Were they wrong?

>>94059438
That you are very hurt by the results of fanfiction tier shit and therefore won't stop spamming /co/ with threads like these.

>>94059469
This is the first thread Ive made about this and I never said they WERE wrong, faggot.

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>>94059438
Haha. No, not really.

>>94059438
They're not wrong, but only because Goku has a definable, relatively consistent power level that takes time to grow.

Superman is as weak or powerful as the author decides, I mean this is a superhero who can apparently keep up with Goku in terms of speed, But he never uses such (allegded) speed in the comic books to just insta-win every battle.

Post-reborn Supes have supernova burst?

>>94059438
So who won? I see a bunch or old videos on jewtube but no new vid.

>>94060033
Superman. It was a short fight where Goku got revived, they went somewhere away from people, and then Superman took some hits before just lobotomizing Goku with his laser vision, because he can do that. The entire fight was just a message to angry fanboys that Superman doesnt lose unless he is written to lose. Goku can never win a fair fight against Superman, and wouldnt settle for anything less given his personality.

>>94059438
They were right, but for the wrong reasons. They kept mixing continuities and their "equations" were bullshit.

>>94060152
>X-ray labotomy
Excellent, Goku is cool and all but Superman is the original superhero with the most bullshit powerset.

>>94059438

I think they were. However it depends on the Superman. Nu 52 supes? yes Goku can beat him, rebirth supes? maybe, pretty crisis supes and all before? no.
Death Battle doesn't really understand out ki works and forgets that Superman can be drained from solar energy and needs a recharge after a savage beating.
Not to mention Hakai goku now knows, thing is if Wonder Woman could beat supes then goku can as well.
Then there is the whole god ki thing. So really it's up in the air.

Superman's power levels have always been bullshit. Goku's power levels are so bullshit that the term "power level" was invented and then swiftly stomped into dust just to describe how bullshit they were.

Never is Stan Lee's rant about "whoever the writer wants to win will win" more relevant.

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>>94062304
>Nu 52 supes? yes Goku can beat him,
What? Nu52 had some of the most impressive feats since Silver Age, he's one of the strongest modern incarnations. He outraced instant teleportation for fuck's sake.

>>94059438
Yes.

>>94062304
Nu52 and Rebirth are literally the same guy along with New Earth. Dr. M just split Superman apart for (reasons to be revealed later). It might be related to the Time Trapper's constant failures to completely remove Superman from history.

>>94060283
>>94060152
I'm glad they realized Superman can kill people by cooking their insides.Heat vision is literally just his X-ray vision cranked up to produce heat. It's a shame so many writers treat it like a pew pew laser blast.

Considering a heart virus killed Goku his organs aren't as tough as his external ki aura. X-ray lobotomy is a hard counter to Goku. Especially since the beams don't have to be visible and not being ki he won't be able to sense them until its too late.

>>94059438
I mean if they have waited, Goku would have been faster than time galaxy busting warrior.

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>>94062394
there's a Sups for that.

>>94062409
Who is not the supes Goku's fighting. That's the problem here. Comics can combine any number of Superman and say it's okay because why not. Goku is just by one person. I mean why don't we take those fanfic Goku.

>>94062334
Wrong. Goku has a measurable power level, he just keeps skipping ahead because "lol, saiyan". He was weaker than Raditz at the start, then got stronger than him. He was weaker than Vegeta after that, then was stronger than him by the Ginyu fights, the. Vegeta was stronger than him, then back to Goku, who was still weaker than Freeza, then Super Saiyan happened, which was weaker than androids 16, 17, and 18. Then- you get the idea.

All of this could be measured mind you, but like measuring statistics, sometimes the 1% happens. The 1% being "not" ass pull power ups mid or near-end arc.

Even simpler; DBZ power measuring is bull shit.

>>94062445
The entire POINT of adding devices which measured power levels was to demonstrate that they were completely useless. This was done in every possible way: by having technique overcome power, by having power fluctuate with will and fighting spirit, by having people control their power level. But somehow people like you didn't get the message and turned power levels into a religion. Every fluctuation in power level was not evidence of how bullshit and useless they were, but just demonstrated how true they were because "every time they get stronger, there is a reason and it's measurable." No shit. EVERYTHING has a reason. But when someone can literally get better and stronger in the middle of a fight just because they want to (something both Superman and Goku have demonstrated) then it's time to throw in the towel.

>>94062391
Nu52 was still the cannon superman until they changed it due to fans getting pissed. Nu Supes was powered down and even took a nuke too protect wonder woman in the process which drained him. Even though they just finished a fight it shows that Superman can be drained.
Goku has enough power to surpass a nuke. Along side a the Xray labotomy Goku in a fight wouldn't allow superman to do it, but if his gaurd is dropped Supes could do it.

>>94059438
Something people never bring up:

Goku is used to fighting guys with his exact same powerset and isn't a problem solver. If he can't punch the bad guy he screams harder and punches again.

Superman is used to not only fighting guys that punchgood and shoot disco lights of death but he's fought people with different powers and people that can shut him down with magic/telepathy/reality control.

Superman has gone up against foes he can't beat by punching harder and harder (Mageddon, Darkseid, Mxy, Wraith, Superboy Prime). He thinks outside the box far more often than Goku to pull off a win.

Superman can attack Goku in ways he's not used to. Vibration tricks. Time travel. Super breathing his air away. Internal attacks with X-rays. Heat vision sniping from Outer Space. Throwing him into the Source Wall. Using a phantom zone projector. Tackling him into a yellow sun so that Goku will constantly take damage from the core while he's constantly healed. Stunning Goku with Supervoice attacks. Matching his vibration pattern and pushing him into another universe. Counter-vibrating him into non-existence with super singing.

Superman can just DO more to Goku. There are tons of silver bullets that drop Superman, way more than just Kryptonite. Goku doesn't have anything like that except -maybe- Hakai and even then Superman has shown resistance to "pure destruction" attacks before.

>>94062508
this is true, which is why lifting something heavy isn't the best way to point out someone's full strength in a battle.

>>94062379
>He outraced instant teleportation for fuck's sake.
Hold up, when did he do that and was it without aid?

>>94062529
>Superman can attack Goku in ways he's not used to. Vibration tricks. Time travel. Super breathing his air away. Internal attacks with X-rays. Heat vision sniping from Outer Space. Throwing him into the Source Wall. Using a phantom zone projector. Tackling him into a yellow sun so that Goku will constantly take damage from the core while he's constantly healed. Stunning Goku with Supervoice attacks. Matching his vibration pattern and pushing him into another universe. Counter-vibrating him into non-existence with super singing.
you are thinking of just DBZ terms, Goku has fought other people with different abilities in early dragonball. What you see with Goku is basic fighting and ki moves and ussually doesn't use anything else unless needed. Take instant movement, or Hakai, or solar flare or many others.

>>94062567
Red Hood and the Outlaws. jason and crew teleport from Pluto to earth from Superman, and he's already there by the time they gather their thoughts.

>>94059880
Inconsistent writing is not one of Supermans powers Deathbattles just decided it that was.

>>94062379
the flash did that
Instant means instant. Supes has the most feats I'm not gonna deny but Nu Supes can be brought down and drained of solar energy.

