Starfire Thread

>>92585481
I think she has the potential to be a B-Lister or A-Lister if DC would let her have her own solo series again and stop putting her on team books .

>>92585646

they did and no one brought it.

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>>92585481
If they keep pushing her she could become A-tier .

>>92585646
You're way too liberal with that. B-lister, maybe. But A-lister? not a single members of the TT has that potential

>>92585481
>writers don't know what to do with her anymore
see, that's the main problem.
because if you write her as anything but her animated counterpart people get upset and then she gets shelved for other characters to get the spot light.

>>92585481
Some characters are just better in a team. The best way to raise her profile is to just raise her team's profile while maintaining her importance to said team. I'd play up her alien background and have her people try to commit some fuckery outside of Earth. Give her and the Titans some space adventures outside of the usual Green Lantern stories.

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>>92586808
I liked her cartoon version, but I get what you mean.
Personality wise, I really liked how she was portrayed in the Judas Contract movie. I wasn't a huge fan of the movie as a whole (though it was leagues beyond the first one), but Kori was handled well imo. She was naive in an endearing way, but still mature enough to lead the team, despite doubting her abilities. Also, she had that alien warrior princess angle that I wish they explored more in the animated series.

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>>92586625
to be fair, it didn't have much going for it outside of Luppachino's art. It was funny at times, but it wasn't anything groundbreaking. Not that it should have been, necessarily, but it isn't a surprise that it flopped

>>92586820
No, she needs to be separated from the lame, creatively stagnating Beast Boy/Raven/Cyborg/etc Titans and develop her own stories.

>>92585481
Nope, new teen titans are destined to be shit, being constantly deaged and lying in a pool of pics called the teen titans franchise. BB and Raven too. Cyborg would be a teenager again if it was for DC fans to decide.

She has potential to have a good solo so it's annoying that DC won't let her
Her only solo so far was mediocre even if it did sell okay, so that means that there IS interest in the character

>>92586625
Actually it was one of the better selling DCYou books

>>92586625
>>92587107
It was only planned for 12 issues, like Power Girl.

Thing is, I actually like Starfire being an idiot because it's tiresome to see every female character has to be this super intelligent girl power symbol. Yes, being stupid isn't a flattering characteristic, but it's more of a personality than Babs Batgirl, Carol Danvers, and Spider-Woman ever had combined.

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>>92585646
Team books are a good way to build up a character, develop their relationships with other characters and expand on their backstory and iconography. Problem is, the Titans are holding Kori back because most of the "traditional" TT members didn't get to grow into their own heroes like Nightwing or Wally, so sticking her on the team to literally babysit the youngsters means she is cut off from her own age group, more powerful villains and more wide-spanning stories that could build up her "cred".

I'd put her on REBELS again and send the whole team on an Annihilation type of space adventure that has far-reaching consequences to the DCU where she could play a role that's more important than "babysitting the Teen Titans and fighting against the mook of the month that will be forgotten within 6 months."

>>92585481
Starfire is already a B tier character when it comes to fans.

People outside of comics know her and like her cause of the cartoon, and wanted her in Injustice 2.
And her comic sales were solid B tier compared to the other DCYou books.

But in the comics she'll never reach B because they're too determined to keep her on TT.
She was good in REBELS and 52 so it's annoying how DC is determined to keep her in just TT.

She has potential, as do most of founding Titans and the founding NTT.

But because of status quo Batman and Superman and Wonder Woman will always have to be at the forefront, so the Titans are stuck in a weird limbo where they're too important to fit on Minor league teams like the Teen Titans but not important enough for the Major leagues, so paradoxically end up on sub-Minor league teams or "supervising" the Teen heroes.

>>92587249
She wasn't "stupid" in that, just unaccustomed to Earth's social cues and commonalities we take for granted.

Her old personality was fine. She wasn't smart or a genius like Power Girl or Barbara Gordon but she was headstrong and emotionally driven. Which would still make sense with the "fish out of water" in normal society. She was kind of like what people who don't know shit about Wonder Woman think Wonder Woman was like.

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>>92585481
>>92585481

She beat Constantine (who had a movie and a tv show) and Black Manta in a DLC poll for Injustice 2 she definitely has potential

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>>92587249
I enjoyed that run more than I expected to, actually. It fell short plot-wise for the most part, but that wasn't really its main focus. Even if I'm not a shipper, the Grayson team-up issue was cute.
>I actually like Starfire being an idiot because it's tiresome to see every female character has to be this super intelligent girl power symbol.
Yeah, same here. It's not like she was stupid, she was just naive and out of her depth. and that's fine.

>>92587200
>Teen Titans shouldn't be teenagers!

I think so. She had one of the better selling DCYou books.

Probably needs to go full cosmic though in the long run.

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PUT HER BACK IN A TEAM WITH PEERS OF HER OWN AGE GROUP

how can you fuck this up

>>92587467
That's not the point. It would be fine if the team expanded and changed (thus allowing new teen superheroes to develop), but no matter how much the roster rotates, it always comes back to the BB/Raven/Starfire formula by deaging them. They're not allowed to do anything outside of the Teen Titans (at least not for long).

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>>92586820
She went to space without the Titans, it was great and hasn't been mentioned since

>>92587387
>She wasn't "stupid" in that, just unaccustomed to Earth's social cues and commonalities we take for granted.

