Sam Wilson as "Captain America"

They wanted a MCU-famous character to get it and already used Bucky. Don't overthink it.

Remender left after only doing one arc with him and Spencer took things in a different direction.

It made the headlines in a couple of online publications
"Captain America is black now"
Must have been worth a few thousand sales at least.

>>94651335
>What was the point of Sam Wilson as Captain America?
None really, it was probably one of those long ass Remender plots that would've wrapped up in 20-30 issues. He left and then there was Spencer

Black or female or younger (or two or all three) of existing superheroes in the name of diversity. And now we have too many of them

>>94651335
Brownie Points.

He took up the mantle of his best friend and focused on helping the disenfranchised. He was a more personal Cap than Steve he spends most of his time globetrotting.

>>94651335
better question why can't Sam see thru the eyes of birds in MCU?

>>94651393
So, what making characters black, is this new acceptable black face?

>>94651468
Because that's unrealistic and the MCU is more grounded in reality and science like classic marvel. Something like that would be more at home in Modern Marvel&DC and the DCEU

>>94651537
meh he could have had some tech or something that allowed him to do it...

>>94651335
It would have been OK if it wasn't during Marvels SJW phase it's currently in.

>>94651558
The evolutionary history of birds is the most complex of any animal, that's way harder to buy than ants

>Be Cap's best friend and ultimate partner
>White people still say you only got the shield because you're black

Why must Sam suffer?

Did you actually read his book?

What would make him "successful"? He had a bunch of story arcs and tackled some social issues similar to Englehart's run.

Are you one of those morons who only reads books that "matter" (read: get referenced in crossovers/HAVE LONGLASTING CONSEQUENCES THE MARVEL UNIVERSE WILL NEVER BE THE SAME)?

>>94651335
Synergy. They wanted to put a black guy in the movies so they made Falcon into Captain America to raise his profile. Most of Marvel's race/gender politicking started later.

>>94651335
Remender had plans for Sam and Hydra but left Marvel after they pissed him off.

Spencer took both ideas and ran them into the ground.

>>94651537
Here just take your (you). I'm not going to even bother correcting this shitpost.

>>94651537
Is this bait?

I like the idea of him as Captain America. I just think the writers failed to write him as an engaging take on the CA role. I think the idea of him flying through the air, flinging a shield, being a one man army sounded really fun, and I also liked the costume. But I guess this wasn't as interesting due to Marvel's lack of editorial focus, writers co-opting superheroes for completely partisan politics (not even remotely subtle like decent writers are), etc.

I mean, shit, the first issue is of him flying into an underground Amazon base, dodging lasers being fired at him from a GI Joe megabase, with a good show of action with Balroc. And then everything after just completely became trash.

>>94651711
The original Secret Empire story from 1974 (one of the best Cap stories of all time) featured Captain America uncovering a conspiracy orchestrated by the president, revealing him as a villain to the USA, and ended with Richard Nixon literally killing himself.

>>94651335
What's the point of anything in comics?

It's not a bad idea, just a really mediocre run.

>>94651400
underrated

>>94651335
clickbait

>>94651635
When did they piss him off? Judging by his farewell message, he'd just gotten fatigued from work-for-hire stuff and wanted to focus on creator-owned comics.

>>94652229
Wouldn't let him do his X-Men his way.

>>94651335
I like the wings.

>>94651335
He was suppose to be Steve's replacement for a long long time. But Spencer is a shitty writer and no one like his comic. So Spencer decided the best way for people to like Sam was to make Steve "Hydra" so that people would hate Steve and love Sam. Turns out that people would rather read about a Nazi than a BLM.

>>94651799
That arc was legit shit though and was so heavy handed it could be chiseled into stone with ease.

better than USAgent

>>94651799
If I don't like the '74 Secret Empire storyline, does that basically mean I don't like Captain America?
I mean, the Lee/Kirby/Steranko stuff is great, but beyond that, I've not read very much by way of "definitive" stories, and Secret Empire was rather uninteresting for me.

blacktain blackmerica

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Geez, hm, I wonder what made them choose him.

>>94651335
>What happened?
Spencer wrote Captain #BlackLivesMatter and no one liked it.

>>94653170
Nah, it's just that stuff is pretty simplistic old-school action hero Nazi-punching.

IMO Englehart and then Gruenwald's runs elevated Cap into having a more complex character and standing for something more. But if you don't like those it's OK. I think people have trouble admitting "this isn't for me" with these kind of things.

I recommend reading Roy Thomas' Invaders series, it's a love letter to classic Lee/Kirby-style Cap, but with more character dynamic between Cap, Namor and Torch, and excellent action scenes.

>>94653271
Cool strawman.

>>94651335
$&@% happens.

