Moving the HVAC condenser (outside unit)

on another thread there's a story of a farmer fined $12,000 for flying a drone over his fields to check his crops. same thing could happen to you for doing unlicensed electrical and refrigerant work.

>>1091964
Even if it's done up to code (unlike the previous work)?

>>1091941
what's the refrigerant type? R22? $$$$$$$$$

what state are you in? in TX i don't think they give a fuck what you do

>>1091967

You can do it yourself as long as you get a permit and work work is up to code. You're almost always better off having a tradie doing elec/plumbing though for liability reasons imo.

>>1091969
R22? What is this 1986? That's shits banned and not been made since like 95 or something. Enough to charge a home AC system would probably cost 5x what he was quoted

>>1091964
That can't be applicable in america though?

Like fuck the fed all kinds of ways if they think I'm paying money to fly a drone over my property or pay someone to move my ac

>>1091979
Not been made since 95? Are you on drugs, or do you believe that the rest of the world gives a shit what the US thinks of any given refrigerant? The world uses more r22 now than ever. It's expensive in the states, but it is most certainly available.

>>1091982
>thinking you have rights on your "property"

>>1091941
Yes, you can buy the tools. Not much use renting them out, because most have no clue how to do it.

Pay the guy to empty it, or 'create a leak' and pay 200-400$ in new refrigerant. Move the unit yourself. You can buy the fittings to empty the gas, but you'll still need to vacuum it out. Good luck.

You're fucked any way you look at it. Pay the guy to do the ref work and do the moving and electrical yourself.

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>>1091941
Good idea, save the $500 and piece of mind that it's done right and go out and buy a:
reclaim machine-$400
reclaim cylinder-$75
vacuum pump-$300
gauges-$100
gas to balance the charge(changed line sizes)-Call it $100 for shit and grins
report back plox

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>>1092015
300 is too much for a (good, used, CL type of) vacuum pump
100 will get you shitty gauges though (even a set of used ones)
both can be used for cars AC too
fuck recovering the refrigerant, so, all new
basically ~500 plus work itself
this being a DIY board, I wonder what the average poster would do
and by poster I mean an actual DIY-er, not people starting a thread to ask how to fix a hole in drywall

>>1092050
Actual DIYer mechanic here. Buy yer own gear because it pays for itself quickly.

https://www.amazon.com/Robinair-15500-VacuMaster-Economy-Vacuum/dp/B000O1C47M has done several trucks and cars for me and my bro. $217.26
Gauges were about sixty bucks.
Refrigerant is cheapest online via Ebay.
I pressure checked all my vehicles since I scored a nitrogen cylinder off Craigslist. Vacuum is a feeble way to check leaks. Uniweld nitrogen regulator I just bought yesterday after old one died from a fall. Uniweld make good stuff. (I also work on welding equipment):
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008HQ6GXO/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o03_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I replaced pump/condenser (when pumps die, small capillaries in modern vehicle condensers clog) dryer/orifice tube and lines in my two Fords and paid for all the above in saved labor plus knowing it was done right. I added UV dye for leak checking which paid off during the pressure test. Nitrogen is cheap at your local welding supply. Refrigerant is not.

I learned all I need to know by reading contractor forums and watching a couple of Youtube videos.
Just loaned all the gear to my bro to do two more of his cars.

I should have gotten this shit twenty years ago!

>>1092057
BTW if you do cars, buy proper line wrenches and WIPE SOME ANTI-SEIZE on the aluminum line fitting threads. Spin the fittings down by finger. Aluminum is soft.

We won get over it liberals lost huge. And i laugh at you fucks all day

>>1092058
Any real mech knows that

>>1092338
Is this /pol/?

>>1092050
>>1092057
even if cost of equipment and refrigerant is a push or close to it. does OP know how to properly evacuate and charge. yeah yeah youtube, but if he doesn't get it right could cost alot more in the long run. let us know how you make out OP

>>1092527
OP here
(I think) I know the basics. I've worked on a few cars' AC. If I'll do it myself, the evacuation will be in the atmosphere, sorry! As far as charging, this is what I know:
>the longer the "open system" time, the more likely it is that you have to change the accumulator
>the lower the temperature, the lower vacuum you need to evaporate/eliminate all water vapors; or just extend the time
>after vacuum, watch the gauges for a while to check for leaks
>charge the system based on gauges not refrigerant weight (take temperature into consideration also)
>check temperatures everywhere (condenser, evaporator, lines, vents) and also check for leaks (use CFC detector)

am I missing something?

