This just came and went. why didn't it have staying power?

>>95270439
Cause it didn't have the furry appeal of Zootopia and the mass girl audience of Frozen

Despite being popular none of the 10s animated movies besides frozen seem to have any staying power tbqh

>>95270439
Too soon on the heels of frozen. Plus some serious mismanagement by the directors. Some of the original ideas for the movie were much more interesting than the end result.

>>95270504
Moana stands out though coming out after Zootopia and Frozen


>>95270467
I want to believe the reason isn't that superficial

>>95270539
That's been the case for just about every disney movie since Princess and the Frog.

https://youtu.be/O00-9oCPZ08
Moana should have known how to sail instead of being taught by Maui. Would have saved time sand made her seem more worthy of the ocean choosing her. She should have encountered actual sea monsters instead of just a big storm and coconut people. And warrior face should habe been included.

>>95270439
doesn't have a memorable villain that's integral to the plot (Frozen) or a deeper meaning that people can talk about after the movie (Zootopia)

>>95270539
>>95270564
what was the original movie going to be like?(both moana and princes and the frog)

>>95270439
A nonwhite princess.

Not even memeing.

You're posting it now so I guess it was memorable enough to still be discussed.

>>95270761
https://youtu.be/O00-9oCPZ08

>>95270790
explains why no one remembers Mulan and Aladdin, then

>>95270439
Polynesian are a hated people.

>>95270907
That was then and this is now. Princess and the Frog was the same. Also Mulan is a low noble at best.

>>95270439
I see what's happening here...

You're face to face with the greatness and it's strange

post it

>>95270439
Cause it was beaten by a Kaiju movie in Japan.The characters were annoying

>>95270963
Well at least by the japs, oh wait, the hate all of them but Hawaiians, they are ok, but moana had the same Disney trend of mess mash Tahitian, Hawaiian and Samoan cultures cause you know, they are all the same right!?

>>95270963
I take it you saw how Samoan families act in buffet restaurants too? I used be a night manager in one, and hooo boy.

>>95270439
Idk, it seems incredibly popular to me

>>95270439
The movie felt really fast, like I don't know if it was actually paced that quick or what, but while watching it only felt like maybe 45 minutes at most.

>>95271203
Thank you?

>>95270439

I've often heard that the popularity of these particular kinds of Disney movies (musicals) depends on the memorability of their songs. Sad to say but most of the songs in this movie are just not memorable enough. Sure you might hear a weird group of drama kids sing a verse or two but for the most part none of the lyrics and music just stood out. Plus the plot really did do nothing memorable either.

>muh Zootopia

Not really in the same vein as the typical Disney princess musical that this is trying to be so comparing them would be like comparing apples to oranges.

>>95270439
>the people who whine about no POC princesses never support the movies with POC princesses
>Disney fucked up a good story by making it drawn out and boring in the second act
>No handsome love interest, a Disney princess doesn't work without a handsome love interest and the normie viewers demand such
>They skimmed Polynesian mythology never really getting into it and making it whimsical and fun
>people were promised a cute pig and got a retarded chicken
>kids wanted that fucking pig and didn't get it

>>95270621
Moana knowing how to sail from the start of the movie would've just made her a mary sue with nothing to learn or grow from over the course of the story as well as give her less of a reason to be hanging out with Maui.

Most of those deleted scenes are just stuff from the beginning of the movie and there was nothing wrong with the way the movie started in the final version. We don't need to see Moana as a child for the entire first act because that takes too much time for the story to get going. Moana does not need to have six brothers because unless they were going to journey with her, they add nothing to the plot.

I want to know more about the rest of the movie. What's the deal with these coconut pirates that come and go in one scene? What's the deal with shiny crab that comes and goes in one scene? Why does Maui not know how to use his hook but learns again the very next scene? That's where the whole movie fell apart, not the beginning.

>>95270439
Bad name for the Film.

