So I just remembered that my family has a three acre plot of

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>>1031407
additional questions:

how much land does one need to make a living off it?

pic related is the immediate surroundings

considering that there is farm land close to it, the odds for my land to be arable should be quite good, right?

I hear there are lots of boar in the area, but I don't have a hunting lincense yet. I understand national and local regulations apply, but is it generally possible at all to hunt boar on three acres? Like, if I were to go there, license and gun and all, set up a tent and then shoot a boar on my own property, would that be alright?

since my questions mostly relate to what one might call "homesteading" I but it on /diy/ rather than /out/. hope that's OK

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>>1031414
Report when you're done

>>1031414
I don't know how big an acre is but I bet it isn't enough.
I live here on the other side of the baltic and I believe the economics are the same. Basically you can't do shit without equipment and that again is too expensive...
I rent here a house while I build my own and our landlord is a farmer. He says that before the EU-money he has a loss of something between 100 and 200 euros per hectare. If i remember correctly he has a bit over 100 hectares of cultivable land. And he has all the equipment from before, tractors, harvesters, drying silos and the whole shebang. If your property is not field then you need serious equipment to make it growable!

So hard to make economically feasible I'd say. You need to grow something that pays well. And weed can be grown in a closet.

Keep it for fun, not for profit as it's hard.

other ideas include growing hops and wheat to do some kind of microbrewery

or maybe make my own whisky

what are some other cool stuff you can do with 3 acres of land?

>>1031440
it's 1,3 hectares so I guess weed is the only way it can be profitable but not gonna risk it because after all, there are neightbours just a few metres away

>>1031450
If it grows hay tell some local farmer that they are free to cut it. And bale it if they want, otherwise they might charge you. It will sprout trees quite fast, like in a couple years...

>>1031407
Well, its green so shit grows there.

An acre is ABOUT 210 feet x 210 feet.
I don't feel like doing conversion.

I'm on 15 acres myself, posted in another thread about fantasy builds (although I'm actually living it).

Regulations depend on local laws.

Out here hogs are a grey area.
They're a game animal but also a nuisance species.

Some areas have a $10 bounty per head.
Also, just because its your property, doesn't mean you can kill whatever you see- you still need permits and to hunt only when they're in season.

We have exceptions here on non game species- no bag limit and kill anytime of year.
Things like mice, rats, squirrels, coyotes, poisonous snakes, armadillos....

>>1031604
I don't know what you're zone is, but I'm an 8a.
If you don't know what that means, google it.
Your zone defines what you'll be able to grow.

I'm working on roses, oaks, avacados, passion fruit, various flowers.

3 acres is enough for a mud pit if you have a truck.
Or a small motocross track if you like dirt bikes.
I personally wouldn't do that on a beautiful piece of land like that.

3 acres is enough for a cabin and nice relaxing porch.
I doubt you have hummingbirds there, but they're my zen moment.

>>1031407
Not a northern hemisphere farmer and I don't know what your soil is like, but you could lease it for grazing for a couple of months to the neighbours and all the cow/sheep shit will improve the soil and get the pasture levels down.
Grazing on that amount is fairly much a 12-15 sheep or about 3-4 cows at most, plus you'd have to make sure they're supplemented, have some shelter in the trees, fences in good order, a reliable water source, drenching, vax etc. Its generally a lot of work for people with no ag experience.

Water source, rainfall, run-off, topsoil depth and sunlight really determine what you can grow. So you'd need to do an assessment of the property in that regard before charging in there with a plough

OP here

not gonna build my own cabin from scratch, but buying a kit from a wood shop is not that expensive. 3,3k dollars would give me a kit for a quite nice cabin of 15 m2.

How hard do yall recon this would be to assemble? walls and shit come pre-made, but I think the hardest part would be to
1) do the ground work
2) insulation because it doesnt always come standard
3) cut out the prep for a wood stove

looking at google street view, it seems that my plot of land is rather flat and on solid ground, so foundation work should be rather easy, I just need to buy some gravel to fill in the pit I dig out of the top soil

there are instructions on how to apply insulations on these prefab cabins, so that's basically just a money issue

what about the wood stove? do I want it opposite of the door, or close to it? in a corner or along the sides? what's there to think about here?

OP again

the cabins in question kinda look like in >>1031930

>>1031604

> wild hogs
> invasive species
> has a hunting season
> need tags

What socialist hippie shithole do you live in? Here in Texas we can hunt them all year. With helicopters and automatic weapons if we want.