Although, the more I think about it, the more I KNOW I'll chicken out and call the guy to do it for me.

>>1091941
Dont think you wanna use elbows for refrigeration lines if thats what youre doing since those are extra connections to braze and potentially leak points. Also the new tubing should be sealed with nitrogen until ready for use. You can trap the vast majority of the refrigerant in the compressor/condenser unit, and only have to deal with recovering whats in the lines+evaporator. You'll want to nitrogen flow the lines during brazing. Make sure to pressure test the lines and pull a good vacuum before charging the system. Also might as well put a new filter/dryer if you can get one cheap. Personally I would put a 40a breaker at the panel and a disconnect switch at the unit, and size all wiring properly. Also you'll have to check and tune the charge after putting the whole system together. If youve never done it before, its not impossible. But its not extremely easy to do "properly".

>>1094255
The elbows are "kind of" needed because there are a lot of bends (I counted 5 in the last 10ft of pipe) in one particular area (going around the chimney in the back of the house)
Like I said in the previous post, I'll just pay 500$ and call the guy to do the last part the right way
two advantages of this are that:
1: If I did something wrong , he'll notice it (like improperly brazing lines)
2: If something goes wrong in the future, I have some one else to blame beside me (I'm not proud of this)

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I almost didn't reply because just like how your ac guy probably feels, I would love for you to do this and have to buy at least a new compressor (cause you're cheap) instead of just getting someone trained to do it right. I understand this is /diy/ but HVAC work is not for the average diyer beyond making sure your filter is clean and not above a mirv 8. Now..... This is gonna be long even if it takes multiple posts so just go with it. So first off, simple but stupid. Don't put it on a 60A breaker even with the 40A fuse, which by the way it is a good idea to keep fuses out of the sun as well as the defrost board (if it's a heat pump.) Instead your tech should install the 40A but make sure it's a hacr breaker, those types allow for a second of overcurrent on startup. Second, definitely good to stick with factory size tubing so props for that. Just so you know though by using fittings you've increased the refrigerant capacity and thus your bill. Each 90° adds about 10ft to the lineset so bends are way best way but no need to rip out what youve done. Third, if it was decided that 8 gauge wire was the right size and you went bigger. I'm just gonna say that resistance is the only thing changing from what it should be, and if your voltage stays the same, what is your current going to do? Fourth and final, refrigerants are illegal to purchase, handle, or even store without EPA certification and could land you in jail or fined up to $$blah blah idk$$ but getting caught releasing any refrigerant to the atmosphere can get you a $10,000 fine. You can release small amounts mixed with nitrogen for some reason though. Vacuuming a system IS CRITICAL and must be done to 500 microns to ensure all moisture is out, since I don't know what refrigerant you're using I'll assume it's 410a which commonly uses oils that when mixed with water, creates acids that will eat the insulation on the compressors motor winding (why I said you'd have to buy another one)

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in conclusion, you're not my customer so I can tell you you're fucking retarded and you should try to do it all by yourself. Just for kicks, is it a fixed orifice or txv and do you know how to charge by subcool/superheat? That moisture will throw you for a loop troubleshooting too, likes to hide on the metering device in the form of a clump of ice.

>>1094696
I don't know what I was thinking about the equivalent length on those 90s, 7/8 would be exactly 2 ft per 90. Depending on your liquid line size and if it's 410 then its a simple formula to decide charge capacity.
Factory units are typically charged for 15ft of linset, so add up the equivalent length of your lines and use these [liquid line 3/8 oz/ft 0.60, 5/16 0.40, 1/4 0.27] with this formula;
(oz/ft×total length)-(factory charge for linset)= charge adjustment
Example- existing lineset is 45ft and a 5/16 liquid line and factory charge is 9oz. (0.40×45)-(9)=9
So you would have to add 9oz so total is 1lb 2oz.
Check the sticker on the condenser for factory charge and intended lineset length. Tell us the model number on your indoor and outdoor units.

