Opinion on Vegans?

>>38521224

Isn't not killing animals a nice thing?

The only time it should be mentioned is if they're offered food and it isn't vegan, so they respectfully decline. Unless explicitly asked or gone against, it doesn't need to be brought up.

Otherwise I don't give a fuck. I'd never date a vegan though.

>>38521347
its more the fact they think that because they choose not to kill animals they are better than other people

>>38521429

If they choose not to do something because they think it's immoral, of course they'll feel morally superior over it. You'd feel the same if you chose not to do something immoral and saw others doing it. Everyone does that.

I think to be vegan is basically to be stupid, with shallow morals. If these people applied their moral standards to everything, they wouldn't touch or buy almost anything. Oil based products (everything), anything with mined rareish minerals particularly from the third world (all tech).

They go for the minimum that allows them to participate in society and still lord it over others for their sacrifice for the greater good.

Doing it for health reasons is stupid, there's no properly conclusive evidence to support that vegan diets are healthier.

>>38521812

Basically don't do anything nice if you can't make the world a perfect place

>>38521581
The main issue is let's say i found a wallet on the street and returned it too its owner is feel good about returning the wallet and wouldn't brag about how amazing I am for returning it and how those who don't return wallets support wallet cruelty

>>38521224
You need vitamin b12 if you're going without meat. That leaves you with two options to either get it from a supplement or get it from cow's milk;

http://whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=nutrient&dbid=107

While vegetarianism can be healthy, it's extremely difficult to pull off being a vegan correctly because most of the sources of protein are not appropriate for the body (soy beans, lentils).

If you're going to be a vegan, have a fucking plan or risk getting ill from what you're lacking in your diet.

Dr. Mercola has a diet plan that ranges from very simple to advanced, and I would recommend starting there so that you're not just throwing out your essential foods and replacing them with grapes and fucking tofu.

>>38522051

>most of the sources of protein are not appropriate for the body (soy beans, lentils).

What do you mean not appropriate for the body?

>>38521224
Anyone so self righteous that they believe their opinion is right at the cost of personal freedom deserves to be ostracized.
Vegans are the /pol/ of progressive liberals.

>>38521838
I wouldn't say that. I just think the effort is misplaced. The energy spent trying to avoid animal products at all costs could be spent attempting to influence consumption at a level that actually has an effect on things. Leading a moral life is all well and good, and attempting to reduce the impact you have on your environment could be a part of it. Being vegan just isn't enough. And there are too many people that choose to be vegan because morality and then neglect other key areas.

>>38522199

>Being vegan just isn't enough

But don't you agree that it's also a good thing, and that one should strive to move towards a vegan diet? That you can also do other good things isn't a factor

>>38522051
Stupid. Fucking stupid.

For B12, drink some fortified non-dairy milk.
And plants have much more vitamins and minerals in comparison to meat, dairy, and eggs. Nobody seems to realize that and fall for the shills that want to promote their own diets/products.

If you want to be vegan, just eat a variety of foods, so simple I don't see how anyone fucks it up.

>>38522051
>that moment you realize they supplement your animals with b12

GMO hipsters are worse. Vegans just have to let everyone know for attention. Anti-GMO shits are neo-luddites who have caused third world countries to starve because they adopted their los angeles hipster idea of not accepting free food because it's too good/modern and then starved to death. Penn and Teller has an episode just about them which sums it up the best.

A prepubescent person or pregnant/lactating woman should not be vegan, it is bad for development/growth and nourishment.

Vegetarianism is alright though.

>>38522321
>vegan
>milk

Retard detected

>>38522393

>A prepubescent person or pregnant/lactating woman should not be vegan

Unless they supplement B12, then it's fine

>>38521224
>What is everyone's opinion on vegans?
I don't give a shit what you eat so shut up already.

>>38521224
I'm fine with vegans. I'm a vegetarian, but I don't tell anybody about it unless I am offered it or the topic comes up in conversation. As long as they don't shill it, i'm fine with it.

