Ultimatum

>>92991296
I'd say it definitely helped kill the line. After that it didn't seem like the Ultimate line ever reached their heyday again.

>>92991330
False, Hickman's Ultimates even with the poor resolution is everybit as good as Ultimates 1-2.

It only effected the line badly because fans are adverse to shake ups/change & trying risky things despite that being the entire fucking point of the Ultimate line.

>>92991352
Which is why I liked it.
I honestly enjoy Ultimatum and almost all of the Ultimate Universe.

It's remembered as one of the worst comic events ever

>>92991368
That's not an effect, fuckwit.

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>>92991296
Nothing

>>92991342
It was definitely better but by that point people had lost interest and not enough were picking it up.

>>92991352
Ultimate Marvel was initially change-based, and dead-is-dead writ large. However, the changes that Ultimatum introduced were mostly legitimately shock value deaths. I mean, realistically, 90% of the active superfolk died in that event. It limited the line pretty severely.

>>92991296
It definitely killed the line.

It was essentially a bomb that demolished all ongoing storylines. The Ultimates line was already going in interesting places, then Ultimatum came along and decided it wasn't interesting enough or something.

People sometimes say it was good because it did what the Ultimate line was supposed to do - be able to change things with permanency - but it did this in the most retarded way possible. Instead of stories resolving naturally, Ultimatum just came in and wrecked them. Instead of characters getting their arcs and concluding, Ultimatum basically just made a show out of brutalizing them aside. The entire story was just the Loeb going through a checklist of characters he wanted to get rid of and disposing of them one after the other, with no real buildup or emotional weight to any of it, just lots of hollow gore.

People were invested in the stories that were running at the time and wanted to see how they'd develop and conclude. I think after Ultimatum people lost faith in the line's ability to do that without editorial coming in to make BOLD DRASTIC CHANGES that shit everything up for gimmicky reasons every now and then. In that regard it became just like the main line, only with more blood and swearing.

>>92991352
There's a difference between shake-ups and badly written comic books.

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>>92991296
>in a universe with a rule that all deaths are permanent (even though gwen, cap, thor, valkyrie cheated)
>kill half the heroes and villains with barely any build up or reasoning
>characters basically appearing for a page to either die or already shown as being dead
>loeb and millar take over and bendis shuffles off and does his own thing
>most comics are delayed for various reasons
>"new" characters are just rehashes of dead characters such as kid daredevil and a couple of hulks
>hickman comes in and almost saves it but gets whisked away to 616 f4 and humphries shits the bed
>entire universe is dying in more ways than one
>everyone thinks cataclysm is the end, it's not, but it should've been
>marvel obviously doesn't give a shit anymore as literal who's are given writing and art assignments for the comics leading to laughable sales
>secret wars happens and the only thing worth saving is miles (bendis and normie cred)

Ultimatum is not just the worst event in history, it's the worst COMIC in history. Show me a comic that screwed over a dozen comics and put an entire universe of characters on life support.

>>92991352
This sounds like damage control.

>>92991296
They decided to have Bendis mastermind events from that point on.

>>92991352
It effected the line so badly because it slaughtered half of its characters for no reason at all you dumbass.

>>92991296
as others have noted it started a slow and painful demise for not only the imprint but for the entire universe, as it killed off most of the super population

reminds me a bit of how the last couple comics for Marvel Mangaverse screwed the pooch by similarly killing off most of it's roster for cheap shock value(kinda telling that when Mangaverse Spider-Man showed up in Spiderverse they heavily hinted that a large portion of the comics for that imprint past the initial set were being ignored)

>>92991473
well I'd argue Deathmate was similarly bad for what it did to Valiant Comics back in the 90's

>>92991503

It depends if Valiant was more popular than Ultimate Marvel was.

The answer is no.

>>92991400
>>92991494
That was the point to force them to use lesser know characters.
The only major characters killed was Xavier, Magneto, Hank Pym & Wolverine.

>>92991296
>and the comic book industry as a whole?
Only if you consider they decided to throw the leftovers at regular Marvel. Otherwise, not much, that universe was edgy shit from the start, so not a lot of surprises for readers.

Reached a new low of writing quality?
Destroyed plot lines with potential that could've led somewhere interesting?
Soured people on the UU by being just that bad that you don't want to read a single comic from that universe? (didn't help that most of them were actually bad)
Butchered characters people loved (sometimes that didn't mean kill them, right Ben Grimm?)

>>92991662
>Wasp
>Beast
>Angel
>Cyclops
>Dazzler
>Nightcrawler

>>92992770
Also Daredevil, Doctor Strange, Forge, Emma Frost, Sunspot, Longshot, Polaris, Cannonball, Psylocke, Lorelei...

So much for using lesser known characters.

>>92992770
>Doom
Yeah, yeah, I know that Fialkov retconned it years later in a book read only by me + 2 anons and a half because he was smart enough to understand how retarded everything about that scene was.
Doesn't undo Loeb's intent and lack of research.

>>92992770
>>92991729
>>92994365
Ultimatum was a great Idea with terrible execution. If it killed maybe half the characters it did, left a few others in critical condition, and removed the scenes that were clearly there solely for shock value (like OP), it would likely have been better received and more productive for Ultimate Marvel.

I'm still salty about Pyro.

>>92994441
>another Pyrofag
Noice.
Though it was in Ultimates 3, but they're the same kind of badly-written, badly-researched shitfest written by the same person so I don't blame you for getting them mixed up.