>>94059880
>Never uses his alleged speed to insta-win every battle.

Show me a time he didn't use his speed.

You have to remember he's not the Flash. He can't speedforce away his kinetic energy. If he's going super sonic the air is going to be carrying his kinetic energy and he doesn't want to kill his enemy or the city they're likely to be fighting in.

>>94062668
nothing canon in a certain way, he does do it in injustice when he kills Darksieds minions in an instant, he just didn't want to because of the moral implications.

>>94062529
>isn't a problem solver
Did you actually watch it? And yea, like the other anon said, Goku was much more technique-oriented in DB and he always learned opponents brand new moves they used on him on the spot and used it against them. Not a big fan of Super but they are doing a lot more of this again.

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While they may have fumbled some of the equations and reasoning, no they weren't wrong.

Final "nail in goku's coffin" Crisis is more than enough to give Superman the win (no, befor you fucking plebians jump down my throat, I'm not talking about the thought robot".

Not even counting the innumerable times Superman has shown strength, speed and smarts far beyond anything Goku has shown.

Goku will NEVER beat Superman in a fair fight.

>>94062822
I'm not trying to jump down your throat but do forget that goku is a martial artist and relies on technique more than pure strength and speed. Smarter than goku, in many ways yes, but when it comes to fighting Goku is an idiot savant.

>>94062853
I never understood how much people missed that Goku was a genius fighter and thought he was a retard in all aspects. It wasn't a hidden thing at all.

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Goku needs to stop being so obsessed with fighting, go home, clean his room, sort himself out, get a real job, and evaluate the priorities in his life.

He's a strong, smart, capable guy. But look at what he does all day. Nothing but fight fight fight eat eat eat.

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>>94062853
>>94062892

I'm not disagreeing with you at all about Goku being a better technical fighter. It's not even close. Goku has put his entire life into being the best martial artist he can be. Put them on an equal power-field and Goku mops the floor with him 9/10 times.

But I cannot agree with it being of any consequence at the time when Superman thinks "Okay. Enough of this shit. Time to end it".

>pic vaguely related

>>94062896
Holy shit that image. Perfect.

>>94062896
shut up chichi

>>94062905
>>94062896

Was there ever a part 2? I know the original had a second part but I'm not sure the guy doing the edits edited the second part.

>>94062896
like hell goku would be upset if he lost.
He would be glad that he could fight him again. Goku doesn't care that he couldn't be some one, he cares about fighting some one strong, even if he loses he will want to fight him again because it's fun.

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Despite what the DBZ fanboys will say: No. They were not wrong.

Sure Goku is strong and a great fighter, but Superman is on a whole other level in terms of strength, speed, durability and abilities.

>>94062899
In today's Super, all Goku has to do is fight him and he will eventually attain his godly power lol

>>94062940
It's more so directed to the "I hate Superman he's so perfect he's never had to work a day in his life or struggle Goku deserves to win" crowd.

>>94062899
the thing is, goku isn't about improving himself to be the best. That's Vegeta, Goku gets stronger because he wants to fight stronger guys. Thing is we keep going back and forth saying that when a character just stops and says enough of this shit, but actually they wouldnt, Superman wouldnt kill goku when Goku just wants to fight and Goku wouldn't kill superman because he wants to fight supes again.

>>94062964
>, Superman wouldnt kill goku when Goku just wants to fight

No, of course not. But he sure as shit would knock him out sooner or laterr.

>>94062956
I get that, but those fans don't get Goku. Goku doesn't care if he loses he cares if he didn't put his all into the fight, if he drained himself of all possibility he is satisfied

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>>94062956
>"I hate Superman he's so perfect he's never had to work a day in his life or struggle Goku deserves to win" crowd.

Normies. Is there anything they can't ruin?

>>94062971
But so would goku. Superman still has a humanoid body that's effected by techniques. To put power vs power goku would not win, power vs technique, Goku has a chance.

Does Superman beat Zen-Oh?

>>94062991
so youre saying

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>>94062991

Technique can only take you so far, anon.

What use is knowing how to block and counter literally every punch under the sun, if the arm that hits you not only breaks your rib, your arm, hits all your pressure points, does an entire book of sudoku puzzles, shatters your kidney, stretches and then punches you eleven thousand more times before you can even register that the arm has moved in the first place?

>>94063013
Zen-oh doesn't have a battle power.
He can erase what ever. Think of all the gods in DC and they had the almighty highest form of creation above those gods. That's Zeno. Litterally Zeno is probably the representation of the Fan bad of DBZ.

>>94063062
>Think of all the gods in DC and they had the almighty highest form of creation above those gods.

You know nothing about the high tier beings in DC.

Stop spouting shit, please.

>>94063052
The ability to absorb that punch an redirect it. That's the while point of Martial Arts.

>>94063077
You literally just ignored every single thing I said.

I can see this is going nowhere. I'm out of the thread, hopefully someone else insults you.

>>94063070
Any DC god that rewrites existence is Zeno in DBZ. It's been stated Zeno has no battle power, he is just god above all gods though not omnipotent it would seem.

>>94063089
you haven't been paying attention to anything I just said, you keep ignoring that goku is super human abilities too along with techniques.

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>>94062991
Superman has hundreds of years more experience in fighting than Goku does.

Pic related is from when Superman and Wonder Woman fought in Valhalla for 1,000 years.

>>94063096
you cant say that, he CURRENTLY has no battle power, but theres nothing stating he legit has NO battle power.

he simply has no feats in combat.

>>94063120
and still fights with no new techniques.
only to forget it all because of new writers.

>>94062598
Nope. Nu52 Superman flew from Pluto to Earth faster than a teleporter could send Starfire and her harem there.

>>94062304
>Nu 52 supes? yes Goku can beat him
You mean the guy that hit Brainiac so hard it hurt different incarnations of him?

>>94063077
dude that shit only works if the punch is only marginally stronger than yours...by your logic a child could take out a 6 foot 300lb black man with redirection.

at the moment of impact...that ABSORPTION is going into your hand/arm and shit and shattering your fibers and bones.

>>94063134
Yes they do, they discuss it in a super episode, Whis tells goku not to fight Zeno, and tells goku that he has no battle power there is no point fighting him.

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>>94062422

>>94063164
again you compare goku to nothing and super man as everything. You keep ignoring Goku's abilities and how technique works.

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>>94063166
>Whis tells goku not to fight Zeno, and tells goku that he has no battle power

This never happened.

Goku is just a really strong dude. Not even the strongest in his own show and not the strongest anime character by a long shot. Superman is literally the strongest character in the DC universe.

The essence of his character when he was a part of the Superman Thought Robot was to literally overcome ANY threat.

>>94063155
yeah while goku could kill an immortal with a hakai move, it's retarded but it's there.

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Were they wrong about this too?

>>94062571
>Goku has fought other people with different abilities in early dragonball
And beat them with simple punchgood.

>>94062899
>Put them on an equal power-field and Goku mops the floor with him 9/10 times.
An equal power field doesn't stop Superman from cooking his brain through his eyes.

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>>94063181
You're replying to about 5 different people as if they are one guy.

Stop being a retard.

