to stop giving a fuck? Just give up, accept yourself and accept life stop trying so hard, stop all the questions stop all the analyzing stop all the research stop all the reasoning just stop

>>38987528

>You wanna know how to stop giving a fuck? Just give up, accept yourself and accept life stop trying so hard, stop all the questions stop all the analyzing stop all the research stop all the reasoning just stop

I know, I know. I should stop all the questions, stop all the analyzing, stop all the research, stop all the reasoning... but lately, I've been doing a lot of research into Sigmund Freud, psychoanalysis, the ego, the superego, and the id... Now, I know most (if not all) of you here consider psychoanalysis to be a "pseudoscience" and that Sigmund Freud isn't really taken seriously anymore... but I find that some of his ideas are still kind of interesting.

I'm not sure if I am capable of truly understanding his ideas, but this is what I've understood so far:

So the "id" is the part of a human's "subconscious" that is interested only in satisfying its own most basic, primal, selfish needs (such as: hunger, sex, etc.)

While the "superego" is the part of a human's subconscious that is concerned with satisfying the needs not of the individual, but of the "collective", right? The "collective" being either the individual human's: "immediate family" (parents, siblings, and/or offspring) and/or "extended family" (cousins, aunts, uncles, grandparents, etc.), or "clan", or "tribe", or "community", or maybe its entire species. Since, after all, the individual organisms within the population of a species should be able to cooperate on some level, or else the whole system collapses and the species goes extinct.

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>>38987528

>You wanna know how to stop giving a fuck? Just give up, accept yourself and accept life stop trying so hard, stop all the questions stop all the analyzing stop all the research stop all the reasoning just stop

And the "ego", in a way, is kind of like a mediator. The ego must be the part that the human individual is "consciously" (whatever the hell that's supposed to mean, if "consciousness" even exists) aware of. The ego is the part of a human that must learn how to mediate between the instinctual needs of the individual and the needs of the collective, right? A human individual must learn to equally divide both its selfish and selfless needs. If it fails to satisfy its selfish needs, it could die. If it fails to satisfy the needs of the collective, this individual could potentially be "exiled" by its tribe, essentially ostracized by its entire species. And so this individual is left to fend for itself, most likely dying as a result and therefore failing to make any significant impact on its species' genepool.

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>>38987528

>You wanna know how to stop giving a fuck? Just give up, accept yourself and accept life stop trying so hard, stop all the questions stop all the analyzing stop all the research stop all the reasoning just stop

So I figure, hey, if there really is such a thing as an "ego" and a "superego", maybe I can identify where in my brain these things are located.

And I have here with me a disc containing several images of the Magnetic Resonance Imaging scan (which was done from various angles) on my brain back in the 17th of September of 2013.

This is the M.R.I. scan that I paid $700 for and the neurologist that I had met with back in mid-2013 (after I had already met with my first psychiatrist) suggested that I get.

According to the neurologist, he didn't find anything unusual on this MRI scan aside from something called an "arachnoid cyst" which is apparently very common, normal, and goes away on its own.

Over these past several weeks, I've been carefully analyzing these images looking for any gray matter abnormalities in the left anterior insula.

I will be posting screenshots of all of the images of this MRI scan.

Here's one image of the MRI scan.

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>>38987528

>You wanna know how to stop giving a fuck? Just give up, accept yourself and accept life stop trying so hard, stop all the questions stop all the analyzing stop all the research stop all the reasoning just stop

There's this one study that apparently suggests that they have provided the first "empirical evidence" for Narcissistic Personality Disorder:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23777939

To quote it:

>Background:

>Despite the relevance of narcissistic personality disorder (NPD) in clinical settings, there is currently no empirical data available regarding the neurobiological correlates of NPD. In the present study, we performed a voxel-based morphometric analysis to provide initial insight into local abnormalities of gray matter (GM) volume.

>Methods

>Structural brain images were obtained from patients with NPD (n = 17) and a sample of healthy controls (n = 17) matched regarding age, gender, handedness, and intelligence. Groups were compared with regard to global brain tissue volumes and local abnormalities of GM volume. Regions-of-interest analyses were calculated for the anterior insula.

>Results

>Relative to the control group, NPD patients had smaller GM volume in the left anterior insula. Independent of group, GM volume in the left anterior insula was positively related to self-reported emotional empathy. Complementary whole-brain analyses yielded smaller GM volume in fronto-paralimbic brain regions comprising the rostral and median cingulate cortex as well as dorsolateral and medial parts of the prefrontal cortex.

>Conclusion

>Here we provide the first empirical evidence for structural abnormalities in fronto-paralimbic brain regions of patients with NPD. The results are discussed in the context of NPD patients' restricted ability for emotional empathy.

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>>38987528

>You wanna know how to stop giving a fuck? Just give up, accept yourself and accept life stop trying so hard, stop all the questions stop all the analyzing stop all the research stop all the reasoning just stop

The following seven pages that I will be posting are the full text of this study.

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>>38987528

>You wanna know how to stop giving a fuck? Just give up, accept yourself and accept life stop trying so hard, stop all the questions stop all the analyzing stop all the research stop all the reasoning just stop

Here's the second page.

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>>38987528

>You wanna know how to stop giving a fuck? Just give up, accept yourself and accept life stop trying so hard, stop all the questions stop all the analyzing stop all the research stop all the reasoning just stop

Third page.

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>>38987528

>You wanna know how to stop giving a fuck? Just give up, accept yourself and accept life stop trying so hard, stop all the questions stop all the analyzing stop all the research stop all the reasoning just stop

Fourth.

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>>38987528

>You wanna know how to stop giving a fuck? Just give up, accept yourself and accept life stop trying so hard, stop all the questions stop all the analyzing stop all the research stop all the reasoning just stop

5th page...

Or page 1367 out of the Journal of Psychiatric Research.

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>>38987528

>You wanna know how to stop giving a fuck? Just give up, accept yourself and accept life stop trying so hard, stop all the questions stop all the analyzing stop all the research stop all the reasoning just stop

Page 1368.

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>>38987528

>You wanna know how to stop giving a fuck? Just give up, accept yourself and accept life stop trying so hard, stop all the questions stop all the analyzing stop all the research stop all the reasoning just stop

...aaaaaaand the last page.

>>38987714
https://youtu.be/h6H0OwnIvs8
It's all in your head
I also recommend you listen to todd white and bishop td jakes for data spiritual healing you need

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>>38987528

>You wanna know how to stop giving a fuck? Just give up, accept yourself and accept life stop trying so hard, stop all the questions stop all the analyzing stop all the research stop all the reasoning just stop

>>38987694

Oh, and I have those two images on that page in somewhat higher resolution.

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>>38987528

>You wanna know how to stop giving a fuck? Just give up, accept yourself and accept life stop trying so hard, stop all the questions stop all the analyzing stop all the research stop all the reasoning just stop

>>38987694

Here's the second image.

>>38987740
Look into eriksons psychosocial development if you still think you need more research

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>>38987528

>You wanna know how to stop giving a fuck? Just give up, accept yourself and accept life stop trying so hard, stop all the questions stop all the analyzing stop all the research stop all the reasoning just stop

What I'm hoping to get at with these MRI scan images of my brain is maybe I'm hoping to find some sort of "empirical evidence" to either confirm or deny the existence of some sort of disorder (any kind of disorder, whether it be a: mental disorder, or personality disorder... like Narcissistic Personality Disorder.)

If it turns out that I actually *do* have Narcissistic Personality Disorder, and there *is*, in fact, such a thing as "empirical evidence" to suggest that such a personality disorder exists... then I should be able to find some sort of physical evidence confirming this on my MRI scans... no?

And if it turns out that I do, in fact, have Narcissistic Personality Disorder... then that might be why I've been diagnosed with Major Depressive Disorder. So this would essentially mean that I am, in fact, "weak". But then, to what extent could I be considered to be "weak"? And does this mean that everyone who has been diagnosed with Major Depressive Disorder or other disorders like the ones that I've been diagnosed with (Social Anxiety Disorder, Generalized Anxiety Disorder, etc.) are "weak"?

And then what if it turns out that I can't actually find any physical evidence on my MRI scans that confirms the existence of Narcissistic Personality Disorder? Does that mean that I am not "weak"? Does that mean that I actually have good reason to be depressed?

And I can find physical evidence to suggest that I actually do have Major Depressive Disorder, and I don't have Narcissistic Personality Disorder... then what route should I take to "cure" myself? Is there even such a thing as a "cure"?

>>38987808
Try seeking God go to church or open up the bible youll find peace and rest for your soul there, God WILL save you
https://youtu.be/YBQHkD-zXSM

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>>38987528

>You wanna know how to stop giving a fuck? Just give up, accept yourself and accept life stop trying so hard, stop all the questions stop all the analyzing stop all the research stop all the reasoning just stop

What I'm thinking is that... if I can identify where the "left anterior insula" is located in my brain as revealed on my MRI scans, and it turns out that I do not have those "gray matter abnormalities" that are associated with Narcissistic Personality Disorder... then that must mean that I truly am capable of experiencing "empathy" for other human beings.

And if it means that I am capable of experiencing this so-called "empathy", then that must mean that I still have what Sigmund Freud may have referred to as the "superego" as I explained in my post here >>38987565

So what I'm thinking now, is... maybe so that I can finally stop giving a fuck, I need to figure out a way to completely remove my capacity to experience empathy not only for myself, but completely remove my capacity to experience empathy for all other human beings.

So how the hell am I going to remove my capacity to experience empathy? Maybe I could lobotomize myself? No... too dangerous, I think. For me to do it by myself.

Maybe I could do it by abusing drugs and alcohol, non-stop, for several days. A combination of deliriants, psychedelics, and dissociatives all at once.

Maybe then I can finally cut myself off from both the "superego" and the "ego". And then, and only then, will I finally be left alone with the "id".

>>38987911
Drugs will only make you hate yourself even more than you already do it will also push everyone even further away from you and I know that you don't want to feel lonely anymore, it's a horrible feeling

94 posts

nearly every single one is OP

nice

>>38988087
I've been trying to help him
the hearts of these people are hardened, and their ears cannot hear, and they have closed their eyes--so their eyes cannot see, and their ears cannot hear, and their hearts cannot understand, and they cannot turn to me and let me heal them. Matthew 13:15

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>>38987973

>Drugs will only make you hate yourself even more than you already do it will also push everyone even further away from you and I know that you don't want to feel lonely anymore, it's a horrible feeling

You're right.