I think this made no sense considering she was still canonically on Earth for years and DCU alien life isn't that different anyway. Like she should understand the concept of currency.

Supergirl basically covered that same ground in her book and she wasn't retarded. I get Starfire is meant to be more comedic than that, but they went too far with it.

Keep her as a sluttily dressed action babe, that's also a sweet, devoted girlfriend to Dick.

That'll fire her up, popularity wise. Add a shot of dick's ass now and then to maintain a female audience as well.

>>92587543
DC cosmic in general has been ignored since Flashpoint.

>>92587518
They did that with the 2008 Titans book and it was awful

>>92587608
the current Titans book is good though, just put her on it

>>92587592
Pretty much yeah, which is a shame since it could be really cool and creative if DC actually did something with it that didn't involve a group of lanterns punching each other in the face.

>>92587036
>Also, she had that alien warrior princess angle that I wish they explored more in the animated series.
There was plenty of that in the cartoon, though. In fact, the origins episode made her practically indistinguishable in ferocity from the comics. And then there were the brutal Blackfire fights.

Y'all need to rewatch it.

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I've been trying to put together a list of recommended Kory comics. It's incomplete, but if anyone's interested, here:
https://pastebin.com/wzk1kbhk

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>>92587512
>Probably needs to go full cosmic though in the long run.
This. A character's staying power depends on their history, the quality of their stories and their relationships with other characters that creates a network that anchors them firmly into the DCU. Mediocre adventures on the sidekick team will never raise her status within the DCU.

>>92587811
Oh, I know, I rewatched the whole series last year. I just wish she had a few more episodes dedicated to her.

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>>92586767
Would be better if she got good stories to back up pushing her in other media.

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>>92588515
Where's the botom left one from?

>>92588653
One of the Batman Superman animated movies.

>>92588653
>>92588671
Public Enemies
She's just a cameo

>>92588760
>>92588671
Thanks!

Alright faggots, it's time to settle this once and for all:
www.strawpoll.me/13016174

DC doesn't give a shit about the Titans brand. So no character from that is ever going to become anything close to an A-list. Nightwing and Robin are only saved because they have the Batman brand to fall back on, and Deathstroke was moved into being a DCU villain rather than a Titans villain and broke away from them.

>>92587811

Blackfire episodes were always good.

It's a shame she never got her arc, like the writers wanted. They never got the chance to.

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>>92588924
I use both interchangeably.

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When are they reintroducing best sister?

They fucked her up horribly in nu52, but it seems like they're now enemies again, given how Starfire speaks of her.

>>92589129

I didn't like how the show changed the Tamaraneans into a brutal warrior culture where Starfire was the exception, rather than former warriors who became space hippies.

>>92589057
The writers couldn't think of an arc for Starfire.
Source: http://www.titanstower.com/five-seasons-of-murakanime/

>>92589268
should have been that one episode where blackfire controlled tamaran but expanded on to be a seasonal arc.

>>92585481
Kori has the potential, just like Vic does, just like Dick. DC is capitalizing on Dick, but Vic is getting closer to Marvel's Carol treatment than a legitimate push.

I'd probably start off with giving her a team-up book with Dick. This doesn't immediately throw her on the League, but it also doesn't doom her by immediately giving her a solo title. Let her build her rogues gallery there. If they don't want to make new characters, just ape the Teen Titans enemies that haven't been seen in forever. While I think her, Raven, and Garfield should be in Titans, have her maintain a leadership role there. I'm not sure if Percy is having her do that, but it's possible.

After the duo-book with Dick and team book with Damian and the other Teen Titans, I'd probably throw her in a Titans/JL crossover. One of the weirdest things about the Teen Titans is how very infrequently they interact with the Justice League. Starfire is basically a hotter alien Wonder Woman, but I can't recall the last time they interacted. Have her go cosmic or whatever. Throw her in GL or Supergirl for an arc. Establish her presence in the DCU rather than just a subset of it.

Once they've gotten her personality, rogues, and supporting cast down, give her an ongoing. At this point, she should be knowledgeable enough about Earth to the point where she's not as much of an airhead. Take some risks with it. I don't know who the equivalent of Dick's Seeley/King would be, but if they find that for Starfire (and aren't afraid to take risks), you could easily make an A-lister out of a character that's almost been around for 40 years.

>>92585481
1.Give her a solo series that isn't slice of life humor, although I think that book actually sold relatively well if I'm not mistaken.

Make it a classic Edgar Rice Burroughs space adventure. Think Princess of Mars but here she's the heroine and the princess (There was a character like that in the Barsoom books, Tavia).

2. The plot is simple. Her sister is trying to seize the throne and Kori has to step up and put her home in order before returning to Earth. Have her take some friends along for the ride as a supporting cast, maybe the Green Lantern of whatever sector Tamaran is in (has there ever been a Tamaranian Lantern?).

3.Develop Tamaran and Tamaranian culture. Remember that they're creatures of passion. They don't feel half emotions. When they're heroic they're very heroic. When they're angry they're very angry. This part of their physiology gives them a culture that's very much like something Edgar Rice Burroughs would write where everything is melodramatic and operatic.

4. Don't make Kori a turbocunt. No one likes the female warrior with a personality of steel wool. Make her sweet and polite and humble. Her default is caring and gentle. She's seen as something of a nerd by her fellow Tamaranians because she's big into alien culture, particularly Earth culture. She is however capable of flying into truly fearsome rages.