The thing you aren't realising is that Gokus abilities are not even close to Supermans. His technique does not come into play because of the GIGANTIC speed difference, so removing ability and technique, goku has nothing.

It's time for you to head on home to /r/whowouldwin. A cancerous place you would fit in well with.

>>94063194
a) killing an immortal means jack fucking shit in and out of context and b) he didn't even kill him.

>>94062991
An ant can master every martial art in the world and train for twenty years to fight me, that's not going to actually make a difference.

>>94063186
it was beerus that told him this. That he will destroy goku in an instant.

>>94063223
all you do is remove ability and technique to win the argument, you really don't even bother trying.

>>94063242
buy you are an ant.

will goku surpass zen-oh? he surpassed kami, king yemma, the kais, he'll eventually pass beerus.

having an actual ceiling for him doesn't feel right but i can't see goku having that kind of power.

>>94063194
>hakai
>reality removal
>something Superman has resisted dozens if not hundreds of times because Darkseid is a thing

>>94063204
no he didnt, he didn't beat them all, shows that you don't know dragonball

>>94063261
>you really don't even bother trying.
What is there to even try for, lol?

Superman is so, so much faster than that Goku couldn't even see him move, let alone move in time to stop a hit.

If goku has no technique or powers, he has literally nothing.

>>94063220
>death battle is always right

>>94063197
No, because that was G1 Starscream, who is incapable of winning anything.

>>94063291
and that'd what pissed you off that is what he has, if superman didn't have his super powers he'd be nothing to goku.

>>94063220
http://dragonball.wikia.com/wiki/Eye_Laser

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>>94063261
Wew lad.

Is this the debate standard /a/ has to offer? Pathetic.

>>94063186
yes it did, they stated Zeno doesn't have a fighting power and can't even be destroyed by his own powers, proof of that when he destroyed future trunks universe and he was the only thing there left alive.

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>>94063303
>wah supermans too overpowered

see this image >>94062896

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>>94063315
>they stated

oh they did, did they?

Go on then, link it?

Oh look. You can't.

>>94063306
...and?

>>94063316
>points are proven but I must save face so I'll just shit post instead.

>>94063299
>He didn't read Alternity or the Marvel comics
Pleb.

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>>94063332
>points are proven

But you proved no point, silly.

>>94063329
he literally dealt with eye killing lasers when he was 12

>>94063326
watch the show then it's the first episodes of the universe survival arc.

>>94063339
just because you are a retarded asshole who ignores all other points doesn't mean they haven't been proven.

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>>94063379
>implying eye lasers and heat vision are the same

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>>94063409
>points

>>94063413
Gonna go down with the ship huh

>>94063422
>stniop

>>94063430
Tell me Anon, how do eyes function?

>>94063548
I'm curious on how either of you function.

>>94063409
What is your point? That Goku could beat Superman if only Superman didn't completely outclass him in terms of speed & power?

No shit?

>>94063577
>speed and power wins, just cuz, you know cuz it does

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>>94063430
>>94063379

>Ki based energy generation in the eye area
>being even a little bit the same as focusing solar energy from inside the eyes cells

Nigga you need to be stopped. You're probably one of those plebs who thinks the watchmen film is good because it has all the comic panels translated to film.

>>94063584
when it's at such a colossal difference, you can sure as hell know that it does.

>>94063548
>>94063565

1. Goku's inner organs were vulnerable to a fucking virus. Not even a super virus. Just a virus.

2. Superman's heat vision is concentrated X-rays.

3. If Goku can take an X-ray with no problem then one look from Superman liquefies his insides completely by stepping any durability his ki aura grants him.

>>94063584
Could Mr Satan beat Goku?

no depiction has goku using kaioken against superman. kaioken would fuck old clark.

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>it's an "assmad dragon-baby makes a fool of himself by revealing how little he truly knows about how strong superman is relative to goku" episode

>>94063599
>so colossal that super man never losses to others, when except he does.

>>94063627
he doesn't even have technique he thinks that all those ki techniques are tricks.

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>>94063647
No he doesn't, you fucking abridged watching spastic.

He just says that to appear better in the eyes of the public.

You've never even watched the show, have you?

>>94063621
it was a space virus
in space
you know where Clark is from.

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>>94063548
>>94063565
Assuming the Superman in this scenario can't couple his X-ray and heat vision like Justice Lords and Red Son did to lobotomize their enemies his eyes still shoot solar energy.

And if that's the case then we get a scenario like pic related happening.

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>>94063667


>>94063662
What was the power level of the space virus?

>>94063659
I see you are upset
please tell me more why you are on the rag?

>>94063565
Eyes reflect light inward, it's how sight works. The fact Goku can still see means his defenses do nothing against light. Heat vision isn't a laser, but it does behave like light in many ways, for example it can be reflected. That means any being with eyes that work is vulnerable to Superman reflecting heat vision inside their skulls through their eyes, and it's 100% lethal on any being that doesn't have A) highly durable organs, or B) a need for functioning organs in order to live.

Heat vision is not a ki technique, Goku cannot sense it. It can be so subtle as to be invisible. Superman could kill Goku without looking like he's doing anything, an Goku wouldn't know anything was happening until he woke up at Yemma's. Goku having fought people with "eye lasers" before mean absolutely nothing, it can't help him here.

>>94063662
Appropriate.

Dies to space virus, dies to a space man.

>>94063681
power levels don't mean anything, lurk more faggot.

>>94063693
>spaceman fan cries when no one believes in deathbattles outcome

>>94063704
>When no one believes in deathbattle's outcome

Anon, did you skim the thread sweetie?

>>94063696
But vulnerable organs do Anon.

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>>94063704
>no one believes in deathbattles outcome

Whatever you say, madfag.

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>>94063704

>>94063704
>no one
Have you seen this thread?

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>>94063704
>no one

This nigga for real

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HAHAHAHAH how the fuck are heart attacks from space viruses real HAHAHAHAH Saiyan just fly into the sun and kill the virus like Saiyan just close your eyes and jump at the glowing ball in the sky.

>This thread
I'm glad you people wont breed, holy shit.

>>94063692
there are many things he can't sense, you make it sound like he doesn't even know how to fight.

>>94063770
you can't "fight" an instant lobotomy, ya goose.

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>>94063760
HAHAHAHA how the fuck are heart attacks even real HAHAHAHA Saiyan just control your heart muscles like Saiyan just close your eyes and flex.

>>94063770
He does know how to fight. But knowing how to throw a punch and see one coming back at you means less than nothing when the enemy's attack is merely looking in your direction and not moving. Or looking in your direction from orbit, where you can't even see him (or sense him, the only nondeveloped ki Goku has ever sensed was Bulma, the person he's known longer than anyone). Remember, Superman can do this heat vision trick at any range heat vision functions. He could cook Goku's brain from Mars.

>>94063781
nice head cannon

>>94063819
That would be poor sportsmanship.

>>94059438
Superman is not a character in an rpg that has stats and can be measured, he's an concept.
Like Saitama or Popeye, the writer will just bullshit something on the spot to make him stronger.
Now can you people PLEASE stop putting Goku in those things, even fucking Kenshiro can beat his ass.
>meanwhile JRPG characters are either killing or enslaving god himself.