>>94651611
Being able to fucking execute the ideas he's got and not coming off like the BLM equivlaent of a chick tract. I wanted to see him go up against Flag Smasher with an Antifa or refugees. I expected him to negotiate America's complicated issues with China, and North Korea. Or a tour of Latin America, Venezuela. Cuba.

Hell, even if he keeps it in the US, I wanted something more than BORDER MILITIAS ARE FUCKING RACISTS, and fucking AMERICOPS.

Most importatnly, I wanted good stories. I mean, what was the BEST part of the run? Probably Capwolf. Beyond that, it gets pretty lean. Secon is maybe that thing with US agent. A pretty good idea, but couldn't stick the execution. Third, is what, BLM with Rage?

>>94653170
No more than hating frank miller means that you hate batman.

>>94651335
Or maybe you are just a racist???

>>94655512
I should just create a script that just randomly accuses people of being racist,

>>94655506
>BORDER MILITIAS ARE FUCKING RACISTS
anon a terrorist group that was making a push to go full beyond corp. and were abducting people including American citizens for genetic experiments.
>AMERICOPS
privatized security force that is harassing low income people so a wealthy real estate mogul can make a quick profit after buying the property for cheap.

blame Spencer all you want for the execution but this is that far from things Rodgers has/would tackle

>>94656666
You forget the part about Americops simultaniously being inhuman robots and also massive racists, and that the dialogue from the evil corp was taken straight from the republican campaign trail.

>>94656919
part about Americops simultaniously being inhuman robots
irrelevant
> and also massive racists
they were targeting low income areas Rodgers called out the guy who planned the thing,
>dialogue from the evil corp was taken straight from the republican campaign trail
So what, bad guys legitimizing their actions is nothing new, just admit you're butthurt because the political beliefs you hold were shown under a poor light.
>but I'm not even right wing
SJW stand ins tried to murder a speaker at a public event get thicker skin

>>94656666
>privatized security force that is harassing low income people so a wealthy real estate mogul can make a quick profit after buying the property for cheap.

Also a retcon of what the original Americop was.
This shit was like digging Jack Flagg and making him a member of the KKK levels of retardation.

>>94657210
it wasn't the original Americacop program anon

>>94651335

Same reason anybody assumes the mantle for a while, to shake things up. It happens all the time. The problem was that Sam's time was wasted on Spencer's writing. I would've loved for Sam to still be Cap while Steve was running America and the two would butt heads often but they haven't really interacted and that's a missed opportunity.

>>94651611
>What would make him "successful"?
Not having to be demoted to Falcon because the sales are shit is "successful". Even Jane Foster lasted longer as Thor than him and was more popular.

*mic drop*

>>94657270
Of course it wasn't, my point was digging a concept back and using it as a political statement.

Same shit happened with Rage in the very same arc.

It's all going as planned, don't you worry about a thing

>>94651400
Checked and kek'd

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>>94657179
I'm somewhat impressed at how thorough your flight of fancy of my motivations are. And you spent so much time pretzling my motivations into whatever retarded political POV you have that you missed the central thesis.

Which actually is a fitting metaphor for the book. It lavishes all it's pages on predictable political wankery and never actually does get to the point of what it means for Falcon to be captain america, at least anything beyond the most cursory mentions. It doesn't handle it's antagonists and villians well, which means that it can't really drive the central conflicts that it should be.


>>94657444
Well, congratulations! Now what's the next step in the master plan?

>>94651335
Gimmicky temporary change to give an illusion that they are doing something fresh.

>>94657519
>Well, congratulations! Now what's the next step in the master plan?
Crashing Captain Falcon, with no survivors.

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>>94651537

>Because that's unrealistic and the MCU is more grounded in reality and science like classic marvel.

Personally if they wanted to elevate Sam's importance, I'd have preferred a "Captain America and The Falcon" book. Make it a buddy thing.

>>94652327
Thank God.

>>94657662
Yeah, my problem with this from the beginning was that I wanted Falcon to be a stronger brand. I think it's a good look and he deserves to be more than a c-lister but this whole Captain Falcon thing has kind of stuck him there for a while

>tfw Captain Falcon has legitimately resulted in my favorite Cap stories since Brubaker's run
Cap Wolf was great, and Sam having to deal with everyone going "not muh Cap" was great, especially since there were tons of people in real life saying the exact same thing, despite how obviously retarded it is.

It changed up the status quo enough to get people talking about it, that's really all there was to it.

To his credit, his change-up lasted longer than others. Superior spider-man only lasted a year, for example.

>>94657647
he's right. "more grounded in reality" doesn't mean it's realistic, just more realistic than the comics.