>>95274844
One of the deleted scenes mentions that the realm of monsters where shiny crab lives is actually hell. I don't know if they changed that because can't have hell in my kid's Disney movie or what but they should have kept that. Shiny crab is a monster Maui killed and somehow took the hook with him. That's enough info to give him a reason to be there while the final movie gives none. That's the kind of stuff the movie lacks in.

I still sing the songs sometimes when I shower. It make me feel cleaner and SHINY.

>>95270439
You're welcome is a God Tier Disney song

Prove me wrong
Pro-Tip: You can't

>>95270907
Now explain away Pocahontas, a film from that era that was a much closer analogue to Moana.

>>95275403
no one wants to remember Pocahontas

>>95275131
People said the same thing about Colors of the Wind

>>95275414
We'll be saying the same about Moana someday.

>>95275454
I doubt it

people will say the music was good but otherwise it's just an unmemorable movie

>>95270439

It was just Disney by the numbers. It was entertaining enough to watch, I wouldn't tell anyone not to, but it didn't have anything that hooked you and kept you thinking about it more than 5 minutes after you watched it.

>>95270439
Because it was overall bland and forgettable? The twist with the villain and Maui's buttugly face were the only things to leave lasting impressions, I hardly remember anything else about the film.

>>95270558
>I want to believe the reason isn't that superficial
People aren't as deep as you think, especially not children.

Kids like cute talking animals. Girls like pretty princess in shiny dresses. Disney's successes, past and present, are the product of pandering to the lowest common denominator; every time they try something new and original, it goes over the audiences' heads and is quickly forgotten.

>>95270439
Relied on inconsistent supernatural entities rather than the protagonist herself doing shit.
The ocean supposedly favors her, while also trying to drown her.

>>95275131

You're Welcome is a reminder that if Disney Animation was more interested in making fairy tale movies and less interested in trying (and failing) to subvert tropes this could have been a new generation's Aladdin

>>95270439

It made almost $650 million worldwide and is the third highest earning WDAS film behind Frozen and Zootopia.

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>>95276940
that means they dont have to try anymore.

Just not enough songs desu

>>95273312
>No handsome love interest
I like how Frozen was touted as "Oh yeah gurl power" yet there was still attractive men helping the female lead.

>>95270439
It was boring

Up to the coconut people it was a fun movie then it just went to shit and felt like the creators either lost focus or tried to pad the movie with forced drama.
Maui leaving Moana felt forced then him coming back with no scene where he reflects on that decision didn't help his character or the movie.

>>95270439
Because it was bad

>>95270439
Because staying power = the rest of the world.

We don't care about your diversity shit. We want to see pretty princesses sing and be pretty and do stuff.

>>95270907
Besides, to the rest of the world, Mulan is "white". Chinese are fucking pale as fuck.

>>95277772
Handsome Princes to go with the beautiful princess is what girls want. Don't make the mistake of falling for feminist strong independent womyn memes; the average girl eats that shit up.

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>>95270439
Because every single adventure that Maui sang about in his "You're Welcome" song would've been way more interesting than the actual movie.

Because it felt like Little Mermaid with all the good parts taken out, and outside of Shiny the songs were boring.

>oh this magical princess wants to explore the world and get out of her own bubble

zzzzzzzz

Because it lacked wide, universal, deep and thorough appeal.
The characters, the atmosphere, the mythology, the aesthetics, none of it was pleasing in the same way.

Everything else is just a rationalization, if it had done well people would say it did so well because Frozen opened the way for it instead.

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>>95270467
>Disney makes princess film where everyone is extremely white
>America: Yes! The old Disney magic is back! Let it go!
>Disney makes film about racism
>America: So powerful! So inspirational! #BLM!
>Disney makes princess film where everyone's brown
>America: Uh... Hey, that Shiny song with the David Bowie crab was pretty okay, I guess. Yeeeaaahh...
>America: So when are Frozen 2 and Zootopia 2 coming out?

