did he really deserve to pass or was edna just feeling sorry for him?

Yes, he deserved to pass. Look, Bart is a troubled kid. His father's a drunk jackass, his mother doesn't understand him and his younger sister shows remarkably more potential than he does. But in when it came down to goofing off or studying, he chose to study, something he proved to Edna by citing historical knowledge. He did his best and Edna made the right call passing him.

>>92730232
but you dont argue with a test
thats why there are tests

>>92730232
Also, the american grading system is fucked up and design to punish anything below a 70%; it would have been a middling passing grade in other parts of the world.

The applied knowledge reasoning Edna used here is valid; coupled with the above all she did was just nudge his grade into passing --barely-- by one point which would have been easily justified if she was ever called on it. It's not like she let him ace the test forthe reference.

>>92729998
He had proven that he actually knew the information, rather than just what the test needed, so yes, he deserved to pass.

That terror of failure and pure joy of success, provided this was a show that kept character growth, would have stayed with him, proving that he can and would be able to do well in life.
It's just a shame that The Simpsons chooses to ignore essentially everything.

>>92730451
It's more that until pretty recently television programs, and sitcoms/prime time shows especially, weren't really given any leeway in terms of allowing major character growth or plot development beyond brief interludes like a character (or worse the actor playing them,) dies. Fox always made demands of the show (ISTR that there were specifically told to make Grandpa Simpson more of a joke character and they kept badgering them to do less emotional episodes and stick to jokes, for example) and coupled with the fact that alot of chances to develop or characters who initiated change were self contained in the episode they appear in. Guest characters especially hurt Simpsons plot growth because they never fucking come back or in Mother Simpson's case, eventually die.

>>92730690
Kinda sad. Bart hoped to avoid repeating 4th grade and he's been there almost 3 decades.

>>92730435

>Also, the american grading system is fucked up and design to punish anything below a 70%; it would have been a middling passing grade in other parts of the world.

american here, explain

>>92730819
not that anon, but in australia getting 60% on a test is a pass. Sometimes you can go as low as 55. scoring better than a pass is called a 'credit' as in 'you're a credit to your class', above that is a distinction, and 90-100 is a high distinction.

You have to know less than half the content to actually fail

>>92730819
Uh... well, in general anything from 94-100 = A, 86-93 B, 78-85= C, and 70-77 = D. 69 or lower = F. TMK other countries are a bit more lenient and use a more forgiving scale--I can't recall the exact numbers but you are at least in the clear if you get 60 or higher.

>>92731016
We do that here.

>>92731016
what the fuck kind of shit school did you go to. every place i was at school, and taught at had everything graded in increments of 10% with anything 59% and below being fails

>>92729998
I think he deserved to pass because he made significant effort, on his own, with no support, to pass. Perhaps she should have had some strings attached "I want to see more improvement on the next test, you need to be tutored,"

>>92731016
>>92731256
Canada here. 50% was a pass in my schools. Often, if you got higher than a 45 but less than 50, teachers would round up your grade.

>>92729998
Both.

I was a dumb kid in school and tried hard at time as well so this episode really hurt. I don't know if he deserved to pass though but i dont think he deserved to fail either

>>92731256
South Carolina schools from roughly 88' to 00'. I got the impression relative kids in different states had the same system. Much like Lisa Simpson though, I refused to be a Gamecock in the end.

At least it's not as retarded as a grade curve. I don't even know why people support those things. I get it's to show competiveness and where they lie in relation to others. But it doesn't give any indication of ability matched to an absolute datum.
>Sorry Billy, you scored 99% on the test, but since the others got 100% you fail.
>Congratulations Billy. You got 60% on the test. That means you get an A+ since the others got 20-30%.
>now that grade will be stuck with you forever even though the next group to take the test will reset the score all over again and could get the same grade with wildly different scores.

>>92730425

> I never experienced """education""" as it existed before 1990

ftfy

Tests are bogus and not a good way to judge ability or knowledge

>>92731449
Yea. In Canada 50% you get your credit/pass

>All these people defending this shitty episode
>All these Canadians and Americans talking about their griding systems

No wonder your countries are so shit lmao

>>92732070
nah it's the only way too. I could understand if you said "multiple choice tests" or "standerized testing has problems" but just "tests don't work" is incorrect

>>92730451
it's a show that resets every episode, so of course it wouldn't stick.