I wouldn't even know where to begin to safely find such drugs anyway.

So I suppose that the easiest and quickest way to remove my "superego", and my "ego", and my capacity to feel empathy is with this.

Maybe if I aim it at my head in just the right position, I can get lucky like Gabrielle Giffords.

And then I would finally be able to stop giving a fuck.

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shit fuck liars they can all die.
put there heads in here /pic related.

>>38988210
If you don't want your life anymore give it to God he'll know what to do with it cuz you dont

>>38982532
Those manuals are meant to aid trained professionals diagnose patients within some sort of care environment. Using them outside of context makes them useless. If you aren't regularly seeing patients somewhere don't pay them any heed.

If you feel you're having problems of course see a doctor. You seem to have had a bad experience and naturallythat can put you off.

OP, I don't often give this kind of advice, but you need to stop fucking thinking because your thoughts are almost completely worthless. You're do convinced there is something wrong with yourself that you've made it true.

Here's a tip, go and watch some YouTube vids and watch how normal people interact with each other. Something like Wil Wheatons Tabletop series, or video game people like Game Grumps.

Also, put those never ending thoughts of yours towards something worthwhile. Forget about your fucking myriad of issues for two seconds and learn about something that you might actually be able to turn into a career.
Tbh you sound autistic as fuck, so programming would be right up your alley. Learn Java and shitpost on /g/ instead of /fit/

>>38983851
>>38987908
>>38988313

I can no longer hear the voice of God.

I don't think I was ever capable of hearing the voice of God.

And that's just what I think is so funny about all of this.

I've been getting all of these different people with different opinions trying to tell me what is or isn't "science". What is or isn't "pseudoscience".

Hell, I've noticed that even among all of these specialists themselves there's disagreements about what is or isn't "science". What is or isn't "pseudoscience".

They'll disagree with each other about what is or isn't the right treatment.

If there's something that they can't quite figure out, something that they don't specialize in, they simply tell me to go see a different specialist.

I'll have one psychiatrist telling me that for testing for personality disorders there's the "MMPI-2" which he told me "isn't very scientific."

I'll have my psychologist telling me that there's no such thing as "chemical imbalances", and that all psychiatrists are "weird", that he doesn't like having to deal with them, and that "psychiatrists of today are like the alchemists of the Middle Ages."

So I'm left wondering: what is a person to do when they no longer have the luxury to be running around in circles, constantly going back and forth seeing and speaking to all sorts of different doctors who disagree with each other, being repeatedly ignored, shot down, turned away, given the run-around...

...when that person's time is limited, and their source of income is unreliable and could end at any given moment?

Who can that person turn to, when the only people willing to give him any time will only do so if given money?

What can that person turn to next when both science and medicine have failed?

Philosophy? Spirituality? Religion?

Who can that person turn to, when not even God is willing to understand his pain, because God is probably not even there to listen?

>>38988313

And what of all of those other people out there in the world today who don't even have the luxury to access all of this knowledge... to access all of the knowledge that may be available in science, medicine, philosophy, spirituality, and religion?

What if a person never had access to all of this knowledge due to unfortunate circumstances?

What if a person once had access to all of this knowledge, but due to a series of unfortunate events lost it all?

What if a person felt that they were on the verge of finally losing it all: financially, socially, physically, emotionally, intellectually, spiritually, mentally? That they were on the verge of losing: their privacy, their security, their possessions, their freedom?

If this person did decide to turn to philosophy, spirituality, and/or religion, how can they be certain that they could trust their own intelligence, their own logic, their own intuition, their own judgment, their own senses, their own perception of reality to be able to truly comprehend everything that they have read?

If this person really did have a deep, underlying, undiagnosed severe mental disorder all along (like schizophrenia), how could this person know to trust in himself?

How could this person possibly know where one draws the line between reality and fantasy? Who in the world has the authority to draw that line, and why should they have that authority?

How can anybody around this person possibly trust in any of his words and/or actions?

What is this person supposed to do then?

>>38988313

I find that my mind is arguing against itself, non-stop. I'll tell myself: "there is no such thing as God. How can people believe in such nonsense?" But then another part of me will respond: "who the fuck am I to tell people what is or isn't nonsense? I'm just a fucking loser. I'm a 27-year-old, unemployed, friendless, virgin, high school drop-out. I don't know anything about the world. Why does my opinion matter than anybody else's? The majority of the global human population believes in a 'God'. I'm in the minority. Why the fuck does the 'Big Bang Theory', or the 'Big Crunch', or 'Big Bounce', or 'Multiverse' theories have anymore hold in the scientific community than the 'God Did It Theory'?"

Maybe the pain that I feel right now is a punishment for a sin that I have committed. Maybe that is why I do not hear the voice of God. Maybe the sin that I have committed is "sloth".

I remember when I was very little and I'd see all of the homeless people walking around Los Angeles, and I remember thinking that I wished that there was something that I could do for them. That I wished that I could just magically create money out of thin air, give them the money, and magically cure them of whatever mental illness that they might have. But I realize now that it's not quite that simple.

Maybe my problem is that I waited too long to do something with my life. Maybe my problem is that due to my constant fear of making mistakes in my life, I ended up not doing anything at all. And so that was the greatest mistake that anybody could make: doing nothing. And so that must be the greatest sin. Sloth.

Maybe the "superego" is "God". Maybe it is my "superego" that is punishing me. Maybe that is why I feel so miserable all the time. Because I failed to serve my purpose for my species. I was too selfish because of my own fears, that I failed to perform selfless acts of kindness towards my fellow man.

Maybe that really is the ultimate sin a man can commit. It must be sloth.

>>38981742
Even though this is anonymous:
Do not take the following as medical advice; I urge you to follow the consultation of your personal medical professional.

I feel your pain OP, you are not imagining things.

There are many conditions wherein western society's outlook does not match that of western medicine. Pop-psychology has damaged how the public thinks about psychological science, and by extension, mental health issues.

Evidence based medicine has revolutionized healthcare within the past century. Healing used to be achieved through ancient and traditional treatments with little to no scientific understanding of the underlying cause.

Many of the psychological maladies you've listed are rooted in evidence-based medicine. Causes, interactions, and treatments are still developing, but we have a good idea of the underlying problems (even to a biochemical level sometimes, as you've shown with your OP pic).

The field of psychology has taken a big hit due to the public's love for the phrases "scientifically proven", and "studies show". I assure you that the majority of the social science studies would never qualify to be published in reputable medical journals, and add nothing to the current literature. Medical psychological science should not be placed in the same category as click-bait studies about why it's okay to eat <insert guilty pleasure here>.

If you feel confused about why your doctor chose certain treatment plan, voice those concerns. It is hard as a practitioner to illicit every fear and the complete background of our patients. This kind of rapport is especially important in psycho-social problems, because there are few objective tests to measure your mental state.

Psychiatry and (scientific) psychology are real fields with positive impacts on patients everywhere. The first step to improving your outcome is to build a better relationship with your practitioner. Express what your motivations, fears, and expectations are.

>>38989018

>The first step to improving your outcome is to build a better relationship with your practitioner. Express what your motivations, fears, and expectations are.

And I've tried doing just this oh so many times.

Pretty much every doctor that I've seen (psychiatrists, neurologists, GPs, ENTs, optometrists, etc.) is only willing to speak to me for about 15 - 20 minutes. Some of them only put up with me for about 5 minutes or less, even one GP going so far as to telling me: "OK. Close that mouth" while I'm describing my symptoms. I don't really have much of a choice on the matter. I can't tell them, "could I maybe speak to you for about 1 or 2 hours so that I could tell you my symptoms, my concerns, my entire medical history, my life story?" Only my therapists and psychologists are willing to put up with me for that long. Even they sometimes couldn't up with me for that long. One therapist cut the session short after only about 15 minutes.

Also see my post here to read my experience with my first psychiatrist:

>>38983283

And see my post here for other experiences with other doctors:

>>38983359

>If you feel confused about why your doctor chose certain treatment plan, voice those concerns. It is hard as a practitioner to illicit every fear and the complete background of our patients. This kind of rapport is especially important in psycho-social problems, because there are few objective tests to measure your mental state.

I even tried doing this with one of my nurse practitioners who was prescribing me Adderall. See my post here to see my experience with her:

>>38983359

>....and then after seeing that NP for nine sessions nearly every month for over a year I was suddenly told that I was allowed neither to see nor speak to her anymore, so I ended up with yet another NP only to be later told by this practice the same thing about him not being "comfortable" near me, so now I'm allowed to only see this practice's psychiatrist...

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>>38982217
>English is not my first language
>sorry for that mess
>writes the most eloquent post that 4chan has seen in eons

>>38989018
>>38989097

And that second nurse practitioner (the male) wanted to prescribe me both Abilify (an antipsychotic) and Adderall (a psychostimulant) at the same time. Two drugs with completely opposite effects.

And then my psychiatrist wanted to completely stop prescribing me Adderall.

And all of this because I said that I wanted to be referred to a geneticist to have myself tested for any possibly genetically inheritable disorders and/or diseases (Alzheimer's disease, antisocial personality disorder, autism spectrum disorder, schizophrenia, etc.)

This nurse practitioner guy would even ask me questions like "do you believe to be receiving messages from people on your computer?" I was a bit confused by this question, and I responded with something like, "well, uh, yeah... since I play a lot of video games over the internet, I do communicate with people through these games with text messages and whatnot." This nurse practitioner then proceeded to put down on my MedRec that I believed my computer to have been "hacked" and that "there didn't seem to be any reasoning behind his logic." He also put symptoms of schizophrenia on my MedRec like: "illogical thinking" - "magical thinking" - "auditory hallucinations" - "flat affect" - "odd, peculiar, guarded".

But then my psychologist told me that I am definitely not schizophrenic and that I am too old to develop schizophrenia at this point.

>bruh just meditate
>bruh just be yourself
>bruh just get rid of those awful thoughts

you people are idiots

>>38988917
Psychologists are just butt hurt that they couldn't afford to go to med school
If a psychiatrist says you need drugs, you probably need some drugs
But use discretion

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>>38982943
>we

>>38988997
"I'm a 27-year-old, unemployed, friendless, virgin, high school drop-out" this is how you see yourself and that's all you see about yourself that's why you hate yourself and that's the root of your problems

Neurologist in training (masters, not MD, I dont wanna do brain operations, I specifically do sleep neuro)

Think of psychology and psychiatry like alchemy and other weird medieval practices that are rarely used. You were diagnosed with the equivalent of irritable bowel syndrome for digestive issues. You show the symptoms, but they dont know fuck all after that. More tests will have to be done

I got my undergrad in psych/bio, and I realized the shortcomings of psychiatry/psychology. It's basically if you want a change, you are going to have to do the majority of the work. Those pills and therapy will do jack shit if you dont commit yourself 100% to get out of the funk

>>38986036
Just meditation; sitting of lying down comfortably, closing your eyes and thinking about nothing else but the feeling of your body breathing.
Everytime a thought comes true you make yourself aware that you are thinking and stop the thought, continuing with breathing.