What I'm saying is make her John Carter but a girl. She's a gentlewoman outside of battle but a natural fighter with a subdued ruthless streak. She enjoys the thrill of combat, but isn't a psychopath or a burnt out husk like so many warrior women characters.

Could this work? What do you think of my idea thread?

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>>92589129
bring back best ship

>>92588066
>pfft, No way, Fag.

>>92585481
Why do they keep showing her and Cyborg as adults but keep resetting Raven, Beast Boy, and Terra?

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>>92590404
>>92590786
Combine these two and you're onto something.
>...have her maintain a leadership role there. I'm not sure if Percy is having her do that, but it's possible.
That seems to be the direction they're taking in the animated movies, but I could see it happening in the comic seeing as she's the oldest and most experienced (despite what Damian says).
>She's seen as something of a nerd by her fellow Tamaranians because she's big into alien culture, particularly Earth culture.
Ooh, I really like this. It could potentially open up some interesting dialogue with other alien characters, particularly Supes or J'onn.
>She's a gentlewoman outside of battle but a natural fighter with a subdued ruthless streak. She enjoys the thrill of combat, but isn't a psychopath or a burnt out husk like so many warrior women characters.
Well said. This is essentially how I've always envisioned her.

On an unrelated note, I like the idea of her hair being fluffy by default and catching fire whenever she gets intensely emotional, whether it's grief or excitement. It plays into the "Tamaraneans are creatures of passion" angle.

>>92591237
I guess it's because of Kori's previous relationship with Dick. As long as he's an adult, so is she.
As for Vic, they've been pushing him as a founding JL member for a while now, which would require him to be an adult.

>>92591237
>Starfire
She was in a relationship with Dick

>Cyborg
He was always one of the oldest Titans plus he's getting pushed

>>92590404
Establish her on the Cosmic stuff? Like she did with Animal Man and Lobo during 52?

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What's your favourite Starfire costume?
I think she looks great currently. Pic related is also underrated

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>>92591025

>>92592913

I like her spacesuit

>>92592913
I don't mind any of her outfits, but I feel like staying close to the leotard shape does her best. Current costume is fucking great.

>>92591237
Isn't Terra as old as Dick, Kori, and Vic now? I haven't read any of Lazarus Contract yet.

>>92591874
I didn't get to read 52 yet and I probably will when I finally get time away from uni but if that's what happened, then yeah.

>>92592997
Daaaaaaayum, those are Power GIrl sized!

>>92592913
That's my favorite Stargirl outfit. Wished the pants matched her top though.

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>>92593359
Terra hasn't shown up yet in Rebirth. We only have this cover with her and there's no telling how old she'll be since the kids here range from like 13-20something.

>>92593445
Man I'd fuck the shit out of Rose

Both Starfire and Donna worked best as cosmic characters when it came to forming their own identities.

>>92585481

I haven't read a single thing with her since like right after New 52 began but that bit in Outlaws where she turned into Commander Shepard was actually pretty cool. I thought it was the clearest we'd seen of the direction she'd need to take to be a real A-Lister with her own supporting cast and shit to take care of.

Which I think is the thing people forget. A listers don't need to sponge off other characters or live in a team base, they have their own friends outside work and their own place to be. If another character shows up it's assumed to be temporary and they don't take over unless both characters somehow get top billing like Green Lantern/Green Arrow, and in that case supporting characters from both will still show up unlike a team book like Justice League.

If you wanted to pitch Kori as an A lister she needs to keep that ship and a crew. The ship can dock with the tower or wherever the Titans present base at the time is, but that needs to be her space with her own separate people under her authority.

>>92587433

>Starfire that looks black

Yes.

>>92593545
Even Lobo knows she's a slut.

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gud thread.
Imma be honest, I'm not an expert on Star so I can't really contribute to the discussion but keep this going

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Amazon.

>>92594181
she is just lewd not a slut

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>>92594558
Liar!

I say keep her naive, but experienced at heroing. Have her leave these teen titans and go to the new titans, and fill her role with Terra.

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I'm sure she's eventually be a B-Tier character .

>>92596921
looks like she's already a DD-lister.

bamp

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>>92590786
>has there ever been a Tamaranian Lantern?
Yep, her name is Alisand'r.

>>92602171
Was she the one that got her neck snapped by Darkseid.

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They need to do a Green Lantern arc that develops Tamaran and other Tamaranian characters who could become her supporting cast there and have Kori be a key player in the story.

>>92600620
Is fanart like this spreading the misconceptions about Starfire's characterization in the cartoon?
Not that it's bad fanart, mind you, but I'm tired of people hating on the deepest character in the show

I think Kori's problem is Batman.

Generally speaking, comic universes have "pillar," characters, the major identities who form the backbone of the setting, and their galaxies of supporting characters. There's a symbiotic relationship there: a character can't BE a pillar unless they merit a supporting cast. Dick Greyson began as just supporting cast for Batman, but because of Kori and others he BECAME a pillar. The problem is, Dick will always be a secondary pillar because of Batman. We had that brief glimpse of just how great Dick could be in that pillar role when Bruce died and he took up the cowl, but of course Bruce returned, and when new 52 came he was right back to where he had been since he first became Nightwing. As long as Batman is around, Dick is under a glass ceiling, and as part of his galaxy Kori is stuck there with him.