>>94063819
you do know that Superman despite being alien still has ki right? even then Goku knows how to read another fighter by movements, even creating openings for supes to attack right? this happened with Goku vs Hit. Goku couldn't sense Hit either and the dude was stopping time.

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>>94063820
>head cannon
BRUH

>>94063867
>used it on a non martial artist
any wasn't this another non canon book?

>>94063854
>the dude was stopping time

But was he melting Goku's brain from orbit?

No?

Irrelevant to the point being made then, isn't it?

>>94063867
>He has Contessa's power

>>94063883
>non canon
No. stop it.

>>94063886
muh head canon

>>94063854
Undeveloped ki. The only undeveloped ki Goku has ever sensed was Bulma's, the person he's known longer than anyone else. Superman's wouldn't stand out to him in the lightest, no matter what he did. Also, how can Goku read Superman's movements, when Superman is too fast for Goku to react to? Superman isn't merely twice, three times or ten times as fast as Goku, he's several million times faster. Goku has no, NO, legitimate light speed feats Superman has them in abundance.

>>94063867
why does he bleed if he is invincible?

>>94063883
>used it on a non martial artist

Oh man you're so right, I forgot about all those martial arts techniques for avoiding laser lobotomy.

>>94063883
>used it on a non martial artist
Why do you think that's relevant?

>>94063904
goku was a kid he trained dodging lightning, not by beating the speed but predicting it.

>>94063910
Read the comic. He let them smack him around on purpose, he was buying time.

>>94063910
He'd recently fought both a magic user and a psychic.

>>94063911
good because you know that happens in real life all the time right?

>When people on the internet take videos more seriously than the creators do...

>>94063915
you've never been in a fight have you>>ll

>>94063919
Yeah, the fastest lightning is nowhere near the speed of light.

>>94063924
>>94063927
>bu-but my invincibility

>>94063938
neither is superman while being on earth.

>>94063936
Yeah, all those karate lesson sure help you get ready for defending against someone looking in your direction.

>>94063919
So he's fine so long as Superman behaves predictably and just flies at him fast.

>>94063951
yeah, especially from some autistic raging superfag.

>>94063883
No, Manchester Black just showed up again a few months ago, he's 100% canon.

>>94063955
yes
all I'm saying is goku knows how to fight and bait opponents, after all that I don't think goku could kill supes, I think he could beat him.

>>94063969
how he get unlobotomized?

>>94062896
>Goku needs to stop being so obsessed with fighting, go home, clean his room, sort himself out, get a real job, and evaluate the priorities in his life.

But he really can't. Its literally his entire character to live for the thrill of the fight. Like, its ingrained into the genes of his race. For fuck's sake, the Saiyans transform into giant monster apes and smash the shit out of everything.

Not to mention the fact that the Earth would have been destroyed several times over if he had decided to settle down and NOT fight and train all those years.

And also, Goku would have never been upset that he lost like >>94062940 said. He pretty much knew Cell was strong than him and he smiled and stepped down because he knew Gohan was stronger. He also wasn't mad he lost to Beerus. He was more upset that he only go so far on what was literally a borrowed power and not on his own power.

they're almost always wrong

>>94063288
Every time he lost it was due to an opponent just being better at martial arts or stronger than him.

Tenshinhan is a different case.

>>94063984
Aliens.

>>94064008
They were only wrong twice. Batman v Cap, and Hulk v Doomsday.

>>94059438
If Goku fought DCAU Supes, wouldn't it have been a fair fight?

>>94063288
>Goku has beaten opponents who had more than just punching!
>Yeah, but he beat them with punching.
>Nuh-uh, sometimes he lost!

Do you understand how arguments work?

Superfags always avoid this question. If Superman is the greatest, why isn't he the greatest in his own comic? If Superman is the strongest, why is there someone stronger. If Superman is only suppose to win, why is there time he lost. You Supermanfags always like to think that this fight is going to be like it was in a comic. That's ridiculous. That's like saying that DBZfans expect Toriyama to write the fight between Goku and Superman to let Goku win.
The truth here is, Goku can beat almost all of the Superman. And those he can't beat are multiverse destroying faster than god asspull bullshit monsters. Just face it guys. Even Goku can't beat asspull after asspull.

>2017
>Goku vs Superman is still a thing
Quickly /co/, come up with something new for autistic vs debating on the same caliber.
Hard mode: No Saitama, no toon force

>>94059438
NLF outliers on Supes
NO LIMITS FALLACY

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>>94064222
>outliers

an outlier done more than once is no such thing.

Remain salty, friend.

>>94064058
>uses the same argument
really makes you think

>>94063755
>>94063748
>>94063746
>>94063737
>>94063715
>>94063704
those were for charity clark

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>>94064165
not even in dragonball

>>94064390
>gloves

will never look good, fampai

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>>94063951
more than you know

>>94064206
batman vs spiderman

>>94063659
http://www.kanzenshuu.com/translations/saikyo-jump-june-2014-issue-twel-buu-mysteries/

>>94064025
kirby vs buu?
I don't know about this I'm a spiderman fan and I think Batman would beat spiderman.

Next big fight for goku is Jeiren
>jieren
>jorlen
>jorel
>Jor'El

>>94059438
I'm just going to throw this out there:
>Only reason according to their explanation why Superman wouldn't be instantly K.O.'d by most of Goku's Ki/Chi/whatever the fuck powers, is because they're "not magic".
>Magic is quite simply "stuff that is unnatural"
>Therefore, if it was some special technique and that's it, it wouldn't count as magic
>Except in Super (Which I look into every now and again because I hate myself) they're doing a new tournament where Ki/Chi/whatever flying is illegal, because it unnatural
>Flying, and dragonball powers in general are not something you're born with and can use with training, they're literally magic, something that anyone could tell you the moment they established the first fucking Kamehameha, because the only reason it even happened was to put out a gigantic fucking magical fire that's been going on for years, and was created by the very guy who came up with Kamehamehas

>>94064544
Kirby can't kill Buu. But Buu can kill himself (see Buu vs Evil Buu). Any attack Buu uses, Kirby eats it and uses it against him.

>>94064674
Unnatural =/= magic. Magic is magic, and they make it very clear in DBZ that magic an ki are not the same thing. Also,

>thinking magic instantly beats Superman

>>94064676
that's not true though
kirby can swallow all attacks, look at his games.

>>94064753
can't*

>>94064692
I agree with you bit where was that said? and Isn't there chi/ki magic?

>>94064692
They make it very clear in most fantasy works that [Insert name of voodoo equivalent back water dark shit] and [insert name of whatever the proper wizards use] are not the same thing.
Game of Thrones has like a minimum of 3 completely separate things that are all basically a form of magic, but have nothing to do with each other.
All DBZ establishes, is that Ki is not the same kind of stuff that Baba uses to float on her crystal ball and give lifts to dead people.

As for the "instantly beat Superman".
Goku is explicitly stated to possess strength that could Superboy the fuck out of the universe.
Except he's punching with weeaboo fightan' magic, instead of only muscles, which goes past Superman's invulnerability.
And even if punching wouldn't work, he's got (effectively) death rays, and even a thing where he starts chanting a few words and next thing you know, you're in a bottle you can never escape from (unless someone removes a flimsy piece of paper).