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>>95270907

Mulan isn't a princess. It's a movie about a war, fighting, and violence with an East Asian female during the height of anime's popularity in the West as well as the height of "Girl power!" being accepted and celebrated instead of vilified as the obnoxious shit it has since become. Plus all that China money.
Half of that movie appealed entirely to boys as well. Cut out that first 20 minutes or so where Mulan has to dress like a pretty Geisha and there's almost nothing left to appeal to girls save for the female lead existing and doing badass things. Hell, the movie had one of the manliest Disney songs ever created, which is far more memorable for the general audience than the generic Disney princess song in the first act of the movie.
There's also the fact that it had Eddie Murphy's name attached to it, which at the time certainly helped to sell tickets.

When was the last time you saw the Princess line try and sell the warrior persona Mulan had through most of the movie? The answer is never. You see them marketing the pretty princess version that the character herself utterly despised at the start of the movie, and Mulan often takes a back seat

And Aladdin was memorable because of Genie.
Remove Robin Williams from the movie and it would have had a mediocre showing at the box office. Robin Williams name on anything back in the 90's, no matter how fantastic or how shitty it was, was a guaranteed box office success due to his wide appeal.
The combination of Disney and Robin Williams as the top billed actor meant that parents would take their kids to see it in droves. Anything involving Robin Williams back then with a PG rating was a guarantee that the kids would enjoy it and that the parents themselves might actually have a good time because Robin Williams.

Moana has no real staying power.

>>95278208
Nah dude
Staying power = articles about the true meaning of the movie/ why its important
The only thing the rest of the world adds to movies is revenue
The reason why frozen was so popular wasn't because it was popular in the rest of the world

Look at the transformer movies
There are a shot load because of foreign markets, but nobody actually cares about them in the US

>>95276841
The words you are saying make no sense when put together. You're Welcome is a song about a demigod bragging about taming the sun and the moon and all kinds of ridiculous mythical acts of strength. It has nothing to do with princess movies and there is no other song in the Disney canon like it.

>>95270439
In a parallel universe I imagine a much more culturally insensitive version of this film starring Mila Kunis and Jack Black.

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>>95279236
>with an East Asian female during the height of anime's popularity in the West

Jesus, i'm not even going to read the rest if you're gonna start out with bullshit this strong.

>>95279388

Not bullshit at all.
Do you not remember the mid to late 90's?
One in three American children were dirty little weebs that subsided on a steady diet of Pokemon, Dragon Ball Z, and whatever shit Toonami was limping into the barn with any given weak. Not to mention It was the dawn of the internet, where every time we went to Newgrounds we were bombarded with a million pop up ads and advertisements for this weird ass thing called "Hentai".
They ate up anything that came out of Japan as if it were crack.

By the time the 2000's hit, kids moved on to other things.

Literally no modern animated movie has had any "staying power" other than Frozen, and that was mainly due to "Let it Go" and it making retarded amounts of money in Japan

>>95273312
I have to say, I was a little surprised that you only see the pig at the beginning of the movie. But it was a pleasant surprise, since the Heihei stuff was funny and anons who thinks otherwise should seriously consider the possibility that maybe they've outgrown Disney.

>>95279485
>Do you not remember the mid to late 90's?
He probably wasn't alive then

>>95279538
>He wasn't there to wonder where the fuck his Pokemon and Dragonball Z were on 9/11

I feel bad for that poor dumb chump.

>>95279506
I honestly don't get the posts on here crying about a fucking pig not being in the majority of the movie. Who cares? They literally show you why it didn't want to go with her and that's because Moana almost got him killed

If the movie was about Moana being beckoned by the sea to face an unknown threat, she defies her elders to go face said threat, get trounced or deferred by evil threat, stumbles upon Maui who reluctantly joins her, and the rest of the movie is Maui training her to perform her own heroic feats ultimately being able to tag team the giant threat. I would have loved Moana.
Instead we got some half knockoff Little Mermaid/Frozen/Lilo and Stitch story. The movie fell apart of got boring.