>>1031407
>So I just remembered
Fucking retard.

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>>1032031
In Texas they're out of control.
>>1031967
Pic is the model of cabin I bought, where I actually live.
I'm in it right now.

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>>1032130

Where in sweden is it?

>>1031407
Dig a bunker system in it, concrete shell buildings, fortifications etc. Then charge people to play airsoft or paintball across it.

>>1031407
I'm sitting on a piece of land pretty much the same size and surrounding in Estonia (parents bought the land some time ago and are only using it for summer vacations). What I have done is plant half of it with oak trees for my very own sacred grove (where I grow some special fungi ;) and the rest I use for growing vegetables, berries, herbs and other stuff for eating and apple, cherry and plum trees for making wine. Thinking of getting into bee keeping for the added value of an army of natural pollinators for the plants and free honey for mead.

>>1033077
Idk where these hippy demographics come from. But ive done the math and my research. To have an effective farm for personal use. You need at least 10 acres. You will find out when one of your lifestock gets sick as to the reason why... Also what is crop rotation...

>>1031421

Where will he put the 38 Somali rapefugees?

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>>1033129

kek

>>1031421
If the kale and spinach needed to be replaced with something due to severe allergy, what would it be replaced with. (no spinach, kale, collards, other dark leafy greens)

>>1031440
One hectare is just under 2.5 acres

>>1031604
A family I know professionally grows roses. They hold an exemption to shoot any deer on their property. Deer evidently are considered a nuisance to roses.

>>1031421
>having the cow shed right next to the human shed
its like you dont want quiet and fresh air.
If youre going to build a cow shed, put it in the cow field.

>>1031677
>cow/sheep shit
>improving the soil
>not just letting the fucking plants on top of the soil rot to fertilize the soil
It's like you are really fucking brain-dead.

>>1031962
>y'all
>using local colloquialisms on the internet
Kill yourself, you sisterfucker.

>>1032130
You live in a high res Gmod level?

>>1033907
Dis foo ain't aight in the head. Fact, he mad.

>>1031414
>hunting wild boar
https://www.naturvardsverket.se/Var-natur/Jakt/Jakt-pa-klovvilt/Jakt-pa-vildsvin/
For actually shooting you have to take real care because you aren't allowed to shoot if you can't guarantee the bullet will ricoche. And you need a class 1 rifle and license plus hunting exam. And having a weapon license gives the police the right to do unannounced home inspections to see that you store the weapon correctly. There's no way you are ever going to get a license if you think you can store the weapon 9 months in your cabin while you don't live there. I'd consider getting a class 1 rifle license in your own EU country and get a passport for it.

>>1031962
Check out if there is municipality provided sewage and water. If there is you are obliged to connect to it and that is expensive. If not you are going to have to roll some kind of septic tank solution for gray and shit water.

>>1032994

This is a viable cash raking method, if there is sufficient local interest, or, if you know a lot of city folk who'd like to breathe some country air.

>>1033206
Holy shit this is brilliant. brb becoming a commercial rose grower.

>>1031421
This picture is such shit and not even close to something you can call to scale.

First off, not nearly enough veggies. No one ever accounts for poor yields, pests and animals, or disease.

Second, why waste space on pigs and cows? Stick to chickens for protein and goats for milk.

If you have grazing cows, you need an absolute minimum of 2 acres per head and this is assuming you have a good year. Realistically probably 4-5 acres.

A lactating cow will eat up to 2.7% of their body weight a day.

The average Holstein (your most common commercial milking cow) weighs about 1,500 lbs. (1500 x 0.027 = 40.5lbs/day) (40.5 x 365 = 14782.5lbs/yr or 7.39tons/yr)

One acre of hay provides about 3.4 tons of dry forage. So you would need 2 acres to feed a cow per year.

Pigs need about 9 pounds of food per day for adults.

This graphic shows 2 cows and three pigs which would need about 6 acres to feed unless you are buying food.

>>1034016
were you in 4H or something?

also, why aren't there any miniature livestock breeds specifically for this kind of set up?

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>>1031407
>hunt
>camp
>random screwaround space
>grow food and keep animals
>give it to me
>>1031414
see pic related, it's all one could need

>>1031407
Could set yourself up as a hobbyist grass cutter.