>>38522051
VEGEMITE
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>>38522481
You're doing it right man keep up the good work

>>38522199
this is actually a good point.
there's an important difference between actively trying to influence the market consumption on a community/region level and abstaining from a certain subset of product on an individual level.
While vegans may have an idea that can, in some ways, positively impact our relationship with developing a more sustainable environment, doing it in a decentralized manner is ineffective and ends up more as a form of virtue signalling for the community that they're already in, rather than promoting a more mutualistic lifestyle to people who aren't already in their community.

Vegans, and a good portions of vegetarians, do not make a good appeal to abstaining from meat markets for appeal to long-term outlook. instead, they favor an offputting rhetoric of moral outrage and moral superiority. Their method is ineffective to people who may be more influenced by suggesting a more classical ideal of living off the land; the individualist agrarian style.
They fail to recognize potential overlaps in their marketing pitches in favor of emotional and moral appeals and anecdotal evidence

>>38522081
http://thepaleodiet.com/beans-and-legumes-are-they-paleo/

>>38522567

Are you saying the problem with vegans is they DON'T try to get other people to stop eating meat?

>>38522588

The paleo diet is retarded. Lentils are not "inappropriate for the human body."

>>38522593
I think he was saying that instead of listing benefits and the long terms effects of being vegan a lot just say "muh animals" and don't elaborate why other than morality

>>38522620

Not at all true. It's just that if you talk about anything else, no matter what you say the response is always "that's just vegan propaganda" or "you're a shill"

>>38522606
Prove it faggot. I like how you backed up what you said with facts.

"What the USDA doesn’t tell us is that our bodies don’t process bean and legume proteins nearly as efficiently as plant proteins – meaning that the proteins found in beans, peas and other legumes have poor digestibility."

"The Food and Agricultural Organization (FAO)/World Health Organization (WHO) of the United Nations have devised a protein quality index known as the Protein Digestibility-Corrected Amino Acid Score (PDCAAS). This index reveals that beans and other legumes maintain second-rate PDCAAS ratings which average about 20 to 25 % lower than animal protein ratings (14). So to add insult to injury legumes and beans not only contain about three times less protein than animal foods, but what little protein they do have is poorly digested. Their poor PDCAAS scores stem from a variety of antinutrients which impair protein absorption (20, 29, 44) and from low levels of two essential amino acids (cysteine and methionine) (66)."

"All beans and legumes are concentrated sources of lectins. Lectins are potent antinutrients that plants have evolved as toxins to ward off predators."

"This is why raw beans are so toxic – they contain much higher concentrations of PHA than cooked beans (4, 23. 46). However, cooking doesn’t completely eliminate PHA, and even small amounts of this lectin are known to produce adverse health effects, providing they can penetrate our gut barrier."

>>38522668

Show scientific evidence of the unhealthiness of cooked legumes and whole grains. The paleo diet is an unsupported hypothesis based on a fantasy caveman diet.

they tend to eat pretty badly, I have to cook for my sister since if I don't all she would eat is bead and pasta.

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>>38522668
Refer to;
>>38522588

Scroll to the bottom of the page.

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Might as well ask this here. I've been thinking of switching to pea protein to see if switching off whey concentrate helps my acne any. It's way cheaper than whey isolate with similar macros aside from fat. Any downside to doing this?

Pic unrelated but salmon is tasty.

>>38522757

Which references do you think makes a point that whole grains and legumes are unhealthy?

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17449231
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18954578
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22166190
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15585760
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14980987
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10479217
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15987863
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11718588
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15228991

>>38521224
>Anyone so self righteous that they believe their opinion is right at the cost of personal freedom deserves to be ostracized.
Do you believe that murder should be illegal? What about slavery? If you do, you'd better stop being so self righteous about your opinions, because you're curtailing the freedom to murder or keep slaves.