>>94064674
they don't allow flying because they couldn't knock each other off the arena, you can disable wings but you can disable their ability to fly.
Ki is an inner power, natural energy that flows through everyone.
When they fly they push their energy below themselves. Kind of like how they yous a ki attack to bounce back.
A ki attack is like a punch being tossed out into the distance in energy form.
Ever see the Hadoken on the snes paused? look at the fire ball and it shows Ryu's hands. Thats what ki attacks do.

>>94064802
>could Superboy the fuck out of the universe
Wrong, watch episode 13.

Both characters are in a stage of inconsistent writing. Remember Roshi blew up the moon? Toriyama is still inconsistent with his characters, not as much as super man but still.

>>94064861
of what?

>>94064851
You're kind of missing the part where Master Roshi both created the Kamehameha technique, and was also the guy responsible for creating a massive raging inferno that is explicitly magic.
Also Franchise A =/= Franchise B.

>>94064861
Honestly, Super's been all over the place.
Point was, that without his invulnerability, Superman is a tough cookie, but not a "Brush off a Planet Cracker" tough.
Goku's dueling parter is a dude who's been cracking planet since before they "started to get serious".

>>94064966
he had a magic item made for putting out thw fire but he never made the fire. He did make the kamehameha.

>>94064909
DBS. Old Kai says "three shock waves will wipe out the universe also Goku and Bill will die." In 13 there was a third wave, and none of that happened. So any time someone says Goku threatened the universe, laugh at them.

>>94064966
>Goku's dueling parter is a dude who's been cracking planet
No, he hasn't. Vegeta has never destroyed a planet, that was filler.

>>94064025
Who won hulk v doomsday?

>>94065044
3rd shock wave goku absorbed the blow, the anime is not the best when it comes to cannon but that saying neither is the manga

>>94065060
think he's talking about beerus

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>>94062896
>sort himself out

>>94065102
it's like fighting autism with autism

>>94065118
>>94065102
I'm new here, what's wrong with the phrase "sort himself out"?

>>94065075
The third wave wasn't from punches, it was from ki attacks.

>>94065069
Doomsday, they decided Dooms could overload Hulk's healing factor, which is what let his brain generate the chemicals for anger endlessly. Despite the Beyonder saying Hulk had "no finite element" inside.

>>94064966
I only use the Hadoken to give you an image of what I mean. Everything about ki is a natural power through training and technique. Some people think it's psychic powers but it's not it's simply energy pulled from with in and manipulated. The Kiyai is that shout and makes their aura appear, that's what it is, your body mind and soul given form outside the body.

>>94065158
just ignoring the basic characteristics when it comes to goku.

>>94065178
>Despite what the Beyonder said

His strength is potentially infinite as long as he stays in Hulk form but getting smacked by Superman level characters (like Sentry in WWH) can knock him down to Bruce.

>>94064674
>implying magic is just "stuff that is unnatural" in the DC

It's not the emotional spectrum and its not the speed force and its not the bleed and its not the Red/Green/Grey/Black. Magic is -magic-. If you look on the multiversity map you'll see the sphere of the Gods where Heaven/4th World/Olympus/Dreaming are. That's magic.

Ki is not magic.

>>94064165
>Why isn't he the greatest in the DCU?

Because the top tier guys in DC are magic reality warpers

>Why is there someone stronger?

Name one and you'll probably answer it yourself.

>Why is there a time where he lost?

Either it was his Doomsday death during his Byrne era where he had mental blocks preventing him from accessing his full potential or because he went up against someone with one of his many, many weaknesses.

>>94064008
They're right about most.

They were wrong about:

Doomguy vs Master Chief
Wonder Woman vs Rogue
Cloud vs Link
Gaara vs Toph
Batman vs Captain America

And I'm probably forgetting a few. But for a show several seasons long their track record isn't that bad. Most of the stuff they got wrong were from the early seasons.

>>94065118
>>94065102
>>94065158
>Dissing the JP

I sure hope you guys don't have to rescue your father from the Underwrorld

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>>94065118
lmao moron
>>94065158
nothing wrong with it. the picture of the guy i posted is jordan b peterson. he often uses the phrase is his lectures as shorthand for getting your life together

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>>94064802
>>94064966
>Thinking planet busting would kill Supes

>>94063155
>superman delivers the punch heard r'round the multiverse

>somewhere in the 31st century brainiac 5 gets a headache

>>94065515
>Brainiac got punched so hard his descendants developed a love of Superman's genetic line

>>94065419
I hated toph vs gaara but their logic was pretty sound. Toph can sense sand that she's not in contact with which means she can use it against him. Gold has impurities so she can sense that as well. Assuming the only sand she can't control is gaara's gourd sand, she can still control his sand armor and use that to kill him.

>>94059438
Goku's really vulnerable. You can just drown or suffocate him, or shoot him with his guard let down and he will die. He can't even survive the detonation of a planet.

At the time no

But now Goku has surpassed Superman with aome bullshit feats in Super

>>94065610
No, he really hasn't.

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>>94065610
>But now Goku has surpassed-

No.

Why do people say Goku has no tactics?

He found a way to break theough Hit's time stop


https://youtu.be/-2ejNt9jBG8

BAN STEALTH ANIME THREADS!!!!!!!!!!!

Mods, do your fucking work.

>>94065709
did he punch brainiac and every incarnation of him from likely different universes felt it?

>>94062896
Goku would never say that

Vegeta has said that same thing before in the anime

>>94065922
yes

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I know who would btfo Superman

>>94065178
This is why death battle is freaking stupid.

>>94065922
Yes.

He also got in a fist fight with his alternate Earth-2 self and their blows were so powerful they were knocked into each others' timelines and lives.

As in one Superman would suddenly find himself kissing the Superman's Lois or saving the other Superman's Earth.

Superman's punches are like Popeye's. They alter reality.

>>94063904
Goku is like a thousand times ftl in raw speed measuring kail ken x 10 while in blue

Plus he can teleport

Superman may be faster but lets not exaggerate

>>94065459
>calling others morons
>not knowing whom he is talking about.

If we accept that Goli wouldnt simply instant transmission to grab kryptonite we have to accept that Superman wouldnt use his full power to enable him to kill Goku, giving Goku a chance

>>94059438

Superman is stupidly strong and DBZ character stupidly inconsistent, I swear that since the end of Frieza saga, they have been similarly strong, they always make a huge deal of blowing up a planet for example, they cant even lift a thousand tons in ssj2, lasers hurt them, if they aren't paying attention, bullets hurt them, it is a big mess. And superman is basically God's fist, and I mean the Abrahamic, "all your gods are my sexy little bitches" God.

In DBS the god forms are the new super sayajin whatever with no truly discernible challenge, is like an RPG.

>>94066013
>look my ass pull strength counters another ass pull strength

>>94065419
>mental blocks
hahaha oh wow

>>94066093
>Look, my demonstrated feats outdo your guy's feats

Yeah that's how you win the argument.

>>94066111
There's a reason no one looks back favorably on John Byrne's run. He also took away Krypto.

>>94066130
>muh feats, muh inconsistent fears
>I'm winning

Stands to reason that Goku has a chance since Beerus actually got roughed up while fighting him and Superman would similarly get btfo by Beerus

>>94066093
Don't get mad. You haven't actually read the comic right? You don't know the actual context of that fight. He's just fucking with you.