Could Kori succeed if she were promoted to be the support for a higher-level pillar, as Barbara did when she left Dick's galaxy as Oracle and became part of Bruce's? Maybe, but I think it would be a difficult sell to try and attach her to a character more highly rated than Dick. Could she succeed if given the opportunity to be a pillar in her own right, as they've been trying to do with Cyborg for the last while? Maybe, but I think her character history is so entwined with Dick that it would take something tremendous to get her out from the glass ceiling he's under. I think they're destined to rise and fall together.

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>>92600620
Slut!

>>92602223
Yep.

>>92603212
What a shame.

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>>92602812
Relax. I'm sure there was no ill intent behind the art. It was just having a little bit of sexy fun with Starfire's naivety. We all know she's pure in the show.

>>92603235
Yes, that's why I said
>Not that it's bad fanart, mind you
I'm not blaming the artist, I'm blaming the Starfire haters.

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>>92603222
>shame
Anon...

>>92603273
Red Lanterns love to hate.

Was Starfire's giant poofy hippy hair and constant nudity and love of sex supposed to be evocative of 60s-era Free Love philosophies? I always thought so.

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>>92603273
I don't think that pic is turning anyone into Starfire haters though.

>>92603235
>>92603355
You know, you're really not helping by posting screenshots from early season 1, the only few episodes where the "silly naive girl" criticism holds.

>>92586625
because they gave her pupils, a crime.

>>92603454
Blankeyesfags need to get a clue, Toonfire's eyes are fucking beautiful. (And on top of that they're clearly drawn as a reference to her species' feline origins from the comics, quite a nice touch there.)

Comics Starfire is good but she's ruined by her association with the cartoon.

>>92603482
The cartoon is ruined by its association with the comics, if anything. If it was standalone like Avatar we'd probably be on season 20 by now.

>>92603500

An inferior adaptation cannot be "ruined" by association with superior source material.

>>92603320
Cute!
>>92603472
Death to pupils

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>>92603386
>silly naive girl
You saw that like it's a bad thing. Besides I don't see how season one screenshots will create Starfire haters either.

>>92603524
Totally agree, but we're talking about the best cartoon of all time here. Wrong thread, anon?
>>92603553
Many people hate those traits. Don't remind them.

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>>92603609
TT Starfire is best Starfire. Just because she is naive doesn't mean she's stupid or anything.

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>>92603472
She's a ginger.

>>92603672
>TT Starfire
Later in life, she'll be addicted to the dick.>>92603683

She's a slut.

>>92603609
>Totally agree, but we're talking about the best cartoon of all time here. Wrong thread, anon?

False flagging, the post.

>>92586769
uh Robin?

>>92603789
No false flagging whatsoever, I've been posting that in various relevant threads for quite some time now.

>>92585481
Starfire is already B tier like the rest of the cartoonTitans minus robin

>>92603672
>TT Starfire
That could refer to any version. I think you mean Toonfire.

>>92596919
When did this get announced?

Why does DC want to keep Nightwing and Starfire apart when both characters would be stronger together?

>>92603850
Because modern media hates healthy relationships

>>92603813

Uhuh, yeah. You're totally honest and sincere in your love for this cartoon and totally not just posting this to rile up the TTGO fans.

>>92603850
Because Nightwing is a player.

>>92603862
LMFAO, I literally couldn't care less about TTG, it's so fucking irrelevant (other than introducing kids to the original series, which I grudgingly respect it for doing). I basically only post about it when someone comes in asking if they should watch it or whatever, and I try to direct them to the original instead, for obvious reasons.

>>92603917
>it's so fucking irrelevant

And yet it's got much better viewing numbers than TT ever had. Go figure huh nostalgiafag.

>>92603933
You don't have a source for that. Wanna know how I know? Because NOBODY has original TT ratings, other than the industry itself.
Feel free to keep shitposting.

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>>92603933
And running longer.

>>92603973
Running into the ground, that is.

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>>92604000
True that the 4th Season isn't doing as good as the previous seasons, but kids are still enjoying them. Wouldn't be surprise if they decide to start Season 5 as the series finale.

>>92604292
Only "special" kids enjoy TTG.
Normal kids get the old DVDs.

>>92587554
They tried too hard to make her like cartoon Starfire. Even in the way she spoke.

I wish insecure Teen Titans fans would not feel the need to dump on Teen Titans Go. Both shows are great, chill your balls out.

>>92604336
Nobody's "dumping" on it, we just want people with actual taste to post here.

>>92604320
Or just not watch both.

>>92604347
That's abnormal too, though.

>>92587691
Omega Men was pretty good.

>>92592997
What's this from?

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>>92604381
Not everyone enjoy either versions of the series.

>>92604387
It was, but it didn't gain enough traction for anything larger to come out of it.

>>92604341

>I don't like farcical humor and anyone who does is bad! Only extremely serious stories like Killer Moth's daughter making Robin go to the prom are allowed in REAL Teen Titans.

>>92604412
That's called shit taste, anon.
>>92604453
Yes, I like brilliant comedy like that ep, not TTG's farcical humor. Glad we're on the same page, anon.

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>>92604453
They should have just fuck on the table.

>>92604473
>farcical humor
Ain't that the point of the show? Being silly and dumb?