>>1091979
>>1091995
r 12 and other cfc refrigerants have been banned since the 90's, r 22 is a hcfc refrigerant and it's schedule of bans kicked off a few years ago, first no new gas made, no new equipment sold charged with it, then a few years later no import of it, then a few years after that only reclaimed or nos gas can be sold, it's never banned entirely,,, you can still by r12 if you feel like paying out the ass for it, but your competing against everyone who has some kind of special snowflake piece of equipment that would cost a shitload to replace so they're limping it along by stockpiling whatever gas they can get... especially if for some reason or another they can't convert to a replacement....

>>1092534
appliance guy here... not sure if this is auto specific since I have no experience with that but...

>the longer the "open system" time, the more likely it is that you have to change the accumulator
you mean filter dryer I hope... since an accumulator is a tank to prevent liquid from getting back to the compressor and doesn't give a fuck how long it's open if you evacuate the system properly... and you should change the filter dryer any time you open up a system anyway...

>the lower the temperature, the lower vacuum you need to evaporate/eliminate all water vapors; or just extend the time
get a proper micron gauge and evacuate the system properly... if your still in the range where temperature is affecting your readings and your reading a good micron reading of below 500 then you probably have other issues because your in record setting cold temperatures... for siberia...

>after vacuum, watch the gauges for a while to check for leaks

if you have a big as shit leak then yes... if you have a pinhole leak then you will need to use afformentioned micron gauge as it's entirely possible to have a leak that isn't big enough to show on your regular gauges in a reasonable time frame... however a couple months down the line you'll be wondering where the charge went.

>charge the system based on gauges not refrigerant weight (take temperature into consideration also)

for home AC you'll need to take temperature readings off your condensor coil... you need to use the pressure/temp chart for your refrigerant and work out what your superheat is... subcooling as well if you have a heat pump? ... honestly I do fridges, we weight the charge in because we have a defrost cycle so balance isn't nearly as critical... most home AC stuff I'm remembering from a few classes a long as shit time ago.... but if you fuck this up you can break your condensor...

comment to long...

>>1094746

continued

>>1094451
don't use fucking elbows.. buy yourself a fucking tubing bender and do it right... the bender will cost you like 20$ total for both sizes.... you don't need more joints...

>>1092534
>check temperatures everywhere (condenser, evaporator, lines, vents) and also check for leaks (use CFC detector)

you can spring for a fancy cfc detector... but just use soap bubbles... it's what your gonna end up using to pinpoint the leaks in the end anyway...

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I don't know why this guy thinks the accumulator would need replacing, it's the liquid line filter drier that will need replacing. I would hope that the tech would see that with the shit fit this annoying customer is putting him through, he should put a suction line filter drier too, in case this guy did a piss poor job of brazing (without nitrogen) and deburring the tube. Plus he'd get to charge him to take it off in a few weeks. $$$
But that's why he's a diyer with no respect for people that decided to learn about it and charge for the knowledge.

OP here
first, there seems to be a misunderstanding about the 60A/40A breaker (although I think I was clear enough in the first post)

So, right now there is a 60A breaker in the panel and a 40A fuse outside (by the compressor) which works but it's not good
I installed a new 40A breaker in the panel and I drew the wire to the new place (like it should be)

second, I'll get rid of all the elbows and, sometime in spring (I have a gas furnace for heat) I'll call the guy to do the rest

thanks for all the advice!

>>1091941
$1500 for all of that? Stop being a Jew and pay the fucking man. A can of R-22 (which you CANT buy) is $700, a set of cheap gauges are $125, a vacuum pump is $400, micron gague is $100...bro, you're gonna fuck up, call back the same guy, who is now going to be pissed for wasting his time, and he's gonna say you need a whole new system for $4500.00 or more.

>>1095405
OP here
the guy said 1500 but he said I'd have to help him fish the pipes and cables through the ceiling
he said he wouldn't do that by himself for twice the money
well, he didn't say that but it was kind of implied
all I did was to buy the set of pipes and cable and did the dirty/low grade work myself
another thing was that for 1500 we should have done everything in one day
the way I did it, it took me more than a week working an hour or so a day (cutting holes in drywall, using fish tape, patching the holes, cutting a hole in the side of the house, patching it etc etc
all this because there's no rush (I'll need the system 5-6 months from now)
What's left can be done:
1:without my help
2:in one day
3:even when I'm not home