>>95279485
By the time Mulan came, the pokecraze didn't even happen yet and the most attention anime got was from a sailor moon and the dragonball crowd, even then they were mostly restricted to toonami and cable broadcast and didn't have the sheer reach cartoons on basic television had until the 00s as basic television began phasing out cartoon blocks.

Any popularity attributed to Mulan had zero to do with any anime craze and everything to do with it being a Disney movie during the Disney Renaissance.

>>95279581
Aside from a few details, that's almost the plot of Hercules. Do you really want another Hercules?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KznZcK7ksf4

>>95279581
>If the movie was about Moana being beckoned by the sea to face an unknown threat, she defies her elders to go face said threat, get trounced or deferred by evil threat, stumbles upon Maui who reluctantly joins her, and the rest of the movie is Maui training her to perform her own heroic feats ultimately being able to tag team the giant threat.
So she just goes and tries to fight some monster with zero knowledge of what she's doing or where she's going? Just to defy her elders?

>>95279629
>So she just goes and tries to fight some monster with zero knowledge of what she's doing or where she's going? Just to defy her elders?
Literally what would have happened if fucking /co/ got to direct the movie instead of the two seasoned veterans that did

>>95279617
>Do you really want another Hercules?
You know the answer is yes

>>95279639
This is exactly why I don't take this board seriously. It's like they have some renowned hate for this movie and I don't know why. I personally thought it was great.
>Good music
>Gorgeous visuals
>Maui was cool
>No forced romance or shitty 'true villain' reveals
>Moana and Maui played off of eachother very well
It's pretty much the best you can do with this kind of movie

>>95279707
But instead you got another Little Mermaid (minus the love story), a movie which no sane person would deny is better than Hercules on just about every level.

>>95279629
>So she just goes and tries to fight some monster with zero knowledge of what she's doing or where she's going? Just to defy her elders?
Mr. Incredible goes off to an unknown island ends up fighting killer robots just to defy his wife and societies rules against Supers. He unknowingly walks into a plot to kill Supers and an evil plot.
How is that different than Moana being lead by the sea to go find a great evil, her elders telling her it's unsafe and to stay as a humble princess, and defying them in order to see what journey awaits?c

>>95279581
>the rest of the movie is Maui training her to perform her own heroic feats
This is the only part I like because this is where I felt the movie was going then they just suddenly started being assholes to one another.
Maui passing on some of his knowledge would have been a nice touch to the Moana/Maui relationship.

No Love story, No buy

t. All the little girls in the world

Seriously, little girls only care about the prince and the princess hooking up cuz they want to believe romance means something, but now, their moms are trying to push the GURL POWER agenda and Disney bent over to please them, why do you think nobody remembers Brave?

>>95279896
>then they just suddenly started being assholes to one another.
He literally manipulated her into going into a cave where he trapped her to presumably die just so he could steal her boat. Based, I know, but you can clearly see why she had trouble getting along with him. He kept tossing her off the boat as well

Because it didnt have a very memorable or interesting plot, world or characters.
it also looks like every other animated film under the sun.

>>95279837
Because Mr. Incredible is a nearly indestructible superhero with super strength who has probably dealt with similar situations multiple times in the past.

Moana is a normal island girl who has never been off her island and doesn't even know how to boat.

>>95278768
that made me think actually, isnt it usually the norm that you'd actually *see* the demigod do shit instead of being told he did it?

It's just some movie execs ordered to sell yet another Disney princessTM doll.

Same thing as Wreck it Ralph and Tangled. The movie's good but wasn't memed into popularity like Frozen or hinged off of nostalgia like Finding Dory. It's just its own thing and that's fine

>>95280331
More like Musker and Clements trying to pay their dues after Princess and the Frog disappointed at the box office and they failed to get their Alfred Hitchock satire greenlit; luckily for them, Moana performed well, so I won't be too surprised if the latter reemerges in some form: http://disney.wikia.com/wiki/Fraidy_Cat

>>95270621
While you aren't wrong Moana not knowing how to sail performs a number of fairly important narrative functions in the film.
It immediately demonstrates that her father is incredibly overprotective of her, to the point that he denies her the opportunity engage in some of the normal day to day affairs of the island. In turn this explains why she finds the island so stifling, the ocean so fascinating, and why she is so eager to leave.
It's also the main the main way we see her grow as a character, and in a way that imo parallels the theme of the story pretty nicely (Moana grows to become a skilled sailor in the process of returning her people to their position of skilled sailors).