>>92604513

He's saying he doesn't appreciate farce. Which is fine.

Saying TTG is an objectively bad show because it is a farce on the other hand would be a stupid statement.

>>92604320
>Normal kids get the old DVDs.

DVDs? This isn't 2005 anymore grandpa.

>>92604542
No, it's an intelligent statement. Pretty much the only such statement one can make about TTG, in fact.

>>92604559
Kids don't know about Kametsu. Hence the DVDs.

Nobody wants shit streaming quality, not even kids

>>92604771
So by that statement, any slapstick shows are bad in general?

>>92604792
Especially since they can't afford it.

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>>92604000
Trips of fucking truth son.

>>92604837
>So by that statement, any slapstick shows are bad in general?
I've yet to see a good one. Feel free to prove me wrong though, I'd only appreciate it really.

>>92604412
Who the hell keeps backing soda in the fridge

>>92604837
>Especially since they can't afford it.
Who can't afford what? Your sentence is confusing as fuck.

>>92603351
Maybe, but she was created in the 1980's when huge hair was stylish at the time.
I also thing she was partially based off of the Red Martians from the Barsoom novels; notably Marv Wolfman had just got off writing a John Carter comic series before being put on NTT, so for Kori he might have been thinking of Dejah Thoris except flying and lasers and orange instead of red.

>>92590786
I like it.

>>92603201
That's a good point.

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>>92604542
TTGO is trash. The writing is lazy and not creative. The characters have become one dimensional and flanderized even within their own show. A couple of their gags from the first episodes have become their entire personalities in the later ones. There's not much there to it other than filling air time slots and generating revenue for CN at this point.

>>92604928
Bimbos.

>>92604931
Saying kids can't afford streaming service.

>>92605042
Rather take TTGO, Cloudy, or Ben 10 than the movies.

>>92605042
That flipped image bothers me.

Anyone have that image where Barbra tries to visit Dick but Kori answers the door?

>>92605042

>The characters have become one dimensional and flanderized even within their own show. A couple of their gags from the first episodes have become their entire personalities in the later ones.

I find is fascinating when somebody states the premise of a fucking show as the main criticism of it. They're supposed to be one-dimensional gag characters who blow one note of the originals to outrageous proportions: its a farcical parody.

The fact that you don't like it does not make it trashy, lazy or not creative. You are not the divine arbiter of taste.

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>>92605257
Starfire is his main bitch.

>>92605316
Doesn't anyone have the original?
This is why I hate edits, generally speaking.

>>92605332
An edit?

>>92605367
What? Yes, that's an edit...

>>92605332

I mean, that is the original other than MS Paint VAN HALEN on her shirt.

>>92605392
That's my point. EVERYONE posts that one now.

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>>92605332

>>92605417
Being that tall compared to a 6'4" freak of nature, even in heels, is not remotely "womanlet" status.

>>92605417
>Filename
Kek. Also, thank you savior.

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>>92605417
Cuck porn when?

>>92590786
I think it would work. You have the whole hippy Tamaran/warrior Tamaran that needs to be resolved especially with the Citadel involvement. But the Citadel can be written as truly scary motherfuckers especially post Omega Men so Tamaran doesn't have to be weak to be to whatever extent under their heel.

But never mind, you had me at John Carter.

>>92604928
You're supposed to keep an open box in there to absorb odors. It's fairly basic m8.

You have a separate one for cooking though.

>>92605296
Yes it it is trash. It's not trying to be entertaining. It's just being mean. Just because you can label it as something like a farcical parody doesn't mean it can't be bad at what it's trying to do.

>>92605602
>It's just being mean.
Again with the "responding to critics" episodes?

>>92605602
>It's not trying to be entertaining.
I'd say it's trying but failing miserably because the writers are hacks who couldn't even be bothered to watch the original apparently.

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>>92605417

>>92605706
Yeesh, no wonder the cartoon is near-universally considered better.

>>92605706
This is why Dick and Starfire should be fuck buddies. Also, would love DC making a scene from that page.

>>92605706
>>92605764

Why should Dick and Kory be fuck-buddies when this annual was a terribly written story that contradicted a bunch of canon just to portray how Dick and Babs are a toxic couple of assholes that deserve each other?

If anything, it should be a better proof that Dick and Babs are terrible because it keeps taking a huge crap on better stories to validate an awful and forced ship.

>>92605834
>portray how Dick and Babs are a toxic couple of assholes that deserve each other
Damn, really? They should've just let Dick be single.

>>92605907

Yup, go read it. Nightwing Annual 2, from 2006. It's a story meant to show how Dick and Babs almost got it on several time throughout the ages, but somehow always cock-blocked or cheated on each other. It's meant to be romantic and tragic, but in my opinion only served to show how such an awful couple they are.

That whole flashback scene with Dick fucking Babs right before his marriage with Kory is specially awful, because it is something that never fucking happen in the original canon because back then Dick and Babs had no romantic interest for each other, and Dick was truly in love with Kory. This a shitty retcon.

>>92605521
The Citadel should be scary as hell even pre-Omega Men. It's an aggressive power that invades and ransacks planets like it's nothing, it runs a prison where people are imprisoned without trial and slim chances of ever getting out again and it's strong enough that none of the colour corps have decided to deal with it.

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I started this but then the artist changed and I didn't like the new style

>>92603766
what the hell is with this art? Whose waist is thinner here?