>>94065556
Gaara is hundreds of times stronger than any character in avatar and can move at speeds near sound if not faster he can also move hundreds of tons of sand at incredible speeds there is no way Toph could have won

>>94066186
What was the context?

>>94066186
>u mad
ok bruh

In the comics Goku would lose

In DB Goku would win

Just because of how the respective universes work

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>>94066154
>Muh inconsistent fears

Freudian slip?

Do you fear Superman?

>>94066254
or a cigar is just a cigar and you fear something that can come beat your super asspull

>>94065995
Dante's amazing, but I don't think he'd be able to keep up with Superman or Goku. Maybe God/Devilhand Gene or the Asura could do it

Perfect Cell vs Superman would be a better fight.

Cell handed Goku's ass to him.

>>94066192
Don't remember agility feats in the anime besides travelling. Not really his style. I think they assumed Toph could handle a sand coffin, and thats all she really needs to handle because the entire point of gaara's aoe is to set up a sand coffin finisher.

>>94064674
>>94064802
That's not how Superman's magic weakness works. It's not that one specific kind of supernatural power weakens him like kryptonite. He has extreme resistance to physical force, but that doesn't apply to things other than physical damage, like transformations and mind control. It's not that attacks will cause more damage if they're powered by magic, it's that if his durability is irrelevant he doesn't have any special anti-magic defense to protect him.

>>94066324
Dante in devil trigger could keep up with Superman and actually wound him because of magical properties

>>94065536
to be fair all dox men are aroused by anyone stronger than them, brainy lusting after the super d is perfectly natural

look at vril and stealth

I think as a super villian and I think ways how to kill Goku after extensively watching Super and Z, one thing Superman or any character with his archetype do, is to hold Goku and submerge him in to lava, and if possible try to fight him there, his ki shield wont hold up and he would have to breathe ( he is shown to need air after a few minutes no character in and no DB can survive lava with their own body not using a ki shield) the other one would be throwing him to the sun, every character in dragon ball that has been thrown int to the sun has died even physically (read non-ki defences) thought ones like cooler, but this will only apply to superman.

In the end Superman will use brute strength and close range combat to counter Goku blasts, holds in dragonball are very effective to.

https://youtu.be/sFi_RzsKajA


Dante is like demon wonder woman but with way more weapons, powers and plot armor

>>94064753
Hypernova Kirby can.

>>94066377

in depends strongly on what the magic spell can actually do.

>>94066342

Cell is indeed the most physically tenacious of all DBZ charcters probably the only one able to submerge in lava and withstand the sun surface's for several hours.

>>94066471
hypernova needs a super fruit right?

>>94064266
Only if you're a retard. He wasn't arguing with you, he was pointing out that you're a fucking moron.

>>94066034

Dude, every time a Japanese manga speaks that is "faster than light" it is a form of saying "very fast" as in figurative speech. when they fly to whatever place DB characters take several minutes, even up to boo saga.

>>94066542
nice damage control

>>94066478
Yeah, it does. If the magic spell hits him with the force of TEN BILLION TONS or tries to burn him, his normal resistance comes into play. If the magic transforms his brain into literal spaghetti through transformation, he just dies.

>>94059438
I stopped watching Death Battle. There information for using these things is pretty much shit tier.

>>94066505
Yeah, and they gave him one. He had it stored inside of him, Squeak Squad style.

>>94066648
so he cheats, he uses an item to win, that's bull shit.

>>94066377
Are you implying that the thing he learned watching gods of destruction, namely "I hold my hand at you. You die. No questions asked, deleted from existence." (Which he did use in the manga at least) counts as physical damage?
What about the aforementioned containment ability that locks people into bottles? Is that physical damage?
And if all these come from the same source, then is the Kamehameha really just a physical hit?

You're basically pointing at a guy who fought devils and magic aliens screaming at the top of his lungs to produce a beam of light, and saying "Yeah, nah that's basically just a laser or something." even though the same stuff it's made of can do anything between healing the sick, teleporting you across the universe, and reading minds.

>>94062981
Nothing. They ruin everything.

>>94059438
They're wrong a lot.
>cites Superman as having infinite power
>uses all star superman as a source
>says goku is weak to things he isn't
>gaara would lose to Toph

Superman would still win

>>94063181
This guy is an idiot.

>>94066840
>great damage control

>>94066034
>FTL
>DB

The only line talking about FTL in all of Dragonball is instant teleportation.

The rest were translations.

Raditz for example. Piccolo mentions the attack was undodgeable because he meant it to kill Goku and thus used his speed's upper limit for his technique. Raditz was just faster.

Frieza's finger beams were considered FTL in the dub but the manga just comments how they weren't fast enough to react to them which was a comment more on Frieza than the actual feat.

SSJ Gotenks was the next chapter where they mentioned speed as a thing and had a proper feat and he simply flew round the world in under 30 minutes and defused after he challenged Buu. That means he's way slower than the speed of light and Piccolo commented on how he'd not felt a power like it before, so he was at least as strong as Buu or Goku, meaning their base speeds aren't much higher, if at all.

FTL motion would mean that every Z fighter post Raditz would be fighting battles over the distance of a planet with every motion. The only instance of that in ANY DB franchise was Goku vs Super 17 when a single attack launched them both across the radius of the planet and they began fighting at that range.

Even Beerus vs Goku took place around the same area they began.

I'm a DB fag over a Superman fag but people need to stop assuming DB operates at the levels it does and using shitty ass dubs for the source material.

>>94066597
0/10

>>94066924
nice bait

>>94066367
The average named Naruto character has greater agility and strength feats than anyone in avatar

Also the amount of sand and the speed at which he controls it far surpasses anything she has ever done in

>>94066872
You are obviously not a DBfags anon. Please just go back. Goku right now is FTL++. Actually he is faster than time right now with SSB+kaioken.

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How strong would Guy and Rock Lee be in the Dragonball Universe? They would easily be the strongest humans right, and DB ki rules would let them go eight gates without killing themselves

Remember Guy would have beaten fully powered Madara easily had Madara not had regeneration powers

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>>94067823
>the strongest humans

There is only one.

>>94063854
Dude, Goku can't sense all forms of Ki or energy. The furry dudes from Universe 9 had Ki, but Goku couldn't sense them at all.

>>94067823
Krillin could solo the Narutoverse

>>94069771
They were purposefully masking or hiding their ki. Superman wouldn't know how to do this, even an accomplished user of ki like Vegeta had never heard of doing this until he fought on Earth.

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They are now

>>94066194
Not that guy, but during that fight a guy called Alexander Luthor was fucking with reality which causes Earth 2 to come back. Superman's feat of fighting Earth 2 Superman and both punching each other so hard they could alter timelines is basically something that happened because reality was already fucked. That being said, Superman is still physically stronger than Goku.

>>94069841
Except they weren't. Before the tournament of power, Goku commented how he couldn't sense their Ki at all. Even characters on U7 that hid their Ki showed some trace of energy. The furry trio didn't, which is why they had to rely on their sense to fight them.

>>94070148
Which means they have a more advanced ki-masking technique, most likely.

