Secret Empire Captain America(s)

I don't think we know yet.

>>95243235
Sand Superman 2.0

>>95243235
It reeks of editorial interference and last minute changes.

I think what happened is that when Korbik saved Steve and turned him Hydra by altering history, she took the "correct" history in herself/cosmic cube because she cannot/doesn't know how to destroy history. In bringing good Steve back she reestablished the good Steve history in a separate entity. I think. I feel like its been explained a few different times and it never makes any sense.

>>95243235
It doesn't matter. None of that shit show matters.

This should have ended with Superboy Prime retconning it all out.

>>95243339
>>95243419
In Steve Rogers there was this whole thing with some ancient Hydra shrine they took Steve to, and I don't think it ever got brought up again. It seemed like the explanation was going to be that after WWII Stevil was being put in "stasis" in this Hydra shrine and the implication was that all of Cap's post-war history up until the modern day would happen normally somehow and then Stevil would replace that Cap at some point.

I thought the weird scenes with Steve in the woods in SE were going to relate to that somehow and that was going to be the way things got undone, but as far as I know none of the stuff with the Hydra shrine and Steve being in magical stasis has just been dropped. Maybe I just missed it or something.

>>95243628
>In Steve Rogers there was this whole thing with some ancient Hydra shrine they took Steve to
I don't think even Spencer remembers that.

>>95243628

The shrine, far as I understand, was just a means of explaining why Stevil did all the Hydra opposition stuff up until the moment the Red Skull "awakened" him with the cosmic cube. That way they could prevent any logical paradox stuff from messing with Stevil's mind.

>>95243235
What happened was who cares it doesn't matter. Nothing in cape comics is permanent and everything reverts back to status quo.

File: Bakers-wagon-P-Farm-w_000.jpg (43KB, 500x400px) Image search: [Google]

43KB, 500x400px

>>95243235
Remember when they said this event wouldn't be resolved with a cosmic cube?
Pepperidge Farm remembers.

>>95243628
Wasn't there an issue, I think FCBD, where evil Steve jumped into a viewing pool into a mother dimension or something? I hope they try to clear some of this shit up in Omega.

>>95243235

Given what we've read, here's what seems like the most likely events:

Kobik changed the real Steve into Captain Hydra there, but kept a mental copy within herself of the man he had previously been. When the cube was restored, she then had the ability to give that copy a new physical form, aside from the transformed original (and also in the prime of his life, unlike the elderly Steve who he had previously been). During his time spent in her mind, this copy of the original Steve saw all that had transpired from an outsider's view (presumably the same view as we the readers had, given that the scenes he saw were literally images from panels of previous issues), and upon being given this new body, he went to town on his original body, beating the crap out of it.

>>95243235
>Captain America : the Crossing

>>95243924
This. I never understood the whole "stories that matter" meme. No stories matter some are just better written and drawn than others.

>>95243924
>>95244291
That's not what this thread is about, though. We're not talking about whether it "matters", we're just trying to figure out what the logistics of the ending are.

>>95243235
>So did Kobik create a new copy of Steve from Steve's memories or her memories?
Her memories of Steve, but she's a cosmic cube so that makes it pretty much a perfect replica of Steve Rogers, probably without some of the fascist personality traits that he started developing with AvX onwards. Remember, the Captain America that she turned into Captain Hydra wasn't the original Captain America either. It's the Captain America that Reed Richards created using the power of The Beyonders (the same power that Kobik uses for her reality warping).

>>95243628
Captain Hydra jumping into the pool was just a means to give him a reasoning for thinking that he's the real Steve and the world he's in was the fake.

>>95244968
Which characters "survived" Secret Wars, anyway?

>>95245039
Spider-man
Reed
Miles
Few ultimate universe characters
Black panther
Sue storm.

>>95245039
The ones that definitely survived are:
>The Maker
>Miles Morales
>Peter Parker
>Dr. Doom
>Reed Richards
>Black Panther
>Molecule Man
>some OC from Coates' Black Panther run that used super-panther-magic to somehow survive the incursion
>Loki
>Silver Surfer
>Dawn Greenwood

Also, Thanos was killed, but his soul exited the omniverse and re-entered after Reed recreated it, so the current Thanos isn't a Reed-creation, but the one that Doom killed on Battleworld that's back to life. The Reed-created Thanos had his happy ending and retired to Death's Domain during Starlin's Infinity Finale.

Characters that may or may not have survived (they made it to Battleworld, but it's not quite clear if they died during the final battle or not. Most of the Life-Raft survivors died on Battleworld, like Cyclops, Namor and Maximus):
>Carol Danvers
>Jane Foster
>Groot
>Star-Lord
>Black Swan (Groot, Star-Lord and Black Swan all might have killed each other, like I said, kinda ambiguous on the result of that fight)

Until otherwise stated, assume that those last 5 died considering the only person that explicitly survived the final battle was Black Panther, and he used a reality gem to escape Reed's creation wave and jump straight into the new universe.

>>95243235
It's going to be like how our Tony is actually Teen Tony aged up.

We just pretend it never happened and move on with our lives.

This is the real Steve with all his real memories.

>>95245247
>our Tony is actually Teen Tony aged up
Our Tony is a creation of Reed Richards using the powers of the Beyonders. Likewise, this new Steve is a creation of Kobik using the powers of the Beyonders.

At a certain point, the power of the Beyonders is basically the power of narrative convenience.

>>95245402
Not just Reed, Reed with the Future Foundation he created using the powers of the Beyonders.

The Beyonders are way too powerful for a race that got beaten by Doctor Doom's ability to actually travel time.

>>95245717
I mean, Doom created a bomb made out of thousands of Molecule Men. Each Molecule Man was a bomb capable of destroying a universe. That's no joke.

Now, Doom being able to create a machine that stole the Beyonder's powers in the first Secret Wars was some bullshit, but if he was able to do it on the spot in the original Secret Wars with one of them then it doesn't seem that crazy that he'd be able to do it with a bunch of them after decades of preparing.

>>95243235
Isn't this picture the exact thing that Morrison was lampooning in the final issue of his Animal Man run? Gotta have that ideological opposite to punch.

>>95245795
>I mean, Doom created a bomb made out of thousands of Molecule Men. Each Molecule Man was a bomb capable of destroying a universe. That's no joke.

I'll always find It kinda funny how dooms master plan to save everyone boiled down to getting a bunch of dudes into a box and blowing it up