>Oh no, I just remembered I was never born to begin with but

>>94657287
Same reason Marty McFly didn't instantly disappear the second he screwed up his parents' first meeting.

>>94657413
It's not just that she shouldn't have had a delay before she disappeared, it's that it wouldn't make sense either for her to disappear or for her to not disappear because either way would be a paradox. If she was never born, then she was never around to make herself not be born in the first place, and if she was born, then she wouldn't be able to make herself not born by helping get Aku killed.

You know, there's a reason time travel is relegated to fiction.

>>94657287
Shows that aren't about time travel should avoid using it.

fairy tales don't have to make sense

>>94657977
If they want the audience to accept a last minute tragedy, then the circumstances surrounding said tragedy should make sense.

>>94657287
Oh look, it's babby's first time travel story

>>94657413
At least marty fixed the thing that made him be born.
Ashi didn't.

I think you could say that the reason she disappeared was not because of a time paradox but because she was part of aku so she was sustained by him.

>>94657287
I agree, didn't make sense. I would have done something on the side of "her aku-side is gone" and kept her alive.

>>94658015
Samurai Jack was never a time travel story until the finale.
Hence why it was so out of place.
side note: It pisses me off that Genndy said he was putting a bigger focus on mature storytelling and then had such a childish and half assed ending that apparently is okay just because the last shot was pretty.

>>94658009
Time travel inherently doesn't make sense no matter what your autism thinks

>>94658069
>>94658073
That would have made less sense.
Aku himself was literally a piece of a giant extraterrestrial hunk of shit that was cut off before the main body was completely annihilated

File: 1397715589698.jpg (139KB, 1012x578px) Image search: [Google]

139KB, 1012x578px

Her spirit was reincarnated on Galaluna, obviously.

>>94658094
>Samurai Jack was never a time travel story until the finale.
t. dumb millennial who only watched season 5

Okay OP, stop making these fucking threads

>>94657413

Marty throwing a wrench into the works didn't negate the possibility of his parents hooking up. It changes the circumstances but it's not a paradox

>>94658124
In reality it doesn't, but most time travel stories set rules within themselves to follow for future episodes, so that events make sense within the context of the medium.
For example, Bill and teds excellent adventure(great film) establishes the first rule of time travel is that the present day clock is still running in real time while you are going back in time. that rule logically is stupid, but it is established early on and is followed to the letter, so that the movie plays by it's own rules.
>>94658172
Name ONE(1) time in the original series that ANYONE goes backwards in time or arrives from the future.
Alternatively, name any time outside of the pilot that anyone is sent forward in time.

>>94658094
Time ripples

>>94658251
>if you ignore the whole premise of the show it and the protagonists goal in almost every episode, the show has NOTHING to do with time travel

>>94658375
Time travel was literally only used as an excuse to put a ronin in a post apocalyptic scenario and give him an arbitrary goal that would lead him around the world and introduce him to various different characters/opponents.
It was a framing device, and until the finale it was nothing more.

>>94658458
>I'm gonna call it a post apocalyptic setting and not the future so my point is less obviously retarded. I will also ignore how Jack being from the past had impact on every episode, to the point of him even meeting someone who used to know him.

>>94658544
>I'm gonna use greentext to strawman someone I disagree with
Besides, nothing you said has refuted the fact that the point of the show is Jack meeting interesting characters in a frankly alien world.
just because a couple episodes have a throwback to people he once knew, doesn't suddenly change the style of the show into time-travel-focused.
Him being from the past has the exact same effect on his knowledge of the world as being from a different planet.

>>94658697
>t. I have no clue what strawman is, but people say it a lot here so it will help me win this "argument"!

>>94658697
>I will continue to not understand how Jack getting back to his time period was always the point of the show

>>94658731
Strawman is warping someones words/intentions to seem extreme or unreasonable, and then responding that distorted view.
>>94658751
You ever watch a movie called idiocracy?