>>92587433
But she can make a better character than Constantine and Black Manta in a fighting game. I don't think that's all about popularity.

>>92607001
Hard to top Luppachino, bro. Her art was perfect for that series.

>>92606761
Well greens were banned from Vega for a while, but then they got some pre-FP in R.E.B.E.L.S.

Not sure why the others never really bothered to do anything though.

>>92605316
Dick looks like an ugly Asian guy

>>92607564
It should have been a hot spot for lantern attention (even Larfleeze's, if only because they had a huge collection that wasn't his) with all the shit that was going on there, so something must have kept them away. Aside from plot, that is.

>>92606761
Yeah, but we didn't see them as quite that scary pre-Omega Men. Not getting their shit pushed in by the Corps is a good start, and a lot of what makes them terrifying should be doctrine and attitude, not just massive broadsides.

>>92594493
>womenlets

When will they learn?

>>92605521
How should Citadel be written into the story? They help Blackfire take over Tamaran?

By the way what's the status for the major space powers of DC currently?

>>92611055
They need to group together and take down the amazons.

>>92612274
Green+Yellow Lanterns - Working together, one of each for each sector
Blue Lanterns - Saint Walker is the only one left and their battery is dead
Red Lanterns - Brief appearance in Green Lanterns a few months ago, presumably doing the usual but very low key
Indigo+star sapphires Lanterns - Haven't really been mentioned lately
Larfleeze - Had (presumably non-canon) mini a few years back, hasn't really been mentioned since
L.E.G.I.O.N. - Has only had one non-canon cameo since Flashpoint, might not exist yet
Rann/Thanagar - Fought a war in a pretty awful mini, signed a peace treaty. Adam Strange, Katar Hol and Despero "died" during the war.
Tamaran - Hasn't really been mentioned lately afak
The Citadel/Omega Men - Stuff happened in King's Omega Men but I still haven't read it and some writers seem to be ignoring it anyway

Did I miss anyone important?

>>92612545
So many sound like they're basically in comic book limbo right now. A Starfire Edgar Rice Burroughs adventure on Tamaran might be a great way to sort things out just by showing how everyone reacts to a war on Tamaran.

Could other Tamarans be made to be like Starfire with super strength and starbolts? It would make them a presence on the cosmic stage, probably not to the levels of Lantern Corps but they'd have some muscle.

>>92612545
>Tamaran - Hasn't really been mentioned lately afak

There was a cameo early on in the Hal n Pals book

>>92605834, >>92605907
Laying down some Old Reader Truths for all the babbies; this shit >>92605706, >>92605417 is all 100% a retcon to show how "deep" Barbra's relationship with Dick was and how much she felt for him.

Do you know what Barbra was ACTUALLY DOING in the ACTUAL COMICS at the time?
She was fucking getting married to a character you've never even heard of.

The importance of Dick/Babs is literally a retcon, as they were seeing each other back before DC has even begun to attempt to catch up to Marvel's more character-driven storytelling.
By the time EITHER Dick or Barbra had been developed as actual characters with the traits we are now familiar with, they had been dating/actually were engaged to other characters for almost four fucking years at that point.

But Gail Simone lusts after Nightwing and self-inserts onto Barbara, so here we are with this bullshit story she invented that ignores what actually happened.

>>92606017
>That whole flashback scene with Dick fucking Babs right before his marriage with Kory is specially awful, because it is something that never fucking happen in the original canon because back then Dick and Babs had no romantic interest for each other, and Dick was truly in love with Kory. This a shitty retcon.

Barbara was fucking ENGAGED TO ANOTHER MAN at the time for fuck's sake.

>>92612626
>Could other Tamarans be made to be like Starfire with super strength and starbolts? It would make them a presence on the cosmic stage, probably not to the levels of Lantern Corps but they'd have some muscle.

It's actually kind of important that ONLY Starfire and Blackfire have those powers; it sort of ties directly into Starfire's origins as a character.

When I was a kid in 2003, Teen Titans was my absolute favorite show. Starfire was one of my first major cartoon crushes (other than this one girl from ZOIDS who I claimed to be married to when I was like 4).

I wanted to BE Robin. He was so cool. He was everything I wasn't. I strived to be him every day in first/second grade.

Later on as I entered adulthood, I had a realization.


Was I in love with Starfire, or was I in love with Dick Grayson?

I want to fuck both of them.

>>92612943

>The importance of Dick/Babs is literally a retcon, as they were seeing each other back before DC has even begun to attempt to catch up to Marvel's more character-driven storytelling.
>By the time EITHER Dick or Barbra had been developed as actual characters with the traits we are now familiar with, they had been dating/actually were engaged to other characters for almost four fucking years at that point.

Heck, during that time Barbara was a 25 year old congresswoman while Dick was still an awkward teenager. Barbara found his constant show-boating and posturing "cute", but had no romantic feelings for him. Meanwhile Dick had a crush on her, but that was mostly because he was a teen and had a crush on every girl.

It was only after the cartoon that writers started to retcon Babs age so she could be as young as him and now she looks like a fucking womanchild.

>>92613241
It's definitely one of the worst things to happen to a comic book heroine over time; not only was she crippled, but her entire cast that she developed that DIDN'T just revolve around her being an extra in a Batman ensemble got taken away.
And then when she finally developed a new identity that was even more important to the superhero community then Batgirl was, THAT got taken away too.