>>38989123
You are looking for a magic answer, pill, diagnose or treatment that doesn't excist
You didn't even respond to my post >>38984554 probably because it's to much work. Maybe you're weak after all.

Like this guy said >>38989196 The shit you are looking for doesn't work. YOU have to do all the work.
Not meaning to give yourself a diagnose or to figure out your own pills, but work on yourself.
You don't seem to want that, just like a lot of people going to psychologist, psychiatrist etc you want other people to solve your shit.

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Psychology (and nutrition) are probably the softest of soft sciences out there.

The idea that someone, no matter how well educated he is, can perfectly diagnose whats wrong with me through things I AM TELLING him, is madness.
The way we "experience the world" is the most subjective thing in the world. Its like what if you saw blue but called it red your entire life, how would anyone ever know?
I think anyone who either has an atypical mind, or anyone who has tried psychedelic drugs, knows exactly what i mean.
If normal people would think or feel like me, the world would just be different. Human actions wouldnt make sense.

I really dont like how random people who have no idea about any of this, hate on mental health medication BUT, the fact that we dont really know how anti depressiva work, or why this one works and that one doesnt, really makes you think...

>>38989130
Two of those have demonstrable positive effects on shit like depression and anxiety, and are some of the only proven treatments or cures.

God damn stop being a cunt

>>38981784
clinical psychologist doing my MD here.
the difference with the past is that now we have a better understanding of the brain and of human psychology, yet we're still miles away from truly knowing what and how mental disorders (which of course is a human categorization using defined criteria found in the DSM) are and how they work. Also, we're good at diagnosis but not as good as healing.

>>38981742
MD Anon here gain

to be upfront:
I did not read the last paragraphs about the mir scan, Freud etc. in detail.

What becomes painstakenly clear is that your thoughts are running rampant. You are overanalyzing everything you read, every action of the people around you, even every thought you have yourself in terms of causality, meaning etc.

What you are doing is entangling yourself in imaginary constructs. You second guess everything and cant be sure about anything.

Unfortunatly this is a spiral you cant escape on your own right now.
What needs to be done is to help you shield yourself from your own thoughts right now, to help you calm your mind. This is the reason why your doctors tried to prescribe antipsychcotics to you.
Even if these make you feel like zombie for a while, they will help you calm yourself for the moment, so you can start moving towards the future instead of being trapped inside your own mind.

I will now seize to stop reading or replying to this thread and so should everybody else as every paragraph written here is only putting oil into the fire.

Godspeed, OP

>>38990102
yes this is true OP.
And, your way out is THERAPY.
Medication will only get you so far.. you need prolonged therapy with a good psychologist, not psychiatrist. You can make it brah

>>38989130
Having the power to stop negative or useless thoughts patterns is a very useful thing for someone in that situation.
The name meditation is just ruined by hippies, but in the purest form it just means having 100% control over your mind.

Ah.., ADHD.

The anxieties and depression sometimes manifest because of the ADHD, at 17 i had the exact 4 illnesses you list so if you would like advice on what it is like living with these i am happy to try and answer your questions regarding these.

It's difficult living with ADHD, i suggest you try medication because it has helped me greatly, And especially, don't ever take the medical advice of someone who is NOT a medical professional that specialises in mental illnesses or neurological disorders, and be careful not to take too many of the negative comments too seriously, there seems to be allot of individuals here who have no idea about mental illnesses. I also warn you about "doctor google", because it is too easy to navigate a few symptom-to-illness pages and find out you have 14 types of cancers, 4 personalities, have AIDS and going bald, so many symptoms overlap and medical science is extremely complex which is why it should be left to the professionals who study for years and years. So don't overdo it or you will freak the fuck out thinking you have this and that, make notes on all the things that worry you and then present them to your psychiatrist when you see her/him next so they that can dispel any confusion.

There are many people who believe medications to be the devil and have absolutely no idea about the brain, its' chemistry and how different substances can interact with the brain in many different and interesting ways.

None of my relatives understand my illnesses in great detail because they have not lived with them and do not have any knowledge about mental illnesses/neurological disorders, it really sucks, you feel sort of alone, like no one understand or sometimes they don't even believe you, encourage them to read about ADHD.

>>38990515
You're right, i didn't think about that, i got lost in the other conversations.

>>38982382
Everyone taking brain drugs should know that these drugs are never any one thing. Their effect depends on the dose.

http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2007/07/the_most_important_article_on.html

So, one drug mainly used for something else can help treat different symptoms by using a different dose. Though not even all doctors understand this.

>>38990548
thank you Anon
good luck on your journey

it's all in your heads faggots

literally grow the fuck up and stop acting like little bitches

>>38990581
Interesting article, i think patients should learn more about the drugs they take and how it affects them in greater detail so they have more respect for the medication they are taking, because if they do not understand why and what actually happens, then they will not understand the reason why they should avoid certain foods, drugs etc while on medication x/y/z. which is the advice given by all doctors before taking these meds.

Allot of patients will sometimes miss a dose, eat something that may interact with their medication, increase or decrease because they may have though their medication did this or that and it is not doing the specific thing they had hoped for so they decide by themselves to increase/decrease the dose, this can lead to many unwanted effects, and also to a decision such as stopping cold turkey because of the 1st set of unwanted effects, giving way to a 2nd wave for worse effects like those brought on by sudden withdrawal.

I know that if i didn't understand why i shouldn't do something, i was less likely to listen to the authority who commanded me not to. But if i do, then i have gained their perspective and completely understand why i shouldn't or should do something and am very likely to listen to them.

I'm not sure where i'm going with this, but i've read countless stories or people not following strict rules with their medications and then things turned bad and they blamed the medication, but were unaware that the actions they took earlier had a direct affect on the meds and their mood.

>>38984554

>It may seem useless and too hard but looking at a ripped body in the mirror is like being on a lasting drug.

I've already achieved this in a way. See my post here:

>>38982382

As for the meditation part, I'll get to that in a bit.

>>38984554

>This can only be done by meditating, look it up and try doing it daily so you can eventually stop thoughts.(this is important)

I've looked up "meditating" in the past, and it seems to me that various different people have various different ways of going about it. The most popular image of meditation seems to be of a person sitting with their legs crossed in a manner similar to what is depicted in your image there. However, I've read that sitting in that position isn't necessary to achieve meditation.

In a way, I think that I may, at times, meditated. I think that this is what I've been doing these past few weeks whenever I go outside. I've been going outside, walking aimlessly around the city of Los Angeles for four hours every day, quietly thinking to myself, trying to stabilize my thoughts and emotions. Sometimes I'll get on a bus or on a train, and ride it for hours until it reaches its last stop and it turns around or goes out of service.

So I'll quietly sit there in a train for nearly four hours, staring out of the window, trying to organize my thinking.

But that's the scary part.

A few weeks ago I had the most unusual phone conversation with my psychiatrist. The things that he was telling me just completely blew my mind away. It completely contradicts everything that I've experienced.

I tried telling my psychologist about this back in July of this year, that maybe I imagined this whole thing, possibly as a symptom of schizophrenia. My psychologist seemed adamant in trying to convince me that I definitely do not have schizophrenia.

My psychologist refused to hear the reasoning behind my argument. He actually told me on one of his e-mails: "I refuse to accept an invitation into a philosophical argument with you. Your constant disbelief in everything that you are told will make you completely ignore everything that I tell you (I do not blame you for being this way.)"

He stopped responding to my e-mails several weeks ago.

>>38984554

I tried explaining to my psychologist my theories behind my psychiatrist's and his practice's behavior towards me, but my psychologist refused to hear the reasoning behind my argument. So I've been left alone with my own thoughts, desperately scrambling to find order.

I can't even tell if any of this is real or not anymore. How the hell do I know for sure? How do I know that I'm not just in some mental institution right now, imagining all of his?

These last few weeks, I've felt my whole world dismantling itself all around me. The world feels so surreal now. I feel like I'm the last human being on the world left. I have never felt so alone. Maybe I'm unreal. Maybe I'm not even really here.

What is this that I'm feeling? Is this what schizophrenia is like? Am I at the onset of schizophrenia? Is this what they call "psychotic depression"? Is this what they call "amphetamine psychosis"?

Is this psychosis, is that what this is? How the hell can I tell?

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>>38990102

>What needs to be done is to help you shield yourself from your own thoughts right now, to help you calm your mind. This is the reason why your doctors tried to prescribe antipsychcotics to you.

>Even if these make you feel like zombie for a while, they will help you calm yourself for the moment, so you can start moving towards the future instead of being trapped inside your own mind.

That's just the thing. I don't quite have the luxury to keep doing this anymore. I'm at the end of my line here.

I'm currently living in an apartment with my 70-year-old mother. And I know that this won't last for much longer. I don't know how much longer this will last. Maybe six more months... or five... or four, or three, or two, one...

Pretty soon I'm going to end up like the 6,000 homeless people pictured here living a short walking distance east of here, in Skid Row, Los Angeles.

And I just know that when I end up homeless, taking medications that make me feel like shit, even worse than I feel right now... I just know that nobody is going to feel sorry for me.

I'll just keep wandering aimlessly around the city, feeling like shit, looking like shit, smelling l like shit, barely coherent...

I'll just keep getting fed antidepressants and antipsychotics until my senses are so deadened that I simply stop caring completely, and then I'll just find a hole to rot and die in. All away from public view, so that everybody else doesn't have to look at me and feel sorry for my poor quality of life.

It's real science

t. neuroscience/psych major

>>38990102
>>38992870

I know how this world works.

I remember that on that one month that I worked as a mall cop on December of 2011, around Christmas time... how a homeless guy would just walk right into the mall and my supervisor would immediately turn him away, to the exit, without having to say a word.

Nobody in the mall wants to have to see that shit. Nobody in the world wants to have to see that shit. Nobody wants to see it, smell it, or feel sorry for it. And that's exactly how it'll be for me.