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>>1031962
i have heard positioning the front of a wood stove can change the distribution of heat drastically, so if you can't sleep when it's too cold for example, you should point it at your bed, and if you have it just for the atmosphere and the cold does not bother you, you should point it at the door or a window. also, if you don't have a connection to a local sewage system, you might look into biogasproduction based on your shit, as in pic related. i currently have set up a little instalation for a school project that turns food leftovers and peels and the like into gas, it's only 2 jerrycans, a buffertank and a gasmeter, but it makes a lot of fuel. here is a link where you can download a book about it:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B0cnpaVRbKKCODA5Ui1tTkQ3VGkxWEhWcklaYVpJM05hVUhn

>>1033907
>sisterfucker
we're talking about a svenskabro, his sister is currently occupied by a gang of somalis

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>>1034109
dumping some more handy infographics

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>>1034117

>build cabin in Sweden
>Government finds out and forces you to take refugees

Top kek good luck op.

>>1031407
>>1031414
swedfag here, if you get your huntingpapers dóne you can hunt on your land, just try to make sure it run outside of yout land and you will be fine, if you just wound the animal and it runs off, you are supposed to call it in, but yeah we all know how it is!
What you can grow mostly depends on how much North you are, and if you allready know there are lots of pigs you will not have much fun groing shit uo there,

>>1031421
There's such a thing as vertical farming, so potentially a lot of space can be saved.

>>1031414
Build a house. Afterwards:

Start a commercial fishery and vertical aquaponics farm.

>Grow veggies in towers to conserve space and money.
>use fishwater as fertilizer
>possibly just make it small scale to keep yourself/and possibly family alive

Start an energy farm to power your house and facilities.

>invest in ptv (photovoltaic + thermal) solar panels
>maybe some primitive wind turbines (like a windmill)

>>1032031
Lol, Kansas/Oklahoma line here. Got buddies traping the fuck out of them right now. Game wardens said thst by the time they turn us loose on the the mutherfuckers will have already taken over. Never even seen a wild hog in my 30 years and now we're getting 3 or 4 a week in traps. Cannot wait. Have legal access to dynamite. I'm gonna fuck shit up.

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>>1032130
Nice anon. What size. Been considering it myself

>>1033904
Yeah, cows are stupid and noisy as fuck and stink like shit. Fuck cows...

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>>1033907

>>1034013
Legit bro, bring on the fucking deerjerky!

>>1034091
As someone pushmowing a 2 acre lot 4 days a week i can promise u its a stupid hobby.

>>1031407
Kill many mudslimes in secret and bury them on your land.

>>1034153
explain

>>1031407
>what fun can I do with it beyond building a cabin?
Look for werewolves.

>>1034016
>why waste space on pigs and cows? Stick to chickens for protein and goats for milk

That!
Cows take too much resources and you wouldn't be able to use all the milk they would give you. And the genetics of cow is shitty unless you buy the sperm and your cow is already a good one, keeping the bull will make you waste even more resources. By having only one you will be in deep shit if she gets sick.
For the same amount of resources you can have 4-5 goats, their milk isn't as good but the meat is better.
A pig can be a decent add but only as many as you can feed with your waste (pigs can eat human shit too, just so you know), don't waste resources on them because you can do way better with more chickens and goats. Also consider that pig's shit isn't a good fertilizer.

>>1031604
OP don't listen to this. In Norway/Sweden hogs don't have a season due to their invasive nature. As long as you take normal hunting precautions and follow the weapons regulations as such, you can hunt all year and sell the meat that's usable.

If I were you, I'd apply to the municipality to build a curing house and dry/cure the meats for specialty salt ham. That could let you buy whatever you cant grow.

An acre is about 1000m^2, a person needs 400m^2 of potato land per year to cover their entire caloric need. Bad harvests, pests and poor yields due to nescience apply, but that's the brass tacks of it.

Rye and barley is more energy dense per weight but also more work intensive and less of an entry plant. Potatoes have 2-4 harvests a year and don't cost anything to reset (just chop the taters into halves or quarters and plop them back in after you've harvested.

>>1036301
>An acre is about 1000m^2
Acre is an imperial unit, around 4000m^2.
You're probably thinking are, which is 10x10m=100m^2.
Or maybe hectare, 100x100m=10000m^2.

>>1036303
Right, sorry, I'm thinking decar, it's more common here in Norway. a decar is 1/4 acre.