File: IMG_7044.jpg (488KB, 1136x640px) Image search: [Google]

488KB, 1136x640px

>>94657287
DUDE WITHOUT AKU I NEVER EXISTED LMAO

>>94658697
> I refuse to admit that this was a time travel story and will wrongly use things I read on /pol/ to try to get people to agree with me
Dude it's the whole point to the show it's even In the theme song in the first 4 fucking seasons.

>>94658792
>warping someones words/intentions to seem extreme or unreasonable
But they're already that:
>"It was a framing device, and until the finale it was nothing more."

>10 episodes
>I know I've limited time to flesh out this love story but fuck it we're going all in.

Waifus literally destroyed SJ. WHY COULDN'T YOU KEEP YOUR DICK IN UR PANTS GENNDY!

>>94657878
Says you. Time travel is possible, but it isn't possible to change the past without literally destroying your universe and entering a new one.

>>94658094
>Samurai Jack was never a time travel story until the finale.
FUCKING WHAT

Seriously. FUCKING WHAT??

>>94658792
>You ever watch a movie called idiocracy?
No. Is it about you?

Sometimes history is changed in "waves". Or to put it another way, it takes a while for a changed timeline to "catch up".

On the other hand, maybe the wedding was literally a day later and she was barely there at all.

>>94659067
See:
>>94657445

>>94659067

Reminds me of that shitty A Sound of Thunder movie.

File: sj timeline.png (21KB, 800x600px) Image search: [Google]

21KB, 800x600px

>>94657445
>>94659091
That's not necessarily true, sometimes in fiction characters that wouldn't exist in the future can go back to change things in the past, it's not that uncommon.

The problem here it's that Ashit lived too long for the sake of forced drama.

>>94657287
Please stop making these threats. Its fucking over. Deal with it.

>>94659201

I wonder if SJ follows the "alternate timeline" rules, like in DBZ.

Lets hope not.

>>94659220
Call the police anon!

>>94658837
>>94658882
>>94659004
I've said it before and I'll say it again, if the show was about time travel they would have used it in some fashion outside of framing the context of the setting.
The point of the show is to have a stylized action show about a dude cutting people up with a samurai sword, however you cant have a kids show with that kind of gore and violence, so you need him to fight robots/wildly alien monsters. And what better way to pit a samurai against robots than placing him in a future setting. It also just so happens that that framing device also gives him a goal that he may or may not accomplish that will keep him from just settling down in one place.
>>94659044
Very clever.
It's a movie about an average intelligence man who is frozen and wakes up in a world where everyone is completely idiotic. He is told that there is a time machine by one of the inhabitants, and then goes searching for it. in the journey searching for it he is quickly discovered to be the smartest human currently living, and is recruited into a political position in an attempt to fix the world, his suggestions(using water on plants instead of their gatorade substitute) begin having a positive impact on the world and by the end chooses to stay and continue making the world a better place.
Tl;dr its literally samurai Jack with an ending that makes sense

File: i dont trust like that.png (46KB, 285x150px) Image search: [Google]

46KB, 285x150px

>>94657287
>ashi never existed
>ashi was the only way for Jack to go back in time

>>94659226
It does not, otherwise Ashi would have sustained her existence

Technically all stories are time travel stories because the characters move chronologically forward in time.

If Samurai Jack wanted a deep ending maybe don't do a poor rip off of a superior anime from ten years prior

Going back to the past wasn't the problem; completely forgetting to DEVELOP said past after a season of "The past is gone let it go" and then ignoring the future where the overwhelming 90% of the story takes place is the problem.

File: 1478582273893.gif (528KB, 480x270px) Image search: [Google]

528KB, 480x270px

>>94659266
>if the show was about time travel they would have used it in some fashion outside of framing the context of the setting.
>"I decide how everyone should make time travel stories"
>"I decide how much time travel a show needs to have to be about time travel"

>>94659302

Hm. So what does that mean for all the people Jack met? Never born? Or born in an Aku-less world?