>>92731016
Doesn't it work out to be more or less the same though? Like, someone scoring 90%-ish in America would probably be getting closer to 70% elsewhere?

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>people always talk about this scene as the most relatable part of the episode
>not how bart falls asleep studying and his parents walk in afterwards gushing over how hard he must push himself

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This was a touching episode, even though I can't relate because I'M an INTELLECTUAL

>>92731973
Usually when a teacher says they're "grading on a curve", they're actually grading on a sliding scale, meaning whomever got the highest score gets a 100 and everyone else gets their score shifted by the same amount.

>>92729998
Yes.

The inherent issue with tests is that they don't necessarily test you on knowledge, but instead memory. Bart wasn't just regurgitating something he was told, he was saying things he learned through reading and paying attention. He did exactly what he was told to, which was learn intricate nformation from the textbooks.

>>92731973
For a large enough class grade curves make sense. The probability that ALL of your classmates being brilliant/retarded drops away as the class gets bigger, and you're left with the average grade being a reasonable measure of how hard the test was.

>>92734452
*information

Think of it this way: If you tested someone on their guitar skills after their first attempt at putting forth effort, their skills are still going to be a fail, but their effort ensures they keep going.

Bart never tried before. He doesn't have proper studying skills (as shown by that episode) so even though he put his best effort forward he probably didn't know how to study so he'd actually retain that information.

Thus, the effort is rewarded instead because he needed that push so he wouldn't give up for the rest of his life.

For the record i'm from NY and 65 and above is a passing grade here. So if you got a 65 on every test, you'd pass the class, but by the skin of your teeth (How often you do homework and attendance, as well as participation grades way more on your overall grade than just tests).
You can actually fail every test at my high school and as long as you did every homework assignment (even if you failed all of those) you'll still pass.

I think it's a dumb way of going about it if we actually want to educate our country.

And this is all in a state with standardized testing too so i'm actually surprised at how easy it is to breeze through school (I only flunked out of high school due to lack of attendance, but my school even paid for my GED as long as i went to the classes so i just got out of school a year early really)

>>92729998
Well he demonstrated how he knew the information and how it related to his situation instead of just regurgitating facts. That should count for something

>>92734579
why did you leave?

>>92730435
>it would have been a middling passing grade in other parts of the world
I know right? Expecting a person to know the material.
>>92730232
He studied the day before the test (a day that should have been test day, but he got lucky), and didn't study for any of the other ones.

The fact people will take pity on stupid (not troubled, not struggling, not differently gifted, STUPID) kid is why shit doesn't get done anymore and it's basically why someone like Homer can get a safety inspector job at a Nuclear plant.

Put it in perspective.

>Should a 10 year old boy pass a test he was one mark away from passing, provided he showed extensive knowledge of the subject that wasn't tested but still part of the subject?

>>92734884
of course

>>92731973
Law student here, all our classes are on a curve. Sometimes they're nice, something's they aren't. It just depends.

>>92730435
Argie faggot here. In highschool you pass with a 7/10. Anything below that is a failure.
Still, the percentage isn't as important as the actual content of the tests.
The common American seems to be pretty damn illiterate and ignorant, from what I know. At least just on par with most halfway decent countries. So that 70% seems to be a pretty low bar anyway.

>>92735030
what makes you think those illiterates are high school graduates, or even GED holders

>>92734884
>one mark away from passing
10 marks away from acceptability, 20 marks away from subpar.

He failed, I don't know what responsibility-free world you grew up in but it sounds nice.

>>92735030

Another argie faggot here.
Dont pay attention to him. You pass with a 6/10 in almost every school.

And in college, you pass with a 4/10.

>>92729998

It's fucking grade school of course he deserves a pass. The thing is we saw him actually put in the effort. If Edna saw him she would've passed him anyway. Having him blurt out that information gave her the confirmation that he did try. For someone like Bart that was really what mattered, proving that he tried.