>>38522837
I don't think this post was meant for OP

>>38522814
>http://thepaleodiet.com/beans-and-legumes-are-they-paleo/

1. Alvarez JR, Torres-Pinedo R. Interactions of soybean lectin, soyasaponins, and glycinin with rabbit jejunal mucosa in vitro. Pediatr Res. 1982 Sep;16(9):728-31.

3. Baumann E, Stoya G, Völkner A, Richter W, Lemke C, Linss W. Hemolysis of human erythrocytes with saponin affects the membrane structure. Acta Histochem. 2000 Feb;102(1):21-35.

6. Calloway DH, Carol A. Hickey CA, Murphy EL. Reduction of intestinal gas-forming properties of legumes by traditional and experimental processing methods. J Food Sci. 1971; 36: 251-255.

8. Carmalt J, Rosel K, Burns T, Janzen E. Suspected white kidney bean (Phaseolus vulgaris) toxicity in horses and cattle. Aust Vet J. 2003 Nov;81(11):674-6.

>>38522814
10. Chrispeels, M.J. & Raikel, N.V. (1991) Lectins, lectin genes, and their role in plant defense. Plant Cell 3, 1-9.

12. Cordain L, Toohey L, Smith MJ, Hickey MS. Modulation of immune function by dietary lectins in rheumatoid arthritis. Br J Nutr. 2000 Mar;83(3):207-17.

13. Couzy F, Mansourian R, Labate A, Guinchard S, Montagne DH, Dirren H. Effect of dietary phytic acid on zinc absorption in the healthy elderly, as assessed by serum concentration curve tests. Br J Nutr. 1998 Aug;80(2):177-82.

16. Francis G, Kerem Z, Makkar HP, Becker K. The biological action of saponins in animal systems: a review. Br J Nutr. 2002 Dec;88(6):587-605.

19. Gibson RS, Bailey KB, Gibbs M, Ferguson EL. A review of phytate, iron, zinc, and calcium concentrations in plant-based complementary foods used in low-income countries and implications for bioavailability. Food Nutr Bull. 2010 Jun;31(2 Suppl):S134-46.

>>38522593
they try to show what good vegans they are to other vegans. they don't actually try to use methods that would actually sway markets in their favor.

Now I would never go full vegan. that's just dumb. BUT! there is good reason to reduce non-synergistic environmental consumption. And those are the terms that vegans should be appealing on to influence markets away from animal products, if they actually want to make more significant impact in reduction of usage of animal products.

However, this is not the argument or method that I've seen vegans or vegetarians apply in argument. Instead, it has been flimsy, pseudo-moral appeal and anecdotal evidence.
It doesn't convince me, it certainly won't convince the average person, and it won't work to achieve their presupposed goals

>>38522814
Pusztai A, Greer F & Grant G. Specific uptake of dietary lectins into the systemic circulation of rats. Biochemical Society Transcations. 1989;17, 527-528

>>38521347
Not really
Not killing humans is a nice thing and vegans don't give a shit about it

>>38522944
>>38522957

The evidence that the paleo diet is the proper human diet is that rabbit anal mucus in a petri dish doesn't respond well to lectins in uncooked soybean lectins, and horses and cows fed raw white kidney beans show decreased milk production?

What disease is implicated in humans from these foods and what research supports that?

>>38523040

>Not killing humans is a nice thing

Wow, what a self-righteous dickhead. Look, I get that you don't want to kill humans, but don't act like you're better than everyone who kills people.

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>>38521224
nice tripcode OP

>>38523189

Reminds me of this study on pigs

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1635051/

>claim the paleo diet was finely crafted by evolution to be the perfect diet for human beings specifically
>use pigs as test subjects

>>38522424
How...?

>>38521902

>let's say i found a wallet

It'd be more like deciding not to pickpocket people, and looking down on people who intentionally steal others' wallets.

(post got deleted, probably because of the pic)