>>94659394
It means Morrigan never existed

>>94659394
never born

File: dbsfuturetrunksreturn.jpg (73KB, 800x600px) Image search: [Google]

73KB, 800x600px

>>94657287
Should have just used DBZ time rules.
Go back in time and kill Aku in the past, Jack ages, duels guardian,a nd uses that portal to go back to the future to finish Aku. Or something.

>>94659408

Wrong franchise, dude.

>>94659411

So he kinda fucked them over either way, huh?

>>94659445
pretty much, as we aren't given any hint as to the contrary

>>94659201
So you're saying Jack didn't go back to the past but instead created a parallel universe of the past? I think that would resolve the logical problem as long as Ashi didn't disappear, but it would introduce the new problem of making their actions pointless since Aku would still be alive then in the original universe.

>>94659567

Thats DBZ rules. But if that were true, then its possible Ashi wouldn't have disappeared.

File: yeah sure.png (28KB, 499x322px) Image search: [Google]

28KB, 499x322px

>jack goes back in time, killing aku, undoing the future
>jack still gets sent into the future, moments before he comes back to kill aku

Where did that jack go
is he just going to be spit out in an aku-less future, confused as fuck?
You cant say he's going to be the same as the first time because now aku wont exist in the future, because ashi disappeared
you can't say it created a branching timeline, because again, Ashi disappeared, and that would leave the can of worms of "theres a timeline where jack disapperared while fighting aku with all his friends, leaving no sword and no way to kill aku"

>>94659384
It's not a specific time travel guideline, its a standard for any plot device to be used.
For example, in the show about a samurai fighting robots, logically a shitty katana shouldn't be able to hurt a solid steel entity; so the show establishes that it is a magic sword, which allows the creator to add more rules to it as the show moves forward(like how they later establish it can't harm an innocent in the hands of evil, or that it was forged by gods).
If we weren't told as an audience that it wasn't just an average sword, then we wouldn't be able to suspend our disbelief when it didn't shatter on contact with robots.

It is up to a work of fiction to establish it's own rules and follow them, otherwise any and all believability/immersion is lost.

File: 1501023375412.png (419KB, 752x451px) Image search: [Google]

419KB, 752x451px

>>94658803
WTF I GOT AKU POWER NOW LOL

>>94658985
>Time travel is possible
forward is possible

The final season is ultimately just padding.
Punished Jack serves absolutely no purpose.
Cut Ashi, use the original guardian portal, make it a 90 minute movie.

>>94659201
>jack still not getting a happy ending
there are no massage parlors there?

>>94660065

Their happy ending is getting a free eggroll.

>>94660045
>forward is possible
Not even.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Unreality_of_Time

>>94660087
Cryogenic suspension and wormholes are real.

>>94657287
I'M PICKLE JACK XD

JUST TURN OFF YOUR BRAIN BRO! SO DEEP!

>>94660098
You're not actually travelling through time in either case. Time doesn't exist and everything is just one giant eternal four dimensional shape. We only think we're moving forward through the shape because the similarity in content between adjacent segments creates an illusion of cause and effect.

>>94660173
>Time doesn't exist
Yes it does. The passage of time slows down as you go faster, and that's been proven.
>>94660173
>four dimensional shape
There are more than four dimensions.

Fuck off, you don't know shit about physics

>>94660245
>The passage of time slows down as you go faster
What that actually means is the slope of the temporal dimension is less steep around objects with more spatial distance per temporal distance. It's all still just a shape, the "passage" part is the illusion.
>There are more than four dimensions.
That's not relevant to anything. The extra dimensions beyond the three spatial dimensions and the one temporal dimension are only a mathematical contrivance for making a unified theory of fundamental forces work.

>>94660086
>jack didn't even get that

>>94659436
DBZ had good time travel. Shame they fucked it up with Super.

File: 1495758924302.png (3MB, 1280x1811px) Image search: [Google]

3MB, 1280x1811px

Oh look, it's this thread again. Not like we had one thirty minutes ago or anything.