>>95280015
How does Frozen fit into this theory?

Has fanciful dresses and classic Western princess fantasy:
Frozen
Princess and the Frog
Everything else in the princess product line

Does not:
Moana
Zootopia
Wreck-it Ralph
Brave

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>>95270439
The movie was too PC. You can't make girls not want to be THIN princesses in a castle, doing cute things. The only reason dollmakers make thicker dolls is the moaning of the moms, the little girls always want the perfect little twig with giant eyes.

>>95279591

>By the time Mulan came, the pokecraze didn't even happen yet

t. 5/13/2003

>>95270851
Removing the brothers from the film seriously hurt the film's potential for incest porn vs Frozen.

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>>95270439
Maui's Face

>>95280737
Man that picture makes me cringe

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>>95280803
Maui is pure greatness, fuck off

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>>95280683
Oh yeah, I forgot there was no male romantic interest in that movie

>>95280749
He's right though.

>Mulan - June 1998
>Pokemon US release - Sept 1998

Also the fact that Mulan began development in 1994

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But I thought good movies not getting bit by the autistic virus of mass appeal was a good thing?

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>>95280795
The lack of porn for this movie actually astounds me considering some of the vore situations Moana is in, as well as the Ocean can literally form tentacles

>>95280844
The romantic interest that goes nowhere and doesn't appear on any of the merchandise?
Yes I'm sure he's the secret to the shows success with little girls.

>>95280312
Disney movies don't really understand "Show, don't tell."

>>95280925
>>95280312

I think the crew was tired after that fuss with Zootopia so they winged it.

Really generic lead character, even for Disney.
No TALKING funny sidekick animal.
Also, the story felt really finished.

>>95270907
Mulan becase yellow fever.
Aladdin because its a classic faible with male hero/action and has some harem thing going.

>>95279236

>There's also the fact that it had Eddie Murphy's name attached to it, which at the time certainly helped to sell tickets.
Germany too. Had some rather old but still beloved wacky comedian voice acting the dragon.

>And Aladdin was memorable because of Genie.
I guess its a classic tale too. With a male hero.

>>95280882
You think other people not liking something is somehow a plus?

>>95270439
Because everyone just wanted to fuck the crab.

>>95282682
I hated the musical sections but Liberace crab was hilarious.

>>95279192
Shiney was the only song I really remember and could sing. Nothing else.

>>95279236
she didnt despise the fact that she was to be a wife you fucking idiot, she was troubled over how bad she was at being an ideal Chinese wife in China, it was bringing dishonor to her family and that in turn made her feel bad. in fact the only fucking reason she went to join the war was because her father was getting old and injured from previous shit if I recall and she knew if he went he wouldnt fucking come back. If he had been perfectly able still she wouldve been fine with it, worried and hoping he'll be safe of course but she wouldnt have ran off to take his place if wasnt in the state had been in the movie.

I thought it was a really beautiful movie. Very memorable to me.

It was pretty good, desu.

>>95276462
Not exactly true.
But yeah, whenever they try something very different from the usual stuff, they bomb, stuff like Treasure Planet and Atlantis: The Lost Empire prove this, they were huge box office bombs even if they were really great films.
At least they became cult classics later on, though.

>>95276462

What t was "new and innovative" about Moana? Cuz I don't remember. Zootopia tried something new but then they backed off because kids wouldn't handle it. At least it was a step in the right direction.

>>95283191
What did Zootopia back off of because kids couldn't handle it?