The problem with these problems is:
1. The more you label yourself, the more unfixable you will tell yourself you are. "i can never be normal without these meds" etc.
2. The brain is extremely malleable, more so than you think. This means disorders like depression, anxiety and similar things can generally be solved without medication, given the right effort and time. Of course there's always exceptions, but chances are you are not one of them.

>>38981742
Isn't depression an umbrella term for the blues, and only takes a new perspective to "cure"?

Tbh depression doesn't exist in the clinical sense that we understand it to be. By separating us from our emotions we feel that we cannot control our behaviour or attitude. The truth of the matter is that both behaviour and attitude can be altered consciously by anyone. If this is true then in theory you can over come depression with thoughts alone. Though having someone else to tell you that depression is literally all in your imagination helps tremendously to validate this view.
Instead I propose that you simply forget everything you know about depression, and with that you'll find yourself less likely to be in cycles of depression. While being more likely to escape or recognize said cycles.

Calling it "Major Depression etc" is just stupid for a number of reasons.

This isn't some mind over matter bullshit, because there's no "matter" to mind over.

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>>38990102

>Unfortunatly this is a spiral you cant escape on your own right now.

>What needs to be done is to help you shield yourself from your own thoughts right now, to help you calm your mind. This is the reason why your doctors tried to prescribe antipsychcotics to you.

>Even if these make you feel like zombie for a while, they will help you calm yourself for the moment, so you can start moving towards the future instead of being trapped inside your own mind.

I remember a few years back watching this documentary called "Lost Angels" about the homeless living in Skid Row, Los Angeles. There's about 6,000 homeless people living in Skid Row, one of the largest stable populations of homeless people here in the US, and this place is only a few miles east of here.

I can see a situation like what is depicted in the film Gattaca unfolding over the course of the next four decades or so.

People diagnosed with disorders like me will gradually be pushed to the side by automation, genetically superior individuals, and sanism.

We'll be placed in poorly-constructed ghettos (like Skid Row) where we'll be fed antidepressants and antipsychotics until our senses are so deadened that we simply stop caring completely, and then we just find a hole to rot and die in. All away from public view, so that the genetically superior individuals don't have to look at us and feel sorry for our poor quality of life.

It will all happen so gradually that by the time anybody notices what's going on, it'll be too late.

>>38990581
TLP is the GOAT

He's crazy and I ended up disagreeing with him on a lot of things philosophically and politically but he knows his shit. His essays on psychiatry and pharmaceuticals are very enlightening, the high point of his blog.

>>38993041

Haven't really read the thread, but have you noticed symptoms of schizophrenia?

I was on adderall for like 1.5 years, and I even abused it for a while (not insane amounts like 3 day binges but I was heavily addicted anyway) and I think that along with some bad trips on LSD I've developed speech a disorder, which is a sign of schizophrenia. I'm slurring my words a lot and I have trouble making real sentences. I speak perfectly fine if I take it slow though, but some social anxciety causes me to always speak quickly.

This might just be me overanalyzing and maybe it's just my confidence that hinders my speech since I always feel very awkward and anxious in social situations.

>>38993034
(you)

>>38993255

>Haven't really read the thread, but have you noticed symptoms of schizophrenia?

>I was on adderall for like 1.5 years, and I even abused it for a while (not insane amounts like 3 day binges but I was heavily addicted anyway) and I think that along with some bad trips on LSD I've developed speech a disorder, which is a sign of schizophrenia. I'm slurring my words a lot and I have trouble making real sentences. I speak perfectly fine if I take it slow though, but some social anxciety causes me to always speak quickly.

>This might just be me overanalyzing and maybe it's just my confidence that hinders my speech since I always feel very awkward and anxious in social situations.

According to the psychologist who tested me for personality disorders (with the "MMPI-2" along with a bunch of other written tests) earlier this year back in July... he told me that I had what he called a "schizotypal personality style" (not "schizotypal personality disorder".) After doing a bit of research, apparently schizotypal personality disorder could be considered within the "schizophrenia spectrum". There's apparently a few similarities between schizotypal personality disorder and schizophrenia. Anyway, my psychologist told me that he didn't think that I had any personality disorder. He told me that what I had wasn't sufficient for me to receive the diagnosis of "schizotypal personality disorder". So instead he told me that it's just my "personality style" (whatever that's supposed to mean.)

Anyway. Yeah. I do seem to have speech problems. I seem to have had these problems since I was very little. Maybe I was born with it. Maybe it's genetic. Maybe I fit within the "autism spectrum disorder". I've also noticed various similarities between the "autism spectrum disorder" and the "schizotypal personality disorder". Or maybe it's like you said, it's all a symptom of my "social anxiety disorder". I tend to get especially nervous around attractive women, and so I stutter.

>>38993949

This only started around age 20 for me. Never had problems before that and always excelled at languages in school. Even my typing seems worse. I forget complete words here and there, multiple times per day. Maybe I'm just more aware of myself nowadays, I think that's part of it.

You should stop labeling yourself anyway. It's not healthy.

>>38994057

>This only started around age 20 for me. Never had problems before that and always excelled at languages in school. Even my typing seems worse. I forget complete words here and there, multiple times per day. Maybe I'm just more aware of myself nowadays, I think that's part of it.

How old are you now? I'm 27 now, and my psychologist told me that I definitely do not have schizophrenia and that I am too old to develop it at this point. So I guess I'll have to take his word for it.

>You should stop labeling yourself anyway. It's not healthy.

In which case people will label me anyway. See my posts here for examples as to what I'm talking about:

>>38982885
>>38982899
>>38982921

>>38983027

>you seem to care A LOT what others think of you and that this causes you much trouble.

>Why do you care? Why dont you continue your education FOR YOURSELF. Why do you care about your teachers? Why do you care if people in school may not want to be associated with you?

Why do I care? I'll tell you why.

I know that most (if not all of you) will believe me, or even care about everything that I've said so far, and everything that I will say. But anyway. Here goes. I've been browsing 4chan since May of 2005 (yeah, yeah, I know, it's bullshit, blah blah blah, nobody cares, whatever) and I've seen first-hand the way that people treat each other.

It's like I wrote in my post here:

>>38983004

>Schaudenfreude. People enjoy seeing those who are weaker than them, it makes them feel better about their own situations. And those "weak" people that they see, they see people deserving of all the hate and mockery, instead of seeing people deserving of love and understanding. That's how people in this world survive.

For years what I've been seeing is this sort of "witch hunt" thing that not only 4chan has going, but the whole world seems to have going.

It's almost as if the whole world has this "mob mentality" where they just try to identify somebody that is perceived as being "unfit" for this world, somebody who deserves to be hated, mocked, and ostracized.

Additionally, I wrote the following in my post here:

>>38983004

>Once a person is labeled a "narcissist", or a "sociopath", or a "psychopath"... or diagnosed with just about any other mental and/or personality disorder, it's basically like they're having a big label stamped on their forehead for everybody to see that states "EVIL" or "LAZY" or "CRAZY" or "WEAK" or "STUPID". And so, people take advantage of this. They see a person who is unfit for this world. They see a person who is deserving of all the hate and mockery. I finally understand now. That's the impression that I get.

>>38983027

>you seem to care A LOT what others think of you and that this causes you much trouble.

>Why do you care? Why dont you continue your education FOR YOURSELF. Why do you care about your teachers? Why do you care if people in school may not want to be associated with you?

And being that I live within the city of Los Angeles, only a very short distance away from Hollywood Boulevard... where this obsessive popularity of the schadenfreude revolving celebrity gossip spurred on by things like TMZ rages on harder than ever, it would seem that we'll all be stuck on this world for a very, very, very long time. Not that I would consider myself "superior" to people who are interested in celebrity gossip. I mean, hey, if you think that Tom Cruise being a Scientologist is funny and you guys like making fun of all the things he says and does... go ahead. I'm not religious or anything, but I've tried to very closely follow the so-called "Golden Rule" in my life. I'm not going to pretend to be holier-than-thou or take the moral high ground, because I'm certainly not perfect, I'm only human.

But I understand now. I finally understand now. This is how the world works. The whole world is on a witch hunt to identify those that are perceived as being "weak", and so the mob mentality centers its attention on this individual, and they see someone deserving of all the hate and mockery.

And if they can't find any real reasons to hate and mock the person, they'll find something. They'll make something up. I've experienced this first-hand, myself. My family has done this to me. My classmates have done this to me. Everyone has done this to me in the past.

It's a victim-blaming complex. They blame the victim for his misfortunes. They look for reasons not to feel sorry for the victim.

>>38983027

Here's some copypasta that explains pretty well what I'm trying to describe:

"Normal" people don't want to admit that losers exist because they've been riding the high wave of self-confidence and social skills from their early childhood into the present. They want to think that that's a result of their own good character and activities, and not simply the result of factors entirely outside of their control. Like upbringing and the absence of early childhood trauma.

Normals want the double pleasure of having had good things fall on them by an accident of fate AND believe that they're truly responsible for having brought it about. For example (and this is just ONE example of a possible cause). They're physically fit. Why? Because they came from a high income family that provided them with organic vegetables. They did not come from a low income family full of abuse where the child was forced toward compulsive eating to fill the hideous emotional gap in is/her life. They never had the feeling of hopelessness that comes with not knowing when you'll have to kill yourself out of sheer poverty. They always knew that they had the material, emotional, and other resources to succeed.

Normals hate losers complaining because they don't want to feel guilt or sympathy for them. They realize on an instinctive level that empathy for losers will only drag them down in to the mire with them. so they have to find a way to simultaneously deny the losers their aid whilst still believing themselves to be good, friendly wholesome people. The only way to do this is to imagine the loser as a villain who's responsible for their own misery.

Otherwise the nice, inclusive, tolerant normal would have to face up to the fact they aren't nice, inclusive or tolerant at all.

>>38983027

>you seem to care A LOT what others think of you and that this causes you much trouble.

>Why do you care? Why dont you continue your education FOR YOURSELF. Why do you care about your teachers? Why do you care if people in school may not want to be associated with you?

We all understand that "just be social" or go outside, meet people" or "man up" are meaningless phrases. But people assume it's really that easy for everyone, and you must be lazy for not doing what's so simple for them. You will mostly get "advice" from people who have had normal social lives and cannot fathom being in your position. People who get invites to parties monthly, weekly, or even daily, will advise you to "just say yes" when invited, thinking it's your fault for constantly saying "no". Because what kind of a person doesn't get invited to parties all the time, right? And when you point that out, lacking empathy, they feel that you're being an ungrateful scum, and do their best to injure you for the perceived insult.