Now she's a tiny little dwarf-woman that they created to pander to a tween girl demographic that isn't even reading their fucking comics.

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>>92613202
It's okay anon, wanting to ravage Dick Grayson's plump yet firm behind isn't gay; it's a part of human nature, as is being in love with Kori.

>>92604928

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4WMA1XnLQGE

Arm and hammer advertised baking soda as acting as an air freshener for decades.

it does and does not actually work. Baking soda DOES work technically. however, its a matter of surface area, and filtration. its not doing shit, in the box, with just a tab pulled.
it WOULD however be quite effective, if you had an entirely tray of baking soda poured out on a rack. or a means to cycle the air through the baking soda.

>>92613030
Yeah, I know how they were experimented on to get their powers, but shouldn't that mean that if you juice up Tamaranians with enough UV radiation they'll get powers to? It seems like some of them would risk trying to power-up being a warrior culture and all.

I just think it would be a way to make a Tamaranian war something that would attract the attention of the universe. The powers that be are going to have more of a stake in Tamaran's future if they're a race with lots of superhumans flying around.

Is it a good idea to power up more Tamaranians or should the sisters be the only ones?

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>>92613737
X'Hal (at least in the nu52) got her powers in a similar experiment but her powers went full on god mode. It might be interesting if some Tamaranians got different energy powers from experiments like healing or shield creation.

>>92613202
PERFECTLY
NORMAL

>>92594493
>>92611055
>>92612500
>Being that tall compared to a 6'4" freak of nature, even in heels, is not remotely "womanlet" status.

>>92613737
>but shouldn't that mean that if you juice up Tamaranians with enough UV radiation they'll get powers to?

Kori suggested that the experiments were extremely painful; ALL Tamaranians naturally absorbed solar radiation, but the only used it to fly, which Blackfire couldn't naturally do in addition to being ugly by her people's standards (though her family still loved her) and drove her inferiority complex towards Kori.
The experiments kind of forced them to absorb more solar energy then normal and channeled it into increased strength and starbolts, so it's more like something that they can naturally do painfully artificially enhanced.

In addition, her and Blackfire actually don't have identical powers: Komand'r can't fly and has less physical strength, but conversely her starbolts are potent enough to one-hit KO Starfire in most fights.

>>92614225
This is actually what happened in the comics too.
The Tamarianians are descendants of X'Hal and the Citadel basically we're trying to replicate and weaponize the same thing, though it should be noted that X'Hal eventually when fucking nuts.

>>92614825
But in the cartoon, Blackfire could fly, and Starfire defeated her in every fight they had. Why was that?
>being ugly by her people's standards
Did they change this in the cartoon too?

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>>92615314
>But in the cartoon, Blackfire could fly, and Starfire defeated her in every fight they had. Why was that?
The cartoon was deliberately meant to be a simplified version of the story meant for younger audiences (kids, basically) rather then the 16/17+ stuff collage Age readers that the NTT targeted.
Entire swaths of character origins, motivations, and personalities changed to more fit the more anime-styled storytelling and character archetypes.

It was never trying to be accurate or even really introduce new readers to the characters, by admission of the show's writers. It was just trying to make a show.

>Did they change this in the cartoon too?
Kinda.
Blackfire in the comics wasn't ACTUALLY hideously ugly; it's just that her entire species is a bunch of 10/10 nudists and she's a little odd-looking (though gradually she's gotten prettier just as all comic book women do as art changes over time), but by Tamarianian standards it made her hideously deformed. This along with her generic inability to fly made Kori obviously the favored daughter of the populace, though supposedly her parents treated them as equals and didn't care.

>>92615520
>Entire swaths of character origins, motivations, and personalities changed to more fit the more anime-styled storytelling and character archetypes.

What else was changed?

>>92615520
>Entire swaths of character origins, motivations, and personalities changed to more fit the more anime-styled storytelling and character archetypes.
But isn't anime generally aimed at older audiences?

>>92615582
Not that anon, but I can't think of a single character that WASN'T changed significantly from the comics. Not one. I'll let someone else fill in the details though, as I'm not that into the comics.

>>92615582
Robin's personality was partially the same but his motivations were removed.
Beast Boy's personally was radically altered; he acted similar in the comics but his character depth is much more complex and a LOT sadder in the comics.
Raven ironically was actually closer to how Starfire was in the show then Starfire was, in addition to being much more shy and empathetic. In the show was was Ruri, not that any of the show viewers really know who that is.
Cyborg's entire personality and origins were different, and he by far had the most overall changes to him.
Starfire was sweet and nice, but she was SAVAGE in battle, and early in they had a hard time getting her to hold back her emotions and desire to kill her enemies in a fight. She also had less problems with Earth customs; she had zero nudity taboo but could speak perfectly good English and her problems early on stemmed from how people weren't as emotionally honest as they were on her home.

The Teen Titans show is good for what it was, but the reason that the people who watch the show don't like the comics is because they were never intended to do so and after the show ended they were kinda expected to just....ya know, grow up and not watch kids cartoons anymore I guess. It was just going to be another show, not some huge thing that people glommed onto.

>>92615639
Not even remotely.
People assume that the fan service and blood means that it's meant for older kids, but actually Japan has even stricter censorship laws then the US does.
It just doesn't censor the same things due to cultural differences.