>>95278208
Pretty young blonde girls are basically the whole world's ideal peak beauty standard.

Asians love them, latin americans love them, indians love them, blacks love them, eastern europeans love them, muslims love them a lot.
Pretty much the only people who don't like cute blonde girls are americans and western europeans.

It's practically a biologically universal beauty standard thing with some people having developed different tastes here and there.

>>95270439
It was about brown people.

>>95281962
>Really generic lead character. even for Disney
How? When I think generic Rapunzel or Anna immediately comes to mind. Moana had enough charisma, and quirkiness, and fucked up so much she actually felt like a character
>No talking funny sidekick animal
This is a good thing

>>95270907
>Mulan
Went to a school filled with primarily asians, whites, every time someone mentioned the words business "LETS GET DOWN TO BUSINESS"

I fucking hate that movie still.

>>95270851
Neat thanks

>>95283819
Also to add on, none of the songs are really memorable

How Far I'll Go reminds me of Let It Go (James Bay)

>>95283515
>americans and western europeans

god, u're one of THOSE people - tumblr isn't an accurate representation of modern western society, stop shitting on the world with ur picketing for the dark enlightenment and go do something useful with ur goddamn life

goddamn insufferable /pol/ rabble

anyway, the west still loves blondes - still does, always will

cara delevigne and taylor swift and lady gaga are huge names right now, and they're all blondes - i can't imagine those 3 being famous as brunettes, especially not swift

as to why that is - i can think of lots of reasons

blond hair is just kinda soft and magical looking. it's ethereal, flaxen - seemingly delicate and pillowy and essentially feminine

red hair is oddly coarse-looking - i associate it with the lower class. brown hair is basic and normal, like american english. black asian hair is too severe and cold, and black non-asian hair is cutesy and ridiculous and at times, negligible - just an extension of the skin

golden locks of lightly curled blonde hair just seems otherworldly. it seems divine

i remember reading that the most desirable beauty in medieval europe was flaxen blonde hair and grey eyes like a morose morning sky

and it seems to work best on western europeans, whose features fit it the best, though it kinda works on some black people and asians - especially the white-looking ones, like beyonce

me, though? i prefer brunettes. blondes don't quite do it for me

>>95280683
>how does frozen fit into this theory
Oh yeah I forgot Kristoff didn't exist. Fucking idiot

Should have just made everyone furries in that movie. Tbh I can understand why so many people use anthros as a crutch. You get to play with the idea of race and culture more without seeming racist, and any furfag no matter the race will go nuts over it.

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>>95283896
Blonde hair and light eyes are the GOAT combination and anybody who says otherwise has shit taste and or was bullied or turned down by a blonde in HS or something. Pic related. First result that comes up for "cute blonde hair." I forgot this is 4chan though and I know their definition of beauty is
>muh pale skin
>muh glasses
>muh black hair
>muh short hime cut

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>>95284047

>>95284047
>if anyone disagrees they are literally being irrational due to some past experience
Just..no. I've always avoided blonde women because they all conjure up the idea of methhead trailer trash to me. They just aren't my type. You can counter with just "yeah well all shitskins are blahblahblah" and that would prove my point. Blonde white women are too "alien" for me to appreciate.

>>95270439
Not enough musical numbers. There is only about 5 total. Could have used 2 more.

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>>95270439
Main character was too generic. Maui is a much more interesting character.

I work at disney world and see girls dressed as moana every single day

>>95284166
Thats an outfit that does not work in the winter months.

>>95283209
Probably referring to the original story about predators in shock collars.

>>95284195
Okay?

>>95283209
Nothing serious, really. I can't find full thing anymore, you will have watch it in parts:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1eQgypYsA5U

(recommending the polar bears scene, surprising and powerful emotionaly)

The fuck is this 'lead character was too generic' meme. It was actually refreshing seeing a female in these movies get shit on so often. And when she does fuck up there's actual consequences

>>95284245
Its also worth noting that she was being trained to be a good leader by her dad, so her taking initiative is part of her character.