It's almost always better to suffer alone. Other people only pretend to care for the shortest possible time frame. After that, they can't be bothered. Unless you're paying them (like you pay a therapist to be your friend for hire), nobody really cares about you, and even then they don't help you unless it helps themselves too.

You won't receive any empathetic suggestions. Instead, people will suggest that you do ridiculous public antics that they would never do and have also never made friends that way: go talk to a stranger at a cafe, approach someone reading a book in a bookstore, go for a walk in a park alone and start talking to someone sitting on a bench. Those are creepy weird behaviors that normal social people rarely do to make friends, and anecdotal evidence to the contrary is usually a stroke of luck that you shouldn't count on.

>>38994495

I'm 23. So you're saying I should have more symptoms now if I have it?

>>38983027

You're living in a world that they will never understand. In their reality, you can go up to someone else at a the bar and strike up a conversation, easy as pie. If they don't like you, they will calmly say so. If they do, you've made a new friend. But for you, there is no positive outcome. If they don't like you, a scene is made, and you become known as a creeper or something along those lines to the person and their friends. If they do like you, it's usually out of pity not out of genuine interest. It's a lose-lose situation.

What make these suggestions dangerous is that most of them are true in a completely trivial sense that misses any sense of context for the other person. so they sound reasonable to a "normal" person with underdeveloped empathy. It's like telling a homeless person to "just invest in a stock portfolio". Yes, investing in a stock portfolio would definitely solve the hobo's problems, but the advice is ignoring context.

First: Does he even know what a stock portfolio is? Most people like you don't have this problem, since they're knowledgeable about social situations and their predicament by necessity. Second: Does he have any money to invest in one ? You have to have beginning capital, monetary or social, to make an investment. Obviously this is where a friendless loser will stumble, as he is not desirable in any way and he has nothing to offer. Third: He doesn't have a house or phone to call someone and get things set up, he doesn't have the connections to a stock broker, he will probably get swindled since he's an easy target and so on. So even if you somehow overcome the second hurdle with superhuman willpower and you improve yourself enough to compensate for your position in society this is where almost everyone will fail. They simply don't have the support structures that would enable them to do anything substantial in life.

>>38995055

>I'm 23. So you're saying I should have more symptoms now if I have it?

I'm not sure which age would be "too old" for a person to develop schizophrenia. According to this:

http://www.psychiatrictimes.com/schizophrenia/atypical-antipsychotics-treatment-schizophrenia-spectrum-disorders

>The onset of schizophrenia occurs by the age of 19 in nearly 40% of male patients and 23% of female patients. Although childhood-onset schizophrenia (onset of psychotic symptoms before age 13) is rare, the incidence of schizophrenia rises sharply and steadily after the onset of puberty.

>>38983027

A person who says that is thinking it's "simple advice" when they're really relying on a lifetime of experience, positive reinforcement, social contact, upbringing and opportunities they can't take for granted which the homeless person doesn't have and not only can't get overnight, but probably won't get ever again, and the advice giver can't comprehend that someone else might not have this.

To change anything major in your life, you need all the necessary tools plus a lot of luck. To get the tool you need to have been winning at life from the start, to build confidence and learn that the world is a place of good experiences and not everyone's out to get you. If you were born with good luck, you're reasonably happy and most things have been going your way, you'll have a decent life. If this hasn't been happening to you since early childhood, you're fucked.

Life is unfair. Those having it good justify this with the "just world fallacy". It's easier to think that people have what they deserve: They suffer because they're bad people, and they have it good because they're better than the rest. Yet sport players that barely know how to speak properly earn 8 digits for running behind a ball, and others work their ass off for a miserable wage if they're lucky enough to even get a job. Some are born into families of political power, others are born in the middle of African poverty with nothing to eat but mud and worms.

If you're a "normal person", you won't think about this, in the course of your daily life you won't have t. If you're a loser, you will be aware of all that society does to people and have a higher sense of empathy, even if only you've experienced it yourself. It's not that "normals" are without any misfortune. But they are by definition excluded from having most problems that plagued people like you have to go through during their formative years.

>>38995100

Well it started around that age, but I started doing drugs at that age as well. Adderall, LSD and weed. It doesn't say how long it takes for the effects to really express themselves. Maybe I'm still in the onset? I don't know. Worrying about it doesn't do me any good either.

>>38983027

Imagine if you will, two people. One is "normal", one is "abnormal". They both grew up in a troubled environment. Maybe their parents had a divorce at a young age, or one of them died. Maybe they were abused and had a difficult home life, and both were probably depressed at some point.

Now, imagine that these two people have only one thing separating them: The normal one wen through school, into college and then work while having friends, have a few girlfriends, kissed before the age of 14, lost his virginity before 18, did relatively well at school and despite the troubles he may have had elsewhere came out a well-rounded and well-adjusted person as a result. Now, imagine that the abnormal one was the exact opposite of this: Having no friends, no girlfriend, never kissing, never having sex, getting bad grades and then spending the rest of his life as a shut-in with no future because of this.

What was the difference? Both had problems, yes. The normal person certainly had plenty of problems himself. But the abnormal person's problems were greatly amplified as he had no outside support, no person or group to fall back on. This is where the bitterness towards "normals" comes in. A normal person is by his nature destined to have an easier life than an abnormal person in the same situation, and for this reason "abnormals" can become very jaded, jealous and hateful towards society.

>>38983027

When you're not a part of some group, you don't feel like a part of the society, you aren't accepted in the tribe, you can't "just do it", you can't "man up", you have all this underlying anxiety and depression stemming from not having your place in the world that will prevent you from doing anything no matter how hard you try. When it develops it is something you really have to get over by force. You need to put yourself outside of you comfort zone and stay there. And if you consistently have bad experiences when you try, unless you're completely insane, you will eventually stop trying.

Normal people don't understand this, they think that "giving up" means giving up after the first try because they usually succeed at the second. They don't understand that "giving up" means years of banging your head against the wall, trying to integrate into the very same society that they, out of their stupid tribal instincts and inherent evil in their hearts, don't want to let you in.

Let's analyze a few common pieces of "advice" you'll hear from such people:

"Success is a journey, not a destination."

Take an analogy of a road trip. You're supposed to be driving from Houston to New Orleans to spend Mardi Gras with some women from the area that you met on the internet.

Normal person: They drive there, but they get a flat tire. They call up a friend to help them and in the process of fixing it, the encounter a hobo who asks them for money. They give him $20, and he tells them there's a great bar down the road, they fix the tire, go on the to the bar, drink and do drugs and fuck local whores there, continue driving while feeling an amazing high, and arrive to see the internet girls were even hotter than in the pics. "Ah, an interesting event on the journey" , you say.

>>38983027

Someone like you: They get pulled over by a cop halfway there for going 4mph over the speed limit. While being pulled over a drunk driver crashes into their car and speeds off, the cop follows. Their car is inoperable and the cop doesn't return, being hot in the chase. They're stranded and don't have anyone to call because they have no friends. The hobo appears and stabs them for the $20. But it's ok, the girls weren't even real, it was just some old high school or college bullies playing a prank on the guy by pretending said girls on the internet.

It was an interesting of events, but you can see that just saying "success is a journey, not a destination" has an assumption that you eventually reach the destination and get positive feedback. This is not guaranteed, and due to the random happenings of luck and your own capacities to deal with it, or the lack thereof, is often not achieved at all.

"You're depressed ? Oh come on, everybody gets sad, you just got to learn to deal with it. If you can't get therapy or medication."

No, not everybody gets sad. People with girlfriends, a social network, a good job, and various other opportunities might have a "down day" but they are generally quite content with their lives and can feel good about themselves when they look at their standing compared to others. This is illustrated by the way they say "I'm sooo sad" then whip back a day later to a happy mood. That's not depression. And "learn to deal with it" ? What does that mean ? It's vague to the point of having no substance at all.

>>38983027

When you're depressed in the way you might be, the issue is finding a motivation for anything. It's not chemicals or brain disease or anything else. It's that your worldview is bleak and dismal, It's not depression in a classical sense where you have a good life but you are "depressed" due to the brain chemistry or a short circuit that can be fixed by talking to a shrink, it's just being perfectly realistic about your shit life and inability to achieve anything a normal person could.

You can work on it, meditate, practice saying "yes" to life, write down positive qualities about yourself and good memories you've had and read them back to yourself... but those techniques only work for people who didn't have shit lives in the first place. They only make you realize and focus on how good you have it. When you don't, you'll only feel worse. You'll wake up at night crying, you'll slug through each and every day wishing you were dead because you won't see any place in life as a good place to go. It will all feel bad, and when it will feel good it barely will. For you it's so hard to get to those good feelings compared to a normal person, it's like dragging a boulder for 3 miles just get an M&M. You just want to lie down and die.

It's just another thing that normal people don't get. They can solve situational depression bby changing their lives for the better because they have a support structure. They can solve chemical depression by taking meds because their lives are otherwise good. The drugs work, because theu allow them to live their good life. If you have a miserable life, the drugs don't work. They can treat it as a simple obstacle to push thorough. But in your life there's no one single obstacle. There's nothing you can define that happened to "burn you out". There's just nothing that looks worthwhile to you anymore.

>>38983027

Depression for you is a lifetime of loneliness and acceptance of the fact that you can never be happy even when trying, depression for a normal person is "OMG NO GF FOR 2 WEEKS", they will never get it. If they say there depressed but "worked out of it" by lifting or just "going out" then they're lying to make you feel even worsen they were never depressed, just bored. Being strongly bored might look like "depression" but it's an entire universe away. Happiness is not a decision, it's something you either get or don't get. You could do nothing all your life and be happy, and you could try things all your life and still be miserable.

"Man up and stop being a pussy."

This obviously has no meaning. It's just macho posturing from someone who's never has anything to complain about and has ample opportunities to vent his minuscule stress levels in productive way.

"Think about all the starving African children, your problems are insignificant compared to theirs."

The logical end point of this is that no one is allowed to ever feel sad or think about their problems, because they all have it better than some poor African armless legless bastard in a trash can with people shitting on him. It's irrational. People judge themselves and get reinforcement from their peer group. You are probably surrounded or exposed to more successful people your age who accentuate your problems.

>>38983027

"Just work out and get a better diet."