>>94062896
Seriously. He nearly killed the multiverse out of his retarded need to fight.

>>94070270
Zeno was going to do it anyways now the universes have a chance to survive.

>>94070024
It's been awhile since I've read Infinite Crisis but all Alex did was bring the multiverse back for a little while. The Supermen punching each other into each other's lives was something their strength accomplished, it wasn't as if other people were spontaneously porting from Earth to Earth.

I could be wrong though.

>>94070024
Actually it was before Luthor started messing with reality.

Superman's narration actually states that the force of their punches are causing the problems with reality.

>>94059609
Can we talk about how darkseid was literally melkor

>>94063984
Supes didn't really lobotomize him, just bruised his brain a bit.

>>94064025
>Not doomguy vs haloguy

>>94066872

One of the most retarded things in the original dragonball that fans ( not the anime nor manga itself) say is that they move FTL because people cant see them, the eye can lose track of things moving far, far slower than light, the hand is indeed faster than the eye in the end...

We all know people just love dragonball and their fanatism blinds them, even if you hate superman you must admit, fighting him is impossible, Dragonball multiverse is to small, OUR real universe is incomprehensibly huge, even characters like superman would barely affect it.

>>94070432
I think Grant even called Darkseid the Morgoth of DC.

>>94070550
Wonder Woman vs Rogue will never not piss me off. Of all their fights that's the one I'm saltiest about.

Having the reason be "because Diana doesn't wear a lot of clothes" was one of the most retarded reasons they've ever given.

>>94066600

Yeah.. that's what I say, and spell that burns people will do nothing to superman but an spell that transforms him in a cat will make him a super can and a spell that transforms him in to a city will convert him in to a fucking.

That is the point of magic.

Depends on the versions.

Golden Age: Goku one shots
Silver Age: Superman one shots
Pre-Crisis: Toughy
Post Crisis: Depends one the versions with-in this time frame. But overall Goku wins, with difficulty.
New52/Rebirth: This is were their more evenly matched. And here is where I think Supes would win, but with difficulty.

>>94070815
Pre-Crisis was literally just Silver Age with the added bonus of that Bronze Age feat where he survives the big bang hitting him in the face.

I agree with you on the rest though.

>>94070815
This

The problem is people take peak superman in all continuities snd put him against goku which is stupid

Some continuities he gets whooped and others he walks pver Goku. Current Superman is pretty evenly matched with a slight edge, and Goku is currently at his peak

>>94063413
not all heat visions are laser vision but all laser visions are heat vision

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>>94069907
Nope. Omega Effect = Hakai. Superman can survive the Omega Effect, therefore he can survive Hakai.

Yes, head over r/whowouldwin

>>94071306
https://youtu.be/4opiAShgmZI

I wonderif Goku's Hakai is weaker, since Beerus can literally destroy invulnerable beings with it

>>94070432
>>94070588
It's not unoriginality, it's just the hypercrisis

>>94071519
That Zamasu wasn't immortal.
When Beerus Hakai'd him, it created another timeline where he wasn't Hakai'd and went on to be Goku Black.

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Could Superman beat King?

>>94063180
He's gotta cook in the heart of the sun for like 1000 years to get to that level

>>94059880
to be fair, DB power levels became inconsistent as fuck too as the series progressed ie vegeta blowing up a planet easily before reaching earth yet not having that same power as a super saiyan.

>>94071535
Unoriginal or not I am more than okay with Darkseid being the DC's Morgoth.

>>94071649
It's not much of stretch for Vegeta from the Saiyan Saga to be able to blow up a planet since Roshi blew up the moon, and the gap between them is vast.
What is bullshit is Goku being able to deliver punches that send out shockwaves and destroy planets, but having a hard time phasing a guy made of iron.

>>94071545
You got the timeline wrong.

>Two timelines because Trunks fucks with time, A is "our" timeline, B is BAD END, where Trunks is the only hero left
>Timeline A Zimzam flimflams with the timeline
>Goes to Timeline B
>"Get in, Faggot. We gonna make some Justice"es himself in Timeline B
>Together they fuck up Timeline B even more
>Trunks goes to Timeline A to get help, getting attention from the gods
>Top Cat kills Timeline A Zamasu, changing Timeline A so it's nice
>This doesn't create a new timeline, because instead of a juryrigged time machine that the gods complain about Trunks using, they used magic rings that were specifically made to change time and travel in it
Basically, Timeline A Zamasu's entire version of Timeline A ceased to exist. It doesn't exist as an alternate, it just never happened.
The only reason he's around, even though he's also dead, is because he had the Magic (i.e.: I ain't gotta explain shit) ring that lets him do whatever the hell he wants with time

>>94066034
>Goku is like a thousand times ftl
Except he has no provable feats of light speed, let alone FTL.
>plus he can teleport
Which by definition is not speed. Speed is a measurement of time and distance, with teleporting there is no time.

>>94066168
See >>94059609

>>94067052
>The average named Naruto character
This happens every time. Someone says Gaara is fast, someone else asks for feat of peed, and the weeb starts talking about Naruto characters in general because there are no speed feat for Gaara.

>>94066686
You have heard of Darkseid, right?

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>>94073537
Self-reply, ignore my entire post. I give up, Toriyama's time travel makes no fucking sense.
First it establishes that the only reason Zamasu is still around is because of the ring, then apparently later Whis says Zamasu's original version of the universe exists still?
And it was created when he killed Zamasu, instead when Trunks came back in time and went on to tell everyone about Zamasu, thus being the original point where things started to diverge?

I'm confused.

>>94070550
I never played Halo so I couldn't speak to that one.

>>94070575
One of my favorite things to do in the jewtube comments for DB is find weeb who say this, then explain to them what subsonic bullets are.

>>94071223
>people take peak superman in all continuities
Literally no one does this.

>Kazekage Gaara vs Toph
>Toph wins
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA no

>>94071599
Follow the post chain, "if they waited for Goku to blah blah" Well, that's what you get when you give Superman time.

>>94071649
Filler, never happened.

>Universe shattering punches
>No wind
>People around doesn't desintegrate
>Closest planet (Earth) barely has a small tremble
DB is inconsistent as fuck on top of being a dick towards anyone who isn't Goku

>Seth the programmer making video after video trying to "debunk" this
That guy is such a loser.

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>>94073732
>there are no speed feat for Gaara.

In comparison to other characters in the series you are right he does not have any feats of speed but the general speed of Naruto characters is at least three times that of any avatar character

Also in his fight in with his dad(the fight where Gaara's mother manifests in his sand) he moves faster than any character in ATLA

And his control over sand is much greater than Toph's pic related

>>94073732
He beat a guy that moves at the speed of sound, you need moore? He then beats a guy who moves faster than the guy who moves at the speed of sound.

>>94059438
Yes. Goku could destroy Supes from existence if he wants

>>94059609
Hakai

Supes is dead

>>94063638
I'm sure Supes would like a nice warm cup of Hakai.

>>94074580
>>94074729
>>94074811
take your (you)

Superman is written both inconsistently and without any concern for long term effects. He's basically just a living plot device, so no, I'd say he'd still "win," in that sense.