Chickens can take care of just about anything organic. They are nearly as omnivorous as goats and pigs. As long as you have a couple pouches of dietary supplements for them, you can feed them almost exclusively from your organic waste and still be able to harvest eggs relatively often. Chickenshit is good fertilizer, but stinks to all hell. Also don't need to keep them fenced in unless you have many. Sometimes they run away, but mostly they stay around the yard.

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>>1033907

>>1033129
That's what the pigs are for.

>>1034109
I kekked at the filename and that's some interesting information. 10/10 post

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>>1031407
> what fun can I do with it beyond building a cabin?

I’d suggest that whatever you do with it, first get a 10’ shipping container to use as a secure shed on the property, to store a picnic table, lawn mower, BBQ and whatever other stuff you don’t want to haul 3 hours back and forth every time you visit the property.

Don’t know what they go for in Sweden but here in metro Detroit, I’ve been told one can get a 20’ shipping container for $800, though I’d guess a 10’ one would cost more, as they’re not very common.

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>>1031407
>a three acre plot of land in the middle of nowhere in Sweden

Congrats, I'm jealous but is that 3 acres or 3 hectares (which would be 7.4 acres)?

Also, while not really /diy/, I'd suggest getting a pop-up camper before jumping into building a cabin.

If it turns out to be a fun camping spot, (and it looks like it is) you'll want to go all the time and a tent become a hassle.

A pop-up is easy to tow and easy to store at home and provides for much more comfortable outdoor living then a tent.

Also, what's the hunting situation around there?

>>1036428
>get a secure shipping container to store valuable/stealable stuff like picnic tables, lawnmowers

why the fuck would anyone recommend to a swede that they get a lockable metal box to store...
>here in metro Detroit

oh. Right. Nevermind.

That kind of shit don't get stole. Who the fuck would care to haul it to a loot van in the first place? The nignogs and balkan rape/rob-bands are in the cities where there's easy access to free gibs, bikes, cars and other easily converted high value items.

Picnic tables? Barbecues? Come on.

>>1036428
>Secure

Hahaaha

>>1036058
i think the idea is that the sturdy trees protect the more vulnerable plants from wind, while plants that don't like sun so much can stand in the shadow of the other plants. i read an article about a guy who had planted an edible forest, it was circular, like an onion.

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>>1036454
>sturdy trees protect the more vulnerable plants from wind, while plants that don't like sun

Those are pioneer plants, when you are regenerating an area there is a sequence of plants you need to saw them as to protect the sencondary and forth ones, that can't stand the sun. Pioneers grow faster, need lots of sun and live less, that's what defines them.
Anyway that simple and badly draw shit merely says a few types of plants it seems, post the rest you fag, context is important and whta you saved in not informative at all.

>circular

He is doing it wrong. The air does little to most plants and it will not come from every direction.
unless he lives n some shithole that has tornados, in which case it would do nothing to help.

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>>1036437
> That kind of shit don't get stole.

Ok then, it’s not my stuff.

> Picnic tables? Barbecues? Come on.

Do you plan on squatting in the dirt and eating twigs and bugs?

Why wouldn’t you want that stuff at a vacation property?

>>1036440
> Hahaaha

Yes, a shipping container would be far more secure then a tool shed.

>>1036661
You misunderstand. The items are good for a vacation propert. Heck, I wish I could it some near my regular home. Point is, that sort of thing doesn't get stolen unless you live smack dab in the middle of jolly subsaharaville.

>>1036651
oh sorry if i got it wrong, the guy whose article i read must have been using a different method

>>1036661
>More secure than

It's a myth. There's no such thing. The only factors to consider is time, tools and chance of getting caught.

It's only A deterrent not a preventative.

>>1036839
> steel shipping container vs. wooden shed
> It's a myth.

>>1036928
Tell me how you can get in one any easier than the other?

Wooden shed: chain saw
Steel container:petrol angle grinder.

Both are quick and noisy, both will work.

Fuck, the locks on shipping containers can be broken off or picked in little time by the right person

>>1034050
>also, why aren't there any miniature livestock breeds specifically for this kind of set up?

Because what would be the point? You can grow chickens instead of cows and they give you eggs as well.

>>1036750
>Point is, that sort of thing doesn't get stolen unless you live smack dab in the middle of jolly subsaharaville.

Yeah, and he said it was in Sweden.