If you mean in modern day? Yes.
Largely because there's no more children in Japan so they aim the market at lonely manchildren, which is a declining market in and of itself.

The anime industry is actually in a worse off state then the Big Two are in the comics industry, and that is REALLY saying something.

>>92615797
I'd say the reason many of the people who watched the show don't like the comics is that they came for the Ameranime, not the superhero stuff per se (though it worked wonders in terms of having a base to start from). It's the same reason why Avatar and TMNT '03 are still so popular.

>>92615963
I would agree, completely.
It's why there's such dissention between the two; a bunch of people who watched a show and basically were kind of misled about the basic premise of the franchise get upset when a show made for tweens and kids isn't the same thing as a comic made for a completely different audience of a completely different time period.

Of course since the people that come on here usually are rather manchildish, rather then just admit that their show is different and was never really designed to introduce them to anything at all they get butthurt and start arguments over it which causes the comic guys to start shit back and it's all so very juvenile and repetitive.

>>92614825
Even if it is extremely painful I can see Tamaranian warriors willingly shooting up with UV to see if they can get stronger. The fact it hurts like hell might even make them want to do it more to prove how tough they are. Warriors gonna warrior.

I think the idea of Tamaranians getting slightly different powers from overclocking UV is interesting. One could be like a purple human torch and surround their body with energy becoming deadly up close but unable to shoot starbolts. Another could temporarily transform into pure UV light to zip through solid objects and move really fast, but only in short spurts.

Kori could lead the first Tamaranian team of super-warriors and it would make her even more like John Carter. John Carter usually ended up with a little team of sidekicks by the end of his adventures. Tars Tarkus and Kantos Kan being examples. You could even throw in the Green Lantern of Tamaran for good measure (or maybe they have different color? Red? Maybe there could be a few lanterns. The emotional spectrum ties nicely into the theme of Tamaranians being naturally hyper-emotional. They'd probably make really powerful lanterns).

>>92615520
>Blackfire was a little odd looking

What specifically was supposed to be wrong with her? The giant eyebrows?

>>92617559
>Warriors gonna warrior.
They weren't a warrior culture.
They warred passionately, but they did EVERYTHING passionately. In fact rather then fight and die when the Citadel came to conquer them they surrendered because they knew the losses they would sustain would be horrific if they did.
Kori HERSELF was a warrior, trained by the Warlord of Okaara, but it wasn't a universal trait among the culture. Komand'r for instance was crap at fighting.

>What specifically was supposed to be wrong with her? The giant eyebrows?
Look at her face; it's angular, more alien, her forehead is longer, and she's extremely skinny. Now they doesn't look all that bad by comparison to humans, but when the entire rest of your species looks like really tall golden skinned European underwear models with no nudity taboo?

Yeah, you look kind of ugly in comparison.

>>92617559
>I think the idea of Tamaranians getting slightly different powers from overclocking UV is interesting.

Also, her powers while they come from ultraviolet light and aren't actually lasers or anything like that since sometimes they are shown to burn but also they hit with nonlethal concussive force when they want them to; they're just generic "solar energy blasts" which either burn or knock people back.
Even the UV light stuff is actually only as recent as 2009, and it was mentioned in concert with how Kryptonians get THEIR power from UV radiation which isn't actually correct at all.

>>92618370
>Kryptonians get THEIR power from UV radiation which isn't actually correct at all.

What, they don't?

>>92618400
Let's not get into the inconsistencies about how Kryptonian powers work, but in short; no they do not work that way.
If it did they wouldn't loose all power under a red sun, which actually puts out MORE UV light due to it's dying nature then a yellow sun does.

>>92618254
>They weren't a warrior culture

Huh. I stand corrected then. I still think you'd find a couple of Tamaranians wanting to try powering up. You're bound to find a few in a planetary sized population.

Her being a trained warrior sort of adds to the "Kori is an oddball among her own people" idea written about earlier. She's an Earthaboo AND she's a warrior.

>>92618370
>Sometimes they are shown to burn but also hit with nonlethal concussive force

Easy fix for that. Say she can do both. She can choose to make her starbolts burn or not when they hit things.

How's this a title for the pitch though: A Princess of Tamaran?

What all do we know about Tamaran culture and history? I know that they're super passionate and evolved from cats. What else is there?

>>92618634
>How's this a title for the pitch though: A Princess of Tamaran?
Fine enough. Like I said, I always thought she was kinda inspired by Dejah Thoris a bit.
>What all do we know about Tamaran culture and history? I know that they're super passionate and evolved from cats. What else is there?
Basically nothing.
History is a subject most comics writers barely have any knowledge of, and the ones that write aliens don't seem to care much more either.

>>92619278
>Tamaran is a planet that has a history of cultural extremes. They were once a race of warriors, then a race of a pacifist monks, then a race of explorers, then a race of isolationists.

Good idea? Bad idea?

>>92619421
Dunno, never thought about it.
Ideas aren't good or bad; writers are.

>>92595021
KID, TURN AROUND. STOP LOOKING AT YOUR RED POTATO!

>>92607001
HOLY FUCK DID THE SAND TURN THAT WOMAN INTO NOTHING BUT BONE AND A BIKINI?

That's fucking scary!

>>92604336
Both shows are bad. TTG is just much, much worse.