Here we go again:
Time travel in Samurai jack seems to function on a single, dynamic timeline, where travelers can move forward and backward freely.
However, it seems that travelers have a fixed position in time in which they are intended to exist, and thus are tied to that point no matter when they travel to.
When Jack was flung forward, the timeline continued with Aku's reign and Jack's absence, and we got the future seen in the majority of the series. But Jack himself was displaced in time, meaning he stopped aging as soon as he left the point in time he belonged in.
So basically, for the entirety of the series, up until Jack got back to the past, he wasn't aging because his own time was still rooted in the past.
Ashi, on the other hand, was born in the Aku future, and so her existence was tied to it. When her and Jack went back and destroyed Aku, the timeline was altered from that point on, meaning no Aku and Jack starts aging again.
Altering the timeline wouldn't necessarily erase everyone from the future, and I think there's a good chance many of them went on to be born regardless. Ashi though was tied to Aku's existence, which is why she disappeared when the paradox caught up to her "Back to the Future"-style.

I don't know why I bothered to type all this out, but whatever. People are still going to complain.

>>94657287
I thought it was a blatant rip off to the ending of Gurren Lagann, except that Jack didnt end up as a hobo.

>>94663228
Or so we think...

>>94663136
>Jack stopped aging because he was in the wrong time
That's just conjecture, the only explanation or hint we get in the show is that "the initial time travel affected the aging process".

>>94659687
The jack that was sent into the future was the same jack that came back. There wouldn't be 2 jacks. Theres only 1 timeline.

I assumed he would come back before aku sent him into the portal then there would be 2 jacks and future jack dissapears while past jack looks confused as fuck

File: op.png (2MB, 1920x1072px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 1920x1072px

>>94658803
>REMEMBER MY LAST WORDS, AUTOBOTS
>THE MATRIX IS A BOMB THAT CAN BE USED TO DESTROY THE MONSTER PLANET UNICRON

>>94663228
It actually makes sense in TTGL. They knew it would happen, decided to have a wedding anyway before it did, and when it actually does happen Simon's already braced himself.

Here either Ashi knew but never told him for some idiotic reason, or neither of them considered this a possibility. It's just "oops I can't exist anymore bye."

>>94665206
Even if Ashi knew, it's needlessly cruel to the audience and Jack to have her say "I'm alright, I felt him leave me" and then have her vanish a few years later in the fucking epilogue poochie-style.

Fucking garbage ending, I don't think I can ever enjoy the show again

>>94665206
Yeah, that's kind of the thing. No matter how you rationalize the science behind what happened, the issue is less about the nature of Ashi's existence and more about the absolutely cheap way it played out.

>>94657287
Gurren Lagann did it better

>>94665206
>>94665305
Has Genndy addressed the fact that the ending is so similar to Gurren Lagann's? I'd like to know if he was intentionally homaging it and just failing to understand why it worked.

File: visualization and influence.png (55KB, 761x393px) Image search: [Google]

55KB, 761x393px

>>94665319

>>94657287
>2017
>bitching about time travel paradoxes concerning the existance of one character
Wow it sucks to be you, not able to enjoy dozeons of works of fiction because your suspension of disbelief is just so high.

File: b65.jpg (94KB, 1189x890px) Image search: [Google]

94KB, 1189x890px

>>94659687
>Where did that jack go

>>94658094
>It pisses me off that Genndy said he was putting a bigger focus on mature storytelling and then had such a childish and half assed ending that apparently is okay just because the last shot was pretty.
How's it childish? I think the theme of never knowing whether you did the right thing or not but being powerless to undo it is pretty mature.

>>94660464
>spatial distance per temporal distance
you mean velocity?

>>94665483
Mainly because it abandons the mature concept of being the change you want to see in the world, and goes for an unrealistic lesson of "the only way to improve the future is to just undo the bad things that have happened lol".

as well as the fact that I find it incredibly lazy and immature to bait&switch the audience into thinking the outcome they are worried about won't happen, and then immediately do it when their guard is down.

>>94658227
>>94658057
>>94657445
>>94657413
Time travel in back to the future doesn't make sense and isn't even consistent with its own rules but that doesn't make it not fucking great