Probably the least retarded advice. But it still ignores context: genetics, metabolism, habits, general quality of life, psychological hangups and motivation. Normals can do this stuff on autopilot, whereas foreveralones have to really force it and overcome their own insecurities and lack of inertia and the most important thing: Support structures. They don't even have friends to help motivate them or go to the gym with them, they are on their own in this as in all other aspects of life, which kills all motivation. And even if you do it, it will not affect your life nearly as much as it will a normal person's life. You'll just be a foreveralone loser with a slightly better looking body. Best you could get is a meaningless sex from clubs sluts if you're still young (early twenties). Later than that, no one will care. And do you really want that in the first place? It won't be getting you love or emotional support or anything good from anyone worthwhile.

"Just get a job and stop lazy."

Most jobs come from social contacts. Normals have many of these, foreveralones have few if any. Very few people get jobs just from applying online or in person. They get it through a friend or family member. Normals also have confidence from their otherwise successful lives, which lets them ace interviews. This is another thing that is harder for foreveralones. requiring much more willpower, intelligence and luck than a normal would need.

>>38983027

"Just stop being sad and be happy instead."

Another meaningless "courage wolf" type of "advice" that implies that foreveralones just somehow didn't remember to be happy! Now that the normal person has reminded them, there it is, happiness at last! Even worse, when you're still not happy after just being told to just be happy, they will blame you for conditioning yourself to be unhappy, for outright wanting to be unhappy. Who the hell wants to be unhappy? But how can you be happy when all the people around you already have friends, when they are probably getting married, have sexual experiences and normal interests, and you don't have anything, and don't see a path in life that could lead to it?

Even your "friends" aren't really on the same level as a friend to other people. You have to buy their love, and can't expect anyone to call you first, or return your messages. You just have to live your life hoping you'll stumble into someone you know when you feel the need to talk, but even then you have to be incredibly guarded and watch what you say because you've learned through direct experience the you shouldn't take about yourself, because it's offensive to others, even in benign things like musical tastes and fashion statements.

Another thing people will suggest is to "work on yourself" to achieve greater confidence and ultimately happiness. But confidence and happiness comes from success, and doing something useless like "getting ripped" and realizing that you're STILL being just as unsuccessful in life as before, can only lead to an even greater depression.

But you know, first you get fit, then you get money, then you get a big house and a nice car, you get a new haircut, you get a nice suit, you look great, you smile, you talk to women every single day...

>>38983027

...and then you do it for 30+ years with no results and become completely insane and start doing stupid, creepy or crazy things out of sheer desperation. Because none of the arbitrary goalposts ever did anything for him like they won't for you, they were all lies meant to keep you busy and not thinking about the actual reasons for your predicament.

When you're told " All you gotta do to achieve X is Y" and you've been doing Y since forever, it makes you feel even shittier, like some divine power has decided that aren't worthy of X, no matter what you do to try to redeem yourself. Like there's a permanent stain on you that you can't make up for no matter how hard you try.

Most "advice" you'll get will be useless with regard to real life. People will give you arbitrary milestones that mean nothing. They will keep regurgitating the same "do this then you deserve to be a normal person" line over and over again, the same "advice" that's been fed to you by the media and the authorities, in effect making you unhappy with who you are, with the goal to spend spend spend, and live in constant anxiety, so you can be the same as any other obedient working class drone.

None of this will make you happy, and none of this will help you become a "normal human being". You will constantly see proof that none of these goalposts mattered one bit, something that the people giving you this advice will be oblivious to, because after all, it worked for them.

>>38995235
Seems that you haven't gotten over your childhood trauma that's why you cant move on with your life go back and revisit the past and forgive yourself for thibking you were weak(you were a child) and forgive others for making you feel that way

>>38995280
https://youtu.be/3MPh2hQxYZ0
This will help you please watch I've been in the same place you were

>>38983027

They will say you need to get fit, but the fat guy down the street is happily married, living a real sitcom life with his family. You need to get a good job , car, house, but the unemployed hippie stoner down the street is in an open relationship with two chicks he mooches off who love his "art". Get a better haircut? Fix your teeth? Get a nose job? But the comically ugly guy down the street is not only in a relationship but cheats on her at every opportunity, and his friends approve that behavior. Work on your social skills? Even the model train society guys who go on bar crawls in your town are pretty social and happy regardless of being aspergers and not letting new people into their clique.

It's known that you've got to have money to make money. The same applies to friends and everything else in life. If you get to zero, you have to declare bankruptcy. You can't do anything unless someone takes pity on you and helps you reboot your social life.

Just "talking to people" was never the problem. Communication, in and of itself, can encompass any useless ot miserable exchange. What matters in real life is the value you bring to others. Never be retarded enough to think that "nice" or "compassionate" are considered valuable in the modern world, because they're not. What matters is whether or not you can make money for others, and whether or not you can make others feel good.

Even socializing works like a market. People trade their time with other people if and only if they believe they're gaining something of greater value than what they're giving up. These "gains from trade" so to speak are then reinvested (e.g. meeting friends of friends, "networking"). It's pure capitalism. Unlike in a real economy though, none of this social wealth can never be regulated or redistributed and therefore losers will usually remain socially destitute, as the gap between them and the winners widens with years.

Give meditation a try, I just assumed it was dumb hippy bullshit but apparently there is visible changes in the brain after a couple weeks of meditating

It's been proven by brain scans to work

>>38983027

Sometimes, what "might' work to an extent, and only if you're still very young (late teens, early college years) is to join a club that promotes some kind of group activity. The problem with this is that you're probably not a fan of any sort of social activity, which helped to make you friendless in the first place. You will likely not have the social skills to integrate yourself smoothly among your peers out of the blue. Unless the club is made up of D&D neckbeards, you're going to be somewhat socially awkward, meaning people aren't going to want to be seen with you.

For a lot of people in your situation, even easy-mode friend-making things like university clubs do not work most of the time. Let me tell you what happens in clubs in general:

1. A bunch of friends will join to get discounts on a common activity. They have friends, they don't need more.

2. They hang out together and have inside discussion that prevents anyone outside the circle from sounding remotely interesting.

3. In club meetings same circles of friends sit together and joke around and participate TOGETHER.

4. People generally don't care what you have to say, and will listen, if and only if, they were brought up to be "polite". After listening to you attempts they will get back with their friends and keep doing the same things as before

As you can see clubs will mostly be full of people who are already friends with each other and joined the club to have an excuse to drink or shoot the shit together, who will have their own discussions and won't let anyone in, no matter their qualities, and how good at the activity they might be. The chance of this will increase with age, and the older you are, the more will everyone expect that you are really good at thing the club is about, and that your social connections are already made.

>>38995300
You don't like yourself so you don't become vulnerable to people you're scared that they will see your true self and you don't allow them to get close to you, first step is becoming a person worth liking then you'll be comfortable with yourself and you'll let your walls down slowly and people will start getting closers to you

>>38983027

In any human relationship, business, social, romantic, any type, when one side shows that they really need need the other side, it automatically makes them the loser, the bitch, the creep, the undesirable party. It shows weakness. The only way to really make new friends is to present yourself in such a light that they would want to be your friend - for that they must see you as a socially desirable person, as attractive, as someone better than them who can provide them with something in a social context.

In other words, you're out of luck and it won't work. It's not kindergarten or highschool or first semester in a college dorm anymore, you can't just make friends by coming up to people and saying "wanna be my friend", in the real world it just doesn't work that way, and you don't have what it takes to be seen as desirable, no matter how much you might pretend.

When you get older, when your life steers this far out of the norm, you can never return. There's no way to reboot it, no way to fix your past, when you have 10+ years of going in the wrong direction behind, you'd have 20+ years going in the right direction at double speed to just catch up with the average Joe, and he's been working at it at the same time too...

Perhaps you will continue to live life, and everything will be normal while your attention is occupied by study, work, TV, internet if you're lucky enough to have those distractions. But when you're tired of those you will start to crave for company. The basic need to tell people about yourself, about your experiences in life, about the things you enjoyed, to be a real human being.

btw I can tell from your posts you're high as fuck on adderall, so much wasted energy, such a fucking stupid drug to be taking

>hmm lets just drink 5 cans of redbull and sit here browsing the internet

sounds like a fantastic idea

>>38983027

If you do your chores outside, people you see will be in a different world, like looking through a shop window at something you could never afford. You'll realize your world is so much smaller than theirs. You'll see them talk on their phone and wonder what if you had someone to talk to. You'll see couples holding hands, eating ice cream, hugging... You'll start to wonder, or worse, remember what it feels like to be touched by someone special. You'll see people laughing and drinking and talking about their interests and you'll wonder what's so funny. Maybe it will be something that you know a lot about, that you could amuse and impress people with, if only there wasn't for that thick glass between you and them.

Soon you'll feel more alone than ever, you will feel empty, your life will start to seem meaningless, with no visible goals. You'll realize that you have separated yourself from society. You'll have lost your ability to enjoy company and laugh together with others, they'll seem different. You'll have lost your social skills and created mental barriers around yourself to stop getting people from getting close to you, you'll feel nervous or outright threatened when you are among people who fully enjoy themselves. Then comes the worst, when suddenly all these things become unbearable, all that natural need for social interaction and how much better it would be to have friends and how much you missed in your life until now. You'll realize that you need other people to live but the other people will never need you.

Then finally your brain will snap and you'll feel like the small world you live in is collapsing on you, you are suddenly filled with grief and sadness, it is overwhelming so much you could start to cry. You'll realize that nobody is there to hear you cry which makes it even worse and you have fallen so far that you cannot climb back up anymore. It is a downward spiral that just gets progressively worse and worse as time goes by.

>>38983027

And there is no way out. As we've concluded: you have to have friends to make friends, you have to have money to make money, you have to have a social backing of some sort to support you in your endeavors... If you truly have nothing, you can't get anything, short of someone taking pity on you and rebuilding your life for you, which won't happen, or some similar incredible stroke of luck.

Some people will tell you to just endure and that it gets better over time. It doesn't. Over 30 everyone half decent is married, or has been married multiple times. The rest are lesbians, still holding out for Mr. Perfect (6'4", blond hair, blue eyes, 9" dick, rich, perfect personality, talented), even as their looks are completely ruined, or women with massive mental and physical issues who find solace in the fact that they can still get a reasonably attractive guy to have sex with them, and do this very, very often (despite being obese yaoi fans who smell like cat pee and dress in brown polyester pant suits). Male friends? Can't really make new ones after college or your first day of work.