>>1034013
Its a lot more than you think.
Growing known roses will never make rent- theres too many nursery's with contracts/known products.
I can buy a rose bush at Lowes/home depot/Walmart for $4.99- that plant is already at least a year old, if not 2-3. Think of how much the grower actually made after shipping/packaging/greenhouse/pesticides/etc.
Best chance is developing your own rose.
But a random rose, no matter how pretty, means nothing when its from a backyard grower unless you sell out to a know nursery.
To qualify for american rose society "all american rose" award, you have to have 250,000 plants available first year of sale for ARS nursery's.
Germany's "Kordes" award is even more difficult to attain. It has to go through 7 years of trials (vs ARS at 4 years).

Not saying don't do it.
I'm saying stop stealing my ideas.

>>1035444
I got the 12x32.
Wider requires special permits to transport in my area.
I don't plan on it being my home for the next 40 years, just until I get main house built.
I think their largest is 16x40, but I'm probably wrong.

My size was large enough to build a decent bathroom (still finishing it so don't want to post pics, but I can) and have a studio feeling home.
People in new York would probably be jealous.

Be sure to get the lofted style though, other one has about a 6 1/2 foot ceiling and feels claustrophobic, plus I have nice storage areas.

>>1037108
BTW, I wouldn't go any smaller than 12x32.
I also would get one without the porch if I did it again. I could have easily added on the porch and had an extra 12x4 inside.

>>1036944
>wake up
>feel hungry
>open the fridge
>someone ate all the cow eggs
things like this make life less worth living

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>>1036948

>>1034153
I too would like to know what the relevance of this is. It's not possible to efficiently farm multi-level, is it? The taller plants would inhibit light (and root growth) of the ones below.

>>1031421
I know people are shitting on this already, but when you grow crops dont you have to swap between different crops every few years to not destroy the soil?

If you were truly trying to have a long term homestead, wouldnt it be much better to have less variety and a more uniform like patches to easily move crops around?

>>1037542
The infographic is more about showing what kinds of plants thrive in what light/soil conditions. If you remove one height, the lever underneath it thrives etc.

So if you want to have fruiting trees and strawberries, you need to thin out the fruiting trees, or choke the strawbs.

It's true that a canopy would overshadow underlying plants, but you can work with a canopy, you don't have to work against it, thus the stories about onion/circular orchards and fields further up in the thread.

>>1037544
Depends how hard you run the soil. It's not strictly speaking necessary to let soil go without crops unless you run it very hard with nitrogen etc. But in principle yeah, consciously rotating crops is a good way of letting soil regenerate nutrients.

>>1037555
Couple things I've discovered doing my own gardening.
I'll use roses for an example.
Everyone says most of my varieties "love full sun!!".
Well, that's not true. When its the middle of summer and 105°f, it doesn't matter how wet you keep the soil, they still get scorched.
I planted a few variety's next to trees/shrubs for afternoon shade, and they did much better.
I then moved some varieties that did poorly in the summer to a location where they received afternoon shade, and they did much better also.

So using trees and their shadow area during different times of the year can increase yield from some plants. Something planted 1 foot south of a small tree may have shade at noon during the summer when it needs heat protection, but in the spring and fall when the sun follows a lower path across the horizon, that plant could have full sunlight at noon to speed growth when the temperature is milder.

* people in upsidedownland just replace south with north.

>>1034050
They do make miniature cows.
But they also make goats.
Think goat milk is a gross idea?
Ever had feta cheese? That's made from goat milk, not cows. Many cheeses can be made correctly form goat or cow milk (whereas some cheeses require a specific kind of milk).

>>1031407
trenches, spiderholes, VC-esque tunnel systems... Generally, things underground.

>>1031414
Depends on how many crickets you're willing to eat.

>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nWK3zNXePAs&ab_channel=CNN

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>>1038729
You know you've detoxed from american media when the very tone of voice on a regular news reporter is enough to have you break out in hives.

>THEY ARE FOR PUTTING
>IN THE MOUTH
>AND EATING

>>1032130
>the dream
>>1032131
>the reality

>>1033087
>ten acres for personal sustainable crops
lol

man you're dumb.

>>1031407
Get a doge and use it to kill yourself a moose.

>>1031407
Build cheap shitty housing on it and then collect millions of euros a year from the government to house asylum seekers.

Use that money to move to a better country, like Denmark, Finland, or Iceland.