What they did get wrong are a bunch of details and factors involved in trying to assign math to Goku's power set. Which I mention because when they go back to Dragonball characters, for some reason they keep reusing their old math to reinforce stupid notions about power scaling. Which they did again recently with 18 vs Captain Marvel. The most obvious error from that is hinging the whole fight on 18 being able to absorb energy, which she was stated not only to not possess, but they gave her one of 17's abilities which also is not stated to absorb energy, only act as a barrier.

They generally seem to have a history of focusing on the wrong things, completely ignoring details they don't like, and sometimes outright fabricating information based on flimsy evidence. The earliest time I started noticing that was that Gaara vs Toph fight. I had no investment in it, but it remember being baffled at their interpretation of their abilities.

If you've ever watched their podcasts, you get the impression they're just a bunch of half-witted chucklefucks. Ever so often one of them might get autistic and spend a day doing incorrect math analyzing a single feat the original writer wrote in 2 minutes, but that's as deep as it goes.

>>94066872
Goku is faster than time

>>94067823
Depends on the fight. Dragonball isn't written consistently, and the feats haven't changed much since the original series through Super. They're stated to be capable of destroying universes at this point, but we honestly never see much more than mountains getting blown up, barring someone intentionally destroying a planet here or there.

That said, if Roshi can blow up the moon a few episodes into Dragonball, I can't imagine anyone from Naruto being able to deal with them. Although it's played for comedy, they can also move so fast the human eye can't track them.

>>94074899
take your hakai

>>94059880
>>94060192
>>94062304
That's the thing with this argument
It's relatively easy to measure gokus power since he one official series (the original show, z and super) with and the same writer from beginning to end
Superman however, he has countless different stories of him and there are countless versions of him having dozens of writers over the years so it's hard to decide how physically strong he should be and powers he will have in the fight

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As an actual comic nerd:

Logically, Goku at his current power level would wipe the floor with Superman, as well as any other fucking faggot in that power class.

The NO LIMITS meme makes no sense and is objectively untrue.

>>94064025
>Forgetting Yang vs Tifa.

>>94067924
His fucking baby hands always get me.

>>94059438
Of fucking course they were, but /co/ will never admit this.
The big issue is that Goku's speed is the big issue here and there's not really good quantification for that. Logically speaking, if you keep consistent with the scale of escalation in Dragon Ball Goku SHOULD be FTL by now, but the issue is that DBZ, and especially DBS are super inconsistent with Goku's powerlevels. We DO know that he's been able to blow up the planet since at least Namek if not earlier, but speed translations are different.
Meanwhile comic writers are ridiculously OCD with quantifying character stats, even if those stats are plainly absurd (A T T O S E C O N D), which means that we have more stats with Superman. Problem is that Superman is also really fucking inconsistent over his history.
In their modern incarnations Goku sweeps Superman, obviously, unless Goku is especially retarded (even for his standards) or Superman comes up with either a clever technique or one of his attacks happens to cleave right through him (which none should be able to, except when the plot dictates it should).
/co/ will never admit this because /co/ doesn't like admitting that anime could possibly beat comics/cartoons at anything.

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>>94075115
>>94075447
Go take your daily dose

>>94075679
And remember to take your dose of hakai

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>>94075447
>As an actual comic nerd:

As an actual nerd you would know that there are numerous versions of Superman with greater feats of speed strength and durability than Goku could ever match

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I like that nerds keep arguing about this although the PLs don't mean squat. Both characters are as strong as they need to be to satisfy the requirements of their respective plots. SSJSSG Gokou is strong, is he as strong as the new fully powered Rebirth Superman? What about Superman Prime? Blah blah blah

These arguments always end the same way, lots of moving the goalposts and fans of the respective franchises disagreeing no matter what points are made.

Superman and Gokou probably wouldn't even fight because Superman does not have the desire to prove himself in combat like Gokou, nor does he particularly even enjoy using violence in place of diplomacy. Gokou would see that and probably decide Supes wouldn't give 100 percent, so what would be the point or fighting?

>>94075678
>Superman is also really fucking inconsistent over his history.

So is Goku that's why you use their greatest feats of speed strength durability and so on to approximate what they are capable of and if you do that for both characters superman will always come out on top

>>94075714
That's the problem though. Supes gets the god treatment whenever he's in a team book, but in his solo shit, he's shown as FAR weaker, slower, etc.
So what do you go by?

Also, I
There's characters like the flash (infinite mass punch and runs faster tha n time) and green lantern (create anything he can imagine from energy with his magic bullshit ring) who could logically slaughter everyone else with their powers,yet are relegated to comic relief in team books.

Lastly, superman is only super under or near a yellow sun. Goku grabs him and teleports somewhere without one, and he's dead. Period. And then there's the whole kryptonite thing.

Superman is such a snowflake that he HAS to have just the right conditions to be superman at all someone like Thor could kill him in the right circumstances. So all this"superman vs" bullshit is totally pointless in the end, since he's basically super here and nowhere else.
Goku is godly wherever he goes. Sorry

>>94074165
The dude is obsessed with Death Battle. It's sad.

>>94075929
>Goku can just teleport Superman somewhere without a Yellow sun.

This meme needs to end. Not only would Goku not know about Superman's power source, but even if he did, he wouldn't be able to teleport Superman to a Red sun because Goku has no scholarly knowledge. Hell, he most likely wouldn't know the location of a red sun even if he did have a diploma.

>>94059438
Yep.

Goku can teleport as a beam of light, can move faster than anyone can see on the ground before even turning super sayan has destructive power greater than all nukes in the world combined (times a trillion) and newtonian physics dictates that if he can assert that force, he can withstand it.

Superman is indeed shown to be stronger and a faster flyer, but is only super near a yellow sun and is depicted as being weakened by ONE nuke. Not to mention wonder woman beat him.

So all goku has to do is teleport him somewhere with no yellow sun, or hit him with one ki blast. Or punch him as hard as he can and superman is out.

Even if he stays near a yellow sun and keeps his invincibility, goku can still knock him out.
See, when your brain gets rattled, you pass out. Even an indestructable brain, rattles around insde an indestructible skull, and you're out.
Force man not harm superman but it can move him. Especially force as strong as goku.

Goku wins anything but a space fight or a fight in the air. And since he beats enemies 100x stronger than him, I doubt he'd willingly fight somewhere he'd have a major disadvantage like that.

>>94075929
>. Goku grabs him and teleports somewhere without one, and he's dead.

Superman still has his powers for a few hours after he leaves the yellow sun so all he would have to do is fly back to one and since he has been shown to move faster than instant that's no problem for him

Goku's powers are incredibly inconsistent and he's almost never shown to be able to do the things that he stated to be capable of

But that shouldn't matter because in a death battle you find a character's greatest feats of strength speed durability and so on than you measure them up against each other

and if you do that for both characters superman will always come out on top. Period.

>>94076177
see here >>94076224
and here>>94076123

>>94075678
Superman and goku have equal plot armor. Goku beats guys a hundred times stronger than him because he's mad, while superman is suddenly able to sing holes in reality out of nowhere when he needs to. It's ALL bullshit. That said goku is regularly shown to defeat enemies he's totally outclassed by while superman generally struggles with people as strong as himself. So I bet on goku.

Still bullshit though.