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>>94657519
anon you missed the point of my post completely. As for Sam being Captain America, Spencer made this pic here, it sums up the run, people complaining about his political leaning and taking over the mantle. The entire run was political wank because it was a call back the the political run Rodgers had.If you think I have a distorted view of your political leanings too fucking bad my conservative friends made the same points you did complaining about the political nature of the book, but ignored anytime Spencer threw shade at modern left wingers.

>>94657876
But the people in the marvel universe are SUPPOSED to be retarded. Even moreso than regular people.

There should have been protestors demanding that cap be a mutant, and BLM should have been treating him like they treat black cops.

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>>94653271

>>94651335
Writers hijacked him to push their own agendas.

>>94658164
The pages where he actually gets crapped on by leftists, and shit like the page you posted don't have any traction. They aren't memorable at all and they aren't tied into the plot very tightly.

Is it really that surprising to you that people of different political persuasions can think a political work is shitty in the same way?

And I'm not claiming you have a distorted view. I claim you have NO view. It's all in your head.

>>94658243
That by itself isn't enough. Writers have been doing that since way back when punching hitler was controversial.

>>94651350
Which is stupid because people like MCU Falcon as Falcon. Even the actor. That was the first time most people gave a shit about him.

>>94651335
>What was the point of Sam Wilson as Captain America?
That Spencer's superpower is to sbit on everything. Good ideas get run into the ground and bad ideas just wiggle around and expire too slowly like a fish in the sun.

>>94658355
This. MCU Sam is a bro to hang with and until Vulture looked super cool. Comics Sam is a whiny loser.

>>94658355
Hey man I always liked Falcon. Even with his goofy outfit.

>>94651335
What was the point
Was it rape
Were you autistic
What was your endgame
What was your fucking problem
How was this allowed

Really makes you think

>>94651335
There wasn't one.

His run as Captain America was complete garbage. It was basically just far-left propaganda, while shitting on anyone who dared notice it was far left propaganda.

>>94658444
>Everything that isn't some Conservative Nazi-tier wankfest is leftist propaganda

The Right is going to collapse on itself. It clearly can't be sustained in the current world.

>>94651411
See, this was a good, interesting angle.

But because Spencer has all the subtlety of a machine gun laden truck ploughing into a China shop, it ends up being shrill.

Also, as for Secret Empire, events are supposed to cover a multitude of characters, that's the actual point of an event, if you're doing it properly.

Spencer narrowly focused on about four or five characters, in an event, resulting in a plot that is mostly stationary because the other wheels all stop so Spencer can have Widow make a political speech, or so Spencer can show us how awesomely clever HydraCap is, or portray the diverse heroes as superior.

The story would have been more interesting without Hydra, with a more ambiguous machine surrounding Captain Keikaku.

>>94658540
They said the same thing about Hilary winning the election.

>>94651335
Marvel was in full Diversity mode at the time. Every character had to be Diversity-fied. Sometimes it worked and sometimes it didn't. Marvel plans on fixing it in 2018 with a big event staring Thanos (in time for the new movie). In the meantime, they are doing small pandering stuff to help: Falcon back to being Falcon, Renew Your Vows, Venom, etc.

>>94658540
Ackowledging that his comic was nothing but far left propaganda neither makes one a conservative, or a nazi.

It just means you have shit taste and should feel bad.

>>94651359
I miss Remender.

>>94651335
I feel sorry for Sam. He had so much potential and Spencer ruined it. Now we won't see Sam as Captain America for a long time because of him.

>>94651400
underrated post.
had to force-feed that (((agenda))).

>>94651400
CARLOS!

>>94659007
>was

>>94658879
You know, even though I hate Blumpf I was happy to see him win because I thought it would make everyone shut up about Hillary.

I was wrong.

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Cyclops should've been Captain America, would've given some events more depth and he probably knows how to throw that shield much better than Sam

>>94656919
Americops being robots was editorial decree from above after they forced Spencer to rewrite the arc to make the Americops basically neutral evil and not lawful evil.

Spencer had them show up in an issue of Steve's book during Secret Empire still human.

Of all the shit Spencer did, him fucking up Americop was one of the worst things.

I mean, just rip off Bendis' White Tiger arc with Americop getting arrested for killing a black crook and have Sam, Rage, Speedball (who nearly killed Americop) try and find proof Speed Demon framed Bart. Maybe toss in a happy ending where unlike with White Tiger, Americop doesn't die in disgrace and have the entire arc revolve around Sam realizing how full of shit he is?

Hell, they could still do the Civil War 2 tie-in by having Ulysses point out that Bart can't die because he hasn't had a child yet and said child has to be born so he can give birth to Punisher 2099?

Hell, maybe even do a Punisher/Sam Cap/Spidey 2099 crossover out of it!