>>92735437
In college you do pass with 4. In highschool it's 7.
Of course, it doesn't mean anything because getting a 7 in highschool is easy as fuck.
Like I said, the percentage means nothing if the content is crap.

>>92735215
Right, I keep forgetting graduating from highschool isn't as mandatory as it is here.

>>92729998
Kids in grade school can pull a pretty big turnaround achievment wise just based on simple things. If status quo weren't god it's possible Bart might have become a competent (not good but decent enough)

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>>92729998
>tfw used to be a fuckup in school at Bart's age
>stopped hanging out with retards who would bully me
>jumped up 2 grade levels
Feels good

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>>92729998
he didn't deserve to pass the class. passing him on the test is fine, but there's no way someone who was making 12s on assignments had enough points to where making a 70 or a 60 (depending on what a D- was graded as) on the last exam would pass them for the class. that would mean his class average was hovering around 60 or 70 to begin with which is impossible given his established failing grades. at that low of a grade, there isn't a significant difference between a 68/58 and a 70/60 anyhow.

>>92730819

Back in the late 80s to early 90s, a 70% was seen as a C, not a D. A 90 was a B, and a 92+ was an A. The grading system was changed in order to make student scores look better and improve graduation numbers. They made it easier to get As and Bs, so suddenly you had more "smart" students. Having a higher minimum of 70% meant even the "average" student would have higher scores and improve test averages.

>>92731973

I'm certain the curve exists to make up for that fact that a lot of teachers/professors are awful at their jobs. If the professor makes a test that is so hard and confusing that only 20% of the class passes it, is it really the students' fault?

I had this chemistry professor in college who taught graduate level science to people in Chem 101. Our TA was confused as to why this intro course was covering some topics that he himself as a graduate level chemistry student had barely covered.

>>92729998
Teachers are normally allowed to adjust someone's grade if they show sufficient knowledge of the subject while discussing the reasons why they failed. Had it happen to me once got 78% (min pass mark was 80) after going through the test and explaining my answers I ended up with 96%

>>92729998

He didn't deserve to pass, but this is the American education system we are talking about here. Spending $10k+ a year just to have him repeat a grade is not feasible. A lot of students get to pass because it's just cheaper that way.

>>92736057
You should look at the IB system where a 3/7 is considered equivalent to a D because 7/7 equals 100%.

>>92736204
I was under the impression that public schools where free or atleast heavily subsidised

>>92735870
>but there's no way someone who was making 12s on assignments had enough points to where making a 70 or a 60 (depending on what a D- was graded as) on the last exam would pass them for the class.

I had a few college classes allow for this. Your grade on the final exam could replace your overall grade if it was higher. So if you could manage to get an 80 on the final, but had a 25 average overall, you would get an 80 as your final grade.

>>92734296
it does

>>92730232
>Edna made the right call passing him.
In modern America, she would have been forced to pass him regardless of how he did on the test. He wouldn't even have needed to study.

American education is a fucking joke.

>>92736234
The government pays which is what they meant

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>>92730788

fuck

>>92731973
>>Sorry Billy, you scored 99% on the test, but since the others got 100% you fail.
I have never seen a curve bring scores down. they're only there when the professor makes the tests too hard for the class

>>92729998
In today's school system, the districts get money based on pass rates. Edna was thinking about getting new textbooks and not having to deal with Bart for another year

>>92734459
It still doesn't make sense, because grading on a bell curve mandates that a portion of the class would have to fail. It totally invalidates the point of the test evaluating you on the subject matter.

>>92737429
>>92730788
this is clearly the last episode of the series, it was just broadcasted very early on

>elementary school
>fully orchestral school band in music class
Is this how they do it in America? In Canada you might have a band or not in high school and elementary school is primarily music theory and choir.

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>>92737679
I went to a highschool in Ausfagland and let me tell you they try so fucking hard to copy the yanks

>Highschool band was nothing but sodding clarinet players and one bird on double-bass

>Dance performances were always done to that one Fat man scoop song

>No SAT's but TEE's which I think TEE stuff is irrelevant now or something

I heard kids were legit killing themselves over TEE grading/testing as well, man fuck