As far as meeting new people in carious public venues goes, over 25, you start having problems with bouncers. Over 30, you don't even want to go to those places... If they let you in, the people will make it very clear you're not welcome. Same thing goes for cons and concerts. Also, expect to get bullied even if you go out to eat by yourself.

If you're old and ugly, and decide to go for a prostitute, you'll find out they do refuse customers (or ask more than you can possibly afford). Sometimes their pimp will beat you up and still keep your money.

>>38983027

Life is cruel and unfair. By the time you're even aware enough of a personal flaw to care or want to fix it, it's too late. It's always been too late. You were born without the raw abilities that others take for granted. And it is only this raw ability that translates into value in the real world. Sometimes, because of institutions like schools or colleges, humans can convince themselves that "you get what you put in" in life. But the truth is that unless some valuable shit was "put in" when you were born, you will not succeed.

All that you were supposed to build up until now, you didn't, and you have no foundation to build things you're supposed to build in this part of your life, you'll always be an outsider, shunned, ostracized, looked upon as a creepy friendless loser, that's just human nature and the tribal instinct. No matter where you go and how you try to fit in, this will follow you.

Past a certain age, mid twenties to early thirties at the latest, if you haven't been living a very social lifestyle, you're fucked forever. Human life is structured in a way where the majority of people gain friends when they're forced to be with someone for a long period of time, and when you they're still in their formative years years. So highschool, college, work, army etc. And then in your mid-twenties people start leaving faster than you gain them and most people end up with very few friends at an old age.

You're reduced to experiencing what an average 75 year old man is experiencing: No social opportunities to interact with your peers and hang around them long enough for a friendship to develop. Even he has the option of going to a retirement community or various senior citizen clubs, events etc. A friendless person in a place in life where they're not supposed to friendless can't really do anything because it's not socially acceptable, you just come off as a weirdo whatever you try.

>>38983027

Another problem with being a NEET or generally falling off track with life, is that all the goals that might make you start caring about life again are unattainable for you without years or decades of work, and you're so behind everyone else, that even if you're stupid you have to understand that you'll always lag, and things will only get worse no matter how hard you try.

If shit just sorted itself out in a matter of months or even a year, and you got into a normal life again, I'm sure most of you would be pretty good at it, surely not much worse than the average person. But to work against the whole world to even begin getting there, you have to be in an exceptionally great mental state, have support from your friends, social network, family, be attractive and rich and charming...

And of course, if you had that, you wouldn't have ended up like this in the first place...

The only people who will ever understand your situation are the same as you and don't know how to dig themselves out of their hole anymore. They have tried, it's not because of their inaction, they've been trying all their lives, and they have exhausted more options than anyone with a normal life could even think up as suggestions.

Fixing yourself isn't as simple as gazing at a picture of a snarling wolf on a yellow background, and that anyone would think that degree of "help" is actually helpful is offensively patronizing and serves only to breed further hatred and resentment for people as lucky as themselves: People who can just "make friends" and "go out" and "get laid" with a minimum of effort and not have their failures set them farther and farther back until there's no point in trying anymore.

There are no real answers that can be given aside from accept your situation and learn to cope with being alone your whole life. You've managed to make it this far, so just keep enduring. Maybe one day a miracle will come.

But don't bet on it.

File: Gattaca.png (223KB, 272x393px) Image search: [Google]

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>>38983027

You ever seen the movie Gattaca?

I can see a situation like what is depicted in the movie Gattaca unfolding over the course of the next four decades or so.

People diagnosed with disorders like me will be pushed to the side by automation, genetically superior individuals, and sanism.

We'll be placed in poorly-constructed ghettos where we'll be fed antidepressants and antipsychotics until our senses are so deadened that we simply stop caring completely, and then we just find a hole to rot and die in. All away from public view, so that the genetically superior individuals don't have to look at us and feel sorry for our poor quality of life.

It will all happen so gradually that by the time anybody notices what's going on, it'll be too late.

https://youtu.be/h6H0OwnIvs8
Watch this it will help

>>38983027

You ever seen the documentary "Lost Angels"? You can probably find it on Netflix, if you have Netflix.

I realize that every once in awhile we get a productive mentally ill person like John Forbes Nash, Jr.

But what happens to all the other mentally ill people?

I remember a few years back watching "Lost Angels" about the homeless living in Skid Row, Los Angeles. There's about 6,000 homeless people living in Skid Row, one of the largest stable populations of homeless people here in the US, and this place is only a few miles east of here.

Now, of course, I'm sure that I'm about to get responses like, "oh? You feel so sorry for those homeless people, why don't you go out there and help them instead of sitting here all day posting in this thread?"

Let's say that I do decide to go out there to some homeless shelter, and help out in some soup kitchen.

And I just know how it's going to turn out. The experience will be like every other experience in my life.

People will just look at me and think, "this guy will only be here this one time to feel good about himself. He wants to prove to everyone how much of a nice guy he is. And then he's just going to leave and never come back. He doesn't really care."

Is there such a thing as a "selfless act"? How could I help people and it be completely "selfless acts" when in the end I'm still getting something out of it? I'll feel good about myself. I'll feel good knowing that maybe people will finally think of me as a better person, that I'm not selfish after all.

Maybe I should point out anecdotes in my past in which I've tried helping somebody out. But what good would such anecdotes do when I can't even prove to anyone that they really happened? And besides, all I'll really be doing is trying to prove to everybody that I'm not a selfish person after all.

>>38983027

It's like I wrote in my post here:

>>38992870

>That's just the thing. I don't quite have the luxury to keep doing this anymore. I'm at the end of my line here.

>I'm currently living in an apartment with my 70-year-old mother. And I know that this won't last for much longer. I don't know how much longer this will last. Maybe six more months... or five... or four, or three, or two, one...

>Pretty soon I'm going to end up like the 6,000 homeless people pictured here living a short walking distance east of here, in Skid Row, Los Angeles.

>And I just know that when I end up homeless, taking medications that make me feel like shit, even worse than I feel right now... I just know that nobody is going to feel sorry for me.

>I'll just keep wandering aimlessly around the city, feeling like shit, looking like shit, smelling l like shit, barely coherent...

>I'll just keep getting fed antidepressants and antipsychotics until my senses are so deadened that I simply stop caring completely, and then I'll just find a hole to rot and die in. All away from public view, so that everybody else doesn't have to look at me and feel sorry for my poor quality of life.

>>38983027

You ever read the story "Manna" by Marshall Brain? This is the sort of future I envision as the decades of this century roll on by:

Manna

Chapter 1

by Marshall Brain

Depending on how you want to think about it, it was funny or inevitable or symbolic that the robotic takeover did not start at MIT, NASA, Microsoft or Ford. It started at a Burger-G restaurant in Cary, NC on May 17. It seemed like such a simple thing at the time, but May 17 marked a pivotal moment in human history.

Burger-G was a fast food chain that had come out of nowhere starting with its first restaurant in Cary. The Burger-G chain had an attitude and a style that said "hip" and "fun" to a wide swath of the American middle class. The chain was able to grow with surprising speed based on its popularity and the public persona of the young founder, Joe Garcia. Over time, Burger-G grew to 1,000 outlets in the U.S. and showed no signs of slowing down. If the trend continued, Burger-G would soon be one of the "Top 5" fast food restaurants in the U.S.

The "robot" installed at this first Burger-G restaurant looked nothing like the robots of popular culture. It was not hominid like C-3PO or futuristic like R2-D2 or industrial like an assembly line robot. Instead it was simply a PC sitting in the back corner of the restaurant running a piece of software. The software was called "Manna", version 1.0*.

>>38983027

Manna's job was to manage the store, and it did this in a most interesting way. Think about a normal fast food restaurant. A group of employees worked at the store, typically 50 people in a normal restaurant, and they rotated in and out on a weekly schedule. The people did everything from making the burgers to taking the orders to cleaning the tables and taking out the trash. All of these employees reported to the store manager and a couple of assistant managers. The managers hired the employees, scheduled them and told them what to do each day. This was a completely normal arrangement. In the early twenty-first century, there were millions of businesses that operated in this way.

But the fast food industry had a problem, and Burger-G was no different. The problem was the quality of the fast food experience. Some restaurants were run perfectly. They had courteous and thoughtful crew members, clean restrooms, great customer service and high accuracy on the orders. Other restaurants were chaotic and uncomfortable to customers. Since one bad experience could turn a customer off to an entire chain of restaurants, these poorly-managed stores were the Achilles heel of any chain.

To solve the problem, Burger-G contracted with a software consultant and commissioned a piece of software. The goal of the software was to replace the managers and tell the employees what to do in a more controllable way. Manna version 1.0 was born.

>>38983027

Manna was connected to the cash registers, so it knew how many people were flowing through the restaurant. The software could therefore predict with uncanny accuracy when the trash cans would fill up, the toilets would get dirty and the tables needed wiping down. The software was also attached to the time clock, so it knew who was working in the restaurant. Manna also had "help buttons" throughout the restaurant. Small signs on the buttons told customers to push them if they needed help or saw a problem. There was a button in the restroom that a customer could press if the restroom had a problem. There was a button on each trashcan. There was a button near each cash register, one in the kiddie area and so on. These buttons let customers give Manna a heads up when something went wrong.

At any given moment Manna had a list of things that it needed to do. There were orders coming in from the cash registers, so Manna directed employees to prepare those meals. There were also toilets to be scrubbed on a regular basis, floors to mop, tables to wipe, sidewalks to sweep, buns to defrost, inventory to rotate, windows to wash and so on. Manna kept track of the hundreds of tasks that needed to get done, and assigned each task to an employee one at a time.

Manna told employees what to do simply by talking to them. Employees each put on a headset when they punched in. Manna had a voice synthesizer, and with its synthesized voice Manna told everyone exactly what to do through their headsets. Constantly. Manna micro-managed minimum wage employees to create perfect performance.

The software would speak to the employees individually and tell each one exactly what to do. For example, "Bob, we need to load more patties. Please walk toward the freezer."

Or, "Jane, when you are through with this customer, please close your register. Then we will clean the women's restroom."

>>38983027

And so on. The employees were told exactly what to do, and they did it quite happily. It was a major relief actually, because the software told them precisely what to do step by step.

For example, when Jane entered the restroom, Manna used a simple position tracking system built into her headset to know that she had arrived. Manna then told her the first step.

Manna: "Place the 'wet floor' warning cone outside the door please."

When Jane completed the task, she would speak the word "OK" into her headset and Manna moved to the next step in the restroom cleaning procedure.

Manna: "Please block the door open with the door stop."

Jane: "OK."

Manna: "Please retrieve the bucket and mop from the supply closet."

Jane: "OK."

And so on.

Once the restroom was clean, Manna would direct Jane to put everything away. Manna would make sure that she carefully washed her hands. Then Manna would immediately start Jane working on a new task. Meanwhile, Manna might send Lisa to the restroom to inspect it and make sure that Jane had done a thorough job. Manna would ask Lisa to check the toilets, the floor, the sink and the mirrors. If Jane missed anything, Lisa would report it.

I grew up in Cary, NC. That was a long time ago, but when I was a kid I lived right in the middle of Cary with my parents. My father was a pilot for a big airline. My mother was a stay-at-home mom and I had a younger sister. We lived in a typical four bedroom suburban home in a nice neighborhood with a swimming pool in the backyard. I was a 15 year-old teenager working at the Burger-G on May 17 when the first Manna system came online.

>>38983027

I can remember putting on the headset for the first time and the computer talking to me and telling me what to do. It was creepy at first, but that feeling really only lasted a day or so. Then you were used to it, and the job really did get easier. Manna never pushed you around, never yelled at you. The girls liked it because Manna didn't hit on them either. Manna simply asked you to do something, you did it, you said, "OK", and Manna asked you to do the next step. Each step was easy. You could go through the whole day on autopilot, and Manna made sure that you were constantly doing something. At the end of the shift Manna always said the same thing. "You are done for today. Thank you for your help." Then you took off your headset and put it back on the rack to recharge. The first few minutes off the headset were always disorienting -- there had been this voice in your head telling you exactly what to do in minute detail for six or eight hours. You had to turn your brain back on to get out of the restaurant.

To me, Manna was OK. The job at Burger-G was mindless, and Manna made it easy by telling you exactly what to do. You could even get Manna to play music through your headphones, in the background. Manna had a set of "stations" that you could choose from. That was a bonus. And Manna kept you busy the entire day. Every single minute, you had something that Manna was telling you to do. If you simply turned off your brain and went with the flow of Manna, the day went by very fast.

My father, on the other hand, did not like Manna at all from the very first day he saw me wearing the headset in the restaurant. He and Mom had come in for lunch and to say hi. I knew they were coming, so I had timed my break so I could sit down with them for a few minutes. When I sat down, my father noticed the headset.

>>38983027

"So", he said, "they have you working the drive-thru I see. Is that a step up or a step down?"

"It's not the drive-thru," I replied, "it's a new system they've installed called Manna. It manages the store."

"How so?"

"It tells me what to do through the headset."

"Who, the manager?"

"No, it's a computer."

He looked at me for a long time, "A computer is telling you what to do on the job? What does the manager do?"

"The computer is the manager. Manna, manager, get it?"

"You mean that a computer is telling you what to do all day?", he asked.

"Yeah."

"Like what?"

I gave him an example, "Before you got here, I was taking out the trash. Manna told me how to do it."

"What did it say?"

"It tells you exactly what to do. Like, It told me to get four new bags from the rack. When I did that it told me to go to trash can #1. Once I got there it told me to open the cabinet and pull out the trash can. Once I did that it told me to check the floor for any debris. Then it told me to tie up the bag and put it to the side, on the left. Then it told me to put a new bag in the can. Then it told me to attach the bag to the rim. Then it told me to put the can back in and close the cabinet. Then it told me to wipe down the cabinet and make sure it's spotless. Then it told me to push the help button on the can to make sure it is working. Then it told me to move to trash can #2. Like that."

He looked at me for a long time again before he said, "Good Lord, you are nothing but a piece of a robot. What is it saying to you now?"

"It just told me I have three minutes left on my break. And it told me to smile and say hello to the guests. How's this? Hi!" And I gave him a big toothy grin.

"Yesterday the people controlled the computers. Now the computers control the people. You are the eyes and hands for this robot. And all so that Joe Garcia can make $20 million per year. Do you know what will happen if this spreads?"

>>38983027

"No, I don't. And I think Mr. G makes more than $20 million a year. But right now I've got two minutes left, and Manna is telling me that I need to move back to station 3 to get ready for the next run. See ya." I waved at Mom. Dad just stared at me.

The tests in our Burger-G store were surprisingly successful. There were Burger-G corporate guys in the restaurant watching us, fixing bugs in the software, making sure Manna was covering all the bases, and they were pleased. It took about 3 months to work all the kinks out, and as they did the Manna software totally changed the restaurant. Worker performance nearly doubled. So did customer satisfaction. So did the consistency of the customer's experience. Trash cans never overfilled. Bathrooms were remarkably clean. Employees always washed their hands when they needed to. Food was ready faster. The meals we handed out were nearly 100 percent accurate because Manna made us check to make sure every item in the bag was exactly what the customer ordered. The store never ran out of supplies -- there were always plenty of napkins in the dispenser and the ketchup container was always full. There were enough employees in the store for the busy times, because Manna could accurately track trends and staff appropriately.

>>38983027

In addition, Burger-G saved a ton of money. Burger-G had hundreds of stores in the United States. Manna worked so well that Burger-G deployed it nationwide. Soon Burger-G had cut more than 3,000 of its higher-paid store employees -- mostly assistant managers and managers. That one change saved the company nearly $100 million per year, and all that money came straight to the bottom line for the restaurant chain. Shareholders were ecstatic. Mr. G gave himself another big raise to celebrate. In addition, Manna had optimized store staffing and had gotten a significant productivity boost out of the employees in the store. That saved another $150 million. $250 million made a huge difference in the fast food industry.

So, the first wave of fast food robots did not replace all of the burger flipping employees as everyone had expected. The robots replaced middle management and significantly improved the performance of minimum wage employees. All of the other fast food chains watched the Burger-G experiment with Manna closely, and they started installing Manna systems as well. Soon, nearly every business in America that had a significant pool of minimum-wage employees was installing Manna software or something similar. They had to do it in order to compete.

In other words, Manna spread through the American corporate landscape like wildfire. And my dad was right. It was when all of these new Manna systems began talking to each other that things started to get uncomfortable.

>>38983027

Manna

Chapter 2

by Marshall Brain

Once Burger-G proved that Manna worked, the idea spread like wildfire. Every restaurant chain used Manna. Every retail store, whether it was a discount store, a home improvement store, a toy store, or an office supply store, had Manna systems. You saw people wearing headsets on construction sites, in airports, at amusement parks, in hospitals, in movie theaters, at the grocery store... They were everywhere.

I can remember sitting down one day with my friend Brian at lunch. He was working at the giant discount supercenter in Raleigh, and they had just switched over to Manna. He was stunned.

"It doesn't matter if you are a hard worker or a slacker -- once you put on the headset, you are going to be working every minute of the day or you are gone. The system has already fired five people."

"What's it have you do all day?" There were something like 50 people working in the supercenter at any given time -- it was a 200,000 square foot store.

"Manna has you moving through the store aisle by aisle. I bet I am walking six or eight miles a day right now. I am constantly straightening merchandise on the shelves. Manna knows where I am, and it knows where everything is on the shelves, so it asks me item by item to straighten them. Manna wants everything on the shelves looking perfect. It is also big on restocking. So it will ask me, 'How many rolls of masking tape are on the shelf?' Whenever anything gets low, it has me go to the back and bring stuff out to the shelves. It knows what is selling through the cash registers, so it knows exactly when to restock everything and it makes sure that every single item in the store is fully stocked."

"That doesn't sound so unusual." I said.

>>38983027

"It's not unusual, except that Manna is telling you exactly what to do every second of every day. If it asks you to go to the back and get merchandise, it tells you exactly where to walk to go get it. And here is the weirdest part -- I never see another employee the entire day. The way it makes me walk, I never run into anyone else. I can go for a full shift and never see another employee. Even our breaks are staggered. Everyone takes their breaks alone. We all arrive at staggered times. It's like Manna is trying to totally eliminate human interaction on the job."

"That's spooky. Why would it do that?" I asked.

Brian looked down, "I'm guessing that talking with co-workers wastes time, and Manna is eliminating the waste everywhere it can."

"What else does it have you doing?" I asked.

"I am constantly checking for spills and other problems in the aisles -- Manna uses us as its eyes to constantly look for problems. I am also looking for customers in the aisles and asking them how I can help -- customer service is huge to Manna, as long as it takes less than 30 seconds. And Manna always has us looking for shoplifters. All day long we are walking back and forth up and down the aisles straightening things, asking people if they need help and looking for shoplifters. And like I said, you never run into another employee. There's no chatting. I never see Amy anymore. Or Kevin. The minute you put on the headset you are working, and you work alone without stop until you take the headset off at the end of the shift."

"Shit." That's all I could think to say.

Brian asked, "Does Manna count you down during your breaks at Burger-G?"

"Yes, every minute you get a reminder."

Even your breaks were supervised. I had never thought about it, but all the breaks at Burger-G were staggered as well.

>>38983027

When Mom and I went to shop in Brian's store, you could feel the difference that Manna made. Every two or three minutes an employee would walk past you no matter where you were in the store. The merchandise on the shelves was always neat, and everything was stocked. The floors were spotless. Shopping carts never stacked up in the parking lot. If you needed help, you knew that all you had to do was stand there and an employee would walk by in a minute or so.

As the Manna software evolved, it gained more and more responsibility. From the start Manna was able to schedule employee hours. Manna printed a piece of paper for each employee to put on the refrigerator -- it told you your hours for the week. In version 2.0 they went further. They connected Manna to the telephone network and the public email network. So Manna was able to begin calling and emailing employees and reminding them to show up on time. If an employee didn't show up, Manna could call in a replacement. If the store became unexpectedly crowded, Manna could call in reinforcements.

>>38995395

>btw I can tell from your posts you're high as fuck on adderall, so much wasted energy, such a fucking stupid drug to be taking

>>hmm lets just drink 5 cans of redbull and sit here browsing the internet

>sounds like a fantastic idea

If it weren't for this drug, I wouldn't be able to function at all.

At least now I'm making somewhat more effort in going outside... even if going outside means sitting in a train for four hours trying to organize my thoughts.

Life is meaningless.

>>38996232
yup

It's all just dependent on what society expects from people.
Modern civilization expects people to be able to sit for hours on end and focus on one, often abstract, thing.
It also expects you to be able to interact to its standards with dozens of other people on a daily basis.

Can't do those things?
Here you go, get diagnosed with all these mental "issues".